# Think Tank > History >  List: Reasons why Obama is the wost president in American history

## 106459

Hello All,

With the upcoming general election and possibility of finally voting BO out; I'd like to compile a list of all the reasons why Obama has been a horrible president. Should be a good one to tell my grand-kids one day. 
Now, I'm looking for intelligible reasons with adequate factual and/or logical backing. In-depth reasoning is appreciated. Bonus points for broken promises, quotes of them, and flip-flops.
Should this thread go well enough, I can edit this post to include all your user entries, and even categorize it all.

I'll start:

1) Obama has increased national debt by 5.1 trillion from the time he's taken office to 5/27/2012. That's increased our national debt by 48% from the prior level of 10.6 trillion; in just 3.5 years. Our debt to GDP is now over 100%.
2) “Today I'm Pledging To Cut The Deficit We Inherited In Half By The End Of My First Term In Office.” Obama is the first president to preside over a trillion dollar deficit. Not only did he break his promise to cut the deficit in half, he increased it by record levels. Every year of his presidency has presided over a trillion dollar deficit.
3) "The fact that we're here today to debate raising America's debt limit is a sign of leadership failure. Leadership means 'The buck stops here.' Instead, Washington is shifting the burden of bad choices today onto the backs of our children and grandchildren. America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership. Americans deserve better. I therefore intend to oppose the effort to increase America's debt limit." Obama talks tough as a senator;flops as president. Not only does he contradict his past-self and raise the debt ceiling, but he's the first president to lose our AAA credit rating.
4)In a rare show of bipartisanship, Obama has his 2012-13 fiscal budget unanimously smacked down. A senate vote of 97-0, and house vote of 414-0.
5)In a further show of economic ineptitude, Obama appoints *medical* doctor Jim Yong Kim to head the World Bank. Of course, this in the midst of BRIC nations pushing for their own nationalities to become appointed.

6)"Let me say this as plainly as I can: By August 31, 2010, our combat mission in Iraq will end,""I intend to remove all U.S. troops from Iraq by the end of 2011." Nope. Obama continues the war in not only Iraq, but also Afghanistan and involves the US in Libya. He follows the G.W. Bush timetables for our withdraw from Iraq. The story now? We'll be supporting them until 2024, and that's with no extensions.
7)"I intend to close Guantanamo, and I will follow through on that. I have said repeatedly that America doesn't torture. And I'm gonna make sure that we don't torture. Those are part and parcel of an effort to regain America's moral stature in the world." Did he? No.
So much for the Nobel Peace Prize. Do they come in happy meals nowadays?

8)“No more illegal wiretapping of American citizens” BO signs a four year extension, 2011-2015. No reforms. Broken promise? I think so.
9)Obama signs National Defense Authorization Act (NDAA). Indefinite detention of American citizens by U.S. military.

10)From Obama website: Protect Whistleblowers: Often the best source of information about waste, fraud, and abuse in government is an existing government employee committed to public integrity and willing to speak out. Such acts of courage and patriotism, which can sometimes save lives and often save taxpayer dollars, should be encouraged rather than stifled. . Another broken promise. Obama is more vigorously combating whistleblowers than any other president. In his presidency, he has charged 6 under the Espionage act for alleged mishandling of classified information. Twice the number of all other presidencies combined (3).

11) "When I was a kid, I inhaled, frequently." Obama smoked marijuana; yet he has presided over one of the most vicious federal crackdowns on state medical marijuana. "I'm not going to be using Justice Department resources to try to circumvent state laws on this issue." Wrong. More than 100 raids in three years; he might just surpass Bush. In fact, he's even brought in the IRS; threatening property owners with repossession if they don't evict dispensaries. 

