I've changed my mind about Rand Paul

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Nov 28, 2007
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OK, I've changed my mind. I was very disheartened by what I saw as a poor performance on the Rachel Maddow show and then a total statist flip-flop on Blitzer. See here: http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=245680&page=6 . I even wrote "if it weren't for his being Ron's son, I would totally dismiss him."

But then I saw him with Stephanapolous.

The fact that he wrote that letter to the editor in 2002 defending discrimination just makes it clear in my mind what's going on. Perhaps because I've written a lot of letters to the editor over the years, so I can relate to it. But for whatever strange reason, that just made it all click together for me. That letter is where his true feelings lie.

He's playing politics, being somewhat "stealth" if you will, like some of us were stealth delegates back in the Ron Paul campaign. No need for everyone to necessarily know all of what he stands for until he's safely in office, just as there was no need for the neo-con GOP members at the caucus to know you supported Ron Paul until you were safely elected as a delegate.

Plus, Ron Paul has vouched for him. That means a lot.

I guess sometimes you just gotta have faith. I am so cynical about politicians, I lose faith very easily. At the drop of a hat, as it were. And usually that cynicism is more than justified. But in this case I was wrong to lose faith, I think. Perhaps Rand will let us down, but I don't think so. This is an exciting time. We could actually have a basically-libertarian or at least quasi-libertarian Senator! The ideas of liberty really are spreading!
 
Carole and Ron didn't raise a chump. All the naysayers need to chill out.
 
I emphatically agree. Most people who met or talked to Rand at any length have the same feeling... he's the real deal. I've seen his frustration at Republican events where politicians waxed eloquent about liberty after having voted against it repeatedly.

I do not trust easily, and at the very beginning I wondered... but that doubt has been put to rest. I shan't doubt him again until he's had a chance to vote. He is fond of this saying:

"I was told that the chief interest of my constituents were liberty. And in that cause, I am doing the best that I can."

As a human, under tremendous pressure, this is what he is doing... the best that he can for liberty. We need him in the Senate.
 
Not to mention--Paul has surrounded himself with individuals like Matt Collins, and others, who are members of the Liberty movement--a principled members at that.

Consider it like a pressure group. Even if Rand wasn't a principled guy, and I think he is, we are his pressure group. We give him all his funding, he give him the excitement and activism, we supply the boots on the ground and the big moneybombs. If he betrays us, in office, he loses all that. Now he might find another group that's willing to do all those things--certainly many groups have bought senators--but I doubt it.

At the end of the day: just look to what Rand said for ALL of his life before his campaign for Senate. The convictions he expressed when he debated Senator Graham for his father at the age of 18, when he campaigned for his father in '07 and '08, and when we were first drafting him, those are his real views. Since when did libertarians believe what a politician says when he's campaigning? Anyone who knows how politics works knows that politics is a game of obfuscation and expansion of voting blocs. Rand has his core block of voters, fundraisers, and activists (us). Now he's expanding. That doesn't mean he isn't still our guy--it just means he wants to WIN, instead of joining the ranks of every previous libertarian to run for Senate, who lost.
 
The fact that he wrote that letter to the editor in 2002 defending discrimination just makes it clear in my mind what's going on.

What do you mean by this? could you please post the letter and explain what you mean by "discrimination" and how you feel Rand Paul "defended" "discrimination".
I believe that we are ALL discriminatory in who we hire in to our businesses, perhaps the federal gov't are LESS discriminatory, (and look at the inefficiency and failure) but I sincerely believe it that is the JOB of the private business owner to have the power of DISCRIMINATION in who they hire. go hire someone to take care of your mom, and then tell me if you are "discriminatory".

I just wanted to make that clear, and assume that is what you meant by Rand defending "discrimination". OVER MY DEAD BODY would I sell my "product" to a "meth/coke/pcp/godonlyknowswhat head' or someone who comes in to my business looking like they just hopped out of their trailer, ran a 10k, won, and all with no teeth. Is that discriminatory?

sorry to pick, but I just want to make sure we are clear on what discrimination, or more importantly, having the option of being discriminatory really is...
 
