# News & Current Events > U.S. Political News >  Police serving search warrant at home of pro-gun activist Adam Kokesh

## muzzled dogg

HERNDON, Va. -

FOX 5 has confirmed that U.S. Park Police along with Herndon Police are serving a search warrant at the home of Adam Kokesh, a pro-gun activist who was seen on a YouTube video posted on July 4th loading a shotgun in Freedom Plaza.

Roads have been blocked off near the area of the 1500 block of Snow Flake Court in Herndon and residents have been told to stay indoors while police serve the warrant.

In the video, Kokesh, a former Marine, appears to load red shells into a pump-action shotgun while addressing the camera in Freedom Plaza, which is U.S. parkland.

Kokesh said, "We will not be silent. We will not obey. We will not allow our government to destroy our humanity."

Kokesh has threatened to lead an armed march from Virginia into D.C. on the Fourth of July, but later backed away from the plan. At the end of the video, Kokesh hints it may happen in the future. As Kokesh loads shells in to the shotgun, he tells the camera: We are the final American revolution. See you next Independence Day."

D.C. Police Chief Lanier told us on July 4th, "You're allowed to have a rifle [or] shotgun registered for your home, if you're a D.C. resident and it's registered for the protection of your home. You can transport it through the District of Columbia as well. But there are rules for that transport. What [Kokesh] did [Thursday] morning, if in fact that was a real firearm [with] real ammunition, would be a violation of the law."

Read more: http://www.myfoxdc.com/story/2279926...#ixzz2YbftgD11
Follow us: @myfoxdc on Twitter | myfoxdc on Facebook

----------


## muzzled dogg

"All Detained at the house currently
flash banged and and door rammed"

----------


## Dr.3D

He may have been loading it with popper rounds.


Since those don't actually fire anything from the barrel, I wonder if they would be an exception.

----------


## muzzled dogg

Adam Kokesh arrested at home with his crew. Shield Mutual rolling into action.




> Shield Mutual is the agoras first defense agency. Our mission is to defend our customers from state aggression using, not armed patrols, but crowdsourced public relations, proactive leadership, digital fundraising, legal aid and the force of truth. Shield Mutual has, in just its first few years, met with incredible success for our customers. We can do the same for you.
> 
> In our now third evolution as a counter-economic agorist enterprise, we are expanding beyond a simple wait-and-watch posture to a proactive digital communications powerhouse. We are helping our customers build personal platforms. We are fomenting agorist trade. We are building the agorist community to new heights of prosperity and security. We have a long-term vision for achieving the agorist evolution. Support us. Get protected now from just $50 per year. http://ShieldMutual.com/join/

----------


## Reason

There is NO WAY for the police to prove that he was putting live rounds in, "snap caps"

----------


## kcchiefs6465

Flash banged huh.

$#@!ing $#@!s.

----------


## green73

updates please...

----------


## ClydeCoulter

> Flash banged huh.
> 
> $#@!ing $#@!s.


But, Kokesh has been so violent, so many cops hurt by him.  Do you think you will find a cop that will brave going up to his front door and serving a warrant face to face?  /sarc

+rep.

----------


## mad cow

I didn't know he lived in Herndon,I thought he was from Arizona.
Good luck,Adam!

----------


## angelatc

I hope they didn't shoot his dog.

----------


## green73

> "All Detained at the house currently
> flash banged and and door rammed"


I'm not on fedbook. cut and paste please.

----------


## green73

//

----------


## Dr.3D

Seems cops have forgotten how to knock on a door.   Best they can do anymore is break them down.

----------


## Keith and stuff

> Adam Kokesh arrested at home with his crew. Shield Mutual rolling into action.


It sounds like it isn't the first. For example, the Civil Disobedience Evolution Fund came before it. http://cdevolution.org/

----------


## muzzled dogg

http://isadamkokeshinjail.com/

----------


## muzzled dogg

> I'm not on fedbook. cut and paste please.


that's all the post said

i just linked to the post itself

----------


## muzzled dogg

Breaking: Adam Kokesh Home Raided by Feds

----------


## muzzled dogg

Adam Kokesh Arrested, Home Raided Over Open Carry YouTube Video

----------


## JK/SEA

This content is currently unavailable

The page you requested cannot be displayed right now. It may be temporarily unavailable, the link you clicked on may have expired, or you may not have permission to view this page.

----------


## muzzled dogg

> This content is currently unavailable
> 
> The page you requested cannot be displayed right now. It may be temporarily unavailable, the link you clicked on may have expired, or you may not have permission to view this page.


are you friends with https://www.facebook.com/adamcharleskokesh ?

----------


## kathy88

> I hope they didn't shoot his dog.


I asked. Baloo is okay, surprisingly.

----------


## Warrior_of_Freedom

> Seems cops have forgotten how to knock on a door.   Best they can do anymore is break them down.


Seriously. Is this the new way of serving a search warrant?

----------


## muzzled dogg

video here: http://www.nbcwashington.com/news/lo...214849071.html

----------


## SeanTX

> Seriously. Is this the new way of serving a search warrant?


Yes, along with "ordering" the neighbors to stay inside their houses, as if they are prisoners.

----------


## ObiRandKenobi

Too bad he called off the March. Were they going to arrest everyone?

----------


## fearthereaperx

He mentioned on Alex Jones that it was a real gun.

----------


## KEEF

So when does David Gregory get the police flash banging him?

----------


## muzzled dogg



----------


## kcchiefs6465

What's with the Park Police and their hard on for AK?

I don't understand why they are partaking in the raid or even are the ones investigating AK.

----------


## ghengis86

> 


Ah yes, the equal and impartial application of the law?

----------


## Henry Rogue

Maybe Adam will be our Gandhi, our Mandela.

----------


## QuickZ06

The government will bomb you, tax you to death, live above the laws they create. But you will not arm yourself in your own countries capital.

----------


## Deborah K

http://www.nbcwashington.com/news/lo...214849071.html

Video included.

----------


## randpaul2016

Free﻿ Adam Kokesh!!!

----------


## angelatc

> http://www.nbcwashington.com/news/lo...214849071.html
> 
> Video included.





> In the video, titled "Open Carry March on DC a Success," Kokesh looks directly into the camera as he loads bullets into a shotgun.


"Bullets in a shotgun?"  I'm not a gun person, but.....is that phrased right? Shouldn't it say shells?

----------


## Deborah K

> "Bullets in a shotgun?"  I'm not a gun person, but.....is that phrased right? Shouldn't it say shells?



hehe, yep. it should.  dummies.

----------


## BuddyRey

#FreeAdamKokesh !!!

----------


## AuH20

Looks like he got his wish. Sounds like 'the man' is hot on his trail. Stay tuned to this.

http://www.dailypaul.com/291954/adam...olice#comments

----------


## AuH20

His roommate just posted this on Kokesh's facebook:




> HOLY $#@!ING $#@!!!! So police raided our house with dudes looking like call of duty... $#@! was $#@!ed up!! Adam is in jail in Herndon, VA... This is $#@!ed up... More info to come. - Lucas

----------


## BuddyRey

How do we get this put up on Drudge?

----------


## AuH20

Who else is personally conflicted by Adam Kokesh? I honestly don't know if he's friend or foe.

----------


## kcchiefs6465

> Who else is personally conflicted by Adam Kokesh? I don't know if he's friend or foe.


What's his crime again?

----------


## AuH20

> What's his crime again?


No crime. I'm questioning some of his stunts in that they are so over-the-top that doubt starts to creep in the back of your head. You don't beat the leviathan by beating your head against a concrete wall. That's my opinion. Like they say, the quiet guy at the end of the bar who keeps to himself is the one to worry about, so to speak.

----------


## Deborah K

http://www.nbcwashington.com/news/lo...214849071.html

Video included.

----------


## kcchiefs6465

> No crime. I'm questioning some of his stunts in that they are so over-the-top that doubt starts to creep in the back of your head. You don't beat the leviathan by beating your head against a concrete wall. That's my opinion.


Maybe so.

I personally just don't understand much of the hate.

Here's a peaceful activist whose home was flash bang grenaded for the crime of what, supporting the Second Amendment?

It's clear the supposed "crime" he committed is bull$#@!. I just don't know why it seems many here would revel in his arrest or imprisonment.

----------


## Deborah K

> "I was here, and I loaded a shotgun on Independence Day, but I didn't kill anybody. I didn't drone any children," he said Monday. "I didn't steal any children's future. I didn't sell this country into debt. I didn't do any of the crimes that the man two blocks over at the White House is responsible for."


from NBC website

----------


## AuH20

> Maybe so.
> 
> I personally just don't understand much of the hate.
> 
> Here's a peaceful activist whose home was flash bang grenaded for the crime of what, supporting the Second Amendment?
> 
> It's clear the supposed "crime" he committed is bull$#@!. I just don't know why it seems many here would revel in his arrest or imprisonment.


I don't hate him. I actually donated money to his failed congressional campaign. I'm on the fence. I don't know what to think honestly. He could be an impatient, unstable patriot or a paid provocateur. I don't have enough info to formulate a solid hypothesis.

----------


## kcchiefs6465

Adam Kokesh makes some very good points.

----------


## Brian4Liberty

Adam Kokesh, Political Prisoner -Day 1.

----------


## jclay2

> No crime. I'm questioning some of his stunts in that they are so over-the-top that doubt starts to creep in the back of your head. You don't beat the leviathan by beating your head against a concrete wall. That's my opinion. Like they say, the quiet guy at the end of the bar who keeps to himself is the one to worry about, so to speak.


Yes, very over the top carrying a fire arm in emerika!

----------


## AuH20

> Yes, very over the top carrying a fire arm in emerika!


It's all his stunts as an entire portfolio. The Jefferson Memorial garbage, the alleged pot smoking in front of the White House fence. Why all the spectacle? Charles Dyer was fighting the beast in his own way and without all the fanfare. Needless to say the Feds made an example of him.

----------


## James Madison

Arrested for loading a gun on July 4th....

...in the military capital of the world.

Can we secede now?

----------


## Right Wing

> Who else is personally conflicted by Adam Kokesh? I honestly don't know if he's friend or foe.


It seems sometimes he doesn't pick his battles wisely.  For instance, the march on Washington was a good idea, but he got arrested twice within a month prior to the march which ended up getting cancelled.  One arrest was in Philadelphia at the marijuana rally and the second time was for smoking a joint outside the whitehouse.

----------


## anaconda

I don't see any point of a search. How can anything confiscated be authenticated as the firearm in the video?

----------


## JK/SEA

Adams the guy that yells FIRE when everyone else is asleep.

----------


## mad cow

> Who else is personally conflicted by Adam Kokesh? I honestly don't know if he's friend or foe.


We read about people here all the time victimized by the police state who we know absolutely nothing about.
It sounds like Adam Kokesh had his door busted in and he was arrested for a victimless crime for which he might serve five years in jail.

At this point,I don't care what his politics are,or his favorite football team or his zodiac sign,I'm his ally,just like I would be the ally of anybody else I knew nothing about who was arrested by the police-state for an Unconstitutional so-called crime involving a man exercising his God-given and Second Amendment recognized right to keep and bear arms.

----------


## devil21

Imagine if he had taken a 30 round magazine onto national tv!

Oh wait....

----------


## CPUd

> I don't see any point of a search. How can anything confiscated be authenticated as the firearm in the video?


It probably can't.  I suspect they got the warrant based on the video and him having the same model registered.  If they found it there, and he indeed has it registered, they will use it as evidence along with the video to try to make their case.  Still a weak case, especially if they find unedited video and popper shells there too.

----------


## QuickZ06

> Imagine if he had taken a 30 round magazine onto national tv!
> 
> Oh wait....


DUDE that is clearly a clip......


*sarcasm*

----------


## QuickZ06

So where are all the folks at that said the video he made was stupid? Seems to be working pretty damn good right about now, I think they got the message quite clearly.

----------


## mrsat_98

Considering all the fake video we have had opportunity to watch, i.e. all of 911, Boston Bombing, Sandy Hook, etc. Maybe it would be fun to get upload multiple fake videos of armed people all over DC.

----------


## kathy88

> Considering all the fake video we have had opportunity to watch, i.e. all of 911, Boston Bombing, Sandy Hook, etc. Maybe it would be fun to get upload multiple fake videos of armed people all over DC.


THIS is an excellent idea. Clip them all together like the Lib celebrities in those awful anti gun videos. One person after another loading up in front of DC landmarks....

----------


## luctor-et-emergo

> THIS is an excellent idea. Clip them all together like the Lib celebrities in those awful anti gun videos. One person after another loading up in front of DC landmarks....


Green screen ? Who would want to volunteer for that ?

----------


## QuickZ06

No matter what your opinion of him is, he was their on the 4th exercising the rights that are suppose to exists in a free country. So for anyone who sat around and ate BBQ or drank beer on the 4th, how about we stop the bashing and learn a thing or two.

----------


## Working Poor

I feel that Adam is not really helping anything at all.

----------


## presence

http://washington.cbslocal.com/2013/...hotgun-in-d-c/
http://www.wusa9.com/news/article/26...-Activist-Home
http://www.wtop.com/149/3384202/Adam...ted-in-Herndon
http://www.nbcwashington.com/news/lo...214849071.html
http://www.cnn.com/2013/07/10/us/dc-...rch/index.html
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2013/07/10...t-adam-kokesh/
http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/...d39_story.html
http://www.myfoxdc.com/story/2279926...st-adam-kokesh
http://www.wjla.com/articles/2013/07...esh-91171.html
http://livewire.talkingpointsmemo.co...okesh-arrested
http://inthecapital.streetwise.co/20...kesh-arrested/
http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2013/07/1...drugs-charges/
http://www.wusa9.com/news/article/26...-Activist-Home




> Broke on:             July 10th 2013
>             by:            bmdub904
>             Filed under:                Blog 
> 
> *FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE:
>  AVTM Official Press Release*
> *RE: Raid on ADAM VS THE MAN Studios 10JUL13*
> 
> 
> ...


http://adamvstheman.com/







> Kokesh also appeared as a guest on Infowars Nightly News with Alex Jones just hours before the raid.








> What we are looking for is an evolution towards self government...
> []
> ...a voluntary peaceful society




http://www.infowars.com/adam-kokesh-...-trooper-cops/




"media"  (propaganda arm) on the scene *during* the raid seen in video at bottom:


http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2013/07/1...drugs-charges/

----------


## better-dead-than-fed

> I feel that Adam is not really helping anything at all.


How are you helping anything at all?

----------


## thoughtomator

I live not far from where Kokesh is being held. If there's anything I can do to help, contact me.

----------


## presence

//

----------


## Cap

This can be used to our benefit. The state is over-reaching and most rational people will question their response. Adam just did the Constitution a favor.

----------


## better-dead-than-fed

> a court official says that Kokesh refused to appear before a judge


http://www.wjla.com/articles/2013/07...esh-91171.html

This strikes me as odd, because when I was in U.S. Marshals custody, there was no option of refusing to appear before a judge. If they had to use pepper spray and restraints to get you into the court room, they were happy to.

----------


## Cap

Up on Drudge.

----------


## green73

> How do we get this put up on Drudge?



http://www.drudgereportarchives.com/...okesh+arrested

http://www.drudgereportarchives.com/...h+bang+grenade

----------


## IDefendThePlatform

Kokesh's podcasts are thought provoking and well-thought out. I've got a lot of respect for him and for his willingness to put his beliefs in freedom and non-aggression into action. 

Most of the general population who will be turned off by the "omg he loaded a gun and that's illegal" stuff still need to be woken up to the reality of what government really is (the iniation of force). This is one more way to point out that fact and also draw attention to the absurdity of govt edicts. My only critique of this video was the seeming aggressivness of his language (talking about revolution while loading a gun). But I will keep subscribing and donating to his podcast.

----------


## presence

//

----------


## smithtg

I have often wondered that if you had a good blue screen and video editing software and did something like he did with the capitol in the background  (but were really in your living room) would the Feds raid you?  I don't think I am going to try, but it would be an interesting experiment to show how stupid the LE are and how overzealous as well.

It seems like the cops have arrested a lot of people for "online" behavior whether it be a facebook post, youtube video, video game chat etc and nowadays even a 'fake' or 'joke' is going to get you put in the cage

----------


## presence

// consolidating info

----------


## smithtg

the WP article

http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/...d39_story.html

make sure you make him a libertarian err I mean terrorist

_Police searched the Northern Virginia home of libertarian activist Adam Kokesh_ 

they put the word 'tyranny' in quotes too funny

_ He described the proposed event, in which he said participants would carry loaded guns across the Memorial Bridge from Arlington into Washington, as an act of civil disobedience against “tyranny.”_

dont forget to link him to Ron Paul to:

_In six years of headline-grabbing activism, Kokesh has embraced causes including peace in Iraq, free speech in the United States and the unsuccessful 2012 presidential candidacy of Ron Paul._ 

I suppose soon some of the neighbors will have filmed the raid and it will be on youtube.   Start looking.

----------


## presence



----------


## presence

> *Published on Jul  9, 2013*  
> 
> www.sovereigntactics.org
> Educating  these "statute" "police" enforcement officers on the REAL laws. No  victim No crime. Shout out to copblock.org, ademo freedom, clyde  freedom, Pete Eyre, and many others. Note, I should have said, "ALLEGED"  crime, but forgive me,  I was in court for 8 HOURS today with my  brother arguing with cops, sheriffs, court clerks, give a guy a break. I  know it was "alleged". but they understand my point!!!! Its been a long  day. Regardless. NO VICTIM, NO CRIME. FREE KOKESH
> 
> Adam Kokesh's home was raided tonight by Herndon Police & US Parks Police, details are still fuzzy.

----------


## Warlord

Faces 2 years in prison? Sheesh.  They will throw the book at him .

----------


## QuickZ06

> Faces 2 years in prison? Sheesh.  They will throw the book at him .


Why I thought you knew he was one of them.....change of heart?




> This guy is a provocateur.

----------


## presence

> Faces 2 years in prison? Sheesh.  They will throw the book at him .


I hope 10 men fill his shoes.

----------


## MoneyWhereMyMouthIs2

> Seriously. Is this the new way of serving a search warrant?






> Yes, along with "ordering" the neighbors to stay inside their houses, as if they are prisoners.



That last part seems to be the new way.  Breaking down doors by itself is old school.





> No crime. I'm questioning some of his stunts in that they are so over-the-top that doubt starts to creep in the back of your head. You don't beat the leviathan by beating your head against a concrete wall. That's my opinion. Like they say, the quiet guy at the end of the bar who keeps to himself is the one to worry about, so to speak.



He can be him and I'll be me.

----------


## AuH20

Adam is right in terms of principle, but in my humble opinion his stategy and tactics are severely lacking. 


BTW Did anyone else laugh out loud when reading this?

http://www.infowars.com/adam-kokesh-...-trooper-cops/



> *Kokesh’s supporters are urging people call the US Parks Police non-emergency number at (202) 619 7105 to demand Adam’s release “and that charges be placed on the individuals that committed a B&E, vandalism, destruction of property, theft, and kidnapped Adam at our home.”*


ROFL First, Kokesh makes the video with the explicit threat of armed rebellion and now his supporters suddenly want their superfluous "rights" restored? Really? Don't they know that we are basically under occupation?  I needed some levity to start off my day and I certainly got it.

----------


## Warlord

> Why I thought you knew he was one of them.....change of heart?


 Not sure... never 100% about these things.

----------


## JK/SEA

> Adam is right in terms of principle, but in my humble opinion his stategy and tactics are severely lacking. 
> 
> 
> BTW Did anyone else laugh out loud when reading this?
> 
> http://www.infowars.com/adam-kokesh-...-trooper-cops/
> 
> 
> ROFL First, Kokesh makes the video with the explicit threat of armed rebellion and now his supporters suddenly want their superfluous "rights" restored? Really? Don't they know that we are basically under occupation?  I needed some levity to start off my day and I certainly got it.



i'm glad you're amused.

I'll bet you'd laugh your a$$ off if Ron Paul himself got blacked bagged wouldn't ya?..eh?

effin drool donkey day today in RPF. $#@! all you Kokesh bashers. Gutless POS. All keyboard warriors and zero balls.

----------


## JK/SEA

> Not sure... never 100% about these things.


i'm sure. Whats your problem oh great and powerful warlord?

----------


## QuickZ06

> Not sure... never 100% about these things.


Why you gotta neg rep me, I have gave you plenty of +rep throughout the past. That is just not cool. So how about you cut me some slack and don't be such a cry baby because you put your foot in your mouth and it now backfired on you.

----------


## AuH20

> i'm glad you're amused.
> 
> I'll bet you'd laugh your a$$ off if Ron Paul himself got blacked bagged wouldn't ya?..eh?
> 
> effin drool donkey day today in RPF. $#@! all you Kokesh bashers. Gutless POS. All keyboard warriors and zero balls.


Start using your head and stop reacting emotionally. This has nothing do with illogical machisimo. Discretion is the better part of valor in some instances. Being locked up in a 7x7 cell does no one any good. There are many patriots on this site critical of Adam Kokesh willing to take the great dirt nap if the return is satisfactory. There is nothing satisfactory about fighting them when they essentially dictate the terms of engagement. Street activism and other stunts like this are pure theater, nothing more. I'm reminded of a few telling verse lines from the song Architecture of Aggression:

_
Born from the dark 
In the black cloak of night 
To envelop it's prey below 
Deliver to the light 

To eliminate your enemy 
Hit then in their sleep 
And when all is won and lost 
The spoils of war are yours to keep_ 

Ruminate on those words and calm down.

----------


## VoluntaryAmerican

local news always has the best coverage:
video at link.




> Adam Kokesh, the prominent libertarian activist and Internet show host, was due to appear in a Fairfax County courtroom Wednesday morning on drug and gun charges.
> 
> However, a court official says that Kokesh refused to appear before a judge, so authorities are trying to determine what their next step is. He may be arraigned in his cell or forced to appear in a courtroom on another date.
> 
> Kokesh's arrest came less than a week after he purportedly loaded and cocked a shotgun in Freedom Plaza. The July 4 incident was filmed and posted to YouTube.
> 
> Regardless of what happens Wednesday, Kokesh has an Oct. 2 preliminary hearing in a Fairfax County court.
> 
> The 31-year-old Iraq war veteran had his Herndon home searched by U.S. Park Police and Herndon Police officials on Tuesday night. He was then arrested on charges of drug possession and drug while possessing firearms.
> ...

----------


## QuickZ06

> Not sure... never 100% about these things.


And if you are not 100% it might be best to not say anything on the subject matter in this case. But I am all for free speech and this time it just did not work out for ya.

----------


## AuH20

I wonder if they attempted to video the incident and all materials were confiscated?

----------


## VoluntaryAmerican

Looks like Adam is going away for a few years. This $#@!ing sucks.

----------


## MelissaCato



----------


## Warlord

> And if you are not 100% it might be best to not say anything on the subject matter in this case. But I am all for free speech and this time it just did not work out for ya.


I agree. You certainly got me there hence why I wasn't happy.  Don't take it too personally. Normal human reaction. Check PM

----------


## AuH20

> *Looks like Adam is going away for a few years.* This $#@!ing sucks.


which does no one any good. He's book smart but not disciplined.

----------


## Warlord

> Looks like Adam is going away for a few years. This $#@!ing sucks.


It sure does.  I never know what to make of the guy but we can all agree this is harsh.

----------


## angelatc

> After hours of determined attempts, the safe was forced open and all items inside were confiscated.


 His roommate said they were expecting this. They would have been much better stashing the stuff in a storage unit or in the safe of a friend.

I wonder if they kicked down David Gregory's door when they searched his property and arrested him? Oh wait...

----------


## tod evans

> Looks like Adam is going away for a few years. This $#@!ing sucks.


Do you really think Adam is dumb enough to leave "evidence" just laying around for cops to find?

I don't know him at all but from what I've seen and heard him say he's well aware of police tactics.

