Important ! Energy Independence hardly addressed ! OPPORTUNITY!

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CrownThyGood

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May 22, 2007
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What an opportune time to address energy independence. $100 dollars a barrel for oil now and most everyone knows this and are sick and tired for paying ridiculous prices for a type fuel which shoulda be extinct.
Ron talks about free market dictating what type of fuel to use for transportation. Pull out all the stops on what types can be used and what his plans are to help the market for energy independence and use it in the caucuses.
 
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I'm talking about HHO hydrogen cars http://youtube.com/watch?v=pwlOw7iCNrI and electric cars. We all know this is a huge issue. So if Dr. Paul addressed this and had a plan to put the technology in effect wouldn't that create jobs and give us something to export(trade)? If it's all about freedom then here it is. You get in your car, go to the fill station, get raped by high prices just to be an effective productive citizen. Could you imagine just plugging in your car or just putting a gallon of water in yur tank. NOW THAT"S FREEDOM!
 
The market decides. There are so many subsidies to oil companies nowadays by government that Hybrids are a joke.

Hybrids can't compete.
 
he did say in the video that they could run exclusively on water. Wal-mart is selling an electric mini-cooper. This has got to spread but not exclusively to the big car mfg companies because then you're dealing with too much control over the market. The regulations have to come off but not so much that people get hurt, just passionately pursue it through private developers. It's not like they're stupid and the big manufacturers have all the brains. What investor wouldn't jump all over this? I don't know all the ins and outs but hey.. the future is here!
 
Hydrogen is not a form of energy, it is a storage medium, much like a battery. Hydrogen must be charged with electricity, which comes from burning fossil fuels (coal, natural gas, oil).

Read about hydrogen cars here: Wikipedia Hydrogen Vehicles

At present there is no fuel which can compete with oil on a head to head basis. When (and if) a new technology is introduced that is cheaper, as efficient and more environmentally friendly it will be adopted without the need for any government intervention whatsoever.

In the meantime I suggest you figure out ways to drive less. I only fill up my gas tank about once a month, and most of that is for recreational driving. It won't bother me if oil goes up to $600 a barrel. In fact I hope it does. That will be all the motivation people need to stop driving so much and that will create a brand new market for alternative modes of transportation all by itself.
 
wow .. you hope for 600 a barrel eh. that just alot more bondage and a big oil tycoons wet dream. It also would cripple the economy if we waited till that point to just get motivated.
In the video below the guy who invented and has his own hydrogen powered car says he won't sellout to big corporations but he's waiting for the right guy to actually put it to use for the betterment of humanity. . and i think you may know someone who fighting for that cause. hint.. hint. There's alot more vids on "hygrogen car".


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UVhXrvCCILw&NR=1
 
CrownThyGood said:
I'm talking about HHO hydrogen cars http://youtube.com/watch?v=pwlOw7iCNrI and electric cars. We all know this is a huge issue. So if Dr. Paul addressed this and had a plan to put the technology in effect wouldn't that create jobs and give us something to export(trade)? If it's all about freedom then here it is. You get in your car, go to the fill station, get raped by high prices just to be an effective productive citizen. Could you imagine just plugging in your car or just putting a gallon of water in your tank. NOW THAT"S FREEDOM!
Click to expand...

I believe this fellow was murdered last year. I do not know what happened to his technology. There is another hydrogen based technology in New Jersey that has been in development for over 15 years and is well past the prototype stage. It is well funded and supported. Check out http://www.blacklightpower.com/.
 
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CrownThyGood said:
wow .. you hope for 600 a barrel eh. that just alot more bondage and a big oil tycoons wet dream. It also would cripple the economy if we waited till that point to just get motivated.
In the video below the guy who invented and has his own hydrogen powered car says he won't sellout to big corporations but he's waiting for the right guy to actually put it to use for the betterment of humanity. . and i think you may know someone who fighting for that cause. hint.. hint. There's alot more vids on "hygrogen car".