12) ObamaCare. The monstrous federal takeover of healthcare; 2000 pages of legislative nonsense. Passed with only unilateral support from Democrats and Nancy Pelosi saying "We have to pass the bill to find out what's in it." Yes, the first attempt by federal government to coerce citizens into buying a product. Obama contradicts himself, for some reason believing universal healthcare will fix our problems despite this quote "if a mandate was the solution, we can try that to solve homelessness by mandating everybody to buy a house."
There are so many flaws with ObamaCare it's unbelievable. To add insult to injury, the CBO later projected ObamaCare was going to cost 1.76 trillion instead of the assumed 940 billion over a decade. Anyone familiar with Austrian economics and price controls will understand the government's attempts at price controls will merely prolong shortages and introduce rationing.
Equally appalling is the deceit of government health insurance. There is no such thing. By definition insurance involves risk, which government health welfare does not by its universal coverage. 

So, these are the atrocities I'm familiar with; there are no doubt many, many more. In fact, I recall an article about Obama creating a task-force to watch "propaganda". He wouldn't want his election hopes dashed. Hope he doesn't shut this thread down.

The list I've compiled so far is by no means comprehensive, I look forward to other user submissions. Also, I did stumble across a list of broken promises (although I'm unsure of its accuracy) here: newsgnome.blogspot.com/2009/03/official-list-of-obamas-broken-promises.html if anyone wants to jog their memories.
 If any of my information is inaccurate or misleading, bring it to my attention.

Ron Paul 2012

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## Voluntary Man

great men stand on the shoulders of giants, while scoundrels play limbo with serpents.

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## Anti Federalist

Yeah, he's pretty bad.

So was Bush.

So was Clinton.

So was Bush the Elder.

And Reagan was no great shakes in the main either, especially considering deficits.

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## jmdrake

He's the worst president in U.S. history because he beat McCain.

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## pcosmar

Definitely the worst president since Bush.
I'm glad we had him rather than McCain though. And he seems to be delaying war with Iran as well..for whatever his reasons are.

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## Supernaut

He's pretty awful, but c'mon.  He's certainly not in the same league as  Lincoln, Wilson, LBJ, Nixon, or GWB.

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## Gumba of Liberty

All presidents suck. The very existence of the position is designed to restrict, no liberate, mankind. The President is meant to be an elite individual (chosen by an inner-circle of elites) capable of understanding the wants and needs of 300 Million people, fat chance. This is folly of continental proportions. Free men do not need to be lead. We need to be free.

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## Anti Federalist

> All presidents suck. Free men do not need to be lead. We need to be free.


This.

I lose my mind when I hear or read some knothead talking about how "we'll elect a new leader in November" or some such claptrap.

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## pcosmar

> This.
> 
> I lose my mind when I hear or read some knothead talking about how "we'll elect a new leader in November" or some such claptrap.


From my understanding (and it could be flawed) The President is not supposed to be a leader.
he is supposed to be the national Representative. The face to the world.

We are not supposed to have leaders. but representatives.
Not be told what to do or be controlled, We are supposed to tell them what to do and they are supposed to be controlled.

Somewhere it got backwards.

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## MelissaWV

The ultimate reason that Obama is "the worst" is that we're alive now, he's President, and the world's going more obviously to $#@! than it has seemed to in the past.

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## 106459

> Yeah, he's pretty bad.
> 
> So was Bush.
> 
> So was Clinton.
> 
> So was Bush the Elder.
> 
> And Reagan was no great shakes in the main either, especially considering deficits.


Well, researching the Reagan deficits, that's an interesting point. I'm probably a lot younger than you think, so my presidential history is rather limited. However, the Reagan deficits pale in comparison to Obama's in terms of nominal value - 733 billion in four years compared to 5.1 trillion. In terms of GDP, he raised it by 10.3% (one term) as opposed to Obama's 48% (one term). Give Obama two terms, and we're probably talking 96% increase or higher, as opposed to Reagan's 51% GDP. Essentially, Obama has done in one term what Reagan did in two. Both are pretty atrocious, but I would hardly measure Reagan in terms of Obama.

Now, what really disgusts me about Obama is how he's played with fire, and burned the American people. Reagan didn't have the debt above 60, or even 90% gdp, both dangerous metrics. While Obama did inherit debt at around 65%, he's increased it with reckless disregard. He fiddled while our credit rating burned. We're going to lose our status as the global reserve currency. There's already talks of a UN basket of currencies. Once that happens, people will realize exactly how worthless our Federal Reserve Notes are.

