Anybody interested in some confusing information from Alabama?

[Eryxis]

Well, in Alabama you vote for your Presidential preference, and then vote for specific delegates for the state and then vote for specific delegates for your Congressional District. Looks like Ron is having 2-4 times the delegates being voted for than he has people voting for him as their choice. The fun part (as I'm reading) is that our electronic counters were supposed to kick out ballots that had votes for delegates other than who you voted for as President. Anybody actually surprised by this? I'll share more as I come across it.

*edit* I changed my mind about a poll after posting this. I'm not really alleging fraud, but looks like we've got more "irregularities" cropping up here in Alabama.

 

[tsai3904]

It states on the ballot that if you vote for delegates, you must vote for delegates pledged to the Presidential candidate you voted for.

Also, the voting for delegates is just a technicality. It has no consequence on whether a candidate is awarded delegates. The delegates you see on the ballot are Ron Paul supporters fighting for the same specific delegate position. This happened because we had 33 more Ron Paul supporters file as delegates than we needed.

 

[Eryxis]

I'm familiar with how the delegates are awarded. What I've been reading is that there were x RP votes with 4x delegate votes for place 1, and 4x place 2, etc.

 

[BamaAla]

There was a woman at my polling station that voted for Ron Paul and then filled in the first 3 or 4 delegates listed below the Presidential box (they were Gingrich delegates.) After she realized her mistake, she voted correctly for Ron Paul delegates only and then the statewide offices and local offices. When she finished, she asked the worker if she needed to fill out another ballot, but he directed her to put it in the machine and see if it was accepted; it was accepted.

I'm inclined to believe that a lot of these discrepancies are the result of people not reading the directions and filling in every box on their ballot.

 

[Eryxis]

I'm leaning towards that too Bama. Apparently, the reader was supposed to reject ballots that didn't follow the rules. It doesn't look like they did.

 

[bbwarfield]

http://results.enr.clarityelections.com/AL/38312/75652/en/summary.html

Confirmed.... Did it show you all the delegates or just Paul's after you voted for Paul?

 

[bbwarfield]

Ah.... Punch ballots in some places... That could make some sense

 

[RonRules]

One possible explanation is that vote shenanigans (by algorithmic vote flipping) were only applied to the presidential candidate, but not to the delegates. So if there were 4X votes for Ron Paul, 4X votes for the delegates, then the vote flipping applied on the candidate, but not the delegates, you would end up with 1X votes for Ron Paul and still remaining 4X votes for the delegates.

If you live in Alabama, please URGE your local Registrar of Voters to seal all the votes, the voting machines, record all the serial numbers, software version numbers and get all that stuff SECURELY locked up immediately. Please do it!

 

[bbwarfield]

Download the vote excel files from secretary of states office before they "fix" this! Es&s will get rid of it by morning! http://results.enr.clarityelections.com/AL/38312/75652/en/summary.html

 

[RonRules]

Hi bbwarfield!

You decided to take a break from the vote flipping thread! Me too.

Alabama is absolutely outrageous! Look guys/gals, please wake up here!

Ron Paul: 4.97% 26,181
Ron's delegates Place 1: 72,126
Ron's delegates Place 2: 68,001
Ron's delegates Place 3: 65,015
Ron's delegates Place 4: 65,659
...
...
Mitt Romney: 29.52% 155,511
Romney's delegates Place 1: 155,087
Romney's delegates Place 2: 137,992
Romney's delegates Place 3: 136,525
Romney's delegates Place 4: 135,450
...
...

Rick Santorum: 33.90% 178,585
Santorum's delegates Place 1: 162,257
...
...


Time to get the lanterns and pitchforks out!

 

[Tonewah]

I've got an 'irregularity' for you... we were outside my precinct all day and we had multiple Ron Paul supporters come up and tell us that they weren't given a GOP ballot after being told they had to vote democrat. We live in an area that is primarily democrat and has a long history of voter intimidation (I live in Selma... think voting rights march). My Aunt was refused a GOP ballot, told she had to vote democratic and a fellow RP supporter was turned away from the precinct when he and his wife asked for GOP ballots. After another Paul supporter contacted the Probate Judge, they allowed him to come back. I'm still not sure if they gave him the GOP ballot or not. I personally did not have this experience. They handed me my GOP ballot and let me vote.

To address your issue, my cousin accidentally put a line through another candidate's delegate and they gave him a new ballot.

 

[gerryb]

Hi bbwarfield!

You decided to take a break from the vote flipping thread! Me too.

Alabama is absolutely outrageous! Look guys/gals, please wake up here!

Who is heading up the lawsuit?

Who

Ron Paul: 4.97% 26,181
Ron's delegates Place 1: 72,126
Ron's delegates Place 2: 68,001
Ron's delegates Place 3: 65,015
Ron's delegates Place 4: 65,659
...
...
Mitt Romney: 29.52% 155,511
Romney's delegates Place 1: 155,087
Romney's delegates Place 2: 137,992
Romney's delegates Place 3: 136,525
Romney's delegates Place 4: 135,450
...
...

Rick Santorum: 33.90% 178,585
Santorum's delegates Place 1: 162,257
...
...


Time to get the lanterns and pitchforks out!

Who do we have on the GOP committee to investigate this?
Who do we have on the State Central committee?

Who have they hired as attorney?

 

[kathy88]

This is enough. We need to file a class action lawsuit against the National GOP and let it trickle down. How do we do it?

