# News & Current Events > U.S. Political News >  BREAKING:  mass shooting at elementary school

## tangent4ronpaul

60 miles NE of NYC - Newtown CT

Multiple types of injuries.

Just came across the newswire

It's a K-4 elementary.  Sandy Oak elementary
2 shooters, one is dead.
one person has numerous gunshot wounds
one person already transported w/ gunshot wound to foot
2 ambulances on scene and another inbound from neighboring town.

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/c...,4678476.story

At least one person is dead after a shooting at an elementary school in Connecticut. Police said there are multiple shooting victims, and some of them are children. 
...
A dispatcher at the Newtown Volunteer Ambulance Corps says a teacher has been shot in the foot and taken to Danbury Hospital.

State police sources said one shooter is dead. Earlier reports of a second shooter are unconfirmed. A person in one room had “numerous gunshot wounds,” police said.

2 guns
at least 2 dead, 3 wounded in hospital
shooting looks to have happened in kindergarten class.

one fatality is a child
one victim may be the principle

Could be as many as 12 dead.  This is BAD!
At least 3 children transported to hospital.
ATF on site
Shooting was in kindergarten and principles office.

Confirmed:
5 children dead
4 adults dead
varying reports of 12-20 victims.

18 children dead
8 adults dead
26 dead total + shooter
shooter was wearing mask and mil style vest + black BDUs
Sig and Glock

Second shooter just taken into custody
4 weapons now involved
dead shooter is 22yo M
has some connection to the school
one weapon is .223 rifle


-t

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## pochy1776

Now we will get more gun control.

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## sailingaway

Oh $#@!.

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## sailingaway

> Now we will get more gun control.


elementary school students are already forbidden from owning guns.  clearly the perp went where he knew people would be defenseless.

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## luctor-et-emergo

Seriously... 
NYC ? Aren't guns mostly banned there ?

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## Chester Copperpot

its time to ban elementary schools

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## sailingaway

> Seriously... 
> NYC ? Aren't guns mostly banned there ?


Leaving it wide open for people to shoot others without repurcussions. 

But honestly, my first thought here is 'those poor kids!' not 'protect our gun rights'.  when they are threatened, I'll be right there with you protecting them.

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## sailingaway

> its time to ban elementary schools


there's the ticket.

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## tttppp

> 60 miles NE of NYC - Newtown CT
> 
> Multiple types of injuries.
> 
> Just came across the newswire
> 
> -t


I live in Newtown. Which elementary school is it?

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## JK/SEA

someone forgot to put the ''NO GUNS ALLOWED  sign on the front door.

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## donnay

> someone forgot to put the ''NO GUNS ALLOWED  sign on the front door.


As I understand it, there are "Zero Tolerance" zones all around the federal prisons errr schools.  Gun's, knives, baseball bats, plastic knives, etc.

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## tangent4ronpaul

> I live in Newtown. Which elementary school is it?


It's a K-4 elementary.  Sandy Oak elementary
2 shooters, one is dead.
one person has numerous gunshot wounds
one person already transported w/ gunshot wound to foot
2 ambulances on scene and another inbound from neighboring town.

-t

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## tangent4ronpaul

> As I understand it, there are "Zero Tolerance" zones all around the federal prisons errr schools.  Gun's, knives, baseball bats, plastic knives, etc.


you forgot knitting needles, some combs, water pistols and toy soldiers (because of the tiny plastic gun they are carrying)

-t

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## DerailingDaTrain

Reminds me of Brenda Ann Spencer




> Brenda Ann Spencer (born April 3, 1962) is a convicted American murderer who, at the age of 16, carried out a shooting spree from her home in San Diego, California, on January 29, 1979. During the shooting spree, she killed two people and injured nine others at Cleveland Elementary School, which was located across the street from her home.

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## Cowlesy

I can't stand animals that do these things.


As a consquence, I bought some more shares of RGR.

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## tangent4ronpaul

> Reminds me of Brenda Ann Spencer






Yes, the song was inspired by her shooting spree.

it looks like she's eligible for parole soon.

-t

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## whippoorwill

link..http -- ://www.kltv.com/story/20345707/school-shooting-reported-in-newtown

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## TheGrinch

> Leaving it wide open for people to shoot others without repurcussions. 
> 
> But honestly, my first thought here is 'those poor kids!' not 'protect our gun rights'.  when they are threatened, I'll be right there with you protecting them.


+rep

I know it's easy on a political board to go straight to the political repercussions, even suspicions of false flags and such in some cases, but there's plenty of time for that once the smoke clears. For now, my thoughts go out to those who've had to go through the unimaginable.

Anyways, I'll step off the soapbox now, just hope people remember that we're trying to change things for the better of our fellow human beings, not to use things like this to push an agenda like the opportunists do.

----------


## tangent4ronpaul

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/c...,4678476.story

At least one person is dead after a shooting at an elementary school in Connecticut. Police said there are multiple shooting victims, and some of them are children. 
...
A dispatcher at the Newtown Volunteer Ambulance Corps says a teacher has been shot in the foot and taken to Danbury Hospital.

State police sources said one shooter is dead. Earlier reports of a second shooter are unconfirmed. A person in one room had “numerous gunshot wounds,” police said.

-t

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## fisharmor

> But honestly, my first thought here is 'those poor kids!' not 'protect our gun rights'.


I agree with you: this isn't even a gun control issue.
This can not possibly ever happen to my children... because I'm not sending them to the state indoctrination camp.
Arguing about gun control in schools is like complaining when a rapist doesn't wear a condom.

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## Dr.3D

> you forgot knitting needles, some combs, water pistols and toy soldiers (because of the tiny plastic gun they are carrying)
> 
> -t


Don't forget pencils and pens... they can be deadly if used as a weapon.

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## tangent4ronpaul

The gun control nuts are on the comments and a fight is underway on diff articles.

2 guns
at least 2 dead, 3 wounded in hospital
shooting looks to have happened in kindergarten class.

-t

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## tangent4ronpaul

one fatality is a child
one victim may be the principle

-t

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## CaptainAmerica

you all need to buy guns,learn how to use it and carry. Encourage friends and family to buy guns and train with them. This $#@! is getting $#@!ing ridiculous.

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## tangent4ronpaul

Could be as many as 12 dead.  This is BAD!
At least 3 children transported to hospital.
ATF on site
Shooting was in kindergarten and principles office.

