How do I explain to someone that not everything is as peachy as they may think ???

OceanBlue

Member
Joined
Nov 7, 2007
Messages
24
I need help.
A friend of mine thinks just as I thought 5 months ago, that America is good and our government although it has a few down faults, overall is also good and does good across the globe.
She trusts what she sees on the news and says she will be voting for Hillary. When I tried to informer her on the unconstitutional income tax, her response was but how would we pay for the roads. I have been sending her lots of videos and literature, obviously she has not looked at any of it.
So I want to stop conversing with her on this topic but also for the last time I want to let her know in a short and concise manner what is happening in our world.

She also sent me these comments that Jay Leno made, and I believe this is how she feels as well and she doesn't understand why I am so negative:


Jay Leno wrote this; it's the Jay Leno we don't often see....

"The other day I was reading Newsweek magazine and came across some poll data I found rather hard to believe. It must be true, given the source, right?

The Newsweek poll alleges that 67 percent of Americans are unhappy with the direction the country is headed, and 69 percent of the country is unhappy with the performance of the President. In essence, 2/3's of the citizenry just isn't happy and want a change.

So being the knuckle dragger I am, I started thinking, ''What are we so unhappy about?''
Is it that we have electricity and running water 24 hours a day, 7 days a week?

Is our unhappiness the result of having air conditioning in the summer and heating in the winter?

Could it be that 95.4 percent of these unhappy folks have a job?

Maybe it is the ability to walk into a grocery store at any time, and see more food in moments than Darfur has seen in the last year?

Maybe it is the ability to drive from the Pacific Ocean to the Atlantic Ocean without having to present identification papers as we move through each state?

Or possibly the hundreds of clean and safe motels we would find along the way that can provide temporary shelter?

I guess having thousands of restaurants with varying cuisine from around the world is just not good enough.

Or could it be that when we wreck our car, emergency workers show up and
provide services to help all, and even send a helicopter to take you to the hospital.

Perhaps you are one of the 70 percent of Americans who own a home. You may be upset with knowing that in the unfortunate case of a fire, a group of trained firefighters will appear in moments and use top notch equipment to extinguish the flames thus saving you, your family and your belongings.

Or if, while at home watching one of your many flat screen TVs, a burglar or prowler or intrudes , an officer equipped with a gun and a bullet-proof vest will come to defend you and your family against attack or loss.

This all in the backdrop of a neighborhood free of bombs or militias raping and pillaging the residents. Neighborhoods where 90 percent of teenagers own cell phones and computers.

How about the complete religious, social and political freedoms we enjoy that are the envy of everyone in the world?

Maybe that is what has 67 percent of you folks unhappy.

Fact is, we are the largest group of ungrateful, spoiled brats the world has ever seen. No wonder the world loves the U.S., yet has a great disdain for its citizens. They see us for what we are. The most blessed people in the world who do nothing but complain about what we don't have , and what we hate about the country instead of thanking the good Lord we live here.

I know, I know. What about the President who took us into war and has no plan to get us out? The President who has a measly 31 percent approval rating? Is this the same President who guided the nation in the dark days after 9/11? The President that cut taxes to bring an economy out of recession? Could this be the same guy who has been called every name in the book for succeeding in keeping all the spoiled ungrateful brats safe from terrorist attacks?

The Commander-In Chief of an all-volunteer army that is out there defending you and me? Did you hear how bad the President is on the news or talk show? Did this news affect you so much, make you so unhappy you couldn't take a look around for yourself and see all the good things and be glad?

Think about it...are you upset at the President because he actually caused you personal pain OR is it because the "Media" told you he was failing to kiss your sorry ungrateful behind every day.

Make no mistake about it. The troops in Iraq and Afghanistan have volunteered to serve, and in many cases may have died for your freedom. There is currently no draft in this country. They didn't have to go.

They are able to refuse to go and end up with either a ''general'' discharge, an ''other than honorable'' discharge or, worst case scenario, a ''dishonorable'' discharge after a few days in the brig.

