Debt hits 18 trillion!

[HVACTech]

"Eventually the price of gold and silver will be equal to or exceed the supply of all the money in the world"? When was the last time that happened? And how does one calculate it?

Gold and Silver are NOT money.
(praise be unto the Bernanke)
"Money" is an invention of the Human mind.
therefore, it can be any frickin thing.

Gold and Silver simply serve as very good restraints on Human capriciousness.

to calculate something. a base reference point is required.
think of it this way.
will a road map do you any good. if you do not know where you are?

 

[Ronin Truth]

"It is well enough that people of the nation do not understand our banking and monetary system, for if they did, I believe there would be a revolution before tomorrow morning." -- Henry Ford

//

 

[Madison320]

Cutting taxes adds to the debt.

It depends on where you are on the Laffer curve. If you keep raising tax rates at some point you start collecting less. The real solution is to cut govt spending and that means the big 3, SS, Medicare and defense.

 

[Zippyjuan]

It depends on where you are on the Laffer curve. If you keep raising tax rates at some point you start collecting less. The real solution is to cut govt spending and that means the big 3, SS, Medicare and defense.

Those are the only places you can make meaningful cuts in spending but they are also the biggest "hot button" issues which can get a person thrown out of office for suggesting cuts in them so no politician wants to tackle them.

It would take about a 100% reduction in "discretionary spending" to balance the budget with no tax cuts. That is just to keep the debt from growing- not even starting to reduce it.

 

[Deborah K]

It is good, but I agree with Hendrickson. Phil got the 16A wrong.

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showth...ked-scanners&p=2780442&viewfull=1#post2780442

How so?

 

[Acala]

I think realistically, the only way to really make it go away is to default which would cause lots of economic pain as well.

There are actually TWO ways out of this situation. The first way is to default: simply not pay the interest and then not repay the principle. The second way is to inflate the currency so that the debt is actually repaid but with dollars so seriously devalued as to be nearly worthless. To illustrate the point, the government could print up 200 bills denominated at a trillion dollars each and use them to pay off all obligations. "There! It's fixed!" Hahahahahaha!

Both ways result in severe economic pain, as you note. But the pain from inflation takes longer to reach the insiders and so THAT is the most likely scenario. The path that keeps the party going longest for the control group is the path we will follow. And so ultimately, it will be the fires of inflation.

 

[Acala]

I think realistically, the only way to really make it go away is to default which would cause lots of economic pain as well.

There are actually TWO ways out of this situation. The first way is to default: simply not pay the interest and then not repay the principle. The second way is to inflate the currency so that the debt is actually repaid but with dollars so seriously devalued as to be nearly worthless. To illustrate the point, the government could print up 200 bills denominated at a trillion dollars each and use them to pay off all obligations. "There! It's fixed!" Hahahahahaha!

Both ways result in severe economic pain, as you note. But the pain from inflation takes longer to reach the insiders and so THAT is the most likely scenario. The path that keeps the party going longest for the control group is the path we will follow. And so ultimately, it will be the fires of inflation.

 

[RonPaulIsGreat]

If you want to help fix the system.

1. Spend as little on consumable items as possible.
2. Spend as much as possible on silver, gold, bitcoins, and hold them for the duration.
3. Don't buy stocks.

 

[Zippyjuan]

There are actually TWO ways out of this situation. The first way is to default: simply not pay the interest and then not repay the principle. The second way is to inflate the currency so that the debt is actually repaid but with dollars so seriously devalued as to be nearly worthless. To illustrate the point, the government could print up 200 bills denominated at a trillion dollars each and use them to pay off all obligations. "There! It's fixed!" Hahahahahaha!

Both ways result in severe economic pain, as you note. But the pain from inflation takes longer to reach the insiders and so THAT is the most likely scenario. The path that keeps the party going longest for the control group is the path we will follow. And so ultimately, it will be the fires of inflation.

Trillion dollar bills to pay off the debt is basically defaulting.