-t

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## VoluntaryAmerican

> But honestly, my first thought here is 'those poor kids!' not 'protect our gun rights'.  when they are threatened, I'll be right there with you protecting them.


Same here. This is truly sad.

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## tttppp

> It's a K-4 elementary.  Sandy Oak elementary
> 2 shooters, one is dead.
> one person has numerous gunshot wounds
> one person already transported w/ gunshot wound to foot
> 2 ambulances on scene and another inbound from neighboring town.
> 
> -t


I think you mean Sandy Hook. My brother went to that school years ago. My father was out today and said he saw tons of cops flying by.

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## No Free Beer

sad

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## LibForestPaul

My first thoughts...

Brings back memories of Russian incident.
More gun control for CT, think of the children.

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## tangent4ronpaul

Confirmed:
5 children dead
4 adults dead
varying reports of 12-20 victims.

-t

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## tangent4ronpaul

18 children dead
8 adults dead
26 dead total + shooter
shooter was wearing mask and mil style vest + black BDUs
Sig and Glock

-t

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## ronpaulfollower999

I just got an AP alert that say 27 dead, including 18 children.

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## ronpaulfollower999

Tragic. 

I hate people.

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## ronpaulfollower999

If I ever have kids, NO WAY IN HELL are they going to a public school. I've always said homeschool, and this confirms. 

Devastating. Absolutely terrible for the parents.

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## Machiavelli

My god

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## ronpaulfollower999

I can't believe CNN is interviewing a 3rd grader. The MSM is $#@!ing disgusting.

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## Anti Federalist

So, the asset failed in Portland?

Roll with Asset B.

What a cluster $#@!.

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## supermario21

I pray for all the victims and their families. Moreover, CT and NJ (where the shooter came from) are the 5th and 2nd ranked states by the Brady Campaign for strictest gun control laws, and both states have assault weapon bans, etc. Yet the gun control people will ignore this.

http://www.bradycampaign.org/stategunlaws/scorecard/NJ/
http://www.bradycampaign.org/stategunlaws/scorecard/CT/

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## JK/SEA

all your guns are now targets.

Holiday Season...grade school....can't get much worse than that.

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## tod evans

Sad day...

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## cjm

> State police sources said one shooter is dead. Earlier reports of a second shooter are unconfirmed.


"Although the security cameras were malfunctioning at the time of the incident, most witnesses say there was only one shooter" in 3....2....

Sorry folks, I'm pretty jaded today.

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## UWDude

It is just going to get worse, and gun control laws will only make these people angrier.  To kill children is an act meant to maximize pain on society itself.

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## UtahApocalypse

Sick to my stomach.

The sheeple will be begging Congress to take our guns away

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## VoluntaryAmerican

New York Post ‏@nypost
BREAKING UPDATE Now 18 kids among 27 killed after gunman opens fire in Conn. elementary school: report http://nyp.st/UM6xYL

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## Dark_Horse_Rider

> "Although the security cameras were malfunctioning at the time of the incident, most witnesses say there was only one shooter" in 3....2....
> 
> Sorry folks, I'm pretty jaded today.


. . . and another masked man, another report of multiple gunmen

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## erowe1

How does somebody shoot a kindergartner and then shoot more of them after that?

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## ronpaulfollower999

Principal, vice principal, and school psychologist went out into the hall after the first shot. Only the vice principal returned.

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## Sola_Fide

Those poor families...

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## CaptUSA

Unreal.  Just unimaginable.  Clearly a deranged individual to shoot up a kindergarten class.

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## Anti Federalist

> How does somebody shoot a kindergartner and then shoot more of them after that?


An asset.

We're being played.

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## JK/SEA

my wifes a 4th grade teacher...

haven't talked to her on this yet.

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## Nirvikalpa

This came across radio:

(DANBURY - ) DPD ON SCENE PURPLE VAN LOCATED POSS INVOLVED IN NEWTOWN SHOOTING, BE ON THE LOOKOUT 2 MALES 1 DRESSED AS A NUN [CON017]

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## aravoth

> So, the asset failed in Portland?
> 
> Roll with Asset B.
> 
> What a cluster $#@!.


expect more in the coming weeks...

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## JK/SEA

> An asset.
> 
> We're being played.


i think i agree with this...this is waaay over the top to be just some angry parent about his kids grades, or a jealous lover...

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## ronpaulfollower999

> This came across radio:
> 
> (DANBURY - ) DPD ON SCENE PURPLE VAN LOCATED POSS INVOLVED IN NEWTOWN SHOOTING, BE ON THE LOOKOUT 2 MALES 1 DRESSED AS A NUN [CON017]


The suspects, dressed as a nun?

Ugh, ugh, ugh. 

Can't trust anyone now.

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## CaptUSA

I have a hard believing there could be a second person involved.  One person being this f**ked up is rare enough.  Two people working together to do this?  I can't even imagine it.

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## tod evans

Supposedly a childs father.....

I'd bet involved in a custody dispute...

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## Nirvikalpa

Police/Fire/EMS Radio is still very active in that area.  ~2500 people listening to the stream.

This is devastating.  Why children...

Couldn't imagine being a first responder and seeing children dying, or already dead.  How would you even begin to triage that?  Could you look a dying child in the eye and pass over them knowing all your efforts to save them would be futile, and you had to save your energy for the ones that could be saved?  I couldn't.

Right now a parent is getting a call that was once just a worst nightmare for them.  I can't.  This is horrible.  They're just kids... and why are these reporters asking these children questions... do they have no shame... let them be.

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## VBRonPaulFan

> An asset.
> 
> We're being played.


If your boss told you to go to a school, shoot up a ton of kids, and then let the cops shoot you to death - would you go along with that? Would anyone? That's just an unbelievable idea to float around.

If anything, it's some dude in a custody dispute (maybe on anti-depressants) that snapped.

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## tod evans

> This is devastating.  Why children...


The "Just-Us" system has made children a prize....

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## thoughtomator

> If your boss told you to go to a school, shoot up a ton of kids, and then let the cops shoot you to death - would you go along with that? Would anyone? That's just an unbelievable idea to float around.
> 
> If anything, it's some dude in a custody dispute (maybe on anti-depressants) that snapped.


They don't tell the agents that they're expendable.

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## squarepusher

so sad

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## Nirvikalpa

Cops on the radio stream asking where they can send frantic parents calling from work asking where their children are.  
A lot of the stream is being scrambled.

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## VBRonPaulFan

> They don't tell the agents that they're expendable.


not everything is a big, government conspiracy. sometimes people just totally snap and go ape$#@!.

