Amazingly releveant quote about... [Guess who?!]

Conza88

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Amazingly relevant quote about... [Guess who?!]

“The pattern repeats itself so often that it almost seems to be a law of history: the radicals who change history must do so over the resistance of the moderates, who claim to be friendly to the same cause, but somehow always end up on the side of established interests.”

Lew Rockwell, Moderates and Radicals
 
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The OP quote is why I call some folks we ally with "useful idiots". I don't mean they're dumb, and I don't mean they're communist sympathizers. I don't even mean the phrase in a dreogatory way (how it was meant historically). I just mean they further our goals without relaizing it, all the while calling us piggybackers on "their" cause, as if our philosophy wasn't where all their good ideas in their ideology originate. They will end up as all moderates do; incrimentally dragging the cause back to the side we're fighting. It'll be them that ends up our enemies in the end, if they don't wake up.

The first step to them being in our way and fighting for the enemy will be running Rand, then step two will be sophistically supporting his neocon leaning ideas, and step 3 will be refusing to convert to Voluntaryism and moving further and further, election after election, candidate after candidate, back to where we started. They are bound for Establishment-ville and don't even know it.

The only Republic I'm interested in cheering for with them is in Star Wars (and even then I find myself going "Chewie! Tell them no! You want a Free Kashyyyk! It'll only end in Empire again, and in slavery for your people again! Noooo, Chewieeeeee!")

Rand remind anyone else of Palpatine (the Trojan Horse candidate)? Dude was a Senator afterall.
 
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It's obvious he is playing politics: It was obvious from day one when he started his senate campaign, he was Mr. Neocon. But once he got elected, he was filibustering patriot act, opposing indefinite detention, preventing war with Iran.

Ron Paul is not a constitutionalist, yet he used the constitution for its appeal to a wider base. Yet even with that, he could only appeal to so many people. Rand on the other hand, is playing the game even farther, to appeal for even a wider audience: a voluntaryist, pretending to be a constitutionalist pretending to be a mainstream Republican Neocon.

Guess what? It's working.
 
It's obvious he is playing politics: It was obvious from day one when he started his senate campaign, he was Mr. Neocon. But once he got elected, he was filibustering patriot act, opposing indefinite detention, preventing war with Iran.

Ron Paul is not a constitutionalist, yet he used the constitution for its appeal to a wider base. Yet even with that, he could only appeal to so many people. Rand on the other hand, is playing the game even farther, to appeal for even a wider audience: a voluntaryist, pretending to be a constitutionalist pretending to be a mainstream Republican Neocon.

Guess what? It's working.

Rand didn't prevent war with Iran...he voted for sanctions (an act of war) against them. There was no declaration of war, so that act of war was unconstitutional. Since they were no threat to us, having a nuke is as much their right as ours, etc., this was purely an act of interventionist foreign policy. PERIOD. Him stalling the bill to add a sophstic Amendment to it is hardly being against war. He CLAIMS he thinks sanction help prevent war...but that means he's ignorant to the fact they actually historically increase the probability of war, or he's a sophist (intellectually dishonest person)...either way, he isn't worth supporting or making excuses for.

If I delayed an execution but then voted for it, am I against capital punishment? If your answer is "no", then delaying sanctions and then voting for them (and on video supporting it as a tactic) is not preventing or even being against war with Iran.

This "he's a Trojan Horse" conspiracy theory is just in your head. This is who he is.

What Ron did worked because what he did was educate people and stood firm on libertarian principles. What Rand is doing will not work (even if he wins the Presidency someday, God forbid), as what he is doing is abandoning the most important libertarian principle (noninterventionism and peace) and moving incrimentally toward neocons.

Apparently, he's fooling many into going along for the ride into self destruction of the movement, like Reagan destroyed libertarianism after Barry Goldwater's progress.
 
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I actually agree with this.

I'm hoping Rand is the personification of a trojan horse.

Maybe he is a trojan horse against us. Something tells me that he is not.

It's obvious he is playing politics: It was obvious from day one when he started his senate campaign, he was Mr. Neocon. But once he got elected, he was filibustering patriot act, opposing indefinite detention, preventing war with Iran.

