Another $17 trillion surprise found in Obamacare

[Liberty74]

lets take care of these wars first before we take care of stopping taking care of american citizens?

that's my opinion anyway

I agree for those already dependent on government.

BUT we don't need to expand the welfare state and the power of the federal government to control us. Obamacare is not about healthcare or about controlling the cost of healthcare because it increases the costs more so than if nothing was done at all. We don't need it. And we cannot afford it. It does not even address the root problems of healthcare which is government intervention.

What's Really Wrong with the Healthcare Industry. Click Here!

 

[osan]

lets take care of these wars first before we take care of stopping taking care of american citizens?

that's my opinion anyway

Not a multi-tasking sort, I see.

No reason we cannot do both at once.

Many of us. Few of them.

Do the arithmetic.

 

[osan]

the poor are fucked over in this country

Your statement is meaningless. By whom and how, precisely are they "fucked over"?

,excuse my language,

Your language is the least of your problems. I'd be more worried about my facts and possibly my honesty and ethics, were I you. But let us continue on a bit...

our country is in survival mode right now.

Another fragment oddly void of any specifically discernible meaning. Zero for two.

not giving free healthcare sounds like some depopulation scheme.

Free? Please define "free". Zero for three.

We do have the resources,we have the best doctors in the world, my doctor(s) treat me like I'm a piece of gold, and guess what, I get free health care.(through a state program).

Without the aforementioned definition of "free", your statement also lacks meaning. Zero for four. But if I dare step outside the box of rigor and assume you mean that your healthcare costs you nothing, then I suggest you are in some trouble. Such healthcare is NOT "free". Just because it cost YOU nothing, it does not mean it was free. It simply means that the costs were offloaded onto someone else's shoulders. That is to say, you got healthcare on someone else's nickel. Someone, somewhere, worked for some portion of a day or a number of days or perhaps even weeks or months so that you could stroll into your doctor's office and receive treatment without having to shell out anything of your own. How nice for you.

You do not have free healthcare because there is NO SUCH THING. Hello. Somebody or somebodies are paying YOUR bills for you. The doctors are not working for free. The medical supply companies are not manufacturing goods free of charge. The utilities companies are not operating for free. It ALL COSTS and somebody has to pay or the national economy grinds to a screeching, smoking, metal-galling halt.

You are taking from others that to which you are not entitled. That makes you a thief in the most literal sense.

Does Ron Paul care about the poor?

Ron Paul cares about human FREEDOM and the rights that this implies. He therefore cares more about the "poor" than any of the other candidates, or you for that matter. Judging by your words, you care about handouts taken under the threat of force from those who work for their livings. Your lack of compassion for those who toil at shitty jobs [or ANY job for that matter] so you can be treated like gold by the doctors who take STOLEN money in exchange for service to YOU is noted.

One does not rob one citizen for the enrichment of another, regardless of the reason, and legitimately claim to be moral. Being poor is no excuse for robbery.

Either you are painfully ignorant of what constitutes proper human freedom and morally correct living amongst your fellows or you are just another troll in to stir the muck. I have responded to your post out of largess in assuming you to be the former. Let us now see how it plays. Are you willing to learn the better way or will you stubbornly hold to your misbegotten-at-best notions?

 

[frodus24]

I am not sure if this fits the conversation, but I will throw in my two cents. IF I offend someone, I am truly sorry up front!!

I work at a university doing financial aid and at a Wal-Mart pharmacy part-time. I see so many people come in during my shifts demanding/picking up those must have prescriptions all the time. It's not just pain medications, but the majority is for high-blood pressure, cholesterol, depression and diabetes. Yeah, you have your addicts for your controlled drugs, but my main focus is on the latter.

The people I see are overweight, sluggish, snappy and very demanding. I do not believe in telling people what they should do. Eat what you want, but don't come crying later on in life because of your poor choices. Drink all the alcohol you want, but don't come crying when your liver deteriorates. I believe that it is up to the individual to be morally responsible for themselves. 20 years ago, the pharmacies were not nearly getting the amount of traffic as they are today. The pharmacist I work with have been in the business for many years and now the business is about volume and sales.