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## ronpaulfollower999

CNN- Lou Palumbo Security Expert/Former Nassau County Sheriff plugging gun control. Believe it or not, CNN cut him.

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## LibertyEagle

> If your boss told you to go to a school, shoot up a ton of kids, and then let the cops shoot you to death - would you go along with that? Would anyone? That's just an unbelievable idea to float around.
> 
> If anything, it's some dude in a custody dispute (maybe on anti-depressants) that snapped.


There are also things like MK-ULTRA.

This whole tragedy seems just too convenient for the emerging police state.  In my opinion, something smells.

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## EBounding

I'm torn between being furious and extremely sad...

God please comfort those children and their families....

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## tangent4ronpaul

Second shooter just taken into custody
4 weapons now involved

-t

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## thoughtomator

> not everything is a big, government conspiracy. sometimes people just totally snap and go ape$#@!.


True that. These things don't happen in a vacuum however, and there is almost certainly some $#@!ed-up government meddling involved on some level.

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## AuH20

They really are coming for all the guns. This is surreal. Do they know what events they will set in motion? Seriously...

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## Nirvikalpa

> CNN- Lou Palumbo Security Expert/Former Nassau County Sheriff plugging gun control. Believe it or not, CNN cut him.


Watched it too.  They indeed did cut him.  Guess even they believe it's not the time and place...

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## aGameOfThrones

> If your boss told you to go to a school, shoot up a ton of kids, and then let the cops shoot you to death - would you go along with that? Would anyone? That's just an unbelievable idea to float around.
> 
> If anything, it's some dude in a custody dispute (maybe on anti-depressants) that snapped.


Like telling someone, you'll get a lot of virgins if you go suicide bomb something.

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## cbrons

*WHO smells a rat?*

I am in no way inclined toward conspiracy theories, in fact I make fun of people who usually are.

HOWEVER, when I read the story today, I had to really check myself because my immediate knee-jerk reaction was not necessarily sympathy for the victims which it should be, but that the government is running a patsy/false flag out there.

This is far worse than Columbine. The same week the 7th Circuit gives Illinois Conceal & Carry?

This reminds me of Matt Bracken's novel Foreign Enemies & Domestic, where the government used a patsy to kill a bunch of people who were sitting ducks and used it to push their inhumane anti-self defense laws.

Anyways, we need to pray for these people. And for the country.

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## Nirvikalpa

> There are also things like MK-ULTRA.
> 
> This whole tragedy seems just too convenient for the emerging police state.  In my opinion, something smells.


Just watched a documentary on MK-Ultra... couldn't believe it.  Really blew my mind.

Red Cross is now on the scene (or will be shortly).  Radio'd in.  If anyone is interested in the stream: http://www.radioreference.com/apps/a...wp&feedId=7623

A lot of it is scrambled.

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## belian78

> not everything is a big, government conspiracy. sometimes people just totally snap and go ape$#@!.


Throw in the fact that a majority of our society is hopped up on a cornicopia of Dr prescribed psychoactive drugs, and it's not hard to believe.  But on the other hand, someone snapping and going ape$#@! will take out one or two, maybe a handful of people before offing themselves.  But this?  Tactical gear, masks, disguises..  all to go in and decimate a gradeschool?  Nuts don't do that.

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## AuH20

Both CT senators will sponsor a new AWB bill next session. Book it.

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## tangent4ronpaul

dead shooter is 22yo M
has some connection to the school
one weapon is .223 rifle

-t

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## Anti Federalist

> If your boss told you to go to a school, shoot up a ton of kids, and then let the cops shoot you to death - would you go along with that? Would anyone? That's just an unbelievable idea to float around.
> 
> If anything, it's some dude in a custody dispute (maybe on anti-depressants) that snapped.


If my boss did, no.

If my handler did...

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## Lucille

Heart-wrenching.  I feel sick.  Those poor kids.  The ones who lived through it too, they'll never be the same.

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## juleswin

> I have a hard believing there could be a second person involved.  One person being this f**ked up is rare enough.  Two people working together to do this?  I can't even imagine it.


Maybe there are real terrorists. Anyone know if its a Jewish school?

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## Anti Federalist

> Throw in the fact that a majority of our society is hopped up on a cornicopia of Dr prescribed psychoactive drugs, and it's not hard to believe.  But on the other hand, someone snapping and going ape$#@! will take out one or two, maybe a handful of people before offing themselves.  But this?  Tactical gear, masks, disguises..  all to go in and decimate a gradeschool?  Nuts don't do that.


Well co-ordinated, well handled nuts do.

I'm sorry if it looks like I'm jumping the gun, bad pun *not* intended, but I smell a rat here, this is just way too over the top wrt to timing and impact.

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## tangent4ronpaul

> Maybe there are real terrorists. Anyone know if its a Jewish school?


There was one mention of Episcopalian

some shrink is on FOX advocating pre-crime psych screeming of the entire population - oh joy! 

-t

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## Meatwasp

Who do you trust anymore and  I am so up set for the kids and their parents.

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## Anti Federalist

> They really are coming for all the guns. This is surreal. Do they know what events they will set in motion? Seriously...


Yes, yes they are.

Yes, yes they do.

What are your intentions folks?

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## Romulus

> I have a hard believing there could be a second person involved.  One person being this f**ked up is rare enough.  Two people working together to do this?  I can't even imagine it.


27 people dead... that is more than one shooter

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## tangent4ronpaul

> Well co-ordinated, well handled nuts do.
> 
> I'm sorry if it looks like I'm jumping the gun, bad pun *not* intended, but I smell a rat here, this is just way too over the top wrt to timing and impact.


Maybe some were the kids of a major news exec

-t

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## juleswin

> Like telling someone, you'll get a lot of virgins if you go suicide bomb something.


Comparing apples and oranges buddy. if your God through your priest/iman told you to kill someone and you believe it, wouldn't you do it? Ofc not trying to say that is what motivates suicide bomber but your boss and your God are just 2 very different animals

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## A Son of Liberty

Whether or not this was a staged event really doesn't matter.  There are a few things we know for sure:

A lot of innocent little kids are dead, and that is an immeasurable, indescribable tragedy.

A lot of parents and families lives are forever marred, and the fallout for them personally will be long-term and devastating.

This incident WILL be used to push an anti-gun agenda.  

My thoughts and prayers are with a lot of people right now.  Mostly too many parents and families in Connecticut.

God have mercy on us all.