----------


## VoluntaryAmerican

> Do you really think Adam is dumb enough to leave "evidence" just laying around for cops to find?
> 
> I don't know him at all but from what I've seen and heard him say he's well aware of police tactics.


So what the cops planted the drugs? Either way, looks like he's going to jail for a stretch. 

Adam has openly used drugs on his YouTube show, so it's not really hard for me to believe he had drugs at his house. If he wasn't expecting a search warrant over that video, it is very likely he did have drugs at his home.

----------


## JK/SEA

> which does no one any good. He's book smart but not disciplined.


Adam is no dummy. Perhaps you need to use your head and think about this. Adam is getting the powers that be, and the rest of the ignorant sheep a lesson in civil protest. I suppose many Kokesh bashers are relegated to just writing harshly worded letters, and phone calls to politicians who don't give a flying $#@! about what you or i think, and will use the power of their office to put their boot down on your neck while laughing all the while as they spend your tax money, pass new draconian laws, to shred the Constitution, to work towards that New World Order that we so desperatly need to control people like me.

I don't neg rep people as a rule, but.....those days maybe coming to an end. Too many shills, too many traitors, too many blind sheep. Time to draw that line.

----------


## AuH20

BTW it's not very hard to identify the interdiction team they sent. All that information is available if given some clues.

----------


## VoluntaryAmerican

> which does no one any good. He's book smart but not disciplined.


You can't really fault the man for living free. But I get what you're saying -- he took on the State so he would be wise to prepare accordingly.

----------


## AuH20

> Adam is no dummy. Perhaps you need to use your head and think about this. Adam is getting the powers that be, and the rest of the ignorant sheep a lesson in civil protest. I suppose many Kokesh bashers are relegated to just writing harshly worded letters, and phone calls to politicians who don't give a flying $#@! about what you or i think, and will use the power of their office to put their boot down on your neck while laughing all the while as they spend your tax money, pass new draconian laws, to shred the Constitution, to work towards that New World Order that we so desperatly need to control people like me.
> 
> I don't neg rep people as a rule, but.....those days maybe coming to an end. Too many shills, too many traitors, too many blind sheep. Time to draw that line.


I respectfully disagree. Showboat martyrs don't lessen the weight of the chains. The chains need to be cut and removed. I'll leave it at that.

----------


## green73

> Why you gotta neg rep me, I have gave you plenty of +rep throughout the past. That is just not cool. So how about you cut me some slack and don't be such a cry baby because you put your foot in your mouth and it now backfired on you.


What a jerk. Heres some rep to make up for it.

----------


## presence

> I respectfully disagree. Showboat martyrs don't lessen the weight of the chains. The chains need to be cut and removed. I'll leave it at that.


No... but they do put the chains on display.

----------


## angelatc

> Adam is no dummy. Perhaps you need to use your head and think about this. Adam is getting the powers that be, and the rest of the ignorant sheep a lesson in civil protest. I suppose many Kokesh bashers are relegated to just writing harshly worded letters, and phone calls to politicians who don't give a flying $#@! about what you or i think, and will use the power of their office to put their boot down on your neck while laughing all the while as they spend your tax money, pass new draconian laws, to shred the Constitution, to work towards that New World Order that we so desperatly need to control people like me.
> 
> I don't neg rep people as a rule, but.....those days maybe coming to an end. Too many shills, too many traitors, too many blind sheep. Time to draw that line.



i agree.  we need rebels more than we need principles at this point.

----------


## Todd

> I personally just don't understand much of the hate.
> 
> Here's a peaceful activist whose home was flash bang grenaded for the crime of what, supporting the Second Amendment?
> 
> It's clear the supposed "crime" he committed is bull$#@!. I just don't know why it seems many here would revel in his arrest or imprisonment.



What people clearly don't understand is that average "I hate guns" American or those on the fence, doesn't see Adam as a peaceful guy.  They see him loading a gun as an act of aggression and intimidation.    We know differently, but it's not so difficult if you understand the mindset.

----------


## JK/SEA

> I respectfully disagree. Showboat martyrs don't lessen the weight of the chains. The chains need to be cut and removed. I'll leave it at that.


Sure, you can disagree, but its clear to me, and most Patriots in RPF that you are on the wrong side of this issue.

Whats the definition of a true warrior and Patriot?.....

----------


## AuH20

> Sure, you can disagree, but its clear to me, and most Patriots in RPF that you are on the wrong side of this issue.
> 
> Whats the definition of a true warrior and Patriot?.....



"No bastard ever won a war by dying for his country. He won it by making the other poor dumb bastard die for his country."

George S. Patton

----------


## angelatc

> What people clearly don't understand is that average "I hate guns" American or those on the fence, doesn't see Adam as a peaceful guy.  They see him loading a gun as an act of aggression and intimidation.    We know differently, but it's not so difficult if you understand the mindset.



And the average peace loving middle class liberal didn't like the factions that were blowing crap up and burning stuff down.  Who got the power?

----------


## pcosmar

Sooner or later,, there is going to have to be a confrontation.

Nothing will change otherwise. Those that think that the Tyranny  is going to go away peacefully are deluded.

----------


## AuH20

> Sooner of later,, there is going to have to be a confrontation.
> 
> Nothing will change otherwise. Those that think that the Tyranny  is going to go away peacefully are deluded.


Prepare accordingly. Tyranny doesn't sleep. Nor does it relent. It needs to be ruthlessly destroyed or it will destroy you & your loved ones.

----------


## JK/SEA

> "No bastard ever won a war by dying for his country. He won it by making the other poor dumb bastard die for his country."
> 
> George S. Patton


out of context. Try again.

----------


## AuH20

> out of context. Try again.


Martyrs don't contribute to the effort since they have been "removed." You understand?

----------


## QuickZ06

> I agree. You certainly got me there hence why I wasn't happy.  Don't take it too personally. Normal human reaction. Check PM


All good Warlord.

----------


## Thor

> I feel that Adam is not really helping anything at all.





> http://washington.cbslocal.com/2013/...hotgun-in-d-c/
> http://www.wusa9.com/news/article/26...-Activist-Home
> http://www.wtop.com/149/3384202/Adam...ted-in-Herndon
> http://www.nbcwashington.com/news/lo...214849071.html
> http://www.cnn.com/2013/07/10/us/dc-...rch/index.html
> http://www.foxnews.com/us/2013/07/10...t-adam-kokesh/
> http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/...d39_story.html
> http://www.myfoxdc.com/story/2279926...st-adam-kokesh
> http://www.wjla.com/articles/2013/07...esh-91171.html
> ...


Making people aware of the tyranny all around them is working...  If you agree with the method, or disagree, is your right.  But to get media coverage is making more people aware.




> All press is good press. 
> 
> There is no such thing as
> bad press.
> 
> Bad press is better than no
> press.

----------


## pcosmar

Has he been alleged to have committed some crime in Virginia?

Who signed a search warrant for an alleged violation of an out of State city ordinance?

And how can any here even attempt to justify this (regardless of who it is)?

----------


## Deborah K

> Start using your head and stop reacting emotionally. This has nothing do with illogical machisimo. Discretion is the better part of valor in some instances. Being locked up in a 7x7 cell does no one any good. There are many patriots on this site critical of Adam Kokesh willing to take the great dirt nap if the return is satisfactory. There is nothing satisfactory about fighting them when they essentially dictate the terms of engagement. Street activism and other stunts like this are pure theater, nothing more. I'm reminded of a few telling verse lines from the song Architecture of Aggression:
> 
> _
> Born from the dark 
> In the black cloak of night 
> To envelop it's prey below 
> Deliver to the light 
> 
> To eliminate your enemy 
> ...


Maybe this will lead to highly publicized lawsuits (Heller).

----------


## AuH20

> Maybe this will lead to highly publicized lawsuits (Heller).


I doubt it. He's likely going to be squashed like a bug by the establishment, while the SPLC is going to have field day with this, especially the drug angle.

----------


## Thor

> Considering all the fake video we have had opportunity to watch, i.e. all of 911, Boston Bombing, Sandy Hook, etc. Maybe it would be fun to get upload multiple fake videos of armed people all over DC.





> THIS is an excellent idea. Clip them all together like the Lib celebrities in those awful anti gun videos. One person after another loading up in front of DC landmarks....





> Green screen ? Who would want to volunteer for that ?





> I have often wondered that if you had a good blue screen and video editing software and did something like he did with the capitol in the background  (but were really in your living room) would the Feds raid you?  I don't think I am going to try, but it would be an interesting experiment to show how stupid the LE are and how overzealous as well.
> 
> It seems like the cops have arrested a lot of people for "online" behavior whether it be a facebook post, youtube video, video game chat etc and nowadays even a 'fake' or 'joke' is going to get you put in the cage


I think this would be great.  The MSM spreads lies and propaganda regularly, and have even been caught red handed in their lies.

Why don't we start a counter propaganda machine, showing people breaking laws like loading guns in DC, but it is all phoney.  I mean, courts have ruled that the "news" is "entertainment" and does not have an obligation or requirement to tell the truth.  So green screen laws being broken everywhere, and see what the reaction is (and video the actual green screen acts for court, when the time comes.

So then the question will become, will they prosecute you for portraying the breaking of a law?  If so, Hollywood will be shut down.

Fun!

----------


## tod evans

> I think this would be great.  The MSM spreads lies and propaganda regularly, and have even been caught red handed in their lies.
> 
> Why don't we start a counter propaganda machine, showing people breaking laws like loading guns in DC, but it is all phoney.  I mean, courts have ruled that the "news" is "entertainment" and does not have an obligation or requirement to tell the truth.  So green screen laws being broken everywhere, and see what the reaction is (and video the actual green screen acts for court, when the time comes.
> 
> So then the question will become, will they prosecute you for portraying the breaking of a law?  If so, Hollywood will be shut down.
> 
> Fun!


There's law on the books that could easily be twisted to apply..

----------


## AuH20

> Has he been alleged to have committed some crime in Virginia?
> 
> Who signed a search warrant for an alleged violation of an out of State city ordinance?
> *
> And how can any here even attempt to justify this (regardless of who it is)?*


I don't think anyone is justifying it per se. It's more akin to watching a man jump into the manmade Siberian Tiger exhibit at your local zoo with shell steaks taped to his back. Their response was highly predictable. We all know that this is a predatory, ruthless criminal enterprise that thrives on force multipliers and intimidation. Nothing new was gleaned from this.

----------


## JK/SEA

> Martyrs don't contribute to the effort since they have been "removed." You understand?



'removed'?...

Yeah, MLK was removed as well. How did that work out?

----------


## AuH20

> 'removed'?...
> 
> Yeah, MLK was removed as well. How did that work out?


African-Americans transitioned to another form of slavery. Very little changed.

----------


## Thor

> There's law on the books that could easily be twisted to apply..


Which law, and how?  If the MSM can do it daily, and if Hollywood can do it....

----------


## pcosmar

> Nothing new was gleaned from this.


Oh.




Ok .

----------


## JK/SEA

> African-Americans transitioned to another form of slavery. Very little changed.


So martyrs don't contribute anything...mmmkay...

----------


## AuH20

> Oh.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ok .


Adam cowered on the floor while pleading for bathroom privileges. Not exactly William Wallace worthy. The question that needs to be asked? Did he think this through or does he secretly enjoy prison life?

----------


## tod evans

> Which law, and how?  If the MSM can do it daily, and if Hollywood can do it....


One specifically comes to mind, If you or I were to represent "fake" drugs to an undercover agent our sentence would be determined as if the fake drugs were real.

----------


## angelatc

> Adam cowered on the floor while asking for bathroom privileges. Not exactly William Wallace worthy. The question that needs to be asked? Did he think this through or does he secretly enjoy prison life?



cowered on the floor? you don't know adam.  

i think you're trolling now.

----------


## AuH20

> cowered on the floor? you don't know adam.  
> 
> i think you're trolling now.


Not trolling. Calling it for what it is as objectionable as it sounds.

----------


## angelatc

> Not trolling. Calling it for what it is as objectionable as it sounds.



He was handcuffed and seated where they told him to sit. 

You're trolling.

----------


## AuH20

> He was handcuffed and seated where they told him to sit. 
> 
> You're trolling.


And he proceeded to cry about not being able to use the toilet and then they kicked him. What did he think was going to happen when he made the video? A stretch limo was going to pick him up?

----------


## Reason

If you are interested in participating in a "call flood" call 202 619 7105 (The phone number Herndon Police gave us) and demand the release of Adam Kokesh and that charges be placed on the individuals that committed a B&E, vandalizism, distruction of property, theft, and kidnapped Adam at our home. Thank you and as always I will be keeping everyone up to date on info and releasing an official statement soon. All posts on this page will be from me. - Lucas

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE:

AVTM Official Press Release
RE: Raid on ADAM VS THE MAN Studios 10JUL13

(HERNDON, VA 10 JULY 2013)--- On the evening of Tuesday, 09JUL13, at approximately 7:45 PM, a combination of US Parks Police (an arm of the DHS) raided Adam Kokesh's residence. Local Herndon police assisted in the armed invasion. The officers used a battering ram to knock in the door after two knocks, and did not announce that they had a warrant. Immediately after breaking down the door, a flash bang grenade was deployed in the foyer.

Numerous police vehicles, including a light armored vehicle and two low-flying helicopters barricaded Adam's street. More than 20 armored SWAT team members surrounded the house, as well as a number of detectives, and plainclothes officers. Assault rifles were aimed on all members of the team as they were handcuffed without being told why they were detained. Masked and armored police in full “Storm Trooper” gear flooded in and ransacked the residence. The team was cordoned in a front room, while Adam was pulled aside for questioning.

Over the course of the next five hours, the police searched every corner of the house with canine units and blueprints to the house obtained prior to the search. All officers refused to speak to the crew while they we being detained. They confiscated cell phones and personal items with force. Throughout the ordeal, the police repeatedly showed a volatile desire to initiate aggressive, forceful conduct with detainees. At one point, Adam politely requested to use the restroom and was kicked by the officer forcing him to sit handcuffed on the floor. After hours of determined attempts, the safe was forced open and all items inside were confiscated. Adam was arrested and his crew were told he was being brought to the Herndon Police department overnight. Well after midnight, police officers cleared the house.

Fairfax County Adult Detention Center has stated that it has Adam in custody.

The ADAM VS THE MAN Team will be continuing production on the podcast and the Youtube channel as long as Adam remains imprisoned for an act of civil disobedience. We will continue to spread the message of liberty, self ownership, and the non-aggression principle regardless of the government's relentless attacks on our operation. We will continue to combat its desperate attempts to crush a worldwide, revolutionary shift in the people's understanding of the state's illegitimacy—after all, good ideas don't require force.

Media Contact: Lucas Jewell – lucas@adamvstheman.com

----------


## Thor

> One specifically comes to mind, If you or I were to represent "fake" drugs to an undercover agent our sentence would be determined as if the fake drugs were real.


But that is interacting and "fooling" an agent of the government, in person.  

Green screening something you put on YouTube is not interacting in person with an agent of the government.

And Hollywood has drugs in their movies all the time.

----------


## pcosmar

> One specifically comes to mind, If you or I were to represent "fake" drugs to an undercover agent our sentence would be determined as if the fake drugs were real.


Attempted sales of Imitation Controlled Substance

I know of a man convicted , for over 1600 years for such. (I typed up his records)

----------


## tod evans

> But that is interacting and "fooling" an agent of the government, in person.  
> 
> Green screening something you put on YouTube is not interacting in person with an agent of the government.
> 
> And Hollywood has drugs in their movies all the time.


Well go ahead I don't have the resources to fight an indictment just to poke sticks..

I know what these evil bastards are capable of, I won't tease them.

----------


## tod evans

> Attempted sales of Imitation Controlled Substance
> 
> I know of a man convicted , for over 1600 years for such. (I typed up his records)


_You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to pcosmar again._

Somebody help me out please

----------


## Deborah K

> And he proceeded to cry about not being able to use the toilet and then they kicked him. What did he think was going to happen? A stretch limo was going to pick him up?



You're not "personally conflicted" about anything.  




> Who else is personally conflicted by Adam Kokesh? I honestly don't know if he's friend or foe.

----------


## Brian4Liberty

The blatant and utter abuse of power and resources in this case is appalling. This was a excessive show of force, to enforce a political agenda, and to intimidate and punish political activism. This is such a violation of the spirit, intent and letter of the law that it is mind-boggling.

----------


## AuH20

> You're not "personally conflicted" about anything.


You're not really creating a false paradigm of "You're either with us or against us?" Let's be serious here. I agree with a majority of what Kokesh has stated in the past, but this is largely a "Dog bites man" story. Openly threaten the order of authoritarians in the heart of empire and we're suddenly surprised by their reaction? And then have some supporters asking for a redress of grievances when Adam started the ball rolling? Not many have read Sun Tzu I take it.

----------


## angelatc

Sorry if i missed this earlier in the thread, but it appears Adam has been charged with posession of 'shrooms. http://cavnews.wordpress.com/2013/07...nic-mushrooms/

----------


## Deborah K

> You're not really creating a false paradigm of "You're either with us or against us?" Let's be serious here. I agree with a majority of what Kokesh has stated in the past, but this is largely a "Dog bites man" story. Openly threaten the order of authoritarians in the heart of empire and we're suddenly surprised by their reaction? And then have some supporters asking for a redress of grievances when Adam started the ball rolling? Not many have read Sun Tzu I take it.


I'm not creating anything.  I'm calling a spade a spade.  You can have your opinion about Adam's methods until the cows come home, but don't pretend you're conflicted when clearly you're not.

----------


## angelatc

> You're not really creating a false paradigm of "You're either with us or against us?" Let's be serious here. I agree with a majority of what Kokesh has stated in the past, but this is largely a "Dog bites man" story. Openly threaten the order of authoritarians in the heart of empire and we're suddenly surprised by their reaction? And then have some supporters asking for a redress of grievances when Adam started the ball rolling? Not many have read Sun Tzu I take it.



look, you and i get along.    so take this in the spirit that it's intended.  we get it - you don't agree with civil disobedience.  we do, so that's just that.  there's no point in arguing about who is right and wrong - history will be the judge. 

you're not going to change anybody's mind, and neither are we.  only time will do that.

but hanging out in this thread, ragging on him and his tactic doesn't help accomplish anything.

----------


## tangent4ronpaul

Adam Kokesh has said he made the video in an act of civil disobedience.
http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/n...otgun/2504911/

Gun rights activist Adam Kokesh, who was shown in a video illegally loading a shotgun in downtown Washington on July 4th in a self-described act of civil disobedience, has been arrested at his Virginia home on state drug and weapons charges.

U.S. Park Police spokeswoman Lt. Pamela Smith said the former Marine was served with a warrant and arrested at his home in Herndon, Va., on Tuesday night.

Kokesh, who has mounted high-profile protests in the past, initially announced his arrest on his website.

"We were expecting this. We were expecting the government to raid our house," Darrell Young, Kokesh's roommate, tells WRC-TV.

The Washington Post, citing charging documents, reports that officers took Kokesh into custody for alleged possession of hallucinogenic mushrooms while also having a gun, which carries a minimum sentence of two years in prison.

WRC also said Kokesh had refused to leave his cell Wednesday morning for his arraignment.

U.S. Park Police Lt. Pamela Smith tells USA TODAY that the agency executed a search warrant at Kokesh's home and arrested him on state weapons and drug charges.

Smith declined to discuss the specifics of the federal warrant. Officials at the U.S. Park Police, which oversees Freedom Plaza in Washington where the video was made last week, said earlier that they were investigating the video incident.

Lt. Jim Moore of the Herndon, Va., police confirmed Kokesh's arrest to USA TODAY but said it was a federal operation and that his officers were only there to "hold the perimeter" and keep the street blocked.

He confirmed that Kokesh was arrested on federal charges related to narcotics possession and weapons violations linked to the video.

In its account of the arrest, Kokesh's website statement claims that officers did not announce they had a warrant, used a battering ram to knock down his door and employed a flash bang grenade in the foyer of his house.

The website also claims that numerous police vehicle, including a light-armored vehicle and two helicopters, were used to block the streets while 20 armored SWAT team members surrounded his house.

"At one point, Adam politely requested to use the restroom and was kicked by the officer forcing him to sit handcuffed on the floor," the statement said.

Moore said he had no details on the circumstances of Kokesh's arrest because his officers were not directly involved in taking him into custody. Kokesh was being held at the Fairfax County Adult Detention Center.

In the video, entitled "Open Carry March on DC A Success," which was posted on YouTube, Kokesh speaks directly into the camera while loading the weapon.

"We will not obey, we will not allow our government to destroy our humanity," he says."We are the final American revolution. See you next Independence Day.""

Kokesh told NBC4 News on Monday that he had indeed loaded the weapon with live ammo in the morning of July 4th in downtown Washington.

He said it did not make sense that he could have a gun on one side of the Potomac river, in Virginia, and not the other.

"I was ready to stand by my word, and I was ready to commit the civil disobedience that I had committed to," he said.

Kokesh had planned to lead a group of activists armed with weapons across the bridge from Virginia into Washington on July 4 but canceled the event, urging supporters instead to demonstrate at the state capitols.

-t

----------


## AuH20

> I'm not creating anything.  I'm calling a spade a spade.  You can have your opinion about Adam's methods until the cows come home, but don't pretend you're conflicted when clearly you're not.


Conflicted about his MOTIVES. The projected payoff doesn't pass the logic test.

----------


## AuH20

> look, you and i get along.    so take this in the spirit that it's intended.  we get it - you don't agree with civil disobedience.  we do, so that's just that.  there's no point in arguing about who is right and wrong - history will be the judge. 
> 
> you're not going to change anybody's mind, and neither are we.  only time will do that.
> 
> but hanging out in this thread, ragging on him and his tactic doesn't help accomplish anything.


I'll stop ragging on him. I thought he had vast potential at one time.

----------


## pcosmar

> Sorry if i missed this earlier in the thread, but it appears Adam has been charged with posession of 'shrooms. http://cavnews.wordpress.com/2013/07...nic-mushrooms/


I am expecting that even a novice halfwit lawyer could rip this to shreds in short order.

Will watch as it plays out.

----------


## Dr.3D

> Sorry if i missed this earlier in the thread, but it appears Adam has been charged with posession of 'shrooms. http://cavnews.wordpress.com/2013/07...nic-mushrooms/


And having a gun at the same time.   I guess the penalty is supposed to be worse if you have a weapon?

----------


## tod evans

> And having a gun at the same time.   I guess the penalty is supposed to be worse if you have a weapon?


Federal statute 924c applies for "using and/or carrying a firearm in the commission of a drug crime"....And believe me the interpretation of the statute is very loose depending on the prosecutor!

Anyway if convicted of 924c the mandatory minimum for a 1st offense is 60 months.

----------


## Deborah K

> Conflicted about his MOTIVES. The projected payoff doesn't pass the logic test.


Your $#@!-slinging personal opinions would prove otherwise.

I've known Adam since he first contacted me to speak at RevMarch when he found out I was looking for a vet to speak out against the war.  No one had ever heard of him before then.  He is a complicated individual who marches to his own beat.  I cringe at some of the things he says and does, but I respect his right to be who he is.  I know a lot of people hate him, and he brought most of it on himself because he doesn't feel the need to justify his beliefs, actions, or "motives".  You don't have to like him,  I care not one way or the other.  But don't pretend you're "conflicted" and then accuse him of cowardice.

----------


## Brian4Liberty

> I am expecting that even a novice halfwit lawyer could rip this to shreds in short order.
> 
> Will watch as it plays out.


Hopefully there are expert Constitutional lawyers out there who want to take this to the Supreme Court. Is there a lawyer out there who would take this pro-bono? NRA or any other guns rights organization willing to help?

----------


## pcosmar

I can't help but wonder,,

He knew they were coming,, and was expecting it.

Is it possible he set them up and the substance is nothing but an inert substitute,,meant to be found?
just random thoughts (and giggles)

But I suppose that with such an operation,, they would not take a chance on there being no drugs present,, and may provide their own "crime scene enhancement".

