# Liberty Movement > Defenders of Liberty > Justin Amash Forum >  Pauls urge Amash not to run for Senate

## compromise

> (NEWSCHANNEL 3) - Two political heavyweights are reportedly pressuring Congressman Justin Amash not to run for the Senate next year. There's a lot of speculation that Amash will run for Senator Carl Levin's seat when he retires next year. But an article in the National Journal is reporting Kentucky Senator Rand Paul and his father, former presidential candidate Ron Paul are urging Amash to stay out of the race. The Pauls reportedly view Amash as a strong libertarian voice in the House and wouldn't want to see him potentially lose the Senate race. The article also says an unnamed member of Amash's staff says the Pauls have not tried to convince him not to run.


Read More at: http://wwmt.com/news/features/featur...seat-575.shtml

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## erowe1

That National Journal article doesn't really say much. It cites "chatter" as its source.

http://www.nationaljournal.com/blogs...-over-amash-24



> But perhaps most illustrative of the tension between the two camps comes from recent chatter that Amash is being pressured by Ron and Rand Paul to stay out of the Senate race. Amash, the thinking goes, would be better-served as the chief libertarian voice in the lower chamber, rather than risking his young career on a statewide race in which the Democratic nominee would likely be favored.

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## Lucille

I hope he doesn't run for Senate either.

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## FSP-Rebel

There's a divide and conquer MO going around spreading misinfo in libertarian circles and I believe it's emanating from neoconservative sites. The fact that Jones and Kokesh are coming our way on Rand is interesting and now this oxymoron news piece via WWMT from the National Journal about whether or not the Pauls' are trying to keep him out of the Senate race. I've never known the Pauls' to pressure someone not to do something. I see the benefits of JAmash staying in the House and the adding of similar minds to that venue but I just can't see either of the Pauls trying to prevent one of our own from stepping up to take on an open Senate seat leading into an eventual Prez run by Rand which Ron will undoubtedly support. Michigan is no where near being the blue color of NY or IL so it's not a vanity run plus heavy republican and conservative money will be pouring into this race.

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## kathy88

Likely a set up by TPTB to drain his support from Ron and Rand's supporters. Imagine the righteous indignation... The Paul's told him not to and he DID it anyway. Could cost him his seat.

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## KingNothing

> Likely a set up by TPTB to drain his support from Ron and Rand's supporters. Imagine the righteous indignation... The Paul's told him not to and he DID it anyway. Could cost him his seat.


The more I think about it, the more I hope he does not run.  But if he did, I'd max-out to his campaign.  No one is draining my support, that's for sure.

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## jmdrake

I can't imagine the Pauls doing anything other than telling Justin to carefully consider his options.

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## fr33

The media has been on a negative tear against the Pauls lately. (worse than usual I mean.)

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## mczerone

It's not like he's assured to be reelected to his congressional seat, and gerrymandering has made it all the more difficult to retain a majority in his district.

It might be a good idea for Amash to hand-pick someone to enter the GOP primary for the congressional seat if he does run for the senate seat. He must know someone in his area that's willing to run, has the background, and has the electability.

I'm more concerned with how the GOP will treat Amash if he's the nominee for the Senate seat. If they're likely to just roll over and not push for him against the Democrat with ads and media exposure, then Amash is better off just trying to retain his incumbency. But if they are willing to really try to oppose the Dems despite differences between Amash and GOP leadership, then I'd like to see him try.

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## Matt Collins

> I can't imagine the Pauls doing anything other than telling Justin to carefully consider his options.


Exactly, when the MSM isn't biased, they are often times just outright inaccurate.

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## JK/SEA

Rand wants him for his VP.

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## erowe1

I wouldn't be surprised if Jesse Benton and his boss play a role in these rumors.

I have no evidence for this. But as long as chatter is getting reported, this might as well be part of it.

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## supermario21

The ONLY way I believe this is if Ron tells Justin about his Senate experience in 1984...against an ex-Democrat Phil Gramm..Justin tweeted about a #walkwithrand today so I wonder if that came up.

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## compromise

> The ONLY way I believe this is if Ron tells Justin about his Senate experience in 1984...against an ex-Democrat Phil Gramm..Justin tweeted about a #walkwithrand today so I wonder if that came up.


Rand was heavily involved in that too. He debated Gramm on his dad's behalf.

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## supermario21

> Rand was heavily involved in that too. He debated Gramm on his dad's behalf.


That's impressive, think Rand would have been either at the end of undergrad or beginning of med school at that point.

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## luke19

Can Amash run for Senate while also running for re-election in the House? I know some states have different rules about running in multiple races.

