Forget the Russians: It’s the Federal Reserve Seeking to Meddle in Our Elections

[Sammy]

Maybe the Fed should surrender independence and inflate the money supply as much as the President wants and bail him out of the slowing economy caused by his trade wars? Or not inflate the money supply and be accused of trying to get Trump out of office? They will be called biased no matter what they do.

The FED should be eliminated! Central Banking is a form of Socialism!

 

[Swordsmyth]

Economic law says that the value of gold can't change, only the price in nominal currency can be changed via temporary suppression measures and currency devaluation. Back during FDR's days they learned that direct market intervention, through buying and selling of physical gold, in changing the price of gold doesn't work. The only way to change the currency price of gold is to devalue the currency, and later, paper suppression measures. In other words, for the modern situation, they would have to declare a devaluation of the FRN -and- cease the temporary suppression measures (COMEX/GLD paper games) in order for gold to return to its correct FRN value. If that does happen (and I'm sure it will), for all intents and purposes the FRN becomes gold-backed for a short period but also would soon be perceived as worthless.

The value of gold can and does change relative to all other goods depending on how much of it is available.
That doesn't really make much difference though and the market deals with it just fine.

 

[devil21]

The value of gold can and does change relative to all other goods depending on how much of it is available.
That doesn't really make much difference though and the market deals with it just fine.

No, it doesn't. An ounce of gold buys today the same goods as it bought 200 years ago. Or 1000 years ago.

 

[Swordsmyth]

No, it doesn't. An ounce of gold buys today the same goods as it bought 200 years ago. Or 1000 years ago.

Some goods yes, other goods no.
And which are which changes.
The market keeps things at a relative equilibrium but it is not constant and there are many factors that affect it.

 

[devil21]

Some goods yes, other goods no.
And which are which changes.
The market keeps things at a relative equilibrium but it is not constant and there are many factors that affect it.

Nice word salad reply that means absolutely nothing. Good job.

 

[Swordsmyth]

Nice word salad reply that means absolutely nothing. Good job.

You lack reading comprehension.

The market is dynamic in all aspects, there are no absolute constants.

 

[devil21]

You lack reading comprehension.

The market is dynamic in all aspects, there are no absolute constants.

Except the purchasing power of gold. Which was the whole point of my original post. They can't change the value of gold, they can only change the price of gold in nominal currency. Value is not the same as price.

Or continue to double down on being wrong. Whatever.

 

[Swordsmyth]

Except the purchasing power of gold. Which was the whole point of my original post. They can't change the value of gold, they can only change the price of gold in nominal currency. Value is not the same as price.

Or continue to double down on being wrong. Whatever.

Your insistence on gold as an absolute constant is ridiculous, not only does it vary in time based on supply vs. demand of both gold and the goods it is exchanged for but it varies in different areas based on local supply vs. demand of both gold and the goods it is exchanged for.

 

[devil21]

Your insistence on gold as an absolute constant is ridiculous, not only does it vary in time based on supply vs. demand of both gold and the goods it is exchanged for but it varies in different areas based on local supply vs. demand of both gold and the goods it is exchanged for.

Prove it.

Gold and silver represent the main two celestial constants to the history of the planet, hence why it is economic law.

 

[Swordsmyth]

Prove it.

Gold and silver represent the main two celestial constants to the history of the planet, hence why it is economic law.

LOL

The Incas used gold for plumbing because they had so much of it and when the Spanish stole most of it and sent it home it caused ruinous inflation until the market adapted and much of it left Spain to buy hard assets from other countries.

How about you try to prove that it is a constant throughout time and space beyond some kind of strange religious pronouncements?

 

[devil21]

LOL

The Incas used gold for plumbing because they had so much of it and when the Spanish stole most of it and sent it home it caused ruinous inflation until the market adapted and much of it left Spain to buy hard assets from other countries.

How about you try to prove that it is a constant throughout time and space beyond some kind of strange religious pronouncements?

