Advice Needed for Silver Investing

[BladeOfAnduril]

Hi all,

I want to start investing in PM. Currently, I don't have a lot to invest, so I'm thinking I'll probably go for Silver and perhaps some copper rather than gold. I just need to guidance on where to start. I want to invest in something that is pure, and I want to invest in something that has a low risk of confiscation. Also, I'd prefer not to pay extra for "collectability". I'm interested in the PM by weight and purity. I don't care about any historic or artistic value to say, a coin unless there is a compelling reason I should care. Thanks!

 

[Seraphim]

In the short run stay the hell away from copper. In the long run, load up. So if you are willing to sit on your copper reserves for 5+ years and weather a couple of VICIOUS drops - go for it. If you're timeline is shorter than that, I'd recommend going elsewhere with your money.

Quite frankly, I'd buy agriculture well before I'd touch cooper right now. China's industrial demand is set for a large correction (short term - long run, still very bullish on China).

As for silver... Bullion. Bars and coins. Government mints (Philharmonics and Canadian Maples being my favorites)...Englehart and Johnson Mathey bars are the typical brands of bars you'll get - there are other very recognizable ones as well though.

 

[BladeOfAnduril]

Thanks for the reply. I was only really considering perhaps 1 or 2 kilo bars of copper, based one the price of about $20 last time I looked. I at this point my interest is get some money, even if it's a small amount into PM so that when the dollar collapses I'll have a tiny bit of something to fall back on.

As far as the silver goes.. I had heard the bullion was more prone to being targeted by confiscation. Is that true? Also, if I were to go with government issued coins, does the age of the coin matter at all as far as confiscation?

Also, do you have to "register" your PM holdings at all? I'd like to be as off the record as possible for security reasons.

Thanks!

 

[Seraphim]

see below.

Thanks for the reply. I was only really considering perhaps 1 or 2 kilo bars of copper, based one the price of about $20 last time I looked. I at this point my interest is get some money, even if it's a small amount into PM so that when the dollar collapses I'll have a tiny bit of something to fall back on.


As far as the silver goes.. I had heard the bullion was more prone to being targeted by confiscation. Is that true? Also, if I were to go with government issued coins, does the age of the coin matter at all as far as confiscation?

Silver was never confiscated.

Also, do you have to "register" your PM holdings at all? I'd like to be as off the record as possible for security reasons.

NO.

Thanks!

 

[Pennsylvania]

Also, do you have to "register" your PM holdings at all? I'd like to be as off the record as possible for security reasons.

No. Of course, if your transaction involves >=$10k in cash, the IRS wants you to report it.

Btw, I would not rule out gold if I were you. Since it seems like you're concerned with a catastrophic hyperinflationary disaster, remember that gold is more portable and more recognizable than silver. In the weimar hyperinflation, the gold/silver ratio adjusted drastically in favor of gold, but this is not to say that silver was not still a very valuable commodity to have.

 

[erowe1]

Hi all,

I want to start investing in PM. Currently, I don't have a lot to invest, so I'm thinking I'll probably go for Silver and perhaps some copper rather than gold. I just need to guidance on where to start. I want to invest in something that is pure, and I want to invest in something that has a low risk of confiscation. Also, I'd prefer not to pay extra for "collectability". I'm interested in the PM by weight and purity. I don't care about any historic or artistic value to say, a coin unless there is a compelling reason I should care. Thanks!

Why do you have the criterion of it being pure?

Apart from that, the rest of what you say all points to investing in junk silver.

 

[BladeOfAnduril]

It seems to me that say, in coin form, the value of a pure coin would be more accepted than that of a "junk" coin consisting of 90% or less silver. Please correct me if I'm wrong. This is just a speculation on my part.

 

[cucucachu0000]

I heard somewhere that if you have a generic brand bullion that you'll get less for it when time comes to sell it. Does it really matter? How much of a difference in price in either silver or gold?

