Are you unemployed?

[ihsv]

I'm self employed, so I guess I have a job... when I want to work

 

[danberkeley]

I'm self employed, so I guess I have a job... when I want to work

Did you form a union to protect yourself from being exploiting by yourself?

 

[ihsv]

Did you form a union to protect yourself from being exploiting by yourself?

I'm VERY fair with my employee

 

[JordanL]

So, to those of you unemployed...what are you doing? Are you seeking jobs in the same industry or something completely different? Or even nothing at all?

The reason I'm asking is because I stayed with my industry but got a job I'm completely overqualified for.

I am attempting to stay in the same industry, because it is far and away my best skill.

I am, by the words of all my previous employers, not mine, one of the top 2% of programmers they've ever dealt with.

The economy is just shit right now, so it doesn't matter. I might be able to get over the experience hump if I had a CS degree, but that'd require me to take on student loans, which are just about the only form of debt which can't be erased through bankruptcy.

So I'm really stuck between a rock and a hard place.

Not to mention that my last employer still owes me $4,500...

 

[roho76]

So, to those of you unemployed...what are you doing? Are you seeking jobs in the same industry or something completely different? Or even nothing at all?

The reason I'm asking is because I stayed with my industry but got a job I'm completely overqualified for.

I was self employed but the companies that I did work for are dry with work. I am going to work with another company close to me but they are tied to the Automotive Industry also so who knows how long that will last. We are leaving MI probably in the spring soon as we find work in Texas. I would like to stay in robotics where ever I go so if anybody from TX hears of work in automation or Robotics specifically please PM me.

 

[roho76]

I'm self employed, so I guess I have a job... when I want to work

Just curious, what type of work do you do? I would like to stay self employed that would be nice. I'm trying to figure out how to write software for Unix based systems. I'm teaching myself it's a slow process.

 

[Fox McCloud]

while being unemployed is, indeed, no fun...well, it gives you certain leverage when spreading Libertarian ideals to your friends/neighbors/etc. who are more of the liberal persuasion....it makes it very difficult for them to touch on the unemployed, poor, down-and-out, and other such labels....and they can't say "well, you're just supporting that because you want to crush XXXXXXX people".

Won't always work, but hey, it does give you a little leverage.

*sigh* I know, not that great of leverage, I'm sure all of you would rather be employed than have "leverage" in a debate...but, ahh well, just trying to provide a little sunshine.

 

[Brian4Liberty]

I am attempting to stay in the same industry, because it is far and away my best skill.

I am, by the words of all my previous employers, not mine, one of the top 2% of programmers they've ever dealt with.

The economy is just shit right now, so it doesn't matter. I might be able to get over the experience hump if I had a CS degree, but that'd require me to take on student loans, which are just about the only form of debt which can't be erased through bankruptcy.

So I'm really stuck between a rock and a hard place.

Not to mention that my last employer still owes me $4,500...

Top programmer? You mean you you were good at training your Indian replacement? I've trained my Indian replacements at two different companies...

CS degree is taken for granted, and doesn't really help. India churns out MS and PhD programmers (not that those degrees are necessary for programming). Jobs that say Masters or PhD required are usually code for "we only hire Indians".

 

[JordanL]

Top programmer? You mean you you were good at training your Indian replacement? I've trained my Indian replacements at two different companies...

CS degree is taken for granted, and doesn't really help. India churns out MS and PhD programmers (not that those degrees are necessary for programming). Jobs that say Masters or PhD required are usually code for "we only hire Indians".

Web development is a little more American oriented. Mostly because the Indian stuff is almost always complete bullshit.

I'm not gonna hate on anyone for being a certain ethnicity, but how Indian trained programmers manage to be SO BAD at their chosen profession I'll never know.

Anyway, those indian guys usually generate more work for me. They create a bullshit product that someone eventually has to fix. At some point, every firm gives up and simply has an American do it correctly, and that's usually the jobs I get.

Recently a lot of firms have simply been blackballing the whole project when the indian firm returns a fubar product.

 

[Brian4Liberty]

Web development is a little more American oriented. Mostly because the Indian stuff is almost always complete bullshit.

I'm not gonna hate on anyone for being a certain ethnicity, but how Indian trained programmers manage to be SO BAD at their chosen profession I'll never know.

Anyway, those indian guys usually generate more work for me. They create a bullshit product that someone eventually has to fix. At some point, every firm gives up and simply has an American do it correctly, and that's usually the jobs I get.

Recently a lot of firms have simply been blackballing the whole project when the indian firm returns a fubar product.

Lol! Don't you and I know it. Unfortunately, the massive propoganda about "the great Indian tech people" has fooled almost everyone. All so Bill Gates could import his cheap labor.

 

[JordanL]

Lol! Don't you and I know it. Unfortunately, the massive propoganda about "the great Indian tech people" has fooled almost everyone. All so Bill Gates could import his cheap labor.

Most web stuff is forward facing, which is what saves it for people like me. When a shit Indian programmer gives them a shit product, they don't have an operator who's using the software that can compensate for the broken-ness, they have customers who expect it to work.

