And so the character assasination of Cliven Bundy Begins!!!!!

[KingNothing]

Did the BLM show up to shoot Bundy's cattle and those opposing them, because of Bundy's beliefs about slavery? If not, why are you falling for the MSM's attempt to change the discussion?

Well, he said those things and then the lunatic fringe here defended what he said.

 

[KingNothing]

Are you listening to yourself?

You think current welfare and pre-War slavery are even remotely similar?!

What the hell is going on here?

 

[acptulsa]

You think current welfare and pre-War slavery are even remotely similar?!

What the hell is going on here?

You think privately run work-release prisons aren't like pre-Civil War slavery?

What the hell kind of denial is this?

What percentage of the 1860 population were on the plantations? What percentage of the modern population is in prison? Can you answer that? Are you willing to?

 

[AuH20]

You think current welfare and pre-War slavery are even remotely similar?!

What the hell is going on here?

Bullwhips were traded in for batons. Shackles were replaced with bars. The misery was simply transferred into another system.

 

[jonhowe]

glad to see you're being so objective this morning. Looks like you got this white guilt figured out. Cliven is not a racist, no matter how much you want it to be true.

He is CLEARLY racist. Wellfare is not a racial issue, but he portrayed it as one. And he most definitely crossed the line by posing the question that blacks (sorry, "negros") might be better off as slaves. As in, owned as property and forced to work.

If he had said "welfare destroys families and communities by paying people to be lazy", that would be one thing. What he said was clearly and undeniably racist.






The government still can't take his land or kill his cows, though.

 

[Lucille]

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-04-25/cliven-bundy-responds-racism-accusations

In response to the verbal attacks pitched at him over the last few days, Cliven Bundy has held a brief press conference to explain his perspective on 'slavery' and allegations of racism. Much as the world seems 'happy' to live a life of debt serfdom, Bundy notably remarked that he wonders if any of us are better off now "as slaves to charity and government subsided homes."

Someone posted Buk in the comments:

"Slavery was never abolished, it was only extended to include all the colors."
- Charles Bukowski

 

[KingNothing]

You think privately run work-release prisons aren't like pre-Civil War slavery?

What the hell kind of denial is this?

What percentage of the 1860 population were on the plantations? What percentage of the modern population is in prison? Can you answer that? Are you willing to?

I absolutely think the current judicial system oppresses minorities and that it absolutely destroys poorer families, particularly brown ones. They're locked in cages at an absolutely alarming rate. It is enough to say that this is a massive problem. There is no need to consider the merits of slavery, and to ponder whether or not things were better back then.

 

[Brian4Liberty]

Just that it is completely insane to implicitly condone slavery by saying welfare is worse. It's just something that doesn't even need to be said, or considered.

I don't believe that anyone intends to condone slavery, explicitly or implicitly. But people like to compare and contrast (didn't they teach us to do that in public schools?), and people will bring up a comparison to slavery while talking about the negatives of welfare and our Police/Prison state. It could be an interesting topic, if the emotion and race is removed from the discussion.

 

[KingNothing]

Do you people understand that it is possible to attack the institutionalized racism in America today without tacitly defending the slavery of yesterday?

This isn't a difficult concept.

 

[jonhowe]

Be sure and tell all the black tribes in Africa who conquered other tribes and took the people they conquered into slavery. But, perhaps that doesn't fit your meme of making slavery a white thing.

"One group did a bad thing, therefor it's ok if another group does the same bad thing". Right?



Also, I hate to break it to you, but in the US, slavery was a "white thing". In ancient Greece, it was a war prisoner thing. In Africa, it was a tribal thing. Etc.

But in the US it WAS a "white thing". And this matters because, as you know, 99% of people don't give a shit about the legal issues here. It's all a play, a work of drama. If people cared about the Constitution, Ron Paul would be president. Our movement needs to be the good guy in this play. Even if Cliven ISN'T actually racist, any 5 year old could have told him that his comments make him look like a racist nut to the vast majority of people. To many my age, the casual news watchers, the matter is now settled; Bundy is crazy, and therefor was wrong from the start.

It'd be nice if we could settle this issue in a world without a 24 news cycle, but we can't. And now thanks to Bundy's comments, settling it at all just got a LOT harder.




Also, I shouldn't even have responded to this strawman, but I havent had my coffee and couldnt stop myself.

 

[LibertyEagle]

He is CLEARLY racist. Wellfare is not a racial issue, but he portrayed it as one. And he most definitely crossed the line by posing the question that blacks (sorry, "negros") might be better off as slaves. As in, owned as property and forced to work.

If he had said "welfare destroys families and communities by paying people to be lazy", that would be one thing. What he said was clearly and undeniably racist.



The government still can't take his land or kill his cows, though.

Damn. Seriously, what in the ever loving hell does his racism, or lack thereof, have to do with the government showing up at his ranch armed to the teeth???

 

[Anti Federalist]

Talk about racial issues, unintentionally glorify slavery, and maybe even blame the joos?

And "King - Do - Nothing" weighs in.

 

[LibertyEagle]

"One group did a bad thing, therefor it's ok if another group does the same bad thing". Right?



Also, I hate to break it to you, but in the US, slavery was a "white thing". In ancient Greece, it was a war prisoner thing. In Africa, it was a tribal thing. Etc.

But in the US it WAS a "white thing". And this matters because, as you know, 99% of people don't give a shit about the legal issues here. It's all a play, a work of drama. If people cared about the Constitution, Ron Paul would be president. Our movement needs to be the good guy in this play. Even if Cliven ISN'T actually racist, any 5 year old could have told him that his comments make him look like a racist nut to the vast majority of people. To many my age, the casual news watchers, the matter is now settled; Bundy is crazy, and therefor was wrong from the start.

