Convincing Ron Paul to accept $MILLS in matching funds for an independent presidential run

[rp08orbust]

It sounds to me like Ron Paul's biggest reservation about continuing his presidential campaign for another two months is money. And yet as sailingaway has been pointing out throughout the discussions here, Ron Paul is eligible for $39M in federal matching funds to continue his presidential campaign. Problem solved.

Of course, a new problem would be created by accepting federal matching funds, namely, it would no doubt prompt accusations that he loses his credibility as a fiscal conservative by accepting federal matching funds. We can all hear Mark Levin screeching about how the man who says he would balance the federal budget in two years is adding $39M to the national debt in order to pay for yet another quixotic run for president.

I'm hoping to see some creative rebuttals to these frivolous objections in this thread that can be presented to Ron Paul as talking points.

If Ron Paul were to even seriously consider accepting the matching funds for an independent run, that should persuade Gary Johnson to step aside as the Libertarian candidate, because if Ron Paul were to actually run as an independent, I believe Gary Johnson and the LP would be toast in 2012, and possibly beyond. Gary Johnson would be far better off as Ron Paul's LP running mate, debating Joe Biden on TV, than as the completely blacked-out LP candidate in a race in which Ron Paul is also on the ballot and on TV debating Obama and Romney.

I'll start off with a few talking points that come to mind, in no particular order:

1. For $39M, American taxpayers have the opportunity to vote for someone who will save them trillions in wasteful military spending. The focus should be on how many TRILLIONS the campaigns of Obama and Romney are both guaranteed to cost taxpayers, assuming either of them wins.

2. "I'm saving local governments a lot of money by sparing them the job of having to count my supporters' write-in votes if I don't keep running."

3. Ron Paul could promise to spend all of the $39M allocated to advertising in the state of Maine, as an attempt to compensate them for being disenfranchised during the Republican primary. The people of Maine spent time and money on a caucus, which was essentially nullified by Romney, Webster & Ginsberg Corp. (Ron Paul would probably end up winning an elector, maybe even all of them if he did this. Isn't Maine one of the few states that is not winner-take-all?)

 

[brandon]

I think I have a better chance of winning the lottery and getting struck by lighting in the same day than of this happening.

 

[Eire4RonPaul]

ffs he can't run as an Indie at this stage...

The ONLY option left is the VP on the Libertarian Party ticket. This would give him all 50 states ballot access.

 

[rp08orbust]

ffs he can't run as an Indie at this stage...

The ONLY option left is the VP on the Libertarian Party ticket. This would give him all 50 states ballot access.

He doesn't need to be on the ballot in 50 states to get into the debates, which is the objective.

So no, LP VP is not the only option for Ron Paul. It's the only option for Gary Johnson if he wants to prevent Ron Paul from overshadowing him with an independent run.

 

[thatpeculiarcat]

ffs he can't run as an Indie at this stage...

The ONLY option left is the VP on the Libertarian Party ticket. This would give him all 50 states ballot access.

No, that is not an option!

The LP held their convention. Judge Jim Gray is the duly elected VP.

Why can't people understand this?

 

[mport1]

Ron Paul would never rob people of $39M. That is immoral and against everything he stands for.

 

[specsaregood]

Ron Paul would never rob people of $39M. That is immoral and against everything he stands for.

I thought the money came from the fund populated by people that voluntarily check that box/donate on their income tax filing.

 

[[email protected]]

No, that is not an option!

The LP held their convention. Judge Jim Gray is the duly elected VP.

Why can't people understand this?

Yes he was duly elected. What happens if he decided to step down. They would have to nominate a new VP. That's where Ron Paul could step in. So whats the point if he is the VP. Well it gives Ron 2 more months to explain his positions to the american people. He would explain what a sham the Republican and Democrat parties are. He would get debate time on live tv. He would get a lot more donations to be able to get commercials out there. Yes I would love to see Ron Paul as president. I would love even more for him to get the message of liberty, foreign policy and fiscal responsibility out there. Independents are wondering which side of evil to turn to. If Ron joined the race in some capacity it would sway independents to join the Revolution.

 

[rp08orbust]

Yes he was duly elected. What happens if he decided to step down. They would have to nominate a new VP. That's where Ron Paul could step in. So whats the point if he is the VP. Well it gives Ron 2 more months to explain his positions to the american people. He would explain what a sham the Republican and Democrat parties are. He would get debate time on live tv. He would get a lot more donations to be able to get commercials out there. Yes I would love to see Ron Paul as president. I would love even more for him to get the message of liberty, foreign policy and fiscal responsibility out there. Independents are wondering which side of evil to turn to. If Ron joined the race in some capacity it would sway independents to join the Revolution.

