For all - Turn the other cheek for Ron Paul

I was stopped at a stoplight in Houston. I have my Ron Paul bumper sticker up in the window so people have to look at it. i noticed that the guy behind me was looking at the bumper sticker. A homeless man was on the curb to my left. I got out some money and motioned him over and gave it to him. The man in the car behind me smiled. Then the car to my right got the homeless man's attention and gave him money. That got me inspired.

We need to be very charitable and compassionate this holiday season. Put on your Ron Paul T-shirt and get your group to a local homeless shelter or nursing home. I really think I affected this guy in the car behind me and the people in the car next to me. They saw me give money to a homeless man and they know I am a Ron Paul supporter from my bumper sticker.

We have an opportunity here to get a whole lot of free advertising while also helping people.
 
Let me see, sound advise posted in a GRASSROOTS forum on the importance of getting the message out in a manner that gets people to listen, gets a negative reaction in the first follow-up post is sad. The goal of this forum is to find ways to promote RP and get him Elected. The best picture of our efforts is the revolutionary with the bouquet of flowers, for me it symbolizes and enthusiastic mobilization of supporters working to SELL RP’s message tempered by a peaceful delivery.

We are selling RP to people. The stereotypical used car salesperson method turns people off. The rude waitress gets no tip. The obnoxious campaigner does not get heard.

Try handing out a flower with the Slimjim next time your out there on the street. The right man with the right message delivered in the right manner is unstoppable.
 
Personally. Nobody defines my behaviour and I act the way God made me to act. I do not give a good goddamn who i am working for or around. This is utter BS to me.. Stop the collectivist mindset pieces. This os from lew Rockwell's site.. Jeesh.. Even them now??? This is getting worse than the evangelicals and their borg conformity trip.

'Randy

This is a load of crap! Acting respectful to others, setting good examples, being balanced in your thoughts and deeds, gets the above comment? Randy, I am calling you out. Do you engage that grey matter before you type? You engaged this topic in the exact manner that others use when they tune out the message of Liberty and Limited Government.

Next time, don't feel compelled to type the statement that for the most part proves what the post was about. Take a little longer and see if you really want to shove your foot further into your mouth.
 
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Confused? You seem to think that means I go hog wild and abusive. No.. that means I am in control of myslef and understand why I do everyhing I do. I need no outside iinterference in the momentum of MY life.

Is that so bloody confusing? Let me put it this way. I am not working to get a man elected as president so I can be left the fuck alone but be told what to do and not be left alone the entire time I work at that endeavor. This amacks of nanny-statehood. Like I do not know how to behave or act or uinteract. It is insultng ti read these drivelesque pieces daily from "well intentioned" school marms on a multiple per day basis here.

Randfy

I think the idea is to not to force you to behave a certain way, but to point out logically why it is in all of our best interests to behave this way. You certainly have the right to disagree, but for my part I think this message is extremely reasonable.

Our ideas are already making people sit up and pay attention. Political supporters that behave like gentlemen/women and intelligently discuss issues rather than mudslinging will be truely rEVOLutionary. +1 To the message!
 
Revolution9,

I realize that I'm not your favorite Ron Paul supporter, but look at the issue this way.

In the real world, I seriously doubt that you actively campaign for Ron Paul, as well as engage the media, etc., in your birthday suit despite being born that way.

So, I think what many of us are merely asking is that (metaphorically speaking) that we all put on our clothes when engaging the topic online as well. No one is demanding that you, or anyone else, wear a specific uniform. However, I don't think it's too much to ask that we all at least wear some clothes, you know, throw on some jeans and a shirt -- something. 'Cause, even if you do look that good naked, I promise you, it's not all that appealing to our potential supporters....
 
Do any of you going on about how you refuse to exercise self-control of your own behavior actually have a job?

Do you wear a raggedy t-shirt and cuss up a storm in meetings with clients?

Do you rail on about your favorite fringe conspiracy theories at lunches with customers, and then refuse to pay with anything but a Liberty Dollar?

Were you mindful of how you behaved at your last job interview?

We can't control how you behave; we're not trying to. We're simply attempting to convince you that is in everyone's rational self interest to exercise self-control when publicly supporting Ron Paul.

Is that so difficult? All we're saying is stop acting like a dick. Seriously, I know 5 year olds with better self control.
 
No.. I mean to suggest that at 50 years of age I don't need no goddamned lectures from nobody on how to act. I didn't cotten to being told how to act at five by a big drill sargeant with a web belt. This type of drooldonkey advice assumes that those who do not adhere to the positions laid forth by THAT INDIVIDUAL is skewing the campaign and making them look bad. There ain't a snowballs chance in hell that I made the campaign look bad. In fact i am the reason we have a near monolithic RP name recognititon around here. Ask the meetup 294 leaders. They know who I am and how I act.