So most clients end up paying two or three times when they buy the Indian solution.

I usually give them a long lecture, a card, a promise of a competative rate for a working product if they come to me to begin with instead of having me patch up a horribly coded program, and I end up getting some return business out of it.

I invested in some fancy graphs and charts to illustrate Total Cost of Ownership, including opportunity cost. It's fairly convincing.

 

[ihsv]

Just curious, what type of work do you do? I would like to stay self employed that would be nice. I'm trying to figure out how to write software for Unix based systems. I'm teaching myself it's a slow process.

I'm a web/graphic designer. Been doing it on the side for about eight or nine years, and last year I decided to do it full time from home. So far it's been working out great. We haven't missed a meal yet

There's still quite a demand for new websites; I see lots of people turning to the web to expand their business in our tough economic climate. Marketing is becoming more and more important, and increasing your customer base via the web is a vital strategic tool.

And even during a depression, people's websites break or need updating. It is becoming a little more competitive, though.

 

[roho76]

Cool.

It is becoming a little more competitive, though.

You could always lobby the government for regulations to crush your competition so you can be a lazy careless business owner forcing yourself to need bailouts for running your company into the ground.
/s

 

[ArchPaul]

Web development is a little more American oriented. Mostly because the Indian stuff is almost always complete bullshit.

I'm not gonna hate on anyone for being a certain ethnicity, but how Indian trained programmers manage to be SO BAD at their chosen profession I'll never know.

Anyway, those indian guys usually generate more work for me. They create a bullshit product that someone eventually has to fix. At some point, every firm gives up and simply has an American do it correctly, and that's usually the jobs I get.

Recently a lot of firms have simply been blackballing the whole project when the indian firm returns a fubar product.

Glad to see it's not just me! When I was consulting, I got more business fixing failed projects from India than I could imagine!!!

Here's an article of interest...

 

[Brian4Liberty]

Here's an article of interest...

I thought all computer people have had to take a 50% pay cut, that is when they can get work...

 

[ShannonOBrien]

That's kind of where I'm at. I'm a programmer who worked on contracted projects.

Well the projects have pretty much dried up. I make a pitch to people that I know can't afford it. They'd litterally have to fire two employees to pay for the project I'm pitching sometimes.

It's sad... this economy has fallen so far...

My husband's a programmer and is at risk for this. He is inventing a program that would be useful to businesses just in case the SHTF. You can probably do the same. It's still a useful skill to have.

 

[gaazn]

I have two part time jobs and I'm a full time student. I am a nanny during the week after school, and a receptionist on the weekends.

As a full time student, government won't count you as employed.

 

[gaazn]

The big question is: if you are unemployed, are you willing to work at Walmart stores or McDonalds because they are always hiring?

 

[gonegolfin]

Top programmer? You mean you you were good at training your Indian replacement? I've trained my Indian replacements at two different companies...

CS degree is taken for granted, and doesn't really help. India churns out MS and PhD programmers (not that those degrees are necessary for programming). Jobs that say Masters or PhD required are usually code for "we only hire Indians".

A good CS degree is not taken for granted in the field of developing commercial software. It is the IT field (different from the commercial software field) that has felt the bulk of the pressure from offshoring. Actual software companies that want to remain successful continue to build their core operations domestically.

A CS/EE degree is nearly an absolute requirement for my hires. If they do not have a BS or MS (preferred) in one of these fields, they had better be a superstar in the commercial software field (not IT) with a proven track record. I do not have a single position offshored.

Brian

 

[Brian4Liberty]

A good CS degree is not taken for granted in the field of developing commercial software. It is the IT field (different from the commercial software field) that has felt the bulk of the pressure from offshoring. Actual software companies that want to remain successful continue to build their core operations domestically.

A CS/EE degree is nearly an absolute requirement for my hires. If they do not have a BS or MS (preferred) in one of these fields, they had better be a superstar in the commercial software field (not IT) with a proven track record. I do not have a single position offshored.

Brian

Yeah, the outsourcing and insourcing with Indians is mostly in the IT area. Unfortunately, that is the biggest segment of computer related jobs.

If you are a small operation, you would be foolish to go with a resource just because they were cheap. You don't have the bloat to support bad decisisons (like a huge company or government always does).

I should point out that the two biggest software companies do import a ton of Indian developers. MS and Oracle. They also propogate all the myths (not enough Americans, Americans aren't educated enough, Americans aren't the best, India is full of tech geniuses, etc.).

All that being said, I have hired Indian developers. I was given no choice. There was an Indian in upper management that mandated it. Like any other group, there are some good ones. Two good ones replaced 12 that had done absolutely nothing for over a year. It was major player in the computer industry at the time. I told people who were investors to sell their stock, because they would eventually go down due to very poor decision making. Over time (before the great collapse of 08), their shares went from $250.00 to $3.50. It did catch up with them, but evolution is a slow process, and bloated, stupid companies (and governments) can cling to life for a long, long time.