# Start Here > Guest Forum >  Corporate profits at record highs, but where are the jobs

## Boshembechle

Free marketers and supply siders like to say that more money in the hands of "job creators" leads to more jobs, but corporate pforts are at fifty year highs. If your theories are correct, we should be swimming in jobs. I think this reveals a fundamental truth: middle class demand, NOT the rich, are what creates jobs. Middle class demand is diminishing, and you NEED that to have jobs.

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## Natural Citizen

> Free marketers and supply siders like to say that more money in the hands of "job creators" leads to more jobs, but corporate pforts are at fifty year highs.


Terms like "job creators" is a product of the Frank Luntz play on words by way of the "We Ask, You Decide" gang to change the terms of controversy. A slick way to re-personify the corporation and spin the issue six ways from Tuesday. And we don't have a free market system at the moment. What we have is mercantilism. I get to chuckling over this new term "crony capitalism too. That's another knee slapper.

Speaking of mercantilism, we don't read too much in terms of the Trans-Pacific Partnership agreement here at RPF these days.

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## Vanguard101

> Free marketers and supply siders like to say that more money in the hands of "job creators" leads to more jobs, but corporate pforts are at fifty year highs. If your theories are correct, we should be swimming in jobs. I think this reveals a fundamental truth: middle class demand, NOT the rich, are what creates jobs. Middle class demand is diminishing, and you NEED that to have jobs.


Regulations....lack of incentives.....terrible business climate....maybe some people are worried about another crash......scared to invest.......


The middle class is only diminishing because of inflation and the left's inability to understand facts about the economy.

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## oyarde

> Free marketers and supply siders like to say that more money in the hands of "job creators" leads to more jobs, but corporate pforts are at fifty year highs. If your theories are correct, we should be swimming in jobs. I think this reveals a fundamental truth: middle class demand, NOT the rich, are what creates jobs. Middle class demand is diminishing, and you NEED that to have jobs.


You can thank Obummercare for most of that the past 2 1/2 yrs.

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## bunklocoempire

> Free marketers and supply siders like to say that more money in the hands of "job creators" leads to more jobs, but corporate pforts are at fifty year highs. If your theories are correct, we should be swimming in jobs. I think this reveals a fundamental truth: middle class demand, NOT the rich, are what creates jobs. Middle class demand is diminishing, and you NEED that to have jobs.


My Ferrari is actually just a Pinto kit car.  Man Ferraris suck.

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## CaptUSA

> Free marketers and supply siders like to say that more money in the hands of "job creators" leads to more jobs, but corporate pforts are at fifty year highs. If your theories are correct, we should be swimming in jobs. I think this reveals a fundamental truth: middle class demand, NOT the rich, are what creates jobs. Middle class demand is diminishing, and you NEED that to have jobs.


Wow...  If one data point was all it took...

You are missing far too many factors.  Artificially low interest rates, economic uncertainty due to government regulation, new costs for labor, the speed of money... the list goes on and on.  If we remove the barriers, then those "record profits" would start to move.

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## angelatc

> Free marketers and supply siders like to say that more money in the hands of "job creators" leads to more jobs, but corporate pforts are at fifty year highs. If your theories are correct, we should be swimming in jobs. I think this reveals a fundamental truth: middle class demand, NOT the rich, are what creates jobs. Middle class demand is diminishing, and you NEED that to have jobs.


Strawman.   Nobody here says anything even remotely like what you're defending against.  

What we do say is that government handouts and stimulus programs do absolutely nothing except make the rich richer. This proves our point.

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## Cleaner44

I thought Obama fixed everything and jobs are now back to the 2008 level.  Is this information wrong?

*Finally! Job market returns to 2008 peak*
http://money.cnn.com/2014/06/06/inve...y-jobs-report/

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## NorthCarolinaLiberty

> ... but corporate pforts are at fifty year highs.



Source?

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## Natural Citizen

> Source?


Depends upon how one would approach the issue, I suppose. There really are quite a few aspects to the phenomenon. All produce numbers across the board respective to relevance in scope.

Perhaps we could start with the tax havens? 

Top 12 tax havens for US companies

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## TonySutton

> It is a fact that the S&P 500 reported a combined $1.6 trillion in profits in 2011, the highest profits in 50 years, adjusted for inflation. It is also a fact that unemployment remains above 8%. Advocates for higher taxes add these two facts together to refute the notion that lower taxes stimulate job creation.
> 
> But there are a couple of other facts to consider when evaluating the implications of those first two - first, there are 2.5 million corporations in the United States, and those 50-year record profits are what was reported by 500 of them for a single year. A record amount of profit posted by .02% of our corporations does not tell us anything meaningful about the profitability of the other 99.98%.


http://www.maciverinstitute.com/2012...ecord-profits/

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## Cleaner44

> Free marketers and supply siders like to say that more money in the hands of "job creators" leads to more jobs, but corporate pforts are at fifty year highs. If your theories are correct, we should be swimming in jobs. I think this reveals a fundamental truth: middle class demand, NOT the rich, are what creates jobs. Middle class demand is diminishing, and you NEED that to have jobs.


