# Lifestyles & Discussion > Personal Security & Defense >  NRA vs GOA

## sidster

I was talking to a friend and he was telling me about GOA (Gun Owners
of America) and how they are the only gun club that have not ever
helped pass any anti-gun/2nd Amendment legislation.  Whereas, NRA
has been behind quite a few, such as assault-rifle bans, etc.

Mind you I have not done much research in this area, but I'm asking
folks who know first hand and want to get your opinion on these two
gun clubs.

I like this quote from GOA's web-site:



> "The only no-compromise gun lobby in Washington."
> -Rep. Ron Paul (R-TX)

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## amy31416

G.o.a.

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## sidster

> G.o.a.


LOL... I see you are struggling with that too

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## revolutionist

The GOA is much more principled than the NRA.

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## TastyWheat

The NRA gave Ron a "B" rating, likely because of his opposition to caps on gun manufacturer lawsuits. Pretty lame excuse.

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## amy31416

> LOL... I see you are struggling with that too


I tried like hell to get the post in all caps, to no avail....

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## TastyWheat

The NRA gave Ron a "B" rating, likely because of his opposition to caps on gun manufacturer lawsuits. Pretty lame excuse.

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## Nirvikalpa

Gun Owners of America, and the JPFO.

My father received a 'ballot' from the NRA of who he is choosing for president probably a good month or two ago, and there was Obama, Clinton, Huckabee, McCain, but no Ron Paul.

http://www.keepandbeararms.com/infor....asp?CatID=175

*However*, the NRA is larger and everyone knows who they are.

I know I am probably going to be *bashed* for this, but the *Jews for the Perservation of Firearms Ownership* (http://www.jpfo.org) are a bunch of crazy gun lovers (NOT ALL JEWISH - I'm not) and have a lot of useful tactics... and they're fiercly against Jews that are anti-gun... and they're also against the UN.  Only two things you have to support to join: the Constitution and the Bill of Rights.

They also have killer posters, and even a coloring book for the kiddies   I would really suggest giving them a look as well.

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## LibertyEagle

> I know I am probably going to be *bashed* for this, but the *Jews for the Perservation of Firearms Ownership* (http://www.jpfo.org) are a bunch of crazy gun lovers (NOT ALL JEWISH - I'm not) and have a lot of useful tactics... and they're fiercly against Jews that are anti-gun... and they're also against the UN.  Only two things you have to support to join: the Constitution and the Bill of Rights.
> 
> They also have killer posters, and even a coloring book for the kiddies   I would really suggest giving them a look as well.


Why would you be bashed?  They ARE a great gun organization.

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## sluggo

GOA. No question.

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## nobody's_hero

I chose 'other' for a couple of reasons:

1) I think that both organizations have their moments, where they either fall short of my expectations, or greatly exceed them. As with any organization, bigger does not always mean better. I take note that bigger organizations tend to get clumsy, or even lazy. Likewise, smaller organizations may not have the "oomph" needed to drive the message home. 

2) I cannot tell you how to spend your money (or if you should, or if you shouldn't). You must do the research for yourself and decide what you will support. 

3) *Just because you may decide to donate, support for the 2nd Amendment does not stop there*. I have never donated to either the NRA or the GOA (I'm a college student with limited income, I just made my last donation to anything for a while [to BJ's campaign]), but I check regularly at my local gun & pawn's bulletin board to see if any rallies are planned. I went to the January 10th rally for the 2nd Amendment Protection Act here in GA (back when it was still HB915, not HB89), and I must say that making a physical presence is always just as powerful, if not more powerful, a message as donating cold, hard, cash. That was my first activist rally, and I was hooked.

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## rmodel65

im a member of the state group here in ga called georgia carry they are extremely proactive, and are a no compromise group

www.georgiacarry.org ftmfw

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## Primbs

www.vcdl.org

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## angelatc

> I went to the January 10th rally for the 2nd Amendment Protection Act here in GA (back when it was still HB915, not HB89), and I must say that making a physical presence is always just as powerful, if not more powerful, a message as donating cold, hard, cash.