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## ronpaulfollower999

Man wearing cameo came out of the woods being escorted by police handcuffed. Looked at a parent and said "I did not do it."

^That would be a second gunman.

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## JK/SEA

> Yes, yes they are.
> 
> Yes, yes they do.
> 
> What are your intentions folks?


i carry my S&W Bodyguard at all times. The only way anyone will get it from me is .......................

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## VBRonPaulFan

> Man wearing cameo came out of the woods being escorted by police handcuffed. Looked at a parent and said "I did not do it."
> 
> ^That would be a second gunman.


worst day to go hunting, ever?

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## cbrons

*Fact is, the Chicago machine was slapped in the face this week when the 7th Circuit said the people in Illinois aren't slaves. Now the Chicago machine has got its Reichstag Fire and will move in to make the whole country disarmed slaves. Prepare for the most restrictive anti-constitutional gun laws and perhaps a civil war.*

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## juleswin

I hate to see people die, so I hope the $#@! who did this gets caught and get the chair. Not a violent person but there are just somethings you should not do and killing a bunch of kids be it through drones or a gun is one of them

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## Dark_Horse_Rider

> There are also things like MK-ULTRA.
> 
> This whole tragedy seems just too convenient for the emerging police state.  In my opinion, something smells.


mk was what they were capable of in the 60's , one could only imagine what demented $#@! they have developed by now

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## Anti Federalist

> There was one mention of Episcopalian
> 
> some shrink is on FOX advocating pre-crime psych screeming of the entire population - oh joy! 
> 
> -t


Oh, all that and more.

More surveillance, more "knock and talks" with cops at your door, more "pre crime" arrests.

Gut check people, how committed to freedom are you?

Because I'm pretty sure all out, open war has just been declared.

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## tangent4ronpaul

> 27 people dead... that is more than one shooter


100 shots fired.
as to number of people, we are talking about 5yo's trapped in a classroom for most.
and in a gun free zone so no one could stop it.
He took out an entire kindergarten class.  17 kids per class.

-t

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## Cowlesy

Possibly 18 little kids.

It just numbs you with sadness.

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## juleswin

> Man wearing cameo came out of the woods being escorted by police handcuffed. Looked at a parent and said "I did not do it."
> 
> ^That would be a second gunman.


Oh my, someone got caught. I hope the police just continue to look just in case this is the wrong guy.

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## QuickZ06

'Something needs to be done'

Famous last words of those whose liberty has not yet been commandeered.

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## kathy88

I can hardly breathe. We are so $#@!ed.

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## JK/SEA

> I can hardly breathe. We are so $#@!ed.


keep breathing. I'm pretty sure we'll need you.

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## AuH20

This is the line in the sand they can't be allowed to cross. God help us. We can tolerate and overlook many things but this is non-negotiable.

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## tod evans

> Oh, all that and more.
> 
> More surveillance, more "knock and talks" with cops at your door, more "pre crime" arrests.
> 
> Gut check people, how committed to freedom are you?
> 
> Because I'm pretty sure all out, open war has just been declared.


The only cry you'll hear on the MSM will be for more government intervention, there will be no mention of any governmental contribution to this tragedy..

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## newbitech

> NPR is reporting that Connecticut is reaching out to other states to help with autopsies because they dont have enough medical examiners.


http://connecticut.cbslocal.com/2012...tiple-injured/
seriously?  What is the point of this?

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## Dark_Horse_Rider

[QUOTE=newbitech;4775140]http://connecticut.cbslocal.com/2012...tiple-injured/
seriously?  What is the point of this?[/QUOTE

 the hero nurse from Aurora that wound up dead ?

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## Brian4Liberty

> 2 shooters, one is dead.


Not blaming you, but what it is about these incidents that it almost always results in witnesses and the media reporting multiple shooters? There must be some kind of psychological underpinning for this. Perhaps it's instinct that when one danger occurs, the brain goes on high alert for the same situation to continue occurring, thus people are seeing shooters everywhere during and after the incident.

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## juleswin

> http://connecticut.cbslocal.com/2012...tiple-injured/
> seriously?  What is the point of this?


Following protocol just for the heck of it.

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## Pericles

> *WHO smells a rat?*
> 
> I am in no way inclined toward conspiracy theories, in fact I make fun of people who usually are.
> 
> HOWEVER, when I read the story today, I had to really check myself because my immediate knee-jerk reaction was not necessarily sympathy for the victims which it should be, but that the government is running a patsy/false flag out there.
> 
> This is far worse than Columbine. The same week the 7th Circuit gives Illinois Conceal & Carry?
> 
> This reminds me of Matt Bracken's novel Foreign Enemies & Domestic, where the government used a patsy to kill a bunch of people who were sitting ducks and used it to push their inhumane anti-self defense laws.
> ...



Anybody notice that these events no longer happen in Israel? Maybe teachers carrying M16s is a good thing.

----------


## Anti Federalist

> The only cry you'll hear on the MSM will be for more government intervention, there will be no mention of any governmental contribution to this tragedy..


Well, of course, this is impossible, weapons on school grounds are a violation of federal law.

All the lockdowns, all the surveillance, all the cops in schools were useless.

Solution?

More and expanded, "lockdowns", surveillance and cops.

----------


## Brian4Liberty

> The gunman - reportedly the father of a pupil, masked and heavily armed - has been killed. AP said he was 20 years old and used a .223-caliber rifle.
> 
> http://news.sky.com/story/1025646/sc...icut-27-killed


Now they are reporting it was a parent.

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## Petar

SSRI inhibitors seem to be another common thread in incidences like this. I guess that it's the elephant in the room though.

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## Anti Federalist

> Now they are reporting it was a parent.


I'm sure that will be the narrative.

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## Pericles

> SSRI inhibitors seem to be another common thread in incidences like this. I guess that it's the elephant in the room though.


Very likely

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## jmdrake

> +rep
> 
> I know it's easy on a political board to go straight to the political repercussions, even suspicions of false flags and such in some cases, but there's plenty of time for that once the smoke clears. For now, my thoughts go out to those who've had to go through the unimaginable.
> 
> Anyways, I'll step off the soapbox now, just hope people remember that we're trying to change things for the better of our fellow human beings, not to use things like this to push an agenda like the opportunists do.


I'd love to agree.  The sad thing is the anti gun opportunists aren't going to be so restrained.  Expect the president and/or his allies to renew calls for gun control within 24 hours.  We have a president who's top advisers say "Don't let a good opportunity go to waste."