The real problem of course is that the politicians in the government are constantly tilting the situation to strengthen the well connected special interests.  Just look at how the Obama administration sent Solyndra hundreds of millions of dollars.  These politicians don't care about creating jobs, they care about lining pockets.  It doesn't matter if it is Democrats or Republicans, this is what they do, they each have their own cronies.

Once you come to terms with the fact that politicians aren't there to help create jobs, you will be better able to understand real solutions.  The solutions don't lie with corrupt politicians... and let's not pretend that we just need to elect better politicians.  

Stop hating companies that make a profit, they aren't the problem.  Less profitable companies don't create jobs, they go out of business.  

Stop buying the class envy being sold to you by politicians, they are dishonest people that are skilled at manipulating your feelings.

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## erowe1

> Free marketers and supply siders like to say that more money in the hands of "job creators" leads to more jobs


What do you mean free marketers and supply siders?

Isn't giving more money to "job creators" in hopes that it would lead to more jobs exactly what the Obama stimulus was?

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## erowe1

> http://www.maciverinstitute.com/2012...ecord-profits/


So the OP was parroting a line from two years ago that has already been debunked as if it were today's news.

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## jkr

if you look closely, you will find them snuggly nestled inside Corporate profits 

see!
*Corporate the jobs profits*

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## PierzStyx

> Free marketers and supply siders like to say that more money in the hands of "job creators" leads to more jobs, but corporate pforts are at fifty year highs. If your theories are correct, we should be swimming in jobs. I think this reveals a fundamental truth: middle class demand, NOT the rich, are what creates jobs. Middle class demand is diminishing, and you NEED that to have jobs.


Corporatism, modern day mercantilism, isn't free market economics. The market is very much regulated. The Fed engages in price fixing and money manipulation on a daily basis. What you're complaining about is the natural result of socialism, i.e. jobs and goods shortages while the rich keep massive amounts of wealth.

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## Cleaner44

> Free marketers and supply siders like to say that more money in the hands of "job creators" leads to more jobs, but corporate pforts are at fifty year highs. If your theories are correct, we should be swimming in jobs. I think this reveals a fundamental truth: middle class demand, NOT the rich, are what creates jobs. Middle class demand is diminishing, and you NEED that to have jobs.


You and Obama are right...
*Aetna quarterly profit beats forecasts as new members surge*
http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/...A3N0Q320140424

Corporate profits do increase when the government mandates that people purchase their products.

Now I don't know if this resulted in jobs being created, but somehow I don't think that was a concern of the politicians that were interested in getting Aetna more customers.  Now of course the middle class will be diminished as their healthcare cost rise, but again, I don't think that was a concern of the politicians that were interested in getting Aetna more customers.

Poor Cindy Vinson didn't expect that Obamacare would diminish her standard of living:
*“Of course, I want people to have health care,” Vinson said. “I just didn’t realize I would be the one who was going to pay for it personally.”*
http://www.mercurynews.com/ci_242484...osers-bay-area

Now you may argue that Cindy needs a second job and maybe Aetna can hire her as their business is booming, but I think she would be better off if the government stopped causing her cost of living to increase at a pace that far exceeds her wage increases.  She needs her expenses to decrease, not her working hours to increase.  Cindy wants to go home to her children, but all Obama cares about is Aetna quarterly profits.  Won't you please think of the children?

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## TheTexan

The thing is, this isn't a free market

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## specsaregood

> The thing is, this isn't a free market


You mean a "free market" isn't when you go shopping using your ebt card?

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## Vanguard101

Are profits really at an all time high? Did it ever occur to anyone that they earn more money when we give them welfare???

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## VIDEODROME

Seems like the American way is to send the profits to the share holders.  No more incentive bonus for hard working laborers.

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## Seraphim

Here is an answer from an American CEO:

The crux: Government regulations, Obamacare and taxes have made it INCREDIBLY expensive to hire.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-0...g-young-people

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## really

It's clear that corporate profits do not directlytranslate to more jobs.  There is a lotof money sitting around that has not been invested in creating new jobs.

I hear that low interest rates are to blame. Regulation is to blame. The ACA isto blame. Taxes are to blame.

All of these things are true. However, the shrinking middle class has less moneyto spend. It is the middle class that drives the economy and there is no reasonfor "job creators" to create jobs (invest in new production capacity)if no one can afford the products that they make.  
Supply and Demand baby.

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## Acala

> It's clear that corporate profits do not directlytranslate to more jobs.  There is a lotof money sitting around that has not been invested in creating new jobs.
> 
> I hear that low interest rates are to blame. Regulation is to blame. The ACA isto blame. Taxes are to blame.
> 
> All of these things are true. However, the shrinking middle class has less moneyto spend. It is the middle class that drives the economy and there is no reasonfor "job creators" to create jobs (invest in new production capacity)if no one can afford the products that they make.  
> Supply and Demand baby.


Production leads consumption, baby.  Only in the keynesian fantasy world where banks can create money out of thin air forever can you pretend that consumers can come to market without having produced something to trade.

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