Are you for illegal amnesty or not?

[Light]

See poll.

 

[Stary Hickory]

No and hell no. Immigrate here legally.

I would be for open borders if there was no police state which was organized by mob rule, which is subject to the whims and manipulations of the demogauges.

 

[pahs1994]

No amnesty until govt welfare goes away

 

[bchavez]

Don't forget this poll too:

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=241788

 

[Danke]

How do you determine who is illegal? No government papers?


Do we start kicking out "Native Americans" and those without Birth Certificates?

Does an entry of my birth here in my family bible count as ID?

 

[Lord Xar]

How do you determine who is illegal? No government papers?


Do we start kicking out "Native Americans" and those without Birth Certificates?

Does an entry of my birth here in my family bible count as ID?

Do you have a social security number? A drivers license, a valid photo ID? These are all easily obtained "IF" you are legal.

I am tired of these "nazi" arguments of "DO YOU HAVE YOUR PAPERS!!!!!".

You are stoking fear, and using baseless and dishonest arguments to further your own agenda.

 

[Danke]

Do you have a social security number? A drivers license, a valid photo ID? These are all easily obtained "IF" you are legal.

I am tired of these "nazi" arguments of "DO YOU HAVE YOUR PAPERS!!!!!".

You are stoking fear, and using baseless and dishonest arguments to further your own agenda.

What documents do I need to get a SSN? A driver's License? A "valid" photo ID?

Just apply? Just my signature?

Which begs the question, why should I have to get any of those forms of approval from this government?

 

[Lord Xar]

What documents do I need to get a SSN? A driver's License? A "valid" photo ID?

Just apply? Just my signature?

Which begs the question, why should I have to get any of those forms of approval from this government?

You are fighting a bigger battle then. This is why I think extreme libertarians, are very harmful to this country. You, not you specifically - just many libertarians, sound almost anarchic. I find many libertarians are their own worst enemies because in one respect they advocate so much individual freedom, which is good, but they don't temper that with what is actually happening in current day.

You rally behind open borders, "there is no illegals", YET I barely ever, if at all, hear any of you rallying for NO WELFARE, NO GOVERNMENT AID. I never see threads started regarding it, but boy o' boy, you guys love you some open borders.. and jump right in and create threads and preach about the horrors of "showing your papers" etc... So, your advocation actually increases big government, welfare etc. and in my eyes, a globalistic government.

To answer your questions:
If you are born here, you get a SSN.
If you are authorized to work/school here, you get a temp visa, which can get you a legal/photo ID.

 

[ViniVidiVici]

Absolutely not.

 

[AuH20]

You are fighting a bigger battle then. This is why I think extreme libertarians, are very harmful to this country. You, not you specifically - just many libertarians, sound almost anarchic. I find many libertarians are their own worst enemies because in one respect they advocate so much individual freedom, which is good, but they don't temper that with what is actually happening in current day.

You rally behind open borders, "there is no illegals", YET I barely ever, if at all, hear any of you rallying for NO WELFARE, NO GOVERNMENT AID. I never see threads started regarding it, but boy o' boy, you guys love you some open borders.. and jump right in and create threads and preach about the horrors of "showing your papers" etc... So, your advocation actually increases big government, welfare etc. and in my eyes, a globalistic government.

To answer your questions:
If you are born here, you get a SSN.
If you are authorized to work/school here, you get a temp visa, which can get you a legal/photo ID.

The global elites love the pure libertarian approach. They can literally shift demographics and voting trends to their liking. Break downing national sovereignty and the concept of personal liberties was never so easy!!! Bring in destitute, desperate peoples from a nation long beset with corruption and crime & pit them against the native population, until they become the dominant population and culture. Of course, along the way, these so-called NEW Americans will swallow every statist solution since they originally emigrated from a hellhole to begin with.

 

[John Taylor]

You are fighting a bigger battle then. This is why I think extreme libertarians, are very harmful to this country. You, not you specifically - just many libertarians, sound almost anarchic. I find many libertarians are their own worst enemies because in one respect they advocate so much individual freedom, which is good, but they don't temper that with what is actually happening in current day.

You rally behind open borders, "there is no illegals", YET I barely ever, if at all, hear any of you rallying for NO WELFARE, NO GOVERNMENT AID. I never see threads started regarding it, but boy o' boy, you guys love you some open borders.. and jump right in and create threads and preach about the horrors of "showing your papers" etc... So, your advocation actually increases big government, welfare etc. and in my eyes, a globalistic government.

To answer your questions:
If you are born here, you get a SSN.
If you are authorized to work/school here, you get a temp visa, which can get you a legal/photo ID.

+1776.

If we do not control and limit immigration to those least likely to seek to redistribute and further overthrow our system of private property rights, we'll soon have a hundred million new voters, voting to use the federal government to take from the productive to reward the lazy and unproductive.

 

[John E]

Unfortunately, the immigration system is a mess and it can take a decade or more to bring some cases to a close. During that time, these people are getting married and having children. Or they bring their children with them and they grow up with America as the only home they know. These people aren't always here illegally either.

I think we need to fix a few things to reduce the # of people coming here, reduce the time that the people who are here are stuck in the courts, and then we can resolve the remaining cases in an easier way.

