How To End The Fed Now! by use of lawful money

[Lindsey]

You really want to frustrate your accountant?

Ask him to show you the law that states that "Personal income Tax" is legal.

Stress Personal in that question.

The real Truth is that there is no law !

Yes, I understand this, but I am still paying what the IRS says is required at this time.

Thank you for your help!

 

[GeorgiaAvenger]

Does Bill Still support this idea?

 

[Lindsey]

I've also worked for companies in the past the required employees to receive their paycheck by direct deposit. There was no option for a paper check. What options do people in that situation have?

 

[unknown]

Cliff notes please.

 

[jointhefightforfreedom]

Cliff notes please.

From the US treasury website: http://www.treasury.gov/resource-center/faqs/Currency/Pages/legal-tender.aspx

"What are United States Notes and how are they different from Federal Reserve notes?"
"The issuance of United States Notes is subject to limitations established by Congress. It established a statutory limitation of $300 million on the amount of United States Notes authorized to be outstanding and in circulation."

"Both United States Notes and Federal Reserve Notes are parts of our national currency and both are legal tender."

"The Federal Reserve Act of 1913 authorized the production and circulation of Federal Reserve notes. Although the Bureau of Engraving and Printing (BEP) prints these notes, they move into circulation through the Federal Reserve System. They are obligations of both the Federal Reserve System and the United States Government."

Questions
1. Why are there 2 Currencies in the united states today?
2. What is the True Significance of these 2 currencies and what truly make them different?

Answer:

One is "lawful money" and the other is a negotiable debt instrument.

You want to Really Stop the bailouts, Inflation, and runaway spending?

Then Act NOW yourself , Stop allowing debt to be created in your name using your money!
If you Redeem lawful money this way The federal reserve can no longer loan out $10 for 3very $1 they have on deposit!
and you also become Tax exempt to boot!

Facts you should know:

1. The Federal Reserve Bank is a PRIVATE CORPORATION ! Not part of the US government.
2. The IRS is a PRIVATE CORPORATION ! Not part of the US government.
3. The IRS is the Collection agency arm of the Voluntary Income Tax and Voluntary Debt Instruments AKA "Federal Reserve Notes"

http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/D?r108:1:./temp/~r108mUXWDd::

By demanding non-negotiable Federal Reserve Notes at the time of cashing any paycheck, you’re avoiding the taxable event:
Redeemed in lawful money Pursuant to 12 USC 411
:True Name: dba LEGAL NAME
You’re avoiding the activity — or the verb — of endorsement. [Actually, I believe it is a restrictive endorsement because it 'restricts' how the bank may negotiate the instrument.]
Negotiable instruments can be exchanged for other and presumably higher forms of currency. So a nonnegotiable Federal Reserve Note is a way of saying that you’re getting United States Notes instead. This is domestic emergency currency, instead of foreign emergency currency (Federal Reserve Notes).

 

[bobburn]

I can not provide legal advice over the internet, however I will tell you that the "lawful money" is a term of art that refers to anything the governments deems legal tender (that is, anything that must be accepted in satisfaction of debts, obligations, etc. whether they be private or public). The reference to US notes on the treasury website is speaking of old currency floating around--it is still valid legal tender. The federal reserve notes have been deemed by congress to be "legal tender." I assure you, although the term "voluntary" is used in reference to the income tax, it is not used in relationship to the duty to pay. Please do not attempt to "opt out" of the income tax or avoid it, this will not end well if the IRS finds out. This will subject you to potential criminal and civil penalties (think Wesley Snipes).

These arguments have never worked in a court nor will they. I abhor the income tax as much as anyone else, however, it is the law. It is incumbent upon every United States citizen to pay their income taxes.

View the following articles: http://docs.law.gwu.edu/facweb/jsiegel/Personal/taxes/IncomeTax.htm

See http://docs.law.gwu.edu/facweb/jsiegel/Personal/taxes/voluntary.htm for an article debunking the "voluntary" nature of the tax.

 

[jointhefightforfreedom]

I've also worked for companies in the past the required employees to receive their paycheck by direct deposit. There was no option for a paper check. What options do people in that situation have?

there are lots of these questions discussed in this thread

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?9307-redeem-lawful-money

 

[jointhefightforfreedom]

I can not provide legal advice over the internet, however I will tell you that the "lawful money" is a term of art that refers to anything the governments deems legal tender (that is, anything that must be accepted in satisfaction of debts, obligations, etc. whether they be private or public). The federal reserve notes have been deemed by congress to be "legal tender." I assure you, although the term "voluntary" is used in reference to the income tax, it is not used in relationship to the duty to pay. Please do not attempt to "opt out" of the income tax or avoid it, this will not end well if the IRS finds out. This will subject you to potential criminal and civil penalties (think Wesley Snipes).

