# Think Tank > History >  "He united the states of America" JOHN ADAMS starting Sunday on HBO

## Cal Mabus

http://www.hbo.com/scripts/video/vid...7711+title=HBO

Spread this far and wide. The revolution is not over yet!

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## sophocles07

The video didn't work, but I'm pretty sure it's just my computer.

I looked it up elsewhere; Giamatti's a good actor, he'll do well.

They better pull this off well also though, in general.

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## Joseph Hart

SWEET!  Looks great!!!

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## constitutional

Next time, bump an old thread instead of creating a new one.

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## Unspun

Not a big fan of Adams, much at all...

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## Cowlesy

> Not a big fan of Adams, much at all...


I admire his courage, but I didn't like his decisions after the revolution (didn't he do the Alien & Sedition Acts)?

That being said, it will be interesting to see Hanks' portrayal of the Revolution.

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## yongrel

> I admire his courage, but I didn't like his decisions after the revolution (didn't he do the Alien & Sedition Acts)?
> 
> That being said, it will be interesting to see Hanks' portrayal of the Revolution.


Yeah, Adams was the Alien & Sedition Acts.

Adams was a fascinating character though. I can't get enough of his biographies.

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## V3n

After watching "1776" (a movie based on the musical) I was very impressed with John Adams, and thought Ron Paul was more of a John Adams than a Thomas Jefferson, but I admit I don't know much about the actual historical figure outside of what I saw in the movie.

I am looking forward to this HBO special, and I recommend the movie "1776".

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## constitutional

> Not a big fan of Adams, much at all...


why not?

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## Alawn

He was behind the Sedition Act.  It was one of the worst abuses of free speech ever in the US.  Basically it made it a crime to say anything bad about the US, the president or congress (but not the Vice President because he didn't like Jefferson) and if you did you could go to jail for up to 20 years.  He was also a federalist and wanted a strong federal government and weak state governments.  Adams was the anti-Jefferson

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## Anti Federalist

Interesting to note that Adams was influenced by Jonathan Mayhew, a preacher who set the Apostle Paul's words in his _Letters to the Romans_ (Romans 13) on it's ear.

At that time, there were many in the clergy who were using the same argument that the clergy is using now, that you must submit to government since it's ordained by God.

History keeps repeating...

_It was on this day, January 30, 1750 that Jonathan Mayhew preached his Discourse Concerning Unlimited Submission and Non-resistance to the Higher Powers. In it he took to task those who used some words by Paul in the New Testament to argue that the colonists must obey King George III whether he was right or wrong. Paul had written that we are to obey authorities. They are instituted by God, serve God, and exist to do us good. We should obey not just for fear of punishment but for conscience's sake. 

"Here the apostle argues, that those who resist a reasonable and just authority, which is agreeable to the will of God, do really resist the will of God himself; and will, therefore, be punished by him," said Mayhew. "But how does this prove, that those who resist a lawless, unreasonable power, which is contrary to the will of God, do therein resist the will and ordinance of God? Is resisting those who resist God's will, the same thing with resisting God?"

"Common tyrants, and public oppressors, are not intitled to obedience from their subjects, by virtue of any thing here laid down by the inspired apostle." To illustrate his point Mayhew raises a similar case. "Suppose God requires a family of children, to obey their father and not to resist him...Suppose this parent at length runs distracted, and attempts, in his mad fit, to cut all his children's throats: Now, in this case, is not the reason before assigned, why these children should obey their parent while he continued of a sound mind, namely, their common good, a reason equally conclusive for disobeying and resisting him, since he is become delirious, and attempts their ruin?"

Mayhew's lengthy, carefully reasoned sermon was printed and widely read in the colonies. Many Americans accepted its arguments. Among them were John Adams, James Otis, and Josiah Quincey, leaders of the revolution._

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## mavtek

Cant' say I'm a fan of Adams, his support of Jackson and his ridiculous slaughter of Native Americans for his ideal of "Manifest Destiny" is essentially NeoCon agenda of 170 years ago. So no, not my guy.

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## Cholo

Alexander Hamilton ftw.  Still wish I had HBO to see this though. Looks like it's going to be really good.

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## constitutional

> Alexander Hamilton ftw.  Still wish I had HBO to see this though. Looks like it's going to be really good.


Hamilton-- A federalist who created the first national bank and an opponent of Thomas Jefferson. Which of Hamilton's ideas do you admire?

Ron Paul does not represent John Adams. Ron Paul represents more of Thomas Jefferson and Andrew Jackson.

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## mrchubbs

What is interesting is, if I'm not mistaken, I remember Ron Paul saying his favorite founding father was John Adams, in an interview.  Which surprised his interviewer (and me as well). I could be mistaken though. I do know he didn't say Thomas Jefferson, which is who I thought he'd say.

I'll look for the interview. I think it was a radio interview.

