# Lifestyles & Discussion > Personal Health & Well-Being >  To vaccinate or not to vaccine, that is the question.

## SWATH

Hello all,

I have a 2 month old baby boy and we just got back from the pediatrician for his 2 month check up and scheduled vaccines.  When he was first born I refused the Hep B for him, as I thought the risk of him contracting Hep B were so remote that giving a newborn baby a vaccine against it was ridiculous especially for a premee.  Then at our 2 week appt. the pediatrician was asking why we didn't get the Hep B, to which I explained that we were uncomfortable with vaccinating him so young.  She started into a semi rant about how vaccines are perfectly safe and the guy who said they weren't has lost his license and so on.  At the 1 month appt. with another doctor we discussed our apprehension with the vaccine schedule and she was curious why.  I went into the adjuvants, and Hg and Al and formaldehyde and knowingly injecting these things into an infant goes against what we believe.  She listens and assured us that they are safe and there have been no evidence that they cause any harm and pointed to the many photocopies of articles taped the exam room walls talking about how there is no link between vaccines and autism and how autism is genetic.  "You do know that they took the mercury out a long time ago right" she said, to which I replied "I do know that that is what they say, but I've read it was just a reduction not an elimination of it".  She kind chuckled and said "oh you don't believe they took it out?".  She vehemently insisted that they were safe and that there is a lot of misinformation about them that is causing a decline in vaccinations and the result of which is an increase in the number of infants that she treats with all the diseases that they are to protect against.  She was very nice about it but very concerned pointing to her infant patients in intensive care and some that have died from preventable diseases and so on.

My wife is very conflicted about it but is heavily leaning in favor of vaccinating.  One reason being is that her mother was an Ob nurse and strongly advises vaccination.  I'm about to read another book on the dangers of not vaccinating.  I have read 3 books written by pediatricians so far on the subject, one totally for vaccinations, one totally against, and one sort of in the middle.  I have read tons of stuff online, mostly against, I have read all the conspiracies and soft kill stuff, all the natural stuff like from Mercola and NVIC, and all the stuff from the CDC.  I read some stories of children who came down with some devastating illness like meningitis because the parents choose not to vaccinate them then promptly changed their minds and had all their other children vaccinated.  I have also read stories of parents who chose to vaccinate only to have their child die or develop some neurological malady immediately after the shots were given.  

Today at our 2 month visit we discussed vaccines again and we told the doctor that were were going to wait and delay giving any vaccines until we can further educate ourselves and be comfortable with a decision.  She respected that and just informed us that he will be at some risk until he is vaccinated and spoke more of some of her infant patients in the hospital with diseases because they refused vaccines.  She informed us that after some vaccines were introduced she saw marked reductions in cases of the disease to virtually nothing, and only now that more people are refusing them she is seeing more cases of the diseases.  She also mentioned that at the 4 month visit a vaccine schedule must be agreed upon or they could no longer see him for his safety because they see patients with diseases and don't want an unvaccinated baby exposed.  Before we left she just told us what symptoms to look for if he comes down with pertussis or rotavirus which are more common now and if we take him to the hospital to inform everyone there that he he has not been vaccinated.    

So I am red eye from researching vaccines endlessly to come up with what we are going to do.  My gut tells me not to vaccinate by my head says vaccinate at least on some level even if we selectively choose which vaccines and spread out the schedule.  I did ask her which diseases are the most serious and the ones she would most recommend vaccinating against and I think there were 3 or 4, I can't remember them all but she marked them down.  I'm not sure I'll get a completely objective discussion here because I know here it leans heavily against vaccination but give me your input anyway and discuss.  I have until April to come up with something.  Thanks

Update with pic:

----------


## specsaregood

We went with a selective, delayed schedule.   It means more office visits but our doctor does the shot-only visits for free.

----------


## Nate-ForLiberty

As with any big decision, don't be bullied into doing something. You make up your mind and then own your decision. This is your child, period. Not the doctors'.

----------


## SWATH

> We went with a selective, delayed schedule.   It means more office visits but our doctor does the shot-only visits for free.


That is kind of how we are leaning.  What kind of schedule and vaccines do you go with?

----------


## Krugerrand

It's hard to get objective information on vaccines.

First off, I have a hard time believing anybody who thought swine-flu vaccines were worthwhile.  Secondly, pediatricians make a boatload of their money on vaccines and the process shields them from liability since they simply parrot the American Academy of Pediatrics - who they treat as God speaking directly to them.

It's really difficult to get them to be truly honest about them too.  Ask if they used to give out oral polio vaccine and if they had claimed they were perfectly safe.  Ask why they will not give out an oral polio vaccine now.  (I say "ask" but in all reality, if you do ask this, they'll get super defensive and the discussion will go nowhere.  Plus, if you irritate them enough, they could end up reporting you to CYS and you'd have a HUGE headache on your hands.)  Pediatrician, in general drink some serious Big Government Kool Aid and it makes it really hard to deal with them.

Many vaccines are developed on cell lines from aborted fetuses.  I have a serious issue with this, morally.
http://www.cogforlife.org/fetalvaccines.htm
That wipes out HepA, MMR, and Chicken Pox.

Another note, a woman where I work told me that her son has Whooping Cough ... despite getting the vaccine.  It was virtually the last thing they tested for because in their minds it's impossible to happen, until it happens.  She had to fight to get them to prescribe antibiotics because - 'what do parents know?'  After the test results came back for WC, she was advised that everybody her son has been in contact with and their entire families should start antibiotics ... and OF COURSE re-vaccinate!

----------


## specsaregood

> That is kind of how we are leaning.  What kind of schedule and vaccines do you go with?


We've been following the delayed suggested schedule from Dr. Sears vaccine book.  It was a friendly compromise between mine and my wifes differing opinions on the subject.

----------


## Merk

> The Vaccine Book: Making the Right Decision for Your Child (Sears Parenting Library) [Paperback]
> Robert W. Sears (Author)


Get this book asap.  Also if you don't have his dad's book on pediatrics get it asap too.

----------


## mosquitobite

I thought I'd be doing a delayed schedule and here my kids are 3 and 2 and only the oldest has had 1 shot.

I just can't get over the toxins in the vaccines.

For the record, I am not ANTI-vaccine.  I'm anti UNSAFE vaccines.  Just because millions get them, don't mean they are safe in my opinion.  The rise of allergies, asthma, auto-immune disorders... all these are very real and I'm convinced they are on the rise because of the increase in vaccines.

I have an auto-immune disorder & so does my husband.  Because of that, I just can't logically do it to my kids.