Sigh.  If only that were true....

http://lfpress.ca/newsstand/Business...39946-sun.html

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## nobody's_hero

> Sigh.  If only that were true....
> 
> http://lfpress.ca/newsstand/Business...39946-sun.html


I read it. And I still stand by my comment. If nothing else, pointing that out has further substantiated my sentiments.

_Having a personal, physical presence sends just as powerful, if not more powerful, a message than writing a check to be spent on your behalf._

Do I _prefer_ violence? _No._ 

But instead of sighing, you should be breathing fire!

If South Koreans can _riot_ over something so trivial as beef (I know, it isn't trivial to them), why aren't Americans absolutely *infuriated* whenever _one of our clearly defined rights_ is boldly trumped?!

I dare say that South Koreans understand the concept of liberty better than the U.S. citizens, and, not to sound overly conceited, we once 'wrote the book' on it.

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## Chase

I'm a proud life member of the Gun Owners of America myself. In this fight, we need an organization that does not compromise, and GOA is just that organization.

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## youngbuck

GOA Life Member

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## ChickenHawk

Well, now we know why the NRA compromises so much. All the hard core no compromise types joined the GOA instead.

If you aren't a member of the NRA you have no influence on their policies so don't be surprised when they keep doing things you don't like. How many of you quit the NRA because they did something you don't like? Your part of the problem.

BTW, I voted both.

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## pacelli

absolutely g.o.a.

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## Dr.3D

LOL, I'm part of the problem huh?

When an organization becomes so large it fails to listen to it's members, it's time to get out of it and find another organization.

GOA is the other organization.
I'm a member of the GOA and darned proud of it.

I was a member of the NRA and even was working to do extra with the Second Amendment Task Force.

Seems like all they really did was ask me for money every few months and never once ask my opinion about anything concerning what was being done.

I even asked them who they were supporting for President of the United States and they wouldn't tell me that either.

This is why I left them and joined the GOA.

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## familydog

GOA is the way to go.

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## sidster

Great guys and gals!

Thanks for your input.  A bit more reading and talking to others
and your comments have convinced me to join the GOA!

Cheers!

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## MoneyWhereMyMouthIs2

Here's a board member of the NRA saying civilians should never have a weapon with more than 5 rounds.  

If you presently give money to the NRA, you might ever consider giving money to the NRA, *or if you even want to passively mention to people that you support the NRA, you need to see this video*.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=uSGySNLyACE

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## sidster

> Here's a board member of the NRA saying civilians should never have a weapon with more than 5 rounds.  
> 
> If you presently give money to the NRA, you might ever consider giving money to the NRA, *or if you even want to passively mention to people that you support the NRA, you need to see this video*.
> 
> http://youtube.com/watch?v=uSGySNLyACE


love this guys comment on the youtube vid:




> 5 rounds!? What a douche, maybe we should only have the freedom of speech for 5 sentences. Or, maybe we should only have our 4th ammendment rights for 5 days a year.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> $#@!ing ridiculous

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## Peace&Freedom

At the NY LP convention this spring, I asked Bob Barr (an NRA board member) if the NRA would endorse him if he became the LP nominee. He said no, without hesitation. So what would it take? Was there anyway for the group to back somebody for President who wasn't a Republican, I asked. He again said no, without hesitation.

Join the GOA.

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## youngbuck

> At the NY LP convention this spring, I asked Bob Barr (an NRA board member) if the NRA would endorse him if he became the LP nominee. He said no, without hesitation. So what would it take? Was there anyway for the group to back somebody for President who wasn't a Republican, I asked. He again said no, without hesitation.
> 
> Join the GOA.


Wow, truly ridiculous.  

It appears that the NRA has been infiltrated (perhaps from conception) and is operating as controlled opposition.