 

[jclay2]

If you decide to buy, be sure to only buy physical. Do not mess around with paper etfs or the like. As far as physical silver goes, I recommend you go for American Silver Eagles. They are extremely recognized and liquid among silver investors and usually have the smallest bid/ask spread.

 

[Seraphim]

Name recognition comes with a premium.

I heard somewhere that if you have a generic brand bullion that you'll get less for it when time comes to sell it. Does it really matter? How much of a difference in price in either silver or gold?

 

[Seraphim]

No.

It's by weight of silver +/- the up to date premium.

It seems to me that say, in coin form, the value of a pure coin would be more accepted than that of a "junk" coin consisting of 90% or less silver. Please correct me if I'm wrong. This is just a speculation on my part.

 

[cucucachu0000]

What are the benefits of buying for the name? Is it worth it?

 

[tsai3904]

What are the benefits of buying for the name? Is it worth it?

If you were to choose between the same bar but one was branded by Johnson Matthey and the other was branded by APMEX, you will pay more for the JM brand. When you sell, you will receive more for the JM brand.

 

[erowe1]

It seems to me that say, in coin form, the value of a pure coin would be more accepted than that of a "junk" coin consisting of 90% or less silver. Please correct me if I'm wrong. This is just a speculation on my part.

If you mean a coin containing a full ounce of silver is worth more than one containing 0.71 ounces of silver (such as an old silver dollar, or two old half-dollars, or ten old dimes), then that's correct. It will cost you less to buy the one with 0.71 ounces, and what you get back when it comes time for you to sell it will be commensurate with that. But junk silver is a good way to buy it in small cost increments, which seems like what you want.

 

[WilliamC]

For modest sums (up to a few thousand) buying some mix of 90% junk, 1 oz American Eagles, or good quality generic 1 or 5 oz bars would be the way to go.

Assuming you have the cash there are considerations as to whether or not to try and 'cost average' yourself into the metal (making several purchases over time so as to minimize the risk of buying all in at a peak) or simply to make one lump purchase, but this largely depends on your transaction costs, sometimes it's cheaper to buy larger quantities.

If you have access to a good local coin shop (mine requires valid ID for selling but pays within 5% spot, for buying you don't need ID but they have to charge sales tax, ouch!) then just buy as much as you can as you have the cash to do so.

If I had more than this then I might start picking up an ounce or more of gold, just so your not all-in silver.

Don't buy copper bullion, the premiums (at least that I've seen) are nuts. If you must buy copper stick with pipe or wire, or you could try buying copper pennies or sorting them yourself.

Don't spend all your cash though, someday, if only for a while, it will be needed.

 

[BladeOfAnduril]

If I get American Eagles, does the year matter at all?

 

[Seraphim]

not one bit.

If I get American Eagles, does the year matter at all?

 

[pmbug]

The spread between what a dealer will sell to you versus buy back from you is important if you are buying for investment or hedging purposes. You can ask your local coin dealer for *both* their sale and purchase prices/policies. Some online retailers like apmex, tulving and a few others publish their purchase (buy back) prices too, so you can use that as a guidline to the spread you might expect locally. Bear in mind that the spreads can change. A while back, demand for Silver Eagles exploded and the premiums for both buying and selling went up pretty dramatically compared to the premiums for 90% or generics.

Having a mix of 90%, good name generic rounds/bars and US Mint bullions (Silver Eagles and/or America The Beautiful coins) is the way to go. Nothing wrong with foreign mint coins either, but I'm not sure that the premiums behave the same as the US Mint coins. I really haven't been paying much attention to them (their premiums).

If you are buying silver for TEOTWAWKI/TSHTF, 90% silver all the way IMO. You will want fractional (small denomination) weights for barter.

YMMV.

 

[Seraphim]

Ironically enough here is support for my short term NO on cooper:

http://www.kitco.com/ind/RichardBaker/sep062011.html

 

[Sjmfury]

I'd start with 1 oz, 5 oz, 10 oz silver bars depending on what your looking to buy. I'd recommend goldeneaglecoin.com