So why then the flat-out discontentment in the minds of 69 percent of Americans? Say what you want, but I blame it on the media. If it bleeds, it leads; and they specialize in bad news. Everybody will watch a car crash with blood and guts. How many will watch kids selling lemonade at the corner? The media knows this and media outlets are for-profit corporations. They offer what sells , and when criticized, try to defend their actions by "justifying" them in one way or another. Just ask why they tried to allow a murderer like O.J. Simpson to write a book about "how he didn't kill his wife, but if he did he would have done it this way"...Insane!

Stop buying the negativism you are fed everyday by the media. Shut off the TV, burn Newsweek, and use the New York Times for the bottom of your bird cage. Then start being grateful for all we have as a country. There is exponentially more good than bad.

We are among the most blessed people on Earth, and should thank God several times a day, or at least be thankful and appreciative.

"With hurricanes, tornados, fires out of control, mud slides, flooding, severe thunderstorms tearing up the country from one end to another, and with the threat of bird flu and terrorist attacks, "Are we sure this is a good time to take God out of the Pledge of Allegiance?"

Jay Leno
2007
 
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The gasoline tax is what pays for the roads.

Why is that the common response, incidentally? "How will we pay for the roads?" I get that a lot.
 
Show her the Jay Leno interview with Ron Paul.

Don't try to convince her that her 'peachy' beliefs are wrong. You can send her videos and literature all day long, but nobody in their right mind is going to sit at their computer to watch a 2-hour "conspiracy theory" video.

Instead, compare Hillary's policies to Dr. Paul's policies. Just like you, she has to arrive at her opinion herself. It should be a targeted assault on her political awareness. Just deliver Ron Paul to her and say that this is the only candidate that gives you hope. If she is accusing you of being negative, portray a positive theme through Ron Paul's policies.

Remember-- you attract more flies with honey than with vinegar.
 
She also sent me these comments that Jay Leno made, and I believe this is how she feels as well and she doesn't understand why I am so negative

By the way, did you see that forum adminstrator's comments in the post below your quote?


http://forum.breakthechain.org/index.php?topic=76.0
 
The "Jay Leno" piece that you are referring to is an attempt to refute the obvious by 'sticking one's head in the sand' approach to addressing the core issues and instead painting a rosy picture of relative prosperity. While it is true that our country has been blessed....we do enjoy a comparatively high standard of living.... we are also living on borrowed time. The policy decisions that have been implemented and/or are being considered do nothing to address the roots of our problems. In fact, they don't even ACKNOWLEDGE those root causes; they simply attempt to cure lung cancer with cough medicine. When one points out the obvious peril in such short-sighted thinking, arguments like the 'Jay Leno' response are the reply.
 
I love it that when some one says they want to give a top notch healthcare to every single American, people go yeah, you got my vote, without even thinking how it'll be paid for.

Yet when someone says I want to eliminate the income tax, everybody scoffs at it as being too unrealistic and wonder who will "pay for the roads".

We are so backward.
 
Yeah but when you have to work 60 hours week to earn half the amount of opressively devalued american dollars you actually worked for to pay for your oppressively overpriced goods and services the view is a little different.
When you see elected officials selling future income down the river to pay for present deficits. (see Corzine in NJ for instance) You can see something is wrong.
Oh and for the record my health plan blows. I pay $250 a month for jack. I'm lucky a doctor even talks to me.
I'm not even a guy with credit card debt. I don't have the latest this or that. It's stuff like groceries, insurance, and gas that are breaking the middle class' back. Flat panel TV's come on! I make as much as my father did when the currency was worth twice as much.
 
I love it that when some one says they want to give a top notch healthcare to every single American, people go yeah, you got my vote, without even thinking how it'll be paid for.

Yet when someone says I want to eliminate the income tax, everybody scoffs at it as being too unrealistic and wonder who will "pay for the roads".

We are so backward.


QFT.
 
If your friends lives in the "Leno" essay world, she is a lost cause. Better to discuss issues with people who are atleast a bit suspicous of the way things are.