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## TruthisTreason

Goa  !!!!

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## JRegs85

*BOTH!!!*

I know that the GOA is more principled than the NRA, but...

if something happens on a national scale similar to Katrina in New Orleans, I want an organization with millions of members to put its foot down and stop gun confiscations. Give the NRA credit for that, they had a court injunction against the New Orleans confiscations within one day. GOA is nice, but the NRA is a good insurance against mass gun control.

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## ChickenHawk

> *BOTH!!!*
> 
> I know that the GOA is more principled than the NRA, but...
> 
> if something happens on a national scale similar to Katrina in New Orleans, I want an organization with millions of members to put its foot down and stop gun confiscations. Give the NRA credit for that, they had a court injunction against the New Orleans confiscations within one day. GOA is nice, but the NRA is a good insurance against mass gun control.


The irony is that the NRA is more effective because they are willing to compromise. The opposition doesn't really take GOA seriously because they don't compromise. Think about it, whose going to be willing to deal with an organization when they know full well they are going to be told it's "our way or the highway".  That being said, it's kinda tough to go along with compromise when you are talking about an inalienable right.

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## Inflation

N.r.a. Is co-opted by the powers that be.

G.o.a. All the way.

J.p.f.o. Is good too.

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## FindLiberty

Right on Inflation.  


> N.r.a. Is co-opted by the powers that be. G.o.a. All the way. J.p.f.o. Is good too.


I also like the Vin Suprynowicz take on the NRA in his "Send in the Waco Killers" book.
He calls 'em "America's largest gun control organization" 'cause they
always compromise and give ground to the gun grabbers.

http://www.reviewjournal.com/cgi-bin.../16231491.html

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## Kalifornia

> Why would you be bashed?  They ARE a great gun organization.


Nothing wrong with Jews anymore than there is something wrong with the Irish. 

People who put the welfare of Israel ahead of the welfare of the U.S., I am suspect about, regardless of their ethnicity or religion.  While there is some crossover, I see one as an ethnic group, the other as a philosophy.

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## krazy kaju

Meh, it's all about the GOA and the JPFO.

The NRA is unprincipled.

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## Danke

> Meh, it's all about the GOA and the JPFO.
> 
> The NRA is unprincipled.


I too quit the NRA a few years ago and joined the GOA.  But it is kinda like RP sticking with the GOP vs. Libertarian party and trying to change an already large and powerful organization.

I can see the merits of those who stick with the NRA.   Not too long, host Alex Jones (supporting GOA) challenged his guess Ted Nugent about his involvement with the NRA.  Ted basically said that is why he is sticking with the NRA.  Established, big and influential Org.

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## porcupine

Here's the deal.  The NRA is the most effective pro-gun lobbying/political organization.  They've got TONS of resources, over 4 million members and are able to get headlines almost at will.  They have respect because people know they can kill legislation.  They're huge and effective, but to keep this mainstream effectiveness, they compromise at times.  However, their overall effect has been VERY GOOD.

GOA is hard line.  They are no compromise, and while the NRA has a conservative tinge to its message, the GOA is decidedly libertarian.  They don't have the respect, name recognition or cash that the NRA does.  They are great because they remind us all what the pure position is and, at times, I think they even keep the NRA in line.  Their overall effect has been VERY GOOD.

Both organizations rock.  That's my take.  We need both.  They both serve a different and necessary purpose.

It really irks me when people attack one organization or the other.  We're all working for the same thing.  Let's do it in our own way and throw the mud at the gun grabbers, not each other.

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## TruckinMike

> The NRA is the most effective pro-gun lobbying/political organization.


Thats subject to heavy debate..... I could also use that same argument for the Republican Party... will you be voting for McCain?

TMike

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## pacelli

NRA is the most effective junk mailing organization. They send me at least 2 free membership cards & plea for donations a week, and they both arrive on the same day.  

