Ben Carson: Being Gay Is A Choice Because Of Prison Sex [VIDEO]

Using someone or something as a sex object does not mean you are attracted to him or it. Also I do not think there is any evidence that heterosexual men who have sex in prison lose their preference for women over men. Sure, you can bring up the "acquired taste" argument where you might be able to actually influence your preference, but I hope you realize that this is not what happens in the vast majority of cases. You are using rare exceptions to draw a broad conclusion.

The absolute correct point that Ben Carson was making is that race and sexual preference are fundamentally different. Race is not an "acquired taste." It doesn't change. It's fixed. Sexual preference is not fixed in the same way the racial preference of the black children who preferred white dolls is not fixed.
 
Actually what I was saying is that some dude could spend his whole life not having had any sexual encounters with men or women, and still claim to be straight. I was responding to the incorrect claim that sexual orientation is "not about who you are attracted to, it's about who you actually have sex with." Which I have just demonstrated to be incorrect by counterexample.

In your scenario though, I suppose they could, but why would they? Have you ever heard of that happening? If everyone knows you are a man and have had boyfriends your whole life, why would you embarrass yourself and claim to be straight? At the very least you would have to go with bisexual if you wanted to claim you still prefer women.

From this......





To this......




 
The use of the term "orientation" is a code phrase for "born that way/it's not a choice," which is used in the culture war to say "thou shalt not question that." What if you don't subscribe to that notion, does that mean your very dissent must be "insulting" to others? Why can't social conservatives like Carson be likewise "insulted" that the tilting of the discussion of an issue, down to the questions asked, packs the social liberal view into the cake as being self-evident? The crap slung was undeserved, in other words.

If you think it's a code phrase so be it, I'll grant that, even though I don't. If you don't "subscribe to that notion," then no, that dissent isn't insulting to others (or I should say I don't think it should be). Social conservatives can be insulted if they want to react in that way - each person on both sides of the issue are free to react in any way they choose.

Now, that said, from my own personal experience I just always knew I was straight - always - even when I was "too young" to know what such a thing was. So, based on that I am extrapolating my experience to the rest of the world. Some people may "fairly" critique this, but I also extrapolate my experience of pain when I stub my toe or get hit in the head, and conclude from my experience that the rest of humanity doesn't like those things either...so it's not exactly an invalid argument to make (my argument based on sexuality takes the same form); though I will allow that it may be slightly incomplete, as I do see a probability (possibility) that there could be social (or other) factors that influence someone's sexuality.

I find this to be so "self evident," that it is difficult to listen to people on the other side (especially those people who have had the same experience I outlined above) who then conclude that someone else's sexuality is a choice, when at the same time they would never suggest that one day they themselves woke up and went "hmmm, I think I'll be X (straight/gay)." It just seems like such an obtuse conclusion to reach (hence political position to hold) given the reality of most people's experiences - hence the vitriol on the other side of the isle. Really? Really? REALLY?

How do I know what most people's experience was? I don't. Maybe it's worth a poll...
 
That's some funny shit.

What you're saing is some dude could spend his life getting fucked in the ass, and claim he's straight because he'd rather have a girlfriend.


LOL

What if the dude spends his life getting pegged by his girlfriend?

Y'all like your lil pigeon holes don't ya.
 
Bunch of people in this thread need to sit down and watch the following doco. I can't really recommend it highly enough. The science is much more involved and grey than either the "PC" or "non-PC" camps purport.

 
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Ben Carson: Being Gay Is A Choice Because Of Prison Sex [VIDEO]

Un-Related

Rape in the American Prison

February 25, 2015

On a tangential note, read this Atlantic article and it has shocking graphic detail not quoted in below excerpts. Sending children to adult prisons seems like a very horrific punishment.