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## mrchubbs

> I'll look for the interview. I think it was a radio interview.


Here is is...

It is from the Mike Church Interview on November 30th 
(available on RonPaulAudio.com)

http://www.ronpaulaudio.com/rpaudio/...view113007.m3u

It is the last question, starts at around 24:40.

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## Dave Wood

http://www.hbo.com/films/johnadams/

sorry if in wrong forum, wasnt sure where to put it.

This link will take you to the trailers.......looks incredible.

I hope someone can youtube it..........we dont get hbo

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## quezkittel

YEAAAAAH! John Adams has always been a hero of mine... after McCollough wrote his biography I felt kind of like that kid who's favorite band suddenly got popular.  Thanks for the heads up!

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## Unspun

He really let me down with the Alien and Sedition Act, comparative to today's patriot act.  Should be an interesting film though.

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## zmyrick19

I saw Paul Giamanti promoting this on one of the late night talk shows. The preview clip they showed had John Adams arguing to cooperate with the British while the other guy was arguing freedom and individual liberty.

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## obsolescence

Can't say I'm a John Adams fan.

I'm more sympathetic towards Thomas Jefferson's Democratic-Republicans.

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## Jeremy

> Can't say I'm a John Adams fan.
> 
> I'm more sympathetic towards Thomas Jefferson's Democratic-Republicans.


"Liberty cannot be preserved without a general knowledge among the people." - John Adams

=D

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## Alawn

John Adams was not that great of a guy.  Look into what he did.  The Sedition Act was horrible.  He was also pro strong centralized federal government.

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## nullvalu

Yep, Adams was a Federalist/Hamiltonian. Still I'm sure he's 100x better than most politicians alive today. Like "obsolescence" said, I think most of us are more Anti-Federalists/Jeffersonians.

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## Dave Wood

I think the revolutionary appeal of the movie is timed perfectly with what is beginning in this country. I side with Jefferson also.
You have to admit that John Adams if he were alive today, would have most of these bastards drawn and quartered.

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## RSLudlum

> John Adams was not that great of a guy.  Look into what he did.  The Sedition Act was horrible.  He was also pro strong centralized federal government.



given this little tidbit...why would Dr. Paul say John Adams was his favorite 'founding father' in an interview with Mike Church?  He said Adams "had it right."  What did he have right??

http://www.ronpaulaudio.com/rpaudio/...view113007.mp3

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## Carole

I am looking forward to it. and hope it is well done. Maybe the alien and sedition act will be mentioned/explained as to why?
I will definitely try to watch this and maybe learn a little. Maybe look up more online first to learn more about him.

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## LibertiORDeth

> Can't say I'm a John Adams fan.
> 
> I'm more sympathetic towards Thomas Jefferson's Democratic-Republicans.


Ditto...

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## ionlyknowy

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9CNbQOrxQ-g

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## Phantom

More here: *http://www.fancast.com/tv/John-Adams/100190/videos*

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## nullvalu

Should be a great mini-series. Yay for BitTorrents!

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## Todd

No HBO here.  Must wait for DVD series.

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## nullvalu

> No HBO here.  Must wait for DVD series.


*ahem* http://thepiratebay.org *caugh*

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## Corydoras

If you want a good read, I recommend "The Book of Abigail and John," which is comprised entirely of selected letters, so you can see what remarkable personalities they were:
http://search.barnesandnoble.com/Boo...5535223/?itm=6

If you want a total mindless Chee-tos ha-ha version of John Adams et al., watch "1776," which is a comedy musical based mostly on the letters of the Adamses. I love it.
http://video.barnesandnoble.com/DVD/...6058910/?itm=1

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## Cowlesy

It'll be interesting to see how Thomas Jefferson and Samuel Adams are portrayed by Hanks/McCullough in this mini-series.

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## Truth Warrior

> given this little tidbit...why would Dr. Paul say John Adams was his favorite 'founding father' in an interview with Mike Church? He said Adams "had it right." What did he have right??
> 
> http://www.ronpaulaudio.com/rpaudio/...view113007.mp3


 The Constitution probably.  Well I guess Ron must be a Federalist then. 

TJ fan here, I'll watch the mini-series though.

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## sophocles07

> Yep, Adams was a Federalist/Hamiltonian.


While it is true (obviously) that Adams was a Federalist, he was constantly in argument with Hamilton and other Hamiltonian Federalists.  That being said, I see no real justification for his signing certain pieces of legislation he did into law.  I have a great deal of respect for his intelligence—the Jefferson-Adams letters should showcase that part of his character, alone—though; and would hope this miniseries is well done.

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## nullvalu

> given this little tidbit...why would Dr. Paul say John Adams was his favorite 'founding father' in an interview with Mike Church?  He said Adams "had it right."  What did he have right??
> 
> http://www.ronpaulaudio.com/rpaudio/...view113007.mp3


Thats a good question, I'm not sure why Paul would say he liked Adams over Jefferson..?  Perplexing..