These arguments have never worked in a court nor will they. I abhor the income tax as much as anyone else, however, it is the law. It is incumbent upon every United States citizen to pay their income taxes.

View the following articles: http://docs.law.gwu.edu/facweb/jsiegel/Personal/taxes/IncomeTax.htm

See http://docs.law.gwu.edu/facweb/jsiegel/Personal/taxes/voluntary.htm for an article debunking the "voluntary" nature of the tax.

Thank you !
A lawyer finally !!!

I understand the Fear of fighting the IRS. I fully understand Rights and responsibilities , as most do not stand up for thier rights due to the IRS nazi's

Personally , i am endorsing my checks this way , paying my taxes, keeping a record of all checks redeemed to non-negotiable lawful money , then intend on filing with the IRS to recover these funds. That way i won't have to worry about any type of Tax evasion Wesley snipe scenarios.

However,

I would like to ask Dr. Paul about the effect of this on the FED?
what i have been told and have read on this subject is that this Does stop Federal reserve banks from using any funds deposited with this endorsement for fractional lending.

what is your opinion (not legal advise of course) on this part?

According to the treasury Dept WE CURRENTLY DO HAVE 2 competing Currencies.
http://www.treasury.gov/resource-center/faqs/Currency/Pages/legal-tender.aspx
The info on the US treasury site raises lots of questions and curiosity!
I wonder if the Truth is right in front of us !
1971 Nixon severed the last tie to gold/silver standard with bretton woods?
Why have they allowed United States Notes to remain in circulation? because they couldn't find them all? I think Not!
Why is there such a distinction between the 2 notes Today? Is it because we do volunteer to enter into use of FRN's as a debt instrument and not lawwful money?

If this is truly the case and we can choose not to use FRN' as negotiable instruments and replace them with United States Notes (not a debt instrument) with a ciculation cap of $300 Million.

Then We Really CAN End the Fed and rein in out of control Spending NOW ! Without waiting on an election and no matter the outcome.

What are Federal Reserve notes and how are they different from United States notes?
Federal Reserve notes are legal tender currency notes. The twelve Federal Reserve Banks issue them into circulation pursuant to the Federal Reserve Act of 1913. A commercial bank belonging to the Federal Reserve System can obtain Federal Reserve notes from the Federal Reserve Bank in its district whenever it wishes. It must pay for them in full, dollar for dollar, by drawing down its account with its district Federal Reserve Bank.

Federal Reserve Banks obtain the notes from our Bureau of Engraving and Printing (BEP). It pays the BEP for the cost of producing the notes, which then become liabilities of the Federal Reserve Banks, and obligations of the United States Government.

Congress has specified that a Federal Reserve Bank must hold collateral equal in value to the Federal Reserve notes that the Bank receives. This collateral is chiefly gold certificates and United States securities. This provides backing for the note issue. The idea was that if the Congress dissolved the Federal Reserve System, the United States would take over the notes (liabilities). This would meet the requirements of Section 411, but the government would also take over the assets, which would be of equal value. Federal Reserve notes represent a first lien on all the assets of the Federal Reserve Banks, and on the collateral specifically held against them.

Federal Reserve notes are not redeemable in gold, silver or any other commodity, and receive no backing by anything This has been the case since 1933. The notes have no value for themselves, but for what they will buy. In another sense, because they are legal tender, Federal Reserve notes are "backed" by all the goods and services in the economy.

What are United States Notes and how are they different from Federal Reserve notes?
United States Notes (characterized by a red seal and serial number) were the first national currency, authorized by the Legal Tender Act of 1862 and began circulating during the Civil War. The Treasury Department issued these notes directly into circulation, and they are obligations of the United States Government. The issuance of United States Notes is subject to limitations established by Congress. It established a statutory limitation of $300 million on the amount of United States Notes authorized to be outstanding and in circulation. While this was a significant figure in Civil War days, it is now a very small fraction of the total currency in circulation in the United States.

Both United States Notes and Federal Reserve Notes are parts of our national currency and both are legal tender. They circulate as money in the same way. However, the issuing authority for them comes from different statutes. United States Notes were redeemable in gold until 1933, when the United States abandoned the gold standard. Since then, both currencies have served essentially the same purpose, and have had the same value. Because United States Notes serve no function that is not already adequately served by Federal Reserve Notes, their issuance was discontinued, and none have been placed in to circulation since January 21, 1971.