They don't seem to mind paying the return postage on them for the past 3 years either when I write on the envelope, "Not at this address, return to sender".

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## sluggo

* "[The NRA's] blessing is required for any bill that enforces or creates gun laws." -- Rep. Carolyn McCarthy, July 27, 2007*

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## porcupine

> Thats subject to heavy debate..... I could also use that same argument for the Republican Party... will you be voting for McCain?
> 
> TMike


No. 




> NRA is the most effective junk mailing organization.



That's why they have a ton of money and use it very, very effectively.  Most of the good they do is done at the state level.  30 years ago, gun owners weren't a political force, even though they were a majority.  Now they are.  There's a reason Obama is pandering to us.

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## Godfather89

As long as their is someone to defend the second amendment, I vote both!

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## TruckinMike

The NRA claimed -- "Huge Victory" in the Heller case...

BUT.....

http://www.wusa9.com/news/local/stor...4036&catid=158




> WASHINGTON (WUSA) -- District residents can start registering their guns today. But at least one very high profile application was already rejected.
> 
> Dick Heller is the man who brought the lawsuit against the District's 32-year-old ban on handguns. He was among the first in line Thursday morning to apply for a handgun permit.
> 
> But when he tried to register his semi-automatic weapon, he says he was rejected. He says his gun has seven bullet clip. Heller says the City Council legislation allows weapons with fewer than eleven bullets in the clip. A spokesman for the DC Police says the gun was a bottom-loading weapon, and according to their interpretation, all bottom-loading guns are outlawed because they are grouped with machine guns.
> 
> Besides obtaining paperwork to buy new handguns, residents also can register firearms they've had illegally under a 180-day amnesty period.
> 
> Though residents will be allowed to begin applying for handgun permits, city officials have said the entire process could take weeks or months.


TMike

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## 2ndAmendmentWarrior

I know I am a little late with this post, but after my friend asked which group I would recommend him joining, and me promptly saying NRA, I looked online to check what others were saying.

I am currently a member of both.  That being said, if I could only choose one, it would be hands down, the NRA.

There is no pro-gun group out there like the NRA.  The file lawsuits, get injunctions, influence elections and have Washington's ears.  I am tired of hearing that the GOA is, "no compromise".  First off, the GOA can't yet afford to be no compromise.  They need to appeal to the base of gun owners and an in-your-face style, with an image of doing whatever it takes to appease the base, is the best way to grow in numbers.  

The fact is, that although the NRA has taken stances that everyone disagrees with, pro-gun or not, the NRA has done far more good for gun owners than bad.  The NRA is the primary reason that gun ownership is not a thing of the past.  The NRA was front and center in providing concealed carry in 48 states.  The NRA took the lead in the New Orleans fiasco, and was instrumental in haulting the San Francisco ban.  

I also disagree with those who claim the NRA almost dismantled DC vs Heller.  If, yes, IF the Supreme Court handed down an opinion that gun ownership was not an individual right, then there would be state after state banning individual ownership already.  The NRA being strategic in the battles it fights, is not the same as "compromising".  

Again, I am a GOA member, don their logo on my hat, and enlist others to their cause (our cause), however, they have to gain a lot more people, a lot more resources, and a lot more notoriety in DC and state capitols in order to be as effective as the NRA.

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## LibertyEagle

The NRA sold out long ago.
*
Gun Owners' of Ameri**ca* and *Jews for the Preservation of Firearms*, are the only true national level 2nd Amendment organizations in existence today.

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## LibertyEagle

> Again, I am a GOA member, don their logo on my hat, and enlist others to their cause (our cause), however, they have to gain a lot more people, a lot more resources, and a lot more notoriety in DC and state capitols in order to be as effective as the NRA.


Effective?  Do you consider advocating gun locks, amongst other things, effective?  I don't.  I guess it all depends upon what you consider "effective" to mean.  If someone is pushing anti-gun types of actions, I don't particularly want them to be good at getting the legislation passed.  Do you?