----------


## puppetmaster

> Hello all,
> 
> I have a 2 month old baby boy (I'll update with a pic later that you all will like) and we just got back from the pediatrician for his 2 month check up and scheduled vaccines.  When he was first born I refused the Hep B for him, as I thought the risk of him contracting Hep B were so remote that giving a newborn baby a vaccine against it was ridiculous especially for a premee.  Then at our 2 week appt. the pediatrician was asking why we didn't get the Hep B, to which I explained that we were uncomfortable with vaccinating him so young.  *She started into a semi rant about how vaccines are perfectly safe* and the guy who said they weren't has lost his license and so on.  At the 1 month appt. with another doctor we discussed our apprehension with the vaccine schedule and she was curious why.  I went into the adjuvants, and Hg and Al and formaldehyde and knowingly injecting these things into an infant goes against what we believe.  She listens and assured us that they are safe and there have been no evidence that they cause any harm and pointed to the many photocopies of articles taped the exam room walls talking about how there is no link between vaccines and autism and how autism is genetic.  "You do know that they took the mercury out a long time ago right" she said, to which I replied "I do know that that is what they say, but I've read it was just a reduction not an elimination of it".  She kind chuckled and said "oh you don't believe they took it out?".  She vehemently insisted that they were safe and that there is a lot of misinformation about them that is causing a decline in vaccinations and the result of which is an increase in the number of infants that she treats with all the diseases that they are to protect against.  She was very nice about it but very concerned pointing to her infant patients in intensive care and some that have died from preventable diseases and so on.



Hey that's probably why they have you sign a waiver before they give the shot....because it is sooo safe.
It is BS. How many other things you go to the doctor for that they make you sign a waiver before they treat you?

My wife had a fit when I said no and we still disagree

----------


## donnay

It's not for anyone of us to tell you what to do for your child.  The best thing is to educate yourself.  There are no laws that say your children have to be vaccinated.  It is color of law.  You need to be informed!!  You need to know your rights and you need to know there are wavers.  

Here are some sources to start researching:

http://drtenpenny.com/default.aspx
http://socioecohistory.wordpress.com...han-swine-flu/
http://www.vaccinetruth.org/dr_blaylock.htm
http://vaccines.mercola.com/
http://www.naturalhealthstrategies.c...ine-study.html
http://www.vacfacts.info/Dr_RD9A.html
http://www.vaccinetruth.org/
http://vaccineinfo.net/
http://www.nccn.net/~wwithin/vaccine.htm

----------


## tennman

I'm a parent who NEVER vaccinates my kids because I love them too much to allow that crap to be put in them. Heck, the thing that you thin you're getting vaccinated for includes hundreds of biproducts from pharmasutical companies who convinced some politician to use taxpayer money to but their junk and put it in too. Many other countrieshave stopped vaccinating and their children are less sick because of it. The effectiveness of vaccines has been grossly overstated if not outright lied about to put taxpayer money in the hands of pharmasutical corporations.

----------


## specsaregood

> Get this book asap.  Also if you don't have his dad's book on pediatrics get it asap too.


The best part about that book is that the author isn't even anti-vaccine.   I knew our doctor was full of crap when I mentioned the book and he immediately jumped in about how the author was just anti-vaccine when that isn't remotely true.

----------


## low preference guy

> We've been following the delayed suggested schedule from Dr. Sears vaccine book.  It was a friendly compromise between mine and my wifes differing opinions on the subject.


let me guess

You=no vaccine. Wife=all vaccines?

----------


## specsaregood

//

----------


## tttppp

Vaccinations are a complete fraud. They do not prevent diseases. And like most medications they can have severe side effects. 

From my experience with doctors, doctors always underestimate the side effects from medication. Even after you take a medicine and experience side effects from their medication, they try to convince you your delusional and either your not experiencing side effects or the side effects are not from the medication. They always do this $#@!.

Not to mention they are completely reckless with medication and its side effects. I've explained to doctors before I can't have certain kinds of medication because my body can't handle it. They ended up prescribing that kind of medication for me and I had severe side effects because of it. 

If you do get your kids vaccinated and they have a severe side effect, your doctor will definitely make up an excuse for why its not the vaccine's fault.  

Bottom line. Doctors are scumbags. I wouldn't trust them.

----------


## mosquitobite

> Bottom line. Doctors are scumbags. I wouldn't trust them.


That's a HUGE leap.  For one, our good man Ron Paul is a doctor and has spoken out against how many vaccines we have on our schedule and that it should be a parent's choice.  For another, you just have to shop for a good one.  Mine doesn't allow ANY pharm reps in nor does he allow any pharma advertising in his patient rooms, etc.  He goes with MY choices, as any GOOD doctor should!

----------


## Krugerrand

> Vaccinations are a complete fraud. They do not prevent diseases. And like most medications they can have severe side effects. 
> 
> From my experience with doctors, doctors always underestimate the side effects from medication. Even after you take a medicine and experience side effects from their medication, they try to convince you your delusional and either your not experiencing side effects or the side effects are not from the medication. They always do this $#@!.
> 
> Not to mention they are completely reckless with medication and its side effects. I've explained to doctors before I can't have certain kinds of medication because my body can't handle it. They ended up prescribing that kind of medication for me and I had severe side effects because of it. 
> 
> If you do get your kids vaccinated and they have a severe side effect, your doctor will definitely make up an excuse for why its not the vaccine's fault.  
> 
> Bottom line. Doctors are scumbags. I wouldn't trust them.


I don't think they're scum bags.  They're heavily indoctrinated.  Drunk on the FDA kool aid.

----------


## tttppp

> That's a HUGE leap.  For one, our good man Ron Paul is a doctor and has spoken out against how many vaccines we have on our schedule and that it should be a parent's choice.  For another, you just have to shop for a good one.  Mine doesn't allow ANY pharm reps in nor does he allow any pharma advertising in his patient rooms, etc.  He goes with MY choices, as any GOOD doctor should!


Thats not a huge leap. Like most professions, 99% of people are idiots. The 1% remaining know what they are talking about. For every 1 doctor who gives you honest advice, there are 99 of them that are completely clueless.

If you have ever been to the hospital, you'd know that calling them scumbags is not a huge leap. I've been seen by negligent and incompetent doctors there and have then been billed for thousands of dollars for just a few minutes of their time. My brother also told me about an experience in a hospital when he fell and injured his shoulder, that a doctor there was treating him like complete $#@!.

Doctors are not these geniuses they are made out to be on tv. They run their businesses about as well as the government runs the DMV. I would never take advice from someone working at the DMV and I certainly would not take advice from a doctor.

----------


## tttppp

> I don't think they're scum bags.  They're heavily indoctrinated.  Drunk on the FDA kool aid.


Lets see. Doctors typically prescribe you tons of medications you don't need. Perform surgeries you don't need so they can make more money. And overcharge you.

How is this ethical?

----------


## Krugerrand

> Lets see. Doctors typically prescribe you tons of medications you don't need. Perform surgeries you don't need so they can make more money. And overcharge you.
> 
> How is this ethical?