The Federal Reserve Act of 1913 authorized the production and circulation of Federal Reserve notes. Although the Bureau of Engraving and Printing (BEP) prints these notes, they move into circulation through the Federal Reserve System. They are obligations of both the Federal Reserve System and the United States Government. On Federal Reserve notes, the seals and serial numbers appear in green.

United States notes serve no function that is not already adequately served by Federal Reserve notes. As a result, the Treasury Department stopped issuing United States notes, and none have been placed into circulation since January 21, 1971.

 

[Lindsey]

Cliff notes please.

I'm not an expert, but here's my take.

By signing the back of your (pay)checks:

Redeemed in Lawful money
Pursuant to Title 12 USC §411
True name dba Legal name

You give a restricted endorsement.

This slows the process of inflation, because it hinders the banks ability to practice fractional reserve banking (at least on the amount you just deposited in this manner.) Fractional Reserve Banking allows banks to create "money" out of thin air, because banks my lend out 9x the amount of deposits they receive. Your restricted endorsement, keeps the banks from being able to use your deposit in this manner, because your deposit is theoretically for "US Notes" as opposed to "Federal Reserve Notes." Unlike FRN, US Notes are not elastic and lending of US Notes cannot exceed cash on hand, so to speak.

An added side effect may be that you do not owe income tax on money received this way, because you have "opted out" of the Federal Reserve pyramid scheme with your restricted endorsement. However, the personal risks of pursuing this tax angle likely outweighs the personal rewards.

Disclaimer: I only started reading about this approx. 2.5 hours ago, proceed with caution.

 

[spudea]

this can't work with direct deposit, and how do I get all my FRN i've already accumulated out as US notes? Change banks?

 

[Lindsey]

this can't work with direct deposit, and how do I get all my FRN i've already accumulated out as US notes? Change banks?

My understanding is that you can't really get US Notes, since they are no longer in circulation. When you opt-out with your restricted endorsement, you effectively make FRN's act like USN while in your possession, because the bank cannot make loans against them.

 

[jointhefightforfreedom]

More info i found on this subject:

http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/12/411
http://keystoliberty2.wordpress.com/2012/01/12/federal-reserve-act-remedy-title-12/

http://savingtosuitorsclub.net/show...my-deposit-with-demand-to-redeem-lawful-money
WOW ! Here is a post from the link above


"Bank stonewalling my deposit with demand to redeem lawful money
My local bank, one of two banks with branches in my community, has been dragging its feet for two weeks after my initial demand to redeem lawful money on 7/18/11. The first meeting consisted of me attempting to explain the remedy to the branch manager, who had never heard of it, with her final conclusion being that this would have to be run past the bank’s internal legal department. Fine, I can live with that and understand the bank needs to educate itself with its legal obligations.

In this initial meeting I explained I wanted to negotiate my checks with "Redeemed in Lawful Money Pursuant to 12 USC 411" with my lawful name dba legal name as my signature below the verbiage. However, the bank said, based upon their internal policies, they could not alter the title of my account (title = legal name and social security number according to the SSA) or signature card to anything else. Since my only intention, at this point, is to utilize the lawful money made available to me, and to avoid endorsing the private credit of the Federal Reserve, I did not feel I will be 'losing' anything by signing my legal name after the demand instead of my lawful name. Please correct me if I am wrong in this assertion. I realize I am acting on behalf of the legal fiction, my legal name, created by the State.

Yesterday (7/28/11) I received a phone call from a representative of the bank related to their legal/compliance department. The person I spoke with, I will call her Bankster, who is not an attorney, asked me what my intention of doing this was and if my intention was to restrict the bank from loaning against my deposits. I simply replied that it is my intention to not endorse the private credit of the Federal Reserve. Whatever you can or cannot do with the money I deposit is your responsibility, not mine. After several more questions she stated that I could negotiate the checks with the demand for lawful money verbiage so long as I signed with my legal name instead of my lawful name dba legal name.

Today, as a courtesy, I met with the same branch manager I had initially met with to let her know that I was about to deposit my checks and to thank her for working with me on this issue. I live in a small community with a population of about 2,000 and therefore everybody knows everybody and I thought a ‘thank you’ was in order. I was good friends with her daughter in our high school years.

However, it quickly became apparent that she had reached, or had been told, a different understanding based upon the information from the Bankster and legal/compliance department. She said that the bank would not allow me to make a deposit with my demand for lawful money and legal name signature. So she called up Bankster and all three of us had a discussion.

