Back in the wind.

[tod evans]

Where did he put his equipment??

Gangbox...

He was an out-of-towner brought in on commercial work........1st tapeworm I ever saw in use...

 

[Origanalist]

Gangbox...

He was an out-of-towner brought in on commercial work........1st tapeworm I ever saw in use...

Lol, I own one of those pre-historic beasties, in working order!

 

[tod evans]

Lol, I own one of those pre-historic beasties, in working order!

Whadda use now?

 

[Origanalist]

Whadda use now?

Tape Tech. There are probably 7 or 8 different brands now, Tape Tech is a direct copy of the Ames tools. I was actually working for the guy who started Tape Tech, he used to send tools out with us to run and give feedback on. He finally gave up and just directly copied Ames when their patent ran out.

 

[TheCount]

CBR300R with same motor goes 100 MPH. Why would 90 MPH a bad estimate?

There's a world of difference aerodynamically between a sportbike with a fairing and a cruiser or something pretending to be a cruiser. Also, even though those bikes have the same engine, they do not have the same cams or gear ratios They've sacrificed top end power in the rebel for more torque.

Ultimately, though, riding a light bike at those speeds - any speed above 60-ish really - is not a pleasant experience. You get blown all over the place, and the bike is much more apt to track the pavement and go where it wants to go rather than where you want it to go. If you've ever driven a tiny car with small wheels/tires, it's a similar problem, but much more pronounced on the bike. It requires a lot more attention from the rider, and you have to constantly adjust to keep going where you want to go. It's partly to do with weight and partly to do with the angle of the front fork. My wife has a CB500F which I've ridden many times. I wouldn't choose to ride more it for longer than maybe 30-45 minutes at freeway speeds. I could, and it would be fine, but it certainly wouldn't be fun or pleasant.

If this is purely a commute machine for you, then you likely won't be affected by that, but you should keep it in mind if you are thinking about doing any long-distance riding.


On the topic of 'enough power' one thing that you should keep in mind is gearing. That 300cc single cylinder is going to be in its top gear on the freeway, and midway through the RPMs. It would be completely wrung out. If you suddenly decided that you needed more power to scoot out of a situation, you would have very little power on tap no matter how far you turned the throttle. You'd need to drop a gear or else just scoot away slowly. Either way you're not going to be able to react as quickly to a problem as if you had a bit more displacement, torque, etc. where you could just twist the throttle a bit and have instant power.

 

[anaconda]

Would you feel comfortable riding a 'scooter' or even an entry level bike during rush hour in any city?

Obviously anaconda can do as he pleases but my kid won't get my permission to ride anything smaller than a sportster as long as I'm in charge

Make no mistake. Everyone's opinions here are monumentally valuable to me.

Ironically, the reason a smaller bike might be A-OK in lane splitting CA is that the rush hour traffic in many areas is SLOW! If everyone is going 0 to 10 MPH in their cages, you could zip through that stuff and never have your bike over about 35 MPH. Lane splitters, if I recall, are limited to 15 MPH over the bogged down cars. BTW "rush hour" between S.F. and Oakland is from about 7 AM to 8 PM with a break from about 11 AM to 1 PM.

 

[tod evans]

Make no mistake. Everyone's opinions here are monumentally valuable to me.

Ironically, the reason a smaller bike might be A-OK in lane splitting CA is that the rush hour traffic in many areas is SLOW! If everyone is going 0 to 10 MPH in their cages, you could zip through that stuff and never have your bike over about 35 MPH. Lane splitters, if I recall, are limited to 15 MPH over the bogged down cars. BTW "rush hour" between S.F. and Oakland is from about 7 AM to 8 PM with a break from about 11 AM to 1 PM.

At 15mph a water cooled rig might be your best bet.......

Even those get hot at low speeds, hot for the rider more than the motor....

 

[anaconda]

I'm picturing 75mph, 4-6 lanes fighting for position....The ability to drop a gear, or two, and open it up has always been my favorite way to avoid idiots.

Ah! We were having a semantic misunderstanding. The situation you describe here is not Bay Area "rush hour." You've described the Bay Area at all times not rush hour. "Rush hour" is cars backed up a quarter of a mile bumper to bumper waiting to creep towards the Bay Bridge toll booth. And after paying, they get to wait at metering lights. The only lane that moves fast is the "car pool" lane which, BTW, motorcycles can use!

