Gary North and the Ron Paul Curriculum

[AmericaFyeah92]

"So let us be blunt about it: we must use the doctrine of religious liberty to gain independence for Christian schools until we train up a generation of people who know that there is no religious neutrality, no neutral law, no neutral education, and no neutral civil government. Then they will get busy constructing a Bible-based social, political, and religious order which finally denies the religious liberty of the enemies of God. Murder, abortion, and pornography will be illegal. God's law will be enforced. It will take time. A minority religion cannot do this. Theocracy must flow from the heart of a majority of citizens, just as compulsory education came only after most people had their children in schools of some sort. [p.25]"

"In order to survive the onslaught of the humanists, Christians must oppose the humanists' version of religious freedom, which is officially grounded in the myth of neutrality, and which is really being used to construct a temple of man, with tax revenues. We must argue that true religious liberty is exclusively for people to obey the social laws of the Bible. [p. 32]"

-Gary North, Myth of Pluralism

So far as I know, North has not recanted his theocratic (not religious, theocratic) beliefs. Now he is going to be the spokesman of Ron's educational movement? Jesus Christ (hehe), what a horrible way for Ron to use his time and resources now that he is out of office

 

[sailingaway]

Gee, that title doesn't say 'Ron Paul's Curriculum' at all, does it?

And what about the fact that TOM WOODS has been working for months drafting on the curriculum Do you think that might have some impact?

Because right now you are just guessing and smearing a curriculum that doesn't even exist.

 

[Ender]

"So let us be blunt about it: we must use the doctrine of religious liberty to gain independence for Christian schools until we train up a generation of people who know that there is no religious neutrality, no neutral law, no neutral education, and no neutral civil government. Then they will get busy constructing a Bible-based social, political, and religious order which finally denies the religious liberty of the enemies of God. Murder, abortion, and pornography will be illegal. God's law will be enforced. It will take time. A minority religion cannot do this. Theocracy must flow from the heart of a majority of citizens, just as compulsory education came only after most people had their children in schools of some sort. [p.25]"

"In order to survive the onslaught of the humanists, Christians must oppose the humanists' version of religious freedom, which is officially grounded in the myth of neutrality, and which is really being used to construct a temple of man, with tax revenues. We must argue that true religious liberty is exclusively for people to obey the social laws of the Bible. [p. 32]"

-Gary North, Myth of Pluralism

So far as I know, North has not recanted his theocratic (not religious, theocratic) beliefs. Now he is going to be the spokesman of Ron's educational movement? Jesus Christ (hehe), what a horrible way for Ron to use his time and resources now that he is out of office

I am always quite amazed at the extreme pettiness and prejudices that come from so-called freedom-lovers posting on a Ron Paul site. He is talking about CHRISTIAN schools. of which you have no obligation to be part of.

And this is about the zillionth thread on this topic-

Get over yourself.

 

[erowe1]

So far as I know, North has not recanted his theocratic (not religious, theocratic) beliefs.

So far as I know, neither has Ron Paul.

 

[sailingaway]

Lew Rockwell and EPJ on this topic:

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showth...(Lew-Rockwell-also-EPJ)&p=4971281#post4971281

 

[AmericaFyeah92]

I am always quite amazed at the extreme pettiness and prejudices that come from so-called freedom-lovers posting on a Ron Paul site. He is talking about CHRISTIAN schools. of which you have no obligation to be part of.

And this is about the zillionth thread on this topic-

Get over yourself.

You clearly didn't read the part where he says he wants to create a "political order" with no religious liberty for anyone who isn't Christian. Or you just have no ability to comprehend what you read.

 

[AmericaFyeah92]

So far as I know, neither has Ron Paul.

Ron Paul has never had theocratic beliefs. He is religious, but he believes in religious freedom and tolerance. Gary North, on the other hand, thinks homosexuals and pornographers should be executed.

 

[sailingaway]

You clearly didn't read the part where he says he wants to create a "political order" with no religious liberty for anyone who isn't Christian. Or you just have no ability to comprehend what you read.

That was just never in Ron's curriculum, that is something you know about him from a different setting. If you run your own business you can do things your way, if you then take a job w someone who does things differently you don't necessarily have that leeway. I trust Ron if he is involved, but you do raise the issue of how much does he actually intend to make sure this reflects his views, and that we won't know until we have it to look at.

Ron Paul has never had theocratic beliefs. He is religious, but he believes in religious freedom and tolerance.

I agree with that.

 

[VoteRandPaul2016]

Ron Paul has never had theocratic beliefs. He is religious, but he believes in religious freedom and tolerance. Gary North, on the other hand, thinks homosexuals and pornographers should be executed.

I highly doubt Dr. Paul would allow Gary North to put anti-gay stuff in his curriculum. Personally I was very skeptical at first, but I'm going to give this all a chance.

 

[AmericaFyeah92]

http://www.lewrockwell.com/blog/lewrw/archives/135452.html

http://www.lewrockwell.com/blog/lewrw/archives/135452.html

http://www.lewrockwell.com/blog/lewrw/archives/135452.html

http://www.lewrockwell.com/blog/lewrw/archives/135452.html

http://www.lewrockwell.com/blog/lewrw/archives/135452.html

http://www.lewrockwell.com/blog/lewrw/archives/135452.html

http://www.lewrockwell.com/blog/lewrw/archives/135452.html

http://www.lewrockwell.com/blog/lewrw/archives/135452.html

PICK ONE AND READ IT.