Rape in the American Prison
February 25, 2015

Three years ago, the young man who would later be known as John Doe 1 shuffled into the Richard A. Handlon Correctional Facility in Ionia, Michigan. The town of 11,000 residents, which sits in the remote center of the state, houses five prisons, and over the years, it has earned the nickname “I Own Ya.” John, who was 17, had already gotten over the initial fear of going to an adult prison—he had spent several months at a county jail near Detroit and an intake facility in Jackson—but he also knew he would be spending longer at this lonely outpost, a minimum of three years for a couple of home invasions. It was still wintery in April, and his state-issued jacket was poor protection against the drafts coming through the broken windows, shattered by men who had passed through before. “It was pretty ragged,” he recalled recently, “a tear down.”

Over the next few days, while bringing trays of food around the blocks for his new kitchen job, John would learn that he had been placed in one of the nicer units (another he saw “looked like a basement, with the lights busted out”). But he also noticed that he was one of the youngest prisoners on the block. The other prisoners noticed too. He was what they called a “fish.”

When prisoner advocates talk about PREA’s passage over a decade ago, they use use words like “miracle” and “victory.” But those same advocates acknowledge that this rare moment of bipartisanship was born out of tragedy. In 1996, a 17 year-old prisoner named Rodney Hulin Jr. had torn up his bed sheet, tied it above the door of his cell in the Clemens Unit in Brazoria County, Texas, and jumped down from the top bunk of his bed. When correctional officers cut him down, Hulin was comatose, and he died four months later. Hulin had been raped, beaten, and forced to perform oral sex within three days of his arrival at the unit. He asked to be placed in protective custody and was turned down. After his suicide, a picture of his small shoulders and thin face circulated on major news networks and Hulin became a symbol of two related phenomena. One was the prevalence of new laws that allowed youth to be sent to adult prisons, rather than juvenile facilities, for non-violent crimes (Hulin had committed second-degree arson, resulting in less than $500 of property damage). The other was prison rape.

Among prisoners and their keepers, Hulin’s experience was hardly notable. It was widely known that younger, smaller inmates were at constant risk of sexual assault. Haywood Patterson, one of the Scottsboro Boys, wrote that when he got to Alabama’s Atmore Prison in 1937, he found that young men were beaten into submission and eventually “sold themselves around on the weekends just like whore women of the streets.” In 1980, Louisiana prison-newspaper editor Wilbert Rideau won national journalism accolades for an essay called “The Sexual Jungle,” in which he wrote that “rape in prison is rarely a sexual act, but one of violence, politics, and an acting out of power roles.” Being raped, or “turned out,” he explained, redefines the male victim “as a ‘female’ in this perverse subculture, and he must assume that role as the ‘property’ of his conqueror or whoever claimed him and arranged his emasculation. He becomes a slave in the fullest sense of the term.”

Some corrections officials have pointed out that sexual assaults regularly occur in juvenile facilities as well as in adult ones. But many non-violent crimes lead to probation, rather than incarceration, when they’re handled by the juvenile system, and a 1989 study found that inmates under 18 in adult prisons reported being “sexually attacked” five times more often than their peers in juvenile institutions.

At the same time, John appears ready to be called as a witness should the case against the prison agency go to trial. He has become something of an expert on prison rape. When asked about racial dynamics—many believe that black prisoners tend to rape white prisoners in a kind of revenge for power dynamics in the outside world—John shrugged and said, “If you’re vulnerable it doesn’t matter what color you are.”

http://www.theatlantic.com/features/archive/2015/02/rape-in-the-american-prison/385550/




Suicide of Rodney Hulin

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suicide_of_Rodney_Hulin
 
,

So there is hope for HB?


dafuq-.jpg

Y do u queers keep trying to drag me into ur ghey talk? :P
 
it's quite true, but it's also incredibly poor politics to say so

It is a bad debate for him given his debating skills and tactics of those attacking him.