So - looking at the other posts coming through, it doesn't look as if people are too interested. And that's fine; the point presidents aren't designed to be great is a good point.

However, I do take issue with many of the other arguments made.

1) Worst because we don't have McCain/glad instead of because he's delaying war with Iran.
Well, a quote originated from Benjamin Franklin (I believe) comes to mind: That a bad father would wish for the hard times to be put off, but a good father wishes it upon himself such that his kids may not endure it. To further quote John Adams, "I must study politics and war so that my sons may study math and science."
I have no interest in delaying what people consider inevitable. Don't waste my time. I will not perpetuate my misery.

So, some think that McCain would be a worse president. I disagree. Now, I will admit I didn't get a taste of how awful McCain was until I heard him advocate for even more involvement in Libya. However, at least he served unlike Obama, and quite honorably I believe. To quote Dr. Paul, I remember him saying that he'd like the metric for wars to be started that those themselves would serve for the cause, or see their kids/grand-kids serve. Obama I'm sure has no clue as to the monstrosities of war.

Yes, people want to infer the damage that could've happened under McCain. But I don't believe they're inferring the enormous difficulties McCain would've had getting us involved in Libya. He would've been branded as a blood-thirsty republican. Over 2/3rds of Americans want us out of Iraq. Do you really think a republican would've been able to pull that off very well? I don't think so. Obama, on the other hand, is this Nobel Peace Prize winning liberal. "Well gee, since he's a Democrat and loves peace I guess we have to do this..." is a sentiment I believe some sheep believe.

Obama's globalist and green agenda is terrifying. McCain would've suffered tremendous opposition for policies that would've been seen as reactionary. But Obama has caught wind of the movement for the decade. For some reason people believe that the green movement is a good thing. I believe there is a distinct possibility we are inflicting far greater harm upon ourselves. Those CFL bulbs designed to replace incandescents? They're toxic. They contain mercury, albeit a small amount. A better example: Great Britain. All gung-ho about adopting clean energy, installed a bunch of wind turbines. Of course, those have consequences as well. How are these magical turbines built? Well, with special minerals that have to be extracted from the ground. They did that, and are now experiencing unique environmental concerns.

Whereas McCain would've been a horrible president and probably left it at that, Obama takes it to a new level. McCain most likely wouldn't have increased American's dependence on government. Obama has, especially considering ObamaCare. He's been referred to as the greatest foodstamp president in history, I believe that claim turned out to be true. The fact of the matter is the government can't take care of us. When we collapse, we will be far worse off because of Obama.

Thought I would throw all this out there for those who are content to simply state "Well, if we didn't get Obama, we'd get McCain, and that's way worse." For reasons stated above, I'm rather skeptical. It's a lot more complex than that. Obama is in a unique position to swindle us especially hard.

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## specsaregood

He is a patzer in comparison to some of the ones that came before him.

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## Anti Federalist

> Long post is long


OK, so I get a sense that you don't think McCain would have been as bad as Obama.

I disagree.

Of the three things that I consider to be of primary importance:

1 - Ending wars and occupations.

2 - Restoring monetary and fiscal sanity to the fedgov.

3 - Applying the brakes to the out of control police/surveillance state,

McCain would have been just as bad if not worse.

That being said, what are you suggesting be done in November of 2012?

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## Origanalist

That being said, what are you suggesting be done in November of 2012?

Get stinking drunk.

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## 106459

> OK, so I get a sense that you don't think McCain would have been as bad as Obama.
> 
> I disagree.
> 
> Of the three things that I consider to be of primary importance:
> 
> 1 - Ending wars and occupations.
> 
> 2 - Restoring monetary and fiscal sanity to the fedgov.
> ...


Well, can't say I have the answers. There are many other fun statistics to bring up. To keep from another "Long post is long" quote, I'll leave it at if Ron Paul isn't elected in 2012, I don't have much hope for the situation. The U.S. will meet the cliff of insolvency, and run right off.
Right now we spend 72% on four categories: Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, and Interest (on debt.) By 2020, that will become 92%. Thus, everything else which previously had 38% will be squeezed into 8% in a matter of eight years. That's a reduction of 71% (20/28.) It's just not going to work.