 

[John Taylor]

Unfortunately, the immigration system is a mess and it can take a decade or more to bring some cases to a close. During that time, these people are getting married and having children. Or they bring their children with them and they grow up with America as the only home they know. These people aren't always here illegally either.

I think we need to fix a few things to reduce the # of people coming here, reduce the time that the people who are here are stuck in the courts, and then we can resolve the remaining cases in an easier way.

Start by securing the border with troops and a fence. Then, deport every single illegal who is apprehended. I think in ten years or so we'll have most of them out. There's no point to bailing water out of one end of the pool and dumping it in the other... and that's precisely what is occuring now with the complete lack of security on our border.

 

[Danke]

You rally behind open borders, "there is no illegals", YET I barely ever, if at all, hear any of you rallying for NO WELFARE, NO GOVERNMENT AID. I never see threads started regarding it, but boy o' boy, you guys love you some open borders.. and jump right in and create threads and preach about the horrors of "showing your papers" etc... So, your advocation actually increases big government, welfare etc. and in my eyes, a globalistic government.

To answer your questions:
If you are born here, you get a SSN.
If you are authorized to work/school here, you get a temp visa, which can get you a legal/photo ID.

You don't answer the questions you are responding to, then just make shit up.

Under the current system, I'm not so much against boarder control. Will be hard, especially on our long border with Canada.

You think a person born here should get a SSN (application for a Federal government entitlement program) and/or authorization to work. And I'm for big government. You're funny.

 

[The Patriot]

Socialism and open borders do not mix. Working towards abolishing the State and it's welfare is a goal of mine, ideally. But until then, Libertarians need to take proper sides and form pragmatic political solutions conducive to liberty. Opening the borders while we have a governing apparatus and a large welfare state is not conducive to economic and personal liberty(which are one in the same). Nearly everyone of those voters is a statist, and wants to expand the scope and power of the State in every aspect of our lives through economic redistribution and centralization. I support the American Nation, and I don't want to see the State dilute it by importing in masse the dregs of the third world. We need to work towards abolishing the welfare state and ending birthright citizenship. However, those are goals that will take years to fully implement. So until then, we can let every single person with a pulse into America.

Murray Rothbard did a good article on National Self Determination.
http://www.lewrockwell.com/rothbard/rothbard134.html

 

[JeNNiF00F00]

fas·cism
   /ˈfæʃɪzəm/ Show Spelled[fash-iz-uhm] Show IPA
–noun
1.
( sometimes initial capital letter ) a governmental system led by a dictator having complete power, forcibly suppressing opposition and criticism, regimenting all industry, commerce, etc., and emphasizing an aggressive nationalism and often racism.
2.
( sometimes initial capital letter ) the philosophy, principles, or methods of fascism.
3.
( initial capital letter ) a fascist movement, esp. the one established by Mussolini in Italy 1922–43.
Use fascism in a Sentence
See images of fascism
Search fascism on the Web
Origin:
1915–20; < It fascismo, equiv. to fasc ( io ) bundle, political group ( see fasces) + -ismo -ism

—Related forms
an·ti·fas·cism, noun
pro·fas·cism, noun

*******

Socialism and open boarders do not mix. You are correct. However by closing the boarders and becoming staunch "nationalists", that would make us "National Socialists". Remember who ran the National Socialist Party?

 

[John Taylor]

fas·cism
   /ˈfæʃɪzəm/ Show Spelled[fash-iz-uhm] Show IPA
–noun
1.
( sometimes initial capital letter ) a governmental system led by a dictator having complete power, forcibly suppressing opposition and criticism, regimenting all industry, commerce, etc., and emphasizing an aggressive nationalism and often racism.
2.
( sometimes initial capital letter ) the philosophy, principles, or methods of fascism.
3.
( initial capital letter ) a fascist movement, esp. the one established by Mussolini in Italy 1922–43.
Use fascism in a Sentence
See images of fascism
Search fascism on the Web
Origin:
1915–20; < It fascismo, equiv. to fasc ( io ) bundle, political group ( see fasces) + -ismo -ism

—Related forms
an·ti·fas·cism, noun
pro·fas·cism, noun

*******

Socialism and open boarders do not mix. You are correct. However by closing the boarders and becoming staunch "nationalists", that would make us "National Socialists". Remember who ran the National Socialist Party?

Hahahaha!!!

 

[dean.engelhardt]

I didn't vote. To fix the immigration problem there must be a choice in the middle. If we have to choose one of the extremes we will always have the problem.

 

[Stary Hickory]

Do you have a social security number? A drivers license, a valid photo ID? These are all easily obtained "IF" you are legal.

I am tired of these "nazi" arguments of "DO YOU HAVE YOUR PAPERS!!!!!".

You are stoking fear, and using baseless and dishonest arguments to further your own agenda.

+1776

Come here with rational arguments not slogans or meaningless catch phrases in an attempt to make ridiculous comparisons.

 

[aravoth]

this question is loaded, and the only reason immigration is a big deal now is because the economy is in the shitter.

I understand wanting to kick out the cartel group that shoot up small border towns. But instituting a police state and forcing people to display their "papers" just because of the way the look is complete and total horseshit, and it is exactly what the Nazi's did.