# Think Tank > Austrian Economics / Economic Theory >  Retailers Rejecting Customers Cash As More Ban Paper Money

## RonZeplin

Yo cash ain't nothing buy trash, they say. Sure, FRN's are fake money but the digital version isn't any better?




> _
> Your cash is not wanted here_,a growing number of  retailers and restaurants throughout the US and UK are telling  customers. But are reasons being given by companies for the  new cashless approach  speed, efficiency, and the safety of store  employees __ valid enough to require something as utterly and downright unAmerican as rejecting cash?
> 
>  We think not, and unfortunately the trend of cash not welcome here establishments is growing, to the point that *lawmakers are beginning to take note and could introduce legislation barring the practice*,  as Massachusetts has done already, and as the New Jersey State House  could be set to do next. According to a Federal Reserve survey conducted  in 2017 cited in _The Wall Street Journal_, *cash represented 30% of all transactions in America, with 55% of those being under $10*.  
> 
> Regardless of Americans longtime preference for plastic in most  transactions, many of which take place online, research by the Federal  Reserve found that cash is still king in terms of Americans daily lives  and usage, and as the study concluded further, this remains true across all income levels: *
> Not only is cash used frequently for small value and in-person purchases, it is also used by a wide array of consumers.* The  data on cash use by household income provides two main insights. First,  consumers makeon average14 cash transactions per month, regardless of  household income. It is also noteworthy that cash was the most, or  second most, used payment instrument regardless of household income, *indicating  that its value to consumers as a payment instrument was not limited to  lower income households that may be less likely to have access to an  account at a financial institution
> *
>  But this reality is now pushing up against the new trend of the  cashless restaurant, bar and retailer, and creating awkward and  frustrating situations for consumers, as a new _Wall Street Journal_ piece chronicles. In one scenario, *a customer had to intervene on anothers behalf and play personal bank for a card only salon*, even though there was plenty of cash on hand offered by the woman who couldnt pay. Ironically, as the WSJ story notes, this created an emergency:
> ...

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## Origanalist

> . After all, you can’t give back a hairdo, an already dressed salad or the two beers you already drank.


Well, then I guess the dumb sonsabitches don't get paid then do they?

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## oyarde

> Well, then I guess the dumb sonsabitches don't get paid then do they?


Ya , free beer .

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## euphemia

My hair stylist and nail technician are happy to take my cash.  In the US, FRNs state:  This note is legal tender for all debts, public and private.  No public business at the point of sale can refuse cash.  It is unwise, of course to mail cash payments, because there is no proof that the payment has been made.  

I am a cash user.  If a business does not want my cash, they do not want my business.  In fact, there are places that do not accept plastic, or they attach a fee for plastic, because there are fees attached to those cards by the bank.

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## Dr.3D

Where I shop, they always ask at the checkout counter, "Plastic or paper?"

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## RonZeplin

> Where I shop, they always ask at the checkout counter, "Plastic or paper?"


That kind of question is illegal in California, but they'll sell you a bag for 10 cents, or you can bring your own.

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## Swordsmyth

> Well, then I guess the dumb sonsabitches don't get paid then do they?


What are they going to do?
Will the cops arrest you if you are standing there offering cash?
I suppose if the no cash policy is clearly displayed they might have a case but the law says cash is legal tender for all debts..........................

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## William Tell



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## Origanalist

> What are they going to do?
> Will the cops arrest you if you are standing there offering cash?
> I suppose if the no cash policy is clearly displayed they might have a case but the law says cash is legal tender for all debts..........................


Exactly. If people get taken by surprise then they don't make it very clear to the customer. so they can either accept payment in cash or go pound sand.

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## William Tell

I wonder what kind of stores are doing this, and where they are? As long as the local gas stations, sporting good stores, grocery and hardware stores, and restaurants for the common man don't do this lots of us are just fine.

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## Origanalist

> I wonder what kind of stores are doing this, and where they are? As long as the local gas stations, sporting good stores, grocery and hardware stores, and restaurants for the common man don't do this lots of us are just fine.


