# Liberty Movement > Defenders of Liberty > Justin Amash Forum >  Michigan Poll: Justin Amash Underwater Beneath 20 Percent, Trails Challenger by Double Digits

## Cleaner44

What a shame. Amash could have built a bridge with Trump and helped push the GOP in a more libertarian direction, just as Rand Paul does, but instead he chose to burn bridges. While Rand doesn't see eye to eye with Trump on many issues, he does have an open line of communication and the respect of Trump. Amash now has no influence and we libertarians will lose one of the few voices we have in D.C. TDS is a terrible disease.

_Rep. Justin Amash (R-MI), the Michigan Never Trump GOP congressman who recently publicly backed impeachment of President Donald Trump, is now underwater in his own district according to a poll obtained exclusively by Breitbart News._
https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2...double-digits/

----------


## devil21

A poll obtained exclusively by Trumpkin media?  Sounds legit.

Polls are meant to influence, not inform.

----------


## EBounding

What if Justin actually believes what he says about impeachment?  It wouldn't be very principled to say nice things about Trump just to keep his seat.

----------


## dannno

> What if Justin actually believes what he says about impeachment?






> TDS is a terrible disease.



Then we mourn the loss of a great man, to a terrible disease.

----------


## Cleaner44

> What if Justin actually believes what he says about impeachment?  It wouldn't be very principled to say nice things about Trump just to keep his seat.


Why does Amash has to say nice things about Trump? What if he just didn't make a point to call for an impeachment he should know will never happen? 

Given that Trump absolutely won't be impeached, it seems to me that the smarter approach would be to just continue working for his constituents. Lining up with AOC and the gang is the definition of political stupidity.

----------


## Superfluous Man

What a load of sensationalistic bull. As if "double-digits" equates to some huge margin.

----------


## Brian4Liberty

> Michigan Poll: Justin Amash Underwater Beneath 20 Percent, Trails Challenger by Double Digits


It ain’t over till it’s over. But what happened to Mark Sanford and Dave Brat is not a good sign.

----------


## spudea

> Rep. Justin Amash (R-MI), the Michigan Never Trump GOP congressman who recently publicly backed impeachment of President Donald Trump, is now underwater in his own district according to a poll obtained exclusively by Breitbart News.
> 
> *Amash is polling at just 17 percent in the GOP primary, trailing State Rep. Jim Lower by double digits.* Lower, who announced his candidacy as Amash revealed his support for impeaching Trump, is at 27 percent–a 10-point lead over Amash. What’s more, another Amash challenger, State Rep. Lynn Afendoulis, is tied with the congressman for 17 percent–meaning one challenger to the incumbent representative is beating him by double digits and a second is already tied with him.
> 
> The poll, conducted by Strategic National, surveyed 400 likely Republican voters in Michigan’s third congressional district from June 29 to July 1 and has a margin of error of 4.89 percent.  *Strategic National has a track record as a political consulting and polling firm for getting Michigan politics correct.* In fact, it was the only firm in the nation to correctly call the Michigan victory by President Trump over Democrat Hillary Rodham Clinton in 2016, publishing a poll showing a tie between the two in the final days of the election. 
> 
> Strategic National CEO John Yob, whose firm conducted the poll, said in a release obtained by Breitbart News that there are two big takeaways from this survey: First, *Amash is in serious trouble and his only real path back to his congressional seat is if Democrats cross over to vote for him in the GOP primary.*
> 
> “Congressman Amash has a path to victory by *turning out Democrats to vote in the Republican Primary* in a crowded field that isn’t represented in the topline results of the survey,” Yob said.  “The results of the Democrat portion of the survey are consistent with the *strong Democrat turnout he had at his townhall meeting.*”
> ...


https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2...ouble-digits/#

----------


## kahless

> https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2...ouble-digits/#


LMAO!  As expected.  He played to the lunatic left thinking it was going to help him.  What a dumb-ass.  All he had to do is keep it together, not be a moronic anti-Trumper and he would have been leading.

----------


## fcreature

> LMAO!  As expected.  He played to the lunatic left thinking it was going to help him.  What a dumb-ass.  All he had to do is keep it together, not be a moronic anti-Trumper and he would have been leading.


Think about it. If he actually cared about reigning in FISA abuse and government surveillance, what more perfect an opportunity would have ever arisen than now? He could have rallied Republicans around him and joined efforts with Trump, who does not want this to ever happen to another president again.

How he could blow this moment so hard is beyond me. TDS is a very sad disease.

----------


## Anti Globalist

Hopefully Amash can still pull out a victory.  I don't like what hes doing calling for Trumps impeachment, but hes one of the best people we have in Congress.  We can't afford to lose him.