Bankster continually said during yesterday and today’s telephone conversations that it was the banks preference that I do not negotiate a check with a restricted endorsement. I continually corrected her by saying that I am not endorsing the private credit of the Federal Reserve and that the bank's preference is different than what the banks legal obligations are.

Furthermore, she said that she is ‘leaving the door open’ for this to proceed but since ‘it is a gray area’ and there are many different opinions in the matter with very little statutory or case law support (don't know what she meant by this) they want me to respond to the Bankster’s letter and provide additional support of my position (statutes, court cases etc) which I’ve come across in my research.

How would you proceed if you found yourself in this situation? Thanks in advance."

 

[jointhefightforfreedom]

My understanding is that you can't really get US Notes, since they are no longer in circulation. When you opt-out with your restricted endorsement, you effectively make FRN's act like USN while in your possession, because the bank cannot make loans against them.

Lindsey there is currently $300 million in US notes in circulation, all coins fall in this category as well i believe.

see http://www.treasury.gov/resource-center/faqs/Currency/Pages/legal-tender.aspx

 

[Danke]

anyone know anything about this .

Ya, it has been discussed here.

See my sig, \/

 

[Lindsey]

Lindsey there is currently $300 million in US notes in circulation, all coins fall in this category as well i believe.

see http://www.treasury.gov/resource-center/faqs/Currency/Pages/legal-tender.aspx

Ahh I see, I had read it that there had been $300mln in USN, but that banks were no longer circulating the physical bills and would destroy any USN received just as they do with old FRN. My understanding was the the USN in existence currently, were those kept in the hands of the public and not exchanged at any bank since the 1970s or so. I am often wrong though.

 

[jointhefightforfreedom]

Interesting definition!

http://www.investopedia.com/terms/l/lawfulmoney.asp#axzz1jpaAF48t

Definition of 'Lawful Money'
Any form of currency issued by the United States Treasury and not the Federal Reserve System, including gold and silver coins, Treasury notes, and Treasury bonds. Lawful money stands in contrast to fiat money, to which the government assigns value although it has no intrinsic value of its own and is not backed by reserves. Fiat money includes legal tender such as paper money, checks, drafts and bank notes.

Also known as "specie", which means "in actual form."

Investopedia explains 'Lawful Money'
Oddly enough, the dollar bills that we carry around in our wallets are not considered lawful money. The notation on the bottom of a U.S. dollar bill reads "Legal Tender for All Debts, Public and Private", and is issued by the U.S. Federal Reserve, not the U.S. Treasury. Legal tender can be exchanged for an equivalent amount of lawful money, but effects such as inflation can change the value of fiat money. Lawful money is said to be the most direct form of ownership, but for purposes of practicality it has little use in direct transactions between parties anymore.


Read more: http://www.investopedia.com/terms/l/lawfulmoney.asp#ixzz1n4pOTbBk

 

[rhelwig]

Wow, there's a lot of discussion of how to use some magical incantation to get the banks to give you something they cannot and will not (US Notes) when there is a much simpler solution: just receive all your money in coins. Dollar coins (Sacajawhoza, Susan B, etc), quarters, etc are produced by the mint and not the Federal Reserve. Take your money out of the banking system and they can't lend it.

 

[Narmical]

Wow, there's a lot of discussion of how to use some magical incantation to get the banks to give you something they cannot and will not (US Notes) when there is a much simpler solution: just receive all your money in coins. Dollar coins (Sacajawhoza, Susan B, etc), quarters, etc are produced by the mint and not the Federal Reserve. Take your money out of the banking system and they can't lend it.

Good suggestion, Also what about the gold coins offered by the mint?

 

[rhelwig]

Good suggestion, Also what about the gold coins offered by the mint?

We should certainly be using alternatives as much as possible. If you can use gold or silver eagles with some of your trading partners, go for it. You should be aware, however, that the government will still try to tax your transactions at whatever rate is most favorable to them. In other words, if accounting for your transactions in face value is to their benefit, they will insist on it being accounted for in face value; but if market value benefits them more, they will insist it be accounted for in market value. They will change the rules or ignore them if they have to in order to retain and maximize power.

I am mostly trying to build a wall of separation between money and government. There really is no reason for government to be involved in it, other than a power grab. See my sig for more info

 

[Constitutional Paulicy]

You really want to frustrate your accountant?

Ask him to show you the law that states that "Personal income Tax" is legal.

Stress Personal in that question.

The real Truth is that there is no law !

This is true, but the IRS destroys peoples lives every day with audits and people cant do a damned thing about it. Which is why if you are not paying taxes by practicing this method, then I have to believe they will come after you in the same "unlawful" way they are currently doing it. So is this really a way to avoid paying taxes?