I was a sheep for many years. I went to McDonalds and grabbed breakfast on the go and then would grab lunch. I never became overweight, but my body was never functioning at it's greatest level. 2 years ago, I made an appointment to get my cholesterol and blood-pressure checked and it was high. The doctor told me I needed to eat better adding fruits and vegetables and exercise. I didn't want any medication to help reduce my issues, but I did have a come-to-Jesus meeting with myself. It wasn't just health related issues. It included finances and proactive goals that I wanted to accomplish. For 3 months, I personally studied myself, my actions and my desires. I had a total mind-f@#king experience. For years, I ate fast-food and knew it was bad for me. For years, I spent money I didn't have and lived pay check to pay check. I would sit in front of the TV being hypnotized watching Real World on MTV. And what did I get from this? Nothing at all. I wasn't being a productive person which led to greater prosperity. I complained about everything, blamed others for my own stupid ways and lost my thought process. When I woke up from being a sheep, it was a mind-blowing experience to say the least.

Are people really that dumb? When a 300 pound person continues to eat crap all of the time, sit in front of a screen and flip channels, walks the least amount possible and refuses to remotely try and better themselves, why must I pay for this? Why must you pay for this? I am so aimlessly fed up with people who act like they do not know what is bad for you. Everyone knows that smoking is bad for you. If they answer, NO, then they are living in denial. We live in an age of technology at our fingertips and we don't know? When you go to the doctor are you looking for an answer or are you looking for an easy way out? Take a f#$king pill to lose weight. Take a f#$king pill to feel better. Take this pill!!!!! What kind of country is this we live in now? A lazy society built on popping pills to keep going?

The 300 pound guy I mentioned was a roommate for 7 months and I ended up kicking him out because he left dog crap laying around his bedroom for 3 days. He bathed 3 times a week. He stunk. He was messy. I informed him when I gave him the news to move out that along with FREEDOM(he had lived with his mother for most of his life) comes PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY! He got pissed.

Yes, there are some that need more help than others when it comes to healthcare and I believe in charities, organizations and churches stepping up to fill the gap. BUT my main point when it comes to health is that each individual must be responsible for their own actions. I should not have to pay for someone's laziness. Go to a Wal-Mart pharmacy and sit and observe the line. Tell me what you see.

The government has caused the healthcare industry pricing to go through the roof in pricing like education.

On a personal note: I took my doctors advice. I eat more fruits and vegetables, eat way less fast food, have eliminated sugar and exercise at least 5 days a week. I feel better than I did in my 20's.

Sorry for the rant. I am just tired of hearing that "I am owed something for nothing."

 

[Lucille]

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/massive-17-trillion-hole-found-obamacare

This latest revelation means that total underfunded US welfare liabilities: Medicare, Medicaid and social security now amount to $99 trillion! Add to this total US debt which in 2 months will be $16 trillion, and one can see why Japan, which is about to breach 1 quadrillion in total debt (yen, but who's counting), may want to start looking in the rearview mirror for up and comer competitors. And while Obama may have been taking creative license with a number that is greater than total US GDP, he was most certainly correct when saying that Obamacare would not add a penny to US debt. Because the second the US government comes to market to fund a true total debt/GDP ratio of 750%, it is game over
[...]
Regular readers are well aware that when it comes to US insolvency, the underfunded American welfare state, whose obligations now amount to $100 trillion!, is the primary cause of this country's ultimate downfall. This latest revelation only makes it that much more certain, and likely, faster.
[...]
Of course, that this "discovery" happened two years after the law was originally proposed and enacted merely once again confirms that other banana republics have nothing on the US, and that America continues to live in a state of sheer chaos when it comes to understanding that every use of funds must ultimately have a source as well.

Well, Nancy Pelosi said they had to pass it so we could find out what's in it, and SCOTUS joked about how reading it would violate the VIII.

This thing might not have passed at all if one of the members on TEAM RED had actually bothered to read it and exposed this during the debate. TEAM RED is utterly useless.

 

[oyarde]

Obama, 2010: "Obamacare will not cost a penny over $1 trillion and not add a dime to the debt."

A bit optimistic there!

Also how did this take 2 years to come out?

Read that bill and you will see .