----------


## tod evans

> Hopefully there are expert Constitutional lawyers out there who want to take this to the Supreme Court. Is there a lawyer out there who would take this pro-bono? NRA or any other guns rights organization willing to help?


If "the court" granted certiorari it would take years..........Big "if".

----------


## angelatc

> And having a gun at the same time.   I guess the penalty is supposed to be worse if you have a weapon?


Oh you are probably right.  We all knew he had guns, so I wondered why they mentioned that. Now it makes sense.

----------


## angelatc

> Your $#@!-slinging personal opinions would prove otherwise.
> 
> I've known Adam since he first contacted me to speak at RevMarch when he found out I was looking for a vet to speak out against the war.  No one had ever heard of him before then.  He is a complicated individual who marches to his own beat.  I cringe at some of the things he says and does, but I respect his right to be who he is.  I know a lot of people hate him, and he brought most of it on himself because he doesn't feel the need to justify his beliefs, actions, or "motives".  You don't have to like him,  I care not one way or the other.  But don't pretend you're "conflicted" and then accuse him of cowardice.


yes, exactly.

----------


## Deborah K

QFT




> *James Oliver Deckard*: First they came for Adam Kokesh, and I didn't do anything because he was Adam Kokesh...


post from fascist book

----------


## AuH20

> Your $#@!-slinging personal opinions would prove otherwise.
> 
> I've known Adam since he first contacted me to speak at RevMarch when he found out I was looking for a vet to speak out against the war.  No one had ever heard of him before then.  He is a complicated individual who marches to his own beat.  I cringe at some of the things he says and does, but I respect his right to be who he is.  I know a lot of people hate him, and he brought most of it on himself because he doesn't feel the need to justify his beliefs, actions, or "motives".  You don't have to like him,  I care not one way or the other.  But don't pretend you're "conflicted" and then accuse him of cowardice.


I'm trying to put myself in his shoes and understand what he's trying to do. I have arrived at 4 possible scenarioes:

(1) He's mentally unstable and is spontaneously playing this out, since he's already "checked out" so to speak & wants to martyr himself. Hence the lack of any plan or preparations.
(2) In lieu of the Edward Snowden shockwaves, Adam wants to catapult himself to John Connor status as leader of the resistance, which would account for all the high profile stunts. He's always had a pretty big ego.
(3) He's fighting the best he can & the only way he knows how, albeit in a flawed manner
(4) he's a paid provacateur attempting to initiate a conflict at the government's time and choosing.

----------


## pcosmar

> I have arrived at 4 possible scenarioes:


All based on your own negative views.

----------


## Czolgosz

> I'm trying to put myself in his shoes and understand what he's trying to do. I have arrived at 4 possible scenarioes:
> 
> (1) He's mentally unstable and is spontaneously playing this out since he's mentally already thrown in the towel and wants to marty himself. Hence the lack of any plan or preparations.
> (2) In lieu of the Edward Snowden shockwaves, Adam wants to catapult himself to John Connor status as leader of the resistance. He's always had a pretty big ego.
> (3) He's fighting the best he can & the only way he knows how, albeit in a flawed manner
> (4) he's a paid provacateur attempting to initiate a conflict at the government's time and choosing.



Probably not #4, but the other 3 seem quite viable.

Calling off the armed marched really dampened my impression of him.  I thought he was the guy, but now I'm suspect.

----------


## presence

> I'm trying to put myself in his shoes and understand what he's trying to do. I have arrived at 4 possible scenarioes:
> 
> (1) He's mentally unstable and is spontaneously playing this out since he's mentally already thrown in the towel and wants to marty himself. Hence the lack of any plan or preparations.
> (2) In lieu of the Edward Snowden shockwaves, Adam wants to catapult himself to John Connor status as leader of the resistance. He's always had a pretty big ego.
> (3) He's fighting the best he can & the only way he knows how, albeit in a flawed manner
> (4) he's a paid provacateur attempting to initiate a conflict at the government's time and choosing.


(5) He's having a coming to Jesus moment w/ magic mushrooms
(6) He's angry and not going to take it any more
(7) Liberty Jihad

----------


## Deborah K

> I'm trying to put myself in his shoes and understand what he's trying to do. I have arrived at 4 possible scenarioes:
> 
> (1) He's mentally unstable and is spontaneously playing this out since he's mentally already thrown in the towel and wants to marty himself. Hence the lack of any plan or preparations.
> (2) In lieu of the Edward Snowden shockwaves, Adam wants to catapult himself to John Connor status as leader of the resistance. He's always had a pretty big ego.
> (3) He's fighting the best he can & the only way he knows how, albeit in a flawed manner
> (4) he's a paid provacateur attempting to initiate a conflict at the government's time and choosing.


How can he be a paid provocateur, etc. and a coward who shrivels up on the floor?  Does not compute.  If he's paid, why would he be afraid?

----------


## better-dead-than-fed

> Calling off the armed marched really dampened my impression of him.  I thought he was the guy, but now I'm suspect.


I do not understand. He did not stop anyone from open-carrying in D.C. on July 4.

----------


## Occam's Banana

> It's all his stunts as an entire portfolio. The Jefferson Memorial garbage, the alleged pot smoking in front of the White House fence. Why all the spectacle? Charles Dyer was fighting the beast in his own way and without all the fanfare. Needless to say the Feds made an example of him.


I have never heard of Charles Dyer. Hence, I have not been inspired or motivated by him (assuming I should or would be - as noted, I have no idea who he is or whether he is worthy of my admiration).

However, I have heard of (and am inspired and motivated by) Adam Kokesh. THAT is "why all the spectacle" ...




> which does no one any good. He's book smart but not disciplined.


By all means, please provide for us evidence of your superior acumen in "disciplined" socio-political activism.

I eagerly await the edification your example shall provide ... (N.B.: posting on Internet forums does not count)




> Martyrs don't contribute to the effort since they have been "removed." You understand?


 It is you who appears not to understand. Even granting that Kokesh has "martyred" himself (an assessment I am not yet prepared to make) ...

Martyrs contribute to "the effort" (whatever it might be) precisely because they have been "removed" - thereby inspiring others to action.

That is, after all, the defining characteristic of martyrs & martyrdom.




> [Adam Kokesh] strikes me as more of an anarchist.


I suspect he "strikes" you that way because he actually IS an anarchist.

----------


## AuH20

> *How can he be a paid provocateur, etc. and a coward who shrivels up on the floor?  Does not compute.  If he's paid, why would he be afraid?*


Generate sympathy and empathy in the face of the great power?

----------


## Occam's Banana

> Hopefully there are expert Constitutional lawyers out there who want to take this to the Supreme Court. Is there a lawyer out there who would take this pro-bono? NRA or any other guns rights organization willing to help?


The NRA would not touch Adam with a ten-foot pole. They haven't got sufficient spine, guts or principles ...

----------


## Deborah K

> The NRA would not touch Adam with a ten-foot pole. They haven't got sufficient spine, guts or principles ...



If memory serves, Heller reached out to them as well.  They did nothing.

----------


## smithtg

alex is interviewing adam's people right now  infowars.com/listen

----------


## Brian4Liberty

I see this as a Constitutional test case on the 2nd Amendment. The Police brought in the drug charges to muddy the waters. Hopefully those charges can be separated.

----------


## AuH20

Does anyone think I would be criticizing Adam Kokesh if he boobytrapped his home and rid himself of these unwelcome transgressors? I'd be writing songs about the man.

----------


## Brian4Liberty

> The NRA would not touch Adam with a ten-foot pole. They haven't got sufficient spine, guts or principles ...


Probably not. Who does?

----------


## Deborah K

> Generate sympathy and empathy in the face of the great power?


The same "great power" who is supposedly paying him to be a provocateur???  What would be the point?

----------


## CPUd

> The NRA would not touch Adam with a ten-foot pole. They haven't got sufficient spine, guts or principles ...


Particularly since he recently cut up his card on video.

----------


## AuH20

> The same "great power" who is supposedly paying him to be a provocateur???  What would be the point?


The average human reaction is too cower and play the role when the stormtroopers come. He would be selling the effect of a violent breakin.

----------


## Deborah K

> Does anyone think I would be criticizing Adam Kokesh if he boobytrapped his home and rid himself of these unwelcome transgressors? I'd be writing songs about the man.


My issue is not with your criticism, some of it is thought provoking.

----------


## Czolgosz

> I do not understand. He did not stop anyone from open-carrying in D.C. on July 4.


Perhaps I'm missing some details.  Did he, or did he not, back away from a march that he called for?

----------


## AuH20

> Perhaps I'm missing some details.  Did he, or did he not, back away from a march that he called for?


Nobody knows the exact details.

----------


## Deborah K

> The average human reaction is too cower and play the role when stormtroopers come. He would be selling the effect of a violent breakin.


Selling it to whom?  You stated before he'd be selling it to the very "power" he's working for.  And I still don't see the point of "selling the effect of a violent break-in" to tptb who are supposedly paying him to be a provocateur.

----------


## Occam's Banana

> Does anyone think I would be criticizing Adam Kokesh if he boobytrapped his home and rid himself of these unwelcome transgressors? I'd be writing songs about the man.


I thought you had no use for "martyrs" ...

----------


## AuH20

> I thought you had no use for "martyrs" ...


Not in blatant self-defense situations like these. Battering ram. Drawn rifles. Flash-bang grenades. Who would shed a tear for any of them? Seriously. Kokesh pumped a shotgun in a square and they send a specialized SWAT Team?

----------


## angelatc

> Does anyone think I would be criticizing Adam Kokesh if he boobytrapped his home and rid himself of these unwelcome transgressors? I'd be writing songs about the man.



But Adam will never be the guy drawing first blood, and that's a good thing.

----------


## Brian4Liberty

> Does anyone think I would be criticizing Adam Kokesh if he boobytrapped his home and rid himself of these unwelcome transgressors? I'd be writing songs about the man.


WTF?!  I'll be criticizing anyone doing that!

----------


## pcosmar

> I have never heard of Charles Dyer. Hence, I have not been inspired or motivated by him (assuming I should or would be - as noted, I have no idea who he is or whether he is worthy of my admiration).







He wore the mask originally because he was still active duty,, to protect his identity.

He has several inspirational videos.

----------


## AuH20

> WTF?!  I'll be criticizing anyone doing that!


They broke into his PROPERTY locked and loaded with the INTENT TO KILL if necessary. There is no innocence when you come to apprehend the man for some mock trial and possibly kill him and the other occupants.  Eff them! Let's take the Praetorian Guard worship out of the equation. Play with fire and you get burnt. In this country, you can't send a goon squad to destroy someone for exercising their 2nd amendment rights.

----------


## Czolgosz

> He wore the mask originally because he was still active duty,, to protect his identity.
> 
> He has several inspirational videos.




^ one of the few who I believe will answer the call.

----------


## better-dead-than-fed

> Openly threaten the order of authoritarians... And then have some supporters asking for a redress of grievances when Adam started the ball rolling?


Blaming the victim for exercising his constitutional rights, and further blaming supporters asking for a redress of grievances.




> Not many have read Sun Tzu I take it.


Which section of "Sun Tzu" do you mean?

----------


## AuH20

> ^ one of the few who I believe will answer the call.


If he is ever released from prison sadly.

----------


## tod evans

> I see this as a Constitutional test case on the 2nd Amendment. The Police brought in the drug charges to muddy the waters. Hopefully those charges can be separated.


Police work for prosecutors, the prosecutor in this case wanted drugs and guns in the same indictment....The likelihood of them being "separated" is slim to none.

I'd bet a cyber nickel that the indictment was written before the warrant was signed, but there's no way to prove that....

----------


## better-dead-than-fed

> WTF?!  I'll be criticizing anyone doing that!


why

----------


## better-dead-than-fed

> Perhaps I'm missing some details.  Did he, or did he not, back away from a march that he called for?


I do not know the details about his calling off the march; I did not keep up with the thread here about that. But here he is,

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-sAGG...ature=youtu.be

doing it on his own, taking all the risk on himself. Taking on heightened risk, because he was not accompanied by thousands of others to diffuse the government's aggression. He did not stop anyone from joining him, as far as I know.

----------


## Occam's Banana

> Not in blatant self-defense situations like these.


You have made little sense in this thread. Now you are making none at all.

You just told us that you would "be writing songs about the man" if the had aggressively resisted the stormtroopers (and likely getting himself aerated into a bloody red mist in the process). Yet you profess to have no use for martyrs "in blatant self-defense situations like these") ...

----------


## AuH20

> why


I don't think he wants to be sued. In all sincerity, I apologize for being so frank and drawing too much attention for my comments. But I'm really tired of the doublespeak. SWAT teams can't just run roughshod over citizens with lethal force and not consider this a gross violation of our former compact.

----------


## Occam's Banana

> SWAT teams can't just run roughshod over citizens with lethal force and not consider this a gross violation of our former compact.


They can and they do.

Bitching because someone (Adam Kokesh, in this instance) acknowledges this unfortunate fact of reality and seeks to engage in principled, high-profile civil disobedience (rather then getting himself uselessly "martyred" in a hail of bullets) is just ridiculous ...

----------


## AuH20

> You have made little sense in this thread. Now you are making none at all.
> 
> You just told us that you would "be writing songs about the man" if the had aggressively resisted the stormtroopers (and likely getting himself aerated into a bloody red mist in the process). Yet you profess to have no use for martyrs "in blatant self-defense situations like these") ...


I can't really explain myself as much as I'd like in this public forum. Let's just say that the ratio would have to be ideal.

----------


## pcosmar

> SWAT teams can't just run roughshod over citizens with lethal force and not consider this a gross violation of our former compact.


They consider it doing their job. 
Just following orders.

The same way cops violate rights as everyday routine.

----------


## Todd

> Sorry if i missed this earlier in the thread, but it appears Adam has been charged with posession of 'shrooms. http://cavnews.wordpress.com/2013/07...nic-mushrooms/


Hmm...  So was that listed on the search warrant as what they were looking for?

----------


## AuH20

> They consider it doing their job. 
> Just following orders.
> 
> The same way cops violate rights as everyday routine.


No SWAT teams for Jon Corzine for Grand Larceny squared by 2000. No SWAT teams for David Gregory. No SWAT Teams for Eric Holder. Is anyone starting to put 2+2 together?

----------


## pcosmar

> Hmm...  So was that listed on the search warrant as what they were looking for?


Most likely just the generic "drugs".

My point of curiosity is that "Park Police" from an out of state city,, got a warrant and served it.

This seems a violation of State Sovereignty.

----------


## tod evans

> No SWAT teams for Jon Corzine for Grand Larceny squared by 2000. No SWAT teams for David Gregory. No SWAT Teams for Eric Holder. Is anyone starting to put 2+2 together?


"Just-Us"....

----------


## Dr.3D

> Most likely just the generic "drugs".
> 
> My point of curiosity is that "Park Police" from an out of state city,, got a warrant and served it.
> 
> This seems a violation of State Sovereignty.


I don't know why, but every time I hear or see the words, "Park Police" I think of the "Church Police" in Monty Python.

----------


## AuH20

> "Just-Us"....


They broke the social contract. It no longer has any legitimacy.

----------


## Occam's Banana

> No SWAT teams for Jon Corzine for Grand Larceny squared by 2000. No SWAT teams for David Gregory. No SWAT Teams for Eric Holder. Is anyone starting to put 2+2 together?


Leviathan's enforcers serve the interests of the elites & their lackeys? No new news here.

But I fail to understand how deliberately setting oneself up to be murdered by the State's brute squad can be considered a productive form of resistance or activism ...

----------


## tod evans

> They broke the social contract. It no longer has any legitimacy.


I was never party to any "social contract"....

The closest I came was swearing to defend the constitution in the 70's while in boot camp...

I couldn't stomach being one of "them" back then and I just worked in the ER...

----------


## presence

> But I fail to understand how deliberately setting oneself up to be murdered by the State's brute squad can be considered a productive form of resistance or activism ...


Which is where I say Adam is all win.

Blatantly illegal but patently lawful.

----------


## AuH20

> I was never party to any "social contract"....
> 
> The closest I came was swearing to defend the constitution in the 70's while in boot camp...
> 
> I couldn't stomach being one of "them" back then and I just worked in the ER...


But the entire citizen/government relationship model was built upon the concept of the social contract or at least it was many many many moons ago. There is no contract any longer. It's basically a rape sentence. I withdraw my consent due to gross violations of the contract.

----------


## tod evans

> But the entire citizen/government relationship was built upon the concept of the social contract or at least it was many many many moons ago. There is no contract any longer. It's basically a rape sentence. I withdraw my consent due to gross violations of the contract.


Bend over and like it or it'll get worse...

----------


## AuH20

The bill of rights was the closest semblance to a contract and it's been perverted and outright nullified by sociopaths. Every amendment has been practically destroyed. I think many citizens are reasonable and don't expect ridiculous expressions of freedom which Robert Bork outlined, but the line has been crossed by MILES.

So why should anyone in their right mind kow-tow to these kevlar garbed brutes when they come for their pound of flesh? Sorry, bub but the contract has been annulled by your superiors. In other words, you're now an armed intruder in my house and I am within my inalienable rights to put you down like a rabid dog.

----------


## Dr.3D

> Bend over and like it or it'll get worse...


Ehhh, isn't that 'Lean Forward' and like it or it'll get worse....?

----------


## mczerone

Well, this thread kept me somewhat up to date on Kokesh, and expanded my ignore list a little. Thanks guys.

And I also realized that I might be un-ignoring some hot-headed, sheltered, bigots just so that I can neg-rep them more. Why are so many of the people that are outspokenly racist, violent, or otherwise close-minded getting so many plus-reps?

----------


## paulbot24

> Ehhh, isn't that 'Lean Forward' and like it or it'll get worse....?


I heard the trick was to lead the sheep to the edge of the cliff so the sheep has no choice but to push back while its being %#$@*&.

----------


## tmg19103

I have my opinion of Kokesh, but guess what - it's not important.

RP has always endorsed non-violent civil disobedience. RP supports those who choose not to pay taxes at risk of imprisonment. 

As long as someone is not harming the equal rights of others, it is not my place to judge. I respect anyone standing up for the Constitution while risking - and most likely for Kokesh - losing their freedom to unjust and unconstitutional laws.

Unfortunately, this will not amount to a success for the freedom movement - as one poster indicated that the establishment will squash Kokesh like a bug, and the military assault on his home was meant to send a message to others not to stand up to unconstitutional laws.

Still, I have to respect his principles. Kokesh puts his freedom where his mouth is. Some may not agree with everything he says or does, but I have to respect non-violent civil disobedience against unconstitutional laws where you will probably end up in prison for years standing up not only for your principles, but those those country was founded on. The founders would be doing 360's in their graves if they knew holding a loaded shotgun in D.C. would get you years in prison.

Some may also say the time for violent rebellion is near since what Kokesh has done won't accomplish anything, but there are too many sheeple in this country. Will never happen. 

I admit I don't have the courage of conviction to do what Kokesh did, though I fight the fight in my own way.

----------


## MelissaCato

Nice post tmg19103.

----------


## Brian4Liberty

> why





> I don't think he wants to be sued.


Lol. Getting sued is never good.




> Leviathan's enforcers serve the interests of the elites & their lackeys? No new news here.
> 
> *But I fail to understand how deliberately setting oneself up to be murdered by the State's brute squad can be considered a productive form of resistance or activism ...*


Productive, that's a key concern. That wouldn't be productive, would it?

If Adam did things that resulted in injury or deaths of people, including himself, it would have been a worse outcome than what really happened (and illegal and immoral). No one was killed. No one was injured. In reality, Adam had as much reason to fear the Police as the Police had to fear him. Those levels of fear should be at a minimum level for both sides. The police over-reacted, abused their authority, and wasted taxpayer money and resources, there's no doubt about that. A single officer with a search warrant and no gun would have been perfectly safe going to the house. They knew exactly who Adam was, and that this was a non-violent political protest.

Non-violent protest can be productive. Violent protest brings about the exact opposite of the supposedly desired results. It turns the masses against your cause. It gives politicians reason to pass more laws. It gives bigger budgets to power-drunk bureaucrats and officials. It justifies their escalation of force. Nothing good comes from it.

----------


## WM_in_MO

The $#@! RFP, the $#@!.

-rep this whole debacle

----------


## kcchiefs6465

//

----------


## angelatc

> Perhaps I'm missing some details.  Did he, or did he not, back away from a march that he called for?



I didn't pay that much attention but iirc he said it had to get 10,000 facebook commitments, because that would give them about 1,000 actual attendees and they didn't get that number.

----------


## Czolgosz

> I didn't pay that much attention but iirc he said it had to get 10,000 facebook commitments, because that would give them about 1,000 actual attendees and they didn't get that number.


I see.  Thanks.

----------


## kcchiefs6465

As a side note, mushrooms have ridiculously long prison sentences behind them.

I've never understood it.

From what I've read, he is facing ten years for the mushrooms which truth be told could very well just be one cap or one stem, the laws are so damn ridiculous, or it very well may not have even been on his person or his. He is the one they were targeting, it was his home. If the mushrooms were on the table or even in someone else's pocket they would say they are his and charge him as if they were. A not too uncommon scenario is someone throwing drugs when the police come. Even if the mushrooms were near someone else, they very well probably would still charge him as if they were found in his pocket. Just something to consider.

I've also read that he is facing a mandatory two year addition to whatever time he's sentenced to because of a gun. To be clear on this though, he very well may not have been in possession of the gun. A gun simply ,ay have been there so they charged him. Consider too that they usually overcharge you so that they have leverage. Something like 90% of Federal charges don't make it to the jury. People plead out to avoid the near certainty of being convicted, the mandatory minimum sentences, and the football numbers they throw out. 60, 70, 100 years is no joke. Not many would want to risk that when they offer you 15. I can't particularly say I'd blame them.

Helicopters and APCs, a no knock raid and arrest with absurd sentencing possibilities (though the "crime" is absurd enough) and people can't support him? I'd hate to see if I'm ever targeted and thrown in a cage what the people from the woodwork would emerge to say. Or God forbid _you are._

----------


## Czolgosz

> Helicopters and APCs, a no knock raid and arrest with absurd sentencing possibilities (though the "crime" is absurd enough) and people can't support him? I'd hate to see if I'm ever targeted and thrown in a cage what the people from the woodwork would emerge to say. Or God forbid _you are._



You'll get a thread on a few forums.  Comforting,  no?

----------


## tod evans

Ummm, KC,

60 months fed time for a gun w/drugs..

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...=1#post5118204

----------


## ZENemy

> As a side note, mushrooms have ridiculously long prison sentences behind them.
> 
> I've never understood it.
> 
> From what I've read, he is facing ten years for the mushrooms which truth be told could very well just be one cap or one stem, the laws are so damn ridiculous, or it very well may not have even been on his person or his. He is the one they were targeting, it was his home. If the mushrooms were on the table or even in someone else's pocket they would say they are his and charge him as if they were. A not too uncommon scenario is someone throwing drugs when the police come. Even if the mushrooms were near someone else, they very well probably would still charge him as if they were found in his pocket. Just something to consider.
> 
> I've also read that he is facing a mandatory two year addition to whatever time he's sentenced to because of a gun. To be clear on this though, he very well may not have been in possession of the gun. A gun simply ,ay have been there so they charged him. Consider too that they usually overcharge you so that they have leverage. Something like 90% of Federal charges don't make it to the jury. People plead out to avoid the near certainty of being convicted, the mandatory minimum sentences, and the football numbers they throw out. 60, 70, 100 years is no joke. Not many would want to risk that when they offer you 15. I can't particularly say I'd blame them.
> 
> Helicopters and APCs, a no knock raid and arrest with absurd sentencing possibilities (though the "crime" is absurd enough) and people can't support him? I'd hate to see if I'm ever targeted and thrown in a cage what the people from the woodwork would emerge to say. Or God forbid _you are._


We cant have mundanes expanding their awareness and becoming one with themselves.

----------


## kcchiefs6465

> You'll get a thread on a few forums.  Comforting,  no?