It'd be nice if we could settle this issue in a world without a 24 news cycle, but we can't. And now thanks to Bundy's comments, settling it at all just got a LOT harder.




Also, I shouldn't even have responded to this strawman, but I havent had my coffee and couldnt stop myself.

Let me be clear.

I DON'T GIVE A SHIT.

Slavery in the U.S. is over. LONG OVER. It is good that it is over. If you want to rant about it, go bitch about it going on in other countries still today, and by people who aren't white.

THE GOVERNMENT DIDN'T SHOW UP AT BUNDY'S RANCH BECAUSE OF HIS VIEWS ON SLAVERY. DO YOU EVEN GET THAT? Because you damn sure are doing your best to further this dumbass distraction.

 

[Anti Federalist]

Damn. Seriously, what in the ever loving hell does his racism, or lack thereof, have to do with the government showing up at his ranch armed to the teeth???

He spoke heresy, impolitic, unpure thoughts.

Therefore he deserved it.

Cliven Bundy did this to himself

 

[acptulsa]

Do you people understand that it is possible to attack the institutionalized racism in America today without tacitly defending the slavery of yesterday?

This isn't a difficult concept.

What part of...

Well, you know, if I were choosing a spokesperson for our cause, I would not choose Cliven Bundy. Or anyone from Duck Dynasty either.

Unfortunately, CNN isn't concerned with choosing the best talking heads to present our viewpoint. Quite the opposite, actually.

...do you not understand?

 

[AuH20]

I don't believe that anyone intends to condone slavery, explicitly or implicitly. But people like to compare and contrast (didn't they teach us to do that in public schools?), and people will bring up a comparison to slavery while talking about the negatives of welfare and our Police/Prison state. It could be an interesting topic, if the emotion and race is removed from the discussion.

It's very comparable, but of course slavery is the more oppressive system. I think Bundy slipped up by conflating Jim Crow era with the slavery period. But I understand what he is getting at. If you take someone's dignity and self-respect away from them (which is what both the government and slavemasters did), one's options become extremely limited.

 

[jllundqu]

I don't get why everyone is arguing over this. The issue about the government tactics, snipers, BLM and federal tyranny has not changed.

Bundy fired off his mouth because he wanted the attention. Well he's getting it. You buy the ticket, you takes the ride!

I found what he said to be truly cringe-worthy. I knew this was going to be the reaction... he would be demonized and destroyed. The left would use it to paint a broad picture that all anti-government fervor is ultimately racist, etc.

Bundy may have been making a point about the welfare state, but when he said "Negroes never learned to pick cotton" the game was over. Pack up and go home. No one will touch him with a 10-meter cattle prod. Rand and others now have to distance themselves or risk being labeled racist themselves. The Pauls have their own problems with race issues following them around without Bundy firing off his damn mouth.

 

[AuH20]

I don't get why everyone is arguing over this. The issue about the government tactics, snipers, BLM and federal tyranny has not changed.

Bundy fired off his mouth because he wanted the attention. Well he's getting it. You buy the ticket, you takes the ride!

I found what he said to be truly cringe-worthy. I knew this was going to be the reaction... he would be demonized and destroyed. The left would use it to paint a broad picture that all anti-government fervor is ultimately racist, etc.

Bundy may have been making a point about the welfare state, but when he said "Negroes never learned to pick cotton" the game was over. Pack up and go home. No one will touch him with a 10-meter cattle prod. Rand and others now have to distance themselves or risk being labeled racist themselves. The Pauls have their own problems with race issues following them around without Bundy firing off his damn mouth.

I'm pretty sure he said this privately to a small group of minority militia. And it was a long winded discussion about the lack of minority participation as well as the Watts Riots.

 

[jllundqu]

Here's the unedited version posted on Drudge for context:

Bundy:“... and so what I've testified to you -- I was in the Watts riot, I seen the beginning fire and I seen that last fire. What I seen is civil disturbance. People are not happy, people are thinking they don't have their freedoms, they didn't have these things, and they didn't have them.

We've progressed quite a bit from that day until now, and we sure don't want to go back. We sure don't want the colored people to go back to that point. We sure don't want these Mexican people to go back to that point. And we can make a difference right now by taking care of some of these bureaucracies, and do it in a peaceful way.
“Let me tell, talk to you about the Mexicans, and these are just things I know about the negroes. I want to tell you one more thing I know about the negro. When I go, went, go to Las Vegas, North Las Vegas, and I would see these little government houses, and in front of that government house the door was usually open and the older people and the kids -- and there's always at least a half a dozen people sitting on the porch. They didn’t have nothing to do. They didn’t have nothing for their kids to do. They didn’t have nothing for their young girls to do.

And because they were basically on government subsidy -- so now what do they do? They abort their young children, they put their young men in jail, because they never, they never learned how to pick cotton. And I’ve often wondered are they were better off as slaves, picking cotton and having a family life and doing things? Or are they better off under government subsidy?

You know they didn’t get more freedom, they got less freedom -- they got less family life, and their happiness -- you could see it in their faces -- they wasn't happy sitting on that concrete sidewalk. Down there they was probably growing their turnips -- so that’s all government, that’s not freedom.

 

[LibertyEagle]

The Pauls have their own problems with race issues following them around without Bundy firing off his damn mouth.

And this demonstrates why you shouldn't be "firing off your mouth", either. The Pauls have NO "race issues". They are not racist in the least. All that exists is the MSM twisting reality to attempt to paint them as such. Shame on you for assisting.