It is a constant because it is always valued by civilizations throughout history as representations of the sun, with silver representing the moon. You are talking about economic rules while I am talking about economic laws. The difference being that laws are historical agreement over many cultures that something has value to society. Rules, however, are fleeting changes at the whims of men over relatively short periods of time. Your own example of the Incas proves this out. BOTH civilizations, which were entirely unconnected, BOTH viewed gold and silver as having value. The theft of the metals by Spain triggered short term market distortions that eventually worked themselves out. Yet, gold is still valuable in Spain today. Is stolen Incan gold still screwing up the Spanish economy now? Only man's interventions in markets distort the price of gold and silver and always temporarily until it returns to its rightful place as valuable. Heck, even JP Morgan summed it up well when he said gold and silver are money. All else is credit. Why? Because gold and silver are the constants and that is law. Credit is man-made and is comprised of rules. Rules are what governs currencies, not laws. If you want to argue with him, go for it.

 

[Swordsmyth]

It is a constant because it is always valued by civilizations throughout history as representations of the sun, with silver representing the moon. You are talking about economic rules while I am talking about economic laws. The difference being that laws are historical agreement over many cultures that something has value to society. Rules, however, are fleeting changes at the whims of men over relatively short periods of time. Your own example of the Incas proves this out. BOTH civilizations, which were entirely unconnected, BOTH viewed gold and silver as having value. The theft of the metals by Spain triggered short term market distortions that eventually worked themselves out. Yet, gold is still valuable in Spain today. Is stolen Incan gold still screwing up the Spanish economy now? Only man's interventions in markets distort the value of gold and silver and always temporarily until it returns to its rightful place as valuable. Heck, even JP Morgan summed it up well when he said gold and silver are money. All else is credit. Why? Because gold and silver are the constants and that is law. Credit is man-made and is comprised of rules. Rules are what governs currencies, not laws. If you want to argue with him, go for it.

There were plenty of cultures that used different items for money instead of gold and silver.

But I never said that gold or silver might not be valuable, I said their exact value varies throughout time and space and that is quite true, the value of gold IS still affected by the Incan gold, if it had never been discovered there would be less gold in the world and each oz. of gold from other sources would be more valuable, if a massive new source of gold was found tomorrow that doubled the world's supply the value of each oz. that we currently have would be severely diminished.

 

[devil21]

There were plenty of cultures that used different items for money instead of gold and silver.

And where is that "money" now? Relegated to the pages of history. No, SS, they used different items as currency, not money. I assure you that while sticks with notches were being passed between the peasants as "money", the King was still accounting for those sticks in GOLD. There's nothing new under the sun...

But I never said that gold or silver might not be valuable, I said their exact value varies throughout time and space and that is quite true, the value of gold IS still affected by the Incan gold, if it had never been discovered there would be less gold in the world and each oz. of gold from other sources would be more valuable, if a massive new source of gold was found tomorrow that doubled the world's supply the value of each oz. that we currently have would be severely diminished.

You still don't understand the difference between value and price. Price is a function of man's temporary interventions. Value is a constant that asserts itself, despite man's interventions. Wise people know this. And it's such a simple concept that I wonder why more do not grasp it.

 

[Swordsmyth]

And where is that "money" now? Relegated to the pages of history. No, SS, they used different items as currency, not money. I assure you that while sticks with notches were being passed between the peasants as "money", the King was still accounting for those sticks in GOLD. There's nothing new under the sun...

That could just as easily happen to gold and silver, they could end up being used for industrial applications, jewelry and decoration and not for money if our culture replaced them with something else.

You still don't understand the difference between value and price. Price is a function of man's temporary interventions. Value is a constant that asserts itself, despite man's interventions. Wise people know this. And it's such a simple concept that I wonder why more do not grasp it.

Price doesn't apply to money because price is how much money a thing costs, value is subjective and inconstant.
The value of money is how much of other things it will buy and that is affected by many factors.

 

[devil21]

....some people will never understand economics. Most people, in fact.^^^