Except that their entire modus operandi is follow FDA, or some other group's set of recommendations.  They're taught to treat symptoms.  That means medications and surgeries that you don't need.  

I truly believe that most doctors believe that their work is for human betterment.

----------


## tttppp

> Except that their entire modus operandi is follow FDA, or some other group's set of recommendations.  They're taught to treat symptoms.  That means medications and surgeries that you don't need.  
> 
> I truly believe that most doctors believe that their work is for human betterment.


You obviously have not been to the er. Doctors have the same commitment to their job that employees have at the DMV. The vast majority of them hate their job. 

Doctors have more education than any profession I can think of. They can't play the stupidity card. They should no these medications don't help and should not prescribe them unless they are really necessary. Same goes for surgery. I remember my grandfather died relatively shortly after a surgery because the surgery messed him up. It was one doctors should have advised him not to do. There are always major risks to surgery. Surgery should only be done as a last option. Doctors just view surgery as a payday.

----------


## SWATH

> We've been following the delayed suggested schedule from Dr. Sears vaccine book.  It was a friendly compromise between mine and my wifes differing opinions on the subject.


Yeah that is the book I was referring to when I said I read one in between.  He is not anti-vaccine but more anti-unnecessary vaccine.

----------


## gunnysmith

In todays medicine, it's the unknown pathegens in vacines that are the concern, none are pure.

----------


## mosquitobite

> Thats not a huge leap. Like most professions, 99% of people are idiots. The 1% remaining know what they are talking about. For every 1 doctor who gives you honest advice, there are 99 of them that are completely clueless.
> 
> If you have ever been to the hospital, you'd know that calling them scumbags is not a huge leap. I've been seen by negligent and incompetent doctors there and have then been billed for thousands of dollars for just a few minutes of their time. My brother also told me about an experience in a hospital when he fell and injured his shoulder, that a doctor there was treating him like complete $#@!.
> 
> Doctors are not these geniuses they are made out to be on tv. They run their businesses about as well as the government runs the DMV. I would never take advice from someone working at the DMV and I certainly would not take advice from a doctor.


Look I agree with you for the most part.

I just believe it's worth searching for the 1%, just like in politics.

----------


## Mark37snj

> We went with a selective, delayed schedule.   It means more office visits but our doctor does the shot-only visits for free.


+1  Also, try to make sure the vaccine does not contain Mercury or Thermisol. Multiple vaccines overload the immune system and Mercury and Thermisol damage it.

----------


## tttppp

> Look I agree with you for the most part.
> 
> I just believe it's worth searching for the 1%, just like in politics.


I agree to some extent. But anyone who takes your insurance is going to be crap. If you do actually find the 1% doctor, he'll overcharge you. Not to mention, there are no cures in western medicine. Its not like if you find the right doctor that you'll be cured. The option will still be medication (which only hides the symptoms), surgery, or do nothing.

----------


## donnay

I do not care for Medical doctors who do not think for themselves.  I like Naturopaths much better!!

----------


## Mark37snj

> Hello all,
> 
> I have a 2 month old baby boy (I'll update with a pic later that you all will like) and we just got back from the pediatrician for his 2 month check up and scheduled vaccines.  When he was first born I refused the Hep B for him, as I thought the risk of him contracting Hep B were so remote that giving a newborn baby a vaccine against it was ridiculous especially for a premee.  Then at our 2 week appt. the pediatrician was asking why we didn't get the Hep B, to which I explained that we were uncomfortable with vaccinating him so young.  *She started into a semi rant about how vaccines are perfectly safe and the guy who said they weren't has lost his license and so on.*  At the 1 month appt. with another doctor we discussed our apprehension with the vaccine schedule and she was curious why.  I went into the adjuvants, and Hg and Al and formaldehyde and knowingly injecting these things into an infant goes against what we believe.  She listens and assured us that they are safe and there have been no evidence that they cause any harm and pointed to the many photocopies of articles taped the exam room walls talking about how there is no link between vaccines and autism and how autism is genetic.  "You do know that they took the mercury out a long time ago right" she said, to which I replied "I do know that that is what they say, but I've read it was just a reduction not an elimination of it".  She kind chuckled and said "oh you don't believe they took it out?".  She vehemently insisted that they were safe and that there is a lot of misinformation about them that is causing a decline in vaccinations and the result of which is an increase in the number of infants that she treats with all the diseases that they are to protect against.  She was very nice about it but very concerned pointing to her infant patients in intensive care and some that have died from preventable diseases and so on.






> Hey that's probably why they have you sign a waiver before they give the shot....because it is sooo safe.
> It is BS. How many other things you go to the doctor for that they make you sign a waiver before they treat you?
> 
> My wife had a fit when I said no and we still disagree


Autism is NOT genetic. The medical research company I worked for determined that. Vaccines are a double edged sword. Yes they save lives but they can be dangerous. Vaccines have been linked to Autism, Multiple Sclerosis, and other diseases. They SWEAR that mercury and thermisol does not cause autism or other diseases, so why did they begin removing them? Trust is a factor and the pharmaceutical industry has destroyed that trust. The medical community quickly points to that British doctor who was discreteded by the medical establishment/goverment. Yet I have not heard of any thorough unbiased study conducted to follow up on this, my that is suspecious in itself. Until I see that study I call BS as well. Protect your children.

----------


## Revolution9

Let the kid crawl around in the dirt and pick their nose and eat it. That is natures vaccine and they have now found there are various fungi in soil that are anti-viral and anti-biotic. That is where they got all the cillins and cyclins from. Soil fungi. The picking the nose and eating it is a vaccine as the nose mucous denatures the DNA of the bacteria and when ingested it allows the body to make antibodies for it. I was an army brat, I got alot of vaccines due to being posted all over with my dad. I remember issues with every one. The arm feeling like a golfball was injected into it, the rashes when exposed to water after that, the ears leaking amber fluid which caused blisters all down my neck and wherever it touched. Flu like symptoms with earaches. Now I understand from the literature that my brain-blood barrier was trying to eject the metals and adjuvants through my ear canals and neck. Nasty $#@! if it causes blisters to form. If they had gotten through I would have jerked and spasmed to try to shake them or deal with a mercury or aluminum molecule floating in a synapse gap and firing off electron pulses down the dendrites, or creating resistance to signal flow or modulating it so it is out of phase with the brain hologram, confusing the crap out of perception fields. I would then have been labeled autistic but still have the same brain power with most of it trying to recalculate the effects of the poisons and their insidiscriminate neural firings to remain as comfortable as possible under the circumstances.

Rev9

----------


## Greg Buchanan

> Autism is NOT genetic. The medical research company I worked for determined that. Vaccines are a double edged sword. Yes they save lives but they can be dangerous. Vaccines have been linked to Autism, Multiple Sclerosis, and other diseases.


