# Lifestyles & Discussion > Family, Parenting & Education > Books & Literature >  Atlas Shrugged Audio Book

## Anwar_S

Anyone want it? I can upload it if people ask.

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## Brassmouth

I'm game, if it's no trouble.

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## jackers

Hell's yeah!

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## 0zzy

Yes plz. Which is it btw? And how big is it? It would have to be like 40 hours of audio daaaang.

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## Kludge

Mmm....

The audiobook was uploaded earlier last year and linked on here.

Not only does this go against forum guidelines, but it pissed off a few Objectivists last time.

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## Gaius1981

I'd feel pretty damn shameful listening to a pirated version of Atlas Shrugged, knowing I was one of the moochers. The type of people who do that, are the same type of people who would claim that Rearden Steel belongs to "the public". Download it if you will, but don't go around calling yourself a capitalist afterward.

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## torchbearer

I loan out books from my library all the time.
I don't see the problem with it.

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## Gaius1981

> I loan out books from my library all the time.
> I don't see the problem with it.


Capitalism is based on the concept of property rights. The books in your library are your property, so loaning them out to friends is something else entirely than ripping off pirated versions of other people's property through illegal torrent feeds.

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## torchbearer

> Capitalism is based on the concept of property rights. The books in your library are your property, so loaning them out to friends is something else entirely than ripping off pirated versions of other people's property through illegal torrent feeds.


either way- they read the book.
either someone physically drives here and borrows my copy-
or gets a digital copy online and deletes it after they read it.

I have the ability to pirate anything I want.
I buy Fallout 3, even though I could get it for free because I want to support publishers and programmers who make good games.
That is how people should see it.
If no ones buys it- they won't make another one.

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## Gaius1981

> either way- they read the book.
> either someone physically drives here and borrows my copy-
> or gets a digital copy online and deletes it after they read it.
> 
> I have the ability to pirate anything I want.
> I buy Fallout 3, even though I could get it for free because I want to support publishers and programmers who make good games.
> That is how people should see it.
> If no ones buys it- they won't make another one.


So much for being principled, though. How can you except to inspire other people to respect capitalism/property rights, when you show complete disregard for it yourself? Illegally sharing other people's intellectual property online is an act of communism. If you spend several years of your life writing a book, and the people who purchase it simply scan it and publish it on a forum with thousands of users on it, you might perhaps gain a better understanding of the negative effects of your current actions.

As an activist for free market capitalism, you should lead by example so that you might inspire other individuals to do the same.

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## torchbearer

> So much for being principled, though. How can you except to inspire other people to respect capitalism/property rights, when you show complete disregard for it yourself? Illegally sharing other people's intellectual property online is an act of communism. If you spend several years of your life writing a book, and the people who purchase it simply scan it and publish it on a forum with thousands of users on it, you might perhaps gain a better understanding of the negative effects of your current actions.
> 
> As an activist for free market capitalism, you should lead by example so that you might inspire other individuals to do the same.


If it is MY book- I can lend it to whoever I want.
I bought the book. It is mine. My sister wanted to read it. I gave it her to read.
Is that theft?
Maybe you are the one who needs to re-examine yourself.

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## Objectivist

Looks like an ethical gut check.

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## Gaius1981

> If it is MY book- I can lend it to whoever I want.
> I bought the book. It is mine. My sister wanted to read it. I gave it her to read.
> Is that theft?
> Maybe you are the one who needs to re-examine yourself.


Purchasing a book doesn't give you the intellectual property rights to it. There's a very fundamental difference between privately lending the book to your sister, and illegally making the intellectual property of someone else freely available on an online community consisting of several thousands of people (I'm of course assuming that you're defending the original poster, whom I criticized).

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## Brassmouth

> So much for being principled, though. How can you except to inspire other people to respect capitalism/property rights, when you show complete disregard for it yourself? Illegally sharing other people's intellectual property online is an act of communism. If you spend several years of your life writing a book, and the people who purchase it simply scan it and publish it on a forum with thousands of users on it, you might perhaps gain a better understanding of the negative effects of your current actions.
> 
> As an activist for free market capitalism, you should lead by example so that you might inspire other individuals to do the same.


You have some reading to do....

There is no such thing as intellectual property.

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## Brassmouth

At any rate, can I have Atlas Shrugged, plox?

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## 0zzy

You are aware the guys at the Mises institute don't associate digital property with physical? They are two separate things, hence why they have their books online digitally. 

I think this is the link:
http://blog.mises.org/archives/009393.asp

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## Anwar_S

Well if its against forum rules I just won't post it. Anyone that wants a copy will just have to pm me.