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## 2ndAmendmentWarrior

The GOA spends most of their time bashing the NRA and everyone here seems to be falling for it.  The GOA had nothing to do with reconciling the New Orleans gun grab, nothing to do with Concealed carry, and instead of filing suits or getting results, they send press releases and emails.  The NRA is a much stronger force.  If the NRA was gone, GOA wouldnt survive, and certainly wouldn't be able to hold gun ownership together.

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## Danke

I was a member of the NRA for many years.  But what turned me off was their lack of promotion behind the 2nd Amendment as a protection against government.  The NRA emphasized hunting and self protection against common criminals as the reason for gun rights.

I hope GOA grows to where they are as influential.  But I hold out the possibility the NRA reforms itself.

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## Anti Federalist

> I also disagree with those who claim the NRA almost dismantled DC vs Heller.  If, yes, IF the Supreme Court handed down an opinion that gun ownership was not an individual right, then there would be state after state banning individual ownership already.  The NRA being strategic in the battles it fights, is not the same as "compromising".


I can't see what there is to disagree with?

The fact is NRA *did* try to de-rail Heller, back when it was Parker. (see article below) 

Why? Most likely because if Heller/Parker was a success, it would dwindle membership and dues rolls.

Now, it's all well and good that you are member of both, glad to see it.

But the fact of the matter is that *N*egogiate *R*ights *A*way has been more interested in fundraising and being part of the Washington, beltway power structure than it has been in being a non-compromising advocate of 2nd Amendment rights.

It (NRA) was also supportive of and instrumental in passing two of the most egregious assaults, at the federal level, of firearms rights, that being the National Firearms Act of 1934 and the Gun Control Act of 1968.

Battle of the ban

_Enter the National Rifle Association, a Hatch supporter (and vice versa), the organization most closely associated with vindicating gun owners' rights. Now it gets really convoluted, because the facts suggest that Hatch and the NRA are doing everything they can to prevent the Supreme Court from upholding the Second Amendment. Here's the untold story behind the Hatch bill: It was concocted by the NRA to head off a pending lawsuit, Parker v. District of Columbia, which challenges the D.C. gun ban on Second Amendment grounds.

In February, joined by two other attorneys, we filed the Parker case, a civil lawsuit in federal court on behalf of six D.C. residents who want to be able to defend themselves with a handgun in their own homes. When we informed the NRA of our intent, we were advised to abandon the effort. Surprisingly, the expressed reason was that the case was too good. It could succeed in the lower courts then move up to the Supreme Court where, according to the NRA, it might receive a hostile reception._ 

_Despite that risk, the NRA seems determined to derail our case. Nearly two months after we filed our lawsuit, the NRA filed a copycat suit on behalf of five D.C. residents and moved to consolidate its case with ours. Both suits challenged the same regulations, asked the same relief, and raised the same Second Amendment arguments. But the NRA included several unrelated constitutional and statutory counts, each of which would prolong and complicate our case and give the court a path around the Second Amendment.

Worse still, the NRA sued not only the District of Columbia but also Ashcroft, presumably because the Justice Department prosecutes felonies in D.C. Yet no NRA plaintiff is at risk of a felony prosecution. Joining Ashcroft simply adds months to the litigation so the court can decide whether he is a proper defendant. Regrettably, we now have two suits, one of which is unnecessary and counterproductive. 

Thankfully, on July 8, federal judge Emmet Sullivan, wishing "to avoid any protracted delay in the resolution of the merits in either case," denied the NRA's motion to consolidate. That means the NRA failed in its attempt to control the legal strategy. Just one week later, Sen. Hatch introduced his bill. The timing is suspicious, to say the least. If enacted, Hatch's D.C. Personal Protection Act could result in the dismissal of our lawsuit. After all, plaintiffs cannot challenge a law that no longer exists._

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## Danke

Couldn't say it better:

http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...675&pr=goog-sl

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## 2ndAmendmentWarrior

I see we will continue to disagree.  I encourage everyone to join both the NRA and GOA.  Also, the 2nd Amendment Foundation wouldn't be bad either, or your state organizations.  The more people working on behalf of gun rights the better - and that's the bottom line.