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## Brian4Liberty

> SSRI inhibitors seem to be another common thread in incidences like this. I guess that it's the elephant in the room though.


Don't expect a news report about that. Big Pharma and their bought politicians won't allow that.

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## juleswin

> Anybody notice that these events no longer happen in Israel? Maybe teachers carrying M16s is a good thing.


That or the building of giant walls to wall off a group of people did more to lessen the violence. Its not like a person trying to blow himself off inside a bus or cafe is going to be deterred by M16s

----------


## AGRP

Dont guests to public schools have to sign in!?  Did the shooters sign in???????

----------


## James Madison

> Now they are reporting it was a parent.


20 years old and the father of a Kindergardener?

Looks like the principle and vice principle ran down to the room after the first shots were fired. Of course, it was a 'Gun Free Zone' so they had no chance of stopping the gunman.

----------


## tangent4ronpaul

> Anybody notice that these events no longer happen in Israel? Maybe teachers carrying M16s is a good thing.


They check out uzi's for field trips from the cops.  I believe they have to have at least one armed teacher in every school.

-t

----------


## Deborah K

Mark Furhman just commented on a potential conspiracy.

----------


## Brian4Liberty

> SSRI inhibitors seem to be another common thread in incidences like this. I guess that it's the elephant in the room though.


SSRIs and/or mental illness are the only things that can explain this.

----------


## tangent4ronpaul

Body found in home in town - may be mother of child

-t

----------


## LibertyRevolution

CT already has crazy gun laws.. You cant buy an "assault riffle" in this state... 

"Any selective-fire firearm capable of fully automatic, semiautomatic or burst fire at the option of the user or any of the following specified semiautomatic firearms:  Algimec Agmi; Armalite AR-180; Australian Automatic Arms SAP Pistol; Auto-Ordnance Thompson type; Avtomat Kalashnikov AK-47 type; Barrett Light-Fifty model 82A1; Beretta AR-70; Bushmaster Auto Rifle and Auto Pistol; Calico models M-900, M-950 and 100-P; Chartered Industries of Singapore SR-88; Colt AR-15 and Sporter; Daewoo K-1, K-2, Max-1 and Max-2; Encom MK-IV, MP-9 and MP-45; Fabrique Nationale FN/FAL, FN/LAR, or FN/FNC; FAMAS MAS 223; Feather AT-9 and Mini-AT; Federal XC-900 and XC-450; Franchi SPAS-12 and LAW-12; Galil AR and ARM; Goncz High-Tech Carbine and High-Tech Long Pistol; Heckler & Koch HK-91, HK-93, HK-94 and SP-89; Holmes MP-83; MAC-10, MAC-11 Carbien type; Intratec TEC-9 and Scorpion; Iver Johnson Enforcer model 3000; Ruger Mini-14/5F folding stock model only; Scarab Skorpion; SIG 57 AMT and 500 Series; Spectre Auto Carbine and Auto Pistol; Springfield Armory BM59, SAR-48 and G-3; Sterling MK-6 and MK-7; Steyr AUG; Street Sweeper and Striker 12 revolving cylinder shotguns; USAS-12; USI Carbine, Mini-Carbine and Pistol; Weaver Arms Nighthawk; Wilkinson "Linda" Pistol.

2.         A part or combination of parts designed or intended to convert a firearm into an assault weapon as defined in subdivision (1) or any combination of parts from which an assault weapon as defined in subdivision (1) may be rapidly assembled if those parts are in the possession or under the control of the same person.

3.         Any semiautomatic firearm not listed in subdivision (1) that meets the following criteria:

(A)  A semiautomatic rifle that has an ability to accept a detachable magazine and has at least two of the following:

i.          a folding or telescopic stock;

ii.          a pistol grip;

iii.         a bayonet mount;

iv.         a flash suppressor or threaded barrel designed to accommodate a flash suppressor; and

v.         a grenade launcher.

(B)  A semiautomatic pistol that has an ability to accept a detachable magazine and has at least two of the following:

i.          an ammunition magazine that attaches to the pistol outside of the pistol grip;

ii.          a threaded barrel capable of accepting a barrel extender, flash suppressor, forward handgrip or silencer;

iii.         a shroud that is attached to, or partially or completely encircles, the barrel and permits the shooter to hold the firearm with the nontrigger hand without being burned;

iv.         a manufactured weight of fifty ounces or more when the pistol is unloaded; and

v.         a semiautomatic version of an automatic firearm.

(C)  A semiautomatic shotgun that has at least two of the following:

i.          a folding or telescoping stock;

ii.          a pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon;

iii.         a fixed magazine capacity in excess of five rounds; and

iv.         an ability to accept a detachable magazine.

4.         A part or combination of parts designed or intended to convert a firearm into an assault weapon, as defined in subdivision (3), or any combination of parts from which an assault weapon, as defined in subdivision (3), may be rapidly assembled if those parts are in the possession or under the control of the same person.

Source:  General Statutes § 53-202a (a) (applies to §§ 53-202b -- 202k).

Commentary:  The term "assault weapon" does not include any firearm modified to render it permanently inoperable.  General Statutes § 53-202a (b)."

----------


## Brian4Liberty

> Mark Furhman just commented on a potential conspiracy.


When Furhman was asked about .223 caliber, he said it was an "assault weapon".

----------


## Deborah K

> Body found in home in town - may be mother of child
> 
> -t


Mother of shooter

----------


## jmdrake

> Mark Furhman just commented on a potential conspiracy.


Mark Furhman of OJ fame?

----------


## AFPVet

We need more firearm laws and NO GUN signs because criminals always obey regulations

----------


## Romulus

how can this all be done with ONE shooter?? I don't buy that..

----------


## Brian4Liberty

> Body found in home in town - may be mother of child
> 
> -t


Fox said it was the mother of the shooter.

----------


## TER

Lord Jesus Christ, have mercy on those who are suffering and those who have lost their lives.  Lord Jesus Christ, give comfort and hope to the parents and siblings of these little angels who were ruthlessly killed in such a horrific manner.

----------


## Deborah K

> When Furhman was asked about .223 caliber, he said it was an "assault weapon".


He said 'some consider it an assault weapon'.

----------


## juleswin

This appearing to be a domestic dispute, the question I have now is why kill other people not involved with your case? Seems like a really $#@!ty thing to do

----------


## tangent4ronpaul

> When Furhman was asked about .223 caliber, he said it was an "assault weapon".


he also said he didn't know if they made pistols in that caliber.