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UVhXrvCCILw&NR=1
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there is no such thing as hydrogen, currently, as a fuel source. As a ron paul supporter, i expect you to be less ignorant about such a topic. To make hydrogen, we separate it from water by providing fossil fuel energy. The higher the oil price, the quicker we can move to alternates.
 
Registered said:
As a ron paul supporter, i expect you to be less ignorant about such a topic.
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All bow to the mighty Ron Paul?.. umm i really don't think we're here for him it's his message. Were the one's that actually carry out his ideas we believe in. It's about freedom. Piece!
There are several companies working on this same technology.. ford, bmw and a few more home based techies. That link from Jeremiah has a cool video on that site. It even talks about other uses for the energy. This science is actually came alot further than i thought.
Ya see people this is exactly what i'm talking about, none of the candidates that i know of have been specific about technologies like this or others. Don't try and tell me it don't exist, i just watched a hydrogen powered ford fusion go 207 mph. We know people are really looking for alot of change in just about every area in life we face. What would happen if someone actually addressed this HUGE issue on national television? People would be like "huh..a real answer" not rhetoric. We need gasoline like we need the federal reserve!
 
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CrownThyGood said:
All bow to the mighty Ron Paul?.. umm i really don't think we're here for him it's his message. Were the one's that actually carry out his ideas we believe in. It's about freedom. Piece!
There are several companies working on this same technology.. ford, bmw and a few more home based techies. That link from Jeremiah has a cool video on that site. It even talks about other uses for the energy. This science is actually came alot further than i thought.
Ya see people this is exactly what i'm talking about, none of the candidates that i know of have been specific about technologies like this or others. Don't try and tell me it don't exist, i just watched a hydrogen powered ford fusion go 207 mph. We know people are really looking for alot of change in just about every area in life we face. What would happen if someone actually addressed this HUGE issue on national television? People would be like "huh..a real answer" not rhetoric. We need gasoline like we need the federal reserve!
Click to expand...

Thermodynamics disagrees with you.
 
correction-- i did hear the good doctor talk about it once. He mentioned the free market stepping up to produce the fuel alternatives and nuclear is one of the things he brought up. The Nuclear Car! :p
A free society causes the poeple to be innovative and flourish with great ideas. Taxes, dependence, and mind control just brings the people down.
 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BLACf9GObVo&NR=1

they say those are for lease but not for sale to the public cuz they're too expensive. There's the prob, too many greedy people trying to get a strangle hold on it. instead of freeing the people with a more modest affordable version of the car it's in their wallet's best interest to keep the lower or middle class in bondage with big gas taxes and dirty air. It looks like the big corporations would try to sell the hydrogen and put regulations on it. Unless we get people like Ron Paul elected!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by CrownThyGood
All bow to the mighty Ron Paul?.. umm i really don't think we're here for him it's his message. Were the one's that actually carry out his ideas we believe in. It's about freedom. Piece!
There are several companies working on this same technology.. ford, bmw and a few more home based techies. That link from Jeremiah has a cool video on that site. It even talks about other uses for the energy. This science is actually came alot further than i thought.
Ya see people this is exactly what i'm talking about, none of the candidates that i know of have been specific about technologies like this or others. Don't try and tell me it don't exist, i just watched a hydrogen powered ford fusion go 207 mph. We know people are really looking for alot of change in just about every area in life we face. What would happen if someone actually addressed this HUGE issue on national television? People would be like "huh..a real answer" not rhetoric. We need gasoline like we need the federal reserve!
Click to expand...

Thermodynamics disagrees with you.
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+1 for the thermo comment.

Let me explain this simply. The first law of thermodynamics states that matter and energy cannot be created or destroyed in a non-nuclear reaction. Gasoline is not man made, we simply seperate it out of crude oil. Kerosine, diesel, jet fuel, etc are all seperated from oil.

ALL the alternatives require us to actually use a chemical reaction to create fuel. This is true for biodiesel, hydrogen, ethanol, etc. Even if the process was 100% efficient, we would be breaking even. I can guarantee you for a fact that the process is no where near 100%.