There is a restaurant just down the street that still doesn't take plastic. Been there probably 50 years and still going strong.

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## Origanalist

Whoever these businesses are are screwing their employees. I always tip with cash.

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## William Tell

> There is a restaurant just down the street that still doesn't take plastic. Been there probably 50 years and still going strong.


Yep. But who does the opposite now?




> Whoever these businesses are are screwing their employees. I always tip with cash.


 Not just you.

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## Origanalist

> *Yep. But who does the opposite now?*
> 
>  Not just you.


I don't know, I've never run into that situation. But I do my absolute best to stay out of large cities.

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## oyarde

I am going to go ahead and encourage my bartender to sell me beer and refuse my cash . See what his take is on it .

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## Suzanimal

I've noticed a lot of the self checkout machines at Walmart are card only.

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## Anti Federalist

A quick search of transaction fees charged to merchants shows that the average CC processing fees can range anywhere from 1% to almost 4%.

So you and I and *all of us* pay roughly $1 to $4 bucks on every hundred spent, because, just like taxes, these fees aren't going to be "eaten" by the retailer, they will passed along to everybody through increased prices.

Now, multiply this by the *trillions* of transactions that take place in a day.

And idiot AmeriKunts then wonder *why* the banksters own their collective asses.

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## Suzanimal

> A quick search of transaction fees charged to merchants shows that the average CC processing fees can range anywhere from 1% to almost 4%.
> 
> So you and I and *all of us* pay roughly $1 to $4 bucks on every hundred spent, because, just like taxes, these fees aren't going to be "eaten" by the retailer, they will passed along to everybody through increased prices.
> 
> Now, multiply this by the *trillions* of transactions that take place in a day.
> 
> And idiot AmeriKunts then wonder *why* the banksters own their collective asses.


Yep. And if you have a chip reader that doesn't work and we swipe it, the bank charges the bar another 1.00 on on that transaction on top of the fees.

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## Schifference

What happened to the individual property owners rights to refuse service argument?

Could a property owner mandate all sales in cash only? I know some that do? Then why can they not mandate all sales in credit? Some of these institutions might have problems finding competent cashiers that can count change. Some might find it less stressful when doing their bookkeeping. There might be less theft by employees if no cash. If no cash only product can be stolen at gunpoint. I could see lots of reasons a store owner would prefer credit card only purchases.

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## Schifference

Maybe soon these stores will set up the equivalent of a change machine that turns FRN into a Store Card with that balance. So outside the store you put your $20 FRN into a machine and the machine spits out a card that has $20 balance. Then you go into the store and purchase something for $0.89 and have to keep a card with a $19.11 balance. It is like a sale outside the store and then the customer walks around with what could potentially be a worthless piece of plastic that limits its use to one establishment.

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## oyarde

The Antique Mall I sell things at charges me about 3 or 4 percent for credit card purchases which I assume is just passing that cost to me . Cash or check is still free . If I happen to be there stocking and someone asks if I can do anything to reduce a price the first thing I ask is if its cash . If so , many times I will give 5 or ten percent off . There is also no sales tax in Indiana on coins which is a lot of what I sell .

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## Anti Federalist

> What happened to the individual property owners rights to refuse service argument?
> 
> Could a property owner mandate all sales in cash only? I know some that do? Then why can they not mandate all sales in credit? Some of these institutions might have problems finding competent cashiers that can count change. Some might find it less stressful when doing their bookkeeping. There might be less theft by employees if no cash. If no cash only product can be stolen at gunpoint. I could see lots of reasons a store owner would prefer credit card only purchases.


Sure they can, nobody here is saying they cannot, as far as I know, outside of big government Mass and New Jersey.

That doesn't mean that it's a good idea, (it's not) that I would do business with them (I won't) or the fact that it will come to a point where I will no longer have any choice but to use plastic (it will).

