Is the Revolution a Myth in the Republican Party?

[QFish]

 

[RobHino]

If I may add to your statement that some people have chosen to work within the Republican Party to advance Liberty, I'd say the following:

There are 3 ways to make the change we all want. All 3 ways are completely necessary, but one has proved most effective over time. The first way is to run for political office and become a politician. The second is to work through the party process to lobby your representatives to bring about the change you desire. The third, and most effective way to bring change, is through civil disobedience....think of Rosa Parks, Ghandi, the Civil Rights Movement, Anti-Slavery Riots, etc.

From a friend, "Working within electoral politics influences politicians. Civil disobedience educates the people. The primary problem is the people."

Inside the convention center in Tampa, there were several thousand people. Outside the center, there are 300 million people.

So, if some people feel they can be more effective running for office, or working through the party process, or by civil disobedience, we should all do everything we can to advance Liberty, and as Qadoshyah says, not rail on those who choose to work through the party process to build on what was already gained.

 

[notsure]

 

[Aratus]

^^^^^!!!!!~look UP~!!!!!!^^^^^

______ ^THIS^ ______

 

[QFish]

So, if some people feel they can be more effective running for office, or working through the party process, or by civil disobedience, we should all do everything we can to advance Liberty, and as Qadoshyah says, not rail on those who choose to work through the party process to build on what was already gained.

Amen Rob!

 

[jbauer]

If I may add to your statement that some people have chosen to work within the Republican Party to advance Liberty, I'd say the following:QUOTE]
What type of civial disobedience do you suggest? Heck they can arrest you for protesting on federal land now. I could stand outside my voting precinct with a Obamney sign or whatever, but there has to be enough of a stance to make a difference. Maybe something or someone will have something happen to them and we can rally behind them but cival disobedience ussually doesn't just happen. Look at Occupy they did there thing for months but because it was unorganized it netted them nothing but more laws against that type of thing.

 

[RobHino]

We could start by just saying NO...

What type of civial disobedience do you suggest? Heck they can arrest you for protesting on federal land now. I could stand outside my voting precinct with a Obamney sign or whatever, but there has to be enough of a stance to make a difference. Maybe something or someone will have something happen to them and we can rally behind them but cival disobedience ussually doesn't just happen. Look at Occupy they did there thing for months but because it was unorganized it netted them nothing but more laws against that type of thing.

We could start by just saying "NO".

Say NO to body scanners and opt out and each try to get 10 people to opt out with us at airports...try to engage others into wondering why people are refusing to go through the scanners.

Say NO to plea deals...take every legal action against you to court with a trial and a jury...speeding tickets, misdemeanors, etc...to try to bog down the courts.

Say NO to illegal check points...don't break laws, but don't cooperate with unlawful/unconstitutional orders.

These aren't necessarily "civil disobedience" but it's a start. I'm still trying to determine exactly what direction I'd like to take, but I'm definitely doing the top three from now on.

 

[Bastiat's The Law]

We could start by just saying "NO".

Say NO to body scanners and opt out and each try to get 10 people to opt out with us at airports...try to engage others into wondering why people are refusing to go through the scanners.

Say NO to plea deals...take every legal action against you to court with a trial and a jury...speeding tickets, misdemeanors, etc...to try to bog down the courts.

Say NO to illegal check points...don't break laws, but don't cooperate with unlawful/unconstitutional orders.

These aren't necessarily "civil disobedience" but it's a start. I'm still trying to determine exactly what direction I'd like to take, but I'm definitely doing the top three from now on.

Jury nullification?

 

[Butchie]

We could start by just saying "NO".

Say NO to body scanners and opt out and each try to get 10 people to opt out with us at airports...try to engage others into wondering why people are refusing to go through the scanners.

Say NO to plea deals...take every legal action against you to court with a trial and a jury...speeding tickets, misdemeanors, etc...to try to bog down the courts.

Say NO to illegal check points...don't break laws, but don't cooperate with unlawful/unconstitutional orders.

These aren't necessarily "civil disobedience" but it's a start. I'm still trying to determine exactly what direction I'd like to take, but I'm definitely doing the top three from now on.

What?!?!?! If you got a speeding ticket shut up and pay it and next time do the speed limit. It's not that hard, I fail to understand your logic of wasting tax payer dollars "Bogging down the courts" just because you can't control yourself on the road. What happened to personal responsibility?

 

[Elwar]

What?!?!?! If you got a speeding ticket shut up and pay it and next time do the speed limit. It's not that hard, I fail to understand your logic of wasting tax payer dollars "Bogging down the courts" just because you can't control yourself on the road. What happened to personal responsibility?

If you are not doing anything wrong, you have nothing to worry about.

Right?

 

[Butchie]

If you are not doing anything wrong, you have nothing to worry about.

Right?

If you're speeding, you ARE doing something wrong, so yes, you have something to worry about.

 

[RobHino]

What?!?!?! If you got a speeding ticket shut up and pay it and next time do the speed limit. It's not that hard, I fail to understand your logic of wasting tax payer dollars "Bogging down the courts" just because you can't control yourself on the road. What happened to personal responsibility?