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## Highland

I think he liked Adams more because he was the architect of the revolution...tapping GW for leader of the Continental Army...tapped Jefferson for the Declaration....honored GW as first Pres.....and didn't get listened to in that cabinet.  He probably sympathizes with not being heard and understanding it all.  Plus Adams and Abigail were very much in love and he respected her opinions.  I wrote my Senior Thesis on her in part and a real sacrifice she made.  I know that Ron feels the same about Carol...I hear she is feisty too!  and Look at the similarities in Ron's kids, Rand and John Quincy.  Both very political and involved in the work of the Revolution.

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## Highland

Great thread too...very good for us to connect with the founding fathers at this time...I think it is unifying.  The parallels are eerie if you read the HBO description of each episode to our Revolution.  I think it interesting that the story hasn't been told in film...and only because we can finally appreciate a loss of our freedom and the need to hold our government accountable....these men and women saw it coming and gave us the tools in the Constitution to move through to freedom.  They worried about you and me and this day and time.  We need to draw from their keen vision and work the problem.  WE can do it if they can!

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## bucfish

Nice and perfect timing and of all things Tom Hanks could he be a closet Paulite?

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## Highland

He donated $4600 to Obama...I checked it out too.  I was a Dem and would have voted Obama if I hadn't had researched RP last May.  Common thing...I think we are evolved Dems!  lol  now Constitutional Republicans.  Go Ron Paul

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## Rhys

Just to clear up some confusion, Federalsist were for the Constitution. We'd all be original Federalists.

and the movie looks great.

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## Truth Warrior

> Just to clear up some confusion, Federalsist were for the Constitution. We'd all be original Federalists.
> 
> and the movie looks great.


  Except for the Anti-Federalists here.

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## RSLudlum

Reminder....on in 30 minutes!!

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## Highland

> Reminder....on in 30 minutes!!


thanks...wish I had hbo...but just for this!  lol

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## silverhandorder

it will also be on demand after it airs so don't freak out if you miss it but have HBO on Demand.

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## 2young2vote

This looks great.  I wish it was on Normal TV.

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## rajibo

> This looks great.  I wish it was on Normal TV.


I'm sure it will be out on DVD.

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## WilliamC

I'm reading a biography of Alexander Hamilton right now. It's quite new to me, I had no idea of the powerlessness of the National Government under the Articles of the Confederation. I'm at the part now when the Continental Army is in near open revolt against the Congress because they haven't been paid in years and the Congress has no ability to raise money to pay them. 

I think it's pretty safe to say without the Constitutional Convention and the literal coup against the Articles of the Confederation that the several States would have broken apart and gone their separate ways. 

I'll be reading many more biographies soon, John Adams of course and the new one on Daniel Boone looks good too.

I wonder what future historians will write about Ron Paul?

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## BFranklin

> He donated $4600 to Obama...I checked it out too.  I was a Dem and would have voted Obama if I hadn't had researched RP last May.  Common thing...I think we are evolved Dems!  lol  now Constitutional Republicans.  Go Ron Paul




Thats me right there....

I voted for Paul and will not vote for anyone else now ever again unless Andrew Napolitano ran.

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## 0zzy

Just watched it. Pretty good. I took notes for some random reason.

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## robmpreston

Pretty incredible so far. HBO has really raised the bar for miniseries over the last decade.

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## Melissa

I thought it was great too

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## constitutional

> Just watched it. Pretty good. I took notes for some random reason.


You baffle me-- in a good way!  Even if my teachers said "take notes!!!" I reluctantly did so...


I have not watched it. I will watch it when it's out on DVD or something. Don't have the channel or the time right now. I can't wait though!!!

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## TruthAtLast

I just saw it and thought it was great.  Too bad it doesn't air on National TV with a High Tide commercial break.

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## bcreps85

Watched it, it was good.

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## Fields

Just watched part 1. Very good in my opinion.

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## mrchubbs

Watched both parts. I was mesmerized. I actually teared up a few times thinking about what these great men and women sacrificed for our freedom today. 

I just wish we weren't throwing it away.

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## damien88

> Watched both parts. I was mesmerized. I actually teared up a few times thinking about what these great men and women sacrificed for our freedom today. 
> 
> I just wish we weren't throwing it away.


yeah I had the same reaction it was weird i felt like I wasn't doing enough or something like that, like why can't we take control of ourselves as our founders did

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## Truth Warrior

> I'm reading a biography of Alexander Hamilton right now. It's quite new to me, I had no idea of the powerlessness of the National Government under the Articles of the Confederation. I'm at the part now when the Continental Army is in near open revolt against the Congress because they haven't been paid in years and the Congress has no ability to raise money to pay them. 
> 
> I think it's pretty safe to say without the Constitutional Convention and the literal coup against the Articles of the Confederation that the several States would have broken apart and gone their separate ways. 
> 
> I'll be reading many more biographies soon, John Adams of course and the new one on Daniel Boone looks good too.
> 
> I wonder what future historians will write about Ron Paul?