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## specsaregood

> A quick search of transaction fees charged to merchants shows that the average CC processing fees can range anywhere from 1% to almost 4%.
> 
> So you and I and *all of us* pay roughly $1 to $4 bucks on every hundred spent, because, just like taxes, these fees aren't going to be "eaten" by the retailer, they will passed along to everybody through increased prices.
> 
> Now, multiply this by the *trillions* of transactions that take place in a day.
> 
> And idiot AmeriKunts then wonder *why* the banksters own their collective asses.


the bigger you are and more transactions you make the less % you pay, getting to the point of almost nothing.  giving another advantage to large chains

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## Brian4Liberty

> My hair stylist and nail technician are happy to take my cash.  In the US, FRNs state:  This note is legal tender for all debts, public and private.  No public business at the point of sale can refuse cash.  It is unwise, of course to mail cash payments, because there is no proof that the payment has been made.  
> 
> I am a cash user.  If a business does not want my cash, they do not want my business.  In fact, there are places that do not accept plastic, or they attach a fee for plastic, because there are fees attached to those cards by the bank.


Yep. For better or worse, the legal tender law makes it illegal for them to deny cash.

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## oyarde

Mrs O buys her gas at Sams Club . I on the other hand will never use it simply because they do not take cash only cards .

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## Stratovarious

> Yep. For better or worse, the legal tender law makes it illegal for them to deny cash.


Agreed; 'legal tender for all debts public and private' , however, 'better or worse' is 
on the fence, I'm not on the fence*, I will refuse to buy from any retailer that refuses
my cash and encourage others to do the same, which reminds me of Walmart's self
serve check outs, I estimate 3 lost jobs for each ssc, have never and will never use 
them, anywhere.

*
Cashless Society:
The Government can put a hold at anytime on your D.C.
card or digital currency app/acct and freeze your account/s 
without you being convicted of any crime, at anytime, at their whim.
They can stop you from paying your bills. 
They can choose the things they allow you buy,  
and stop you from buying or accessing anything that their (Un- 
Constitutional) spying algorithms tell them are risk items, 
things you may not be able to live without, Food in general, 
 herbs , organic produce , any produce, Coffee, medications, 
medical services. 
They can Stop you from buying Firearms, Ammo, Books, a 
Baseball Bat , Tennis Racket, any sporting goods, literature, gas, 
food, lodging. 
Stop you from travel . Stop you from communicating.
Banks can and will charge you any fees they choose for handling 
your electronic activities (buying or selling, consumer or vendor) ,
as well as charge negative interest rates or exorbitant fees on 
your acct/s.
Essentially , a cashless system can literally kill you, without 
you having done anything illegal ever, all that is required is that 
someone decides, or A.I. determines that you need to be put 
on a list.
Cashless Control (D.C./CHIPS) can transform us all 
into thieves, thugs, robbers, and murderers , in order for us to just 
try to survive, they can and will control every aspect of our lives.
The current push to eliminate the 100 dollar bill has nothing to do 
with curbing or stopping any crime, it is part of the roll out of the 
cashless scheme, to demonize cash, to force us into electronic
 transfers instead of cash.
We all have credit/debit cards, and we pay many of our bills on line
the convenience is there, however in a disaster of any magnitude, 
no Super Market or Hardware Store is going to give you food 
and survival equipment on your 'Cards' and your good word when the
internet connection/satellite/power is down.
I try to buy everything I possibly can with cash, I only use cards 
when absolutely necessary. 
We need to return to a value based currency.
Bitcoin is still a Fiat Currency and the govt will be in control of it,
many of us believe it is a Judas Goat , it is a cloaked introduction
to complete control over every aspect of your lives.
The worst nightmare for me is not that I will live long enough
to be destroyed by a chipped and cashless society , 
my problem is that if we don't stand together 
(every race, color, and creed) and fight the NWO rollout, 
history will be re-written, our descendants will be under complete 
govt control, and will not even understand that humans 
once had inalienable rights, as spelled out in our great and inspired 
US Constitution.

