Do You Think Libertarians Are More Welcomed In Democratic Party?

[Liberty74]

Let's not forget that Libertarians share the same point of view when it comes to social issues with Democrats.

Not so on most issues - religion, schools, civil liberties, marriage, family, drug laws, gun rights, censorship, etc.

As Jingles pointed out, there needs to be a line drawn when people use the words fiscal conservative or social liberal. Does that apply personally? OR Does that apply from the view point of government? There is a huge difference. Democrats are liberal fascists IMO which is the opposite of being a liberal privately. Libertarians are real liberals because they are open to people being people with one rule - you don't harm or steal from another. Know the difference. Rick Santorum would be considered a conservative fascist because he wants to use the federal government to shape society according to his social ends.

 

[kylejack]

The only issue that the current entrenched GOP leaders have against the Libertarians is the whole foreign intervention issue.

Surely you jest. How about their views on The Drug War, abortion, spending.

 

[NewRightLibertarian]

We gotta work to keep making in rounds in the Republican Party. They're weak and vulnerable right now, ripe for the taking.

 

[MozoVote]

The original 1970s Libertarians were a splinter group from the Republican party in the first place. They can be glued back on, so to speak. They don't mesh well with the Democratic party.

 

[Bosco Warden]

Good read. I also want to comment on the Democrats are only welfare hand out people, that is not true. Also the "welfare" crew dont even vote. They are a non issue and used as a wedge issue.

Guest Post: Liberals and Libertarians Need Each Other

http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2010/06/guest-post-liberals-and-libertarians-need-each-other.html

 

[Tudo]

The gop has been about empire since it's very first nominee and president.

 

[Bosco Warden]

The gop has been about empire since it's very first nominee and president.

Are you referring to Lincoln?

The empire is coming to a close now, find you some nice BLM land and prepare to defend it. lol

 

[Moo2400]

Fiscal issues seem to take precedence over most other issues in both parties, and in that regard, libertarians fit in better with republicans than they do with democrats. You'll have a number of a republicans say they love Ron Paul on fiscal issues, but are afraid of his foreign policy. With democrats, it would be more or less reversed. On that basis alone, libertarians would probably find the republican party more open to them.

It should also be mentioned that democrats appear to be much more ideologically rigid than the republican party. They seem to place more emphasis on conforming to the party line and values for both their members and politicians - note the primary back in 2008 where Hillary Clinton and Obama were more or less the same ideologically, it was just a matter of whether you wanted a female president or a black president. The republicans, by contrast, are much more open ideologically - they don't get called "the big tent" for nothing.

 

[kylejack]

It should also be mentioned that democrats appear to be much more ideologically rigid than the republican party. They seem to place more emphasis on conforming to the party line and values for both their members and politicians - note the primary back in 2008 where Hillary Clinton and Obama were more or less the same ideologically, it was just a matter of whether you wanted a female president or a black president.

Not really. Obama and Clinton are about as close to each other on the issues as Romney and Gingrich.

 

[Inny Binny]

The core of the Democratic party is all about Welfare, and taxation. The only issue that the current entrenched GOP leaders have against the Libertarians is the whole foreign intervention issue. It's only been since the rise of the Neo-Cons that the foreign intervention issue has been there. The Neo-Cons want to run around the world bombing everyone. Get past that, and there's no reason why the GOP wouldn't go full Libertarian.

Nonsense. How on earth is the GOP even remotely close to libertarian ideal on anything? They throw a few words around like 'capitalism' and 'small government' and then proceed to spend more than the democrats. And are you saying you honestly believe the GOP is libertarian on social issues?

There was a poll on this forum a few weeks ago about who people thought would be the most dangerous. The republican candidates far outstripped Obama. So why on earth do libertarians automatically flock to the republican party? There is truly no reason for this - and it is unfortunate, because it leads to the perception that libertarians are just selfish republicans who want to smoke pot. Either we should try and infiltrate both parties, or we should work with the Libertarian Party.

 

[Keith and stuff]

Nonsense. How on earth is the GOP even remotely close to libertarian ideal on anything? They throw a few words around like 'capitalism' and 'small government' and then proceed to spend more than the democrats. And are you saying you honestly believe the GOP is libertarian on social issues?

Dude, where do you live? Where I live, there were 30 candidates on the NH Republican Primary ballot. My county has 23 towns/cities. Mitt Romney won 13 of them, Ron Paul won 8 of them (that is 35% of the towns/cities) and Huntsman won 2 of them. The GOP in NH as a whole is more libertarian than it is in my county. That is correct, the three most moderate candidates were the only candidates to win districts where I live. Santorum and his radical views didn't even get 10% of the vote in NH. Rick Perry that ran commercials about Christianity only got 0.7% of the vote in NH and left the race because of how we shut him down. In NH, the GOP is libertarian on lots and lots of social issues. Guns, knifes, automobile registration, seat belts for adults, motorcycle helmets, marijuana decriminalization, medical marijuana, alcohol deregulation, recording the police and so on... As far as I know, all of the Republicans that sponsored and voted for the bill last year to get the government out of marriage were Republicans.

As for why the libertarians flock to the GOP, at least in NH, it is because the GOP loves libertarians. It backs libertarian candidates with money and volunteers. The libertarian State Reps currently have more influence over the Republicans in the NH House than any other group (the very religious, the liberals, the moderates. the pro-union folks) even though there are currently only around 90 State Reps in NH that are libertarian Republicans.

 

[GopBlackList]

Maybe in some places. People tend to be caucasian in NH. John E. Sununu ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_E._Sununu ) was a US Rep and US Senator from NH and his family has strong Palestinian ancestry with some members coming from Lebanon. Though, John H. Sununu, his father was born in Cuba. John H. Sununu was a governor of NH and was recently the head of the state party, even though his mother was born in El Salvador. National origin seems to make no difference when it comes to being welcomed by a political party in NH.