This should not have been a sticky. It is another effing lecture for kindergarteners. When are we going to get respect as grown adults is what this comes down to to me. Stop treating us like children and assuming we need lectures on how to behave like we are some goddamned savages in loincloths all fired up on liquor. Jeesh.

Randy
I would suggest that if you feel that you don't need a lecture then you are free to ignore the author's article.

As far as I can tell, no one has accused you directly of being incorrigible.
 
...Stop the collectivist mindset pieces...

I'm very pro-individual (anti-collectivist) and the article did not offend me one bit.
Lew is suggesting we act like peaceful, 'classy' individuals, and (when we want to) people can act as a collective group.

IMO, Lew's piece is a much nicer read than your negative outburst.
 
Have you done a self-evaluation lately?

No.. I mean to suggest that at 50 years of age I don't need no goddamned lectures from nobody on how to act...

Have you done a self-evaluation lately? :p

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What motivates you to support Ron Paul?
 
I'll have to say I agree with Revolution9 on this one... and I understand his frustration, especially with people who want to water down Ron Paul's message for mass consumption, and then those people who buy into the crap that we are the evil people who turn people away because we are excited about our candidates.. i call these people the apologist.
The increase of mainstream people has also seen an increase in these vices... and some people are falling victim to group think and are not helping the cause anymore than the people they denigrate.
 
Brian? Why is this a sticky? Is this to be a universal doctrine of behavior we are to socialize our members to?
 
Okay, I am going to step up and defend a bunch of people I despise here. :)

This issue, along with the Nazi issue currently raise its head can be tied together.

If someone, using the NeoNazi's, whose opinions and beliefs I stand against, can get up and present a reasoned, well spoken, clear, and non attacking argument for their point, I can respect them, even if I still disagree. However, if that same person gets up screaming, yelling, cursing, and putting me down, I will not hear the same reasoned opinion. Instead, the only message I will hear is 'I am a wacked out, crazy person spouting stupid stuff'. The message is lost by the method of the messenger. In this case, i think the message is more important than the messanger. Ergo, if you use the wrong method, what is happening is the method and messenger becomes the news and NOT the message. But, you are right. It is the messengers choice of which is more important to them.
 
'Fluffy' Has A Good Point...

First let me say that I understand fully the spirit in which the original post is meant.

I understand it philsophically, and I understand it tactically.

But I still don't agree with it, for one simple reason: the other side is not engaged in "reasoned discourse" with us, in the first place.

There is an outrageous double standard at play here. You are buying into it.

That double standard says that Ron Paul and his supporters are crazy when they demand peace, but Rudy Giuliani's foreign policy advisors are engaged in "reasoned discourse" and are "serious" when they advocate Arab and Persian genocide.

The double standard says that Mona Charen can write an article saying that Ron Paul is like David Koresh, and that article can be picked up by blog aggregators and news sites all over the internet, and that's "serious discourse". But when Ron Paul supporters comment on her column, that's "bullying". Don't you realize the absolutely absurd disconnect there? And how you're saying that people with literally no power and no platform to speak are "bullies", and people connected to the Republican establishment and with their choice of public platforms are "the bullied"? It's insane.

The way out of the current political box the nation is in won't be found by using the current popular political language and methodology. Why not? Because it's been designed over a long period to keep acceptable political discussion within a determined range. Our opponents would love to have the entire political dialogue be about purely symbolic and meaningless nonsense like the Don Black donation, because that permits them to continue their narrative that "extremism = bad", because all extremes are actually the same, and holding literalist views of the Constitution is ultimately the same as wanting to exterminate "mud people". I saw that very argument openly made online this week. And we aren't going to overcome that argument by using the polite discourse that produced the politically correct climate we currently live in. We're going to overcome that argument and demolish that bounded discourse by telling people to go fuck themselves.

Every outsider political movement that has succeeded in moving the national discourse in the US since the end of the second world war did so by using extreme and confrontational language, and by deliberately mocking and abusing the establishment that sought to hold them back. People talk about Martin Luther King and Gandhi, but forget that by the standards of their own time their messages were highly offensive. The feminist movement and the gay rights movement advanced to the extent that their advocates were impolite assholes. The counterculture that sprang into being in the US in the 60's was considered highly rude. These are all movements that won in the end, and probably would not have won if the members of these movements limited themselves to "reasoned discourse". That might not make some people comfortable, but it's true.