Yeah and probably be slandered an agent provocateur or have my past mistakes analyzed through someone else's lens. 

It's a little concerning.

We are talking about a man who faces 10+ years for a by and large harmless fungi (whose only harm would be to him and no one else) and a gun yet people still find a reason not to support his case.

Flash banged his house? Helicopters and militarized thugs? Him being kicked when asking to use his bathroom? This is not the country I envision when people say America. I suppose I'm the fool, though. I should have known.

Lord have mercy when they come for you. (not you specifically, to the posters who have used this thread as a means to attempt to assassinate a man's character instead of actually realizing what we are discussing)

----------


## jllundqu

Adam screwed up.  He had shrooms and a gun.  Violation of 18 usc 922... he's gonna get a felony conviction unless they find some technicality.  

I like Adam a lot and find what he did to be courageous, but he screwed up by mixing drugs and guns and getting caught with both by the feds.  Checkmate for him.

----------


## jct74

split thread created:

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...thread-(split)

----------


## kcchiefs6465

> Ummm, KC,
> 
> 60 months fed time for a gun w/drugs..
> 
> http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...=1#post5118204


Ridiculous. (though I can hear some people here applauding that bull$#@! and preaching about responsibility)

My two years additional sentence to the ten years he faces was from an article a few pages back. I just took it at face value because I wasn't actually aware of the specific charge he was charged with and the time he faces.

----------


## Dr.3D

> Adam screwed up.  He had shrooms and a gun.  Violation of 18 usc 922... he's gonna get a felony conviction unless they find some technicality.  
> 
> I like Adam a lot and find what he did to be courageous, but he screwed up by mixing drugs and guns and getting caught with both by the feds.  Checkmate for him.


Maybe his defense will be able to show how both the laws on guns and drugs are unconstitutional.

----------


## kcchiefs6465

> Adam screwed up.  He had shrooms and a gun.  Violation of 18 usc 922... he's gonna get a felony conviction unless they find some technicality.  
> 
> I like Adam a lot and find what he did to be courageous, but he screwed up by mixing drugs and guns and getting caught with both by the feds.  Checkmate for him.


How do you know the mushrooms were his?

----------


## better-dead-than-fed

I did not see any mushrooms. Saw a shotgun, but no mushrooms.

----------


## Dr.3D

> I did not see any mushrooms. Saw a shotgun, but no mushrooms.


They claim they found the shrooms when they searched his home.

----------


## better-dead-than-fed

> They claim they found the shrooms when they searched his home.


I do not assume their claim is true. They also took an oath to uphold the constitution.

----------


## tangent4ronpaul

> As a side note, mushrooms have ridiculously long prison sentences behind them.
> 
> I've never understood it.
> 
> From what I've read, he is facing ten years for the mushrooms which truth be told could very well just be one cap or one stem, the laws are so damn ridiculous, or it very well may not have even been on his person or his. He is the one they were targeting, it was his home. If the mushrooms were on the table or even in someone else's pocket they would say they are his and charge him as if they were. A not too uncommon scenario is someone throwing drugs when the police come. Even if the mushrooms were near someone else, they very well probably would still charge him as if they were found in his pocket. Just something to consider.
> 
> I've also read that he is facing a mandatory two year addition to whatever time he's sentenced to because of a gun. To be clear on this though, he very well may not have been in possession of the gun. A gun simply ,ay have been there so they charged him. Consider too that they usually overcharge you so that they have leverage. Something like 90% of Federal charges don't make it to the jury. People plead out to avoid the near certainty of being convicted, the mandatory minimum sentences, and the football numbers they throw out. 60, 70, 100 years is no joke. Not many would want to risk that when they offer you 15. I can't particularly say I'd blame them.
> 
> Helicopters and APCs, a no knock raid and arrest with absurd sentencing possibilities (though the "crime" is absurd enough) and people can't support him? I'd hate to see if I'm ever targeted and thrown in a cage what the people from the woodwork would emerge to say. Or God forbid _you are._


Kokesh needs to find Jesus the earth spirits real quick!

back in HS, I was working in the schools greenhouse and we'd just brought in a ton of horse manure.  Well, shortly after that we came in one day to find one bed in a shady spot, under a potting bench was showing a bumper crop of shrooms.  Edible?, poisonous? hallucinogenic?  We didn't know, so we didn't mess with them.  Anyway, that is a viable defense:  "Hay your honor, found it in the garden and we were going to take it to the AG extension service to find out what it was and if we should be concerned about it..."

-t

----------


## JK/SEA

yeah, not very likely some stormtrooper planted the shrooms...no pun.

----------


## kcchiefs6465

> I did not see any mushrooms. Saw a shotgun, but no mushrooms.


What are you referring to? In the video or you saw pictures of the evidence?

----------


## better-dead-than-fed

> Violent protest brings about the exact opposite of the supposedly desired results. It turns the masses against your cause. It gives politicians reason to pass more laws. It gives bigger budgets to power-drunk bureaucrats and officials. It justifies their escalation of force.


Any act of forceful self-defense against a government employee could have those consequences.

----------


## better-dead-than-fed

> What are you referring to? In the video or you saw pictures of the evidence?


I was referring to the video. Police plant drugs whenever they want to. Kokesh knew they were coming, so if he really got caught with mushrooms, then that is what he wanted. And if it is what he wanted, then it is strange that he did not post a video showing mushrooms too.

In the jail where I was, most prisoners are Mexicans who cross on foot smuggling drugs. When they get caught, the feds steal the drugs and just charge them with illegal immigration. This is normal fed behavior, not just a few bad apples. So I would have no problem believing the feds planted drugs on Kokesh.

----------


## satchelmcqueen

do they have proof what he loaded was real ammo? or is he just guilty automatically? and they once again order people to stay in their homes? so much irony here. $#@! the system!!!

----------


## tod evans

If it matters to anyone...The 924c (18 USC) charge has been upheld for as little as one joint and with non-functional firearms...


Fair warning if it applies...


In Adams case the law is clear, if he "controlled" the property where guns and drugs were found not only is he subject to sentencing for the drugs and an additional 60 months on the 924c, his property is subject to confiscation..

----------


## phill4paul

Started reading this thread this morning when there were a few posts. Decided to let it go and see what was posted before responding. I got Kokesh bias. FUD slinging. Some really out of place athiest/Jews/Chatholic who-the-hell-knows what. SMFH.

  Forget that it is Kokesh. What if some random guy had said "Enough." Threw his finger in the face of the Laviathan and said "Molon Labe." "Come and get me." He doesn't offer resistance. He doesn't hurt an individual. He goads the state to unleash an Army against him.

  Well, $#@! me. That person is someone that should be excoriated? FUD should be thrown out in his presence instead of discussing the issue itself and what should be done to help him? 

  This is just one of the reasons why I am tired of the interwebz. This $#@! is getting old and the moment is upon us.

----------


## Czolgosz

If you mess with government you're going to jail and or paying huge fines and/or paying officer of the court fee's.

Or you die fighting them.

There are no other options.

----------


## Czolgosz

> Started reading this thread this morning when there were a few posts. Decided to let it go and see what was posted before responding. I got Kokesh bias. FUD slinging. Some really out of place athiest/Jews/Chatholic who-the-hell-knows what. SMFH.
> 
>   Forget that it is Kokesh. What if some random guy had said "Enough." Threw his finger in the face of the Laviathan and said "Molon Labe." "Come and get me." He doesn't offer resistance. He doesn't hurt an individual. He goads the state to unleash an Army against him.
> 
>   Well, $#@! me. That person is someone that should be excoriated? FUD should be thrown out in his presence instead of discussing the issue itself and what should be done to help him? 
> 
>   This is just one of the reasons why I am tired of the interwebz. This $#@! is getting old and the moment is upon us.



Well said, brother.


Just need a few good Men.

----------


## tod evans

The federal leviathan has been singling out 1-4 men at a time for attacks like this for decades.

Legal challenges by some of the best minds on the planet have proved fruitless, 40+ years of campaigning and voting have got a few *states* laws somewhat more permissive.....

But there has been no change in federal legislation other than to increase surveillance and prosecution.

Unfortunately Adam is just one more life that's getting ready to be chewed up and spit out by "our" federal government...

The government that does not represent people like me

----------


## Brian4Liberty

> Adam screwed up.  He had shrooms and a gun.  Violation of 18 usc 922... he's gonna get a felony conviction unless they find some technicality.  
> 
> I like Adam a lot and find what he did to be courageous, but he screwed up by mixing drugs and guns and getting caught with both by the feds.  Checkmate for him.


Damn. That brings up the possibility that they will charge him for things in his home, and *never charge him for the actual act of protest*, which was loading the gun in DC.

Wow, talk about a case of going on a fishing expedition just to charge someone.

----------


## AuH20

> Damn. That brings up the possibility that they will charge him for things in his home, and *never charge him for the actual act of protest*, which was loading the gun in DC.
> 
> Wow, talk about a case of going on a fishing expedition just to charge someone.


What the hell was he thinking????????? Or was he thinking???? Kokesh could have played a critical role but he's likely to be sidelined for 20 years in federal prison.

----------


## tod evans

> What the hell was he thinking????????? Or was he thinking???? Kokesh could have played a critical role but he's likely to be sidelined for 20 years in federal prison.


I'm betting he'll be presented with an 84 month "plea-deal" 7 years!

If he insists on a "jury" he'll do 20+..

The system is rigged and he's $#@!ed.

There's nothing even 10,000 people could do to help him at this point other than make a lot of racket..

----------


## better-dead-than-fed

I did not personally see any shrooms. I only saw a newspaper report alleging that a government employee alleged something about shrooms.

Did anyone here personally witness any shrooms at Kokesh's house?

----------


## tod evans

> I did not personally see any shrooms. I only saw a newspaper report alleging that a government employee alleged something about shrooms.
> 
> Did anyone here personally witness any shrooms at Kokesh's house?



You know better than that!

Cop said there was shrooms, he'll be convicted of shrooms...

----------


## presence

I hope he's able to play a legal trump card and the trigger group and firing pin in that DC gun protest were indeed removed.

----------


## tod evans

Has anyone posted a copy of the indictment yet or is all this just speculation?

----------


## paulbot24

> *What the hell was he thinking????????? Or was he thinking????* Kokesh could have played a critical role but he's likely to be sidelined for 20 years in federal prison.


When you consider the ridiculous amount of laws we have,  and combine that with the zealousness of the enforcers......Don't think this won't happen to you or I at some point. It's not about lifestyle or guilty pleasures. It's not about behavior anymore. It is about sheer numbers. Does anybody honestly think they're name won't be called to be "processed" eventually. I bolded the above because that is exactly what our loved ones will be saying that day over and over again.

----------


## AuH20

> When you consider the ridiculous amount of laws we have,  and combine that with the zealousness of the enforcers......Don't think this won't happen to you or I at some point. It's not about lifestyle or guilty pleasures. It's not about behavior anymore. It is about sheer numbers. Does anybody honestly think they're name won't be called to be "processed" eventually. I bolded the above because that is exactly what our loved ones will be saying that day over and over again.


But the real battle has not even started. That's the prism of ridiculousness I'm examining Adam's actions through. It's kind of like getting disqualified from participating in the Super Bowl months before the game even started.  It's a waste, giving the feds the gun brandishing charges on a silver platter, along with the class 1 substance.

 What did we learn today? The feds are insecure control freaks. Did we know this information the day prior and the day before that? Yup.

----------


## better-dead-than-fed

> Has anyone posted a copy of the indictment yet or is all this just speculation?


I asked the WaPo reporter to post it or email it to me. No reply. I haven't tried PACER yet.

----------


## pcosmar

> What the hell was he thinking????????? Or was he thinking???? Kokesh could have played a critical role but he's likely to be sidelined for 20 years in federal prison.


Nice,, I see you are still at it,, 

And you assign guilt and a conviction on an arrest  and baseless accusation.

Personally I expect that the warrant will be thrown out and the rest of the case with it.
They are targeting him because he is visibly active.

----------


## better-dead-than-fed

> It's a waste, giving the feds ... the class 1 substance.


*hello* did you personally see shrooms, or is your condemnation based solely on the police's unchallenged testimony?

----------


## tod evans

> Personally I expect that the warrant will be thrown out and the rest of the case with it.
> They are targeting him because he is visibly active.


I honestly hope you're right.

My gut's quivering though

----------


## pcosmar

> Adam screwed up.  He had shrooms and a gun.


I have no idea what he did or didn't have.. or what someone else had,, or what the police brought with them.

I am still questioning how out of state Park Police got a warrant.

That is highly unusual and questionable.

----------


## phill4paul

> What the hell was he thinking????????? Or was he thinking???? Kokesh could have played a critical role but he's likely to be sidelined for 20 years in federal prison.


 * ^^^ FUD.*

  Yeah. What I spoke about in my earlier post. Got any suggestion on how to help Adam and the message sent by his video? How best to respond to the situation? How to Any thing other than donkey-drool? You do believe that the second amendment is a natural right?

----------


## Thor

> But the real battle has not even started. That's the prism of ridiculousness I'm examining Adam's actions through. It's kind of like getting disqualified from participating in the Super Bowl months before the game even started.  It's a waste, giving the feds the gun brandishing charges on a silver platter, along with the class 1 substance.
> 
>  What did we learn today? The feds are insecure control freaks. Did we know this information the day prior and the day before that? Yup.


You are right, we should all just sit quietly on the sidelines, in our little cages, waiting for that right moment, while they build bigger and stronger cages.  Don't say anything.  You might upset them, or give other cage dwellers the wrong idea.....  Shhhhhhh.  

Adam has chutzpa many of us can only dream about...

----------


## AuH20

> You are right, we should all just sit quietly on the sidelines, in our little cages, waiting for that right moment, while they build bigger and stronger cages.  Don't say anything.  You might upset them, or give other cage dwellers the wrong idea.....  Shhhhhhh.  
> 
> Adam has chutzpa many of us can only dream about...


Adam has chutzpa sitting in his little cage. You got that right, friend. Secondly, the enemy is flesh and blood men as opposed to superhumans. I suspect they put their pants on one leg at time, but I can't confirm this. LOL Get a grip. This isn't Independence Day the film and we're pitted against a highly advanced species.

----------


## phill4paul

> I have no idea what he did or didn't have.. or what someone else had,, or what the police brought with them.
> 
> I am still questioning how out of state Park Police got a warrant.
> 
> That is highly unusual and questionable.


   Not out of state Parks Police. They are FEDERAL. Dept. of the Interior. Their Jurisdiction is with jurisdiction in all National Park Service areas and certain other Federal and State lands.  Was Kokesh's house in certain Federal and lands?  If not they were NOT in their jurisdiction.

----------


## AuH20

> * ^^^ FUD.*
> 
>   Yeah. What I spoke about in my earlier post. Got any suggestion on how to help Adam and the message sent by his video? How best to respond to the situation? How to Any thing other than donkey-drool? You do believe that the second amendment is a natural right?


I have a novel idea. Be your own leader. You don't need Adam Kokesh to provide the path. I think many of our kind are looking to be led as strange as that sounds.

----------


## Thor

> Adam has chutzpa sitting in his little cage. You got that right, friend. Secondly, the enemy is flesh and blood men as opposed to superhumans. I suspect they put their pants on one leg at time, but I can't confirm this. LOL Get a grip. This isn't Independence Day the film and we're pitted against a highly advanced species.


He has chutzpa in his cage, and outside his cage.  

So you have the ability to monitor the communications of million of people and command minions to do your bidding for "violations" with arms and deadly force?  You superhuman, you....

Adam is trying to wake people up.  But you go back to your cage on the sidelines and do what you're told, sheep.  Shhhhh....

----------


## better-dead-than-fed

> Adam has chutzpa sitting in his little cage. You got that right, friend. Secondly, the enemy is flesh and blood men as opposed to superhumans. I suspect they put their pants on one leg at time, but I can't confirm this. LOL Get a grip. This isn't Independence Day the film and we're pitted against a highly advanced species.


Cops are an advanced species compared with whom? I am having trouble making sense of your writing, besides your insistence that you are better than Kokesh, somehow.

----------


## phill4paul

> I have a novel idea. Be your own leader. You don't need Adam Kokesh to provide the path. I think many of our kind are looking to be led as strange as that sounds.


  More FUD. So now your implying that I, and others, want to be "led?"

Every time you spew you're donkey drool belittling you are gonna get one of these....



  Several members have told you to knock it off. You should think on that.

----------


## AuH20

> Cops are an advanced species compared with whom?


Talk to Thor about it. He's biting his nails down to the bone, just thinking about the human beings that run the control grid.

----------


## kcchiefs6465

> Talk to Thor about it. He's biting his nails down to the bone, just thinking about the human beings that run the control grid.


When they come with APCs, helicopters, and twenty-fold your manpower, you'll piss your pants.

Goddamn you are getting annoying.

----------


## AuH20

> *When they come with APCs, helicopters, and twenty-fold your manpower, you'll piss your pants.*
> 
> Goddamn you are getting annoying.




All that for me? I'd be honored. Why not a cruise missile just for the sake of finality?

----------


## kcchiefs6465

> All that for me? I'd be honored.


But yet, you're still here.....

----------


## phill4paul

OK. I'm just catching up on the specifics.  So please confirm or deny these things.

  20 SWAT members involved.  Local SWAT squad? One agency or several (county and city combined).
  Federal Park police were involved? How many? Were they involved in the raid or did they act in an advisory position? 
  Two helicopters and a neighborhood lock down?

----------


## tod evans

> OK. I'm just catching up on the specifics.  So please confirm or deny these things.
> 
>   20 SWAT members involved.  Local SWAT squad? One agency or several (county and city combined).
>   Federal Park police were involved? How many? Were they involved in the raid or did they act in an advisory position? 
>   Two helicopters and a neighborhood lock down?



I don't know, wasn't there..

How is this relevant?

"The-Newz" has released enough to support a federal indictment, ie; guns/drugs/subversive speech...

The who did what under which color of law will be manufactured to fit the "evidence" and will very likely never see a courtroom..

----------


## Occam's Banana

> But yet, you're still here.....


Imagine that.

The big-talkin' Internet forums warrior yaps about how other people should get themselves killed by uniformed thugs in order to deserve his appreciation.

But he hasn't done jack $#@! to draw the attention of the uniformed thugs in front of whom he wants other people to throw their bodies ...

Big surprise, ain't it?

----------


## phill4paul

> I don't know, wasn't there..
> 
> How is this relevant?
> 
> "The-Newz" has released enough to support a federal indictment, ie; guns/drugs/subversive speech...
> 
> The who did what under which color of law will be manufactured to fit the "evidence" and will very likely never see a courtroom..


 Ummm, you know I know well what has been manufactured. I was asking the community what they may or may not have heard and through which sources. 
  It's relative in many ways. No?

----------


## presence

> OK. I'm just catching up on the specifics.  So please confirm or deny these things.
> 
>   20 SWAT members involved.  Local SWAT squad? One agency or several (county and city combined).
>   Federal Park police were involved? How many? Were they involved in the raid or did they act in an advisory position? 
>   Two helicopters and a neighborhood lock down?


did you see this post?
http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...=1#post5117905

----------


## IDefendThePlatform

> I don't know, wasn't there..
> 
> The who did what under which color of law will be manufactured to fit the "evidence" and will very likely never see a courtroom..


if that's true then it'll prob mean the Feds gave up because its hard to see Kokesh taking a plea deal at this point. Right now he's refusing to even recognize the legitimacy of his kidnappers, which I heartily applaud.

----------


## AuH20

> Imagine that.
> 
> The big-talkin' Internet forums warrior yaps about how other people should get themselves killed by uniformed thugs in order to deserve his appreciation.
> 
> But he hasn't done jack $#@! to draw the attention of the uniformed thugs in front of whom he wants other people to throw their bodies ...
> 
> Big surprise, ain't it?


I have one simple question for you. What is more palatable to you? 20 + years in a federal penitentiary or a valiant stand against the nonsense? When all is said and done, I suspect Adam probably would have been better off killing someone, given the charges that are being talked about.

----------


## presence

> I have one simple question for you. What is more palatable to you? 20 + years in a federal penitentiary or a valiant stand against the nonsense? When all is said and done, I suspect Adam probably would have been better off killing someone, given the charges that are being talked about.


He still has that option as do any of us.

----------


## tod evans

> if that's true then it'll prob mean the Feds gave up because its hard to see Kokesh taking a plea deal at this point. Right now he's refusing to even recognize the legitimacy of his kidnappers, which I heartily applaud.


Make no mistake he's got balls!

Then again some of the ballsiest people in the world are detained in FCI's....

----------


## AuH20

> He still has that option as do any of us.


I hope you're right, but I'm not confident. They are going to throw the book at him as an example, especially with the likely conflation of gun and drug charges in the District of Corruption.

----------


## phill4paul

> did you see this post?
> http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...=1#post5117905


  I did. Thank you and +rep. That was mostly where I was gathering my info from and was wondering about confirmations. 

  The U.S. Park police had NO jurisdiction. This is just one angle that I want to look at. Granted they could have asked the local police to apprehend him but they would have had no place being there to make the arrest. However, the USPP has it's own SWAT. They train locals. What was the FED, state, local connection? Did the USPP provide the SWAT? 
  Just asking questions. Looking for answers and connections.

----------


## Peace Piper

> I have a novel idea.


Bet ya have more than one!!




> I think many of *our kind are looking to be led* as strange as that sounds.


I'd hesitate to ask you at this point what "strange" is. Just remember this: You aren't speaking for me. Get it? Great.

Pvt. Joker: How can you shoot innocent women and children like that?



Helicopter gunner: *It's easy. You just don't lead them as much*.
 You see, anyone that runs, is V.C. 
Anyone that stands still is well disciplined V.C. Ain't war hell?

Updated Version (courtesy RPF):

Prole: How can you shoot innocent women and children like that?

Private Joker Beck: Pretend they're on a hunger strike

----------


## Occam's Banana

> I have one simple question for you. What is more palatable to you? 20 + years in a federal penitentiary or a valiant stand against the nonsense?


No, you don't have a "simple question" for me.

What you have for me is a rigged & false dichotomy.

Well, Homey don't play dat.




> When all is said and done, I suspect Adam probably would have been better off killing someone, given the charges that are being talked about.


Oh, I have no doubt that that is indeed what you "suspect." You have made abundantly clear (here and in the Gitmo hunger strike thread) that you delight in the prospect of the deaths of others for the sake of your twisted mentality. First it was Kokesh himself ... then it was the Gitmo prisoners ... and now, it's some generic person "Adam probably would have been better off killing" ...

----------


## phill4paul

> I have one simple question for you. What is more palatable to you? 20 + years in a federal penitentiary or a valiant stand against the nonsense? When all is said and done, I suspect Adam probably would have been better off killing someone, given the charges that are being talked about.

----------


## AuH20

> No, you don't have a "simple question" for me.
> 
> What you have for me is a rigged & false dichotomy.
> 
> Well, Homey don't play dat.


The question still stands. Rot in a federal penitentiary and become etched in stone as the punchline to a joke or actually inspire others? I'm just questioning when someone takes it upon themselves to embark on half-assed measures, without realizing there can be no half ass measures with the game we're playing. Ask Edward Snowden or Charles Dyer about the price for tangling with the bull? You either go or don't go. There is no in between. Kiss the wife and tell the oldest son that he's in charge. 





> Oh, I have no doubt that that is indeed what you "suspect." You have made abundantly clear (here and in the Gitmo hunger strike thread) that you delight in the prospect of the deaths of others for the sake of your twisted mentality. First it was Kokesh himself ... then it was the Gitmo prisoners ... and now, it's some generic person "Adam probably would have been better off killing" ...


Yes, you got me. I'm a death cultist as opposed to being immensely disappointed in Adam Kokesh for throwing his life away on a shameless display of bravado. Yes, I'm coldhearted for believing his life has value.

