How (some) Donald Trump supporters are hurting him

[jmdrake]

Okay. This thread is long overdue. Let's be brutally honest about some things that most sane Ron Paul supporters can agree on.

1) Donald Trump is not the second coming of Ronald Paul or Ronald Reagan or Ron Howard. (Maybe the second coming of Ronald McDonald I suppose. Just kidding. Actually though...maybe not.)

2) Hillary Clinton really really sucks. I mean really really sucks.

3) This country is going to hell in a handbasket. Forget all the hysteria for a moment. Even Obama's "crowning achievement" is crap. (Universal healthcare). The latest reports are that the healthcare gap is widening!

4) The last thing we need are more liberal judges on the SCOTUS.

5) Gary Johnson can't win....and besides he sucks.

6) Daryl Castle is awesome by all accounts....but he can't win either.

7) Bill sucks as much as Hillary and I don't want him back in the Whitehouse as the "first man".

So based on all of the above there are times when I almost kinda wanna support Trump. Not vote for him. He'll win my state anyway and thus I believe it's more important for me to actually vote for who I believe in. But at least support on an emotional level. This is especially true now that Trump is toning down his anti-Muslim, anti-immigrant rhetoric, reaching out to black voters (in an awkward sort of way) and has actually said he regrets some of the really stupid things he's said. But, and this is a big but, when I get exposed to some of his hardcore supporters, especially here, they inspire me to hate him all over again.

Case in point. I noticed a thread on how Hillary might implement gun control got locked. I was like "How could that happen? Isn't that something we all agree on? Don't we all agree that Hillary sucks when it comes to guns?" Curious I clicked on the thread. Low and behold a Trump supporter had hijacked the thread, not to promote Trump but to bash anyone not supporting Trump as somehow "anti gun." Like seriously? One of the early reasons during the primary that I decided I didn't like Trump is because of his pre-campaign statements about how he supported gun control and wanted an assault weapons ban. Yes he "changed" his position but I've seen no evidence that he "changed" before trying to seek the GOP nomination. Then he more recently gave that odd statement about keeping people on the terror watch list from buying guns. (I've yet to see a satisfactory explanation on that.) No certainly someone wishy washy on gun control like Trump is better than someone solidly against guns like Hillary now that the primary season is over. But to say or suggest that people who aren't willing to vote for Trump support gun control is beyond asinine. Seriously John McCain had a better record on the 2nd amendment than does Donald Trump. And I don't know any Ron Paul supporter who voted for McCain. Same with Romney. This whole movement has been about not compromising principles for the sake of political expediency. Once upon a time is seemed like almost everybody[u/b] here knew that. Strategic "lesser of two evils" voting okay if that's what you want to do. Attacking others who don't is never okay!

The other thing that bugs the hell out of me is the mental gymnastics to try to discredit any criticism of Trump whatsoever. I mean come on folks! Even talk radio hosts who had gotten onboard with supporting Trump prior the convention have stated concerns about things that Trump says or has said. And yes some have voiced grave concerns about what's coming out of the campaign, and to a lesser extent Trump, lately with regards to immigration. So no, this isn't "left wing propaganda" or coming from "anti-Trump bias." It's coming from anyone being at all objective about Donald J. Trump. And FWIW Trump needs people who are not immigration hawks to support him. It's not like he doesn't already have the immigration hawk vote sewed up.

I know this will all fall on deaf ears. Or worse the "hard core...you can't say nothing bad about my man" Trump supporters will use this for more nonsensical "If you're not for us you're for the gun grabbers" rhetoric. But if just one Trump supporter says "Hey.....maybe I'm pushing people away" and thinks before typing next time....it will be worth it.

 

[dannno]

Pretty good post, one thing I think you got half wrong and half was about Donald Trump's apology. I still haven't seen an exact quote, but apparently he apologized TOO people who were hurt or offended by what he had said, but I'm not aware that he actually apologized for what he said.

Meaning, people actually bought the media lies that he said all Mexicans are rapists, because the media wrote the phrase "they're rapists" when it was clear what he meant, and he later clarified that he was saying that Mexico was sending "their" rapists and criminals. The thing is, that is factually true. It turns out that prisoners from Mexico have received state assistance to come to America, so they are sending their criminals and rapists here.

