# Lifestyles & Discussion > Privacy & Data Security >  iPhone Will Track You Even After Location Services Are Disabled

## Agorism

One of the posters here was talking about how he keeps location services turned off to stop tracking. Well here you go.
*
iPhone Will Track You Even After Location Services Are Disabled
*


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/0..._n_853147.html

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## GunnyFreedom

> One of the posters here was talking about how he keeps location services turned off to stop tracking. Well here you go.
> *
> iPhone Will Track You Even After Location Services Are Disabled
> *
> 
> 
> http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/0..._n_853147.html


no, 'silent phone' is what "airplaine mode" is for.  A good developer could add two more modes for you, "black hole" and "no log"

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## EndDaFed

> no, 'silent phone' is what "airplaine mode" is for.  A good developer could add two more modes for you, "black hole" and "no log"


It's built into the hardware. http://www.nbc15.com/news/headlines/2404301.html

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## DamianTV

*sniffle*  Bye bye Privacy.  I'll really miss you old friend.  I kind of wish more people showed up for your funeral... *sniffle*

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## Agorism

bump

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## sailingaway

Well dang.  I thought if I turned location services off in settings, they were OFF.

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## DamianTV

If you cant see and understand the source code, you dont really have any idea what any app does.

That also includes home computers.  I run a firewall and I have it set to tell me every time a new program tries to phone home.  However, if it is something like Firefox, once I set up the rules, then the firewall is quiet and doesnt get annoying.  Starting with the first Windows included firewall, their firewalls block incoming traffic, but by default, dont do $#@! about the outgoing data.  So, its not ok for incoming data requests, but when they are sent out, apparently people are not supposed to have any sort of concern about what kinds of data are being sent back to god knows who.  

Most people have absolutely NO idea how much their standard home computers phone home on them.  For example: doing a File Search on your computer phones home to Microsoft.  No joke.  No clue what it is used for, but why does Windows need to phone home every single time I search for a file on my computer?  Could this not be handled with standard Windows Updates, if this were in fact, an update?  I havent pulled my packet sniffer out on that to see what data they are trying to transmit (too lazy) but odds are that it isnt something that you want in public.

Next step of the Invasion of Privacy: Cloud Computing.

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## pcosmar

Easy, Do what I do with my Cell (not iphone) leave it in a cabinet at home.

It doesn't know where I am from there.

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## ClayTrainor

> Easy, Do what I do with my Cell (not iphone) leave it in a cabinet at home.
> 
> It doesn't know where I am from there.


It knows where you live!

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## pcosmar

> It knows where you live!


$#@!,, That is public knowledge. Widely documented and filed in several Law Enforcement files.

Perhaps because I have been subject to electronic monitoring (ankle bracelet) before makes me little sensitive to the subject.
I just don't need to transmit my every move.

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## DamianTV

Doesnt need to be an iPhone

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## Anti Federalist

There is only one way to make sure that electronic dog collar is not ratting you out.

Fire, and lots of it.

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## Agorism

Which poster was telling about how they left location services off?

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## GunnyFreedom

> It's built into the hardware. http://www.nbc15.com/news/headlines/2404301.html


Right, but AFAIK "airplane mode" throws a hardware switch rendering the phone EM null.  Add a "no-log" function and it can "listen" all it wants to.

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## Son of Detroit

I love my iPhone too much to care.

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## Anti Federalist

> I love my iPhone too much to care.


And there you have it.

"I love the convenience of my implanted microchip too much to care".

*sigh*

What's sad is you are, what, 16-17 years old IIRC?

You don't *know* a world *without* the electronic spy grid covering you every second of every minute of every day.

I'm here to tell you, it existed, not very long ago and you know what?

I'd chuck every "convenience" these electronic dog collars deliver to have that world back again.

You would too, if you only knew what you were missing.

(And yes, I am aware of the irony of using technology to decry it.)

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## Anti Federalist

Oh, and so will OnStar, as well as monitor vehicle cabin conversations, even if the service is off or not paid for.

Not to mention shut your car down or lock you in remotely.

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## tpreitzel

> And there you have it.
> 
> "I love the convenience of my implanted microchip too much to care".
> 
> *sigh*
> 
> What's sad is you are, what, 16-17 years old IIRC?
> 
> You don't *know* a world *without* the electronic spy grid covering you every second of every minute of every day.
> ...


x2 ... liberty declines with passing generations and the result is ugly,  e.g. tracking everywhere. Not too long ago, one could walk down a  street without having a camera tracking their every move.  I yearn for the ability to travel in privacy without ID's, registration, cameras, etc .....

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## politicsNproverbs

Did you guys see this?

4/25/11:
*"Steve Jobs: Apple doesn't track anyone" - Yahoo! News:*
http://news.yahoo.com/s/digitaltrend...V2ZWpvYnNhcHA-

(Copy/paste from iphone would not work in the forum URL window.)

Lol, nobody in the Comments section believed Jobs (me neither). *It reminds me of a few years ago when Charlie Rose (PBS) asked Eric Schmidt point blank: *"Do you (Google) read our Gmails?" *Of course Mr. CFR himself replied to the effect, "Well we could but we don't."