I will not be giving up my memberships anytime soon, and will continue to do my part in bringing more members to both the NRA and GOA.

I respect Ron Paul's opinion on the GOA, but I am willing to bet that if you asked him the more important question, "Which gun organization is more effective", he would say NRA.  I would bet that NRA would also be his answer to, "Which organization has done more for gun owners".  

The more NRA members, the better.  The more GOA members, the better.  I personally feel that the GOA has a lot to do with the divide in Gun Rights people, and that is the worst thing that could happen.

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## CurtisLow

Gun Owners of America 4TW.

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## Pericles

Which of the two organizations supports my right to own automatic weapons and machine guns without registering them with the Feds?

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## american.swan

> I dare say that South Koreans understand the concept of liberty better than the U.S. citizens, and, not to sound overly conceited, we once 'wrote the book' on it.


As someone who lives in South Korea, I don't think Koreans exactly grasp liberty very well.

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## 2ndAmendmentWarrior

No country that bans guns from its citizens cares a shred more about liberty than the United States.  That country does not trust its citizens, and therefore, the citizens will always be reliant on the government.  In order to understand liberty, one has to know what liberty is.  South Korea's laws concerning guns are as strict as they get.  

People is South Korea can throw stones at Americans and their gun ownership.  But South Korea, like many other nations banning guns, have been protected in the past, and currently (South Korea included) by the United States - the country that first enacted liberty and gave it to their citizens to control their government and protect themselves.

Without the United States military, which fights for every amendment, including the second, all over the world and as a force of tens of thousands in the Korean demilitirzed zone, South Korea might be rethinking the idea of letting its citizens protect themselves from their government (or their neighbors).  

I really don't care who thinks that we don't need guns.  I don't care if some big-mouthed senator from California, "wants to go door to door and take them away".  I don't care if some self imporant senator from New York thinks that guns are, "the single greatest threat to American life".  I don't care if my own senator from Illinois voted to allow the UN to dictate our firearms policies.  MY RIGHTS are not theirs to take away.  The Bill of Rights is non-negotiable.  They are protections that nobody can take away.  If Koreans were to obtain the rights we enjoy, they might realize that this whole time, they didnt quite understand true liberty the way they thought they did.

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## xd9fan

I'm a lifemember of both.....BUT

where the NRA is the 800lb Gorillia......the GOA is the 80lb hyperactive Chimp


you need both (just as long as the NRA knows what it is fighting for.......they are not risk takers like they used to be)

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## SWATH

What is wrong with this picture?

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## xd9fan

They all lost the race

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## gls

> They all lost the race


Ummm...actually it's that they included every Republican canididate (plus Richardson!) except for Ron Paul. You can't really blame them, though, since Ron Paul would've exposed them as the sellout gungrabbers they are. If you send money to the NRA you might as well be sending it to the Bradey Campaign...they're controlled by the same people.

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## 2ndAmendmentWarrior

> Ummm...actually it's that they included every Republican canididate (plus Richardson!) except for Ron Paul. You can't really blame them, though, since Ron Paul would've exposed them as the sellout gungrabbers they are. If you send money to the NRA you might as well be sending it to the Bradey Campaign...they're controlled by the same people.