 

[anaconda]

At 15mph a water cooled rig might be your best bet.......

Even those get hot at low speeds, hot for the rider more than the motor....

Another great point. The legal lane splitting in CA helps some with this some, I imagine.

 

[anaconda]

There's a world of difference aerodynamically between a sportbike with a fairing and a cruiser or something pretending to be a cruiser. Also, even though those bikes have the same engine, they do not have the same cams or gear ratios They've sacrificed top end power in the rebel for more torque.

Ultimately, though, riding a light bike at those speeds - any speed above 60-ish really - is not a pleasant experience. You get blown all over the place, and the bike is much more apt to track the pavement and go where it wants to go rather than where you want it to go. If you've ever driven a tiny car with small wheels/tires, it's a similar problem, but much more pronounced on the bike. It requires a lot more attention from the rider, and you have to constantly adjust to keep going where you want to go. It's partly to do with weight and partly to do with the angle of the front fork. My wife has a CB500F which I've ridden many times. I wouldn't choose to ride more it for longer than maybe 30-45 minutes at freeway speeds. I could, and it would be fine, but it certainly wouldn't be fun or pleasant.

If this is purely a commute machine for you, then you likely won't be affected by that, but you should keep it in mind if you are thinking about doing any long-distance riding.


On the topic of 'enough power' one thing that you should keep in mind is gearing. That 300cc single cylinder is going to be in its top gear on the freeway, and midway through the RPMs. It would be completely wrung out. If you suddenly decided that you needed more power to scoot out of a situation, you would have very little power on tap no matter how far you turned the throttle. You'd need to drop a gear or else just scoot away slowly. Either way you're not going to be able to react as quickly to a problem as if you had a bit more displacement, torque, etc. where you could just twist the throttle a bit and have instant power.

This is a top concern as I navigate the shark infested waters of first bike decision making. Thank you for suggesting this. I will prioritize it.

 

[tod evans]

Ah! We were having a semantic misunderstanding. The situation you describe here is not Bay Area "rush hour." You've described the Bay Area at all times not rush hour. "Rush hour" is cars backed up a quarter of a mile bumper to bumper waiting to creep towards the Bay Bridge toll booth. And after paying, they get to wait at metering lights. The only lane that moves fast is the "car pool" lane which, BTW, motorcycles can use!

Were it I navigating 4-6 lanes of hangovers-n-housewives I'd opt for drag pipes and a stroker.........

But you've poo-pooed that............

Next up is enough power to get away from them, them being the idiot trying to kill you either intentionally or by neglect...

After your first year you'll understand that every car and most small trucks are gunnin' for you.............Semi drivers generally show respect.

 

[anaconda]

Also I've read that dual sports with their very high seat heights are good for city traffic as you can see and be seen from the several extra inches of height. Also good for for going over man hole covers, potholes, railroad tracks, and tore up segments of streets. Many months ago I thought I wanted one of these:

But now I really like the idea of not just full flat-footing, but full flat-footing with also some bend in the knees. Which has driven me toward the consideration of something in a cruiser style frame set up.

 

[TheCount]

Also I've read that dual sports with their very high seat heights are good for city traffic as you can see and be seen from the several extra inches of height. Also good for for going over man hole covers, potholes, railroad tracks, and tore up segments of streets. Many months ago I thought I wanted one of these:

But now I really like the idea of not just full flat-footing, but full flat-footing with also some bend in the knees. Which has driven me toward the consideration of something in a cruiser style frame set up.

The problem with cruisers is their width. In a standard or moto bike, you're vaguely top on top of the engine, and they are more narrow. That narrowness will help you lane split.

Somewhat in between the two types of bikes you're talking about is a standard. The CB500X is taller like a motocross bike, and is 'adventure' which means it's 90% pavement and 10% dirt roads. The CB500F is similar but about 2-3 inches shorter. Other than suspension height the two bikes are identical.

If your inseam is 30" or longer you will be flat-footed on a CB500F. Above 32" you would be flat-footed on a CB500X.