----------


## ThePaleoLibertarian

Bra-vo, Justin. What a good move you made. The liberty movement is sure in great shape!




What an idiot.

----------


## TER

So sad. This is horrible news, but not a surprise.  Hopefully these polls are inaccurate.

----------


## TheCount

Oh boy, I wonder what his challenger's politics/policies are...




> Bill Summary:                                                              A resolution to encourage the Congress of the United States to continue aid and support for Israel.                             
> 
>                              Sponsors (1): James Lower (R)*


https://www.billtrack50.com/BillDetail/1127878



Yaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay

----------


## PAF

> Oh boy, I wonder what his challenger's politics/policies are...
> 
> 
> https://www.billtrack50.com/BillDetail/1127878
> 
> 
> 
> Yaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay



Wow. Thats like hot off the press. What a coincidence. See the date?

----------


## Cleaner44

> Think about it. If he actually cared about reigning in FISA abuse and government surveillance, what more perfect an opportunity would have ever arisen than now? He could have rallied Republicans around him and joined efforts with Trump, who does not want this to ever happen to another president again.
> 
> How he could blow this moment so hard is beyond me. TDS is a very sad disease.


Exactly. This is a great time to make a stink about FISA abuse. We all knew it would be abused and here it is happening at the highest level and what does Amash have to say about it? Wasted opportunity.

----------


## RonZeplin

Justin is the tip of the spear movement by Americans to MAGA, by dumping Trump.   

Landslide victory is in the bag.   

Let Liberty Reign.

----------


## Superfluous Man

> ...Trump, who does not want this to ever happen to another president again.


What in the world are you talking about? Trump's outlook is that it sure better happen to other presidents, if it happened to him.

Now that Trump is in the WH, being against FISA abuse means being against Trump.

----------


## oyarde

I hope Amash wins , if he is serious about it he needs to say so . Would get more donations .

----------


## Swordsmyth

> What if Justin actually believes what he says about impeachment?  It wouldn't be very principled to say nice things about Trump just to keep his seat.


He can't, the charges are too stupid for anyone to believe.

----------


## Swordsmyth

> Justin is the tip of the spear movement by Americans to MAGA, by dumping Trump.   
> 
> Landslide victory is in the bag.   
> 
> Let Liberty Reign.


Only an enemy would encourage Amash to keep doing the stupid garbage that made this possible.
You are cheering the political death of one of the best voting records in Congress.

----------


## Swordsmyth

> What in the world are you talking about? Trump's outlook is that it sure better happen to other presidents, if it happened to him.
> 
> Now that Trump is in the WH, being against FISA abuse means being against Trump.

----------


## dannno

> Trump's outlook is that it sure better happen to other presidents, if it happened to him.


Wrong, as you always are.

----------


## UWDude

> He did plenty of other things against Trump and this didn't happen, Rand has opposed Trump and this didn't happen.
> This happened because he endorsed treasonous lies.


Exactly.  

Amash thinks he can unite the parties in their hate for Trump.
He is purple revolution not-gonna-happen levels dumb.

He $#@!ed up.  
That's all there is to it.

Bye Bye Amash.  Run for president for LP.
Bigger win for Trump.

----------


## r3volution 3.0

> He did plenty of other things against Trump and this didn't happen, Rand has opposed Trump and this didn't happen.


Rand isn't up for reelection, and Rand's been shilling for Trump by and large since the doofus moved into the White House. 




> This happened because he endorsed treasonous lies.


It happened because he opposed Trump: period. 




> The GOP is the only side we can work with to get anything done and we are pulling them our direction


If by "us" you mean people obsessed with culture and nationalism and actively opposed to small government, that's right.

Of course, I am not part of that "us."




> Trump himself is closer to us than the GOP, if you actually care about making progress then we must work with the GOP until something changes.


The GOP is a dumpster-fire, more even than during the Bush administration. 

Trump is affecting a permanent change in the party; it isnt even pretending to care about small government anymore.

As we were discussing in another thread recently, FOX is focused on anti-trust and regulatory actions against its political enemies.

No one in the GOP gives a flying $#@! about the astronomical level of federal spending and debt.

Imbeciles seem to think that Trump has accomplished "deregulation."

The GOP is done as a vehicle for libertarians (malfunctional vehicle though it was the whole time). 

It's becoming a national socialist party; i.e. just like the Democrats, but on the other side of the culture war - useless.

----------


## Swordsmyth

> Rand isn't up for reelection, and Rand's been shilling for Trump by and large since the doofus moved into the White House. 
> 
> 
> 
> It happened because he opposed Trump: period. 
> 
> 
> 
> If by "us" you mean people obsessed with culture and nationalism and actively opposed to small government, that's right.
> ...