----------


## presence

> I did. Thank you and +rep. That was mostly where I was gathering my info from and was wondering about confirmations. 
> 
>   The U.S. Park police had NO jurisdiction. This is just one angle that I want to look at. Granted they could have asked the local police to apprehend him but they would have had no place being there to make the arrest. However, the USPP has it's own SWAT. They train locals. What was the FED, state, local connection? Did the USPP provide the SWAT? 
>   Just asking questions. Looking for answers and connections.





> On a weekly basis the SWAT         Unit; conducts high risk search warrants for the USPP narcotics units *and         other state and local agencies*


http://www.nps.gov/uspp/swatpag.htm

----------


## Fredom101

> Maybe Adam will be our Gandhi, our Mandela.


Not likely. More likely, he will simply rot in jail and be forgotten about. I'm hoping this is not the case.

----------


## presence

*Next Court Date:  October 2nd, 2013*








> *Published on Jul 10, 2013*  
>                         A SWAT raid on the property of Adam  Kokesh was conducted late Tuesday night on July 9, resulting in the  detainment of Adam until his next scheduled hearing where he faces  multiple felony charges.
> 
> Months prior to this year's 4th of July,  Marine Veteran & Libertarian activist Kokesh has called for  supporters of the right to armed self-defense to gather in Washington,  D.C. to conduct a peaceful armed march. Thousands have reportedly signed  up for the protest, which Kokesh says would be a non-violent exercise  of the right to open carry. 
> 
> On the evening of Tuesday, July 9,  U.S. Park police in collaboration with the Herndon police department  locked down the 1500 block of Snowflake Court in Herndon, Virginia, a  suburb outlining the District of Columbia. A search warrant was filed  for the home of libertarian activist and TV personality, Adam Kokesh who  was recently featured here on WHDT World News. Here's a clip from that  interview. 
> 
> Now the warrant for Kokesh was issued in light of a  recent Youtube post on July 4th exhibiting Kokesh allegedly displaying a  loaded shotgun in Freedom Plaza, just blocks away from the U.S. Capitol  building. However, a warrant was never presented.
> 
> ...

----------


## phill4paul

> The question still stands. Rot in a federal penitentiary and become etched in stone as the punchline to a joke or *actually inspire others?* I'm just questioning when someone (ELSE) takes it upon themselves to embark on half-assed measures, without realizing there can be no half ass measures with the game we're playing. Ask Edward Snowden or Charles Dyer about the price for tangling with the bull? You either go or don't go. *There is no in between. Kiss the wife and tell the oldest son that he's in charge.*


  Half-assed? Civil disobedience and subjugation to government trial?  What is it YOU are gonna do? What is it YOU are doing? His measure by your protestations is measured in full. Just STFU already. FUD.

----------


## phill4paul

> http://www.nps.gov/uspp/swatpag.htm


 


> On a weekly basis the SWAT Unit; conducts high risk search warrants for the USPP narcotics units and other state and local agencies


  Ahhh, so it will be considered a narco bust? It wasn't about the video?

  Crap. I'm here there and everywhere with family and friends tonight. Is there a copy of the actual warrant?

----------


## presence



----------


## better-dead-than-fed

> Is there a copy of the actual warrant?


If I can find a case number, I'll post everything associated with it. Haven't found a case number yet.

----------


## AuH20

> Half-assed? Civil disobedience and subjugation to government trial?  What is it YOU are gonna do? What is it YOU are doing? His measure by your protestations is measured in full. Just STFU already. FUD.


I don't think you get it. You don't want to get arrested. There is no 'victory' in getting arrested and being exiled into the federal system for 2 decades.

----------


## presence



----------


## tod evans

_You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to presence again._

Need some help here

----------


## phill4paul

> I don't think you get it. You don't want to get arrested. There is no 'victory' in getting arrested and being exiled into the federal system for 2 decades.

----------


## AuH20

One article stated that there were 30-40 police present.

----------


## phill4paul

> _You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to presence again._
> 
> Need some help here


  Covered.. Thanks presence!

----------


## presence

> WASHINGTON - After refusing to get out of his cell, Adam Kokesh will now be  arraigned Thursday, NBC4 reports. 
> 
>  Kokesh has also refused to be photographed and fingerprinted since he was arrested  Tuesday night.  
>  NBC4 reports that a judge will arraign Kokesh in his cell Thursday.


http://www.wtop.com/41/3384202/Activ...ted-in-Herndon

----------


## Deborah K

> I have a novel idea. Be your own leader. You don't need Adam Kokesh to provide the path. I think many of our kind are looking to be led as strange as that sounds.


This is truly ironic.  This is EXACTLY what Adam espouses.  LOL!

----------


## phill4paul

So I think I have read he would not go before the court? If so is that why there is no bail set? Usually, the court sets bail when charges are brought. Since he will not appear then bail is not set yet. Is this the correct understanding?

----------


## AuH20

> This is truly ironic.  This is EXACTLY what Adam espouses.  LOL!


No one said Adam was not intelligent. He's extremely intelligent and a superior communicator. That's why I can't for the life of me understand why he would do this? The so-called payoff isn't large enough to throw one's self down on the altar of selective justice.

----------


## presence



----------


## angelatc

Start about the 3 minute mark;



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_edEU...ature=youtu.be

----------


## phill4paul

> http://www.wtop.com/41/3384202/Activ...ted-in-Herndon


  Interesting reporting. What court is he being arraignd in? Is this a Federal or State charge? Was it a federal or state judge that signed the warrant?

----------


## AuH20

How much is the bond? 1 mill? LOL

----------


## Occam's Banana

> The question still stands. Rot in a federal penitentiary and become etched in stone as the punchline to a joke or actually inspire others?


No, it doesn't. There is no "question" - just your ludicrously engineered false dichotomy.




> I'm just questioning when someone takes it upon themselves to embark on half-assed measures, without realizing there can be no half ass measures with the game we're playing. Ask Edward Snowden or Charles Dyer about the price for tangling with the  bull? You either go or don't go. There is no in between. Kiss the wife  and tell the oldest son that he's in charge.
> 
> Yes, you got me. I'm a death cultist as opposed to being immensely  disappointed in Adam Kokesh for throwing his life away on a shameless  display of bravado. Yes, I'm coldhearted for believing his life has  value.


No, you are just a loud-mouthed Internet forum warrior who boldly yaps about someone  else's "half-assed measures," asininely prattles about "kissing the wife and telling the son he's in charge," and revels in the prospect of the deaths of others - all while hiding like a coward behind the safety &  comfort of your keyboard.

----------


## Weston White

> No SWAT teams for Jon Corzine for Grand Larceny squared by 2000. No SWAT teams for David Gregory. No SWAT Teams for Eric Holder. Is anyone starting to put 2+2 together?


Nor Aaron Hernandez, a very wealthy athlete suspected of having committed up to three cold-blooded homicides.

----------


## kcchiefs6465

He probably makes up the half of the entirety of posts here and the rest are responding to his nonsense. Are you kidding me? Sola_fide's derailment wasn't as trollish as this fool's.

You would have a thread bigger than this if you tried to split them off.

For him to "LOL" at the prospect of AK receiving a million dollar bond (a violation of the Eighth Amendment) for a non-violent "crime" is incredible and very much deserves a "$#@! you" - his trolling in other threads aside.

On one today. Must be a full moon.

----------


## AuH20

> For him to "LOL" at the prospect of AK receiving a million dollar bond (a violation of the Eighth Amendment) for a non-violent "crime" is incredible and very much deserves a "$#@! you" - his trolling in other threads aside.


And this type of inordinate bail would surprise you in what way? AK receiving a million dollar bond so he's incarcerated until Oct 2nd? That's the system, brohim. There is no new ground being broken here.

----------


## kcchiefs6465

> And this type of inordinate bail would surprise you in what way? AK receiving a million dollar bond so he's incarcerated until Oct 2nd? That's the system, brohim.


That you find it comical is what surprises me.

That your trolling has been tolerated as well.

----------


## MelissaCato

Adam's in Jail till October 2nd ? Gezzuz that's longer than my DUI sentence. 

Jail is not fun, I know that. I had to keep myself busy writing a book. LOL I wrote my first book ever - I titled it - Occupy Jail: My 90 Days.  

That said. I took advantage of my situation in a way that evidently no-one else did in my county. My family would send into jail all my political books, DVD's, Constitutions and RP paraphernalia. One thing is for certain being in jail - you have ALOT of time to read, draw, write  and watch video's. I was on the work release program so my time in jail (day by day) was short because I have 2 full time jobs and my employers demanded my work release. So for the most part - I just slept in jail. Sundays I spent the whole day in jail. 

My book is about 220 pages long and I wrote in it everyday and alot on Sundays. All the good, bad and ugly during my 90 days. It's a crazy read. LOL

I talked so much political stuff, tried to convince everyone Ron Paul is right, I left everyone have free access to all my books, DVD's etc. This said .. I learned something about people. You can give someone a Constitution and when they read it for the first time - they wake up. They ALL realized something isn't right in this country. 

I would also like to mention - I had my best New Years Eve inside my county jail. (my DUI was on New Years Eve the year before so they sent me to the clink during the following New Years Eve) I worked that day at one of my jobs and by that time everyone in the jail including the guards and employees ALL knew Ron Paul. When I returned from work that night - something was different. I noticed people didn't pay attention to me when I returned - no pat down, I didn't have to strip my clothes off, all the doors were open for me to just pass by into the next area until I got to out mate block. As I approached out mate block everything was pitch dark - I was kinda scared because I seen no one my entire journey back to out mate. Then all of a sudden the lights went on and BAMB I see everyone sitting at the tables soo quiet you could hear a pin drop, guards were standing single file between the tables - all dressed in black with masks and ARMED !!!! I never seen them with guns till that night !!  The whole out mate block was wall to wall Ron Paul drawings, Gladsden Flag drawings, Metallica drawings, Ron Paul 2012 signs soo flawlessly designed I was in total amazement. I have never in my life seen such pretty and perfect drawings with only paper, crayons and colored pencils. To this day I have NO IDEA who those guards were - none of them would owe up to it !!! 

Those 42 people in out mate (work release program) put so much effort and time in those drawings .. it was clearly a coordinated effort for some time. I later learned the Christian Ministries inside the jail - donated the paper, tape, crayons and colored pencils. Because I didn't work on Sundays I went to church in the jail - the Preachers would always ask who needed included in prayers and why - people would say for drug addictions, alcoholism, getting a job, more drug addictions, diseases they had - then here is me asking to pray Ron Paul wins the 2012 election because he's America's last hope. LOL 

I should get this book of mine published one day. It really is a good read.  

Adam should write a book too I think. LOL

----------


## AuH20

> That you find it comical is what surprises me.
> 
> That your trolling has been tolerated as well.


I find it comical because this is what happens when you embark on a fruitless Youtube crusade in DC, which is the heart of the NWO. Make no mistake about it. No warrant was served. Trumped up charges. Possible conflation of drug/gun violations which usually indicate an additional 60 month penalty. A bond set to ridiculous heights which almost guarantees incarceration for 3+ months. There is no glory.

----------


## kcchiefs6465

> I find it comical because this is what happens when you embark on a fruitless Youtube crusade in DC, which is the heart of the NWO. Make no mistake about it. No warrant was served. Trumped up charges. Possible conflation of drug/gun violations which usually indicate an additional 60 month penalty. A bond set to ridiculous heights which almost guarantees incarceration for 3+ months. There is no glory.


You find it amusing that the man has an unreasonable bond.

You advocated that he should have went out in a blaze of glory or even booby trapped his house. (numerous times)

I could go on and on. Might go through the entirety of this thread and quote your every post. Just so people can read through the bull$#@! all at once.

Riddle me this, what did you do on the Fourth of July? You call a couple Senators? Held a protest? Demonstrated? Sign waved? Created a petition on "We are change"?

It's a rhetorical question that does not need answered. You ate hotdogs and drank beer. Mentally masturbated to the thought of going out in a blaze of glory. I find it comical that you have the audacity to even comment anything aside from a "Free Kokesh." 

Report me again.

----------


## AuH20

> You find it amusing that the man has an unreasonable bond.
> 
> You advocated that he should have went out in a blaze of glory or even booby trapped his house. (numerous times)
> 
> I could go on and on. Might go through the entirety of this thread and quote your every post. Just so people can read through the bull$#@! all at once.
> 
> Riddle me this, what did you do on the Fourth of July? You call a couple Senators? Held a protest? Demonstrated? Sign waved? Created a petition on "We are change"?
> 
> It's a rhetorical question that does not need answered. You ate hotdogs and drank beer. Mentally masturbated to the thought of going out in a blaze of glory. I find it comical that you have the audacity to even comment anything aside from a "Free Kokesh." 
> ...


Whoa. No one is reporting you and I have thick skin, so the attacks on my person are taken with a grain of salt. We're engaging in a conversation here, though you state that I have a trolling agenda, when my motives are almost exclusively educational. If I'm hated for pointing out the flaws of this adventure, so be it. 

Secondly, what did I do on July 4th? My normal weekend regiment. Planting and taking inventory of certain supplies. Thirdly, why do have this unhealthy fascination with Adam Kokesh??? Do you want to vicariously live through him? Take on fictional windmills that are disguised as the man?

----------


## phill4paul

> Whoa. No one is reporting you and I have thick skin, so the attacks on my person are taken with a grain of salt. We're engaging in a conversation here, though you state that I have a trolling agenda, when *my motives are almost exclusively educational.* If I'm hated for pointing out the flaws of this adventure, so be it. 
> 
> Secondly, what did I do on July 4th? My normal weekend regiment. Planting and taking inventory of certain supplies. Thirdly, why do have this unhealthy fascination with Adam Kokesh??? Do you want to vicariously live through him? Take on fictional windmills that are disguised as the man?



 No they are $#@!ing not. Your entire diatribe has been a Kokesh hit piece. AGAIN demeaning those that agree with Kokesh as being "led" by him. Just shut the $#@! up. Christ.

----------


## kcchiefs6465

> Secondly, what did I do on July 4th? My daily regiment. Planting and taking inventory of certain supplies. Thirdly, why do have this unhealthy fascination with Adam Kokesh??? Do you want to vicariously live through him?


One, you didn't do anything. Just so we're clear.

Two, I have a "fascination," as you put it, with ending the kidnapping and false imprisonment of anyone in jail for non-violent, victimless "crimes." I have a "fascination" with this growing police state and the consequences that will come from it. I have a short patience and am easily annoyed by the absurdity of your posts. You are the definition of an armchair quarterback. Probably back up at that.

"Educational motives" huh? You've been educated countless times in this thread alone and still continue the same trollish bull$#@!. Other threads as well. I'm kind of surprised actually. People have offered some good advice.

Maybe a mod did just happen to see my post. I apologize if you didn't report me.

----------


## AuH20

> No they are $#@!ing not. Your entire diatribe has been a Kokesh hit piece. AGAIN demeaning those that agree with Kokesh as being "led" by him. Just shut the $#@! up. Christ.


I think you're too hypersensitive quite honestly since this arrest hit so close to home. Yes, Adam is a folk hero taking the liberty fight to "the Man." And he's an An Cap which gives him that gritty street edge. LOL Too cool for school. Needless to say I think I've been quite vocal in my support for Kokesh's general principles as opposed to this particular act of jackass behavior. In fact, I'll relay to you an interesting story. I was run through the proverbial ringer six months back when I stated on a largely military forum that Adam Kokesh was "courageous" for telling his superior to go pound sand after he was reprimanded for attending an anti-war event in uniform. So don't tell me that I have an agenda to denigrate Adam Kokesh, when I simply perplexed by this entire episode as well as the White House stunt.

----------


## tmg19103

Well, the mushroom possession charge is 1 year max under federal law. I'd say the shrooms are a definite plant by the jack boots.

The 5 year enhancement under 924 is for possession of a firearm in the act of "drug trafficking". 

Sounds like they only got him on the shroom possession set-up and found no shotgun. That's why they planted the shrooms. Who is to say the shotgun in the vid is not functional and he used snap caps? They had to get him for something. No shotgun and they can't prove it was real or functional.

He could be just looking at a few months on the shrooms.

Will be interesting to see how this plays out.

----------


## AuH20

> One, you didn't do anything. Just so we're clear.
> 
> Two, I have a "fascination," as you put it, with ending the kidnapping and false imprisonment of anyone in jail for non-violent, victimless "crimes." I have a "fascination" with this growing police state and the consequences that will come from it. I have a short patience and am easily annoyed by the absurdity of your posts. You are the definition of an armchair quarterback. Probably back up at that.
> 
> "Educational motives" huh? You've been educated countless times in this thread alone and still continue the same trollish bull$#@!. Other threads as well. I'm kind of surprised actually. People have offered some good advice.
> 
> *Maybe a mod did just happen to see my post. I apologize if you didn't report me.*


Why would I report you? I don't even neg rep. This a forum and we're going to come at loggerheads on occasion.

----------


## phill4paul

> I think you're too hypersensitive quite honestly since this arrest hit so close to home. Yes, Adam is a folk hero taking the liberty fight to "the Man." And he's an An Cap which gives him that gritty street edge. LOL Too cool for school. Needless to say I think I've been quite vocal in my support for Kokesh's general principles as opposed to this particular act of jackass behavior. In fact, I'll relay to you an interesting story. I was run through the proverbial ringer six months back when I stated on a largely military forum that Adam Kokesh was "courageous" for telling his superior to go pound sand after he was reprimanded for attending an anti-war event in uniform. So don't tell me that I have an agenda to denigrate Adam Kokesh, when I simply perplexed by this entire episode as well as the White House stunt.


  Moooooooooooooooooo

----------


## AuH20

> Well, the mushroom possession charge is 1 year max under federal law. I'd say the shrooms are a definite plant by the jack boots.
> 
> The 5 year enhancement under 924 is for possession of a firearm in the act of "drug trafficking". 
> 
> Sounds like they only got him on the shroom possession set-up and found no shotgun. That's why they planted the shrooms. *Who is to say the shotgun in the vid is not functional and he used snap caps?* They had to get him for something. No shotgun and they can't prove it was real or functional.
> 
> He could be just looking at a few months on the shrooms.
> 
> Will be interesting to see how this plays out.


What is the legal precedent for video evidence such as this?

----------


## phill4paul

> What is the legal precedent for video evidence such as this?


  Now THAT is a constructive question. Kudos.

----------


## brandon

I don't really have a strong opinion on this either way. It seems pretty obvious that Adam wanted this. He's been trying to martyr himself, for better or worse, for quite a while now.  If it happened at a massive march I think it would have been more effective than the way it currently went down. I want to say I hope he gets out soon, but I don't think that's what he wants.  In any case, he seems like a serously conflicted individual and I hope he can find peace sooner than later, outside of a jail cell.

----------


## brandon

> What is the legal precedent for video evidence such as this?


If they brought charges against him relating to it, it would certainly be admissable evidence. There would definitely be reasonable doubt that the video and/or gun wasn't real, if it weren't for his public statements that they were real.

I still don't think they have enough to get a conviction, so they won't even bring the charge, but it's definitely close.

----------


## muzzled dogg



----------


## JK/SEA

I dehydrated some portabello mushrooms today. Its funny. If you toss a few in your drawer.....cops find em....


burp.

----------


## Thor

> 


Thanks!

----------


## 69360

What a dumbass yet again. Is a line on drudge and 30 pages on RPF worth 5 or so years of his life? The general public doesn't know about this or even care, outside this circle nobody will even hear of it. Oh the irony, wants gun rights but commits felony and becomes prohibited person. 

Still, didn't deserve to be swatted over this.

----------


## phill4paul

> What a dumbass yet again. Is a line on drudge and 30 pages on RPF worth 5 or so years of his life? The general public doesn't know about this or even care, outside this circle nobody will even hear of it. Oh the irony, wants gun rights but commits felony and becomes prohibited person. 
> 
> Still, didn't deserve to be swatted over this.


  Nice to see another pro-active second amendment supporter on these forums.

----------


## Deborah K

> What a dumbass yet again. Is a line on drudge and 30 pages on RPF worth 5 or so years of his life? The general public doesn't know about this or even care, outside this circle nobody will even hear of it. Oh the irony, wants gun rights but commits felony and becomes prohibited person. 
> 
> Still, didn't deserve to be swatted over this.


History will be the judge of Adam Kokesh's methods.

----------


## 69360

> History will be the judge of Adam Kokesh's methods.


Really? Aside from a few internet sites, nobody will mention or remember his name. This isn't going to be in the history books in school. Is that worth sitting in a cell for years?

----------


## cjm

> This isn't going to be in the history books in school.


Neither will Ron Paul.

----------


## phill4paul

> Neither will Ron Paul.


  Or 69360.

----------


## Deborah K

> Really? Aside from a few internet sites, nobody will mention or remember his name. This isn't going to be in the history books in school. Is that worth sitting in a cell for years?


The history books in schools aren't accurate anyway, that wasn't my point.  I predict this won't be fleshed out for a long time to come.  And the ramifications, direct and indirect, remain to be seen.  This had to be done.  It was past time to point out the absurdity and incongruity of the illegality of open carry in the very location that is supposed to represent the founding of our nation and our rights.  I  wonder what the Founders would think if they knew an American was treated this way for exercising his first and second amendment rights.  

How is what Adam did crazier than the mob who taunted the red coats during the Boston Massacre, or the Boston Tea Party, or the tarring and feathering of loyalists, etc.?

----------


## phill4paul

> This had to be done.  It was past time to point out the absurdity and incongruity of the illegality of open carry in the very location that is supposed to represent the founding of our nation and our rights.


   This had to be done. This is only the start.

----------


## 69360

> The history books in schools aren't accurate anyway, that wasn't my point.  I predict this won't be fleshed out for a long time to come.  And the ramifications, direct and indirect, remain to be seen.  This had to be done.  It was past time to point out the absurdity and incongruity of the illegality of open carry in the very location that is supposed to represent the founding of our nation and our rights.  I  wonder what the Founders would think if they knew an American was treated this way for exercising his first and second amendment rights.  
> 
> How is what Adam did crazier than the mob who taunted the red coats during the Boston Massacre, or the Boston Tea Party, or the tarring and feathering of loyalists, etc.?


It's still a felony and he's plainly guilty of it. What will come of it? This isn't going to the supreme court or anything. He's going to sit in a cell for years for a little blurb on the internet. If the point was to effect change, he failed miserably.

----------


## Deborah K

> It's still a felony and he's plainly guilty of it. What will come of it? This isn't going to the supreme court or anything. He's going to sit in a cell for years for a little blurb on the internet. If the point was to effect change, he failed miserably.


Do you have a crystal ball that I don't know about?  And you're missing the point when you speak of Adam committing a felony.  The laws he broke are clearly unconstitutional and he was practicing civil disobedience.  Should Rosa Parks have given up her seat because of a law?  What about Harriet Tubman?  Sometimes breaking unjust laws is the only way to bring attention to an issue.  You may think Adam is a fool, but I respect his sacrifice.  We all need to examine closely now, whether _we_ have the courage of our convictions.

----------


## phill4paul

> Really? Aside from a few internet sites, nobody will mention or remember his name. This isn't going to be in the history books in school. Is that worth sitting in a cell for years?


  AuH2O sock puppet? Get a room...

----------


## Weston White

According to this attorneys Website (Koehler Law), the operability of the firearm is not relevant; also that carrying a rifle or shotgun in public qualifies the firearms violation to a classified felony.

In order to prove this offense as a felony, the government must also prove that the defendant carried the rifle or shotgun in a place other than his/her home, place of business, or land/premises possessed and controlled by the defendant.

Firearm is defined as a weapon, regardless of operability, that is designed as or readily converted into a device that can expel a bullet or other projectile by an action of an explosive.

The offense of carrying a rifle or shotgun is punishable as a misdemeanor by a fine of not more than $1,000 and/or imprisonment for up to one year.  The offense as a felony carries a maximum sentence of 5 years and/or fine of up to $5,000.  D.C. Code § 22-4504(a-1).   D.C. Code § 22-4515.