And just look now at the current monstrous Leviathan that was spawned from the Federalist's coup.

"By their fruits, ye shall know them"

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## Ethek

I agree with many of the sentiments that John Adams was not perfect. He did want a strong separation of powers, he saw that as essential. He was for more centralized Government as well. I think most of this stemmed from wanting desperately for the republic to hold together during its initial struggles. He was definitely not for socialism which is what has hi-jacked the formerly known Federalist movement.

his decades of personal development and study, fostering ideas that would be the driving force behind the deceleration of independence. We would not be a country without John Adams.  I side more with Jefferson and I think Ron would as well but we have to remember people like Franklin and Jefferson were content to sit on the sidelines during the hard decision for independence. Only after it was clear which way the waters were going did they get on board.

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## Ninja Homer

Would this show be suitable for a 12 year old?  My son is home this week for spring break, and I'm considering watching this with him.

I know a lot of the HBO shows can be overly graphic... how's this one?

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## CoreyBowen999

Im 14 but this movie wasen't that graphic. Two episodes on last night and maybe 2 scenes with blood in it. When there was blood, it was pretty little

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## ronpaulmn

I watched last night and really enjoyed it.   I don't remember much about John Adams from history classes of 30 years ago, so it's nice to learn this stuff again, and learn some of it for the first time.   I'd recommend it to anyone and everyone.  I can see them showing this in history classes in jr. high or high school when they're covering the founding fathers.   I hope the next episodes are also as gripping.

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## belian78

> Im 14 but this movie wasen't that graphic. Two episodes on last night and maybe 2 scenes with blood in it. When there was blood, it was pretty little


congrats to you for paying attention at such an age!  you, and others like you give me hope.

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## TruthAtLast

> Would this show be suitable for a 12 year old?  My son is home this week for spring break, and I'm considering watching this with him.
> 
> I know a lot of the HBO shows can be overly graphic... how's this one?


There is a scene where someone is stripped down nude, then tarred and feathered.  Other than that, I didn't see anything more graphic.

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## slamhead

HBO should be commended. I have seen a few documentaries on HBO as of late such as "Why we fight".

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## Ethek

> There is a scene where someone is stripped down nude, then tarred and feathered.  Other than that, I didn't see anything more graphic.


Also some stuff such as blood in the snow.

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## mmink15

I really enjoy the way they are portraying Benjamin Franklin.

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## Estanislao

wow, so far, absolutely awesome!
This is really powerful stuff. I kept on thinking, 'I hope people think of Ron Paul when their watching this', it's like it was made for Paul's benefit.
5- Stars

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## Ninja Homer

Thanks to all for the ratings, my son and I just started watching it.

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## Todd

> *ahem* http://thepiratebay.org *caugh*


Vielen Dank!!

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## RSLudlum

replay is on right now.

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## Joseph Hart

Great show.  Sign up on IMDB.com and 10star it!!!!!!

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## PennCustom4RP

I too watched this last night, thought it was excellent, and have made it mandatory viewing for my 12yo son. Regardless of any violence or blood, it is not gratuitous, but the real struggle. I feel it important that kids of any age see this miniseries. It is important for them to see what was sacrificed to found this nation, and for them to see what it has become, and why we do what we do to take it back. 
That said, my son has been canvassing with me since May, so he is already pretty well tuned in.
 I am watching it again now.

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## Joseph Hart

> I too watched this last night, thought it was excellent, and have made it mandatory viewing for my 12yo son. Regardless of any violence or blood, it is not gratuitous, but the real struggle. I feel it important that kids of any age see this miniseries. It is important for them to see what was sacrificed to found this nation, and for them to see what it has become, and why we do what we do to take it back. 
> That said, my son has been canvassing with me since May, so he is already pretty well tuned in.
>  I am watching it again now.


I do not believe in any kind of censorship.  Explain the reasons things happen and then let them watch.  The FCC decides whats good for my kids ears and eyes?  No thanks.  HOMESCHOOL! :P

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## buck000

Great episodes so far.   Puts a big lump in my throat, like others, not sure why.

I really wish this had come out before Dr. Paul got largely ignored by the media, I think of him often as I view these historical figures come to life...!

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## xd9fan

I'm a Federalist.......which back then would have been an Anti-Federalist.
I'm a Liberal(classical) which today means I'm a Libertarian.

Half the damn battle is language (and the enemies know it)

I still think Our revolution is the greatest story never told...in film.