Now, what I find funny is you put Restoring monetary and fiscal sanity to the fedgov as #2. That's interesting. I believe it is not only the #1 priority, but the only priority.
If we can restore sound monetary and fiscal policy to the gov, none of those other issues will be permitted to exist. The government would have to obtain their funding from the people and not the thin air printing press of the Federal Reserve. I don't believe we would stand for it. If we did, then I guess we can't complain for being so stupid. And again, no one would pay for the absurdity of the TSA or other infringements on civil liberties and privacy, either.

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## JK/SEA

cut a trillion off military spending, then take those savings and give the money back to the people via soc. sec. and medicare. As Ron said, bring the troops home so they can spend their money here. Cut taxes to biz owners and.....on and on...

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## Eisenhower

Obama < Bush < Clinton < Bush Senior < Reagan

not that any of them were good or anything....

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## sailingaway

> The ultimate reason that Obama is "the worst" is that we're alive now, he's President, and the world's going more obviously to $#@! than it has seemed to in the past.


I don't know. NDAA, flipping on FISA and teh Patriot Act, CISPA and goiing around Congress when it couldn't muster support to regulate the internet doing it by executive dictatorial fiat, Libya and all the other end runs of Congress, on and on and on.....

He's the worst imho, however, it is in part cumulative.  There aren't two things I can think of that he would do differently than Romney.  I'd say the Bush tax cuts but note that he did extend them....

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## flynn

The absolute worst president of all time has to be Abe Lincoln with Franklin Roosevelt as the runner up. Without these two men, no president in the modern times would have so much power over the people.

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## 106459

> The absolute worst president of all time has to be Abe Lincoln with Franklin Roosevelt as the runner up. Without these two men, no president in the modern times would have so much power over the people.


Valid point. However, I hesitate to use Lincoln and FDR as a scapegoat for Obama. His usurpation of power are his own; unique and different manipulations from that of his predecessors. He can't just say he walked right on in because the door was open.

Now, I believe there is also the very distinct difference of magnitude. Abe and FDR "laid the foundation" (they went pretty far too), but Obama really has gone over the top.
When it's said and done, Obama might be the one attributed to the dissolution of the U.S. At this point I find it hard to conceive an alternative; seeing the nation divided 50/50 with a clear cut line between North and South on just about everything. Who would want to claim this mess? I don't see it. Obama's spending will push us to Greece levels very shortly; and our financial stability now built on the sand that is us being the global reserve currency will fall in. As Greece will exit the Eurozone, our states will leave our union.

Ha - I got one person to agree with me on Obama being the worst. Thank you Sailingaway!
Obama's corporatism is outright terrifying. I don't think you can say that about other presidents.

Also, Mitt Robmoney will never have my support. I will vote Ron Paul in November; that's that.

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## Pauls' Revere

1) USA Downgraded to AA+ 

2) Shovel ready jobs

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## tttppp

> Hello All,
> 
> With the upcoming general election and possibility of finally voting BO out; I'd like to compile a list of all the reasons why Obama has been a horrible president. Should be a good one to tell my grand-kids one day. 
> Now, I'm looking for intelligible reasons with adequate factual and/or logical backing. In-depth reasoning is appreciated. Bonus points for broken promises, quotes of them, and flip-flops.
> Should this thread go well enough, I can edit this post to include all your user entries, and even categorize it all.
> 
> I'll start:
> 
> 1) Obama has increased national debt by 5.1 trillion from the time he's taken office to 5/27/2012. That's increased our national debt by 48% from the prior level of 10.6 trillion; in just 3.5 years. Our debt to GDP is now over 100%.
> ...


Good point about the raising of debt when he said he would reduce it. He also stated that he would have $1 in cuts for everyone $1 in spending. If he had done that, I don't know how he could have raised our debt by so much.

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## Anti Federalist

> Also, Mitt Robmoney will never have my support. I will vote Ron Paul in November; that's that.


That's all I needed to hear.

Welcome to the forums.

Pay my snark no mind in the previous post.

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## WhistlinDave

Maybe I missed it, but I can't believe no one has yet mentioned Executive Order 13603.