So what Trump was saying essentially was that if people bought those lies and were hurt by how the media portrayed his statements, then he apologized for that. And it is true that Trump wants to reach out and help the minority communities, but I would argue that has always been the case. He wants to help preserve their jobs and lower their taxes by not having a big government program called "immigration" that subsidizes the whole process so that people are paid to come here and take the resources that people here have earned.

 

[jmdrake]

Pretty good post, one thing I think you got half wrong and half was about Donald Trump's apology. I still haven't seen an exact quote, but apparently he apologized TOO people who were hurt or offended by what he had said, but I'm not aware that he actually apologized for what he said.

I have seen the exact quote and I've listened to the speech and I am 100% right. Trump said he regretted things he said. He did not say he merely regretted how people took what he said or how the media spun what he said.

Here ya go.

As you know, I am not a politician. I have worked in business, creating jobs and rebuilding neighborhoods my entire adult life. I’ve never wanted to learn the language of the insiders, and I’ve never been politically correct – it takes far too much time, and can often make more difficult.

Sometimes, in the heat of debate and speaking on a multitude of issues, you don’t choose the right words or you say the wrong thing. I have done that, and I regret it, particularly where it may have caused personal pain. Too much is at stake for us to be consumed with these issues.

But one thing I can promise you is this: I will always tell you the truth.

Meaning, people actually bought the media lies that he said all Mexicans are rapists, because the media wrote the phrase "they're rapists" when it was clear what he meant, and he later clarified that he was saying that Mexico was sending "their" rapists and criminals. The thing is, that is factually true. It turns out that prisoners from Mexico have received state assistance to come to America, so they are sending their criminals and rapists here.

Trump wasn't specific about what he said he regretted and neither was I. Here's an example of something that he said that was absolutely wrong no matter how you slice it.

"John McCain was only a war hero because I got captured. I prefer the ones that don't get captured."

That was some 100% grade A bullshit. The only way a soldier/sailor/marine/airman can 100% avoid being captured is to never go into enemy territory. John McCain was volunteering to fly over enemy territory while Donald Trump was dodging the Vietnam war draft. (Legally of course but it was still a dodge.) I can't stand McCain. But denigrating all POWs like that was bullshit.

 

[RandallFan]

Trump wanted to lawfully shoot people in 1980s in New York with his own handgun. Makes him to the right of most Republicans.

What was the handgun ban approval rate amongst 1980s Republicans.

If Clinton wins, the Republicans roll over because she has a mandate & you better get with the current year, boy! No one knows what Trump's mandate is; & the wimp Republicans will block most of it.

 

[silverhandorder]

Trump supporters are great. I am tired of being hushed.

So for the OP some supporters are hurting him with some unknown online. They are not hurting him where it counts with quality people who will vote for him.

I don't trust OPs narrative not one bit. Not his description of Trump people and not his description of what Trump says and not his description of a locked thread.

Btw OP if you do end up voting for Trump it will be because of what he says and what you believe in and no one here is going to effect that.

 

[jmdrake]

Trump supporters are great. I am tired of being hushed.

Suite yourself.

So for the OP some supporters are hurting him with some unknown online. They are not hurting him where it counts with quality people who will vote for him.

Yeah. Trump has done enough damage to himself in that regard. He seems to be trying to turn that around and some of his own supporters are becoming unglued and/or in complete denial about what he's doing.

I don't trust OPs narrative not one bit. Not his description of Trump people and not his description of what Trump says and not his description of a locked thread.

Here is the thread in question.

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showth...he-Second-Amend&highlight=hillary+gun+control

And this is what a Trump supporter said to make the thread go to hell.

Aside from open borders, this is one of the top reasons the rabid RPF anti-Trump contingent is cheering a Trump loss in favor of a Hillary Clinton presidency since it fulfills their dream for this kind gun control. With Hillary picking Supreme Court justices there will be no chance for Rand or future Presidents to repeal it. Pretty obvious when some of them support Gary Johnson - a classic liberal (non-libertarian) gun grabber.

That was the second fucking post in the thread! So a thread that would have been an attack on Hillary Clinton became an attack on people who don't support Donald Trump followed immediately by counter attacks against Trump and his supporters. How does that help Trump exactly?

Btw OP if you do end up voting for Trump it will be because of what he says and what you believe in and no one here is going to effect that.

No way at this point that I'm voting for Trump. But if I do it will be because the unthinkable has happened and Trump has tanked so bad that he's about to lose a very red state. In other words, you really don't want me voting for Trump.

 

[AuH20]

Edit. wrong thread.