Abortion babies and a fathers rights

[Danke]

This should all be the consideration BEFORE she has sex. If she gets pregnant then all other considerations fall to the fact that she is talking about premeditated killing of a child here. So no, she doesn't get to just have an abortion because it is otherwise inconvenient to carry the child or because we have to further define our laws. You start at protecting rights then evolve a system of law that does that best. But you don't give up teh protection of the rights of people just because it is difficult.

If you're asking my personal opinion, yes a woman should have to pay child support until the child is at least 18 and living on their own as men currently do. Even if she doesn't have anything to do with the child and the guy is raising the kid.

Anthropologically.

Women desire a masculine man during ovulation.And a more feminine man otherwise, to raise the child.

 

[Kluge]

Anthropologically.

Women desire a masculine man during ovulation.And a more feminine man otherwise, to raise the child.

Isn't it bizarre trying to force certain behaviors that aren't natural? But that's pretty much all that gov't does.

By the way, I need a babysitter--you available?

 

[Danke]

Isn't it bizarre trying to force certain behaviors that aren't natural? But that's pretty much all that gov't does.

By the way, I need a babysitter--you available?

In about 13 years, yes.

 

[Kluge]

In about 13 years, yes.

Quit being a creepy creep.

 

[Danke]

Quit being a creepy creep.

 

[MelissaWV]

Easy. You don't have sex, you wear a condom, or you get fixed. Any will work.

Yes, but this is a bit like teaching abstinence in school, isn't it?

Telling a society where people still do get pregnant (and condoms and even "fixing" don't always work) that they should of thought of things beforehand, does not change the fact that the scenario I discussed still will happen.

It would appear the answer is to force the woman to term, because she should have thought of it beforehand, but also to force her to pay child support until the child is 18.

Meanwhile, if the father does not want the child, but the mother does, he must also be forced to pay child support until the child is 18?

It seems like a lot of laws involved there, folks, and the word "force" used over and over.

 

[tod evans]

Yes, but this is a bit like teaching abstinence in school, isn't it?

Telling a society where people still do get pregnant (and condoms and even "fixing" don't always work) that they should of thought of things beforehand, does not change the fact that the scenario I discussed still will happen.

It would appear the answer is to force the woman to term, because she should have thought of it beforehand, but also to force her to pay child support until the child is 18.

Meanwhile, if the father does not want the child, but the mother does, he must also be forced to pay child support until the child is 18?

It seems like a lot of laws involved there, folks, and the word "force" used over and over.

You're right.........

Is there an answer ?

Please notice I'm not pushing for "more laws", I only believe that a father should have equal rights and I don't know;
1) If the majority believe he is entitled to those rights?
2) How to equalize "The Law" if he is entitled?

I've studied custody laws and not so much abortion law and decisions relevant to "equal parenting" are still in a state of flux. For centuries the mother/child were viewed as the mans property, now the pendulum has swung the opposite direction and a woman has sole discretion.

Fathers are clawing their way back into their childrens legal well being but at the heart of every family court battle is a child.....And here's where things get even more murky, "a child" under law is out of the womb so there are two battles in two separate courts...."The fetus" argument has been held in federal court and the "child" arguments are held in the bowels of County Court.

Sooo,
Is there a solution that would assure equal legal footing? Can the solution be implemented without force?

 

[No Free Beer]

It's just sad what our society is coming to.

The fact that the people who have controlled the debate have brainwashed women to believe this is about THEM, rather than life.

Really sad.

 

[MelissaWV]

It's just sad what our society is coming to.

The fact that the people who have controlled the debate have brainwashed women to believe this is about THEM, rather than life.

Really sad.

None of that answers my questions.

Ideally, it would be solved just as people said. I don't believe in having sex with anyone whose views I don't know for certain on this and various other issues. If you can't discuss pregnancy, STDs, and other expectations with someone, then I'm not sure why on earth you'd want to share something far more intimate than a conversation. It cheapens everyone involved. That's just my opinion, though, and my earlier question still stands: when the father wants the child, and the mother does not, what can be done to force her to carry to term?

There have been a few responses, but it is also sad that rather than address that, you prefer to tsk tsk at me for asking. :>

 

[OrigSEOH]

For the county prosecutor to charge her with murder of my child.

when the father wants the child, and the mother does not, what can be done to force her to carry to term?

 

[No Free Beer]

None of that answers my questions.

Ideally, it would be solved just as people said. I don't believe in having sex with anyone whose views I don't know for certain on this and various other issues. If you can't discuss pregnancy, STDs, and other expectations with someone, then I'm not sure why on earth you'd want to share something far more intimate than a conversation. It cheapens everyone involved. That's just my opinion, though, and my earlier question still stands: when the father wants the child, and the mother does not, what can be done to force her to carry to term?

There have been a few responses, but it is also sad that rather than address that, you prefer to tsk tsk at me for asking. :>

Don't have sex.

Solved.

 

[Domalais]

It seems like a lot of laws involved there, folks, and the word "force" used over and over.

Libertarians only use the f-word when it's the government using force to take money from men. They're perfectly okay when it comes to the government overruling female sovereignty.

 

[MelissaWV]

Don't have sex.

Solved.

What I am asking you is when it DOES happen, what do you think should be done to FORCE the woman to carry the child to term? Not "hey how do we stop this from happening?" but "what do we do when it inevitably does?"

Try really hard to see the difference, since this is only the third time I've pointed it out.

 

[MelissaWV]

For the county prosecutor to charge her with murder of my child.

You're charging her with murder for carrying your child to term?

That... makes no sense?

 

[JebSanderson]

You're charging her with murder for carrying your child to term?

That... makes no sense?

I'm pretty sure he meant if the woman killed her child she should be charged with murder. I completely agree with him.

 

[MelissaWV]

I'm pretty sure he meant if the woman killed her child she should be charged with murder. I completely agree with him.

Right, but that would be like me responding to your post with a mention of scalloped potatoes.

It has nothing to do with what I was actually asking.

I guess I should give up on it and be quite grateful that certain people in this thread are not involved in writing textbooks on emergency medical situations

"Hmm okay it looks like this guy has stopped breathing and was burned over a lot of his body. Let's see. What did that textbook say? Ah yes it said 'don't stop breathing and don't get burned'."

 

[tod evans]

Libertarians only use the f-word when it's the government using force to take money from men. They're perfectly okay when it comes to the government overruling female sovereignty.

Nice!

Instead of contributing to the discussion you suggest a man grow a uterus and that libertarians don't respect women....

Are you for federal tax dollar "family planning" too?

How about federal tax dollar "single mother" programs?

Me,

I'm for NO, zero, government involvement in family matters including funding abortions or birth control.

I'm for removing all legislation that gives ANY parent a leg up in court......level playing field.

I'm for EQUAL rights of all parties involved in a child/fetus.....Pa-Ma & Jr.


I don't know how to achieve this Utopian equality but thinking about it makes more sense to me than ridiculing the idea.

 

[Kluge]

I'm pretty sure he meant if the woman killed her child she should be charged with murder. I completely agree with him.

So...if she miscarries, she'll have to go to court and prove she's not a murderer?

 

[JebSanderson]

So...if she miscarries, she'll have to go to court and prove she's not a murderer?

No, that would be "guilty until proven innocent". If there is suspicion to believe she murdered her child then it would be up to the prosecutor to prove it.

 

[James Madison]

Libertarians only use the f-word when it's the government using force to take money from men. They're perfectly okay when it comes to the government overruling female sovereignty.

Sovereignty over what? Killing her child?

You have sovereignty over a guy's dick going into your hoohah. If you consent to that, you accept all the responsibilities that go along with it.