-t

----------


## Czolgosz

> Dont guests to public schools have to sign in!?  Did the shooters sign in???????

----------


## Pericles

> That or the building of giant walls to wall off a group of people did more to lessen the violence. Its not like a person trying to blow himself off inside a bus or cafe is going to be deterred by M16s


Last time they tried it, one teacher wounded, and dead terrorist was the result.

----------


## juleswin

> how can this all be done with ONE shooter?? I don't buy that..


He was shooting kids, he might as well be shooting fish in a barrel

----------


## TER

> SSRIs and/or mental illness are the only things that can explain this.


Satan is the reason for this.

----------


## Deborah K

> Lord Jesus Christ, have mercy on those who are suffering and those who have lost their lives.  Lord Jesus Christ, give comfort and hope to the parents and siblings of these little angels who were ruthlessly killed in such a horrific manner.



In Jesus' name, Amen.

----------


## juleswin

> Last time they tried it, one teacher wounded, and dead terrorist was the result.


So you really think M16s are a bigger deterrent than a giant walls circling your city and a 1 million check points setup to check for bombs? My God, these people are trying to kill themselves. The day I decide I want to take my life and take the lives of other people I hate, I promise you, no amount of M16 is going to stop me. Whats the worst that could happen?

----------


## Anti Federalist

> Lord Jesus Christ, have mercy on those who are suffering and those who have lost their lives.  Lord Jesus Christ, give comfort and hope to the parents and siblings of these little angels who were ruthlessly killed in such a horrific manner.


Lord, hear our prayer, Amen.

----------


## Deborah K

> When Furhman was asked about .223 caliber, he said it was an "assault weapon".


Quote: "...it's just a caliber of a rifle round..."  "Most people generically call them 'assault weapons' but it's just a semi-automatic rifle."

----------


## Anti Federalist

> Satan is the reason for this.


How harshly does a loving God judge an individual?

Or an entire nation?

We sow death and destruction worldwide for a 100 years.

What harvest will that bring?

----------


## Brian4Liberty

Shooter was 24, not 20.

----------


## Antischism

The dude's name is Ryan Lanza, and he was apparently 24-years old.

----------


## tangent4ronpaul

Shooter was Ryan Lanza 
he's 24, not 22

-t

----------


## Brian4Liberty

> Quote: "...it's just a caliber of a rifle round..."  "Most people generically call them 'assault weapons' but it's just a semi-automatic rifle."


When Dianne Feinstein quotes it, it will just be "assault weapon".

----------


## Lucille

> I'd love to agree.  The sad thing is the anti gun opportunists aren't going to be so restrained.  Expect the president and/or his allies to renew calls for gun control within 24 hours.  We have a president who's top advisers say "Don't let a good opportunity go to waste."


Which will be ironic, since the CIC is deliberately targeting children in his GWoT.

----------


## Pericles

> So you really think M16s are a bigger deterrent than a giant walls circling your city and a 1 million check points setup to check for bombs? My God, these people are trying to kill themselves. The day I decide I want to take my life and take the lives of other people I hate, I promise you, no amount of M16 is going to stop me. Whats the worst that could happen?


The point is that good security intercepts the bomber before the suicide bomber makes it to the intended target. They end up getting shot down before triggering the explosive in the best case. That is why they had to go to car bombs and now air delivery, which is much more expensive to make, and more difficult to target with accuracy.

----------


## Antischism

Here's his Facebook page. http://www.facebook.com/rlanza

----------


## jj-

> SSRIs and/or mental illness are the only things that can explain this.


Sure, mental illness, but that has always existed. Child abuse often triggers it. I don't dispute though that SSRIs probably increase the frequency directly or indirectly.

----------


## squarepusher

> Shooter was Ryan Lanza 
> he's 24, not 22
> 
> -t


conspiracy!!! coverup!!

----------


## tangent4ronpaul

> Here's his Facebook page. http://www.facebook.com/rlanza


This content is currently unavailable
The page you requested cannot be displayed right now. It may be temporarily unavailable, the link you clicked on may have expired, or you may not have permission to view this page. 

see anything interesting it before it went away?

-t

----------


## Anti Federalist

> Which will be ironic, since the CIC is deliberately targeting children in his GWoT.


A bitter, barren harvest.

I just don't know what to say anymore.

Reason to homeschool number 34,821.

----------


## AFPVet

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-201_162-...hool-shooting/




> It is unclear if there was more than one gunman at the school. CBS News senior correspondent John Miller reports authorities have an individual in custody who investigators said may be a *possible second shooter*.

----------


## libertygrl

> An asset.
> 
> We're being played.


I know people scoff at this idea and I was one of them for many years, but it just doesn't make sense how these shootings all seem to happen in bunches and have the same M.O.   Now they are targeting grade school children to maximize public demand for gun control.  I feel sick to my stomach.  I got home early today to have more time to decorate my Christmas tree but I lost all interest.   This is sad beyond belief.

----------


## Brian4Liberty

> Sure, mental illness, but that has always existed. Child abuse often triggers it. I don't dispute though that SSRIs probably increase the frequency directly or indirectly.


It seems like SSRIs have turned suicides into murder/suicides.

----------


## The Northbreather

Wolf Blitzer just tried to lead a mother of an unharmed child at the school into promoting more gun control and she took the opposite view

Wolf: "what do YOU think we need to do to stop this problem?"

Mother: "I dont know maybe we need to equip the teachers and staff with better ...ummm equipment so the can prevent this type of thing"

Sounded like she was going to say guns instead of equipment

----------


## Zarn Solen

t:

It's still there for me.

He seemed to be into theater, but there is no indication of anything else. I'm sure he restricted a lot of stuff on there.

----------


## LibertyEagle

> This content is currently unavailable
> The page you requested cannot be displayed right now. It may be temporarily unavailable, the link you clicked on may have expired, or you may not have permission to view this page. 
> 
> see anything interesting it before it went away?
> 
> -t


It comes up for me.

----------


## Deborah K

> This content is currently unavailable
> The page you requested cannot be displayed right now. It may be temporarily unavailable, the link you clicked on may have expired, or you may not have permission to view this page. 
> 
> see anything interesting it before it went away?
> 
> -t


Works for me, try again.

----------


## Brian4Liberty

> Wolf Blitzer just tried to lead a mother of an unharmed child at the school into promoting more gun control and she took the opposite view
> 
> Wolf: "what do YOU think we need to do to stop this problem?"