Anybody voting for Hillary Clinton is a seriously uninformed citizen. Period. I bet your friend can name all the current American Idol contenstants though, good for her.
 
why don't you point out that the rest of the world has it so bad because of our exploitation of them. point her to the fact that through world bank we cripple 3rd will countries with loans at 20-30% to "help" them. then after they default on their loans the IMF comes in offers them an out and it basically amounts to giving our greedy corporations free reign to exploit every availible natural resource the country has. giving them 10-20 percent of the profits. then we prop up dictators and overthrow beloved democratically elected leaders to protect our interests and prevent the countries from ever nationalizing these things. if the dictator doesn't accept a bribe and isn't politcally able to be blackmailed then our good and wonderful cia either raises a coup or assassinates. they don't even get the benefit of things on their own land.

why don't you point out to her that nearly 1 million iraq civilians are dead by some estimates. why don't you point out the fact they we are dropping our depleted uranium waste all across their country. why don't you point out that if this great guy that is protecting her from terrorism is about to start world war 3 and we can't do that without a military draft. why don't you point out our involvement in the sex slave trade through third world countries ( i know it sounds crazy but MSNBC reported on it to all the naysayers).

and quite frankly i'm not comfortable with this country killing and exploiting the rest of the world in my name and i'm mad god dammit. i feel like an accesory to these atrocities for being a taxpayer and it makes me sick.

why don't you point out all the legislation that is being passed to take away her civil liberties and she possibly won't be living in a free country much longer. (mccain feingold, s1959, patriot act, military commisions act etc. etc. etc.)

honestly though, i've tried to reason with people that think things are just peachy. i've given them mountains of evidence of our misdeeds. still always the same. NAHH UHH DOESN"T EXIST. THE TELEVISION TELLS ME THINGS OUR OK. HOW DOES IT EFFECT ME?

anyone that isn't outraged by some of this stuff is dead weight if you ask me. i really think people will wake up at their own times and hopefully all that time standing in a bread line will give them some time to think about these things.
 
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Use Graphs.

Especially Banking Graphs, Oil graphs whatever.

Anything with big bad spikes.
 
I need help.
A friend of mine thinks just as I thought 5 months ago, that America is good and our government although it has a few down faults, overall is also good and does good across the globe.
She trusts what she sees on the news and says she will be voting for Hillary. When I tried to informer her on the unconstitutional income tax, her response was but how would we pay for the roads. I have been sending her lots of videos and literature, obviously she has not looked at any of it.
So I want to stop conversing with her on this topic but also for the last time I want to let her know in a short and concise manner what is happening in our world.

She also sent me these comments that Jay Leno made, and I believe this is how she feels as well and she doesn't understand why I am so negative:


Jay Leno wrote this; it's the Jay Leno we don't often see....

"The other day I was reading Newsweek magazine and came across some poll data I found rather hard to believe. It must be true, given the source, right?

The Newsweek poll alleges that 67 percent of Americans are unhappy with the direction the country is headed, and 69 percent of the country is unhappy with the performance of the President. In essence, 2/3's of the citizenry just isn't happy and want a change.

So being the knuckle dragger I am, I started thinking, ''What are we so unhappy about?''
Is it that we have electricity and running water 24 hours a day, 7 days a week?

Is our unhappiness the result of having air conditioning in the summer and heating in the winter?

Could it be that 95.4 percent of these unhappy folks have a job?

Maybe it is the ability to walk into a grocery store at any time, and see more food in moments than Darfur has seen in the last year?

Maybe it is the ability to drive from the Pacific Ocean to the Atlantic Ocean without having to present identification papers as we move through each state?

Or possibly the hundreds of clean and safe motels we would find along the way that can provide temporary shelter?

I guess having thousands of restaurants with varying cuisine from around the world is just not good enough.

Or could it be that when we wreck our car, emergency workers show up and
provide services to help all, and even send a helicopter to take you to the hospital.

Perhaps you are one of the 70 percent of Americans who own a home. You may be upset with knowing that in the unfortunate case of a fire, a group of trained firefighters will appear in moments and use top notch equipment to extinguish the flames thus saving you, your family and your belongings.

Or if, while at home watching one of your many flat screen TVs, a burglar or prowler or intrudes , an officer equipped with a gun and a bullet-proof vest will come to defend you and your family against attack or loss.

This all in the backdrop of a neighborhood free of bombs or militias raping and pillaging the residents. Neighborhoods where 90 percent of teenagers own cell phones and computers.