This then means that we would use more energy in electricity than we would get from hydrogen, biodiesel, ethanol, etc. Since 60% of electricity comes from oil burning power plants, these fuels would actually increase our dependency on foreign oil.

Coal is not an option because of the EPA. Believe it or not there is more energy in coal in Indiana and Illinois than there is energy in Saudi's oil fields. Since this midwest coal contains a lot of sulfur, it would be too expensive to burn and still meet EPA regulations.

Now if all of our electricty was nuclear in nature, then we would be energy independent. The system would still be far more inefficient, but wouldnt require oil.

Alternative fuels have always been about saving the environment, not the economy, and certainly not our check books.
 
As a side note, I havent looked into biodiesel a whole lot. It might be viable in small independent garage based production "plants". I say this because the process takes a waste that is normally thrown out, and uses as fuel. I sincerely doubt that as a country, the US uses enough vegetable oil to run the country on biodiesel.

So it might be an option that will make a small dent. Its effct is probably comparable to trying to stop a runaway semi by shooting it with a BB gun.
 
There are a lot of alternate sources of energy out there for vehicles that are supressed, through intimidation and even assassination....
 
alex_trebek said:
Alternative fuels have always been about saving the environment, not the economy, and certainly not our check books.
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Oh yeah .. i forgot , everyone should trust the government. There's no corruption in the oil industry.

Let's flood this thread with sites and videos on electric, hydrogen and whatever else is out there type of cars. Don't limit it to cars only though. Solar power is great. I've heard of generators that put out 5 times more energy than they take to run.

I would so love to see the day when people are not locked into a system of debt and tax. YOU pay for everything. water, sewer, garbage, electricity, property tax etc etc.
 
okay umm.. but I created this thread so we could maybe give dr. paul some valid points on energy. Saying that the market decides offers no direct solution in the ears of potential voters. Attaching viable technologies and solutions to himself would be great. Barrack talks about doubling or tripling the mpg of cars and has sets dates. Even though that may be what people wanna hear it's really just says more oil for 20 years or longer. That's why i'm saying he could score some serious points by elaborating on the technologies that we have right now that aren't talked about.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=I4kufAhnJtc
 
There'd have to be a mini-revolution of sorts here in the U.S. amongst
the companies themselves that produce the oil-based derivatives (gasoline)
in order to massively re-tool their industry.

For this, I would suggest a federal program that would assist the oil
companies in retraining and retooling for a gasoline-to-kerosene
makeover [1], while the automobile manufacturers retrain for replacing
the internal combustion engine with the nuclear powered type.

Stations that sell gasoline could make just as much profit selling
the purified H-H-O that gets "cracked" as they do the gasoline.

Each of these industries would receive a tax credit for the expenses
incurred in retooling and retraining, the oil crisis would be solved,
and the human race would benefit the most.

[1] LOX/Kerosene is the major propellent of the Saturn V series
boosters, and a major supply of these vehicles for earth-to-orbit
technology would launch the country into a new space age.
Payload costs would drastically reduce. Space-entrepreneurs
would rekindle the promise markets, and the country would
enjoy the fruits of a major new industrial revolution.

NASA supporter

"Man always travels along precipices. His truest obligation
is to keep his balance."
- Jose Ortega Y Gasset
 
Andrew-Austin said:
There are a lot of alternate sources of energy out there for vehicles that are supressed, through intimidation and even assassination....
Click to expand...

Lets see what has not been mentioned.......

WIND. Sometimes it blows and sometimes it doesn't, but its free.

SOLAR. Gives up all life that glowing ball'o' fusion.

GEOTHERMAL. Remember plate tectonics? There is a crapton of energy beneath our feet.

HYDRODYNAMIC. Water flows downhill. Why do you think that China just made the biggest Dam in the world? Water moves downhill due to the gravity, harness it and you get low cost energy.

NUCLEAR has the problem that waste is potential fissionable material.

Obviously the Holy Grail of energy is low-temp fusion, but at this point that is still only theoretical fantacy.
 
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