There's is no way to stop the problem. It's reality. You can't stop hurricanes either.

But no doubt Wolf will advocate some well-intended paving of the road to hell.

----------


## thehungarian

Yeah, I can see his page too. Seems like a normal guy. He has more friends than I do.

----------


## Brian4Liberty

Fox: Shooter was the son of the kindergarten teacher?

----------


## tangent4ronpaul

OK - it comes up.  I wasn't signed in.

thanks,

-t

----------


## James Madison

> Here's his Facebook page. http://www.facebook.com/rlanza


//

----------


## Nirvikalpa

ARE YOU PEOPLE $#@!ING KIDDING ME!?  Stop trying to be your own god damn detectives.  Stop posting people's personal photos and facebook pages.

"I LOVE PRIVACY RIGHTS... except for this guys, who no one knows is or is not the shooter yet" said a whole bunch of douches on this forum.

----------


## donnay

*SIGH*  This is so tragic!

I bet this Lanza character was on a cocktail of mind altering drugs.

----------


## belian78

> Definitely doesn't look like a gun enthusiast of any kind. More like a hipster/loser.
> 
> You ever notice that, despite the narrative put out by the media, these shooters are never carried out by self-described Republicans, Conservatives, or other groups associated with pro-gun culture. Instead, they're always men in their twenties, usually with left-of-center or apolitical beliefs. Odd that such shootings rarely take place in traditional 'Red states'. It's always the Northeast or West Coast it seems.


I had a long drawn out psuedo explanation that had to do with mentalities of majorities of people identifying as Rep or Dem, but in the end it's collectivist thinking and wouldn't be helpful right now, even though might be kinda true.

----------


## belian78

> *SIGH*  This is so tragic!
> 
> I bet this Lanza character was on a cocktail of mind altering drugs.


I'll make that bet as well.

----------


## heavenlyboy34

> Lord Jesus Christ, have mercy on those who are suffering and those who have lost their lives.  Lord Jesus Christ, give comfort and hope to the parents and siblings of these little angels who were ruthlessly killed in such a horrific manner.


 Amen, and +rep.

----------


## LibertyRevolution

> ARE YOU PEOPLE $#@!ING KIDDING ME!?  Stop trying to be your own god damn detectives.  Stop posting people's personal photos and facebook pages.
> 
> "I LOVE PRIVACY RIGHTS... except for this guys, who no one knows is or is not the shooter yet" said a whole bunch of douches on this forum.


are your watching cbs or fox? they are giving out this same info, cbs pulled up his facebook page live on the tv ...

----------


## AngryCanadian

And now they are blaming Guns and Video Games how wonderful.

----------


## dannno

//

----------


## Antischism

> This content is currently unavailable
> The page you requested cannot be displayed right now. It may be temporarily unavailable, the link you clicked on may have expired, or you may not have permission to view this page. 
> 
> see anything interesting it before it went away?
> 
> -t


A video of him training his cat to sit and one of him playing Grand Theft Auto IV.
Nothing really interesting on the page. It's mostly devoid of content.

Here are some pictures:

http://imgur.com/IT0b0
http://imgur.com/yrLPW
http://imgur.com/DgyHk
http://imgur.com/flpRq

----------


## donnay

Facebook is anti-privacy.  I do not have one for that very reason.

----------


## LibertyRevolution

> I think it's the wife of the 'shooter', mother of the child in the class


CBS is reporting that the mother of the shooter was found dead in her home in newtown, and she worked for the school.
Father found shot dead in NJ.

----------


## LibertyEagle

> are your watching cbs or fox? they are giving out this same info, cbs pulled up his facebook page live on the tv ...


This, or I wouldn't have posted it, Nik.

----------


## CaptainAmerica

> ARE YOU PEOPLE $#@!ING KIDDING ME!?  Stop trying to be your own god damn detectives.  Stop posting people's personal photos and facebook pages.
> 
> "I LOVE PRIVACY RIGHTS... except for this guys, who no one knows is or is not the shooter yet" said a whole bunch of douches on this forum.


 yeah I totally agree because of that aurora shooter there was another guy named "James holmes" who had no relation whatsoever but his profile was being stalked and harassed by thousands of people

----------


## Nirvikalpa

> are your watching cbs or fox? they are giving out this same info, cbs pulled up his facebook page live on the tv ...


RIGHT and everything the MSM pulls is obviously true... and they don't just jump the gun...

----------


## AngryCanadian

> how can this all be done with ONE shooter?? I don't buy that..


Apparently he didn't act alone on CNN i heard there was another person been arrested taken into custody, wearing black outfits. black facecovers.

----------


## donnay

> And now they are blaming Guns and Video Games how wonderful.



You know the socialists are kicking their heels because now they can use such a tragedy as an example.  Disgusting.

However, there may be a grain of truth to videos games and kids on mind altering drugs.

----------


## Rothbardian Girl

http://ronpaulproblems.tumblr.com/po...ize-a-shooting

----------


## Nirvikalpa

The news hasn't even gotten his age right yet...

----------


## gwax23

http://www.mediaite.com/online/is-th...nzas-facebook/

He says it wasnt him. Status updates saying it wasnt him. How did he become a suspect to begin with?

----------


## Danke

> Facebook is anti-privacy.  I do not have one for that very reason.

----------


## Deborah K

> ARE YOU PEOPLE $#@!ING KIDDING ME!?  *Stop trying to be your own god damn detectives.*  Stop posting people's personal photos and facebook pages.
> 
> "I LOVE PRIVACY RIGHTS... except for this guys, who no one knows is or is not the shooter yet" said a whole bunch of douches on this forum.


Really?  smh

----------


## Brian4Liberty

He killed his father too.

----------


## coastie

Paxil? Seroquel? Effexor? All three, maybe? Xanax "as needed"?  Miss his meds? Taking meds as prescribed? 

These are the real questions that should be going through everyone's minds, they are always the first questions that pass through mine.

----------


## dannno

> CBS is reporting that the mother of the shooter was found dead in her home in newtown, and she worked for the school.
> Father found shot dead in NJ.


Ahh, so there is a wife somewhere, no? Children? Was his child in that class or something?

----------


## Nirvikalpa

> http://www.mediaite.com/online/is-th...nzas-facebook/
> 
> He says it wasnt him. Status updates saying it wasnt him. How did he become a suspect to begin with?


People being detectives and doing a simple facebook search, feeling like heroes.

AS I SAID... just wait.  Don't be like the masses and jump the friggin' gun.

