# Lifestyles & Discussion > Personal Security & Defense >  Thoughts on 5.7×28mm?

## JebSanderson

I've been looking into getting a 5.7×28mm Five-seven handgun. Has anyone here owned/shot one? What are your thoughts? Is it worth it or should I go for a 9mm?

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## Danke

> I've been looking into getting a 5.7×28mm Five-seven handgun. Has anyone here owned/shot one? What are your thoughts? Is it worth it or should I go for a 9mm?


Yes.

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## JebSanderson

> Yes.


Thanks for that clear and thoughtful answer, you have really helped me with this.

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## Danke

> Thanks for that clear and thoughtful answer, you have really helped me with this.


NP.

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## JebSanderson

> NP.


So glad to have you as a friend

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## Danke

> So glad to have you as a friend


Who said anything about friendship?

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## JebSanderson

> Who said anything about friendship?


I did. And your kindness and consideration are signs of friendship.

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## pauljmccain

Just get a 9. Unless you have a couple already.

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## JebSanderson

> Just get a 9. Unless you have a couple already.


I have a 9mm already, want to try something new and was looking into the 5.7

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## Danke

> I have a 9mm already, want to try something new and was looking into the 5.7


Why not go with some thing that is cheap and common?

I like .40 S&W hollow point, but I get those for...

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## JebSanderson

> Why not go with some thing that is cheap and common?
> 
> I like .40 S&W hollow point, but I get those for...


Already have a .22, a .380, a9mm, a .40, a .45...looking for something new and interesting.

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## Danke

> Already have a .22, a .380, a9mm, a .40, a .45...looking for something new and interesting.


reported.

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## JebSanderson

> reported.


To?

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## Danke

> To?


My agency.

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## Pericles

Interesting concept for a pistol round, as it is trying to give you the 5.56 ballistics at pistol ranges. Sucks as a longarm round - way underpowered except for close in targets.

The pistol crowd seems to like it, but I consider it exotic and expensive relative to other as effective or more effective options FWIW.

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## JebSanderson

> Interesting concept for a pistol round, as it is trying to give you the 5.56 ballistics at pistol ranges. Sucks as a longarm round - way underpowered except for close in targets.
> 
> The pistol crowd seems to like it, but I consider it exotic and expensive relative to other as effective or more effective options FWIW.


Yeah range sucks, but you don't need range in a handgun. I like the penetrating power it supposedly has and I've read it has 30% less recoil than a 9mm. It's exotic, expensive and probably hard to get ammo for, but I'd like to give it a try.

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## Pericles

> Yeah range sucks, but you don't need range in a handgun. I like the penetrating power it supposedly has and I've read it has 30% less recoil than a 9mm. It's exotic, expensive and probably hard to get ammo for, but I'd like to give it a try.


Only have experience with a P90, and it was unimpressive. Would be a different story launching the round out of the pistol.

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## JebSanderson

> Only have experience with a P90, and it was unimpressive. Would be a different story launching the round out of the pistol.


Haven't ever tried a P90 and I completely fail to see the point in that "personal defense weapon".

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## youngbuck

I'd recommend it if you're indeed willing to deal with the ammo issue, i.e. as already stated, it being exotic, expensive, hard to find (not at walmarx), and likely expensive spare magazines.  If you do pull the trigger, stock up on ammo.  Better yet, this would be a good reason to get into reloading if you're not already.

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## idiom

I actually thought this thread was about a lens

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## Pericles

> Haven't ever tried a P90 and I completely fail to see the point in that "personal defense weapon".


The P90 is a solution to a non existent problem, other than I want to use the same ammunition in anything I shoot. Do not go there.

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## Len Larson

I'm curious to hear 5.7 reports too. 

I've also looked into a KelTec PMR .22 mag or an AR pistol in .300BLK. Both of those options seem preferable to the 5.7, but I don't know.  

It's cool that we have so many options.

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## JebSanderson

> I'm curious to hear 5.7 reports too. 
> 
> I've also looked into a KelTec PMR .22 mag or an AR pistol in .300BLK. Both of those options seem preferable to the 5.7, but I don't know.  
> 
> It's cool that we have so many options.


 The cool thing about the KelTec is it has a 30 round magazine!

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## JebSanderson

FPS Russia tries out the five seven. Exploding round is $#@!ing amazing on this pistol...wish I could get my hands on those!