The rebel 500 is essentially the same bike but with a 4" lower seat. The rear suspension is different because the seat is too low for the shock to be under the seat and so there's two smaller shocks, one on either side of the seat.

If you look between the white CB500F and the grey Rebel you can see same engine, same radiator, same headers, same footpegs... same same same. The only difference is seating position.

 

[Origanalist]

Too big for me as a starter. I'm gonna need to push whatever I buy around some obstacles in the small garage I'll be sharing with a car. The older Honda Reflex is about the biggest I would want to try for if I go the "maxi-scooter" route. But yes, these are great I believe. Thanks for mentioning it. This beemer is 575 lbs. The Honda Reflex (shown above in post #134) is 375 lbs.

Just a thought, but IMO this is a bad way to go about considering buying a motorcycle. You need to consider what your needs will be on the road and the rest should be secondary and accommodations made accordingly. Otherwise your going to regret your purchase except when you're parking it.

 

[anaconda]

Just a thought, but IMO this is a bad way to go about considering buying a motorcycle. You need to consider what your needs will be on the road and the rest should be secondary and accommodations made accordingly. Otherwise your going to regret your purchase except when you're parking it.

Great point. But for me right now anything large will have to be parked outside. In Oakland. Plus, there's a vague correlation because I believe I will be far more inclined to ride something that I fund fun, flickable, and approachable. There's a youtube of a guy who owned a Ninja 300 and he loved it but just never rode it much. He swapped it out for a Honda PCX 150 scooter and he apparently rides the scooter all the time.

 

[anaconda]

The problem with cruisers is their width. In a standard or moto bike, you're vaguely top on top of the engine, and they are more narrow. That narrowness will help you lane split.

Somewhat in between the two types of bikes you're talking about is a standard. The CB500X is taller like a motocross bike, and is 'adventure' which means it's 90% pavement and 10% dirt roads. The CB500F is similar but about 2-3 inches shorter. Other than suspension height the two bikes are identical.

If your inseam is 30" or longer you will be flat-footed on a CB500F. Above 32" you would be flat-footed on a CB500X.


The rebel 500 is essentially the same bike but with a 4" lower seat. The rear suspension is different because the seat is too low for the shock to be under the seat and so there's two smaller shocks, one on either side of the seat.

If you look between the white CB500F and the grey Rebel you can see same engine, same radiator, same headers, same footpegs... same same same. The only difference is seating position.

Thanks for the great analysis! I knew the engines were identical, but was not aware of all of this you have pointed out.

 

[anaconda]

The problem with cruisers is their width. In a standard or moto bike, you're vaguely top on top of the engine, and they are more narrow. That narrowness will help you lane split.

I'm not understanding why a cruiser would necessarily be wide. V-Twins mostly are longitudinally opposed in line with the frame. Maybe you are referring to the fact that many cruisers are simply big bikes that are also wide. But wouldn't something like, say, a Suzuki S40 be pretty narrow?

 

[Anti Federalist]

I'm not understanding why a cruiser would necessarily be wide. V-Twins mostly are longitudinally opposed in line with the frame. Maybe you are referring to the fact that many cruisers are simply big bikes that are also wide. But wouldn't something like, say, a Suzuki S40 be pretty narrow?

If you like that, you also have this option:

 

[TheCount]

I'm not understanding why a cruiser would necessarily be wide.

It's because of the riding position and styling. Many cruisers you sit more 'in' the bike than 'on' the bike. You're entirely behind the engine, rather than being somewhat above the transmission. Footpegs are forward and wide because your legs are spread out somewhat. The handlebars are also typically wider because of the rake angle of the front suspension.

Again, sticking with Honda bikes for easy comparison, the CTX700 and the NC700 are essentially the same bike, but the CTX is significantly larger. According to Honda's dimensions specs, the CTX is 6 inches wider, which is around 20% more. On the other hand, the Rebel 500 is only about an inch wider than the CB500F.

 

[anaconda]

If you like that, you also have this option:

$6,000 gives this a lot of competition. This is kickstart only! Very Hipster, or possibly simply the A/F simplicity doctrine! I also heard somewhere that you can't kick start a fuel injected engine. But this appears to defy that story line. Very nice looking, sufficient power for me, not too big. Love the seat shape and length. Isn't 24 HP for 399cc's a bit stingy?