How about the complete religious, social and political freedoms we enjoy that are the envy of everyone in the world?

Maybe that is what has 67 percent of you folks unhappy.

Fact is, we are the largest group of ungrateful, spoiled brats the world has ever seen. No wonder the world loves the U.S., yet has a great disdain for its citizens. They see us for what we are. The most blessed people in the world who do nothing but complain about what we don't have , and what we hate about the country instead of thanking the good Lord we live here.

I know, I know. What about the President who took us into war and has no plan to get us out? The President who has a measly 31 percent approval rating? Is this the same President who guided the nation in the dark days after 9/11? The President that cut taxes to bring an economy out of recession? Could this be the same guy who has been called every name in the book for succeeding in keeping all the spoiled ungrateful brats safe from terrorist attacks?

The Commander-In Chief of an all-volunteer army that is out there defending you and me? Did you hear how bad the President is on the news or talk show? Did this news affect you so much, make you so unhappy you couldn't take a look around for yourself and see all the good things and be glad?

Think about it...are you upset at the President because he actually caused you personal pain OR is it because the "Media" told you he was failing to kiss your sorry ungrateful behind every day.

Make no mistake about it. The troops in Iraq and Afghanistan have volunteered to serve, and in many cases may have died for your freedom. There is currently no draft in this country. They didn't have to go.

They are able to refuse to go and end up with either a ''general'' discharge, an ''other than honorable'' discharge or, worst case scenario, a ''dishonorable'' discharge after a few days in the brig.

So why then the flat-out discontentment in the minds of 69 percent of Americans? Say what you want, but I blame it on the media. If it bleeds, it leads; and they specialize in bad news. Everybody will watch a car crash with blood and guts. How many will watch kids selling lemonade at the corner? The media knows this and media outlets are for-profit corporations. They offer what sells , and when criticized, try to defend their actions by "justifying" them in one way or another. Just ask why they tried to allow a murderer like O.J. Simpson to write a book about "how he didn't kill his wife, but if he did he would have done it this way"...Insane!

Stop buying the negativism you are fed everyday by the media. Shut off the TV, burn Newsweek, and use the New York Times for the bottom of your bird cage. Then start being grateful for all we have as a country. There is exponentially more good than bad.

We are among the most blessed people on Earth, and should thank God several times a day, or at least be thankful and appreciative.

"With hurricanes, tornados, fires out of control, mud slides, flooding, severe thunderstorms tearing up the country from one end to another, and with the threat of bird flu and terrorist attacks, "Are we sure this is a good time to take God out of the Pledge of Allegiance?"

Jay Leno
2007

I usually deal with people like your friend by asking them questions that they will (hopefully) ponder. If I can find out what issues are important to them, I ask questions related to their issues. Then I leave them alone for a while and follow up some time later. Most of the time it works, sometimes it doesn't. And when it doesn't, I just find someone else to work on :p

Some examples off the top of my head:

Did you ever wonder why we're guarding Iraq's borders when we don't bother to guard our own?

Don't you think the first line of defense in protecting our country is to close the borders?

Can you define winning [the war]?

Don't you think it's odd that we're building ____________in Iraq while our bridges are falling down here or we can't even rebuild a city after a hurricane?

or

Don't you think it's an abomination that we give foreign aid to countries like Israel and Saudi Arabia when we can't even rebuild New Orleans?

Free health care sounds great! But somebody has to pay for it. Considering that we already have a $50 trillion unfunded debt, all for entitlement programs, who will pay for this "free" health care?

I know it sounds extreme to eliminate the income tax but I studied the issue and discovered that income taxes account for only about a third of federal revenue. Other revenue such as excise and property taxes account for the rest. Don't you think there's enough waste that could be cut in order to at least greatly reduce the income tax? Wouldn't you like to keep your entire paycheck? or Have you ever considered that when your income is taxed, you're being effectively "punished" for being a producer?

Isn't it strange that we're closing military bases on US soil while building permanent bases overseas?

Have you ever wondered why, if they really did want to end the war, a sitting senator couldn't have done something to make that happen?
 
If she only gets her information from the main stream media, of course she's going to think everything is peachy.
 
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