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## Brian4Liberty

> There's a divide and conquer MO going around spreading misinfo in libertarian circles and I believe it's emanating from neoconservative sites.


The neo-con and teo-con media personalities certainly didn't hold back in propagating the anti-Rand rumor mill this week.

It's not them alone though. It's hard to match the hatred and venom that emanates from the MSNBC left.

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## TaftFan

I'm now leaning against it too.

We will have a strong liberty slate of Senate candidates in red states. We can focus there.

FYI-Mike Lee is encouraging Amash to run.

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## T.hill

> Rand was heavily involved in that too. He debated Gramm on his dad's behalf.


That's crazy, where did you find that out?

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## green73

> Rand wants him for his VP.


Not sure if serious.

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## compromise

> That's crazy, where did you find that out?


Rand's book - The Tea Party Goes to Washington

He did it at the age of 21, in front of 300 people and Gramm was impressed by his performance.

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## Brett85

> Rand wants him for his VP.


Justin would be a more credible VP candidate if he were a Senator rather than a representative.

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## FSP-Rebel

> I'm more concerned with how the GOP will treat Amash if he's the nominee for the Senate seat. If they're likely to just roll over and not push for him against the Democrat with ads and media exposure, then Amash is better off just trying to retain his incumbency. But if they are willing to really try to oppose the Dems despite differences between Amash and GOP leadership, then I'd like to see him try.


I'm pretty sure the MIGOP is looking to pick this seat back up and if they did they'd likely get more money from the national GOP for other things going forward. JAmash endorsed the sitting state chair's reelection efforts despite knowing all the grassroots delegates were against the guy, so this was obviously for political purposes. The main contender is Rep Rogers who pushed this CISPA crap amongst other votes to raise the debt ceiling and god knows what else. This news is currently being filtered by the grassroots party state and district comm members through their local party ranks and it isn't going over very well by the at large folks who aren't up to speed on their political trivia, but will be as time goes by. The point is to neutralize the main suspects before they become a threat to JAmash and potentially allow him to bypass a primary if in fact that system isn't overhauled by then.

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## sailingaway

this is a very thinly sourced rumor in the article, and I can't imagine Ron "urging" anyone to not do what they want to do. He might give advice if he thinks it is not a good time, though.  I personally want Amash in the Senate, but I DON'T want him to lose his House seat if he won't make the Senate.

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## XTreat

> I hope he doesn't run for Senate either.


Me too, but I'm down for whatever.

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## Brian4Liberty

> The main contender is Rep Rogers who pushed this CISPA crap amongst other votes to raise the debt ceiling and god knows what else.


We certainly don't want Rogers to win.

I'll support whatever Justin wants to do. If he has a good chance at winning the Senate seat, he should go for it.

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## Lindsey

My instant thought: does it seem likely the Pauls would tell someone else what they should/shouldn't do?

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## XTreat

> My instant thought: does it seem likely the Pauls would tell someone else what they should/shouldn't do?


Same

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## Michigan11

I think that twitter from Mike Lee someone posted tells it all. I hope Justin runs for the senate, as of now I see no reason he shouldn't.

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## Brett85

> I think that twitter from Mike Lee someone posted tells it all. I hope Justin runs for the senate, as of now I see no reason he shouldn't.


Well, the reason why some people think he shouldn't is because he would have to give up his house seat in order to run, and if he lost the Senate race he would be out of politics.  But, to me it seems worth the risk since this will likely be the best chance that Justin will ever have to get into the Senate.  It's a race against a non incumbent in a midterm election where turnout will be lower, Obamacare will likely be unpopular, and history shows that when a President is in his second term, his party doesn't perform very well in a midterm election.

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## Michigan11

> Well, the reason why some people think he shouldn't is because he would have to give up his house seat in order to run, and if he lost the Senate race he would be out of politics.  But, to me it seems worth the risk since this will likely be the best chance that Justin will ever have to get into the Senate.  It's a race against a non incumbent in a midterm election where turnout will be lower, Obamacare will likely be unpopular, and history shows that when a President is in his second term, his party doesn't perform very well in a midterm election.


I think it's time to push, including Rand for prez in 2016. Time is of the essence with the way this government is pushing on us at this point. We need to get any and all of our guys and future guys into the highest positions of power as opportunities arise. Amash just sitting in his current position is great but he could increase his power and that's a good gamble. If he losses he isn't just going away, he will find another path I'm sure. We can't be too conservative in holding positions, we need to press our bets at every opportunity if the odds are anywhere close to 50/50.

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## Christian Liberty

Worth a try, right?