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## BUSHLIED

> reported.


you mean all you have it one of each, you should be buying one gun a month...stock up!! I would if I could.

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## jdcole

I've got a Kimber Custom Stainless II.  .45 ACP.  Aside from a Glock, you can never go wrong with a 1911.

I also like the Springfield XD/XDM line.  Very solid handguns.  

FN makes good weapons, so if you do decide to get something that fires 5.7x28 you can be comfortable knowing it will be of fairly good quality.  And, if you do buy a Five-seveN, you may as well get a PS90 to go with it.  I know FN also makes some AR uppers for the round as well.  Commonality of ammo between weapons is always a good thing.

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## oyarde

> I actually thought this thread was about a lens


 Bino's ??

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## kcchiefs6465

The FN P90 is a joy to shoot. Won't hear anything negative about 5.7x28 coming from me. Pretty much no recoil, defeats Class 3 armor... What more do you want?

EDIT: Didn't see original post. I highly recommend the FN Five Seven.

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## kcchiefs6465

> I'd recommend it if you're indeed willing to deal with the ammo issue, i.e. as already stated, it being exotic, expensive, hard to find (not at walmarx), and likely expensive spare magazines.  If you do pull the trigger, stock up on ammo.  Better yet, this would be a good reason to get into reloading if you're not already.


5.7 ammo isn't really that bad. About 20 dollars a box of 50. Cheaper than .223 or 7.62x39

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## osan

> I have a 9mm already, want to try something new and was looking into the 5.7


I've shot 5.7s.  Nice little cartridge - fairly nasty, but I would not want to count on it for my life.  Generally speaking, larger masses tend to make for better stops.  Not universally so, but a good rule of thumb. 

9mm is anemic.  I have one 9mm pistol (Walther P88) and it sits and collects value... and dust.  The 40 Smith is a much better defensive round.  I load my .357s to SAAMI max., about 1500fps with 125s.  You can load 40 Smith "long", requiring a 10mm magazine, to 1580 with 180s!  That is a VERY hot round, still within spec, but barely.  Getting hit with a 180 grain slug at that energy is going to kick the living snot out of a guy.  An additional advantage is that the .40 Smith brass is actually stronger than 10mm in the web.

So here is a great way to spend your money: get a 1911 in 10mm and replace barrel with one chambered for .40.  Then get to rolling your own.  You will have a thunderously power self defense tool.

Another possibility is 38 Super Auto, which is equivalent to 357 magnum in energy delivery and is one of the gold standards for accuracy.

Finally, there is always the steady old .45 ACP which delivers a hell of a wallop as well.

The FN Five-Seven seems a reliable gun but is stupidly costly, ugly as hell, and offers less stopping power and a greater chance of over-penetration depending on the round used.  I carry .45, .40, and .357.  I sold my 38 Super PPC gun in a fit of financial desperation 3 years ago and have been kicking myself ever since.  The thought still makes my head hurt.  

I think I'll go to my room now and cry.

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## Jingles

I enjoy my FiveSeveN.

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## osan

> I've got a Kimber Custom Stainless II.  .45 ACP.


I would not trust my life to a Kimber.  Nicely made guns, but two years ago several failed at some major competition.  Reliability must be the #1 consideration for any self defense weapon.  If it cannot be trusted absolutely, there is no reason to have it.  If one is going to spend $1400 on a Kimber, I'd say save the pennies and for twice that, give or take, you can get a Baer, which is perhaps the finest 1911 on the planet, bar none.  I was going to get an Ultra CDP II until I heard of the failures.




> Aside from a Glock, you can never go wrong with a 1911.


I know it is all a matter of taste, but I do not like Glocks at all.




> I also like the Springfield XD/XDM line.  Very solid handguns.


Agreed.  I carry a /40 XD daily.  I will note that the triggers on the XDs are actually nicer than the ones on the XDMs that I have shot, which are VERY mushy feeling - not at all what I want from a "match" trigger.  I was utterly shocked by that.

I've stoned the sear on my (or rather my wife's) XD and while not match grade, is still very nice.