LOL

----------


## r3volution 3.0

> LOL


ROFLMAO



We'll discuss this further in a couple decades over a $500 coffee.

MAGA!

----------


## Swordsmyth

> ROFLMAO
> 
> 
> 
> We'll discuss this further in a couple decades over a $500 coffee.
> 
> MAGA!


If you have your way we'll be too dead to enjoy the $50,000 cocoa.

----------


## Origanalist

> Rand isn't up for reelection, and Rand's been shilling for Trump by and large since the doofus moved into the White House. 
> 
> 
> 
> It happened because he opposed Trump: period. 
> 
> 
> 
> If by "us" you mean people obsessed with culture and nationalism and actively opposed to small government, that's right.
> ...


Where do you get the idea that the gop wasn't a dumpster fire under Bush?

----------


## r3volution 3.0

> Where do you get the idea that the gop wasn't a dumpster fire under Bush?


Oh, it was, but it pretended to care about small government.

That was always the reason for libertarians to work within the GOP.

They obviously don't really care about small government, but, as long as they pretended, that gave us an angle. 

...i.e. they couldn't attack us (too much) for actually promoting what they pretended to believe in. 

Now, they don't even pretend; e.g. every single $#@!ing night on FOX this $#@! Tucker Carlson spews anti-capitalist garbage.

...to be invariably repeated by the GOP faithful the next day, on Breitbart, here.

----------


## PAF

> Rand isn't up for reelection, and Rand's been shilling for Trump by and large since the doofus moved into the White House. 
> 
> 
> 
> It happened because he opposed Trump: period. 
> 
> 
> 
> If by "us" you mean people obsessed with culture and nationalism and actively opposed to small government, that's right.
> ...



You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to r3volution 3.0 again.

----------


## spudea

> He's probably going to lose.
> 
> Why?
> 
> He angered Trump, and the GOP is presently Trump's bitch. 
> 
> As I said weeks ago in another thread, this is exactly why (l)ibertarians ought to leave the GOP.
> 
> *Run LP Justin*; so what if $#@!tard loses to Biden, same thing anyway - stop pretending they're allies, $#@! them.


Amash angered his constituents and many people that campaigned and supported him.

----------


## PAF

> Amash angered his constituents and many people that campaigned and supported him.


Correct. Those that vote based on podium rhetoric and emotion and not the actual floor votes in the house.

All of this nonsense does not bother me in the least as long as his record stays above 90%, which it is.

I wonder if he is replaced what the record will be of his replacement. Care to guess?

----------


## Superfluous Man

> Uh, he's said as much in dozens of interviews. What in the world are _you_ talking about?


Ohhhhh. So you're taking Trump at his word. Got it.

That's one of my pet peeves with the Trump lemmings. When Trump claims that he wants something, then instead of saying, "Trump claims that he wants X," they just skip right to, "Trump wants X," as though it's a fact because he said so. Not long ago that very thing happened with one of their thread titles, and they were apoplectic when the mods changed the title to be more accurate, instead of us all going along with them at pretending we could take Trump at his word.

----------


## Superfluous Man

> Amash angered his constituents and many people that campaigned and supported him.


But not by doing anything that any of them have any good reason to be angry about.

----------


## Cleaner44

> Justin is the tip of the spear movement by Americans to MAGA, by dumping Trump.   
> 
> Landslide victory is in the bag.   
> 
> Let Liberty Reign.


This won't age well...

----------


## nobody's_hero

> Hopefully Amash can still pull out a victory.  I don't like what hes doing calling for Trumps impeachment, but hes one of the best people we have in Congress.  We can't afford to lose him.


Then he'd better run as a democrat. You don't get into office in this country unless you play the two party game. It is what it is.





> Correct. Those that vote based on podium rhetoric and emotion and not the actual floor votes in the house.
> 
> All of this nonsense does not bother me in the least as long as his record stays above 90%, which it is.
> 
> I wonder if he is replaced what the record will be of his replacement. Care to guess?


Umm, you *do* realize he could be in there for a long time keeping up that voting record if he had been a bit more savvy about politics, don't you?

Libertarians need to come up with a better strategy than "Damn the torpedoes!" if you actually want to change anything.

----------


## PAF

> Then he'd better run as a democrat. You don't get into office in this country unless you play the two party game. It is what it is.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Umm, you *do* realize he could be in there for a long time keeping up that voting record if he had been a bit more savvy about politics, don't you?
> 
> Libertarians need to come up with a better strategy than "Damn the torpedoes!" if you actually want to change anything.



Justin will be on the RonPaulLibertyReport where he will take off the gloves ;-)

And I can’t wait!