Re Location, recently I was reading gripes & suspicions in App Reviews re photo apps & Location access, so I asked a dev what was the real deal about all that? *This was his explanation:




> Regarding Location Services, here is the deal. Before iOS4 there was only one way for developers like me to access iPhone photo library. There is this image picker control provided by Apple that you normally see when you upload a photo from the photo library. It has some major limitations:
> 
> 1) it cannot be customized,
> 2) you can only pick one photo at a time and after each photo there is a 4-6 seconds delay before the selected photo is saved elsewhere for further processing/uploading
> 3) no way to set a checkmark for the photos that already have been selected
> 4) all the EXIF and location tags are stripped from the photos selected with this image picker.
> 
> With iOS4 Apple added some new classes to their iOS SDK that allow direct access to albums and media files on the iPhone's file system, including all the EXIF and location data. This allows me to build a custom image picker that overcomes the limitations mentioned above. But since the photos contain location data, Apple requires that users enable location services for an app to get access to the photo library, even though the app will not necessarily be tracking location. That's the case with (app name) - it needs Location Services mostly to access the photo library. The only time it tracks your location is when you upload a photo from iPhone's camera. Then (app name) gets your current location to geo-tag the photo.
> 
> I think Apple should have a different control mechanism to enable access to photo library, as this does look shady to an average user. Maybe iOS5 will have it.


So what do you think?

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## Son of Detroit

> And there you have it.
> 
> "I love the convenience of my implanted microchip too much to care".
> 
> *sigh*
> 
> What's sad is you are, what, 16-17 years old IIRC?
> 
> You don't *know* a world *without* the electronic spy grid covering you every second of every minute of every day.
> ...


I see your viewpoint, and I respect the fact that you wouldn't want an iPhone because of it.  That's the beauty of the free market; If you feel the negatives outweigh the positives, you don't have to buy an iPhone.  Now if the government made it mandatory to own one, I'd throw a fit.  But I spent the $200 fully knowing of the consequences of owning the item, and felt it was worth it.  It'll come in great handy next year in college.

If Apple wants to see that I've been to a coffee shop or two in Ann Arbor, I don't care.  That would bother you, and that's your right to be bothered.

Apple is a private company, they can do whatever they want with their products.  Don't like it, don't buy it.

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## Anti Federalist

> I see your viewpoint, and I respect the fact that you wouldn't want an iPhone because of it.  That's the beauty of the free market; If you feel the negatives outweigh the positives, you don't have to buy an iPhone.  Now if the government made it mandatory to own one, I'd throw a fit.  But I spent the $200 fully knowing of the consequences of owning the item, and felt it was worth it.  It'll come in great handy next year in college.
> 
> If Apple wants to see that I've been to a coffee shop or two in Ann Arbor, I don't care.  That would bother you, and that's your right to be bothered.
> 
> Apple is a private company, they can do whatever they want with their products.  Don't like it, don't buy it.


Government has already made it mandatory for me.

They will do it to you as well.

And in my case, part of that surveillance grid, is a private company that supposedly can do whatever it wants.

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## Anti Federalist

///

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## Agorism

Why make it mandatory when they can just slip it into everything like new cars. No one will notice it that way.

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## DamianTV

People will notice.  As soon as you speed in a brand new car now, your warranty is voided.

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## Anti Federalist

> People will notice.  As soon as you speed in a brand new car now, your warranty is voided.


Yup, saw that about three years ago, picking up parts at the local, now defunct, Dodge dealer.

Guy was going bat$#@! at the service counter because they were not going to honor the warranty on his two year old Dodge Hemi P/U because the everfucking onboard computer showed he had spun the tires for more than 15 seconds four months prior to that.

Only a stopgap I know, but 1976 Ford F-150 FTW

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## DamianTV

> Yup, saw that about three years ago, picking up parts at the local, now defunct, Dodge dealer.
> 
> Guy was going bat$#@! at the service counter because they were not going to honor the warranty on his two year old Dodge Hemi P/U because the everfucking onboard computer showed he had spun the tires for more than 15 seconds four months prior to that.
> 
> ...


Like if he got stuck in the snow?

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## Anti Federalist

> Like if he got stuck in the snow?


Yup.

Of course they, the dealer, was claiming, "oh no, you were "drifting" with this vehicle, the uneven rate of spin at the rear wheels confirms it".

The guy looked like he was 55-60 years old. I doubt he was "drifting".

$#@! a bunch of computer cars. Hard.

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## DamianTV

Now it all makes sense.  Cash for clunkers, then destroy the older vehicles.  Force people to do two things.  Promote Big Business by having to buy a brand new computer controlled car.  And to remove the option that they will try to go back to once they find out how much control over their lives they lose to the new car.

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## Anti Federalist

Yes, that ^^^

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## aGameOfThrones

South park made fun of this in yesterday's season premiere.

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## DamianTV

Good News for Android Users:

*Marlinspike's Droid Firewall Kills Tracking 41*
http://yro.slashdot.org/story/11/05/...Kills-Tracking




> "The first dynamic Android firewall, dubbed WhisperMonitor, has been released by respected security researcher Moxie Marlinspike. The firewall will allow users to stop location-tracking apps and restrict connection attempts by applications. Marlinspike, whose company created the application, designed WhisperMonitor in response to the incidence of location tracking and malware on Android platforms. It monitors all outbound connection attempts by applications and the operating system, and asks users to permit or block any URLs and port numbers that are accessed."

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## jmdrake

> Yup, saw that about three years ago, picking up parts at the local, now defunct, Dodge dealer.
> 
> Guy was going bat$#@! at the service counter because they were not going to honor the warranty on his two year old Dodge Hemi P/U because the everfucking onboard computer showed he had spun the tires for more than 15 seconds four months prior to that.
> 
> Only a stopgap I know, but 1976 Ford F-150 FTW


Good for you!  I've got freaking OnStar in my vehicle.  I've tried to find out how to disable it, but the instructions or for a different model.  Under SHTF conditions I'm going to find the first sucker I see with a hoopty and trade vehicles.  Or I might build my own.

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