General anesthetics given to the mother during childbirth, and/or during infant circumcision are the most likely contributing factors to autism.

----------


## Lishy

I wish my mom didn't force me to vaccinate all these years. INCLUDING the Swine Flu vaccine. How dangerous was that $#@!? :/

Now I've stopped taking the flu shot when given the opportunity, and I'm perfectly fine. However, WHY do they use mercury and liquid metals in vaccines anyways? I mean, for something as important as vaccinations, surely there's better preservatives? What IS the reason they give?  (Also, give me the Canadian perspective if possible.)

We need doctor Paul to educate us!!!

----------


## Eagles' Wings

Hi Swath,

Good for you for having some unease about this.  Many are waiting until child is over a year and then vaxing one per visit over a LONG period of time.  Ask for specific lot# of vax and keep a record.  This will show you mean business and will make doc accountable.

If doc and nurses put you down, find one who won't.  We've actually interviewed.

Bless you,
Louise

----------


## Mark37snj

> General anesthetics given to the mother during childbirth, and/or during infant circumcision are the most likely contributing factors to autism.


Source? And if you really want the hair to stand up on the back of your neck, take a look at the disparagy in the number of children with Autism born to military service personel. One thing our goverment is good at is making sure those in the service and their family get all their vaccinations. Anesthetics and circumcision can't explain the increase in those numbers.

----------


## moostraks

I feel your pain....Mine is scheduled for his next appointment on March 1st, he will be 8 months old and we haven't done any vaccines. I vaccinated all of ours up until number 6 had a reaction. She had some developmental regression and I researched the vaccine correlation possibility. This made me paranoid enough to stop vaccinating for the time being, not to mention the whole issue of fetal cell versions that I was completely unaware of and am against. Lucky us, dh then lost his job and there went the health insurance so when we were in between insurance coverage I was not under pressure to move forward.  Now it is on the forefront as we have a new little one and they want you to sign those stupid forms every time you go claiming you are knowingly putting everyone at risk by refusing the shots. I don't even want to go to get him a check up with the way they act about the matter. I know I don't want to be the one who caused them harm and regret that I might have caused number 6's issues by not being more informed. There are no easy answers, but know you are not alone in your anxiety...

----------


## Cyberbrain

The study that linked autism and vaccines has been thoroughly debunked. The data was fudged, the researcher lied, the whole episode was a farce. Vaccines may be linked to autism, who knows, but there is no scientific data to back that up. Then the media spreading it like they did was immoral. 

SWATH the decision is up to you and I'm glad you're questioning what gets put into your kids. I would point you towards the history of many of those diseases and see why vaccines have saved a hell of a lot more lives than they've screwed up and how they are still saving millions of lives as these diseases have NOT yet been eradicated and pop in the US from time to time. Yes you take a small risk in vaccinating your kids and you have to determine for yourself if the risk of the side effects are worth it versus the possibility of death or disfigurement from contracting the disease. At least you're doing research instead of blinding following your doctor or state like many parents do.

----------


## RickyJ

My advise is don't do it.

None of my kids are getting any vaccines.

----------


## Eagles' Wings

> I feel your pain....Mine is scheduled for his next appointment on March 1st, he will be 8 months old and we haven't done any vaccines. I vaccinated all of ours up until number 6 had a reaction. She had some developmental regression and I researched the vaccine correlation possibility. This made me paranoid enough to stop vaccinating for the time being, not to mention the whole issue of fetal cell versions that I was completely unaware of and am against. Lucky us, dh then lost his job and there went the health insurance so when we were in between insurance coverage I was not under pressure to move forward.  Now it is on the forefront as we have a new little one and they want you to sign those stupid forms every time you go claiming you are knowingly putting everyone at risk by refusing the shots. I don't even want to go to get him a check up with the way they act about the matter. I know I don't want to be the one who caused them harm and regret that I might have caused number 6's issues by not being more informed. There are no easy answers, but know you are not alone in your anxiety...


   I always tried to find support for lifestyle choices that are not considered mainstream.   There are many sites about natural mothering.  Perhaps one might doubt the necessity of well baby checks.  Find a doctor, or complimentary health professional who gives you encouragment, not shame.   Blessings to you,  Louise

----------


## RickyJ

> I'm a parent who NEVER vaccinates my kids because I love them too much to allow that crap to be put in them. Heck, the thing that you thin you're getting vaccinated for includes hundreds of biproducts from pharmasutical companies who convinced some politician to use taxpayer money to but their junk and put it in too. Many other countrieshave stopped vaccinating and their children are less sick because of it. The effectiveness of vaccines has been grossly overstated if not outright lied about to put taxpayer money in the hands of pharmasutical corporations.


Your kids will thank you when they grow up healthy and smart while other kids are sick and dumb.

----------


## freeforall

You seem worried about mercury.  Do you feel that aluminum is a safe alternative?  

Also, try not to make it an all or nothing decision.  Study each vaccine and make your decision.  You may find that you make each decision for the same reason ultimately but they are still unique choices.  

Take your time.  You can't undo this decision so you should be absolutely sure.

eta: Also look at how to care for your child for each disease if you choose to delay or not vax.  You will want to be somewhat familiar with this if they were to contract something.

----------


## Mckarnin

I agree with others. Do your own research. This is tricky stuff and even though many of the things we vaccinate against are rare and you can still contract them if vaccinated you have to be ok with receiving additional scrutiny if your kids do contract something that a vaccine exists for. Also, living a healthy lifestyle, eating good food and having some openness to natural medicine help a lot if you decide not to vaccinate because you want your child to have a robust immune system.

----------


## RickyJ

> You seem worried about mercury.  Do you feel that aluminum is a safe alternative?  
> 
> Also, try not to make it an all or nothing decision.  Study each vaccine and make your decision.  You may find that you make each decision for the same reason ultimately but they are still unique choices.  
> 
> Take your time.  You can't undo this decision so you should be absolutely sure.
> 
> eta: Also look at how to care for your child for each disease if you choose to delay or not vax.  You will want to be somewhat familiar with this if they were to contract something.


Mercury is one of the most toxic substances to human beings! Aluminium is also not good to be in a human. There will be no damn poison going into my kids.

----------


## RickyJ

> I wish my mom didn't force me to vaccinate all these years. INCLUDING the Swine Flu vaccine. How dangerous was that $#@!? :/
> 
> Now I've stopped taking the flu shot when given the opportunity, and I'm perfectly fine. However, WHY do they use mercury and liquid metals in vaccines anyways? I mean, for something as important as vaccinations, surely there's better preservatives? What IS the reason they give?  (Also, give me the Canadian perspective if possible.)
> 
> We need doctor Paul to educate us!!!


