16 Open Carriers trying to enjoy dinner vs Several Police Officers!

[jcannon98188]

The real hero here is the manager who refused to tell them to leave.

 

[Nastynate]

The coffee shop was called the red and black. It was a red star, on a black background. FYI, that is an Anarchist symbol. It was an Anarchist Coffee shop. What exactly did the cop expect walking in there? Idiot. This video actually makes me smile.

Not to mention the flag outside the shop. It looked like an anarchist flag.

 

[BlackJack]

The coffee shop was called the red and black. It was a red star, on a black background. FYI, that is an Anarchist symbol. It was an Anarchist Coffee shop. What exactly did the cop expect walking in there? Idiot. This video actually makes me smile.

It was sad too how he actually had the nerve to compare his situation to that of the Civil Rights era.

 

[Jackie Moon]

The coffee shop was called the red and black. It was a red star, on a black background. FYI, that is an Anarchist symbol. It was an Anarchist Coffee shop. What exactly did the cop expect walking in there? Idiot. This video actually makes me smile.

Not to mention the flag outside the shop. It looked like an anarchist flag.

Looks like an Anarcho-Syndicalism/Anarcho-Communism flag. Apparently the cop didn't have very good observation skills.

From their website:

The Red and Black, founded in 2000, is a worker-owned cooperative restaurant and community space in Southeast Portland, Oregon. As a non-hierarchical and democratic workplace we are, in our own small way, living the dream of a world without bosses. We are proudly unionized with the Portland branch of the Industrial Workers of the World (IWW) and are a closed shop, meaning all of our workers are union members. We also belong to the United States Federation of Worker Cooperatives.

The Red and Black is a hub of radical activity; we host regular events by a variety of local, national and international social justice activists, authors, filmmakers and others.

 

[osan]

I was under the impression that it was an Open Carry Card,, (educational information)

Sort of like the "Blind" Cards that some folks carry.

Even so - they have NO need or obligation to explain themselves to police. I suppose it is a principle v. pragmatism thing. Perhaps I am too slavish about principle, but the way I see it people appear to require the baptism by bitch-slap these days where their ignorance is concerned because if you give an inch they take it as license to go for the rest of the mile. At some point the line-in-the-sand issue raises its head and one must either stand his ground or fold like the proverbial cheap suit/accordian. Will you have your rights respected or will you cave to the pressure of those holding no rightful claim upon your territory - those who demand it just because they feel it is owed?

Trespass runs wildly across the face of the globe like one of the Horsemen and the onus of choice is upon us.

 

[presence]

The officers went away sad with nothing to arrest

 

[Jeremy]

I am surprised they were not arrested for inducing panic...

In a blue state maybe

 

[LibertyEagle]

I checked out her blog and she wrote over 4 blog entries about that coffee shop owner. I wonder what her husband would think of her pining for this loser.

What did he do that makes you classify him as a "loser"?

Ron Paul has a number of supporter who are policemen. Before we just haul off and do our damnedest to wholesale ostracize ALL police, military, etc., it seems to me that we should consider that this would seem to be like biting off our own noses to spite our face.

Maybe it would be better to criticize individual actions, rather than an entire group.

 

[AgentforPathfinder]

Why does it upset you? It's not like it is contagious or anything. I don't want to derail the thread, I'm just curious why this bothers you so much. Besides, I don't know that these guys are "severely obese". I think some are also hunched over and that might be making them look fatter.

If we are going to win campaigns in 2014, and 2016, we cannot have anyone look at us and laugh. Obese libertarians means lack of personal responsibility. People who are obese and cannot keep their bodies fit are irresponsible. If you cannot manage your own body, you cannot manage anything. It just reinforces the image liberals have of us that Libertarians are either stupid fat rednecks or fat internet-addicted losers that live in mom's basement.

I don't want to hear about it's "liberty". Obesity = personal irresponsibilty. It looks hypocritical for Libertarians to talk about personal responsibility while being obese.

 

[tod evans]

Placing too much stock in appearances is never wise.

There are very intelligent fat people too.

Personally I'd rather converse with a smart, good natured fat person than someone who places undue importance on the superficial.

(52 years old wearing 30" waist levis before any assumptions are made)

If we are going to win campaigns in 2014, and 2016, we cannot have anyone look at us and laugh. Obese libertarians means lack of personal responsibility. People who are obese and cannot keep their bodies fit are irresponsible. If you cannot manage your own body, you cannot manage anything. It just reinforces the image liberals have of us that Libertarians are either stupid fat rednecks or fat internet-addicted losers that live in mom's basement.

I don't want to hear about it's "liberty". Obesity = personal irresponsibilty. It looks hypocritical for Libertarians to talk about personal responsibility while being obese.

 

[Pericles]

One error I discerned was the presentation of a "business card" to the cops. I would not have done it.

Refuse ID. Refuse to answer questions. Ask whether you are being detained. If not, have a nice day.

Are you a police officer?

Could I see some ID that verifies that?

Questions best asked with about a dozen buddies with rifles in an overwatch position.

 

[mello]

Quick question, is it my right in any State to decline a cop's request for identification if I am literally doing nothing wrong? I understand showing my ID if I'm speeding but I'm talking about the situation on the video, even if I wasn't strapped.

 

[Pericles]

Quick question, is it my right in any State to decline a cop's request for identification if I am literally doing nothing wrong? I understand showing my ID if I'm speeding but I'm talking about the situation on the video, even if I wasn't strapped.

Varies by state - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stop_and_identify_statutes to start reading

 

[ZENemy]

Giving them your ID = first step into contracting with them. Giving them a card with your name on it = you may be open to contracting if further harassed.

When I get pulled over, I don't even roll my window down. I CRACK it and slide my license (forced to contract under duress) and insurance out to them. Don't talk to police.

 

[camp_steveo]

It's a shame the police did not know this was legal.

 

[Origanalist]

If we are going to win campaigns in 2014, and 2016, we cannot have anyone look at us and laugh. Obese libertarians means lack of personal responsibility. People who are obese and cannot keep their bodies fit are irresponsible. If you cannot manage your own body, you cannot manage anything. It just reinforces the image liberals have of us that Libertarians are either stupid fat rednecks or fat internet-addicted losers that live in mom's basement.

I don't want to hear about it's "liberty". Obesity = personal irresponsibilty. It looks hypocritical for Libertarians to talk about personal responsibility while being obese.

Lol, it's the appearance police.

 

[belian78]

It's a shame the police did not know this was legal.

Most likely these jackboots knew what the law was, they just didn't care. They got a call from someone and that's all it takes, they come on down there armed to the teeth and see what they can extract from the situation.

 

[AgentforPathfinder]

Lol, it's the appearance police.

Go ahead and laugh at what I say, but if this movement is going anywhere, we cannot afford to look ridiculous.

 

[Origanalist]

Go ahead and laugh at what I say, but if this movement is going anywhere, we cannot afford to look ridiculous.

Thanks, but I already did.

 

[LibertyEagle]

Go ahead and laugh at what I say, but if this movement is going anywhere, we cannot afford to look ridiculous.

Is that why you chose to have Trotsky as your avatar, because you think it somehow lends you credibility?