"Gold has very little intrinsic value"

[talent scout]

well...if you don't think FRNs are valuable I will be happy to take them off your hands.

I sense you are being silly

 

[brandon]

You all sound like a bunch of marxists. Either that or you have no clue what you're talking about.

 

[brandon]

This strikes me as an odd argument.

"Does gold have intrinsic value"

If it didn't have intrinsic value, then no value can be assigned to it to judge its value.

Sure there is. Have you not read the thread? It has subjective value. Just like everything else.

Just as the body organs of the heart, lungs etc have intrinsic value to health and life, gold has intrinsic value for commerce.

Maybe you don't understand what value is. The above sentence makes no sence. "Value to health." How can health value something? Only intelligent beings can assign value.

The value of organs is also subjective.

 

[rpfan2008]

I agree with the essence of the article, honestly.

Gold has only got value where people value it. And I don't think gold is a very 'cool' thing in mainstream American culture, or most other western nations. But if you come to Asia it is valued very highly, specially in Saudi Arabia/ mid east and India. Gold is associated with the culture and rituals etc. in those lands, but I don't believe it has got such cultural significance in west. But when the prospect of cross-border trade is there, it's logical to have gold in other countries as well.

But that's my pov.

In US or any country something that can preserve your value of money is-- land imo. Arable land, with a small house if possible.

 

[talent scout]

Originally Posted by talent scout
This strikes me as an odd argument.

"Does gold have intrinsic value"

If it didn't have intrinsic value, then no value can be assigned to it to judge its value.
Sure there is. Have you not read the thread? It has subjective value. Just like everything else.

Just as the body organs of the heart, lungs etc have intrinsic value to health and life, gold has intrinsic value for commerce.

.







brandonyates writes:

Maybe you don't understand what value is.

Of course not, been waiting 65 years for you to come along and explain it

The above sentence makes no sence. "Value to health." How can health value something? Only intelligent beings can assign value.

I think the problem is, you cannot read English.
Must not be your native language

The value of organs is also subjective.

Maybe you do not know what value or subjective means

 

[talent scout]

I agree with the essence of the article, honestly.

Gold has only got value where people value it. .

Then name any place it does not have value
Today or human history

 

[klamath]

In my book intrinsic value is what a substance's property has that will promote human survival ie the workings of an ecconomy.

Gold is near the top of the list as far as noncorrsiveness.
Gold is near the top of the list as far as specific gravity ie weight.
Gold is at the top of the list as far as malability.
Gold is near the top of the list as far a conductivity.
Gold is used in many many industrial applications.
The tiny wires in you computer are normally made of gold.
Any area where you want unfailing electrical connections uses gold.
A gold bullet would hold more energy than a lead bullet because it is over 60% heavier. That is why the military uses Depleted Uranium for tank killer bullets because it is even heavier than gold.
Gold is used in extreme fire suits to reflect the heat from the face shield.
Gold is used in color film photography.
Good quality dental fillings are still made of gold.
The list of gold uses in other areas besides coinage and jewelry is long. Its rarity and cost hold it back from being used in many other applications where in reality it would be the absolute best substance to use.

 

[idiom]

Can't counterfeit it.

I see much heartache ahead for this one.

Ethiopia's national bank has been told to inspect all the gold in its vaults to determine its authenticity.

It follows the discovery that some of the "gold" it had bought for millions of dollars was gold-plated steel.

The first hint that something was wrong reportedly came when the Ethiopian central bank exported a consignment of gold bars to South Africa.

The South Africans sent them back, complaining that they had been sold gilded steel.

An investigation revealed that the bank had bought a consignment of fake gold from a supplier, who is now under arrest.

Other arrests followed, including business associates of the main accused; national bank officials; and chemists from the Geological Survey of Ethiopia, whose job it is to assay the bank's purchases of gold and certify that they are real.

 

[jyakulis]

WTH are you talking about? If you believe in an intrinsic theory of value than you are at the wrong website and in the wrong political movement.