No one knows why they use it. Why did they once put HIV in vaccines?

----------


## donnay

> Autism is NOT genetic. The medical research company I worked for determined that. Vaccines are a double edged sword. Yes they save lives but they can be dangerous. Vaccines have been linked to Autism, Multiple Sclerosis, and other diseases. They SWEAR that mercury and thermisol does not cause autism or other diseases, so why did they begin removing them? Trust is a factor and the pharmaceutical industry has destroyed that trust. The medical community quickly points to that British doctor who was discreteded by the medical establishment/goverment. Yet I have not heard of any thorough unbiased study conducted to follow up on this, my that is suspecious in itself. Until I see that study I call BS as well. Protect your children.


That was Dr. Wakefield.  However, the British have retracted that (The Lancet) and now Dr. Wakefield is suing them for Libel.

Source:  http://www.ageofautism.com/dr-andrew-wakefield/

----------


## Mark37snj

Thanks donnay, I havn't seen these vids till now. I have a very relevant post coming in the near future about this issue and after I do anyone would be able to see why I do buy any of the pharmaceutical industries BS on vaccines and neither should they.

----------


## american.swan

> We went with a selective, delayed schedule.   It means more office visits but our doctor does the shot-only visits for free.


I agree. Don't mix if at all possible.

----------


## Mckarnin

Oh and look into your state laws. In some states (like PA where I live) once you take some vaccines you can't refuse any others that are on the mandatory schedule and still have your kids attend school...the religious exemption here is all or nothing.

----------


## Mark37snj

> Oh and look into your state laws. In some states (like PA where I live) once you take some vaccines you can't refuse any others that are on the mandatory schedule and still have your kids attend school...the religious exemption here is all or nothing.


Don't tell them. Find a doctor, out of state if necessary, and get the vaccinations you want.

----------


## Keith and stuff

I totally understand if you are against vaccinating.  NH has the highest rate of vaccinating so if you are against it but still don't want your children to get sick, move to New Hampshire!

----------


## donnay

> Thanks donnay, I havn't seen these vids till now. I have a very relevant post coming in the near future about this issue and after I do anyone would be able to see why I do buy any of the pharmaceutical industries BS on vaccines and neither should they.


You're welcome.  I look forward to your post!

----------


## donnay

> I totally understand if you are against vaccinating.  *NH has the highest rate of vaccinating* so if you are against it but still don't want your children to get sick, move to New Hampshire!


They have the highest rate of vaccinating?  I think you misspoke?

----------


## Keith and stuff

> They have the highest rate of vaccinating?  I think you misspoke?


I don't get it.  What do you think I said wrong?  Clearly, children are less likely to get sick in states with higher rates of vaccinating.  NH has the highest rate so children are less likely to get sick in NH.  If you want to not vaccinate your children and you don't want them to get sick, move to NH.

----------


## Mark37snj

> I don't get it.  What do you think I said wrong?  Clearly, children are less likely to get sick in states with higher rates of vaccinating.  NH has the highest rate so children are less likely to get sick in NH.  If you want to not vaccinate your children and you don't want them to get sick, move to NH.


NH is number 5 on the list of states with the highest increase in Autism. http://www.statemaster.com/graph/hea...e-growth-cases

----------


## gerryb

Watch this documentary
http://premium.naturalnews.tv/The_Greater_Good__NN.htm

http://www.naturalnews.com/034909_Th...ine_movie.html

----------


## Mark37snj

> Watch this documentary
> http://premium.naturalnews.tv/The_Greater_Good__NN.htm
> 
> http://www.naturalnews.com/034909_Th...ine_movie.html


Thanks gerryb, I can relate to those poor kids more than you know.

----------


## Keith and stuff

> NH is number 5 on the list of states with the highest increase in Autism. http://www.statemaster.com/graph/hea...e-growth-cases


And that is useful or meaningful how?  Children in NH don't have diseases.  If you don't want your children to get sick, move to NH were we have the highest rate of vaccination.  Unless of course, you want your children to get sick.  If that is the case, don't move to NH!

----------


## Mark37snj

> And that is useful or meaningful how?  Children in NH don't have diseases.  If you don't want your children to get sick, move to NH were we have the highest rate of vaccination.  Unless of course, you want your children to get sick.  If that is the case, don't move to NH!


The kids in your state do have a disease, fortunately for other kids Autism is not contagious. Small comfort to those who do have it though. Sucks to be them I guess. I see the point your making, its not something that I would feel proud of.

EDIT: Im not promoting an all or nothing strategy. But there is more than enough evidence to warrent change in manufacturing and mandates of vaccines and precautionary steps that should be taken by parents and adults.

----------


## Birdlady

I will never vaccinate because I believe I was injured by a vaccine in my teenage years. I figure if it happened to me, then my child is more susceptible too. Each person has to make up their own mind though. If you decide not to, it's not an easy battle and you have to be mentally prepared to deal with all of the hurdles you come across.

----------


## SWATH

Thanks for the reply's everyone.  Please give me more details of your experiences be they positive of negative with vaccinations.  I remember when I was getting vaccines as a child that they hurt really bad, my whole arm would be sore and useless for a while and I would be lethargic, etc.  As far as neurological effects, I don't know, when I was in elementary school I remember going to several special classes because I guess they were unsure if I was gifted or slow.  I went to the class with all the "genius" kids and I went to the class with the kids who had trouble speaking, I think I also had a speech impediment or a failure to speak kind of thing going on.  I recall going to a counselor a few times because I stopped speaking for awhile maybe a week or two.  I think that had more to do with the emotional trauma of my parents fighting and threatening to leave than anything though, and the frog I found in the creek died because it wouldn't eat the flies I caught for it.  Anyway I do recall having earaches a lot that were agonizing. 

 I've always been sort of anti-medication, I don't take anything, even aspirin or Ibuprofen unless I have some really bad pain.  I've always been skeptical of the western diet and currently eat paleo or as close as I can.  I think this is mainly due to the fact that I was born 2 months premature and had some very serious medical complications immediately after birth which required a couple of very invasive surgeries, and they were almost certainly caused by artificial intervention and could have been prevented.  My mother later would curse about the doctors and relay her extreme guilt for listening to them about the cause of the problems.  I was born so premature because I had apparently kicked her hard enough to break her water and this sent her into labor at about 7 months.  I was put in an incubator so I could breathe and that was all fine.  The came came about because this was the late 70's and it was during a period where western medicine believed formula to be superior to breast milk, you know it is precisely created in a lab to be perfectly balance and this and that, so they told my mother they were going to feed me the formula instead of having her pump breast milk for me.  Well I had a very negative reaction to the formula, I couldn't digest it, and it had caused a small bowel obstruction and led to necrotizing enterocolitis, where part of my small intestine was strangulated to death and had to be surgically removed.  After the surgery my mother was furious that they had fed me formula but the doctors said that had nothing to do with it, so they fed me formula again, and the same thing happened again.  So I had another surgery removing my entire small intestine examining the whole length of it, cutting away the necrotic portion, and replacing it again.  I think at this point I was 5 days old on top of being born 2 months early and already with 2 major surgeries under my diaper.  It wasn't until I was feed intravenously through a pic line in the top of my head that I stopped having the obstructions.   I had a lot of complications from it in life, from anomalous pains to more bowel obstructions requiring hospitalization, to generally poor digestion.  I don't know but I suspect my abdomen is a spider web of surgical adhesions.  All this to only find out now that the medical communities attitude toward formula has changed and they now no longer immediately treat small bowel obstructions with surgery anymore.  Now I take great comfort when I look at my sons belly and don't see a huge scar bisecting him in half.