Talk about some seriously sinister Evil Empire $#@!.  This thing makes the Patriot Act and NDAA look like Obama gave everybody a ticket to Disneyland.  We're talking the legal authorization of COMPLETE TOTALITARIAN CONTROL of everyone and everything.

Forbes Article on Executive Order 13603

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## anaconda

Obama has been quite effective for his globalist handlers.

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## Elfshadow

Any time I see "Obama is the worst president" I normally don't bother listening to anything that is said afterwards, cause it normally means a republican, vote for the lesser of the two evils, and support Romney speech is about to start.

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## Voluntary Man

> He's the worst president in U.S. history because he beat McCain.


that's it, exactly. if mccain had won, he would have deserved that title, just as clinton had it, until W took the crown. it's all a matter of who happens to be in the driver's seat, as the bus races closer and closer to the edge of the cliff. the best president will be the one who actually turns the bus around.

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## Don Lapre

Barry is _easily_ the worst of all-time.

He's a criminal fraud who's not even eligible to hold the office.


Whoever is 2nd worst is a very distant 2nd.

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## MelissaWV

> I don't know. NDAA, flipping on FISA and teh Patriot Act, CISPA and goiing around Congress when it couldn't muster support to regulate the internet doing it by executive dictatorial fiat, Libya and all the other end runs of Congress, on and on and on.....
> 
> He's the worst imho, however, it is in part cumulative.  There aren't two things I can think of that he would do differently than Romney.  I'd say the Bush tax cuts but note that he did extend them....


Drafting your own citizens to fight against people who would otherwise be your own citizens, taking a nice long piss on the Constitution, managing to look like you freed the slaves (to history) while actually being a massive racist, signing people fresh off the boat into a sort of indentured servitude with the notion that your wages and some sort of decent lifestyle would be provided for the family of the newly minted soldier (and all the while "Irish need not apply" kept them poor and likely they died sooner than the soldier did)...?

Honestly, I think we see the $#@! we're in as worse than the $#@! other people were in, or are in, all the time.  Those acts are there, but many of them have not been exploited yet.  If we're to be angry, we should look back and be angry at the Fed, Social Security, Executive Orders, "conflicts" (which we now have instead of wars), and so on.  It is cumulative, as you said, and it would be silly to blame the present for the obvious blunders of the past.  

People toss "worst" around like there's any real way to tell.

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## Origanalist

> Drafting your own citizens to fight against people who would otherwise be your own citizens, taking a nice long piss on the Constitution, managing to look like you freed the slaves (to history) while actually being a massive racist, signing people fresh off the boat into a sort of indentured servitude with the notion that your wages and some sort of decent lifestyle would be provided for the family of the newly minted soldier (and all the while "Irish need not apply" kept them poor and likely they died sooner than the soldier did)...?
> 
> Honestly, I think we see the $#@! we're in as worse than the $#@! other people were in, or are in, all the time.  Those acts are there, but many of them have not been exploited yet.  If we're to be angry, we should look back and be angry at the Fed, Social Security, Executive Orders, "conflicts" (which we now have instead of wars), and so on.  It is cumulative, as you said, and it would be silly to blame the present for the obvious blunders of the past.  
> 
> People toss "worst" around like there's any real way to tell.


Agreed, I think he's only the worst because of lack of perspective. Is he bad? Yes. Is he real bad? Yes.

Is he the worst? I don't think so...............

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## Simple

When Obama's spokesman explained that Obama will work with Congress on the stuff that they want to pass and Obama will legislate by executive order on issues that Congress isn't cooperating on, this is when I realized that Obama is the worst president ever. His own spokesman is telling us that he is acting openly as a fascist.

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## cheapseats

Barack Obama cares more about himself than he does about the well-being of American Citizens.

Same was true of Gee Dub.

Barack Obama cares more about his LEGACY than he does about the integrity of the United States.

Same was true of Gee Dub.

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## tod evans

Fire all of Washington, every last one of them from the prez down to the court clerks, tar and feather every lobbyist and put 'em on a slow boat to China.