Additionally as to other potential charges:

If the barrel of his shotgun is less than 20, *possession of a prohibited weapon*: The offense of possessing a prohibited weapon is punishable as a misdemeanor by up to one year in prison and/or a maximum fine of $1,000.  However, defendants who have been previously been convicted of this offense or of a felony, either in D.C. or in another jurisdiction, are subject to punishment of up to 10 years in prison.  D.C. Criminal Code § 22-4514.  D.C. Criminal Code § 22-4515.

*Possession of unregistered firearm*: The penalty for violating this section is a maximum fine of $1000 and/or a maximum of one year imprisonment.  D.C. Criminal Code 7-2502.01.

*Possession of ammunition*: A person guilty of this charge can be sentenced to a maximum fine of $1000 and/or up to a year imprisonment.  D.C. Criminal Code 7-2506.01.

*A felon or drug addict in possession of firearm* (ergo, enter thy magic mushrooms): Other defendants charged with unlawful possession of a firearm (e.g., drug addicts and fugitives from justice) will be sentenced to 2 to 10 years imprisonment and/or will receive a maximum fine of $15,000.  D.C. Criminal Code § 22-4503.

See at: http://koehlerlaw.net/drug-offense/w...hotgun-in-d-c/

----------


## 69360

> Do you have a crystal ball that I don't know about?  And you're missing the point when you speak of Adam committing a felony.  The laws he broke are clearly unconstitutional and he was practicing civil disobedience.  Should Rosa Parks have given up her seat because of a law?  What about Harriet Tubman?  Sometimes breaking unjust laws is the only way to bring attention to an issue.  You may think Adam is a fool, but I respect his sacrifice.  We all need to examine closely now, whether _we_ have the courage of our convictions.


Yes I think it was stupid and will do nothing to further his cause because the general public won't know about it and doesn't care. Not being able to carry in DC outrages very few people. Black people's lack of civil rights enraged a lot. Simple numbers tell you he will fail, not enough people care.

FWIW, I think we should be able to carry in DC, but don't think it will ever happen. It's not a priority. The best solution is to get yourself to a state where you can carry.




> AuH2O sock puppet? Get a room...


If I'm somebody's sock puppet they put a hell of a lot of effort into into it

----------


## Deborah K

> Yes I think it was stupid and will do nothing to further his cause because the general public won't know about it and doesn't care.


So tell me, exactly what causes do you further? Anything that requires risk?  Or do you just safely donate and attend the occasional event? 




> The best solution is to get yourself to a state where you can carry


.

I live in a state where open carry WAS legal, and now it isn't.  So for me, it would make no sense at all to pack up and leave in the hopes that laws will or won't change.

----------


## Weston White

> If I'm somebody's sock puppet they put a hell of a lot of effort into into it


Oh come on now!  I mean let's be honest, it did not really take that much work.

----------


## 69360

> So tell me, exactly what causes do you further? Anything that requires risk?  Or do you just safely donate and attend the occasional event? 
> 
> .
> 
> I live in a state where open carry WAS legal, and now it isn't.  So for me, it would make no sense at all to pack up and leave in the hopes that laws will or won't change.


I don't recall saying that I wanted to be a visible activist. I like being anonymous. Nothing presently inspires me enough to go to jail. Talk about yes, do something stupid no. I prefer to take care of myself first, get to a safe place, keep a low profile. It could change someday. But for now if I don't like something, I proactively remove myself from it.

----------


## 69360

> Oh come on now!  I mean let's be honest, it did not really take that much work.


If you really think I'm somebody's sock puppet, report me to the mods and have them check my IP and post history. You're going to look stupid.

----------


## phill4paul

> I prefer to take care of myself first,


  Noble. This. SMFH.

----------


## Deborah K

> I don't recall saying that I wanted to be a visible activist. I like being anonymous. Nothing presently inspires me enough to go to jail. Talk about yes, do something stupid no. I prefer to take care of myself first, get to a safe place, keep a low profile. It could change someday. But for now if I don't like something, I proactively remove myself from it.


It appears that not only do you proactively remove yourself from it, you proactively harshly criticize that with which you disagree. So basically, you really have nothing significant to offer.  What motivates you to come to this forum?

----------


## phill4paul

> It appears that not only do you proactively remove yourself from it, you proactively harshly criticize that with which you disagree. So basically, you really have nothing significant to offer.  *What motivates you to come to this forum?*


  Like AuH20, 69360, is here for FUD.

----------


## WhistlinDave

> This can be used to our benefit. The state is over-reaching and most rational people will question their response. Adam just did the Constitution a favor.


I think that's his whole point with everything he's doing.  With this latest stunt, he has managed to get on national cable news TV (MSM).  He's spreading awareness of what government has become.

----------


## Weston White

> If you really think I'm somebody's sock puppet, report me to the mods and have them check my IP and post history. You're going to look stupid.


Internet proxies, they're everywhere.

----------


## phill4paul

> I think that's his whole point with everything he's doing.  With this latest stunt, he has managed to get on national cable news TV (MSM).  He's spreading awareness of what government has become.


  I don't watch MSM TV. THIS has made it that far? Regardless of the message I'd have to give Kokesh props. MSM? Woo-hoo.

----------


## devil21

Adam should claim it was a green screen propaganda video lol.

Oh the irony.

----------


## kcchiefs6465

> Neither will Ron Paul.





> Or 69360.


+reps.

----------


## MelissaCato

> With this latest stunt, he has managed to get on national cable news TV (MSM).  He's spreading awareness of what government has become.


^^ This. Smoke down prohibition didn't work. The 4th of July did. It's nice to know nobody was hurt and the Blue is ok.

----------


## QuickZ06

Well I just watched that Houston Free Thinkers video when they interviewed Adam's manager, cannot believe they did not expect the government to come for him. It would have been nice to give him my opinion on the subject matter on what could be expected after he did his D.C. video. But he pretty much got ran off like many other posters throughout the past. They should have had that place filled will cameras and had that place on lockdown.

----------


## tod evans

The Communist Newz Netwerk ran the story this morning, front page.

The comments, if reflective of Boobus, point to disaster ahead..

http://www.cnn.com/2013/07/10/us/dc-...html?hpt=hp_t3

----------


## tmg19103

> What a dumbass yet again.* Is a line on drudge and 30 pages on RPF worth 5 or so years of his life?* The general public doesn't know about this or even care, outside this circle nobody will even hear of it. Oh the irony, wants gun rights but commits felony and becomes prohibited person. 
> 
> Still, didn't deserve to be swatted over this.


That's his personal choice in regards to his use of non-violent civil disobedience.

To me, the more glaring question is why is he facing jail time for exercising his 2A rights?

----------


## better-dead-than-fed

> I prefer to take care of myself first, get to a safe place, keep a low profile. It could change someday. But for now if I don't like something, I proactively remove myself from it.


Was Kokesh not cowardly enough to impress you?

----------


## tmg19103

> It's still a felony and he's plainly guilty of it. What will come of it? This isn't going to the supreme court or anything. He's going to sit in a cell for years for a little blurb on the internet. If the point was to effect change, he failed miserably.


How is he plainly guilty? Perhaps he intended to use a real gun and ammo as a point of civil disobedience and he will accept the unjust and unconstitutional punishment to demonstrate his point based on his principles. 

Sounds innocent to me as I read the Constitution.

So yeah, he's guilty of breaking an unconstitutional law. That does not make it just.

NSA spying on your computer is "legal" according to unconstitutional laws Congress passed. That's why I am impressed with Snowden.

Just wish Kokesh could have done this in a way that really brought it to the forefront and made it more of a national debate, but its his life to live as he sees fit.

----------


## Cap

> Yes I think it was stupid and will do nothing to further his cause *because the general public won't know about it* and doesn't care. Not being able to carry in DC outrages very few people. Black people's lack of civil rights enraged a lot. Simple numbers tell you he will fail, not enough people care.
> 
> FWIW, I think we should be able to carry in DC, but don't think it will ever happen. It's not a priority. The best solution is to get yourself to a state where you can carry.
> 
> 
> 
> If I'm somebody's sock puppet they put a hell of a lot of effort into into it


But we (the liberty movement) will, and that does matter.

----------


## presence

*Local News
*



http://www.wtop.com/41/3384202/Veteran-activist-Adam-Kokesh-held-without-bond




> Veteran, activist Adam Kokesh held without bond   
> *Thursday - 7/11/2013,  9:33am  ET*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Veteran and  activist Adam Kokesh
>  is seen in his booking photo following 
> his arrest  on two felony drug charges. 
> ...




http://www.wusa9.com/news/article/26...o-Answer-Judge



> WASHINGTON (WUSA9) -- Gun rights activist Adam Kokesh was ordered  held without bond after reportedly refusing to answer a judge on  Thursday. His next court date is scheduled for October 2.
>  Kokesh, a former Marine, was arrested for possessing hallucinogenic  mushrooms while also having a gun on Tuesday night at his home in  Herndon, Va. Before his arrest, Kokesh posted a video that appeared to  show him loading a shotgun with live ammunition in Freedom Plaza in D.C.  on the Fourth of July. 
> 
> 
> 
>  Wednesday, Kokesh who is being held at the Fairfax Adult Detention  Center was supposed to appear in court via closed circuit television,  but he refused. Another hearing was scheduled for Thursday. 
>  Thursday, Kokesh was handcuffed and in a wheelchair surrounded by 6  sheriff's deputies when he refused to reply to a judge's question on  closed circuit TV.  
> *
> The question was "Are you Adam Kokesh?" The judge  told Kokesh, "I will take your silence as consent" before ordering  Kokesh held without bond.*
> ...



http://www.wjla.com/articles/2013/07...ent-91237.html



> Appearing before a judge handcuffed and in a wheelchair, libertarian  activist and Internet show host Adam Kokesh refused to speak Thursday  morning during an arraignment on drug and gun charges.
> 
> Kokesh  was arrested late Tuesday night at his home in Herndon and charged with  drug possession and having drugs while possessing a firearm. Authorities say that they found hallucinogenic mushrooms during a search of his Snowflake Court home.
>  The U.S. Park Police raid came less than a week after Kokesh posted a video of himself purportedly loading and cocking a shotgun in Freedom Plaza, just steps from the White House.
>  Appearing via teleconference in a Fairfax County court, Kokesh  wouldn't answer questions nor identify himself, even after the judge  repeatedly addressed him.
> 
>  "Mr. Kokesh," the judge said as the defendant stared wide-eyed into the camera. He did not respond.
>  "I'll take your silence as your consent," the judge then said before reading the charges against him.
>  Kokesh being held without bond at the Fairfax County Adult Detention Center and faces an Oct. 2 public hearing.
> ...

----------


## Bastiat's The Law

> Martyrs don't contribute to the effort since they have been "removed." You understand?


The truly evil regimes don't even allow activists to becomes martyrs; they simply disappear never to be seen or heard from again.  Not having a tangible place to rally or morn can be a devastatingly powerful psychological weapon to wield.

----------


## angelatc

I just got up.  No news on Adam?

----------


## jkr

He aint the first, he wont be the last


ladies & gentleman, "WE" are under attack.
Without being overly dramatic, the eYe of sauron *IS* on "us"

Who has the balls to poke that $#@!er in the eye?

THIS GUY does.


While I  am sure we disagree on the structural mechanisms of existence and the nature of GOD, we agree that men are NOT worth of worship, power & adulation. For that I applaud him.

If he is so serious that he would lay down his life to prove a point then a coward like me, who does nothing, has to appreciate his resolve AND how his story will be used for, and against, "US".


He is tearing down their illusion over society! TEAR DOWN THE WALL Adam!!!

----------


## presence

> I just got up.  No news on Adam?


http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...=1#post5119674

----------


## Thor

> Kokesh faces two drug charges, including one involving possession of a firearm. The Fairfax County Sheriff's Department tells WTOP the charges are possession of a Schedule 1 or 2 drug and possession of a Schedule 1 or 2 drug while in possession of a firearm.


I am confused.  I thought they did not find any firearms in the house during the raid.  Did they?  

And as the roommate stated, there is no way you can link any illegal drugs specifically to Adam.  Either there were no drugs and they were planted; or if there were drugs, they could have belonged to Adam or to any of the roommates or been left behind by friends/guests. So won't the burden of proof be nearly impossible to show the illegal drugs were even his, versus a roommate or some random person left behind in the house/studio.  

And if they found 1 singular entity of illegal drugs ('shrooms), are they throwing 2 charges at him for the same singular entity of illegal drugs?

So in theory, these charges will not hold water.  In theory.

----------


## pcosmar

> http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...=1#post5119674


So,, no news then. 
(we knew all that yesterday)

----------


## pcosmar

> I am confused.  I thought they did not find any firearms in the house during the raid.  Did they?  
> 
> And as the roommate stated, there is no way you can link any illegal drugs specifically to Adam.  Either there were no drugs and they were planted; or if there were drugs, they could have belonged to Adam or to any of the roommates or been left behind by friends/guests. So won't the burden of proof be nearly impossible to show the illegal drugs were even his, versus a roommate or some random person left behind in the house/studio.  
> 
> And if they found 1 singular entity of illegal drugs ('shrooms), are they throwing 2 charges at him for the same singular entity of illegal drugs?
> 
> So in theory, these charges will not hold water.  In theory.


I'm sure they did not mount the particular show of massive force,, without ensuring that there would be charges.
Either by planting drugs,, or by having someone in the house planting drugs.

The warrant,, in and of itself is highly questionable. Squash that and everything goes with it.

----------


## Brian4Liberty

Adam Kokesh, Political Prisoner - Day 3.

----------


## 69360

> That's his personal choice in regards to his use of non-violent civil disobedience.
> 
> To me, the more glaring question is why is he facing jail time for exercising his 2A rights?


Because it's illegal in DC and none of the residents seem to care to change that.




> Was Kokesh not cowardly enough to impress you?


I don't care enough about gun rights in DC to sit in jail for years over it. I think carrying should be legal, but don't see much protest from residents there. Could a time come in the future where an issue is important enough to me to risk that, possibly. We have plenty of states that allow open or concealed carry, live there. Who would want to live in the city of DC anyway? It's noisy, dirty and crowded.




> But we (the liberty movement) will, and that does matter.


So sitting in a cell for years to impress a tiny fraction of the population and effect no change is worth it?

----------


## AuH20

The Mossberg shotgun used in the controversial video is the key piece of evidence that could really complicate Adam's case. To my knowledge, no weapon was discovered in the raid, which is good news.

----------


## presence

> The Mossberg shotgun used in the controversial video is the key piece of evidence that could really complicate Adam's case. To my knowledge, no weapon was discovered in the raid, which is good news.




http://www.wusa9.com/news/article/26...o-Answer-Judge



> *"A 12-gauge shotgun was taken, yes,"* said Lucas Jewell. 
> 
> Jewell called the raid an "armed invasion." 
> 
> He added, "They took a lot of firearms, some ammo."

----------


## better-dead-than-fed

> Because it's illegal in DC and none of the residents seem to care to change that.


How can something be illegal if it is a constitutional right?




> Could a time come in the future where an issue is important enough to me to risk that, possibly.


What issue would be important enough to you?

----------


## dinosaur

> http://www.wusa9.com/news/article/26...o-Answer-Judge


Ugh, why would you have that stuff stored in your house right before baiting them?  Is the point of this to get arrested?  Snowden is a martyr, but his plan was not to get himself deliberately arrested.  Martyrs typically don't do something in order to get arrested.  I'm having a lot of trouble understanding the point of all this.  Could someone please explain the logic of this to me?

----------


## AuH20

> Ugh, why would you have that stuff stored in your house right before baiting them?  Is the point of this to get arrested?  Snowden is a martyr, but his plan was not to get himself deliberately arrested.  Martyrs typically don't do something in order to get arrested.  I'm having a lot of trouble understanding the point of all this.  Could someone please explain the logic of this to me?


Kokesh is ultimately the only person who can answer your question and I assume he will in due time. But certainly as I stated ad nauseum yesterday, at face value the anticipated payoff doesn't mesh with the punishment. Snowden's expose rocked a superpower, while Adam's operation appears poorly conceived, unless there is more to this.

----------


## Cap

Can we find a liberty minded lawyer to defend him? Opportunity for us.

----------


## better-dead-than-fed

I have no more time today to spend searching for the case number, but if anyone posts it here, I'll retrieve all the court documents and post them. Or we could just keep speculating about the documents actually say.

----------


## dinosaur

> Kokesh is ultimately the only person who can answer your question and I assume he will in due time. But certainly as I stated ad nauseum yesterday, at face value the anticipated payoff doesn't mesh with the punishment. Snowden's expose rocked a superpower, while Adam's operation appears poorly conceived, unless there is more to this.


I hope there is more to this.

----------


## 69360

> What issue would be important enough to you?


A direct immediate threat to my family or property. I like to be left alone and do as I please. That is still possible in my part of the country.

----------


## better-dead-than-fed

> Ugh, why would you have that stuff stored in your house right before baiting them?  Is the point of this to get arrested?  Snowden is a martyr, but his plan was not to get himself deliberately arrested.  Martyrs typically don't do something in order to get arrested.  I'm having a lot of trouble understanding the point of all this.  Could someone please explain the logic of this to me?


What stuff are you asking about? This?




> Many of Kokesh's roommates freely admitted that they were legally carrying firearms with a concealed carry permit when the raid took place.


How would the point of that be to get arrested?

----------


## better-dead-than-fed

> A direct immediate threat to my family or property. I like to be left alone and do as I please. That is still possible in my part of the country.


Do you pay taxes?

----------


## dinosaur

> What stuff are you asking about? This?
> 
> 
> 
> How would the point of that be to get arrested?


Someone as politically aware as Adam knows the drill...first they search, then they "find" evidence.  "This" (the video) would be inviting them to do that.  I'm not sure what the payoff of the video was, did it wake a lot of people up?  Or is there more to the plan?  I guess we'll see.

----------


## pcosmar

> Ugh, why would you have that stuff stored in your house right before baiting them?


What makes you think Adam was "storing" anything in his house?

*Because they said so?*

News Flash.. Cops Plant Drugs. Cops Plant evidence.  All the time. It is routine. a "method of operation".

Proving they did it is sometimes difficult,, but finding numerous cases where this has been done,, and proven to have been done,, is easy.

----------


## better-dead-than-fed

> Ugh, why would you have that stuff *stored in your house* right before baiting them?  Is the point of this to get arrested?  Snowden is a martyr, but his plan was not to get himself deliberately arrested.  Martyrs typically don't do something in order to get arrested.  I'm having a lot of trouble understanding the point of all this.  Could someone please explain the logic of this to me?





> Someone as politically aware as Adam knows the drill...first they search, then they "find" evidence.  "This" (the video) would be inviting them to do that.  I'm not sure what the payoff of the video was, did it wake a lot of people up?  Or is there more to the plan?  I guess we'll see.


Still unclear what stuff in his house you're talking about.

----------


## presence

Pete Santilli 4 hours episode 465


start at about minute 34 for discussion of Kokesh; Santilli Describes his personal relationship to Kokesh.




> Chronology Episode 465 July 10, 2013 PST
> 
> 
>       10:00am – 10:30am
> 
>       Pete and Susannah have a light and loose beginning. They say hello  to their listeners and give a brief synopsis of what is happening on the  show today. 
> 
>       10:30 – 11:00
> 
> ...

----------


## dinosaur

> Still unclear what stuff in his house you're talking about.


Yeah, OK I get your question now.  Still confused by the whole thing...but a lot of what Adam does makes no sense to me.  I tend to agree with AuH2O that the payoff didn't match the risk, but hoping I am wrong to be suspicious of the guy.  I do hope there is a plan behind this.

----------


## kcchiefs6465

> I have no more time today to spend searching for the case number, but if anyone posts it here, I'll retrieve all the court documents and post them. Or we could just keep speculating about the documents actually say.


I've looked all around, can't find it.

Short of calling where he is being held I am not sure how you'd find it.

Someone here should know how to get in contact with his roommates and maybe they'll have it.

----------


## kahless

Is there a video of the home invasion by the state criminals?  

If I was protesting in the manner Kokesh was I would be waiting with hidden surveillance cameras in my home knowing they were coming eventually.  That is unless they confiscated it.

----------


## better-dead-than-fed

> Yeah, OK I get your question now.  Still confused by the whole thing...but a lot of what Adam does makes no sense to me.  I tend to agree with AuH2O that the payoff didn't match the risk, but hoping I am wrong to be suspicious of the guy.  I do hope there is a plan behind this.


I don't know either. If nothing else, jail is a great place to network and make resourceful connections -- connections who are continually being released back into the outside world.

----------


## pcosmar

> Is there a video of the home invasion by the state criminals?  
> 
> If I was protesting in the manner Kokesh was I would be waiting with hidden surveillance cameras in my home knowing they were coming eventually.  That is unless they confiscated it.



unless that is being saved. The last arrest was not clear on the initial videos released.

Later good quality ones showed the police to be *Blatantly* lying,, and Adam was released.

----------


## presence

Free Adam Kokesh Call Flood for Virginia (Official) 
Free Adam Kokesh and Shield Mutual
https://www.facebook.com/FreeAdamKokesh










> July 10 at 9:00am until July 11 at 5:00pm in EDT
> 
> 
> 
>     Please pick up your phone for Adam, call and politely but firmly demand his immediate and unconditional release. Ranked in order of importance:
> 
> "I demand the immediate and unconditional release of Adam Kokesh and the dropping of all charges against him."
> 
> (1) Fairfax County Commonwealth's Attorney: (703) 246-2776
> ...


https://www.facebook.com/events/1398028477077004/


how to call flood:
http://shieldmutual.com/2013/06/how-call-flood/

----------


## Bastiat's The Law

> Can we find a liberty minded lawyer to defend him? Opportunity for us.


ACLU might be the only hope.

----------


## better-dead-than-fed

> (1) Fairfax County Commonwealth's Attorney: (703) 246-2776


They tell me

Fairfax County General District Court, cases:

gc13152459 possession
gc13152461 gun w drug

They had no information about any federal charges.

----------


## presence

*Free Adam Kokesh shared a link.*

Yesterday


Please  share: 


At this time, 

Shield Mutual is raising $1,200 to fund national  distribution for 3 press releases. 


This case is even more high profile  than Adam’s 18 May 2013 arrest. National media is covering it but  outlets like CNN and Fox are presenting a  police narrative. We need to present Adam’s narrative to all the top  national media outlets and we need to start doing that now.


http://freeadam.net/2013/07/10/press-releases/#donate



Click Here to  go to Donation Form

----------


## presence

> ACLU might be the only hope.




One of our members said they were a lawyer a few days ago in the "what is your occupation" thread... around page 20.  Don't remember who.

----------


## Occam's Banana

> ACLU might be the only hope.


The ACLU is notorious for its willful blindness when it comes to 2nd amendment cases.

Unfortunately, they will be no more help than the NRA ...

----------


## presence

> *At Adam’s specific request*, Shield Mutual is now offering a
> *Bitcoin*  donation option. This is the address: 
> 
> 143ciQqyerud8srrh2DDc45UZfAHswTihx
> 
> We’re also now taking Litecoin as well. The address:
> 
> 
> LcEnTbmxi6cDtgaamPL8kwFNouAr6VtYSe


Any cash Adam raises can be held against him and cause increases in fines or bail.  Not so with Bitcoin.

----------


## pcosmar

> The ACLU is notorious for its willful blindness when it comes to 2nd amendment cases.
> 
> Unfortunately, they will be no more help than the NRA ...


Sad, but true.

----------


## The Free Hornet

> ACLU might be the only hope.


The Institute for Justice maybe:

http://ij.org/

----------


## tod evans

> They tell me
> 
> Fairfax County General District Court, cases:
> 
> gc13152459 possession
> gc13152461 gun w drug
> 
> They had no information about any federal charges.


Good that the feds aren't involved yet!

At least I hope they're not...

----------


## Root

Wow, I go off grid for a few days and this...

I couldn't read the whole thread, got too noisy... but I have a few questions if someone could fill in some blanks for me.