So yeah you could say I'm skeptical of western medicine.  However I think it is still valuable as in cases of trauma and such but as a preventative practice forget it.  Though I'm far more inclined towards natural medicine I know it's not perfect.  The master cleanse landed me in the hospital for a week, although I'm certain that was due to my prior altered internal physiology from the surgeries, but my wife is still freaked out about anything that a doctor doesn't suggest.   Never-the-less, she is also mildly skeptical and as a result opted to have a intensely painful natural birth, breast feed exclusively, and have generally minimal artificial intervention with the child.  I refused to have him fed formula when he was first born at the doctors suggestion, and only now have we supplemented him with some only because his demands are outpacing his mothers ability to produce milk.

I have a general life theory/world view that I kind of learned and observed and is one of the reasons I am a libertarian and support Ron Paul and that theory is, that when you artificially try to prevent something from happening you are more likely to inadvertently cause it to happen. All in all generally I am uncomfortable with the vaccinations and my wife is uncomfortable with no vaccinations.

----------


## donnay

> I don't get it.  What do you think I said wrong?  Clearly, children are less likely to get sick in states with higher rates of vaccinating.  NH has the highest rate so children are less likely to get sick in NH.  If you want to not vaccinate your children and you don't want them to get sick, move to NH.


I realize you do not get it.  Do some research on it.  It's better to be informed!  Education is key!  I live in New Hampshire and I do not believe in vaccines!

*The 'Vaccines are safe' lie*

*Jon Rappaport interviews an ex-vaccine worker “Dr Mark Randall”.*

*CDC caught in blatant lies about pandemics and vaccines*
*
Vaccines & Vaccinations are a Big Lie* 

*Polio Vaccine Truth*

*Vaccine Ingredients*
*
Vaccine Ingredients -Formaldehyde, Aspartame, Mercury, Etc*


*
Historical Facts Exposing The Dangers and*
Ineffectiveness of Vaccines

Compiled by Ian Sinclair
http://www.vaccinationdebate.com/about.html



FAIR USE NOTICE:

This may contain copyrighted (© ) material the use of which has not always been specifically authorized by the copyright owner. Such material is made available for educational purposes,

to advance understanding of human rights, democracy, scientific, moral, ethical, and social justice issues, etc. It is believed that this constitutes a 'fair use' of any such copyrighted material as provided for in Title 17 U.S.C. section 107 of the US Copyright Law.
This material is distributed without profit.

- In 1871-2, England, with 98% of the population aged between 2 and 50 vaccinated against smallpox, experienced its worst ever smallpox outbreak with 45,000 deaths. During the same period in Germany, with a vaccination rate of 96%, there were over 125,000 deaths from smallpox.
(The Hadwen Documents)

- In Germany, compulsory mass vaccination against diphtheria commenced in 1940 and by 1945 diphtheria cases were up from 40,000 to 250,000.
(Don't Get Stuck, Hannah Allen)

- In the USA in 1960, two virologists discovered that both polio vaccines were contaminated with the SV 40 virus which causes cancer in animals as well as changes in human cell tissue cultures. Millions of children had been injected with these vaccines. (Med Jnl of Australia 17/3/1973 p555)

- In 1967, Ghana was declared measles free by the World Health Organisation after 96% of its population was vaccinated. In 1972, Ghana experienced one of its worst measles outbreaks with its highest ever mortality rate.
(Dr H Albonico, MMR Vaccine Campaign in Switzerland, March 1990)

- In the UK between 1970 and 1990, over 200,000 cases of whooping cough occurred in fully vaccinated children. (Community Disease Surveillance Centre, UK)

- In the 1970's a tuberculosis vaccine trial in India involving 260,000 people revealed that more cases of TB occurred in the vaccinated than the unvaccinated.
(The Lancet 12/1/80 p73)

- In 1977, Dr Jonas Salk who developed the first polio vaccine, testified along with other scientists, that mass inoculation against polio was the cause of most polio cases throughout the USA since 1961.
(Science 4/4/77 "Abstracts" )

- In 1978, a survey of 30 States in the US revealed that more than half of the children who contracted measles had been adequately vaccinated.
(The People's Doctor, Dr R Mendelsohn)

- In 1979, Sweden abandoned the whooping cough vaccine due to its ineffectiveness. Out of 5,140 cases in 1978, it was found that 84% had been vaccinated three times!
(BMJ 283:696-697, 1981)

-The February 1981 issue of the Journal of the American Medical Association found that 90% of obstetricians and 66% of pediatricians refused to take the rubella vaccine.

- In the USA, the cost of a single DPT shot had risen from 11 cents in 1982 to $11.40 in 1987. The manufacturers of the vaccine were putting aside $8 per shot to cover legal costs and damages they were paying out to parents of brain damaged children and children who died after vaccination.
(The Vine, Issue 7, January 1994, Nambour, Qld)

- In Oman between 1988 and 1989, a polio outbreak occurred amongst thousands of fully vaccinated children. The region with the highest attack rate had the highest vaccine coverage. The region with the lowest attack rate had the lowest vaccine coverage.
(The Lancet, 21/9/91)

- In 1990, a UK survey involving 598 doctors revealed that over 50% of them refused to have the Hepatitis B vaccine despite belonging to the high risk group urged to be vaccinated.
(British Med Jnl, 27/1/1990)

- In 1990, the Journal of the American Medical Association had an article on measles which stated " Although more than 95% of school-aged children in the US are vaccinated against measles, large measles outbreaks continue to occur in schools and most cases in this setting occur among previously vaccinated children."
(JAMA, 21/11/90)

- In the USA, from July 1990 to November 1993, the US Food and Drug Administration counted a total of 54,072 adverse reactions following vaccination. The FDA admitted that this number represented only 10% of the real total, because most doctors were refusing to report vaccine injuries. In other words, adverse reactions for this period exceeded half a million!
(National Vaccine Information Centre, March 2, 1994)

- In the New England Journal of Medicine July 1994 issue a study found that over 80% of children under 5 years of age who had contracted whooping cough had been fully vaccinated.