How many people do you know who have ever listened to what the LP VP candidate had to say? I didn't even pay attention to the VP candidates when I was an libertarian political junkie supporting Harry Browne and Michael Badnarik.

Making Ron Paul the LP VP would be an insulting joke.

Gary Johnson would need to step down to VP for the LP to be at all useful to Ron Paul.

 

[No1butPaul]

wonder how much the RNC convention cost us just to have our votes suppressed

 

[LibertyEagle]

For this to be at all useful, Dr. Paul would have to improve upon his delivery during debates. Do you really see that happening?

 

[sailingaway]

Ron should not run as VP it becomes worth it only as pres. Even as independent run the matching funds would get his message out enough to make up for not having the speech at RNC, even if he isn't on ALL ballots and does write ins.

Only Ron polls high enough to get into the debates, and a lot of that is with people who don't even know who Gary Johnson is.

But the $39 million is too high a number. I know I'm the one who threw it out, thinking matching was essentially what you raised from donations. But it is more complicated and limited than that from what I've looked at to this point. You get UP TO $20 million plus a cost of living adjustment from the time the regs were passed (not sure what that would be) but it is made up of matching UP TO the first $250 from each of your donors. Say Ron had 100,000 donors, and 20,000 gave him over $250. He'd get $5,000,000 from that right off the top, but the other 80% of his donors would be matched UP TO the $250, so if they gave $20.12 once, they'd be matched that much.

Given how many small donors he had, I'm guestimating $15-18 million or so, but I haven't gotten his FEC records and done the numbers. He might have 40,000 who gave him over $250, or whatever. I didn't track that. But that much to spend in a couple of months is still better than the LP has ever had and would raise Gary's profile for a future run, if GJ ran as VP.

I know GJ said he would take Ron as VP not P, but that was before the Rasmussen poll saying GJ only got 1% -- putting him nowhere near the debates. He is already saying if he loses this time he would run again next time. Maybe he'd rethink the top of the ticket.

However, as VP, I don't think Ron should do it. I'm not even sure he could get matching funds for a different office run.

 

[sailingaway]

For this to be at all useful, Dr. Paul would have to improve upon his delivery during debates. Do you really see that happening?

I disagree. This is a general election debate with people who don't track primaries but many of whom would agree with him, imho. I never used to watch primaries, and I'd have noticed him. This is about reaching people who don't even tune in until after conventions, imho.

 

[Lindsey]

For this to be at all useful, Dr. Paul would have to improve upon his delivery during debates. Do you really see that happening?

I remember him doing quite awesomely in a CNN debate where they actually let him speak after the other candidates went on a "Ron Paul is right" streak. He owned that night, until the post-debate commentary proceeded to marginalize him.

 

[Lindsey]

I thought I remembered reading a few months ago, where GJ said he would step aside if RP was Republican nominee. Maybe it's not so far fetched to see him make accommodations to get RP on his ticket.

 

[rp08orbust]

But the $39 million is too high a number.

Go ahead and edit it down to a more reasonable estimate if you want.

 

[sailingaway]

No, that is not an option!

The LP held their convention. Judge Jim Gray is the duly elected VP.

Why can't people understand this?

They would have to decide it is worth it to them. No one is forcing them, but Ron brings a lot to the table. I just think it is as Pres or not worth it, but the LP doesn't have to do it at all, of course. I can understand them wanting to stick to their procedure. However if they were planing to break procedure to make Ron VP, I think that simply isn't worth it and Ron should run independent or not at all in that case. The presidential debate is what would make it worth it, and Ron, not GJ, polls well enough for that to be a real chance.

BUT, the LP is its own party and can make up its own mind if it wants to move things around as much as it would have to to do that. I don't think anyone is saying the LP HAS to do anything.

 

[mport1]

For this to be at all useful, Dr. Paul would have to improve upon his delivery during debates. Do you really see that happening?

No, I don't think he will improve on his delivery. I'd prefer a jumbled and rambling pro-liberty message to get out there instead of none at all though.

 

[sailingaway]

Ron Paul would never rob people of $39M. That is immoral and against everything he stands for.

He might not take it. That is a very real possibility given he refused it in 2008. However, in 1989 he did say that while he was still against it, he no longer felt strongly about it for non major party candidates because of all the funding given to the major parties and the barriers through ballot access etc thrown at anyone else. He said he might be able to be persuaded it was ok for a minor party. Go to this video at 46:50

 

[sailingaway]

wonder how much the RNC convention cost us just to have our votes suppressed

they got $18 million directly and another $50 million was spent on security, I read, although that might have been for both the DNC and RNC combined. But also their secret service protection is paid for at $40,000 a day, from whenever they start getting that in the primary, the list goes on.