Dan Savage challenges Ben Carson to prove being gay is a choice: “**** my ****”

The Seattle columnist said that sometimes you have to be just as vile as conservatives to get their attention VIDEO


Screen-Shot-2015-03-09-at-10.56.33-AM-620x412.png
(Credit: CNN)

“Because a lot of people who go into prison go into prison straight — and when they come out, they’re gay,” he told host Chris Cuomo. “So, did something happen while they were in there? Ask yourself that question.”

Following outrage, Carson apologized for these claims in a statement Wednesday. It wasn’t going to suffice for The Stranger’s Dan Savage, though, who fired back at Carson in a column that weekend: “If being gay is a choice, prove it. Choose it. Choose to be gay yourself. Show America how that’s done, Ben, show us how a man can choose to be gay. s** my ****.”

Savage was not exempt from some public scrutiny of his own after these comments. The columnist joined CNN’s Brian Stelter on Sunday where he was asked why he decided to “lower himself to that level.”

http://www.salon.com/2015/03/09/som...son_after_claiming_homosexuality_is_a_choice/
 
Why do people running for office not have better sense than to say something stupid like this? People who are smart will just be quiet when they hold opinions that are way out in left field.
 
Why do people running for office not have better sense than to say something stupid like this? People who are smart will just be quiet when they hold opinions that are way out in left field.

It is way out there.. not sure it is in the left field though.
 
And humans are not by nature omnivores and are instead cannibalistic because when they are stranded in a area without food, they resort to eating each other. For a neuro surgeon, this man doesn't seem to be very smart. He thinks and talks slowly. I think he should go back to medicine, politics is not his forte.

Not a good analogy juleswin. You don't need to have gay sex to survive.
 
Why do people running for office not have better sense than to say something stupid like this? People who are smart will just be quiet when they hold opinions that are way out in left field.

So what do you feel about gay people who say that being gay is a choice?
 
Eh. I don't know if it's genetic or not, but it's certainly not a "choice". I believe some may be genetically/inherently more prone to it than others, while other external factors such as the nature of one's upbringing and social experiences can also have an impact. I also believe some are prone to it (more than you'd think) but don't have an event that makes them realize it until a certain point, if at all... But to say it's just a behavioral decision is ridiculous and couldn't be farther from the truth. Nobody chooses who they're attracted to. It just is what it is.

A lesbian told me that her decision to be lesbian definitely WAS a choice. Her own words, she "chose to be a lesbian" (she used these exact words).
 
And humans are not by nature omnivores and are instead cannibalistic because when they are stranded in a area without food, they resort to eating each other. For a neuro surgeon, this man doesn't seem to be very smart. He thinks and talks slowly. I think he should go back to medicine, politics is not his forte.

Okay. Let's take your analogy and actually apply it. First off Dr. Carson did not say that most people were gay and not heterosexual. Second, for those people who, without being stranded without food, do eat other people, do you believe those people have no choice in the matter? Jeffry Dalmer was "born cannibal?" And if a person forced into cannibalism comes back to society and continues the practice, what does that mean exactly?

One more question. Why does this even matter? There are gay people who think being gay is a choice. We had the lesbian CNN columnist who declared that being gay was a choice, that she was trying to get her daughter to "choose" to be gay, and that the only reason people were pushing the idea that gay isn't a choice was to stop pressure on people to change from being gay. Is this lesbian homophobic? I don't at all see what this has to do with anything from a liberty perspective.
 
It is a bad debate for him given his debating skills and tactics of those attacking him.

Following outrage, Carson apologized for these claims in a statement Wednesday. It wasn’t going to suffice for The Stranger’s Dan Savage, though, who fired back at Carson in a column that weekend: “If being gay is a choice, prove it. Choose it. Choose to be gay yourself. Show America how that’s done, Ben, show us how a man can choose to be gay. s** my ****.”

Dr. Carson is too nice to be up to the task. Obvious response is "Mr. Savage do you think suicide is a choice? Can you prove that it is or is not a choice by killing yourself?"
 
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