The CDC states that 135 children died during the 2003-2004 flu season.
59 of these children had received their flu shots.

- On November 2nd 2000, the Association of American Physicians and Surgeons (AAPS) announced that its members voted at their 57th annual meeting in St Louis to pass a resolution calling for an end to mandatory childhood vaccines. The resolution passed without a single "no" vote.
(Report by Michael Devitt)

Fair Use Notice Title 17 U.S.C. section 107 of the US Copyright Law.
This material is distributed without profit.

----------


## Keith and stuff

> I will never vaccinate because I believe I was injured by a vaccine in my teenage years.


Excellent.  Then you should move to NH where your children as less likely to get sick if they do not vaccinate.

----------


## Keith and stuff

> I live in New Hampshire and I do not believe in vaccines!


That's excellent.  And by living in NH, your children are less likely to get sick than everywhere else if they do not get vaccines.  It makes so much sense that you live in NH.  You are likely a very good parent!

I was in the military for many years so I was shot up with all types of things.  It is too late for me.  But parents that really care about their kids have a good chance of keeping them healthy without vaccines in New Hampshire.  Parents that really care about their children likely already live in NH or are considering moving there.  You made the right choice.

----------


## Keith and stuff

> I see the point your making, its not something that I would feel proud of.
> 
> EDIT: Im not promoting an all or nothing strategy. But there is more than enough evidence to warrent change in manufacturing and mandates of vaccines and precautionary steps that should be taken by parents and adults.


How is educated parents that care about their kids being better able to keep their kids healthy in NH than other places not something to be proud of?  If you don't want to stick your children with a bunch of needles, more power to you.  That seems like something to be proud of to me.  It is about keeping your kids safe and healthy.

----------


## Birdlady

> Excellent.  Then you should move to NH where your children as less likely to get sick if they do not vaccinate.


You are off your rocker. You don't have to repeat yourself multiple times.

----------


## KingNothing

> We went with a selective, delayed schedule.   It means more office visits but our doctor does the shot-only visits for free.


I like this option best.

The evidence against vaccination is flaky and anecdotal (and possibly criminal), so I definitely encourage that children be vaccinated but the flaky and anecdotal evidence also suggests that you can lessen the potential risks of vaccines by doing as specsaregood suggests.

----------


## KingNothing

> neither of us are "no vaccine" but yeah she comes from a traditional medicine family life, i come from crystal-worshipping alternative medicine family life.



The "no-vaccine" people are completely insane.  I say that with the most empathy and sympathy for people who were potentially harmed by them, but the science is there.  Vaccines have done immeasurable good for mankind.

----------


## KingNothing

> Bottom line. Doctors are scumbags. I wouldn't trust them.


That rash generalization isn't remotely true.  Lordy, Ron Paul is doctor too!

----------


## KingNothing

> The study that linked autism and vaccines has been thoroughly debunked. The data was fudged, the researcher lied, the whole episode was a farce. Vaccines may be linked to autism, who knows, but there is no scientific data to back that up. Then the media spreading it like they did was immoral. 
> 
> SWATH the decision is up to you and I'm glad you're questioning what gets put into your kids. I would point you towards the history of many of those diseases and see why vaccines have saved a hell of a lot more lives than they've screwed up and how they are still saving millions of lives as these diseases have NOT yet been eradicated and pop in the US from time to time. Yes you take a small risk in vaccinating your kids and you have to determine for yourself if the risk of the side effects are worth it versus the possibility of death or disfigurement from contracting the disease. At least you're doing research instead of blinding following your doctor or state like many parents do.


This is the best post in the thread.
+rep to you, sir!

----------


## tttppp

> That rash generalization isn't remotely true.  Lordy, Ron Paul is doctor too!


I've met quite a few doctors. Most of them are scumbags. All of them are incompetent. Ron Paul is the only smart doctor I have ever seen. Although he is still weak on health care policy like all doctors are.

----------


## KingNothing

> I've met quite a few doctors. Most of them are scumbags. All of them are incompetent. Ron Paul is the only smart doctor I have ever seen. Although he is still weak on health care policy like all doctors are.



I know several doctors.  All of them are intelligent, all of them genuinely care about people, and all of them want only what is best for their patients.
Same with nurses.

Not everyone outside of us is malevolent, stupid, or greedy.

----------


## tttppp

> I know several doctors.  All of them are intelligent, all of them genuinely care about people, and all of them want only what is best for their patients.
> Same with nurses.
> 
> Not everyone outside of us is malevolent, stupid, or greedy.


If you're healthy, sure doctors seems intelligent. But if you have health problems and want them cured, all doctors will do is waste your time and money.

Please tell me what cures these doctors have. If they were intelligent they should be able to fix your health problems.

----------


## donnay

> The "no-vaccine" people are completely insane.  I say that with the most empathy and sympathy for people who were potentially harmed by them, but the science is there.  Vaccines have done immeasurable good for mankind.




*SIGH*  It is really a shame when most people just parrot the same mantra over and over again, without ever bothering to research the facts.  I just posted a list of facts above.  Please stop trying to insult the intelligence of people who have done their homework.

----------


## donnay

> Excellent.  Then you should move to NH where your children as less likely to get sick if they do not vaccinate.


Unfortunately you are wrong again.  It is children who are vaccinated that pose the risks to everyone else.

----------


## bolil

Also GET A DOG, dogs play an enormous role in building up a child's immune system.  I had vaccinations... but I also contracted a mysterious case of sepsis when I was very young...

hxxp://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2561739/pdf/jnma00236-0100.pdf  for a similar occurrence.

----------


## donnay

> If you're healthy, sure doctors seems intelligent. But if you have health problems and want them cured, all doctors will do is waste your time and money.
> 
> Please tell me what cures these doctors have. If they were intelligent they should be able to fix your health problems.


Generally doctors do not cure, they treat people.  Which means it's a meal ticket.

Most medical schools do not even school on nutrients and minerals.

----------


## Birdlady

> I know several doctors.  All of them are intelligent, all of them genuinely care about people, and all of them want only what is best for their patients.
> Same with nurses.
> 
> Not everyone outside of us is malevolent, stupid, or greedy.


I'd like to meet some of these doctors you know. Most of the doctors I have seen want the easy patients who will gladly take a pill or some other easy "fix" and be on their way. I ask questions. I like to be completely involved in my care. Many doctors do not like it when patients take a hands-on approach to their care. They feel threatened. 

Unfortunately I don't have many good experiences with nurses. I had a few try to play doctor and had no idea what they were talking about. It's scary some of the things I have had nurses say to me about my conditions. 