Obviously Lew agrees that this was a legitimate concern (even if he won't admit it) if he felt the need to "clarify" on his blog. And the Guardian isn't some MSM outlet - they employ Glenn Greenwald for example and regularly cover anti-Empire topics

 

[torchbearer]

Lew Rockwell has an important commentary up about Ron Paul and religion. He writes:

Ron Paul Is Not a Christian Fundamentalist


Despite what the Guardian claims, Ron is no religious right-winger. His non-denominational Protestant faith is tolerant and humble. It's true that Ron employs the brilliant Gary North; he also employs the brilliant Tom Woods, both to help him with his homeschool curriculum. But Ron is neither a Calvinist nor a Catholic, and he is in charge of the content and everything else. And as Ron said yesterday in a conference call, he wants a curriculum that--while recognizing the importance of religion, as the non-religious Murray Rothbard did--is not "Christian."


"I want all parents concerned about getting, a high-quality, low-price, rigorous, parent-controlled, pro-liberty education for their children to be able to use this curriculum, whether they are atheist libertarians or evangelicals or anyone else," he said. Gary North's religious views are not Ron Paul's, and neither are Tom Woods's. But Ron works happily with both these scholars on shared liberty projects. "Freedom brings people together," as he has often noted.

​

 

[VoteRandPaul2016]

I knew Dr. Paul was not a Christian Fundamentalist -- otherwise he wouldn't have such a vast secular following. Nevertheless I am glad Lew clarified that statement on his blog. I am confident that Dr. Paul and Dr. Woods are going to or have already had talks with Mr. North to ensure nothing too over the top religiously is put into the curriculum.

 

[jllundqu]

Agreed. If anyone understands that it is Liberty that unites people, it is the good Dr.

Obviously (from these numerous threads) religion does much to divide people. Stick to Liberty and teach children about god on your own... don't rely on ANYONE to do it for you. And for you atheists... do.... whatever it is that you do.

 

[sailingaway]

I knew Dr. Paul was not a Christian Fundamentalist -- otherwise he wouldn't have such a vast secular following. Nevertheless I am glad Lew clarified that statement on his blog. I am confident that Dr. Paul and Dr. Woods are going to or have already had talks with Mr. North to ensure nothing too over the top religiously is put into the curriculum.

Even if you are religious, there is too much disagreement. I would expect Ron to leave that aspect to parents.

 

[NewRightLibertarian]

Gary North is a long time associate and friend of Ron Paul's and a defender of liberty. Every anti-religious bigot who is mad at his inclusion for the Ron Paul curriculum needs to realize that their agenda isn't the agenda of Dr. Paul. Maybe they should try a different movement if they don't like it

 

[erowe1]

Ron Paul has never had theocratic beliefs.

What do you base this on? Has he ever said that?

 

[jmdrake]

I am always quite amazed at the extreme pettiness and prejudices that come from so-called freedom-lovers posting on a Ron Paul site. He is talking about CHRISTIAN schools. of which you have no obligation to be part of.

And this is about the zillionth thread on this topic-

Get over yourself.

I'm a Christian, I went to Christian schools, and so far that's where I've sent my children. That said, the quote from the OP is disturbing. Yes people should have a right to create a curriculum who's goal was to create a society where "true religious liberty is exclusively for people to obey the social laws of the Bible." Alternatively people should be free to create a curriculum who's goal was to create a society where "true religious liberty is exclusively for people to obey the social laws of the Koran." I find both goals concerning. And check my posting history. I've been a defender of the Gary North/Ron Paul curriculum up until this point.

As for points others have made about "Ron Paul will make sure the curriculum doesn't contain this or that"....well all I have to say is...this is a much bigger undertaking than some newsletters.

 

[jmdrake]

What do you base this on? Has he ever said that?

What's your definition of a theocrat?

 

[sailingaway]

I'm a Christian, I went to Christian schools, and so far that's where I've sent my children. That said, the quote from the OP is disturbing. Yes people should have a right to create a curriculum who's goal was to create a society where "true religious liberty is exclusively for people to obey the social laws of the Bible." Alternatively people should be free to create a curriculum who's goal was to create a society where "true religious liberty is exclusively for people to obey the social laws of the Koran." I find both goals concerning. And check my posting history. I've been a defender of the Gary North/Ron Paul curriculum up until this point.

As for points others have made about "Ron Paul will make sure the curriculum doesn't contain this or that"....well all I have to say is...this is a much bigger undertaking than some newsletters.

If you read the Lew Rockwell article, apparently there was a conference call yesterday on what the curriculum would contain and Ron said he wanted it to be religion friendly, but not in itself religious, so I would expect it to follow that. Even those who don't like North's religious beliefs don't seem to be saying he would promise not to put them in then do so, and presumably he and Tom will be reading eachother's stuff before it goes anywhere.

Personally, I never new North HAD these beliefs until this week, and I HAD read a dozen or so articles by North that I liked, on various issues. So it isn't like he inserts this into everything he does.

 

[erowe1]

What's your definition of a theocrat?

I'm not sure. It's a word that gets applied to a lot of different people. But I don't know of any normal definition for it that I could positively say that I know Ron Paul has disavowed. Perhaps the person I was responding to can point to something specific about him that they think indicates he is not one.

In the context of Gary North, I think a theocrat is someone who thinks that human activity on earth ought to be governed by God's Law, revealed in the Bible. And he believes that one day the Gospel will spread throughout the earth to such an extent that people willingly living by this law will be the norm, and that his job as a Christian includes the pursuit of that agenda. Ron Paul may disagree, or he may agree. I don't know. I haven't heard him address the issue.