Throw a dart at each states map, go to the local diner and recruit new "politicians" using one simple credential; callouses...

No callouses = no job.....Can't represent me.

Bet things would change in a hurry.


Oh.....Obama.....Same monster, different head.

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## osan

> Yeah, he's pretty bad.
> 
> So was Bush.
> 
> So was Clinton.
> 
> So was Bush the Elder.
> 
> *And Reagan was no great shakes in the main either, especially considering deficits.*


Isn't that the truth.  I've never understood the Reagan worship deal.  Hannity, I am sure, would oblige Ronny with all the oral sex he could stand, were he alive.  In fact, I'd keep Hannity away from Ronnie's grave, especially if he's carrying a shovel or a strap-on backhoe.

I remember as a young adult watching in slack jawed amazement as the Raygun spouted off endlessly about "small government" as government grew to the greatest proportions this nation had ever known at the time.  All I could do was wonder just who, exactly, was buying this line of $#@!.  Apparently, nearly everyone - certainly enough.  I recall cringing when the national defense budget was announced at  $200 BILLION.  Oh if only we could go back even to that...

The Reagan presidency was a clear message to the people of the USA.  It was an overt expression of the utter, bitter, and sheer contempt for which those in power hold the rest of us.  And to be honest, we deserve their contempt because we sat back and let the train keep building steam.  We should have apprehended the lot of them, tried, convicted, and then very publicly executed them.  But no, we chose to be lazy, ignorant imbeciles charging into the 80s to the strains of "Wall Street['s]" Gordon Gecko.  How many of us looked at what was going on and felt the horror of it?  Not too many.  So $#@! the $#@!s of America.  They deserve the shearing they are getting and the ones yet to come.  My regret is that the good people, the worthy people, will be sucked down the vortex with the scum.

OK, now my head hurts again.  I'll be over here in the corner if anyone needs me.

PS: Obama is like a well-tanned Mussolini.  Just look at how his body language is so similar.

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## seeker4sho

Like all presidents, Obama mostly approves what Congress authorizes. If you are upset about the way things are going, take a good look at your voting record -- who have you voted for during your life time and what was their record? Somebody voted the tyrants into office, could it be you?

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## truelies

> Yeah, he's pretty bad.
> 
> So was Bush.
> 
> So was Clinton.
> 
> So was Bush the Elder.
> 
> And Reagan was no great shakes in the main either, especially considering deficits.


Got to agree here. However, I do Rate BHO as the worst Prez because he is the first to openly decline to meet the Constitutional requirements for the Office of President, him not being a Natural Born Citizen.

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## cheapseats

> Like all presidents, Obama mostly approves what Congress authorizes. If you are upset about the way things are going, take a good look at your voting record -- who have you voted for during your life time and what was their record? Somebody voted the tyrants into office, could it be you?



PRESIDENT + CONGRESS + SCOTUS = HANDMAIDENS.

George Bush was no more free to jeopardize the BUSH DYNASTY FORTUNE than Paris Hilton is free to jeopardize the HILTON DYNASTY FORTUNE.  Genuine Deciders mainly stay outta the limelight . . . 'cept for DICK CHENEY.

Money talks?  Billionaires HOLLER . . . AND they control the microphones.

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## truelies

That said Romney will probably double down on being a bad Prez as he also seems to fail the NBC test and will quite likely pick another NBC failure as his VP. Naturally this is all part of teaching Americans that not only are they helpless to oppose their National Elite but are also helpless to resist INTERNATIONAL Elites.

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## truelies

> PRESIDENT + CONGRESS + SCOTUS = HANDMAIDENS.
> 
> George Bush was no more free to jeopardize the BUSH DYNASTY FORTUNE than Paris Hilton is free to jeopardize the HILTON DYNASTY FORTUNE.
> 
> Genuine Deciders mainly stay outta the limelight . . . 'cept for DICK CHENEY.



Thus describing the key characterisitic of American Style Fascism with its signature thin 'progressive' veneer..

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## Occam's Banana

> PS: Obama is like a well-tanned Mussolini.  Just look at how his body language is so similar.


He's definitely got that Mussolini-esque inclination-of-the-head thing going on. Creepy.

