# Lifestyles & Discussion > Personal Security & Defense >  Whats a cheaper alternative to an AR15?

## Rael

I would love to have an AR15 but they are so damn expensive. Is there another type of gun that would be cheaper and make a decent substitute?

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## Todd

If your looking for something in the same line as an American military style that shoots the same round, probably not.
Check out what others say, but I don't know if you'll find something much cheaper, unless you go for Kalashnikovs

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## ItsTime

How much does one go for?

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## Time for Change

AK and SKS are really fun to shoot and used to be really cheap to feed.
You'll need to look around for pricing, but +/- 400 for an AK.
SKS vary from 250 to near 400 depending on what you are looking for.

Pricing is all over the place lately, you may find some really good deals out there.

If you are handy, you can assemble your own AR for a significant savings but again that varies in price over a huge spectrum.

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## Kbeaubs

What is it substituting it for?   What do you currently have?

Do you have a handgun yet?

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## Pericles

Agree with the above - your first need is for a personal defense weapon for close in encounters. My personal favorite is this:



But, others prefer various flavors of 9mm - in any case buy ammo and plenty of it.



Long arms expand the area you can control. If you have wide open spaces, bolt action could be a cheaper alternative to having an AR because you have more reach. Popular cheaper alternatives run toward the Mosin or a Mauser. The Mosin uses the Russian 7.62 X 54 round and there are various Mauser calibers. Mosin ammo is imported, and so is most of what the Mausers use, but there is some limited manufacture of 8mm Mauser in the US.



We hope not to have to go back to percussion or flintlock, so no further discussion of that is required.

As to semi-auto options, the low end military semi would be the SKS, and the most similar to the AR in ballistics would be the AK-74 type.

Compare the costs of those to a build it yourself AR which is possible for $700. Additionally, the AR is going to be more expensive to feed with ammo, but over the long term 5.56 ammo is going to be around, and the non US military calibers are subject to disruption of importation.

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## Icymudpuppy

Try the Keltec SU-16.  Uses the same magazine and ammunition as an AR.  Lighter weight, less customizable, but just as useful.  I love mine.

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## fisharmor

From what I've been able to find out, the thing about the AR is that it's not a piston-operated gas system... it just vents gas right against the bolt face.
This makes it more accurate than piston systems, and also much dirtier.  So I'm not sure what would be comparable, since most of the other rifles I've checked out have pistons.

I would say that if you're looking for a SHTF rifle, you are probably equally served by looking at popular hunting rounds.  It all depends on what your needs are.

At one point I thought I would need a rifle that uses the same round as the US military.  Now I'm thinking differently... that I need a round I can get stockpiled.  If there's trouble afoot, it's either the kind of trouble that my own private stockpile can handle, or it's the type of trouble that requires me to meet up with a bunch  of other people and work out the logistics of everyone having the same equipment... at which point my personal rifle isn't really part of the equation anymore.

For that reason I'm selling off a carbine and getting a Mosin-Nagant.  For the money, I don't think you can get a more accurate rifle and cheaper ammo to feed it.

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## Uriel999

> From what I've been able to find out, the thing about the AR is that it's not a piston-operated gas system... it just vents gas right against the bolt face.
> This makes it more accurate than piston systems, and also much dirtier.  So I'm not sure what would be comparable, since most of the other rifles I've checked out have pistons.
> 
> I would say that if you're looking for a SHTF rifle, you are probably equally served by looking at popular hunting rounds.  It all depends on what your needs are.
> 
> At one point I thought I would need a rifle that uses the same round as the US military.  Now I'm thinking differently... that I need a round I can get stockpiled.  If there's trouble afoot, it's either the kind of trouble that my own private stockpile can handle, or it's the type of trouble that requires me to meet up with a bunch  of other people and work out the logistics of everyone having the same equipment... at which point my personal rifle isn't really part of the equation anymore.
> 
> For that reason I'm selling off a carbine and getting a Mosin-Nagant.  For the money, I don't think you can get a more accurate rifle and cheaper ammo to feed it.


Ah the Nagant, the gun thats been in use for over 100 years, fought in almost every war since then and often against itself and always won!

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## Uriel999

However, ARs get dirty, but keep them wet and they will run just fine. They are a great platform that has been in use for a long time now and just gets better with age.