It is almost hilarious how this new kids on the block network known as the GOA does NOTHING for gun rights except bashes the NRA.  It has no power, and has been holding on to Ron Paul's words as its only form of legitimacy.   There are so many fools that buy into this garbage.  The president of the GOA had a strategic plan - "defame the NRA, disrupt gun rights, and peel away the NRA members.  We will continue with this war of attrition until the members join us and we proclaim ourselves the stop-at-nothing totality of pro-gun lobbying."  It's a joke.  The GOA has done more to damage gun rights than the NRA.  How?  It attacks the most powerful organization for gun rights, the NRA, and causes an uproar amongst pro-gun citizens.  If the GOA doesn't straighten itself out - I will end up canceling my memberships and get about 10 others to do it as well.  Let's get serious about gun rights and start supporting all pro-gun groups.  Enough of this in-fighting.  If we want to make a serious effort at combating this ridiculous congress and president, lets all work in tandem.

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## Danke

> It is almost hilarious how this new kids on the block network known as the GOA does NOTHING for gun rights except bashes the NRA.


Wiki excerpts:

"Gun Owners of America (GOA) is the second largest gun rights organization in the United States with over 300,000 members to date. Formed in 1975, they have been described by Congressman Ron Paul as "The only no-compromise gun lobby in Washington." 

GOA's executive director is Larry Pratt, who also hosts GOA's audio webcast, Live Fire.

n 2004, GOA spent over $1.75 million lobbying the U.S. Congress. Between 1998-2004, GOA spent over $18 million lobbying Congress.[8] GOA's Federal Political Action Committee is "Gun Owners of America Inc. Political Victory Fund" (C00278101).[9] It raises funds to support the election of pro-gun candidates at all levels of government.

GOA victories

GOA got a huge victory on June 26, 2008, when the U.S. Supreme Court rendered a decision in the case of DC vs. Heller. They ruled in favor of plaintiff Dick Heller, which struck down the Washington, D.C. handgun ban. This gave the plaintiff Dick Heller the ability to now apply for a handgun license while living in Washington DC. The ruling also took out any restrictions on forcing guns to have trigger locks on them; citing that "self defense is a protected right envisioned by the [2nd] amendment."

On June 6, 1995, GOA successfully helped in lobbying the House of Representatives to vote against the Moran Amendment, by a vote of 278 to 149. The Amendment would have banned .50 caliber weaponry from being licensed for export.

On July 13, 2006, The Senator David Vitter (R-LA) got a sweeping victory by a vote of 84-16. His amendments declares that no federal money can be used for federal agents to confiscate weapons during a declared state of emergency. This bill was passed not even a year after the devastation in Vitter's home state from Hurricane Katrina. The GOA consider this a sizable win for pro-gun activists.

On June 27, 2007, GOA recorded a victory by getting the Pence Amendment passed. The bill, named after Rep. Mike Pence (R-IN), was passed by a vote of 309-115. According to GOA the amendment would have allowed the Federal Communications Commission (FCC) to radically limit the speech allowed by organizations like GOA over the airwaves.

On August 9, 2007, GOA received another huge win in congress. Sen. Vitter once again pushed through a bill stating that no US funds can be used by the United Nations or any group affiliated with the United Nations to restrict or tax the 2nd Amendment rights. If they attempt to do so, the US can rightfully pull out all of their funds from the organization. This bill, HR-2764, passed with a staggering 81-10 vote.

On February 25, 2008, Sen. Jim DeMint (R-SC) amended bill S-1200, The Indian Health Care Improvement Act. In the Act, the wording stated that the funds were to be used for "violence prevention". Once the funds were attempted to be used for gun buy-backs and other such anti-firearm policies, Sen. DeMint pushed through an amendment to the Act stating that the money cannot be used for any anti-gun programs. The bill passed by a margin of 78-11."

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## 2ndAmendmentWarrior

> What is wrong with this picture?


That doesn't appear to be an article of endorsement.  Did Ron Paul seek NRA Support?

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## SWATH

A friend of mine actually questioned Wayne La Pierre and some of his periphery about why they seem to be hostile towards Ron Paul (who I believe does not actively seek the support of any organization).  Their reply indicated that they have a genuine disdain for him and will not be endorsing him or his policies.  One of the the NRA lawyers he spoke with actually accused Ron Paul of being anti-2nd amendment and against the NRA.   Ok, I might agree with the second part.