 

[Peter4Paul2016]

"There are 10^11 stars in the galaxy. That used to be a huge number. But it's only 100 Billion. It's less than the National Deficit! We used to call them astronomical numbers. Now we should call them economical numbers." ~Richard Feynman

 

[Ronin Truth]

There are actually TWO ways out of this situation. The first way is to default: simply not pay the interest and then not repay the principle. The second way is to inflate the currency so that the debt is actually repaid but with dollars so seriously devalued as to be nearly worthless. To illustrate the point, the government could print up 200 bills denominated at a trillion dollars each and use them to pay off all obligations. "There! It's fixed!" Hahahahahaha!

Both ways result in severe economic pain, as you note. But the pain from inflation takes longer to reach the insiders and so THAT is the most likely scenario. The path that keeps the party going longest for the control group is the path we will follow. And so ultimately, it will be the fires of inflation.

Wouldn't you still owe the interest to the Fed banksters for the TRILLIONS $?

 

[Acala]

Wouldn't you still owe the interest to the Fed banksters for the TRILLIONS $?

Interest on the National debt isn't in the trillions, but you could simply pay whatever it is by printing another note.

 

[Acala]

Trillion dollar bills to pay off the debt is basically defaulting.

If paying back loans with money that has less exchange value than what was borrowed is defaulting, then defaulting has been pretty much constant in the USA for fifty years. I consider defaulting to be not paying the nominal amount owed. I consder paying back the nominal amount but with devalued money to be a kind of theft through inflation. Both injure the lender. Default is more honest.

 

[Ronin Truth]

Interest on the National debt isn't in the trillions, but you could simply pay whatever it is by printing another note.

I much prefer simple. Nationalize the Fed and shut it down.

"The best design is the simplest one that works." -- Albert Einstein

 

[Acala]

I much prefer simple. Nationalize the Fed and shut it down.

"The best design is the simplest one that works." -- Albert Einstein

Yes, Congress could repudiate the debt to the Fed by legislation and then shut it down. I believe Ron Paul suggested this. BUT the majority of the national debt is not owed to the Fed, it is owed to other investors including individuals, institutions like pensions and insurance companies, and foreign governments.

 

[Ronin Truth]

Yes, Congress could repudiate the debt to the Fed by legislation and then shut it down. I believe Ron Paul suggested this. BUT the majority of the national debt is not owed to the Fed, it is owed to other investors including individuals, institutions like pensions and insurance companies, and foreign governments.

Screw 'em, just another really bad investment decision that just didn't work out.

 

[Zippyjuan]

Yes, Congress could repudiate the debt to the Fed by legislation and then shut it down. I believe Ron Paul suggested this. BUT the majority of the national debt is not owed to the Fed, it is owed to other investors including individuals, institutions like pensions and insurance companies, and foreign governments.

Of our $18 trillion debt, $2.4 trillion (13%) is held by the Fed. http://www.federalreserve.gov/releases/h41/current/ $6 trillion (one third) is held in foreign countries. http://www.treasury.gov/ticdata/Publish/mfh.txt

 

[H. E. Panqui]

Currency is cash. Currency is printed by the US Treasury Department. About ten percent of our current money supply exists in the form of currency. Our debt is not currency.

(...i believe steve zarlenga, the world's foremost monetary historian,---if anyone knows of a better one, please name---says it's about 1%..not 10%..and that around x-mas they bump it up a little because the mullets like to use x-mas ca$h...maybe to 2%..

...but why would anyone throw around any number$ coming, essentially, from stinking ?foreign, secret-squirrel bankster$ who've never been publicly, honestly, transparently, independently, etc., audited?!?...

....as to 'what to do about it?'...many MANY things, of course...one would be to renounce what Jerry Voorhis called 'the-debt-that-ought-not-be-debt' in his classic 'Out of Debt, Out of Danger'..(essentially interest on bonds the stinking secret squirrel banksters acquired for nothing...no thing..

...we could use much less gold-bug THEORY from the Austrians...much more REALITY from Zarlenga, Still, Ellen Brown, Jerry Voorhis, Byron Dale, etc..hint: FOCUS on the hideous, AGE-OLD specter of money creation...REALITY, not THEORY..

...also, for the most honest, clear thinking about our stinking Republicrat monetary order, see the fabulous, "Exposing Republicrat Monetary Ignorance..." right here in this forum!..

 

[Ronin Truth]

My fiat FRN US currency says "Note" (debt) printed right on every bill.

 

[Zippyjuan]

"This note is legal for all debts, public and private".