Is Ron Paul wrong about Jihadists and Foreign Policy?

[Roxi]

has anyone seen "the oil factor"....if not i HIGHLY recommend it ...one of the best documentaries on Iraq ive ever seen

heres the link to watch it on google video: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=1130731388742388243

 

[Tsoman]

When I fight with my girlfriend, I am willing to lose the argument in favor of the greater good...

If by withdrawing from the Middle East the terrorists think they have won, I don't care. If the consequence of being seen as "losing" the war on terror is peace, then I'm all for it (given that our sovereignty is not threatened of course).

 

[wecandoit]

Paul is absolutely not wrong. He couldn't be more right.

 

[damijin]

Ask any Brit, the Daily Mail is a crock of shit. They run the most ridiculous stories that are completely pulled out of their ass just to get people reading their crap.

 

[Ponce]

MikelovesGod? you are so right, the damage has been done..... there is no such a thing as "only half pregnant"........ baby coming your pretty soon

There is not such a thing as a "born terrorist"...... a good example are the Palestinian people, they were living in peace with the Jews in Palestine before the Zionists invaded Palestine starting in 1918.

To me the Palestinians are not terrorists but freedom fighters.

 

[mikelovesgod]

Actually Silver, I'm under-estimating them. You have no idea how far these people will go. These people feel the threat of a Jewish nation, which they despise, and it's power over them. When an animal is threatened you can't underestimate what it's going to do. Our influence in the Middle East on behest of an enemy cannot be understated.

"And maybe this is a clue to what we find puzzling in Islam. In 1936, when Europe was preparing for a new fratricidal war, the Muslim world seemed, to most Europeans, hopelessly backward and irrelevant; but Hilaire Belloc warned that Islam was a sleeping giant. It had nearly destroyed Christendom before, he said, and it might yet revive and threaten us again. At the time Belloc's view seemed eccentric. Now it seems eerily prophetic." Joseph Sobran


I'm not talking about attacks like 9/11, but a movement that is within all of Europe, and the only thing that has slowed them down is the oceans. Jesse Ventura made a very wise comment showing how weak our country is when he pointed out the crazy sniper in DC and how much power he had over a city. He said 10 groups of men with guns could cripple this nation. I agree with him.

We are not used to collateral damage at home, only abroad. Wait until it comes here and the media goes into a frenzy and the city goes into calamity. That's not an under-statement. Look at what 2 people did in DC and realize how weak this country is emotionally to take any degree of terrorism. I'm not saying it will happen, but we have to realize they don't need to take over a country to win their goals, just take the mind of the people to make laws which benefit them and then force their ways through using democracy. It's worked in France and in many countries in Europe where the countries are contracepting themselves into oblivion and the Muslims are taking over (e.g. Italy, Denmark, France, etc.)

You under-estimate them because mentally they are willing to risk everything because they have nothing to lose. Ever play sports? Who is the most dangerous opponent? The guy with no fear.

 

[mikelovesgod]

Don't get me wrong, I'm not in favor of nation smashing, but you can' t kill over a million people in one country and then put your hands up diplomatically and just apologize. They are still going to hate us, just not as much. They are rallying the troops and these men are insane on both sides.

We killed so many people we shouldn't have, destroyed a sovereignty we shouldn't have touched, and no matter what we do it will have long term effects. Even if Paul comes in he will get blamed for this unjust aggression by our country. I'm almost feel bad because he's so right, but the world is already burning. No matter how much water he puts on it it's still a wildfire.

 

[Mesogen]

I mean, what does a hardcore Muslim think of Denmark, where prostitution is legal?

He he. The hardcore Muslims HATE Denmark now, after the whole Mohammed cartoon thing.

 

[Mesogen]

That DailyMail article read like total disinfo. Just my opinion.

There are some dangerous people out there and some real wackos ready to kill and die in the name of Islam, but that doesn't mean we have to go around invading and occupying countries. That only makes it worse.

If we're worried about terrorists with WMDs, then we really need to be taking care of loose fissile material from the former USSR and even Pakistan, who used to be pretty loose with their nuclear technology. Maybe they still are.

But a lot of the people you see going crazy in the streets are just morons.

Have you seen the most ironic protester ever?

 

[singapore_sling]

As I have said before, even if foreign policy isn't the case, a non-interventionist foreign policy would give them no more excuses and the entire world would see that. That way we would have the backing of all other countries because it would then be clear that they are just plain intolerant of anything or anyone that isn't deemed "pure islamic".

 

[klamath]

This is the way I see it.
If we as Americans believe we are at war with all of Islam or we are at war to keep the oil flowing then we had better buckle down and fight this war all out like WWII. Quit trying to live in a state of denial that we can go on living a peace time life while tossing a few son’s and daughters lives toward a far off battle that is only going to get worse. And if this is the case that we are at war with all Islamic people of the world and not just a radical few, every American Mother and Father with their sons and daughters in tow needs to walk down to the military recruiting station and sign on the dotted line. It is going to take a lot of bodies to kill 1.5 billion Muslims. Nukes in places like India wouldn’t be a good idea or we will end up fighting 1 billion Hindu’s.

