Another Venezuela Thread :)

[UWDude]

Maduro: Two People Captured While Sabotaging Communications

 

[goldenequity]

tim anderson‏ [MENTION=8329]Tim[/MENTION]and2037 · 36 min.
How they planned the sabotage of electricity in Venezuela - US democracy promotion in action.
By Max Blumenthal
US Regime Change Blueprint Proposed Venezuelan Electricity Blackouts as ‘Watershed Event’ for ‘Galvanizing Public Unrest’
https://thegrayzone.com/2019/03/11/...atershed-event-for-galvanizing-public-unrest/

US tax paid NGO's (The US-funded CANVAS organization) have been training activist 'overthrow saboteurs' like 'Juan Guaido and friends' for decades worldwide.

CANVAS is a spinoff of Otpor, a Serbian protest group founded by Srdja Popovic in 1998 at the University of Belgrade. Otpor, which means “resistance” in Serbian, was the student group that worked alongside US soft power organizations to mobilize the protests that eventually toppled the late Serbian President Slobodan Milosevic.

CANVAS has been funded largely through the National Endowment for Democracy, a CIA cut-out that functions as the US government’s main arm of promoting regime change. According to leaked internal emails from Stratfor, an intelligence firm known as the “shadow CIA,” CANVAS “may have also received CIA funding and training during the 1999/2000 anti-Milosevic struggle.”

A leaked email from a Stratfor staffer noted that after they ousted Milosevic, “the kids who ran OTPOR grew up, got suits and designed CANVAS… or in other words a ‘export-a-revolution’ group that sowed the seeds for a NUMBER of color revolutions. They are still hooked into U.S. funding and basically go around the world trying to topple dictators and autocratic governments (ones that U.S. does not like .”

Stratfor subsequently revealed that CANVAS “turned its attention to Venezuela” in 2005, after training opposition movements that led pro-NATO regime change operations across Eastern Europe.

In September 2010, as Venezuela headed for a parliamentary election, CANVAS produced a series of memos outlining the plans they had hatched with “non-formal actors” like Guaido and his cadre of student activists to bring down Chavez. “This is the first opportunity for the opposition to get back into a position of power,” Popovic wrote at the time.

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Guy Elster
BREAKING Pompeo says Russia has created “this crisis” in Venezuela.


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teleSUR English
Venezuela | The government announced the opening of a humanitarian corridor on its border with Colombia.
https://www.telesurenglish.net/news...2tA6IL7xSL4HRzW88rsHnECfMmEdrKGq_xiXlD3llomxs

 

[UWDude]

Guy Elster
BREAKING Pompeo says Russia has created “this crisis” in Venezuela.

Time and time again, the mind worm finds a new host. How it does it no one knows. What instincts lay it to seek and prey upon the weak minded?

 

[goldenequity]

 

[RonPaulIsGreat]

I doubt anyone sabotaged their grid.

I watched a documentary several years ago, on the venezuelan oil infrastructure deteriorating. So, the question is if oil is the life blood of venezuela and they let that fall into disrepair, why would it be unlikely their grid wasn't suffering the same fate.

I think we are witnessing the result of decades of a corrupt socialist system falling apart.

 

[Swordsmyth]

I doubt anyone sabotaged their grid.

I watched a documentary several years ago, on the venezuelan oil infrastructure deteriorating. So, the question is if oil is the life blood of venezuela and they let that fall into disrepair, why would it be unlikely their grid was suffering the same fate.

I think we witnessing the result of decades of a corrupt socialist system falling apart.

I agree, but bad maintenance could also make it more vulnerable to sabotage.
The thing to remember is that you can't trust anyone in these situations.
Maduro could have ordered the sabotage so that he could blame the US and Guaido.
We should stay out of the whole mess but it is quite sickening to watch libertarians twist themselves into knots to support a communist dictator just because they oppose the American empire.
Ideally the US would have nothing to do with the situation down there and Guaido would overthrow Maduro.

 

[UWDude]

Ideally the US would have nothing to do with the situation down there and Guaido would overthrow Maduro.

How long have you been a follower and fan of Guaido?
How long have you known his name, and believed him to be the great leader Venezuela needs to free them from the chains of Socialism?

 

[Swordsmyth]

How long have you been a follower and fan of Guaido?
How long have you known his name, and believed him to be the great leader Venezuela needs to free them from the chains of Socialism?

I know little about him but I know enough.
I know more about Chavez and Maduro.
I know Guaido is not good enough, he is still a socialist, just a less extreme one, but he is the only chance Venezuela has right now to start turning things around.

 

[UWDude]

.
I know Guaido is not good enough, he is still a socialist, just a less extreme one, but he is the only chance Venezuela has right now to start turning things around.

How?

What is Guaido going to do to turn around Venezuela?

You are all platitudes on this one. You don't have a god damned clue who Guiado is.

All I KNOW, is the media loves the idea, and the US has already declared him legitimate president, and that is ALL I NEED TO KNOW.

 

[goldenequity]

https://twitter.com/ConflictsW/status/1105795433010548739

 

[devil21]

I agree, but bad maintenance could also make it more vulnerable to sabotage.
The thing to remember is that you can't trust anyone in these situations.
Maduro could have ordered the sabotage so that he could blame the US and Guaido.
We should stay out of the whole mess but it is quite sickening to watch libertarians twist themselves into knots to support a communist dictator just because they oppose the American empire.
Ideally the US would have nothing to do with the situation down there and Guaido would overthrow Maduro.