I want a movie on Sam adams, Patrick Henry, T. Jefferson, Paine
Back when Mel Gibson was still cool I wanted him to play Sam Adams and (with a braveheart-like fire in the belly) say this quote on film:

"If ye love wealth greater than liberty, the tranquility of servitude
greater than the animating contest for freedom, go home from us
in peace. We seek not your counsel, nor your arms. Crouch down
and lick the hand that feeds you; May your chains set lightly upon
you, and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen."

I think I would cry on that one!!!....and then I would storm on WashingtonDC

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## BuddyRey

The only thing that makes me suspicious about this miniseries (and I know it's a stupid reason to be wary of it) is that the biography was written by a Skull & Bonesman, David McCullough, and is starring a Skull & Bonesman, Paul Giamatti (don't believe me?  Check this link!  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Bonesmen )


It could be a truly amazing series, but I sure do hope it's not an inaccurate historical whitewash, like "Wilson"

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## amistybleu

I hope that all patriots are watching this as it kindles a fire within that becons a second revolution, trust that the sacrafices made on our behalf should be defended at all costs against a government that is becoming more tyrannous than the one we rebuked so long ago.  This official campaign is about one thing and that is to continue to no end the fight to reestablish our constitutional and free republic. Urge all those you know to watch and learn those truths that have evaded this nation for so long.

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## Perry

For the record this is on hbo. I'll rent it when it comes to dvd.

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## Jaykzo

It is a fantastic series. Me and my roommate watched the first two and got pumped up from it. We kept joking that Ron Paul should have a cameo appearance.

Really though, they do a fantastic job of setting up the atmosphere. The kind of world that these people lived in is almost unbelievable- watching John Adams try and get something done in a do-nothing congress is too sad to watch, considering its even worse now.

I'd reccommend this series to EVERYONE. Go get HBO for the next two months, you won't regret it.

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## durden0

wasn't john adams in favor of big central government?

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## Thanehand

It brought me to tears when they were reading the Declaration of Independence in episode two.  The conditions under which it was written and the eloquence of the words being read (and the unquestionable truths in what it says) was simply moving.

I'm going to have to really fight the urge to be overly defensive next time someone says to me that "those documents are antiquated."

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## fedup100

And to think, no realize, all their sacrifice was for nothing.  The great Amerika was taken by lies and a trojan horse and they never fired a shot to bring her to the ground.

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## 0zzy

Ron Paul's favorite OG was Adams.

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## familydog

I hope it is not based off of David MCullough's biography.

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## Virginia Libertarian

I just finished watching the first two episodes, once again HBO proves it is the only channel on TV worth watching.

Well, maybe besides Discovery.

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## coyote_sprit

> I just finished watching the first two episodes, once again HBO proves it is the only channel on TV worth watching.
> 
> Well, maybe besides Discovery.


Are we gonna have to start looking into dramatized biographies for real history?

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## Renegades

I saw it, and it was great. Great acting.

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## mrchubbs

> I hope it is not based off of David MCullough's biography.


It is.

But it is still good. Great in fact.

Of course there are some liberties taken, especially timeline-wise. But....

It is well acted and rather moving so far.

If you want something completely based in factual history then watch the 6 part "Liberty" series from PBS is a good place to go. It omits things, but it is pretty damn good. Links to each part are below.

Part 1: http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...51196414323436

Part 2: http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...45627130631491

Part 3: http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...22546684391794

Part 4: http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...65465027527206

Part 5: http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...21666647804785

Part 6: http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...50897330746009

Enjoy.

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## devil21

> It is.
> 
> But it is still good. Great in fact.
> 
> Of course there are some liberties taken, especially timeline-wise. But....
> 
> It is well acted and rather moving so far.
> 
> If you want something completely based in factual history then watch the 6 part "Liberty" series from PBS is a good place to go. It omits things, but it is pretty damn good. Links to each part are below.
> ...


Tagged.  I want to watch them all.  Thx for posting those links.

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## JosephTheLibertarian

Maybe we need to form a new Continental Congress? lol. Start it the same way. The New Jersey guy sucked, it looked like he just went along with whatever New York said.

I think his wife is a bit nutty though.

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## Jason726

Great show. Very well done. I loved the last episode about the declaration of independence.

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## Melissa

> I hope it is not based off of David MCullough's biography.


It is and not sure why you hope this as I have read the book and it is a good read.

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## New York For Paul

Rush Limbaugh liked this as well.

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## Soccrmastr

The debate of John  Adams should continue here. Alien and Sedition Act, strong central government, etc. . Of course thatw as back then and he was taking heat for it. If he saw what was happening today he would of course be appalled.

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## Cowlesy

I have really enjoyed the first two episodes of the mini-series, and looking forward to the third installment tonight which is going to detail the time that several of the founders travelled to France to enlist the support of King Louis.