Hey Butchie...I don't even remember the last time I got a speeding ticket...probably over 4 years ago maybe 5 or 6 years?? You do have a point about personal responsibility, and I completely aim to be responsible for anything I'm guilty of, but I have a sneaky suspicion that all speeding tickets are not legitimate, and I don't think you believe they are either.

Are you really making the argument that someone defending themselves in a court of law against a gov't accusation is wasting taxpayer dollars?! Wow...just wow.

The logic is simple. I'm not the one wasting tax payer dollars with a jobs program to enforce laws that don't work...the gubment is! Personally, I think instead of speed limits, we should have speed suggestions...and instead of police officers, we should have peace officers. Bottom line is that if you hurt someone, it's your fault whether you're speeding or not.

Anyway, you seem to have gotten caught up on speeding tickets. Like I said, I'm still trying to determine where I go from here.

 

[SonofThunder]

If you're speeding, you ARE doing something wrong, so yes, you have something to worry about.

LOL, right, because obeying some arbitrary number that some government stooge picked out of thin air is the essence of ethics....

 

[Butchie]

Hey Butchie...I don't even remember the last time I got a speeding ticket...probably over 4 years ago maybe 5 or 6 years?? You do have a point about personal responsibility, and I completely aim to be responsible for anything I'm guilty of, but I have a sneaky suspicion that all speeding tickets are not legitimate, and I don't think you believe they are either.

Are you really making the argument that someone defending themselves in a court of law against a gov't accusation is wasting taxpayer dollars?! Wow...just wow.

The logic is simple. I'm not the one wasting tax payer dollars with a jobs program to enforce laws that don't work...the gubment is! Personally, I think instead of speed limits, we should have speed suggestions...and instead of police officers, we should have peace officers. Bottom line is that if you hurt someone, it's your fault whether you're speeding or not.

Anyway, you seem to have gotten caught up on speeding tickets. Like I said, I'm still trying to determine where I go from here.

So you and your friend below want a world with no laws on the road? You'd be OK with a 12yr old getting drunk, hopping in an 18-wheeler hauling hazardous material and doing 100mph down the road and no cop could pull him over since those rules are just suggestions? Hey, on your own property if you want to get sloshed and drive like a maniac, be my guest, but not out on the road with me and my family, they are not Private roads, they are Public roads.

Obviously, if you weren't really speeding or guilty of some other offense and the officer pulled you over for no reason I'd say go ahead and fight it ofcourse, but the statement was about "bogging down the courts fighting EVERY ticket".

 

[fr33]

If you're speeding, you ARE doing something wrong, so yes, you have something to worry about.

No victim, no crime. Victimless crimes need to be nullified.

 

[Darguth]

Obviously, if you weren't really speeding or guilty of some other offense and the officer pulled you over for no reason I'd say go ahead and fight it ofcourse, but the statement was about "bogging down the courts fighting EVERY ticket".

The point the original poster seemed to be making was that a form of civil disobedience would be to oppose statism by no longer accepting such things so casually. Even if you were "in the wrong" for breaking a speed limit, the point is to stand up to the state, exercise your rights, and say "Prove it."

I don't see anything wrong with that. One of the most basic justifications for taxation is to provide for courts to allow for *exactly* that. Allow an individual to defend himself from the State, right or wrong.

 

[Mr. Perfidy]

If the r3volution is only civil disobedience, then the State that agents of the revolution ignore will just pound them into dungeons. There needs to be a street component, mobilizing the forces of the people AND a corresponding civic wing mobilizing the political classes to defend their rights to do this.

 

[Butchie]

No victim, no crime. Victimless crimes need to be nullified.

Really? So if I fire my gun into a crowd, and I don't hit anyone, it's a victimless crime and I can just go on about my business and keep doing it until I inevitably do hit someone?

The point the original poster seemed to be making was that a form of civil disobedience would be to oppose statism by no longer accepting such things so casually. Even if you were "in the wrong" for breaking a speed limit, the point is to stand up to the state, exercise your rights, and say "Prove it."

I don't see anything wrong with that. One of the most basic justifications for taxation is to provide for courts to allow for *exactly* that. Allow an individual to defend himself from the State, right or wrong.

Stand up to them? About what? Your right to break the law? No, I do not agree with that, unlike some of you I am not into this whole extreme anti-govt philosophy. There is alot of govt I'd love to take an axe to but saying you should waste my tax dollars "defending yourself from the state" when you are in the wrong is beyond baffling.

 

[bunklocoempire]

Thank you for your efforts OP!

RESIST!!

 

[fr33]

Really? So if I fire my gun into a crowd, and I don't hit anyone, it's a victimless crime and I can just go on about my business and keep doing it until I inevitably do hit someone?

Attempted murder is the straw man you bring up when talking about speeding? Your scenario has real victims and an attempt at their lives. My scenario is every day where I go over the speed limit and victimize nobody. Nice straw man.

Are you such a statist that you don't know how to drive safely without the hired goons telling you how to do it?