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## Anti Federalist

> PS: Obama is like a well-tanned Mussolini.  Just look at how his body language is so similar.





> He's definitely got that Mussolini-esque inclination-of-the-head thing going on. Creepy.


I'll be damned, I hadn't ever really noticed but, son of a bitch...

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## Zippyjuan

Bear in mind that a president can't do a whole lot without aid from the Senate and House of Representatives. They have to write and pass the legislation before it can be signed by him.  Presidents may get the major portion of credit and blame on things but there is plenty of that to go around.

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## Voluntary Man

> Bear in mind that a president can't do a whole lot without aid from the Senate and House of Representatives. They have to write and pass the legislation before it can be signed by him.  *Presidents may get the major portion of credit and blame* on things but there is plenty of that to go around.


when you sign a bad bill into law, you are taking and deserve the blame. that's what the veto is for.

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## Zippyjuan

But his power is not absolute. If Congress did not want those things, they could stop the bill as well.  Thus shared responsibility.

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## MoneyWhereMyMouthIs2

> Bear in mind that a president can't do a whole lot without aid from the Senate and House of Representatives.


That may have been true once upon a time.  Not anymore.

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## Wesker1982



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## Occam's Banana

> But his power is not absolute. If Congress did not want those things, they could stop the bill as well.  Thus shared responsibility.


This is true, so far as it goes. But the sins of the legislature are passive ones of abdication, while the sins of the executive are aggressive ones of usurpation.

The former permit the latter, so the responsibility is indeed shared - but is more "concentrated" in the single person of the executive.

(For example: many Congressmen are needed to vote down a bill, but only one President is needed to veto a bill.)

Ultimately, though, it is the American people who are to blame - for allowing the POTUS to be turned into something akin to a god-king.

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## 106459

> Drafting your own citizens to fight against people who would otherwise be your own citizens, taking a nice long piss on the Constitution, managing to look like you freed the slaves (to history) while actually being a massive racist, signing people fresh off the boat into a sort of indentured servitude with the notion that your wages and some sort of decent lifestyle would be provided for the family of the newly minted soldier (and all the while "Irish need not apply" kept them poor and likely they died sooner than the soldier did)...?
> 
> Honestly, I think we see the $#@! we're in as worse than the $#@! other people were in, or are in, all the time.  Those acts are there, but many of them have not been exploited yet.  If we're to be angry, we should look back and be angry at the Fed, Social Security, Executive Orders, "conflicts" (which we now have instead of wars), and so on.  It is cumulative, as you said, and it would be silly to blame the present for the obvious blunders of the past.  
> 
> People toss "worst" around like there's any real way to tell.


Well, interesting point to argue. But I believe where Abe was just putting the lid of the coffin on, Obama is finishing the last of the nails. For the implications to be this evident, and for Obama to continue this path of destruction, is despicable. Unfortunately, I don't have a ton of bullet style evidence Abe vs. BO, but Obama's piss on the constitution is certainly nothing to gawk at. That section of immigrants off the boat reminded me a lot of BO's healthcare. All the promises he's made, and they're blatantly false. Yes, the big spending and centralization BO has done will indenture far more than just immigrants when the true taxation hits.
I'm not quite sure we really see "the $#@! we're in." To quote Henry Ford, "It is well enough that people of the nation do not understand our banking and monetary system, for if they did, I believe there would be a revolution before tomorrow morning." I've mentioned many points about debt, and despite the fact we'll hit Greece levels in a few years, no one has really come to terms with it. I remember exactly what was going on as Obama appointed a medical doctor to head the World Bank. Everywhere you looked: "THREE PEOPLE HAVE WON MEGAMILLIONS!!! OMFG!!!" I could go on forever, but unfortunately, finance is my strong-suit.
Now, I'm unsure of that last part. You said it was all cumulative, and it would be silly to blame the president for blunders of the past. It sounds to me like Obama shouldn't be blamed for all his abuses, because someone else set precedent. That's nonsense. I refuse to excuse his, or anyone else's independent behavior. I said it before, if you left the door to your house open and I walked right on in and helped myself to the fridge, it's your fault? I don't think so. Yes, the door was open, but in what world did I *have* to make myself walk there?