They also give him a luke warm pro-2nd amendment grade while giving others better grades like Thompson and if I recall Richardson who is a Democrat.  The NRA (as an organization) does not seem to like Ron Paul.  I mean they list every Republican candidate, even the blatant anti-2nd amendment ones like Giuliani and McCain, then as if to add insult to injury list a Democrat over Ron Paul, the most pro-2nd amendment candidate the Republican party ever saw, who I might add just out raised every single other Republican in donations during the previous quarter.

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## 2ndAmendmentWarrior

Ron Paul probably wasn't listed on the flyer because, as the flyer states, its purpose was to showcase the canidates seeking NRA support.  If Ron Paul didn't seek it, as you seem to believe, then that would explain why he wasn't on there.

I don't think the NRA is unfair to Ron Paul.  In their 2008 Endorsement Roster, Ron Paul received an A-.  

http://www.nrapvf.org/ELECTIONS/Stat...EPRESENTATIVES 

Now, the minus may or may not be unfair, based on his stances compared to the NRA's.  The didn't endorse presidential candidates until after the primaries, which, in that case, the obvious nod would go to the McCain/Palin ticket.

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## Crosstimbers Okie

"Other" was my choice.

The Second Amendment Foundation was not mentioned: http://www.saf.org/ .

I support the NRA, GOA, and SAF. None are perfect, but you use the tools you have to accomplish your goals. Some tools are better suited for certain tasks and circumstances than others. One size does not fit all.

Power and politics are real. If the perfect is allowed to become the enemy of the good, then the battle is lost. All that will remain are a bunch of dead, imprisoned, or politically impotent Libertarians and Second Amendment Activists. Utopian visions are great as an instrument to keep your eyes on your goals. But utopias don't exist for a reason.

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## sidster

> "Other" was my choice.
> 
> The Second Amendment Foundation was not mentioned: http://www.saf.org/ .
> 
> I support the NRA, GOA, and SAF. None are perfect, but you use the tools you have to accomplish your goals. Some tools are better suited for certain tasks and circumstances than others. One size does not fit all.
> 
> Power and politics are real. If the perfect is allowed to become the enemy of the good, then the battle is lost. All that will remain are a bunch of dead, imprisoned, or politically impotent Libertarians and Second Amendment Activists. Utopian visions are great as an instrument to keep your eyes on your goals. But utopias don't exist for a reason.



Do you mind commenting over on this thread?

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## Crosstimbers Okie

Done.

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## liberteebell

> www.vcdl.org


Yes indeed, VCDL rocks!  One of THE most organized and effective activist groups ever.  

GOA would be my choice for a national group.

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## xd9fan

I'm a benafactor member of the NRA....and I will tell you that the NRA's problems mirror the GOP's problems

Both need radical yet back to basic....help.

Both will not survive without out it.

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## CurtisLow

Join GOA today! http://gunowners.org/

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## Michael Landon

I voted for "other."  The other would be the JPFO.  When I joined the JPFO they sent me a HUGE package filled with all sorts of magazines, a book, a bunch of Grandpa Jack booklets and a bunch of other goodies.  When I joined the NRA I received a magazine subscription and a knife.  When I joined the GOA I received a newsletter.  

I would highly recommend joining all three.  It never hurts to have a say in all of their organizations.

- ML

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## Brooklyn Red Leg

> Which of the two organizations supports my right to own automatic weapons and machine guns without registering them with the Feds?


Good question, as I want to know the same thing. I want an organization that will not so much as utter a peep in objection to my going to my local gunshop and purchasing an FN/FAL M249 SAW light machinegun for the same price the Army buys them for without having to jump through 10,000 fiery hoops.

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## Angio333

I am a supporter of the NRA, GOA, JPFO, and my state based pro-gun organization.

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