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## specsaregood

> Yep. For better or worse, the legal tender law makes it illegal for them to deny cash.


Not according to some.  
https://www.expertlaw.com/library/co...e-cash-payment

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## oyarde

I do not use self checkouts unless they take cash .

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## Stratovarious

> I've noticed a lot of the self checkout machines at Walmart are card only.



They even have employees sold on two issues;
They will always take cash.
They are not taking jobs from cashiers.
-
And of course we all know that we can keep our doctor
and the premiums will not go up. 
The savings to the customer that might be attached to 'self serve' , 
are temporary at best, in the long run, prices eventually will bear no
relationship to that savings, they will creep up until whatever we thought 
they were doing for us is completely gone.
-
At my nearest Wal-Mart, they have 12 self serves open all the time, and
usually 1 to 2 regular checkouts. I view that as 36 jobs, am, pm,  and late evening
shifts, 24 jobs on the lower end, but can anyone see where this is heading 
if we  patronize these 'conveniences' . 
The argument of course for these 'jobs' is that now they can go get better jobs
, get better educated, lol, reality is that a lot of these positions are filled by
folks that are not ever going advance into 'higher tech' jobs, ever, so we can
be like France and just put everyone on welfare right? ha .......

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## euphemia

> I've noticed a lot of the self checkout machines at Walmart are card only.


I can understand that. It takes human extra technology to give change and a human effort to load it.

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## Brian4Liberty

> Not according to some.  
> https://www.expertlaw.com/library/co...e-cash-payment


Yeah, government likes to contradict itself. 

State laws might require people to take cash.

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## Suzanimal

> They even have employees sold on two issues;
> They will always take cash.
> They are not taking jobs from cashiers.
> -
> And of course we all know that we can keep our doctor
> and the premiums will not go up. 
> The savings to the customer that might be attached to 'self serve' , 
> are temporary at best, in the long run, prices eventually will bear no
> relationship to that savings, they will creep up until whatever we thought 
> ...


That is why, when I change my mind about buying something, I just leave it where ever in the store. Mr A gets mad even though I've explained to him that I'm creating jobs. Notice all those employees pushing around shopping carts putting stuff away? I helped create that job.

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## Stratovarious

> That is why, when I change my mind about buying something, I just leave it where ever in the store. Mr A gets mad even though I've explained to him that I'm creating jobs. Notice all those employees pushing around shopping carts putting stuff away? I helped create that job.


Good Lord, I love it, I have threatened to walk away many times under my breath,
even remarked to another customer, I think I actually did it once a couple years ago
at a Smiths Market, not positive, can't tell you how many times it has occurred 
to me though, to do so.

So these jobs you create, Excellent.
I stopped going to Smiths about a year ago, got tired of them having just 1 regular register, but 4 self 
serves open, constantly trying to hustle me over to the self serve, if I ever go back there, 
when they grab my cart and try to herd' me over to self serve, I'll give them the cart, and 
tell them I need to go grab my wallet.....:smile:

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## Suzanimal

> Good Lord, I love it, I have threatened to walk away many times under my breath,
> even remarked to another customer, I think I actually did it once a couple years ago
> at a Smiths Market, not positive, can't tell you how many times it has occurred 
> to me though, to do so.
> 
> So these jobs you create, Excellent.
> I stopped going to Smiths about a year ago, got tired of them having just 1 regular register, but 4 self 
> serves open, constantly trying to hustle me over to the self serve, if I ever go back there, 
> when they grab my cart and try to herd' me over to self serve, I'll give them the cart, and 
> tell them I need to go grab my wallet.....:smile:

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## Stratovarious

> 


Hilarious, plus this kind of humor is so much better than the constant political-agendaand race baiting humorists throughout todays comedic market.

When he gets around to the customer svc calls, I'm reminded of the lady 
that kept telling me she was sorry that I was unhappy , and couldn't admit
or even acknowledge the issue, the fubar co policy , fail,  or whatever  - -  the company
was not in error, dissatisfaction was my problem.

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