If as I believe we are at war with a radical few then we need to get out of the middle East and deprive al Qaeda the rallying and recruitment point of American occupation. If some are thinking I am an appeaser and pacifist you could not be more wrong. It is my firm belief that all things in this universe are about force and counterforce and the struggle to survive. War and terrorism, which are one in the same, will always be in this universe and I will fight for my freedom and right to live without hesitation however it is a ghastly horrible thing that can bring out the worse elements of human nature. If we can find different strategies that cost less in human life and defuse the constant human struggles where it is possible and where they involve us I believe we should go that route.

 

[Starks]

Ron will be tough on terrorism if we get attacked. He just won't be looking for fights.

 

[ButchHowdy]

Surprisingly, what has NOT been mentioned on this thread is the weightier extremism - radical CHRISTIANITY!

I am a lover of Jesus Christ and a scripture freak and I can honestly say that christianity has been hijacked by a Zionist agenda for the last 150 years.

The problem is the Pat Robertsons, John Hagees, and Falwellites that truly believe that the Israel of the Middle East is also the 'chosen' Israel of the bible and God needs our help to defend them

Early in the scripture, they were chosen but fast forward to Jeremiah 3:8, you will see that God divorced them because they were whores.

 

[Nefertiti]

Islam is an anachronism.

Much like the Christianity of the Dark and Middle Ages, Islam needs a renaissance, an enlightenment of its own in order to harmonize it with rational and modern social values.

Their society and culture is backwards, therefore, their religion reflects that.

If you love freedom as much as your name suggests, why is it any of your business to tell others how their religion should be?

 

[Korey Kaczynski]

If you love freedom as much as your name suggests, why is it any of your business to tell others how their religion should be?

He's not forcing anything on anybody, he is giving suggestions;.

 

[1000-points-of-fright]

I asked this same question in another thread and was pretty much shouted down as an idiot swallowing what the MSM is spoon feeding the country.

I'm glad this thread is at least trying to answer the question I asked:

I agree that withdrawing and minding our own business will take a lot of wind out of their sails, but the damage is done. Even if we make nice there will still be a few (read: several thousand) jihadis who are beyond reason. The law enforcement model of showing up afterwards to draw the chalk outline and catch the perps doesn't cut it for me when the crime includes mass casualties.

To answer the question of why the US has fewer radicalized Muslims than Europe, I think it's because we're capitalists and so are they. The Middle East has an ancient history of trading, bartering, bargaining and haggling. They're a culture of businessmen and entrepreneurs. America is perfect for them.

 

[Nefertiti]

I believe much of the leadership in the Islamic world think this way, but they would not have such devoted followers if it wasn't for American foreign policy. Most people are the same, wether they are Americans or Arabs...they just want to live their life, get married, have kids, and enjoy life without dramatic upset. We give middle east leaders all they need to whip people up in a frenzy. Anywhere you find a suffering people, you will find the power hungry would-be saviors of humanity ready to "help" when it's usually these same psychotic people who cause the problems in the first place. The neo-cons operate in this way, though the people are not suffering deep enough to let the ride roughshod over our liberties and install a neo-con dictator quit yet.

Indeed, Muslims in the Middle East want to live their life freely as people in the US live their life. They may not choose to live it exactly like an American Christian would but they would like to have the option to choose what is best for them.

You know, the other day on an Egyptian Web site there was a thread about immigrating to America. So many Egyptians were expressing their great desire to come live here because they admire America and its freedoms so much. One guy wrote something like, "It is my greatest dream to go to America. I just want to be able to spend a dollar, and then I can die." I know many Egyptians who disagree with US policy in the Middle East, but you will be hard pressed to find one that doesn't admire the life that Americans live in their own country.

 

[Nefertiti]

He's not forcing anything on anybody, he is giving suggestions;.

OK, he's not forcing it. But why does it matter to him if Muslims choose to live their lives differently from him? If the way Muslims live their life is backwards from his perspective, then he perhaps should think about the fact that his suggestions might seem a little backwards to Muslims.

 

[Korey Kaczynski]

OK, he's not forcing it. But why does it matter to him if Muslims choose to live their lives differently from him? If the way Muslims live their life is backwards from his perspective, then he perhaps should think about the fact that his suggestions might seem a little backwards to Muslims.

It matters to him because he feel "his way" is better. That's why.

 

[SeekLiberty]

There is a great article at http://www.opednews.com/articles/opedne_alex_wal_070701_ron_paul_3a_making_ame.htm

From the article:

"...the fact that we are not protecting our borders exposes the entire exercise as nothing more than a criminal sham. It negates any claims that we are protecting our national security interests in fighting them abroad. Pulling our troops back and stationing them along the border makes far more sense than the policy we are pursuing now."

"...the fact that we are not protecting our borders exposes the entire exercise as nothing more than a criminal sham.

Yes, very good article. You'd think most Americans could see that the very fact our military is not securing our own borders glaringly demonstrates an outragious criminal scam by our Commander in Chief.

It's right there in our face. The non-action here proves it. Why do some have such a hard time connecting the dots?

- SL