No one is supporting Maduro, but you knew that. We just know what this whole Guaido thing is about and we've seen it over and over. Non-intervention means staying out of other's people's business, not necessarily supporting the decisions they make or the type of system they live under.

You'd have to be a goddamned idiot to think that it's just coincidence that multiple hydropower dams failed, multiple substations caught fire and the country was thrown into darkness right at the same time that the regime change operation looked to be sputtering. Here's a pro tip: regime change operations aren't ultimately about changing the leaders themselves. Regime change operations are about managing the people that live there, their perceptions of their life and what they support, and, of course, controlling the resources that they labor on. That's like saying that swapping out GWB and Obama resulted in grand differences in how this country was run. It didn't. Wars continued, bankers still controlled everything, government still grew, etc. It only changed the people's perspective of how they were managed. Leaders come and go, elected or not. What matters is controlling the perceptions of the masses existence.

 

[juleswin]

No one is supporting Maduro, but you knew that. We just know what this whole Guaido thing is about and we've seen it over and over. Non-intervention means staying out of other's people's business, not necessarily supporting the decisions they make or the type of system they live under.

You'd have to be a goddamned idiot to think that it's just coincidence that multiple hydropower dams failed, multiple substations caught fire and the country was thrown into darkness right at the same time that the regime change operation looked to be sputtering. Here's a pro tip: regime change operations aren't ultimately about changing the leaders themselves. Regime change operations are about managing the people that live there, their perceptions of their life and what they support, and, of course, controlling the resources that they labor on. That's like saying that swapping out GWB and Obama resulted in grand differences in how this country was run. It didn't. Wars continued, bankers still controlled everything, government still grew, etc. It only changed the people's perspective of how they were managed. Leaders come and go, elected or not. What matters is controlling the perceptions of the masses existence.

Are you trying to say that going from Maduro to Gauido is going to be as inconsequential as going from Obama to Trump?

 

[Swordsmyth]

No one is supporting Maduro, but you knew that. We just know what this whole Guaido thing is about and we've seen it over and over. Non-intervention means staying out of other's people's business, not necessarily supporting the decisions they make or the type of system they live under.

You'd have to be a goddamned idiot to think that it's just coincidence that multiple hydropower dams failed, multiple substations caught fire and the country was thrown into darkness right at the same time that the regime change operation looked to be sputtering. Here's a pro tip: regime change operations aren't ultimately about changing the leaders themselves. Regime change operations are about managing the people that live there, their perceptions of their life and what they support, and, of course, controlling the resources that they labor on. That's like saying that swapping out GWB and Obama resulted in grand differences in how this country was run. It didn't. Wars continued, bankers still controlled everything, government still grew, etc. It only changed the people's perspective of how they were managed. Leaders come and go, elected or not. What matters is controlling the perceptions of the masses existence.

People here ARE supporting Maduro and I said nobody could be trusted and that we should keep out of it.

 

[devil21]

Are you trying to say that going from Maduro to Gauido is going to be as inconsequential as going from Obama to Trump?

Something like that. Maduro's Venezuela isn't nearly as 'socialist' as is claimed by the mainstream voices or the shills, outside of their oil industry. It's socialist about like the US is socialist. They're just more honest about it. We spend a lot of effort lying to ourselves about it here.

Any way my previous post wasn't easy to write because it's a hard concept to put into words. Take it however you will.

 

[Swordsmyth]

Something like that. Maduro's Venezuela isn't nearly as 'socialist' as is claimed by the mainstream voices or the shills, outside of their oil industry. It's socialist about like the US is socialist. They're just more honest about it. We spend a lot of effort lying to ourselves about it here.

LOL

 

[devil21]

LOL

That's not a reply to my post but it is a standard deflection from you when facts are presented that you have no way to spin without looking clueless.

Venezuela has many private companies. Venezuela pools monetary resources for redistribution by the government. Sounds familiar, no?

 

[Swordsmyth]

That's not a reply to my post but it is a standard deflection from you when facts are presented that you have no way to spin without looking clueless.

Venezuela has many private companies. Venezuela pools monetary resources for redistribution by the government. Sounds familiar, no?

Venezuela seizes private companies and "nationalizes" them in large numbers and Venezuela sets price controls on many products including basics like food and fuel.

 

[devil21]

Venezuela seizes private companies and "nationalizes" them in large numbers and Venezuela sets price controls on many products including basics like food and fuel.

Here we call them "bailouts" and "subsidies". Privatize the profits, socialize the losses. You think there aren't price controls here? Dude, price controls are one of the Fed's congressionally legislated mandates!

Then there's the entire social security system, welfare state, military industrial complex, ad nausem, all of which are redistribution of the people's wealth at the whim of the government. Tis socialism but using soft language.

 

[Swordsmyth]

Here we call them "bailouts" and "subsidies". Privatize the profits, socialize the losses. You think there aren't price controls here? Dude, price controls are one of the Fed's congressionally legislated mandates!

Venezuela is much worse.
I never said America was perfect.

 

[goldenequity]

https://twitter.com/BradCabana/status/1105974116866117632