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What do you mean by this? could you please post the letter and explain what you mean by "discrimination" and how you feel Rand Paul "defended" "discrimination".
I believe that we are ALL discriminatory in who we hire in to our businesses, perhaps the federal gov't are LESS discriminatory, (and look at the inefficiency and failure) but I sincerely believe it that is the JOB of the private business owner to have the power of DISCRIMINATION in who they hire. go hire someone to take care of your mom, and then tell me if you are "discriminatory".

I just wanted to make that clear, and assume that is what you meant by Rand defending "discrimination". OVER MY DEAD BODY would I sell my "product" to a "meth/coke/pcp/godonlyknowswhat head' or someone who comes in to my business looking like they just hopped out of their trailer, ran a 10k, won, and all with no teeth. Is that discriminatory?

sorry to pick, but I just want to make sure we are clear on what discrimination, or more importantly, having the option of being discriminatory really is...

+1
 
Rand should just play politics to get into office from here on out. No need to upstage his father on matters of principle. Just win come November.
 
Rand should just play politics to get into office from here on out. No need to upstage his father on matters of principle. Just win come November.

Both Ron and Rand conceded this position.

Ron said Rand seems to want to be more of a legislator, while he himself wants to be an educator. So, he said, Rand will tailor his message differently.

Rand said on CNN Ron is very principled, that he could probably never be that principled, and he really admired his father for that. It was as if he was saying to those who follow the Pauls closely that he tried to be his father when talking to Maddow, and that after all this criticism ohe couldn't take the heat like his dad and that he had so much more respect for his dad now that he knows what he has had to go through before.

or maybe I'm just over analyzing.
 
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Get it right. Rand was not "defending discrimination". If that's what he was doing THEN I'M OUTTA HERE! He was defending property rights and saying there were better ways to fight discrimination then having the federal government get involved. At least that's what I think he was saying. I'm becoming seriously worried about the fact that some in the liberty movement seem more worried about the right of some klansman to come out of the closet then they are about the right of someone not to be tortured at Gitmo. :mad:
 
What do you mean by this? could you please post the letter and explain what you mean by "discrimination" and how you feel Rand Paul "defended" "discrimination".
I just meant the right to discriminate, of course, which is an inalienable human right. Discrimination is a swear word in America, so of course no one would defend it, per se.

Well, except for me, perhaps, because my online persona isn't running for office, so I can write whatever I want here. I have the luxury of telling the truth. And the truth is, we all discriminate, discrimination is a good and essential behavior for living in a successful way. Even the big bad evil racial discrimination I don't have some huge, profound beef with. Germans self-segregating and forming cities like Milwaukee, Jews running Hollywood, this is all fine with me. I personally like being around people with a variety of characteristics, including race, but I can appreciate the advantages and the legitimate drive for folks to form ethnic neighborhoods. Bird of a feather flocking together, nothing wrong with that. There are differences between races, and I'm politically incorrect enough to say it. Hispanics like living with other Hispanics, Italians with other Italians, blacks with other blacks, and there's nothing particularly evil about that.

Anyway, that wasn't what Rand was defending, Rand was just saying that gee, maybe we shouldn't shoot or kidnap people for discriminating, but he concedes discrimination is evil, despicable, blah blah blah.


sorry to pick, but I just want to make sure we are clear on what discrimination, or more importantly, having the option of being discriminatory really is...
I don't think I completely understand your point, but if it was just to say "discrimination is not always bad", amen, brother.

Get it right. Rand was not "defending discrimination". If that's what he was doing THEN I'M OUTTA HERE! He was defending property rights
It's the same thing. Right to property = right to employ your property in any peaceful way. Putting up a "No Blacks" sign is peaceful.
 
OP that is what I posted before. He is not lying he is simply not letting these people control the conversation. Instead of saying his true feelings he is telling them what actions he will take. The difference here is that he can say I will not repeal CRA and be tottaly in agreement with defending private property rights.
 
I think a lot of posters get wrapped up in the ideological purity of the RPF world and don't understand that the man is running for a statewide office for one of the most powerful positions in the entire world

He's on a national - and even international platform - at all times, and it is necessary to play politics in order to win

Ron played politics himself in order to first get into office.

Once in office, you can be open with your views.

I think it's sad so many people abandoned Rand just because he's having to moderate his PRESENTATION of his views.

I'm glad you're back on board and understand that
 
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