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## cindy25

> Rand wants him for his VP.


then all the more reason for him to be a senator. house members don't make good VP choices

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## economics102

He needs to figure out his odds. Simple as that. If he has a real, legitimate shot at winning, I feel very strongly that he should do it. This is very likely Amash's only opportunity (other than as a VP nominee) to gain a seat more powerful than he has now.

My concerne is if the GOP establishment would try to shut him down during the primary, and even during the general. Remember, part of how Rand got establishment support after winning his primary was by making it clear he was willing to play ball and moderate his positions. Amash has shown himself to be more Ron than Rand, and while that's not a bad thing, it may mean the GOP establishment sees more con than pro in him being in the senate. They see how much trouble Rand has stirred up even while being a more moderate voice. They might be very afraid of a Senator Amash.

Senator Amash...how amazing would that be???

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## Bastiat's The Law

Has Justin formed an exploratory committee yet?

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## Cap

If Amash does decide to run and it looks like he is gaining momentum, I see the neo-cons resurrecting Hoekstra to thwart the Liberty movement.

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## lakerssuck92

> If Amash does decide to run and it looks like he is gaining momentum, I see the neo-cons resurrecting Hoekstra to thwart the Liberty movement.


Hoekstra is a complete loser who ran racist ads to try to win his election. Amash would wipe the floor with him in a Republican primary....

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## FSP-Rebel

Hoekstra was an embarrassment and made the establishment look like $#@!, no worries there. Was a liability for Romney.

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## libertyplz

As most expected, this rumor is false. Justin just confirmed that these rumors are wrong on his personal twitter account. (twitter.com/justinamash)

For some reason I only see Justin's response if I access his twitter through mobile. On my laptop it's not showing up unless I go directly to the user in which Justin replied to.

Here is the convo:

‏@downwithtyranny 5h (not me, some random guy)
Strange that Ron & Rand Paul are urging libertarian @repjustinamash to make way for authoritarian CISPA author Mike Rogers in US Senate race

and Justin responded:

Justin Amash ‏@justinamash 4h
@downwithtyranny They're not. That report is false.

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## Cap

> Hoekstra was an embarrassment and made the establishment look like $#@!, no worries there. Was a liability for Romney.


Well, I agree but, if you remember they brought Frothy back from the dead after his trouncing.

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## erowe1

If Amash runs for Senate, the establishment will work very hard to recruit, pump up, and fund, some candidate. They can do better than Hoekstra though.

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## Brett85

I think Rove's group really has more of an objection to incompetent candidates than conservative or libertarian candidates though.  At least as far as Rove's group is concerned, I don't think that Rove would run ads against Amash as long as he felt that Amash was a competent candidate.  He cares about winning races first and foremost.  He just doesn't like the Akins and Mourdocks of the world who say stupid things and make it harder for the Republicans to win these races.

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## Bastiat's The Law

> I think Rove's group really has more of an objection to incompetent candidates than conservative or libertarian candidates though.  At least as far as Rove's group is concerned, I don't think that Rove would run ads against Amash as long as he felt that Amash was a competent candidate.  He cares about winning races first and foremost.  He just doesn't like the Akins and Mourdocks of the world who say stupid things and make it harder for the Republicans to win these races.


Do not doubt Rove's cunning and Machiavellian complex.

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## wormyguy

Rove doesn't really strike me as even _having_ an ideology; he just wants to ingratiate himself with the winners.

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## supermario21

Trad Con is right. Rove wants competency. Christine O'Donnell and Todd Akin were flat out incompetent as candidates, they had personal baggage and weren't good in public. Look at guys like Cruz, Rand, and Lee. All would be deemed "extremists" by the establishment but they succeed because they're all intelligent and competent when it comes to campaigning.

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## supermario21

wtg justin!




> Justin Amash ‏@justinamash 9m
> Report that Ron & Rand have asked me not to run for Senate is false--probably made up by same ppl promoting unelectable political class Rs.

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## compromise

> Trad Con is right. Rove wants competency. Christine O'Donnell and Todd Akin were flat out incompetent as candidates, they had personal baggage and weren't good in public. Look at guys like Cruz, Rand, and Lee. All would be deemed "extremists" by the establishment but they succeed because they're all intelligent and competent when it comes to campaigning.


I liked O'Donnell and Akin (and Mourdock and Angle). They could have won if they ran in redder states. I have no doubt that if they did, they would definitely have stood with Rand. They may not have been the smartest people, but their hearts were in the right place.

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## fr33

> wtg justin!


Rand retweeted it too. https://twitter.com/DrRandPaul

https://twitter.com/justinamash/stat...13050650435584

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