Ron Paul is not a constitutionalist, yet he used the constitution for its appeal to a wider base. Yet even with that, he could only appeal to so many people. Rand on the other hand, is playing the game even farther, to appeal for even a wider audience: a voluntaryist, pretending to be a constitutionalist pretending to be a mainstream Republican Neocon.

Guess what? It's working.
 
I actually agree with this.

I'm hoping Rand is the personification of a trojan horse.

Maybe he is a trojan horse against us. Something tells me that he is not.

Well the evidence is on our side, and the conspiratorial notion of his good intentions based on lineage is what you have. I'm not leaving liberty up to "feelings". I'm going with rational evidence.

Principles over Parties, and last names too.
 
:rolleyes:

Says the guy who believes in forced segregation and special rights for groups.

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showth...Pat-Buchanan&p=4480184&viewfull=1#post4480184

It might help if you made sense. First of all, I'm not for group rights, LIAR. Second of all, You meant INTEGRATION, not segregation. Third of all, I made it clear many times to you and others that if not for the STATE enforced segregation, there would have never been a mass psychosis in this country that led to widespread racism and segregation. Any rational person can admit that.

So, to say that segregation of races in economics is aggression is correct, since it was (in the 1970s on back) far exceeding the market level in society that would of occured if the STATE wouldn't have had LEGAL SLAVERY and ENFORCED (notice the word force) segregation. I make clear that this use of force by the state can only be limited by a reversal of force, since folks like YOU don't want to abolish the state.

I'm not in favor of the state, or forced anything, including segreation or integration. To oversimplify my statements and positions is to show your simplicity, not my supposed authoritarian tendancies. What I said was...if the state is to be maintained for the sake of people like you who cheerlead for it, then it must undo what it has done, once it realizes it is doing something tyrannical. This is what has always occured. When it realized women's rights were trampled, it didn't wait to allow the market to fix it...because it would have taken forever given the mass psychosis it imposed via its laws (which were based on misogyny). Because the state is only force, it can only use force...and that includes to fix what its own force has fucked up to begin with.

You may not agree, and wish us , like many libertarians, to just let the state sit idle while the market sorts out the problems the state causes, and that's fine....but to suggest my position is somehow not principled or that I'm for "group rights" is total bullshit. Groups don't have rights, individuals do. And individuals happen to parts of groups called races. When the STATE fucks one race for generations, we can either abolish the state (which you refuse to do), sit back and let the state keep fucking these people (which you want to do), or we can use the state to limit the state's harm by reversing the coercion in the other direction (what I suggested in light of the fact people like you won't abolish the state). Pardon me for not wanting to sit on my hands when the state has done atrocities.

This is not a popular idea, I know that. But it's not my usual thing to be Mr. Conformist. I'm pretty much Capt. Controversy, and I don't mind that...because it means I think for myself.

Lastly, and most importantly...if you can't attack my idea in debate without attacking me personally on a whole other issue, all you're doing is admitting you have no argument. What you just did is called "ad hominem"...it's an informal logical fallacy in debate. It doesn't matter if Hitler says the sky is blue and grass is green, that hardly makes it a bad position or not true. So, attack my statement, the issue, not me...or admit to your intellectual ineptness.

My position is my last post in this thread...address it or don't. I'm tired of your ad hominem games that you've been playing since I met you on these forums. Here it is:

Well the evidence is on our side, and the conspiratorial notion of his good intentions based on lineage is what you have. I'm not leaving liberty up to "feelings". I'm going with rational evidence.

Principles over Parties, and last names too.

I want everyone to notice this has NOTHING to do with the topic LE linked to. NOTHING! It's simply an ad hominem. It has nothing to with conspiracy, lineage bias, having "a good feeling" lead your decisions irrationally, or Principles over Parties...including nepotism.

LE didn't address one single aspect of my post. All LE did was use a failed informal logical fallacy.

I mean how ignorant can you be? Just look up informal logical fallacies online and quit commiting them! Then you can finally win a debate...something you have failed to do, that I've ever seen.
 
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Ron Paul is not a constitutionalist, yet he used the constitution for its appeal to a wider base.

If Ron Paul isn't a constitutionalist, the the animal is extinct. I say he is a constitutionalist; if he weren't I wouldn't be here.
 
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