What was the search warrant for?  
What was the justification for a no-knock warrant (offcer safety I presume)?
Who is the judge (lawyer in costume) who signed the warrant?
Did Adam really have contraband mushrooms?
How do we really know they are not just exotic edible mushrooms?
Who is the victim of the crimes he was suspected in the warrant?

----------


## presence

> Case/Defendant Information
> 
>  Case Number :
>  GC13152459-00
> File Date :
>  07/10/2013
> Locality :
>  COMMONWEALTH OF VA
> 
> ...






> Case/Defendant Information
> 
>  Case Number :
>  GC13152461-00
> File Date :
>  07/10/2013
> Locality :
>  COMMONWEALTH OF VA
> 
> ...



http://epwsgdp1.courts.state.va.us/g...lCaseSearch.do

----------


## presence

> *§ 18.2-308.4. Possession of firearms while in possession of certain substances.* 
> 
>   A. It shall be unlawful for any person unlawfully in possession of a controlled substance classified in Schedule I or II of the Drug Control Act (§ 54.1-3400 et seq.) of Title 54.1 to simultaneously with knowledge and intent possess any firearm. A violation of this subsection is a Class 6 felony and constitutes a separate and distinct felony. 
>   B. It shall be unlawful for any person unlawfully in possession of a controlled substance classified in Schedule I or II of the Drug Control Act (§ 54.1-3400 et seq.) to simultaneously with knowledge and intent possess any firearm on or about his person. A violation of this subsection is a Class 6 felony and constitutes a separate and distinct felony and any person convicted hereunder* shall be sentenced to a mandatory minimum term of imprisonment of two years.* Such punishment shall be separate and apart from, and shall be made to run consecutively with, any punishment received for the commission of the primary felony. 
>   C. It shall be unlawful for any person to possess, use, or attempt to use any pistol, shotgun, rifle, or other firearm or display such weapon in a threatening manner while committing or attempting to commit the illegal manufacture, sale, distribution, or the possession with the intent to manufacture, sell, or distribute a controlled substance classified in Schedule I or Schedule II of the Drug Control Act (§ 54.1-3400 et seq.), synthetic cannabinoids or more than one pound of marijuana. A violation of this subsection is a Class 6 felony, and constitutes a separate and distinct felony and any person convicted hereunder shall be sentenced to a mandatory minimum term of imprisonment of five years. Such punishment shall be separate and apart from, and shall be made to run consecutively with, any punishment received for the commission of the primary felony. 
>   (1987, c. 285; 1990, c. 625; 1992, c. 707; 1993, c. 831; 1999, cc. 829, 846; 2003, c. 949; 2004, cc. 461, 995; 2011, cc. 384, 410.) 
> 
> * § 18.2-250. Possession of controlled substances unlawful.* 
>   A. It is unlawful for any person knowingly or intentionally to possess a controlled substance unless the substance was obtained directly from, or pursuant to, a valid prescription or order of a practitioner while acting in the course of his professional practice, or except as otherwise authorized by the Drug Control Act (§ 54.1-3400 et seq.). 
> ...


http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp...cod+18.2-308.4

----------


## presence

Adam's Girlfriend (who was in the shower when they got raided)

*Adam Vs The Man**  will stay online WITHOUT Kokesh** while he is imprisoned.*




> *In a world like this we have to assume they shot the dog.*

----------


## Anti Federalist

> Seriously. Is this the new way of serving a search warrant?


You're not asking a serious question are you?

----------


## Anti Federalist

> http://epwsgdp1.courts.state.va.us/g...lCaseSearch.do


Off to the Gulag, to be forgotten within a few months, to wither and die along with the rest of the politicals.

SMMFH...brave sonofabitch.

----------


## Occam's Banana

> The Institute for Justice maybe:
> 
> http://ij.org/


IJ litigates economic liberties cases (anti-competitive licensure schemes and the like). They are very good at it, too.

But Adam's case is "out of portfolio" for IJ. I seriously doubt they'd take it on. It just isn't in their bailiwick.

----------


## Cap

> One of our members said they were a lawyer a few days ago in the "what is your occupation" thread... around page 20.  Don't remember who.


I believe it was jmdrake. Wouldn't that be cool.

----------


## 69360

> Do you pay taxes?


Income tax to the fed? No, I'm in the half of the country that doesn't owe.

----------


## amy31416

> I believe it was jmdrake. Wouldn't that be cool.


I believe he's still in law school, but there may be another one here, can't think of who.

----------


## better-dead-than-fed

> Originally Posted by better-dead-than-fed
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  Originally Posted by 69360
> ...


You don't consider taxation to be a direct immediate threat to your family or property?

----------


## AuH20

> You don't consider taxation to be a direct immediate threat to your family or property?


Correct. Calculate how many years of our lives are being siphoned off to these oligarchs and special interests via taxation. It's pretty horrifying to think about. Phony wars, infanticide, wall street graft, welfare fraud. We're literally giving away our precious lifeforce to fund all these criminal endeavors.

----------


## Deborah K

> Free Adam Kokesh Call Flood for Virginia (Official) 
> Free Adam Kokesh and Shield Mutual
> https://www.facebook.com/FreeAdamKokesh
> 
> 
> https://www.facebook.com/events/1398028477077004/
> 
> 
> how to call flood:
> http://shieldmutual.com/2013/06/how-call-flood/


+rep




> *Liberty activists have been released in the past solely upon the outpouring of public support that came via a flood call. Government "justice" is not impartial. When government decision-makers know that Adam still has an overwhelming amount of support and that we stand ready to voice that support in ways that are not convenient for these bureaucrats, then we can convince them that Adam is more trouble than he is worth.*


Nothing ventured, nothing gained.

This is an opportunity for this movement to finally stand behind one of its own, Adam haters notwithstanding.  D.C. and the media that is covering this should experience an outpouring of support for what Adam has done.  As I stated previously, it's past time to expose the absurdity and incongruity of the gun restrictions in the one location that was supposed to represent the founding of our nation and our rights. Adam has forced us to examine the courage of our OWN convictions.  And as this poster on facebook put it:




> *James Oliver Deckard*: First they came for Adam Kokesh, and I didn't do anything because he was Adam Kokesh...

----------


## presence

> Adam has forced us to examine the courage of our OWN convictions.


+rep back at ya

----------


## Philhelm

> Adam has forced us to examine the courage of our OWN convictions.


There's nobody here but us mice!

----------


## The Free Hornet

> IJ litigates economic liberties cases (anti-competitive licensure schemes and the like). They are very good at it, too.
> 
> But Adam's case is "out of portfolio" for IJ. I seriously doubt they'd take it on. It just isn't in their bailiwick.


Good point.  Although I see the Prison-Industrial Complex as an example of the 'war on men'.  Although race/poverty are strong components, it tends to ensure that anyone who is a threat in business as competitor (e.g., to big pharma, media) or exposer of their foibles (IT/banking - BS 'hacking' charges) is easily eliminated.

----------


## Dr.3D

> Good point.  Although I see the Prison-Industrial Complex as an example of the 'war on men'.  Although race/poverty are strong components, it tends to ensure that anyone who is a threat in business as competitor (e.g., to big pharma, media) or exposer of their foibles (IT/banking - BS 'hacking' charges) *is easily eliminated*.


Especially with all of the medical marijuana people out there who own deer rifles and shotguns.

----------


## pcosmar

> Especially with all of the medical marijuana people out there who own deer rifles and shotguns.


Not to mention all of the folks with prescriptions to Dangerous Psychotics and Pain killers.

----------


## presence

> Town of Herndon Police Lt. Jim Moore said*
> 
>  the local department was  called Tuesday night* *
> to assist officers from U.S. Parks**,
>  who served  Kokesh*
> 
>  with a search warrant on his home, located in the 1500 block of  Snowflake Court.
> Moore  said they wanted to search Kokesh's home after seeing a YouTube video  he posted on July 4th, where he appeared to be loading ammunition into a  shotgun in the middle of Freedom Plaza while talking to the camera.
> 
> ...


http://www.onenewspage.us/n/US/74vxq...operate-in.htm

----------


## pcosmar

> http://www.onenewspage.us/n/US/74vxq...operate-in.htm





> as officers found stashes of both drugs and weapons in his home.


I would "LOL",,but this $#@! ain't funny.

Stashes of weapons? Really.  
Isn't Virgina one of the "Gun Friendly" states? Is not the right to have guns in your home even recognized in DC?

I expect the drugs were planted or brought there by someone working with the police,, that is yet to be seen..

But "stashes of guns".. This should be outraging many.

----------


## Root

I've always wondered what guns Adam own(ed).  I guess we'll find out.

----------


## Dr.3D

> Not to mention all of the folks with prescriptions to Dangerous Psychotics and Pain killers.


The point is, they can break into any of the homes these people live in and find guns and drugs.

----------


## cjm

> I would "LOL",,but this $#@! ain't funny.
> 
> Stashes of weapons? Really.  
> Isn't Virgina one of the "Gun Friendly" states? Is not the right to have guns in your home even recognized in DC?
> 
> I expect the drugs were planted or brought there by someone working with the police,, that is yet to be seen..
> 
> But "stashes of guns".. This should be outraging many.


I thought the same thing when I read that.  Stash = Safe or Cabinet?  Heh, there are many of those in Virginia.

----------


## pcosmar

> I've always wondered what guns Adam own(ed).  I guess we'll find out.


Wouldn't it be interesting if out of all the guns found,, (Adams and others in the house at the time) none were a Mossberg 12ga.

(the gun from the "offending" video)

----------


## cjm

> Wouldn't it be interesting if out of all the guns found,, (Adams and others in the house at the time) none were a Mossberg 12ga.
> 
> (the gun from the "offending" video)


I would not be surprised if that were the case.  If I were in his shoes, I probably would not have stored it at my primary residence.

----------


## presence

> allegedly using excessive force on those who were present and leaving the property in shambles.          Helicopters, flash grenades, a SWAT Team, and other various officers of the law might seem like overkill 
> []
> Kokesh was kicked in the stomach upon requesting to use the bathroom


Read more:  http://www.digitaljournal.com/articl...#ixzz2YlklLJZy

----------


## cjm

> Read more:  http://www.digitaljournal.com/articl...#ixzz2YlklLJZy


They picked a good photo of Adam for that article:

----------


## Deborah K

Has this update been posted yet?

http://freeadam.net/2013/07/11/armed-sedition/#comments





> Here are some news updates for Adam Kokesh for July 11, 2013. I will keep this post updated with any further news that comes out today.
> Adam was forcibly arraigned very early this morning. He is being held without bail pending a probable cause hearing. Early this morning, he was dragged barefoot in shorts out of the cage they put him in and carted to the arraignment in a wheelchair. He did not participate in the arraignment because he has been denied access to a lawyer.
> Adam was able to make a call to his father. His father thinks that Adam may not be allowed to make another call anytime soon.
> Adam wants a lawyer. He has requested access to a lawyer constantly since being caged. He refuses to go to court without a lawyer. Adams manager, Lucas Jewell, is working on getting him trusted counsel ASAP.
> Adam is being held in solitary confinement in a 6.5′ x 7.5′ cage without bedding. He was kidnapped while wearing shorts and has not been given proper clothing to protect him from the frigid temperatures that have become standard operating procedure in Americas prisons.
> Adam reports via his father that the cage he has been locked into is infested with ants. Furthermore, the lights are kept on by the guards 24 hours per day without any break for rest.
> A public defender is expected to be appointed at 3PM Eastern today. 3:20PM EDT Update: I spoke with the public defenders office and they still have not received the paperwork from the court that is required before appointing a public defender. One will not be appointed today (11 Jul 2013).
> Adams phone call to his father was monitored by a sheriffs deputy standing right next to him as he spoke with his father.
> During the attack on his home Tuesday evening, the flashbang (stun grenade) deployed by militarized US Park Police exploded right in front of Adam. He reports that he has yet to receive any medical care inside the prison.
> ...

----------


## pcosmar

> I would not be surprised if that were the case.  If I were in his shoes, I probably would not have stored it at my primary residence.


As I understand,, several of the team were armed,, and Adam likely owns guns.

However there is no proof (as yet) that the gun used in the video (the reason for search warrant) was owned by Adam. Or that he had transported it to DC.

It could very well have been a legal gun from someone in DC.. and not Adams at all.

I suspect this warrant will not stand even the slightest scrutiny. And proving that any weapon found in Adams home was that particular gun is nearly impossible.

I also suspect the drug charge to be bogus. If they had found a seed,,a roach or some pot dust I may have bought it. 
But a thorough search found none of that.

That alone makes it suspect.

----------


## Dr.3D

I'm still confused about the drugs and guns thing.   Are all of the people in Colorado who have guns and smoke pot just sitting ducks?

----------


## better-dead-than-fed

> I'm still confused about the drugs and guns thing.   Are all of the people in Colorado who have guns and smoke pot just sitting ducks?


Yes.




> It shall be unlawful for any person...(3) who is an unlawful user of ... any controlled substance (as defined in section 102 of the Controlled Substances Act (21 U.S.C. 802));...to ship or transport in interstate or foreign commerce, or possess in or affecting commerce, any firearm or ammunition; or to receive any firearm or ammunition which has been shipped or transported in interstate or foreign commerce.


18 USC 922(g)

----------


## Dr.3D

> Yes.


Guess the prison system will not have any problem keeping their cells filled then.

----------


## CPUd

> As I understand,, several of the team were armed,, and Adam likely owns guns.
> 
> However there is no proof (as yet) that the gun used in the video (the reason for search warrant) was owned by Adam. Or that he had transported it to DC.
> 
> It could very well have been a legal gun from someone in DC.. and not Adams at all.
> 
> I suspect this warrant will not stand even the slightest scrutiny. And proving that any weapon found in Adams home was that particular gun is nearly impossible.
> 
> I also suspect the drug charge to be bogus. If they had found a seed,,a roach or some pot dust I may have bought it. 
> ...


They will probably want one of the others involved in making the video to be a witness against Adam for them to bring federal charges.

----------


## Deborah K

If you want to write to Adam:

 ADAM C. KOKESH
 Inmate number: 2051995
 Fairfax County Adult Detention Center
 10520 Judicial Drive
 Fairfax, VA 22030

 Incoming mail will be opened and checked

When writing to Adam:
 Items commonly RETURNED by the ADC include:

 Letters or envelopes with lipstick or any type of stain or liquid mark on them
 Blank stationery, envelopes, post cards or greeting cards
 Musical or oversized cards
 Plastic cards or book markers
 Money orders not filled out
 Personal checks, travelers checks or cash
 Gang-related material
 Photographs of nude or partially clothed individuals
 Stickers on letters
 Stamp(s) or self-addressed stamped envelopes
 Items taped or glued to letters or cards
 Magazine pages, newspaper clippings or book pages (original or copies)
 More than five Internet printouts
 More than 10 photos in an envelope
 Photos larger than 4" x 6"
 Bank statements, credit card information or identifying documents

----------


## 69360

> You don't consider taxation to be a direct immediate threat to your family or property?


I just told you I don't pay and no it's not a direct threat.

Feds with guns on my property or the like is a threat.

----------


## better-dead-than-fed

> Income tax to the fed? No, I'm in the half of the country that doesn't owe.


I thought you were being sarcastic here. Never heard of a half of the country that doesn't owe.

----------


## presence

> Has this update been posted yet?
> 
> http://freeadam.net/2013/07/11/armed-sedition/#comments






> Here are some news updates for Adam Kokesh for July 11, 2013. I will  keep this post updated with any further news that comes out today.
> 
> •Adam was forcibly arraigned very early this morning. He is being held  without bail pending a probable cause hearing. Early this morning, he  was dragged barefoot in shorts out of the cage they put him in and  carted to the arraignment in a wheelchair. He did not participate in the  arraignment because he has been* 
> denied access to a lawyer.
> *
> •Adam was able to make a call to his father. His father thinks that Adam may not be allowed to make another call anytime soon.
> 
> •Adam wants a lawyer. He has requested access to a lawyer constantly  since being caged. He refuses to go to court without a lawyer. Adam’s  manager, Lucas Jewell, is working on getting him trusted counsel ASAP.
> 
> ...


no waterboarding?

----------


## torchbearer

> Off to the Gulag, to be forgotten within a few months, to wither and die along with the rest of the politicals.
> 
> SMMFH...brave sonofabitch.


i'm willing to do something about that.

----------


## 69360

> I thought you were being sarcastic here. Never heard of a half of the country that doesn't owe.


Did you miss the whole Romney 47% outrage?

----------


## Dr.3D

> I thought you were being sarcastic here. Never heard of a half of the country that doesn't owe.


Neither have I.  How do I move there?

----------


## presence

> i'm willing to do something about that.


I'm all ears.

----------


## torchbearer

> I'm all ears.


it would be extremely against forum guidelines to define that statement any furthur.
i can say with mortality closer, death isn't feared so much.

----------


## cjm

> ...It could very well have been a legal gun from someone in DC.. and not Adams at all...


Ha, now wouldn't _that_ be interesting!

----------


## pcosmar

> lights are kept on by the guards 24 hours


Sleep deprivation.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sleep_deprivation
http://sleepjunkies.com/features/sle...brief-history/
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/3376951.stm

----------


## torchbearer

> Sleep deprivation.
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sleep_deprivation
> http://sleepjunkies.com/features/sle...brief-history/
> http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/3376951.stm


they are doing this to a human being-
people would be freaking out if they were doing this to a dog.

----------


## pcosmar

> they are doing this to a human being-
> people would be freaking out if they were doing this to a dog.


Well,, except for those that just don't like Adam.

----------


## CPUd

> they are doing this to a human being-
> people would be freaking out if they were doing this to a dog.


They probably got pissed off he wouldn't talk and put him under observation until he gets a psych evaluation.

Although, some facilities do leave the lights on 24/7 as a policy, to make their count go faster, or to prevent people from getting stabbed in the middle of the night.

----------


## torchbearer

> They probably got pissed off he wouldn't talk and put him under observation until he gets a psych evaluation.
> 
> Although, some facilities do leave the lights on 24/7 as a policy, to make their count go faster, or to prevent people from getting stabbed in the middle of the night.



don't buy it.
its torture.

----------


## amy31416

> Well,, except for those that just don't like Adam.


Adam isn't my cup of tea, and I would never think this was the proper way to treat anyone who is being held captive.

----------


## Deborah K

> Adam isn't my cup of tea, and I would never think this was the proper way to treat anyone who is being held captive.


Adam isn't my cup of tea either.  But I respect his desire to restore our freedoms.  It is genuine.

----------


## amy31416

> Adam isn't my cup of tea either.  But I respect his desire to restore our freedoms.  It is genuine.


I can't argue anything either way, I don't know, but I respect your opinion.

----------


## kcchiefs6465

> They probably got pissed off he wouldn't talk and put him under observation until he gets a psych evaluation.
> 
> Although, some facilities do leave the lights on 24/7 as a policy, to make their count go faster, or to prevent people from getting stabbed in the middle of the night.


The only time I've read of the lights being kept on 24/7 was at Guantanamo Bay or in the basement of Leavenworth for a man who had killed a couple guards while incarcerated. (Thomas Silverstein)

Widely protested (not by the MSM, of course) and they justify it as punishing the prisoner and needing to show the others that should you stab a guard, your consequence is going to be far worse than just another 100 years on your sentence. Phones left to ring for hours on end, cold showers, loud music, being awoken if you happen to fall asleep to make sure you are still alive - these are all tactics used.

I would like to hear of a prison which has this as their stated policy. (aside from a small jail within a jail at Leavenworth) It is a form of torture which when accompanied by other methods and tactics becomes quite effective. It should not be tolerated. How can one have a fair trial without a good night's sleep? Being kept up all night then required to see the judge and prepare your defense is a damn shame. I don't care what the person did. And using these methods as a form of punishment is just as bad.

----------


## presence

> *Being kept up all night 
> then required to see the judge and prepare your defense
>  is a damn shame.*


+1

----------


## presence

> The carrying of a firearm in D.C. is currently illegal under D.C. laws, but those laws are themselves illegal as the U.S. Supreme Court has ruled them unconstitutional.  The D.C. (District of Criminals) has chosen to ignore the U.S. Supreme  Court, an act which is itself illegal. So Adam Kokesh's actions on video  -- which threatened no one and harmed no one -- were perfectly legal  under the law of the land (the U.S. Constitution and the U.S. Supreme  Court).
> 
> Kokesh fully expected to be raided after posting this  video.
> 
> *He is attempting to create
> a "Rosa Parks" test of civil liberties  to answer the question:
> will gun owners be treated like blacks* 
> 
> 
> used to  be treated, thrown to the back of the bus and oppressed because they  assert their Second Amendment rights?



Learn more:  http://www.naturalnews.com/041136_Ad...#ixzz2YmRZ39Qy




> *Mushrooms were obviously planted there by police*
> 
> Let me be the  first to state the obvious in all this: there is almost zero chance that  Adam Kokesh had hallucinogenic mushrooms at his residence, knowing full  well that a police raid was imminent following his shotgun video.
> 
> It's  the oldest police trick in the book: drop a bag of cocaine (or  whatever) on the scene, and charge the victim with a felony crime. They  knew Kokesh had firearms, and they also knew that "discovering" schedule  I drugs in his possession at the same time he possessed a firearm could  land Kokesh in prison for two years (or more). So it was a simple  matter to bring some drugs on the raid, drop them on the floor and then  seize them as "evidence."
> 
> Am I saying the cops in Fairfax County  are dirty?
> 
> *You bet I am.*
> ...

----------


## presence



----------


## presence

> libertymafia — The writers and editors at libertarianmafia fully support everything Adam is doing.





> I will keep this page updated as new information comes along.
> 
>  On the action front, I have prepared a prepared a press release for national distribution that should go out tomorrow morning.
>  Adam’s business team is working hard to support Adam in every possible way.
>  We need YOU to continue calling the decisionmakers in Virginia and  to stand by for further information and action requests. This stuff is  scary but we must have the courage and find the determination to never  lose hope and to continue working towards our shared vision of freedom  and justice, a vision that Adam Kokesh works for and adeptly represents.
>  George Donnelly george.donnelly@shieldmutual.com (215) 360-3513

----------


## presence

#freeadam  <<< hashtag

----------


## presence

*I submit that an individual who breaks a law
 that conscience tells him  isunjust, 
and who willingly accepts the penalty of imprisonment 
in  order to arouse the conscience of the community over its injustice,**
 is  in reality expressing the highest respect for law.

*_-MLK Letter From Birmingham Jail_

----------


## AuH20

> Adam isn't my cup of tea, and I would never think this was the proper way to treat anyone who is being held captive.


You can't be surprised by this? Can you? The system is rotten to the core. I hate to say it but the time for talking is over. These are irreconcilable differences.

----------


## presence

Through counter-intelligence it should be possible to
pinpoint potential trouble-makers... and neutralize them 
and neutralize them, and neutralize them, and neutralize them'



*How long?  Not long.*

----------


## muzzled dogg



----------


## jclay2

How in the world did the Federal Park Police gather enough evidence to have reasonable cause the Adam was holding mushrooms? This is such an obvious plant, it isn't even funny.

----------


## HOLLYWOOD

They used; Amour vehicles, blockaded the block, forced residence into their homes, SWAT TEAMS, Masked Enforcement, Undercover Plainclothes LE, Police Cars... 2 Low flying helicopters... HOW MUCH DID THIS COST THE TAX PAYERS? 

Park Police Out of Jurisdiction, Unconstitutional DC laws on loaded firearms, then of course, Dick $#@!in Tracy & company,   planting drugs in the house.  I'm sure Adam's fingerprints are all over it from handling it so many times?  This is where DNA can falsely incriminate you, since the criminal terror squad can just grab some DNA in the house and rub it all over the drugs.

It's so easy today for the state to setup anyone. Surprised they didn't have a spare "Sandwich" planted to frame Adam to a murder or something along those lines.

So, where's Virginia A.G. Ken Cuccinelli on this? Anyone contact his office?