Maybe the communist party would be a better match for you.

Intrinsic value, in general, is the argument that the value of a product is intrinsic within the product rather than dependent on the buyer's perception.

In commodity money, intrinsic value can be partially or entirely due to the desirable features of the object as a medium of exchange and a store of value. Examples of such features include divisibility; easily and securely storable and transportable; scarcity; and hard to counterfeit. When objects come to be used as a medium of exchange they lower the high transaction costs associated with barter and other in-kind transactions.

In numismatics, intrinsic value is the value of the metal, typically a precious metal, in a coin. For example, if gold trades at a price of USD 450 per fine troy ounce ($14/g), a coin minted from one troy ounce of fine gold would have an intrinsic value of USD 450. When the intrinsic value becomes greater than the face value, the coins are in danger of being removed from circulation in large numbers (an expression of Gresham's law). When the coin is in use as money this effect can, at the margin, mitigate forces that might otherwise cause inflation. When copper prices skyrocketed in the mid-to-late 1970s, there was a fear that the U.S. one-cent piece might succumb to this fate. In fact, this did happen, leading the Mint to change the composition of the cent in 1982.






http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Numismatics

 

[brandon]

In numismatics, intrinsic value is the value of the metal, typically a precious metal, in a coin. For example, if gold trades at a price of USD 450 per fine troy ounce ($14/g), a coin minted from one troy ounce of fine gold would have an intrinsic value of USD 450. When the intrinsic value becomes greater than the face value, the coins are in danger of being removed from circulation in large numbers (an expression of Gresham's law). When the coin is in use as money this effect can, at the margin, mitigate forces that might otherwise cause inflation. When copper prices skyrocketed in the mid-to-late 1970s, there was a fear that the U.S. one-cent piece might succumb to this fate. In fact, this did happen, leading the Mint to change the composition of the cent in 1982.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Numismatics

If you look back at my posts you will see that I clearly stated "intrinsic economic value" as too not confuse the subject with other types of value.

Sure, in numismatics the term "intrinsic value" is colloquially used to refer to the value of metal in the coin as opposed to the added value due to the collectibility of the coin. However, both the value of the metal and the value added by it's collectibility are subjective.

 

[brandon]

I'm still waiting for someone to tell me exactly how much gold is worth. I mean it should be easy to calculate if it's value is intrinsic. Also, why does the price of gold fluctuate if it's value is intrinsic?

 

[idiom]

I'm still waiting for someone to tell me exactly how much gold is worth. I mean it should be easy to calculate if it's value is intrinsic. Also, why does the price of gold fluctuate if it's value is intrinsic?

Its intrinsic values won't be reflected in an extrinsic pricing mechanism?

 

[talent scout]

I'm still waiting for someone to tell me exactly how much gold is worth. I mean it should be easy to calculate if it's value is intrinsic. Also, why does the price of gold fluctuate if it's value is intrinsic?

two different subjects

Look up what the word intrinsic means.
It has been given to you already

 

[talent scout]

Intrinsic value, in general, is the argument that the value of a product is intrinsic within the product rather than dependent on the buyer's perception.

In commodity money, intrinsic value can be partially or entirely due to the desirable features of the object as a medium of exchange and a store of value. Examples of such features include divisibility; easily and securely storable and transportable; scarcity; and hard to counterfeit. When objects come to be used as a medium of exchange they lower the high transaction costs associated with barter and other in-kind transactions.