[auote] I know FN also makes some AR uppers for the round as well.  Commonality of ammo between weapons is always a good thing.[/QUOTE]

Kind of pricey, though.  They were ca. $700 back when Obammy was getting hisownself elected.  Dunno what they run nowadays.  I am not sure I see the niche in which 5.7 rests unless round size/weight is an issue.  5.56 is far and away harder hitting and out to much greater ranges.  No sane man will hunt deer with 5.7 unless they enjoy maiming them or likes to run through the woods a lot chasing wounded animals.  Though I'd never want to be on the wrong end of one, I would not trust my life to one unless there was nothing else around.  45 ACP undoubtedly does a far better job, as do other old reliables.

From a practical POV I think it is best to stock arms chambered for military rounds - 5.56, 7.62x51, 50 BMG, 45 ACP - even 9mm in a pinch is better than nothing.  Of course there are a few old standards like 22lr that should be a staple for every owner.  One can store 20K rounds at low cost and make it last for many, many years if conditions ever became "difficult".

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## PaulineDisciple

Just now reading up on the 5.7, sounds like an interesting cartridge that could fill a niche. Looks like it bridges the gap between a low powered rifle round like the 5.56 or the 7.62x39 and a standard pistol round, the benefit being penetration and more accurate for distances that go beyond a standard pistol round. Of course another unique option would be the 7.62X25 Tokarev. Mark Koernke recommends this round/pistol for people that want a pistol round that is a good penetrator and accurate at longer distances. The only thing would be if you choose to go for one of these, buy plenty of mags and ammo at the same time just in case there is a shortage of these items in the future. Since osan mentioned how expensive the 5.7 pistols are, the Tokarev would definitely be the cheaper option and I heard those pistols are built extremely tough so they would provide you with many good years of service.

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## JebSanderson

> 5.7 ammo isn't really that bad. About 20 dollars a box of 50. Cheaper than .223 or 7.62x39


Does anyone other than FN make 5.7 ammo?

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## fisharmor

The MSRP on the five-seven is outrageous.
For that money you can practically get a Kel-Tec 22magnum, and have enough money left over for a Kel-Tec KSG.
_AND_ afford to feed them.

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## damiengwa

> Haven't ever tried a P90 and I completely fail to see the point in that "personal defense weapon".


Its light, reliable, holds 50 rounds, ejects doward out of line of sight, is very compact making it great from vehicle security, and the military grade penetrator can easily cut through a IIA vest out a carbine length barrel (almost as fast as a 5.56 Nato out a 14.5" barrel).  Some say it can possibly beat a level II vest.  What's there not to like other than the light caliber?

Watch last 2 episodes of top shot.  They worked with an FN 5.7 Pistol and last time the PS90.  Its amazing what it did to a big ole watermellon.  Blew it up like a rifle cartidge would.

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## GuerrillaXXI

I recall reading online reports from SWAT pigs who were unhappy with the stopping power from their P90 subguns and gave them up. I might be willing to accept reduced stopping power in exchange for armor-piercing capability, but AP ammo in 5.7 isn't sold to private citizens. The 20-round mag capacity of the FN is nice, but it's not much more than you get with a full-size 9mm like the Glock 17. Hell, you can even get extended mags for the Glock 17 that hold 33 rounds.

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## azxd

The 5.7 is a nice shooter, but if you're after another pistol that's a bit on the exotic side, able tohunt with, and can be used defensively, while being easier to find ammo for ... You should look into a 10mm.

Glock G20 and EAA Witness Elite Match make very nice 10mm pistols (15+1), and Colt is again making a 1911 model in 10mm (8+1), but I have no experience with their gun.

Some info for the curious:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/10mm_Auto

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## kwikrnu

I like the 5.7 pistol. I had one a few years ago, but sold it. I will have another when I get a good deal on one. It is light with good capacity. It also defeats light body armor.
If you don't need to carry concealed it would recommend an ak-47 pistol in 7.62x39 or an AR pistol in 5.56x45 or 5.45x39. Those rounds also defeat body armor.

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## kwikrnu

double post

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## JebSanderson

The reason I'm asking about the FiveSeven is I need a handgun but it must be .380 Auto or smaller.

No .38 Super, .38 Commando, .357 Magnum, .357 SIG, 9x19mm Parabellum or larger.

So basically I'm left with .380 ACP/9mm Kurz, 5.7mm, .22LR, .22 Magnum, etc.

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## Athan

> My agency.


Oh no! The moll is a mole!