 

[RonRules]

BTW, I suspect that a significant l amount of votes were also solen from Gingrich and Santorum, besides Ron Paul
Data source: http://results.enr.clarityelections.com/AL/38312/75657/en/summary.html#

MICHELE BACHMANN (REP) 0.26% 1,393
NEWT GINGRICH (REP) 29.43% 155,068
JON HUNTSMAN (REP) 0.17% 900
RON PAUL (REP) 4.97% 26,181
RICK PERRY (REP) 0.28% 1,468
MITT ROMNEY (REP) 29.52% 155,511
RICK SANTORUM (REP) 33.90% 178,585
UNCOMMITTED (REP) 1.46% 7,715
526,821

Ron Paul: 4.97% 26,181 (Possible loss of 45,945 votes. Lower value technically IMPOSSIBLE)
Ron's delegates Place 1: 72,126
Ron's delegates Place 2: 68,001
Ron's delegates Place 3: 65,015
Ron's delegates Place 4: 65,659
...
...
Mitt Romney: 29.52% 155,511 (424 votes higher from Place 1)
Romney's delegates Place 1: 155,087
Romney's delegates Place 2: 137,992
Romney's delegates Place 3: 136,525
Romney's delegates Place 4: 135,450
...
...
Rick Santorum: 33.90% 178,585 (16,328 votes higher from Place 1)
Santorum's delegates Place 1: 162,257
Santorum's delegates Place 2: 154,505
Santorum's delegates Place 2: 151,710
...
...
Newt Gingrich 29.43% 155,068
Newt's delegates Place 2: 178,627 (No place 1 delegates, 23,559 votes higher from Place 2)
Newt's delegates Place 3: 159,473
Newt's delegates Place 4: 151,173

 

[RonRules]

This is enough. We need to file a class action lawsuit against the National GOP and let it trickle down. How do we do it?

Hi Kathy88, we miss you over in the flippn' thread. If you want to stay here and take care of Alabama that's fine too. Alabamans don't seem as outraged as we are, even three voted "no fraud" in the above poll. The discrepancy of 45,945 votes for Ron, 16,328 for Rick, 23,559 for Newt is serious stuff. Other activists are worried in other states that a few dead people could vote (rightfully so) and here we've got a total discrepancy of 85,832 votes, and very few seem to care.

Please Alabama, this is serious. First contact your respective county Registrar of Voters and the Secretary of State Beth Chapman (800-274-8683). Tell her to SAVE EVERYTHING and start looking into this. If you can witness that, please do.

If that does not work contact your Sheriff and local media for them to investigate. It's their job.

 

[tsai3904]

The discrepancy of 45,945 votes for Ron, 16,328 for Rick, 23,559 for Newt is serious stuff. Other activists are worried in other states that a few dead people could vote (rightfully so) and here we've got a total discrepancy of 85,832 votes, and very few seem to care.

Do you understand that you didn't have to vote for delegates? It is an option. The point is that if you vote for Ron Paul AND if you vote for delegates, you MUST only vote for Ron Paul delegates. In Ron Paul's case, he got 26,181 votes so none of his delegate votes should be over that number. However, in Romney and Santorum's cases, their delegate votes are less than the votes for the candidates' themselves. There's nothing wrong with that as some people who voted for Romney or Santorum chose not to vote for Romney or Santorum delegates because they didn't have to.

 

[specsaregood]

Ok, so this is the first time in this election process my spidey senses are tingling.... unless dr. paul had some real well known stars on the ballot as his delegates I can't imagine how this would happen.

 

[gerryb]

Do you understand that you didn't have to vote for delegates? It is an option. The point is that if you vote for Ron Paul AND if you vote for delegates, you MUST only vote for Ron Paul delegates. In Ron Paul's case, he got 26,181 votes so none of his delegate votes should be over that number. However, in Romney and Santorum's cases, their delegate votes are less than the votes for the candidates' themselves. There's nothing wrong with that as some people who voted for Romney or Santorum chose not to vote for Romney or Santorum delegates because they didn't have to.

This.

Pay attention, folks.

39,478 vote DEFICIT from RP's vote total and his 4th place delegate.

20,061 GAIN for Romney total from his 4th place delegate
27865 GAIN for Santorum
3895 GAIN for Gingrich

 

[RonRules]

Do you understand that you didn't have to vote for delegates? It is an option. The point is that if you vote for Ron Paul AND if you vote for delegates, you MUST only vote for Ron Paul delegates. In Ron Paul's case, he got 26,181 votes so none of his delegate votes should be over that number. However, in Romney and Santorum's cases, their delegate votes are less than the votes for the candidates' themselves. There's nothing wrong with that as some people who voted for Romney or Santorum chose not to vote for Romney or Santorum delegates because they didn't have to.

Understood. I'll clarify the above post, but if you add up Santorum and Gingrich's vote discrepancy you come up with near 40,000. I could see 5,000 people not opting for delegates, but the remaining 40,000 could have been flipped.

In fact, in the case of Romney only 424 people chose to vote for Romney and not to vote for delegates. That's a likely number.
Mitt Romney: 29.52% 155,511 (424 votes higher from Place 1)
Romney's delegates Place 1: 155,087

 

[tsai3904]

Understood. I'll clarify the above post, but if you add up Santorum and Gingrich's vote discrepancy you come up with near 40,000. I could see 5,000 people not opting for delegates, but the remaining 40,000 could have been flipped.

Take a look at the ballot and think about how confusing it is.

http://alabamavotes.gov/downloads/election/2012/primary/sampleballots/Autauga-Rep-2012-Sample.pdf

You think any average person understood what they were suppose to do?

The first column was the vote for Presidential candidate. The second column had Gingrich and Paul delegates. I would bet that most people thought after you voted for the Presidential candidate, you moved on to the second column and some may have voted for Paul's delegates over Gingrich's delegates.