> When Obama's spokesman explained that Obama will work with Congress on the stuff that they want to pass and Obama will legislate by executive order on issues that Congress isn't cooperating on, this is when I realized that Obama is the worst president ever. His own spokesman is telling us that he is acting openly as a fascist.


Yes. This is one of the points I was getting at (corporatism.) Mussolini, who coined the term fascism, later said if he had a second chance he would've named it corporatism; big government getting in bed with big business.




> Bear in mind that a president can't do a whole lot without aid from the Senate and House of Representatives. They have to write and pass the legislation before it can be signed by him.  Presidents may get the major portion of credit and blame on things but there is plenty of that to go around.


That's not true. ObamaCare likely would've NEVER happened if BO didn't push so god damn hard. Many Democrats would've opposed it, until Obama strong-armed it. It's my understanding that even on the vote they weren't entirely certain it would muster all the necessary votes; that's not exactly normal. As stated earlier, Obama will legislate by executive order when Congress disobeys him. Christ, google Obama executive orders. Pages of nonsense. He's signed 126 in just over 1450 days in office. "Hmm, it's been about 10 days. EXECUTIVE ORDER TIME!" Is the general jist of what goes on in that demented mind. And, in comparison, GWB passed 43. Obama is about 3x as much.

So, again, I don't consider Reagan deficits to be on the level of Obama, Reagan was just about 1/5 of what Obama has done, 1st term to 1st term (733/5100 (billions) 14.3%, 10.3% GDP compared to 48% GDP, about a fifth.) Yes, many of you have spoke of how much you hate Reagan, but it looks like Obama is worse by a factor of 5.

Now, in closing, I would like to state I'm not a fan of Reagan, or any other modern president for that matter. However, I do want to compare the metrics, and from what I've posted, Obama is a far cry from GWB or Reagan.
I will concede I haven't necessarily put forth strong argument for Abe vs. BO, other than they seem to be on the same scale and BO has the advantage of far more foresight than Abe did; and I don't have as many facts on Abe.

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## osan

> He's definitely got that Mussolini-esque inclination-of-the-head thing going on. Creepy.


That is what I meant more than anything else.  There is that famous footage of Benito doing that thing with his head like a class-A buffoon.  Barack does the same thing right down to the mouth.

A pair of jerkoffs - one for each century.

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## osan

> I'll be damned, I hadn't ever really noticed but, son of a bitch...


See what I mean?  It is so crazy that sane and rational people cannot help but wonder whether BHOBHO was chosen purposely as some sort of bitterly contempt-laden joke to be rubbed ostentatiously and vigorously into the faces of the great mob of idiots commonly labeled  "the American public".

Seriously d00dz - I am so utterly disgusted with the unplumbed depths of stupidity demonstrated by the vast and overwhelming majority of Americans (not that the rest of the world is really any better,  but I don't give  a $#@! about them) that I really cannot blame the elite for treating them as they do.  If they'd have me, I would probably join them, to be honest because this profoundness of willful imbecility is simply too much to forgive.

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## Voluntary Man

> See what I mean?  It is so crazy that sane and rational people cannot help but wonder whether BHOBHO was chosen purposely as some sort of bitterly contempt-laden joke to be rubbed ostentatiously and vigorously into the faces of the great mob.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  Originally Posted by Anti Federalist
> 
> ...



il duce and il douche

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## osan

> il duce and il douche



Eeediot!  Had I had tea in my mouth, I'd be writing you a bill for a new monitor.

Imbecile.

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## anaconda

> Bear in mind that a president can't do a whole lot without aid from the Senate and House of Representatives. They have to write and pass the legislation before it can be signed by him.  Presidents may get the major portion of credit and blame on things but there is plenty of that to go around.


The problems we're in are because of decades of draconian globalist legislation. The Presidential power of the veto could be enormous. Also the power as Commander In Chief. Also the constitutional authority to "direct the cabinet" could be huge. The President could do a lot without any help from congress. They just never do because their all bought-and-paid-for tools.

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