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## azxd

> The reason I'm asking about the FiveSeven is I need a handgun but *it must be .380 Auto or smaller.*
> 
> No .38 Super, .38 Commando, .357 Magnum, .357 SIG, 9x19mm Parabellum or larger.
> 
> So basically I'm left with .380 ACP/9mm Kurz, 5.7mm, .22LR, .22 Magnum, etc.


Contract/employment requirement ?

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## JebSanderson

> Contract/employment requirement ?


Something like that.

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## jdcole

Eh, get that Kel-Tec PMR-30.  30 rounds in the mag+1 in the chamber, .22 Mag.  Lightweight.  Similar ballistics to a .380 auto (at least in gel).

It'd ruin somebody's day, that's for sure.

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## kcchiefs6465

> The reason I'm asking about the FiveSeven is I need a handgun but it must be .380 Auto or smaller.
> 
> No .38 Super, .38 Commando, .357 Magnum, .357 SIG, 9x19mm Parabellum or larger.
> 
> *So basically I'm left with .380 ACP/9mm Kurz, 5.7mm,* .22LR, .22 Magnum, etc.


I would take the 5.7 over a .380 anyday. The Five SeveN has a large clip capacity as well as defeating basic body armor. And to answer your earlier question there are numerous manufacturers of 5.7x28mm ammunition.

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## JebSanderson

> Eh, get that Kel-Tec PMR-30.  30 rounds in the mag+1 in the chamber, .22 Mag.  Lightweight.  Similar ballistics to a .380 auto (at least in gel).
> 
> It'd ruin somebody's day, that's for sure.


Yeah that's one gun I'd consider. The PMR-30 is extremely lightweight, huge magazine, little recoil and the .22 Magnum has an impressive amount of power for it's size.

30 gr (1.9 g) HP	2,200 ft/s (670 m/s)	     322 ft·lbf (437 J)
40 gr (2.6 g) JHP	1,910 ft/s (580 m/s)	     324 ft·lbf (439 J)
50 gr (3.2 g) JHP	1,650 ft/s (500 m/s)	     300 ft·lbf (410 J)

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## GuerrillaXXI

> I like the 5.7 pistol. I had one a few years ago, but sold it. I will have another when I get a good deal on one. It is light with good capacity. It also defeats light body armor.


I've read that none of the 5.7 rounds available on the commercial market can defeat modern soft armor. The AP bullets for the 5.7 are sold only to the pigs and the military.




> If you don't need to carry concealed it would recommend an ak-47 pistol in 7.62x39 or an AR pistol in 5.56x45 or 5.45x39. Those rounds also defeat body armor.


Those might get through soft armor, depending on muzzle velocity and bullet type.

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## brushfire

Its not uncommon for me to be approached by prospecting gun owners, with similar questions.
For some reason, many new gun owners take the apporach that they will only purchase 1 gun in their life.  So its a gun that must do everything.  Not saying this is the OP's case, but I often reply that there's no reason to limit yourself to 1 gun.  If you want a 22, get it.  You can buy a 500 mag next week, next month, next year... 

The short answer...  Why not get both?  9mm and 5.7 both offer pros and cons.

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## JebSanderson

> Its not uncommon for me to be approached by prospecting gun owners, with similar questions.
> For some reason, many new gun owners take the apporach that they will only purchase 1 gun in their life.  So its a gun that must do everything.  Not saying this is the OP's case, but I often reply that there's no reason to limit yourself to 1 gun.  If you want a 22, get it.  You can buy a 500 mag next week, next month, next year... 
> 
> The short answer...  Why not get both?  9mm and 5.7 both offer pros and cons.


I can't have a 9mm for certain reasons. As I stated, there are limitations on the caliber I can have. So it I'm basically narrowed down to. .22LR, .22 magnum, .38 ACP and 5.7mm.

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## kcchiefs6465

> I've read that none of the 5.7 rounds available on the commercial market can defeat modern soft armor. The AP bullets for the 5.7 are sold only to the pigs and the military.
> 
> Those might get through soft armor, depending on muzzle velocity and bullet type.


EDIT: After doing some research it seems you are correct.

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## JebSanderson

> I was under the impression 5.7x 28mm FMJ's defeat class 3 armor.. I believe FN had a commercial stating that and it caused a $#@!storm.


Type III armor protects against 7.62x51mm, so I doubt a 5.7x28mm can pierce that. I do think it could pierce Type IIIA armor which is supposed to protect up till .357 SIG at 1450 ft/s.

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