If you like Republican ideals of smaller government, lower taxes and more responsibility but are not welcomed into your local GOP, I recommend trying to change it, moving, or not working directly with a political party as superior alternatives to becoming a Democratic Party player. When I lived in TN, where the GOP is much less freedom oriented than the NH GOP, the GOP was still much more inclined towards liberty than the Democratic Party.

However, you certainly know more about your personal situation than I do. If you really think it's the best thing to do, go for it

Well Sununu is a Palestinian Christian, same with Justin Amash. But let's say you have friends who are into the libertarian view points but are of say Hispanic, gay, or Muslim persuasion. Chances are they are not going to be Republicans or much less get accepted (illegal immgration scapegoating, religious bigotry, homophobia, and islamophobia) even if they view points they agree upon. Where do they go? obvisouly the Democratic party since they are open to minorities.

 

[Keith and stuff]

Well Sununu is a Palestinian Christian, same with Justin Amash. But let's say you have friends who are into the libertarian view points but are of say Hispanic, gay, or Muslim persuasion. Chances are they are not going to be Republicans or much less get accepted (illegal immgration scapegoating, religious bigotry, homophobia, and islamophobia) even if they view points they agree upon. Where do they go? obvisouly the Democratic party since they are open to minorities.

They are Christians but my point is they are hispanics. John H. Sununu (the former governor and GOP head) was born in Cuba and his mother was born in El Salvador.

The most popular Republican State Rep in Manchester (the largest city in NH), Steve Vaillancourt, (a Ron Paul endorser in 2008 and 2012) is gay. NH is very receptive to gays. After all, it has more gays per capita than any other state. The former head of the Democratic Party is gay.

According to a blog post by Rep. Vaillincourt,

According to Voter Consumer Research (VCR), which surveyed 712 likely NH voters, “64 percent believe the law allowing gay couples to marry in New Hampshire should stay in place. Only 31 percent believe the law should be repealed.

Not only that, but 51 percent feel strongly that the law should stay in place.

It’s not as if people haven’t been following the issue. VCR finds very high awareness (“fairly universal”) of 94 percent.

Even among likely Republican primary voters, support for leaving the law is at 47 percent (47 percent also favor repeal). Not only that but VCR found gay marriage is not a major voting issue even among Republicans. When asked how they would react if their state legislator voted against repeal, 60 percent said they would either support that legislator or the issue “would make no difference in their vote”.

http://nhinsider.squarespace.com/re...ll-shows-strong-support-for-gay-marriage.html

There is also a hispanic State Rep in Manchester, Carlos Gonzalez. By the way, the co-chair of the Republican House Alliance, State Rep. Marilinda Garcia of Salem, is a latino that I helped elect (I spent around 5 days helping her over a couple months time.) The other co-chair of the Republican House Alliance is a libertarian Free State Project participant. The Republican House Alliance, along with the New Hampshire Liberty Alliance (a strictly pro-liberty organization) greatly influence how people (especially Republicans) in the NH House vote.

I honestly don't know any Muslims that have run for office in NH. Muslims, Hindus, Buddhists and Jews aren't very common in New Hampshire. NH, along with VT, are the least religious states in the US and most of the people that run are either Christian or non-religious.
http://prorev.com/2009/12/new-hampshire-vermont-least-religious.html

 

[Uriah]

It depends on what is most important to you. Party or principle? It depends on where you live and what the constituents of that locale want from their elected officials. Political parties are vehicles. They are not the goal. They help you reach your goal. Many liberty minded activists, austrians, and libertarians are moving into the Republican party because of Ron Paul and with good reason. But running as a Democrat offers an individual to emphasize a sound foreign policy, civil liberties, health freedom, and ending the drug war with little to no opposition.

In general Democrats like to hear about ending the wars, bringing the troops home, alternative medicine, less regulation over renewable energies, keeping the internet free, gay marriage, ending the Patriot Act, industrial hemp, etc. Fiscal responsibility is also an issue that is important to Democrats but needs to be well worded in order to not alienate oneself.

What political party can propel the liberty message forward in your community? Whichever party that may be, is the one you ought to get involved in.

 

[ConCap]

what do you think? abscond from the Republican party and get into the Democratic party?

-5reps

 

[mczerone]

-5reps

It was a valid question. I don't think "we" should abandon anything, but I do think that some of our up-and-coming politicos should explore the democratic party as a more natural fit for their liberty message and their local political environment. We shouldn't FOCUS on the GOP anymore or any less than we focus on the Dems or even the LP.

The GOP establishment has repeatedly dejected and mocked us, and I'm not going to tell anyone that it's better to stick it out with them or to jump ship. You work with the GOP if you want - and I'll support you. If the OP works with the Dems, I'd support him too.

 

[SilentBull]

No way.

 

[Jack Bauer]

No.

They are outright statists.

 

[lib3rtarian]

I am what someone would call a minority (South East Asian) and I really feel out of place in the GOP demographic wise. I am getting involved in the party for the sake of pushing the party more libertarian, but the majority of the folks look at me like I am a space alien. 99% of the folks I see in the GOP here are white Christians and they are all social conservatives, pro-War on Drugs, pro-life, gay-hating, Muslim-hating, big-time Bible-thumpers.

I would be more at home with the Democratic party demographically, but I can't stand their socialist economic policies.

I might be even more home with the Libertarian party, but I don't think they stand a fighting chance against the 2-party monopoly.

I am in a big fix.

 

[AuH20]

This thread makes me Lulz. Since FDR permanently transformed the democratic party into it's present, dispicable form it has been utter trash. Move along.