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## youngbuck

Check out some of the AKs here:  http://classicarms.us/

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## Rael

> What is it substituting it for?   What do you currently have?
> 
> Do you have a handgun yet?


Right now I have a handgun and a shotgun.

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## Uriel999

> Right now I have a handgun and a shotgun.


what brand/models/calibers?

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## Dieseler

I know I shall regret this post but here goes,
http://www.hi-pointfirearms.com/
Flame away but remember the keyword was cheaper and they sure are.

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## cthulhufan

> I know I shall regret this post but here goes,
> http://www.hi-pointfirearms.com/
> Flame away but remember the keyword was cheaper and they sure are.


Hehe, yep.  Feather AT-9 is very fun also and around 500 FRNs, IIRC.  Also, I think someone above posted about the Kel-Tec RFB 7.62x51 bullpup (http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2...bullpup-rifle/) which is going to be very interesting but, eh, I guess it will probably be more expensive than an AR-15

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## puppetmaster

gas piston AR's....clean

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## jkm1864

No point in having a semi auto combat rifle if you can't afford to shoot it .... You should go with a Polish Tantel or a Ak-74 because it shoots the 5.45X39 which goes for 339 bucks for 1000 rounds.

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## FreedomFighter8008

Go with a Ruger Mini-14:

http://www.ruger-firearms.com/Firear...ding&famlst=20

You can find them for around $650 at some stores.  You want to buy the new model of these as there were some issues with the older models.  The new ones are getting great reviews.

They shoot the same round as the AR-15 (.223) and will take a 30 rd. magazine.

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## youngbuck

> Go with a Ruger Mini-14:
> 
> http://www.ruger-firearms.com/Firear...ding&famlst=20
> 
> You can find them for around $650 at some stores.  You want to buy the new model of these as there were some issues with the older models.  The new ones are getting great reviews.
> 
> They shoot the same round as the AR-15 (.223) and will take a 30 rd. magazine.


For the money, an AK is way better than a Ruger Mini-14.  The AKs are just as accurate, significantly more reliable, and magazines are much more plentiful and cheaper.

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## Uriel999

> gas piston AR's....clean


Piston AR15s have their own problems though from I have heard. Many on the AR forums I view call them a "solution in search of a problem."

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## Zeeder

I have the SAIGA 223 AK variant and love it. Cost me 388 dollars. My brother builds AR-15's and he liked it alot.

  I'd rather spend my gun money on 12 gauge ammo and 22lr ammo. I don't see myself lasting in a war long enough to need thousands of rounds and several assault rifles.

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## 50calray

You can piece together an AR15 cheaper than buying a complete rifle and you can pay it out instead of fronting all of the money at once.  Just save up your extra cash and buy the pieces when ever you get a chance. 

The only other thing I can think of is an AK47. You can pick up a low end model for around 500.00.

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## chudrockz

www.classicarms.us has the AK Saiga in 7.62 x 39 (the one I have) and 5.45 x 39 (the one I want) for I think around $330 and $320 respectively.

Oh and you can get 1,000 rounds of Russian 5.45 x 39 for something like $150.

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## Pericles

> Try the Keltec SU-16.  Uses the same magazine and ammunition as an AR.  Lighter weight, less customizable, but just as useful.  I love mine.


Good advice if you are committed to the AR platform and on a budget. You can leverage you stock of ammunition while building an AR and then sell or loan out the Keltec. While Keltec is not the right solution for me, that does not mean that is is not the right solution for you.

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## GBurr

Saiga chambered in 223 Remington 

Russian reliability 
American ammo availability

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## xd9fan

ruger mini 14


but you should get a Marlin 336 30-30    yep its that cool and will work everytime....stood the test of time......and racking the lever is a sick kind of cool that makes me drool that has badguys thinking "oh $#@! I'm a fool"

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## torchbearer



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## ItsTime

> I have the SAIGA 223 AK variant and love it. Cost me 388 dollars. My brother builds AR-15's and he liked it alot.
> 
>   I'd rather spend my gun money on 12 gauge ammo and 22lr ammo. I don't see myself lasting in a war long enough to need thousands of rounds and several assault rifles.


I was thinking about getting a SAIGA or an AR15. 

I may be the only one on Liberty Forest that has no guns. lol

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## pcosmar

> I was thinking about getting a SAIGA or an AR15. 
> 
> I may be the only one on Liberty Forest that has no guns. lol


Nope.

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