FluffyUnbound :D
'Fluffy' Has A Good Point...

happysink3.jpg
 
I was stopped at a stoplight in Houston. I have my Ron Paul bumper sticker up in the window so people have to look at it. i noticed that the guy behind me was looking at the bumper sticker. A homeless man was on the curb to my left. I got out some money and motioned him over and gave it to him. The man in the car behind me smiled. Then the car to my right got the homeless man's attention and gave him money. That got me inspired.

We need to be very charitable and compassionate this holiday season. Put on your Ron Paul T-shirt and get your group to a local homeless shelter or nursing home. I really think I affected this guy in the car behind me and the people in the car next to me. They saw me give money to a homeless man and they know I am a Ron Paul supporter from my bumper sticker.

We have an opportunity here to get a whole lot of free advertising while also helping people.

Another good suggestion, thanks.
 
The message is lost by the method of the messenger. In this case, i think the message is more important than the messanger. Ergo, if you use the wrong method, what is happening is the method and messenger becomes the news and NOT the message. But, you are right. It is the messengers choice of which is more important to them.
Thank you.

The end goal is the same, as long as it's Dr. Paul and his message we are promoting, not our own using his platform.
 
Thank you.

The end goal is the same, as long as it's Dr. Paul and his message we are promoting, not our own using his platform.


And, it is important to remember who your target audience is. Trying to preach the 9/11 Truth as a reason to support Ron Paul to your standard Republican will not work well. Trying to explain, instead, that he is about getting to the bottom of issues, such as how our intel did fail us, and that he does not believe in the hiding of this stuff. Now, if you are talking to a truther, then you can use his expected willingness to make sure the truth is found. Not his belief that it was an inside job, since he does not claim that. This is just an example.
 
Wow

I'll have to say I agree with Revolution9 on this one... and I understand his frustration, especially with people who want to water down Ron Paul's message for mass consumption, and then those people who buy into the crap that we are the evil people who turn people away because we are excited about our candidates.. i call these people the apologist.
The increase of mainstream people has also seen an increase in these vices... and some people are falling victim to group think and are not helping the cause anymore than the people they denigrate.

...Proper civil discourse that facilitates intellectual discussions.

Personally. Nobody defines my behaviour and I act the way God made me to act. I do not give a good goddamn who i am working for or around. This is utter BS to me.. Stop the collectivist mindset pieces. This os from lew Rockwell's site.. Jeesh.. Even them now??? This is getting worse than the evangelicals and their borg conformity trip.

'Randy

... discourse which just offends and drives a wedge between the "old church ladies" and "anti-collectivists," contributing to a fantastic argument with no substance.

My issue is not with the ideologies, because we will never agree on just one- nor should we. We should be free to believe as we want. However, the self proclaimed individualists need to realize that they CANNOT get Dr. Paul elected by themselves. We have to function as a group, like it or not. One vote loses to two in this country (usually!).

As for the person who gave money to the homeless individual- props to you. That's the message that we should be sending to everyone, and its the message that Dr. Paul advocates for.
 
Is it beneficial to assign blame for future failures?

If one can foresee the logically occurring consequence of the behavior, then yes. It wasn't him specifically that I was blaming, however, only those that act as he does.

Your inquiry is like asking if it's beneficial to lay the blame for someone's hair falling out on the fact that they just told you they are about to go and play with some radioactive substance without any protection at all, even though they haven't done it yet and their hair has yet to fall out...

"Check out this x-ray stuff I swiped from the hospital dumpster! Let's check it out!"

"Um no... Your hair's gonna fall out if you mess with that... And you'll get sick."

"Whatever, man."
 
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If one can foresee the logically occurring consequence of the behavior, then yes.

Your inquiry is like asking if it's beneficial to lay the blame for someone's hair falling out on the fact that they just told you they are about to go and play with some radioactive substance without any protection at all, even though they haven't done it yet and their hair has yet to fall out...

What i mean is that you see failure, and assign failure to something you THINK will make failure occur. And you say it as if you KNOW it will.. that is not honesty. Unless you can see the future.
Myself, as a sociologist, study what is called "the game" its any set of actions in combination resulting in any set of probably outcomes. And even after 11 years of study I can only say at best, research says their is a higher probability of failure if you come off abrasive.
And is the blame always on the abrasive person or can the blame actually be prescribed to those who have allowed themselve to be indoctrinated with a belief system that takes offense to such actions? The possibilities are unlimited... thus prescribing motive to failure before it happens is anyone's guess.
So- i say we should be following our on hearts and minds... it has gotten us this far...i don't think we should abandon it because the majority thinks it bad.
 
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