One item I think a lot of folks need to remember is that these guys, though larger-than-life, were in fact human.  They did great things, and made mistakes along the way.  None of them were perfect.  Purist Libertarians, Anarchists, Republicans or Democrats...are going to have bones to pick with the methods of the Founders in one way or another.

To me, one of the biggest things that makes them great men in my view is that they were able to build a consensus between the 13 States.  These weren't a bunch of populists, but a lot of the gentry class that finally decided that taking the big risk and fighting for freedom was worth it.  A lot of them were uber-wealthy, and could have lived perfectly comfortable lives as subjects of the Crown.

My favorite despite any mis-givings he had, was Samuel Adams

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## menoname

bump

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## menoname

> I have really enjoyed the first two episodes of the mini-series, and looking forward to the third installment tonight which is going to detail the time that several of the founders travelled to France to enlist the support of King Louis.
> 
> One item I think a lot of folks need to remember is that these guys, though larger-than-life, were in fact human.  They did great things, and made mistakes along the way.  None of them were perfect.  Purist Libertarians, Anarchists, Republicans or Democrats...are going to have bones to pick with the methods of the Founders in one way or another.
> 
> To me, one of the biggest things that makes them great men in my view is that they were able to build a consensus between the 13 States.  These weren't a bunch of populists, but a lot of the gentry class that finally decided that taking the big risk and fighting for freedom was worth it.  A lot of them were uber-wealthy, and could have lived perfectly comfortable lives as subjects of the Crown.
> 
> My favorite despite any mis-givings he had, was Samuel Adams



Crap, I thought it was on only on Sundays.  When was the second one on?

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## |MC|

There was a double feature on the night John Adams was first shown, with the first and second episodes back to back.

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## libertygrl

I AM THRILLED beyond belief that this story is now being shown to the masses.

Shortly after 9-11,  I felt as if I didn't know enough about my country.   Like that famous saying -"You don't know what you've got till it's gone,"  the enormity of what took place on that day re-awakened my patriotism.    I decided to read up on the American Revolution.   The first book I chose was John Adams.

I found that the book read like a movie.  David McCollough is so discriptive in his writing, that you feel as if he's taking you back in time on an amazing journey.   I also came away never realizing the importance of John Adams - especially for his diplomatic mission in France.    The sacrifices these people made were inspiring.  I believe at one point he was away from home for 10 years while Abigail took care of the farm.   

I saw David McCullough on Charlie Rose the other night.  I've also seen him in other interviews as well.    He is a man that is genuinely passionate about American History and loves the whole process of research and really getting to know these amazing characters.     He has always been an advocate for educating our children about our history and is dismayed about how little of it is actually taught in our schools. He says it's up to the parents to make sure they teach their kids about it.   

I don't have a problem with David McCullough being in Skull and Bones.  I have a cousin who was a member.  I don't believe that ALL members are part of the power elite that are pulling the strings behind the scenes.     

I don't have HBO but I will seek it out when it goes to dvd.  But I sincerely hope all of you enjoy the series and really take it to heart.  Be inspired. Be empowered by those people that came before us.  They weren't perfect. They were human like us, and had both good and bad points. But they knew that they were playing an important part in history, and were aware that they would be judged centuries later by future historians. How would they be remembered?  Would they be remembered? They did all the hard work. They passed the torch down to us.  It is our obligation to make sure that we don't fail them.

How will WE be remembered?  Will we be remembered for restoring our Republic? Or will we become the generation that allowed our country to slip away due to our ignorance and apathy?  I sincerely believe that the Ron Paul Revolution was the tiny pebble cast into a pond that generated thousands of ripples.  So don't be dismayed about vote counts and delegate totals.  Look at the bigger picture.  This was just the beginning!!

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## Cowlesy

> I AM THRILLED beyond belief that this story is now being shown to the masses.
> 
> Shortly after 9-11,  I felt as if I didn't know enough about my country.   Like that famous saying -"You don't know what you've got till it's gone,"  the enormity of what took place on that day re-awakened my patriotism.    I decided to read up on the American Revolution.   The first book I chose was John Adams.
> 
> I found that the book read like a movie.  David McCollough is so discriptive in his writing, that you feel as if he's taking you back in time on an amazing journey.   I also came away never realizing the importance of John Adams - especially for his diplomatic mission in France.    The sacrifices these people made were inspiring.  I believe at one point he was away from home for 10 years while Abigail took care of the farm.   
> 
> I saw David McCullough on Charlie Rose the other night.  I've also seen him in other interviews as well.    He is a man that is genuinely passionate about American History and loves the whole process of research and really getting to know these amazing characters.     He has always been an advocate for educating our children about our history and is dismayed about how little of it is actually taught in our schools. He says it's up to the parents to make sure they teach their kids about it.   
> 
> I don't have a problem with David McCullough being in Skull and Bones.  I have a cousin who was a member.  I don't believe that ALL members are part of the power elite that are pulling the strings behind the scenes.     
> ...