> *I submit that an individual who breaks a law
>  that conscience tells him  isunjust, 
> and who willingly accepts the penalty of imprisonment 
> in  order to arouse the conscience of the community over its injustice,**
>  is  in reality expressing the highest respect for law.
> 
> *_-MLK Letter From Birmingham Jail_

----------


## ThePenguinLibertarian

the government is arresting a conspiracy theorist who has no ties to any organization with resources. My god, government is now more and more a great fiction.

----------


## cjm

> How in the world did the Federal Park Police gather enough evidence to have reasonable cause the Adam was holding mushrooms? This is such an obvious plant, it isn't even funny.


The arrest warrants were issued after they searched the house.  I don't think we've seen the search warrant yet.

----------


## jclay2

Look at the previous page. Someone posted a photo. It says he violated virginia code 18.2-250: Possession of unlawful controlled substances.

----------


## pcosmar

> They probably got pissed off he wouldn't talk and put him under observation until he gets a psych evaluation.
> 
> Although, some facilities do leave the lights on 24/7 as a policy, to make their count go faster, or to prevent people from getting stabbed in the middle of the night.


He already had a psych evaluation,, the last time they arrested him for bogus bull$#@!.

And they leave the lights on and chill the place to $#@! with people. NO other reason.

He has not been convicted of any crime and should be treated with courtesy and respect.

it is a rare jailer that does so,

----------


## cjm

> Look at the previous page. Someone posted a photo. It says he violated virginia code 18.2-250: Possession of unlawful controlled substances.


Right.  If you're talking about these below, then you can see that these are arrest warrants that were generated after the search.  They are dated 10 July 2013 at 1:42 and 1:45 AM.  The search was initiated on 09 July and whatever justified the search should be titled "search warrant" or similar, not "warrant of arrest."  Or am I missing something?




>

----------


## fr33

If you are going to video yourself loading weapons in a prohibited area or taking illegal substances; I respect the size of your balls and your right to do it but you had to see it coming. I do much less and worry about such an outcome.

----------


## kcchiefs6465

*Betterdeadthanfed* did you notice a case number has been posted? Any chance you could find some additional info with it?

----------


## AuH20

> If you are going to video yourself loading weapons in a prohibited area or taking illegal substances; I respect the size of your balls and your right to do it *but you had to see it coming.* I do much less and worry about such an outcome.


What's even stranger is that it is reported that he does not even have a lawyer!!! So if you're a high-profile activist who meddles with the authorities, logically you would think that the said person would have a lawyer in tow, due to their risky job profession. I'm starting to believe that the mushrooms are indeed Adam's and he just doesn't care. Maybe his mind is just gone from all the experimentation. But talk about not being prepared to do battle with the Evil Empire.

----------


## CPUd

> He already had a psych evaluation,, the last time they arrested him for bogus bull$#@!.
> 
> And they leave the lights on and chill the place to $#@! with people. NO other reason.
> 
> He has not been convicted of any crime and should be treated with courtesy and respect.
> 
> it is a rare jailer that does so,


I never meant to say or imply that's the reason they do it, more like that's the reason they say they do it.  Jailers are real good at covering their ass on paper and when people complain, it doesn't usually fall on sympathetic ears..

It's not the light that $#@!s with people, it's the sound coming from it.

----------


## Brian4Liberty

> He already had a psych evaluation,, the last time they arrested him for bogus bull$#@!.
> 
> And they leave the lights on and chill the place to $#@! with people. NO other reason.
> 
> He has not been convicted of any crime and should be treated with courtesy and respect.
> 
> it is a rare jailer that does so,


Cruel and unusual punishment. If it was a foreign country, US government would put sanctions on them and possibly incite regime change.

----------


## AuH20

> I never meant to say or imply that's the reason they do it, more like that's the reason they say they do it.  Jailers are real good at covering their ass on paper and when people complain, it doesn't usually fall on sympathetic ears..
> 
> It's not the light that $#@!s with people, it's the sound coming from it.


The human body needs natural darkness and long periods of deprivation can adversely affect one's psychological state as well as immune system.

----------


## Anti Federalist

> The arrest warrants were issued after they searched the house.  I don't think we've seen the search warrant yet.


Gotta love that:

"OK, what have we got to write up this paperwork on?"

----------


## CPUd

> The human body needs natural darkness and long periods of deprivation can adversely affect one's psychological state as well as immune system.


That's true.  But if you have something to cover your head up enough, the light is easier to deal with.You could try plugging your ears with TP, but the sound still makes its way through.

----------


## UWDude

In fairness, AuH20 is avoiding saying what Adam was openly saying, but wants to say it... ...and then chastises Adam for saying it.

AuH20 is saying kill them.  Off the pigs.  Read what he is writing, he is saying there should be an assassination campaign.  He is saying violence is all these people will understand.

Now he will cower in fear, and deny his words and what he meant, while calling Adam a coward for asking to take a piss.

And the only reason I'm calling you out for this, is because YOU are cutting the throat of your ally like a fool, instead of the throat of your enemy.

----------


## Thor

Back to the green screen tangent....

Someone in the DC / VA area should go to Freedom Plaza and from the same angle as Adam's video take a high res picture or 1 min video that we can all access.  Then those of us who can, we should do short green screen recordings of "I am Adam Kokesh" while loading a weapon (optional) and then have someone who can composite the Freedom Plaza backdrop into each green screen clip and start uploading them to YouTube.  Or compile multiple "I am Adam Kokesh" snippets into some longer videos.

Or just use these backdrops:
http://mumblingnerd.files.wordpress....6-oct-2009.jpg
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...hington_DC.JPG

This would help prove that this "act" could be spoofed, unless they video surveillance of him actually there in Freedom Plaza with a shotgun in hand (which they probably do, being all Orwellian and Big Brother like.)

It would also help show support for Adam (for those of you who do support him rocking the boat), and/or show that you are against the way he is being mistreated in jail.

And if there were 100's or 1,000's of videos clips like this, it is bound to get some notice by the media...  and by the Feds, the NSA, yadda yadda...

Don't want any facetime?  Slap on a rubber Obama mask, a Clinton mask, a Nixon mask, a Vendetta mask. 

Maybe we could get some more recognizable faces to do some green screen short clips too...  Jones, Bleck, etc.

Would this incriminate one of "sedition by proxy"?  Or of being a "sedition sympathizer"?




> First they came for Kokesh, and I did not speak out because I was not a fan of Kokesh.

----------


## IDefendThePlatform

> *I submit that an individual who breaks a law
>  that conscience tells him  isunjust, 
> and who willingly accepts the penalty of imprisonment 
> in  order to arouse the conscience of the community over its injustice,**
>  is  in reality expressing the highest respect for law.
> 
> *_-MLK Letter From Birmingham Jail_


Thanks for that great quote. I made it into a tweet with the #FreeAdam hashtag:
https://twitter.com/tonystuntz/statu...16549924646912

----------


## CPUd

> Back to the green screen tangent....
> 
> Someone in the DC / VA area should go to Freedom Plaza and from the same angle as Adam's video take a high res picture or 1 min video that we can all access.  Then those of us who can, we should do short green screen recordings of "I am Adam Kokesh" while loading a weapon (optional) and then have someone who can composite the Freedom Plaza backdrop into each green screen clip and start uploading them to YouTube.  Or compile multiple "I am Adam Kokesh" snippets into some longer videos.
> 
> Or just use these backdrops:
> http://mumblingnerd.files.wordpress....6-oct-2009.jpg
> http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...hington_DC.JPG
> 
> This would help prove that this "act" could be spoofed, unless they video surveillance of him actually there in Freedom Plaza with a shotgun in hand (which they probably do, being all Orwellian and Big Brother like.)
> ...


Ben Swann could do it.  That would inspire others to do it, and also help fund his kickstarter.  Or Ron Paul, which would make worldwide headlines.

----------


## devil21

> The only time I've read of the lights being kept on 24/7 was at Guantanamo Bay or in the basement of Leavenworth for a man who had killed a couple guards while incarcerated. (Thomas Silverstein)


Adam is in what's known in Fairfax Jail as an 'R Cell'.  The lights-on practice has been in effect there since the mid 90's and probably longer than that.  It's pretty much "the hole" now but it was just a general holding area before the new wing of the jail was built about 10 years ago.  The genpop areas of the jail use normal lights on/off schedules.  Or so I've heard....

What I get from the info in this thread is that a search warrant was executed and his current charges are only based on what was "found" in the house.  He hasn't been formally charged federally yet.  He will be moved to Alexandria City jail if and when he is federally charged.  Fairfax doesn't normally hold federal inmates since the federal courthouse is in Alexandria and the Alexandria City jail is right around the corner from there.  (This is also the jail and courthouse that Snowden would be in based on his charges btw) His Fairfax charges would be decided after his federal charges.  The charges he has now are his "holding charges".  You read about them all the time in random news articles where a suspect is arrested and held on "unrelated charges".  Then they are later charged with the "real" crime and the unrelated charges disappear.  Or so I've heard....

Yes, all Northern Virginia jurisdictions are filled with dirty cops.  Fairfax is the worst but all the Northern VA city and county police and sheriff's offices all train at a central location and are all taught the same protocol.  That protocol is "$#@! With Everyone".  Or so I've heard....

----------


## devil21

> Ben Swann could do it.  That would inspire others to do it, and also help fund his kickstarter.  Or Ron Paul, which would make worldwide headlines.


I posted that green screen thing mostly as a joke but the capabilities are there.  I'm not even convinced Adam's video itself wasn't a green screen.  But hey if someone wants to run with the idea then I'd love to see what it becomes.  Just be careful of video metadata!

Go watch this video:

----------


## better-dead-than-fed

> The only time I've read of the lights being kept on 24/7 was at Guantanamo Bay or in the basement of Leavenworth for a man who had killed a couple guards while incarcerated. (Thomas Silverstein)
> 
> Widely protested (not by the MSM, of course) and they justify it as punishing the prisoner and needing to show the others that should you stab a guard, your consequence is going to be far worse than just another 100 years on your sentence. Phones left to ring for hours on end, cold showers, loud music, being awoken if you happen to fall asleep to make sure you are still alive - these are all tactics used.
> 
> I would like to hear of a prison which has this as their stated policy. (aside from a small jail within a jail at Leavenworth) It is a form of torture which when accompanied by other methods and tactics becomes quite effective. It should not be tolerated. How can one have a fair trial without a good night's sleep? Being kept up all night then required to see the judge and prepare your defense is a damn shame. I don't care what the person did. And using these methods as a form of punishment is just as bad.


Courts have ruled that prisoners have no right to hot water for showering.

The air temperature is like you're in a refrigerator. Don't know if it's been challenged in court.

For the first four years, each time I had court they took me out of my cell at midnight, shackled me and put me in a holding cell ("Maximum Occupancy 75") with 150 other shackled prisoners. Stayed shackled til 6pm the next day. After four years I filed a motion saying the sleep deprivation was depriving me of my right to defend myself. From that point on, they let me sleep the full night and then took me to court in the morning.

----------


## presence

> For the first four years, each time I had court they took me out of my cell at midnight, shackled me and put me in a holding cell ("Maximum Occupancy 75") with 150 other shackled prisoners. Stayed shackled til 6pm the next day. After four years I filed a motion saying the sleep deprivation was depriving me of my right to defend myself. From that point on, they let me sleep the full night and then took me to court in the morning.


Institutionalized soft torture.

----------


## better-dead-than-fed

> He already had a psych evaluation


When the first didn't yield the results they wanted, they gave me eight more.

----------


## better-dead-than-fed

> *Betterdeadthanfed* did you notice a case number has been posted? Any chance you could find some additional info with it?


Everything I've found has already been posted here by 'presence'.

This Twitter account is informative: https://twitter.com/FreeAdamKokesh

and it links to: http://freeadam.net/, which shows the same documents.

----------


## presence

Halls of justice painted green
Money talking
Power wolves beset your door
Hear them stalking
Soon you'll please their appetite
They devour
Hammer of justice crushes you
Overpower

The ultimate in vanity
Exploiting their supremacy
I can't believe the things you say
I can't believe, I can't believe the price you pay
Nothing can save you

Justice is lost
Justice is raped
Justice is gone
Pulling your strings
Justice is done
Seeking no truth
Winning is all
Find it so grim, so true, so real

Apathy their stepping stone
So unfeeling
Hidden deep animosity
So deceiving
Through your eyes their light burns
Hoping to find
Inquisition sinking you
With prying minds

The ultimate in vanity
Exploiting their supremacy
I can't believe the things you say
I can't believe, I can't believe the price you pay
Nothing can save you
Justice is lost
Justice is raped
Justice is gone
Pulling your strings
Justice is done
Seeking no truth
Winning is all
Find it so grim, so true, so real

Lady Justice has been raped
Truth assassin
Rolls of red tape seal your lips
Now you're done in

Their money tips her scales again
Make your deal
Just what is truth, I cannot tell
Cannot feel

The ultimate in vanity
Exploiting their supremacy
I can't believe the things you say
I can't believe, I can't believe the price we pay
Nothing can save us

Justice is lost
Justice is raped
Justice is gone
Pulling your strings
Justice is done
Seeking no truth
Winning is all
Find it so grim, so true, so real

Seeking no truth
Winning is all
Find it so grim, so true, so real

----------


## AuH20

> In fairness, AuH20 is avoiding saying what Adam was openly saying, but wants to say it... ...and then chastises Adam for saying it.
> 
> AuH20 is saying kill them.  Off the pigs.  Read what he is writing, he is saying there should be an assassination campaign.  He is saying violence is all these people will understand.
> 
> Now he will cower in fear, and deny his words and what he meant, while calling Adam a coward for asking to take a piss.
> 
> And the only reason I'm calling you out for this, is because YOU are cutting the throat of your ally like a fool, instead of the throat of your enemy.


Actually, I'm openly saying what Adam had said in his orginal mission statement about the window for nonviolent change being closed. It's been gone for quite some time. My problem with Adam is not his principles or his beliefs, but rather his ineptitude with this entire episode. From all the facts on the table, it is readily apparent that he wants to be prosecuted to the full extent of the law based on his lack of preparation (willfuly done?) with the mushrooms and a host of other logical precautions (obtaining legal counsel, etc.) that were completely ignored. Anyone who has been closely watching the way the system operates knows that if you give the feds an inch, they will take a yard. And watch the duplicitious media start promoting Adam as an unstable junkie, which will completely cloud his original message.

----------


## pcosmar

> Actually, I'm openly saying what Adam had said in his orginal mission statement about the window for nonviolent change being closed. It's been gone for quite some time. My problem with Adam is not his principles or his beliefs, but rather his ineptitude with this entire episode. From all the facts on the table, it is readily apparent that he wants to be prosecuted to the full extent of the law based on his lack of* preparation with the mushrooms* and a host of other logical precautions (obtaining legal counsel, etc.).


What mushrooms?
You mean planted evidence  "discovered" in a raid based on a questionable warrant.

In a house full of pot smokers they did not find a seed,, or a roach,, or a baggie with residue.. Instead they found mushrooms. (think about this)

I think that Adam wants a court case. A real trial of some of these issues.

He has been arrested,,several times..but no trial. The cases keep getting thrown out on their face.
 Seems that they are not willing to have a public trial on this $#@!.

----------


## AuH20

> What mushrooms?
> You mean planted evidence  "discovered" in a raid based on a questionable warrant.


I'm seriously doubting that they were planted based on what we know. Adam is quite open about his drug use given the numerous videos available online. Plus, I watched that one interview with his roommate who giggled and indicated that Adam was a man of many surprises so to speak, when asked about the mushrooms. In other words, they weren't surprised that these would be his. After all, his safe was indeed broken into.

----------


## pcosmar

> I'm seriously doubting that they were planted based on what we know. Adam is quite open about his drug use given the numerous videos available online.


And yet,, in a house full of users,, not a roach,, a seed,,or a baggie with residue.. No Bongs or pipes or papers or paraphernalia. 
After a thorough search for such. (the house was ready)


instead they find mushrooms.
*
If*,, they were not planted by police or someone in the circle acting for the police,,, then I suspect they will be found to be a harmless type of legal mushroom,, to make the police look as stupid as they are.

----------


## AuH20

> And yet,, in a house full of users,, not a roach,, a seed,,or a baggie with residue.. No Bongs or pipes or papers or paraphernalia. 
> After a thorough search for such. (the house was ready)
> 
> 
> instead they find mushrooms.
> *
> If*,, they were not planted by police or someone in the circle acting for the police,,, *then I suspect they will be found to be a harmless type of mushroom,, to make the police look as stupid as they are.*


That's certainly possible. But if the cops wanted to entrap Adam with an illegal substance, I'm pretty sure they would have tried to hit a homerun by planting baggies of heroin or a brick of cocaine.

----------


## pcosmar

> That's possible. But if the cops wanted to entrap Adam with an illegal substance, I'm pretty sure they would have tried to hit a homerun by planting baggies of heroin or a brick of cocaine.


And cut into their profits.. I think not.

----------


## presence



----------


## UWDude

> That's certainly possible. But if the cops wanted to entrap Adam with an illegal substance, I'm pretty sure they would have tried to hit a homerun by planting baggies of heroin or a brick of cocaine.


it needs to be believable.  heroin/cocaine users are different types of people than acid/shroom/pot smokers

And if the time for nonviolent resistance has passed, what is it time for, hmm?  Are you going to man up and say it bluntly, or are you going to talk more macho innuendo about working in the shadows and sun tzu quotes?  Remember, the NSA is watching you.

----------


## AuH20

> it needs to be believable.  heroin/cocaine users are different types of people than acid/shroom/pot smokers
> 
> And if the time for nonviolent resistance has passed, what is it time for, hmm?  Are you going to man up and say it bluntly, or are you going to talk more macho innuendo about working in the shadows and sun tzu quotes?  Remember, the NSA is watching you.


I can safely assume I'm every list imaginable, but I am a law abiding citizen at the moment. They can watch all they want. Secondly, if I was part of a network that they deemed a dire threat to National Security I would have been bagged already. There are far too many of us out there to do anything about, if they decide to go operational. Stay vigilant my friends and keep your eye on the prize. 

And to the feds and pentagon spooks reading this, Karma can be a cruel bitch so I implore you to reexamine your place in this world. Sheer will will defeat those driven by money lust every time. I suspect that selling out your nation of birth for utimately worthless fiat has to feel real good.

----------


## mczerone

> I'm seriously doubting that they were planted based on what we know. Adam is quite open about his drug use given the numerous videos available online. Plus, I watched that one interview with his roommate who giggled and indicated that Adam was a man of many surprises so to speak, when asked about the mushrooms. In other words, they weren't surprised that these would be his. After all, his safe was indeed broken into.


Who says that they were hallucinogenic mushrooms? Maybe they were some other dried fungus used as a kitchen spice.

Also, there are studies showing that mushrooms help PTSD - which Adam claims to have. Maybe he wants a trial to argue that they were for medicinal purposes.

As far as his safe being broken into: Adam has mentioned on his show that he has other ways to conceal things. Maybe there was just his passport, insurance info, birth certificate, or other important documents to protect them in his "fire-safe" - which is an entirely advisable thing for anyone to do. There are no reports about what was in the safe, and what was taken from the safe. There was no claim that Adam was storing metals that could have been used for money laundering. There are no reports of any guns being in the home aside from the shotgun from the video - even though Adam claims to have many weapons. There are no reports of DMT or pot being found in the home or the safe - even though Adam is open about his usage of these items.

So all evidence appears to show that Adam had carefully divested himself of many items that he likely had in the recent past. The fact that mushrooms were found is inconsistent with this procedurally intensive divestiture, meaning that it was an intentional act to make a point.

----------


## AuH20

Mike is right here. Adam Kokesh reminds me of that knucklehead brother that you have to constantly get out of trouble, but he's still your brother at the end of the day.... 

http://sipseystreetirregulars.blogsp...uniformed.html




> My differences with Kokesh are both deep and public, but the FEDGOV is treading upon very dangerous ground here, by giving a guy who already clearly has a John Brown complex a chance to spark the civil war. Flash bangs? Battering rams? Armored vehicles? Held without bond? For a VIDEO? Really?
> 
> *As much as I distrust Kokesh's ego, judgment and his motives, he still is covered under the policy of No More Free Wacos.* As Bob Wright has said for many years, when this thing breaks, it will likely come from an unexpected quarter, in reaction to some stupid move by the regime against someone unsympathetic and even unsavory. But we will have no choice other than 4GW against the warmakers who sent the deadly raid party at that point. Which may have been the purpose of this exercise. Maybe it is what they want now. Or perhaps they're just as blundering and arrogant as General Gage. *It won't make a damn bit of difference when it happens -- to us or to them.*
> 
> For now, I couldn't find a defense fund for Kokesh, so if some reader will provide that, I'll post it here.

----------


## shane77m

> Mike is right here. Adam Kokesh reminds me of that knucklehead brother that you have to constantly get out of trouble, but he's still your brother at the end of the day.... 
> 
> http://sipseystreetirregulars.blogsp...uniformed.html


I will be interested to see the fallout from the next Waco. I don't think the patriot community is organized enough to do anything when it happens. Another thing that makes me think nothing significant would happen is that Kokesh couldn't get the numbers for his march in Washington. But I could be wrong.

----------


## AuH20

> I will be interested to see the fallout from the next Waco. I don't think the patriot community is organized enough to do anything when it happens. Another thing that makes me think nothing significant would happen is that Kokesh couldn't get the numbers for his march in Washington. But I could be wrong.


From my interaction with others, there will be no reprisal without a hot event calling forth nationwide action. While this deliberateness may indicate a death by a thousand paper cuts scenario, it's more that the entire community is on standby. Secondly, the patriot community isn't big on civil disobedience in that they are stubbornly solution oriented. Go big or go home, so to speak. There is no spiking the football until you cross the goalline.

----------


## presence

> Mike is right here. Adam Kokesh reminds me of that knucklehead brother that you have to constantly get out of trouble, but he's still your brother at the end of the day.... 
> 
> http://sipseystreetirregulars.blogsp...uniformed.html





> My differences with Kokesh are both deep and public, but the FEDGOV is  treading upon very dangerous ground here, by giving a guy who already  clearly has a John Brown complex a chance to spark the civil war. Flash  bangs? Battering rams? Armored vehicles? Held without bond? For a VIDEO?  Really?
> 
> *As much as I distrust Kokesh's ego, judgment and his motives, he still is covered under the policy of No More Free Wacos.* As  Bob Wright has said for many years, when this thing breaks, it will  likely come from an unexpected quarter, in reaction to some stupid move  by the regime against someone unsympathetic and even unsavory. But we  will have no choice other than 4GW against the warmakers who sent the  deadly raid party at that point. Which may have been the purpose of this  exercise. Maybe it is what they want now. Or perhaps they're just as  blundering and arrogant as General Gage. *It won't make a damn bit of difference when it happens -- to us or to them.*
> 
> For now, I couldn't find a defense fund for Kokesh, so if some reader will provide that, I'll post it here.




*snatch*


*No More Free Wacos*

#nomorefreeWACOs


memes for freedom!

----------


## presence

> *It's hard for me to object too strongly
> to a man who is willing to go to jail 
> to promote liberty for me.*


http://www.economicpolicyjournal.com...ience-and.html

----------


## Brian4Liberty

Adam Kokesh, Political Prisoner, Day 5.

----------


## Brian4Liberty

Adam Kokesh, Political Prisoner - Day 50?

----------


## kcchiefs6465

> Adam Kokesh, Political Prisoner - Day 50?


Today is day 51.

----------


## muzzled dogg



----------


## Brian4Liberty

Adam Kokesh, Political Prisoner - Day 63

----------


## presence

> Adam Kokesh, Political Prisoner - Day 63


Yes, but released from solitary confinement today!
http://thelibertybeat.com/kokesh-rel...y-confinement/

----------


## torchbearer

> Yes, but released from solitary confinement today!


death to the king.

----------


## better-dead-than-fed

> Did you miss the whole Romney 47% outrage?


Yes because I was locked in a cage.

----------


## fr33

Adam recently podcasted from jail: http://adamkokesh.libsyn.com/podcast-from-jail-9-6-13

----------