In numismatics, intrinsic value is the value of the metal, typically a precious metal, in a coin. For example, if gold trades at a price of USD 450 per fine troy ounce ($14/g), a coin minted from one troy ounce of fine gold would have an intrinsic value of USD 450. When the intrinsic value becomes greater than the face value, the coins are in danger of being removed from circulation in large numbers (an expression of Gresham's law). When the coin is in use as money this effect can, at the margin, mitigate forces that might otherwise cause inflation. When copper prices skyrocketed in the mid-to-late 1970s, there was a fear that the U.S. one-cent piece might succumb to this fate. In fact, this did happen, leading the Mint to change the composition of the cent in 1982.






http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Numismatics

Very good definition of intrinsic, and right here to read

 

[talent scout]

The assigned amount of silver for a US Dollar was given in 1791-2

"Dollars or Units DOLLARS OR UNITS--each to be of the value of

a Spanish milled dollar as the same is now

current, and to contain three hundred and

seventy-one grains and four sixteenth parts

of a grain of pure, or four hundred and

sixteen grains of standard silver"



Silver was chosen for its intrinsic value

 

[tmosley]

I'm still waiting for someone to tell me exactly how much gold is worth. I mean it should be easy to calculate if it's value is intrinsic. Also, why does the price of gold fluctuate if it's value is intrinsic?

You don't measure the value of gold. You measure the value of other things in terms of how much gold they are worth. This is the way things work. Gold stays the same value, it's the goods that change in value. Since everything is measured in terms of gold (due to it's relatively constant supply), it has intrinsic value.

Any medium of exchange has an intrinsic value which is tied to its supply. The more constant it is, the more intrinsically valuable it is, and the more likely it is to be used as a universal medium of exchange.

The value of gold DOES NOT fluctuate, even if it's price based in pieces of paper does. The dollar is what is fluctuating, not gold. Gold buys more of less dollars depending on how many dollars there are floating around, just like everything else.

Also, INTERNET RAGE.

 

[talent scout]

The value of gold DOES NOT fluctuate, even if it's price based in pieces of paper does. The dollar is what is fluctuating, not gold. Gold buys more of less dollars depending on how many dollars there are floating around, just like everything else.

Well said, its true.

An ounce of gold today will buy more goods than an ounce of gold did in 1800, 1900 and probably 2000.


Not because gold has increased in value, but what can be bought today is much easier to get than goods were back on 1800 etc.

This is what real money looked like

1913: $50 Gold Certificate
The last of the true Gold Certificates - the Federal Reserve was instituted in December 1913. This is a completely honest and upright money. You can see that it states right on the certificate: "Fifty Dollars In Gold Coin, Payable To The Bearer On Demand".

What you are looking at here is a money substitute. Any holder of this certificate held title to 2.41896 troy oz of Gold (at $US20.67 per troy oz.) which could be redeemed at any bank or from the U.S. Treasury itself at any time.

http://www.usagold.com/gildedopinion/buckler2.html

 

[Josh_LA]

I'm still waiting for someone to tell me exactly how much gold is worth. I mean it should be easy to calculate if it's value is intrinsic. Also, why does the price of gold fluctuate if it's value is intrinsic?

gold is worth what people are willing to pay, no more no less.

If people want to pay $100 for a stupid piece of paper, that's what it's worth.

I don't believe in intrinsic value, but even if I did, that doesn't mean the market can't at times have a different demand for it. Bush's approval ratings go up and down, does that mean he has no intrinsic value? (not that he has in my opinion, but that's a poor reason to say he has none).

 

[talent scout]

.

I don't believe in intrinsic value, .

Statements like this is why I said this is a silly argument.

Doesn't matter what you believe.

Gold has intrinsic value regardless what you believe

 

[rpfan2008]

You don't measure the value of gold. You measure the value of other things in terms of how much gold they are worth. This is the way things work. Gold stays the same value, it's the goods that change in value. Since everything is measured in terms of gold (due to it's relatively constant supply), it has intrinsic value.

That's where I disagree. Value of gold does fluctuate, depending on willingness of potential takers. When the prices of Gold in international markets changes do you think they are happening based on prices of other commodities? No, that fluctuates depending on the willingness/faith/also called 'demand' on the buyer side wrt current availability.

That was my whole point. If an average American starts to value/respect Gold it would make a great alternate currency.

And the reason RP stresses on Gold because it kills the money changers. What 10gm of Gold buys in America will buy the same in Europe or in Asia. Because you can't manipulate the price of Gold across borders, unlike paper currency.