Great post! Thanks!!

<shameless thread bump>

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## JosephTheLibertarian

I'm not a patriot, but I like this series. I prefer self-government. Least government as possible is the most we can strive for at this point lol. I hope the economy collapses, at least the government would stop growing.

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## TruthAtLast

I can't wait for the 3rd part to air on HBO.  If anyone missed part 1 you can download it here:

h ttp://isohunt.com/download/37251502/john+adams.torrent

It has good quality sound and picture but I'd still recommend watching it on HBO.

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## celticsman7

John Adams, though he may have been a Federalist, would today be considered probably a libertarian. He thought the government should have enough authority to hold the country together, but the people should have the power to exercise their rights, freedoms and liberties. Adams wanted a government of laws, not of men. And while he passed the Alien and Sedition Acts, he thought the Congress was the lawmaking branch and therefore didn't veto it. He never once encouraged its passage or promoted its passage.

Adams was one of the biggest fighters for individual liberty and personal freedom. He and Jefferson just basically differed on whether man was good or bad and whether the government should have more power than the states, which back then was a huge disagreement. But he took the ancient neocons down who were trying to go to war with France. ADAMS AVOIDED AN UNCESSARY WAR WHEN IT WOULD HAVE GOT HIM REELECTED, AND HE KNEW IT TOO! That's what is so great about him. He was a statesman, much like Ron Paul who spoke the truth, would get into arguements and wouldn't back down to people, like Ron in the debates.

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## Cowlesy

T-minus 25min to part 3, EST.

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## JosephTheLibertarian

> T-minus 25min to part 3, EST.


uh? I don't see it.

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## 0zzy

I saw it. Pretty good, Adams isn't a good ambassador apparently, gets sick, he is always angry, Franklin is a old pimp daddy, Abagail is lonely, pretty much the jiff of it.

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## Ninja Homer

> I can't wait for the 3rd part to air on HBO.  If anyone missed part 1 you can download it here:
> 
> h ttp://isohunt.com/download/37251502/john+adams.torrent
> 
> It has good quality sound and picture but I'd still recommend watching it on HBO.


1st and 2nd parts available at eztv.it, and the 3rd will probably be there within an hour from now.

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## familydog

> It is.
> 
> But it is still good. Great in fact.
> 
> Of course there are some liberties taken, especially timeline-wise. But....
> 
> It is well acted and rather moving so far.
> 
> If you want something completely based in factual history then watch the 6 part "Liberty" series from PBS is a good place to go. It omits things, but it is pretty damn good. Links to each part are below.
> ...


Well, the mini-series may take some liberties, but so does McCullough in his biography  I was just curious. Thanks for the links.

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## celticsman7

That was fantastic, as anticipated. I just love how Adams won't take no for an answer. Independence baby!

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## TruthAtLast

just saw the Part 3. loved it

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## 0zzy

Oh and John Quincy Adams goes with John to Paris then Holland and then travels as a secretary to another American to Russia.

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## Cowlesy

I think the producers did a good job of not making it all fluffy/dramatic, but really trying and show how life was like back then---months (or years) apart, people getting extremely ill (pox, flu), sawing a wounded sailor's leg off --- it wasn't all romantic and wow'ish...it was pretty gruesome to live back then.

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## JosephTheLibertarian

> He donated $4600 to Obama...I checked it out too.  I was a Dem and would have voted Obama if I hadn't had researched RP last May.  Common thing...I think we are evolved Dems!  lol  now Constitutional Republicans.  Go Ron Paul


I wouldn't have voted for Obama, even if I never heard of RP. lol. We were all talking about Obama being a socialist on a libertarian forum last year.

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## familydog

> It is and not sure why you hope this as I have read the book and it is a good read.


It is a good read, I agree. It's just not entirely accurate

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## mrchubbs

1 - French society back then seems like American society today. Concerned with appearances and seeking immediate gratification... pushing aside the hard issues of the day for a few more minutes of happiness. Apathetic. How ironic that today one of America's favorite past times is monitoring the movements of someone named Paris (Hilton).


2 - Towards the end of the episode Adams says something that embodies the Ron Paul ethic (at least to me). He said, "I have longed learned that a man may give offense... and he may STILL succeed."

Looks like I'll be trying to make these thoughts a bit more coherent in an article at some point. Or not.

Enjoy.

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## Cowlesy

Very interesting cut between Jefferson, a founder of our Constitutional Republic and Alexander Hamilton, the founder of our Commercial Republic.

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## constitutional

Hamilton created national government and made national government powerful -- Jefferson, being an anti-federalist, hated him. Just bit of history if you wanted to know the background.

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## ItsTime

Man I love this series.