Recently I went to a rheumatologist and he's been the best doctor I have ever seen. He actually said to me, "I want to see you get better". I have never, ever ever had a doctor say anything even remotely close to that. I know there are some good ones out there, but they are few and far between.

Any way I guess where I am going with this, is that for the past 12 years of my life, I've been trying to undo what a vaccine did to me. Doctor's refuse to accept the fact that a vaccine could have done this yet they offer no other ideas of what did. That vaccine was not worth the potential good because I don't lead a normal life now. Ron Paul's views on health freedom is one of the big reasons why I support him and it saddens me to see that a lot of his own supporters feel the need to force vaccines upon each other. Do your own research. Look up those who have been injured and decide for yourself.

----------


## mosquitobite

Cracks me up that people on these forums who mostly (should) understand that everything the media and science tells us is ONLY the part they WANT to tell us still buy big pharmas lies hook line and sinker.

How is it that people who KNOW the media mischaracterizes Ron Paul and his positions wouldn't stop to think that maybe the same media isbe in bed with the pharma lobby (who make MILLIONS off vaccines)

Keith do you believe in man made global warming too?  What about the science behind fluoridating water?  Not to go way off tangent...my point is that even where the science is supposedly "SETTLED" there are still plenty of critics who say "woah, not so fast" but the media paints them as kooky or conspiracy theorists.

Keith just humor me:
do you know the difference between DTP and DTaP and which strains of pertussis they cover?  Don't go and google it now...wouldn't want you to dig too far into this stuff...it might take the blindfold off.

----------


## mosquitobite

I have had the MMR twice.  Still test as unresponsive to it.  Not immune.  So all you science-y folk who believe in herd immunity...do you know how many others like me are out there? 

I am convinced the MMR is why I now have Hashimoto's thyroiditis.

----------


## tttppp

> Generally doctors do not cure, they treat people.  Which means it's a meal ticket.
> 
> Most medical schools do not even school on nutrients and minerals.


Its a complete waste of resources. The medical industry wastes an unbelievable amount of money on treatment that does next to nothing. We would be much better off if the U.S. focused on Chinese traditional medicine which can cure most diseases and focus on developing cures for the things Chinese traditional medicine can't cure.

----------


## Keith and stuff

> Unfortunately you are wrong again.  It is children who are vaccinated that pose the risks to everyone else.


How so?

----------


## mosquitobite

> It is children who are vaccinated that pose the risks to everyone else.





> How so?


Do you know the difference between a live virus and a dead one?  The difference in efficacy and risks (to self and others) between the two types?

How is it that the vaccinated get pertussis in exactly the same rates (or more) than the unvaxxed?

As I said before, I'm not ANTI vaccine.  I'm anti UNSAFE vaccine.  I'm anti UNSAFE AAP guidelines that *are* making our nation sicker rather than healthier - but because the damage is not often *immediate* (death sure would scare a few people from the vaccine camp...oh wait...nevermind it hasn't with Gardisil...) people buy big pharmas manufactured studies and ignore what vaccine damaged people are saying.

Please note, I have not brought up autism ONCE in this thread.  Autism is 100% NOT the reason this mama doesn't vaccinate.  That may have been what triggered me to dig into the research, but in the end that was just ONE of the possible side effects.  In the end, I do feel the risks outweigh the benefits...for MOST children.

----------


## bossman068410

A Picture Diary of Baby Ian’s Reaction to the Hep B shot

http://iansvoice.org/default.aspx

----------


## SWATH

Thanks Bossman, 
That's a powerful story.  I'm so glad I refused the Hep B.  I didn't even really research it before hand but I almost felt angry when they asked me within minutes of him being born if I wanted them to go ahead and give the Hep B shot.  I felt like saying "are you out of your goddamn mind, he is a premature infant with a low apgar score, not a promiscuous drug addict".  It was almost like they were asking me if I wanted to go ahead and give him an AIDS vaccine or go ahead and remove his testicles to prevent him from getting prostate cancer or something.  I got the feeling that the nurse actually agreed with me because she didn't seemed too thrilled to give it to him.  She was a great nurse though and a natural birthing medula on the side.  I don't know if I could ever forgive myself if I harmed that child by allowing him to be injected with something that already makes me very uneasy and am highly skeptical of.  Even more so than if he contracted an illness by chance, as bad as that would be as well.  If we choose to not vaccinate we will need to find another pediatrician who will accept him.

----------


## jllundqu

> We've been following the delayed suggested schedule from Dr. Sears vaccine book.  It was a friendly compromise between mine and my wifes differing opinions on the subject.


+rep

We used the delayed schedule here.  We also did not do the Hep B right out of the womb.  When I refused to let them inject my already fragile son who just had come from an emergency c-section with the Hep B vaccine, they asked me why, to which I replied "He is 10 minutes old, I think we still have some time to prepare for the possiblity of sexually transmitted diseases."  (Hep B is classified as an STD)

There are some shots that I will not ever give myself or family (see aborted fetus post, H1N1, etc.) and I think delaying the schedule is a wise compromise.  Also NEVER allow ANYONE to talk you into giving a pregnant woman vaccines with the pitch that "its a 2-for-1" and will "work for both you and the fetus"  That was SOOOO forbidden just a few years ago with no science to back it up.

In the end, educate yourself, trust your instincts, and question the medical paradigm in the U.S.

----------


## SWATH

Updated with pic in first post.

----------


## Lymeade-Lady

I recommend Dr. Tenpenny.  We have an excellent DVD from her discussing the risk of each disease and the risk of the vaccines.  After learning a bit I was going to do a few vaccinations, but eventually decided to do none.  The preservatives (mercury or not) are bad and the dose has nothing to do with the body weight, so they are much worse for the infants.   MMR is the one associated with autism.  We are choosing a very healthy lifestyle, so vaccinations don't seem necessary.  They increase risk of auto-immune problems and learning disabilities which are much more of an epidemic than pertussis or whatever! There are many more connected issues than just autism. But I do recommend that you not be careless with your child's immune system if you don't immunize.  (Very little sugar and white flour.  No sodas.  Very little juice, etc.)

----------


## SWATH

To add even more $#@! to the problems I had at birth I just found out that I have Hepatitus C and it was 100% contracted from a blood transfusion I had after surgery.  Yeah I am beyond angry.  All of my problems stem from western medicine.  I was born fine but premature, screwed up from being fed formula, sliced up a couple of times from very invasive surgeries, then to top it all of was given a serious disease in the hospital.  I used to say that they almost killed me trying to save me, but now it is possible that they actually did kill me in the end.

----------


## eduardo89

Be thankful you even have a choice...when my daughter was born last year, I wasn't even told they vaccinated her for Heb B. Later on, I found out vaccination is legally mandated and there are only certain "optional" vaccines. My daughter hasn't gotten any of the optional ones.

----------