----------


## nobody's_hero

> Justin will be on the RonPaulLibertyReport where he will take off the gloves ;-)
> 
> And I can’t wait!


I'm sure you and the other guy who watches the show are overjoyed.

----------


## Cap

> I'm sure you and the other guy who watches the show are overjoyed.


GFY

----------


## nobody's_hero

> GFY


Oh please, do continue preaching to the choir.

I'm sorry but y'all need to come up with a G-D DAMNED STRATEGY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

So if you think it's cool for liberty candidates to perform seppuku on a whim after everyone busts their asses to get them into office, maybe you can "GFY."

----------


## Cap

> Oh please, do continue preaching to the choir.
> 
> I'm sorry but y'all need to come up with a G-D DAMNED STRATEGY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  !!!!!!!!!!!!!!
> 
> So if you think it's cool for liberty candidates to perform seppuku on a whim after everyone busts their asses to get them into office, maybe you can "GFY."


Oh I get it, you are just keeping with the new forum mission. Phuck you and the Orange man!

----------


## fcreature

> Ohhhhh. So you're taking Trump at his word. Got it.
> 
> That's one of my pet peeves with the Trump lemmings. When Trump claims that he wants something, then instead of saying, "Trump claims that he wants X," they just skip right to, "Trump wants X," as though it's a fact because he said so. Not long ago that very thing happened with one of their thread titles, and they were apoplectic when the mods changed the title to be more accurate, instead of us all going along with them at pretending we could take Trump at his word.


LOL you are seriously a top tier moron. Trump "lemming"? Read my post history. Your stage 4 TDS is honestly getting tiresome at this point.

You have no evidence that Trump wants to use FISA against future presidents. You are just spewing this nonsense right out of your ass. Literally making it up, acting like it's fact, then telling everyone else how stupid we are. Instead, I've seen and heard in dozens of interviews an authentic expression of disdain for the abuse he has had to suffer. 

An innocent man was targeted by his political opponent in conjunction with the US government spying apparatus / deep state to be set up for a fake crime. Our government sent multiple spies into his campaign to attempt to lure and entrap people who worked for him. They compiled entirely made up, filthy, disgusting "dossiers" and used them to obtain illegal FISA warrants. The deep state worked with multiple foreign governments to circumvent our own laws and spy further on the campaign. Top FBI agents conspired to create an "insurance policy" to take him out in the case that he won. A special council was launched based off the illegal leaking of a justifiably fired FBI director. The special council was run by Andrew Weissmann, one of the most hated and least respected US attorneys in all of history, who hired primarily Clinton donors and former Clinton employees. The special council knew from day one that the crime they were investigating was a hoax, but proceed for two years to lie, attack, smear, and arrest anyone who dared enter Trump's orbit. Many lives of innocent people were ruined over process crimes with the goal of forcing someone to sing the songs the government wanted to hear. 

Everything stated above is FACT. You are unable to even admit what happened, and as such you can't genuinely understand that a man who suffered through this might not want it to happen to others.

Truly disgusting.

----------


## nobody's_hero

> Oh I get it, you are just keeping with the new forum mission. Phuck you and the Orange man!


Orange man is GONE in 5 years (hell, he may be gone by Jan 2021). Do better. Think long term. I know it hurts, but, think. Massie just lost his only ally in congress just so y'all can beat your chests. I certainly don't think Trump is gonna be there forever. I'm trying to figure out how to get more liberty candidates into congress while holding on to the ones we've got, meanwhile others are saluting them and encouraging them to 'go down in flames.' 

Do you kind of see how we're at odds here over what's the best strategy?

----------


## RonZeplin

> This won't age well...


Even Ray Charles can see that you're wrong.

----------


## TheCount



----------


## devil21

> I hate how libertarians tend to virtue themselves into self-immolation.  Justin Amash was $#@!ing retarded on this point.


There's gotta be more to this whole thing.  Amash is no dummy and knew what the reaction would be.  Getting out as one of the last men of intellect and principle in Congress, perhaps, but I can't shake the feeling that he has something else up his sleeve.

----------


## Philhelm

> There's gotta be more to this whole thing.  Amash is no dummy and knew what the reaction would be.  Getting out as one of the last men of intellect and principle in Congress, perhaps, but I can't shake the feeling that he has something else up his sleeve.


I doubt that he has something up his sleeve (or maybe a two of clubs at best).

----------


## EBounding

Another challenger appears.  He's heir to the Meijer store fortune.  And one of his first tweets was anti-war:

----------


## loveshiscountry

> No, I did not.
> 
> Your lies and projection don't deserve any further response.


Yes you did, You repeating the exact same drivel over and over again deserves no credibility.

----------


## RonZeplin



----------