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## MS0453

> It'll be interesting to see how Thomas Jefferson and Samuel Adams are portrayed by Hanks/McCullough in this mini-series.


My only real complaint against the series so far is the portrayal of Samuel Adams as the brute-ish sort of guy. At least thats how he came across to me. For example, that whole tar and feather scene was completely made up. Other than that, it's great stuff.

Oh and to everyone saying that the series makes them wish they could do more, just study Sam Adams. He was practically a one-man revolution.

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## JosephTheLibertarian

I like it. It would be nice if they would maybe stick in "3 years later," or whatever. They make years look like days.

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## sophocles07

> 1 - French society back then seems like American society today. Concerned with appearances and seeking immediate gratification... pushing aside the hard issues of the day for a few more minutes of happiness. Apathetic. How ironic that today one of America's favorite past times is monitoring the movements of someone named Paris (Hilton).


Note too the similar obsession with cosmetics/fake making up of faces.  Cometh before the fall, boys/girls.

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## Cowlesy

debate over Alien & Sedition Acts right now on HBO - John Adams

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## Cowlesy

Jefferson now explaining to Adams how he blackened his reputation because of it...

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## nate895

I now have an idea, lets get an anti-McCain pamphlet in the hands of the delegates to the national convention like Hamilton did to Adams.

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## RSLudlum

it's time for Hamilton's America to end!!!!

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## JosephTheLibertarian

lol very interesting. I don't know why John Adams kept the same guys in his cabinet that Washington had. I would have appointed friends of mine. oh well. And I can see how they scared John Adams into the Alien & Sedition acts. But of course this is just a movie and you can't take a dramatized movie and say, "this is exactly how it happened." I doubt that history as we know it is entirely accurate.

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## MS0453

As usual, the episode was great. Just unfortunate that it's going to be over soon. I could watch these particular actors play these figures for hours.

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## JosephTheLibertarian

Did Thomas Jefferson ever say why he owned slaves? Such a great guy but the slave-owning thing seems so unlike him.

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## torchbearer

> Did Thomas Jefferson ever say why he owned slaves? Such a great guy but the slave-owning thing seems so unlike him.


Sociologically, if he didn't see the slave as human, but animal, he could rationalize ownership. Not saying he thought this, and not saying slaves were animals. Just saying that is how one could rationalize being for equal rights and owning a slave.
You have to somehow rationalize that the different looking human is a lesser class or race. Which I'm sure was a common thought of the day, despite how revolting such a thing sounds to us today.

You have to understand, that with the education of that day... when early explorers saw new peoples that looks different from them... and perceivable less advanced, one would think of yourself as serperate and higher than the almost animal like tribals early white explorers met.
In summary, the didn't see them as the same, so they didn't see them as equal.
Thus having one as a pet didn't seem that demeaning. Sort of like having a monkey in a zoo. Monkeys are now making and using simple tools. Is it immoral to treat sentient creatures in such a fashion?

Many interesting questions... I'm kinda glad the movie didn't try to paint one way or the other.

Anyone know if this will be on DVD?

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## familydog

> Did Thomas Jefferson ever say why he owned slaves? Such a great guy but the slave-owning thing seems so unlike him.


Jefferson makes his opinion on blacks quite clear in _Notes on the State of Virginia_. One of the arguments he puts forth is that black people are incapable of being loyal to this nation, due to some inferiority that he does not name.

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## SeanEdwards

> I AM THRILLED beyond belief that this story is now being shown to the masses.
> 
> Shortly after 9-11,  I felt as if I didn't know enough about my country.   Like that famous saying -"You don't know what you've got till it's gone,"  the enormity of what took place on that day re-awakened my patriotism.    I decided to read up on the American Revolution.   The first book I chose was John Adams.
> 
> I found that the book read like a movie.  David McCollough is so discriptive in his writing, that you feel as if he's taking you back in time on an amazing journey.   I also came away never realizing the importance of John Adams - especially for his diplomatic mission in France.    The sacrifices these people made were inspiring.  I believe at one point he was away from home for 10 years while Abigail took care of the farm.


I had a kind of similar experience. At some point after 9/11, I got really interested in the founders and Thomas Jefferson in particular. As I read about Jefferson, I learned more and more about his relationship with Adams, and that led to me reading McCulloughs biography. Wow! What a book that was! I'm not usually into reading biographies, but "John Adams" blew me away. It really drew me in, and make me feel like a witness to history.

P.S. Early in the book is a reprint of the original to-do list that Adams wrote for himself prior to leaving for the first Continental congress. Item one on the list: Encourage the production of hemp! That still cracks me up.

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## JosephTheLibertarian

Did you like the finale? I watched it last night. John Adams & Thomas Jefferson died exactly on the same day, exactly 50 years after the independence. 4th of July, 1826. That's really not that long ago. If they had lived just a few more years, we might have photographs of them right now.

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