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## Objectivist

Does anyone buy books anymore? I mean original printings. I have Atlas Shrugged from 1957 but I prize my original Planned Chaos more.

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## heavenlyboy34

> So much for being principled, though. How can you except to inspire other people to respect capitalism/property rights, when you show complete disregard for it yourself? Illegally sharing other people's intellectual property online is an act of communism. If you spend several years of your life writing a book, and the people who purchase it simply scan it and publish it on a forum with thousands of users on it, you might perhaps gain a better understanding of the negative effects of your current actions.
> 
> As an activist for free market capitalism, you should lead by example so that you might inspire other individuals to do the same.


Have you yet read Jeff Tucker's "Against Intellectual Property"?  He also has many great articles on LRC that make the libertarian case AGAINST government copyright/patent.  So, you have a bit of a red herring there if you equate copyright infringement with communism.  Time to put on your critical thinking cap!

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## yaz

> There is no such thing as intellectual property.




I was going to post that but you beat me to it.

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## disorderlyvision

> Well if its against forum rules I just won't post it. Anyone that wants a copy will just have to pm me.


thanks

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## Objectivist

By the way there is a bridged version as well as the unabridged original available on CD.

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## Kludge

> There is no such thing as intellectual property.


There is no such thing as rights in nature.

It's a silly concept thought up by the haves to keep the have-nots from having the haves' property.

Ain't no war but the class war.

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## Objectivist

> There is no such thing as rights in nature.
> 
> It's a silly concept thought up by the haves to keep the have-nots from having the haves' property.
> 
> Ain't no war but the class war.


I take it Kludge prefers the Government to take ownership of a Mans ideas. Ironic we're in a Ayn Rand thread.

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## Kludge

> I take it Kludge prefers the Government to take ownership of a Mans ideas.


Nah, government has no right to do that.  

I'm a libertarian because it's in my best interest. As a rational person, I don't want government interfering in markets and taking it upon themselves to regulate me. As a mad Pacifist, I don't want a government murdering/stealing/kidnapping/counterfeiting/torturing (did I miss anything?) in my name.


Objectivism gets weird when it starts talking about virtues, morality, and evil.

...And then there's Objectivist foreign policy.

YouTube - Leonard Peikoff Interview

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## Objectivist

What part did you have a problem with? If you want to defend against people that will kill you solely on the idea that you won't conform to their mysticism, then what other route do you have but to defend against that insanity with all force available to you.

Generals handle the ammo, not politicians.

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## Kludge

> What part did you have a problem with?


Not objecting to the hypothetical of murdering well over 60,00,000 people in the name of "standing up for what we believe in". That is a crusade.

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## Objectivist

> Not objecting to the hypothetical of murdering well over 60,00,000 people in the name of "standing up for what we believe in". That is a crusade.


Not when those 60 million people have a flawed oppressive ideology that says it is justified to murder non Muslims unless they convert to Islam.

I wouldn't let one of them into this country if I was in charge.

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## Objectivist

http://www.ethicalatheist.com/docs/islam_infidels.html
http://www.blessedcause.org/Quran.htm
http://infidelsarecool.com/2008/01/1...oman-must-see/

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## BuddyRey

With book sales stronger than ever for _Atlas Shrugged_, it looks like the mass piracy hasn't hurt much.

IMHO, artists who feel secure in the quality of their work have absolutely nothing to fear from file-sharing.  Notice it's usually the artists who suck (i.e. Metallica), and whose work doesn't thrive in the marketplace anyway, who come out against this stuff and try to initiate government force against non-aggressors.

FYI:  I am a musician, and I hereby grant moral authority for you to rip, burn, spread around, and enjoy my music in whatever way you wish!  Chop it, screw it; remix it, redo it.  Bump it in your ride, on your iPod, and at parties.  Heck, play it on the radio, I won't ask for royalties.  I consider it an ideal exchange; I provide you with a product you (hopefully) enjoy, and you spread the word to your friends and help me gain a reputation for my art!  If you like my stuff enough to help fund my livelihood, I appreciate it.  If not, there is no victim.  I do what I do because I love doing it!  

Last but not least, and as proof that an eschewal of property rights theory is not inherently anti-free market, the great Anarcho-Capitalist theorist Murray Rothbard was very quick to dismiss the idea, and Rothbard was _never_ wrong!  I just invented a new logical fallacy, and I call it "Appeal to Rothbard."

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## Objectivist

If I remember correctly if music is over 50 years old it loses it's copyright protections. I'll have to look that up. SOmething from Film School about copyrights and which music we could use without paying royalties.

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## Brassmouth

There doesn't appear to be a file for 311 of 332.

Typo or missing file?

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