----------


## Philhelm

Edit:  Nevermind.

----------


## QuickZ06

> http://www.mediaite.com/online/is-th...nzas-facebook/
> 
> He says it wasnt him. Status updates saying it wasnt him. How did he become a suspect to begin with?


Reason 9443323427788434363 not to have a FedBook.

----------


## donnay



----------


## dannno

> 


Hah, poor kid

----------


## LibertyEagle

> RIGHT and everything the MSM pulls is obviously true... and they don't just jump the gun...


Yeah, you're right.  Sorry.

----------


## James Madison

> http://www.mediaite.com/online/is-th...nzas-facebook/
> 
> He says it wasnt him. Status updates saying it wasnt him. How did he become a suspect to begin with?


Thanks for the update.

----------


## RonPaulFanInGA

> ARE YOU PEOPLE $#@!ING KIDDING ME!?  Stop trying to be your own god damn detectives.  Stop posting people's personal photos and facebook pages.
> 
> "I LOVE PRIVACY RIGHTS... except for this guys, who no one knows is or is not the shooter yet" said a whole bunch of douches on this forum.





> 


Looks like a whole bunch of internet detectives and mainstream media types (pulling up his Facebook page on television) maybe have some apologizing to do...

----------


## Deborah K

> People being detectives and doing a simple facebook search, feeling like heroes.
> 
> AS I SAID... just wait.  Don't be like the masses and jump the friggin' gun.


Does it occur to you that it's the "goddamned detectives" that are getting to the bottom of this?

----------


## Czolgosz

lol

----------


## Philhelm

> I had a long drawn out psuedo explanation that had to do with mentalities of majorities of people identifying as Rep or Dem, but in the end it's collectivist thinking and wouldn't be helpful right now, even though might be kinda true.


Color me curious.

----------


## Nirvikalpa

> Really?  smh


Hope you're smacking it extra-hard now.

----------


## LibertyEagle

> Hah, poor kid


Oh man, I feel like a sleaze.

----------


## donnay

Newtown, Conn. School District Had Recently Installed New Safety Protocols

http://newyork.cbslocal.com/2012/12/...ety-protocols/

NEW YORK (CBSNewYork) — In the wake of the tragic school shooting in Newtown, Conn., that left more than two dozen people dead, including 18 children, CBS 2 has learned the school district had just installed a new safety policy designed to prevent situations such as what happened on Friday.

Photos: Newtown School Massacre

At approximately 9:41 a.m. a gunman opened fire inside Sandy Hook Elementary School. Early reports indicated one child and the gunman, who has not been identified yet, were killed, but later the horror of what actually took place started to come to the surface. It was later learned a second person connected to the massacre was taken into custody, but the specifics of who he is and how he was possibly connected to the tragedy were not immediately known.

The district took proactive measures to ensure the safety of students and faculty when it unveiled new safety protocols earlier in the school year, but it is unknown if school officials followed the new guidelines prior to the shooting.

Students were seen being escorted to a nearby firehouse in what was described as a very calm and controlled evacuation, a protocol that had been in place for some time, officials said. Hundreds of students and faculty members were reportedly met by dozens of emergency vehicles. Relieved parents then met their children at the firehouse and took them home, by car and even by foot.

CBS 2 has obtained the letter sent home to parents describing the new safety protocols:

Dear Members of our Sandy Hook Family,

Our district will be implementing a security system in all elementary schools as part of our ongoing efforts to ensure student safety. As usual, exterior doors will be locked during the day. Every visitor will be required to ring the doorbell at the front entrance and the office staff will use a visual monitoring system to allow entry. Visitors will still be required to report directly to the office and sign in. If our office staff does not recognize you, you will be required to show identification with a picture id. Please understand that with nearly 700 students and over 1000 parents representing 500 SHS families, most parents will be asked to show identification.

Doors will be locked at approximately 9:30 a.m. Any student arriving after that time must be walked into the building and signed in at the office. Before that time our regular drop-off procedures will be in place. I encourage all parents to have their children come to school and return home on the bus and to remain in school for the entire school day. The beginning and ending of our school day are also important instructional times and therefore we want all our students to reap the benefits of full participation in our program.

We need your help and cooperation for our system to work effectively. Our office staff is handling multiple tasks. Though they will work diligently to help you into the building as quickly as possible, there may be a short delay until someone can view you on the handset and allow you to come in electronically. There are times during the day when office personnel are on the telephone, addressing student concerns, or in the copy room; there are other times when only one person is in the front office. Please help our staff by identifying yourself and provide your child’s name.

Keep in mind we will be following our district guidelines which may need revision once we test the system.

Please know your involvement continues to be critical to our school’s effectiveness and your child’s success. We continue to encourage and value your presence in our classrooms and are counting on your cooperation with the implementation of this safety initiative.

Sincerely,

Mrs. Hochsprung

----------


## Brian4Liberty

The major news networks have been showing the wrong guy's face!

----------


## Nirvikalpa

> Does it occur to you that it's the "goddamned detectives" that are getting to the bottom of this?


LMAO.  Refresh honey...

----------


## Petar

> ARE YOU PEOPLE $#@!ING KIDDING ME!?  Stop trying to be your own god damn detectives.  Stop posting people's personal photos and facebook pages.
> 
> "I LOVE PRIVACY RIGHTS... except for this guys, who no one knows is or is not the shooter yet" said a whole bunch of douches on this forum.


Here is the alleged shooter signalling that you are "right on the money".

----------


## kathy88

I hop[e he sues the $#@! out of the media for putting his facebook out there like that.

----------


## CaptainAmerica

> Looks like a whole bunch of internet detectives and mainstream media types (pulling up his Facebook page on television) maybe have some apologizing to do...


 he should sue them for slander

----------


## Nirvikalpa

In all seriousness, the tweets can be fake.  It could be the kid.  It could not be the kid.  Innocent til' proven guilty... I'll wait it out.

----------


## Deborah K

> LMAO.  Refresh honey...


Uh....who figured out it wasn't Lanza?  NOT the media.  ROFL!!

----------


## tangent4ronpaul

> Hah, poor kid


poor kid?  try about to become wealthy kid!  What a lawsuit!

-t

----------


## libertygrl

> You know the socialists are kicking their heels because now they can use such a tragedy as an example.  Disgusting.
> 
> However, there may be a grain of truth to videos games and kids on mind altering drugs.


Video games are so realistic nowadays that I do believe they desensitize people to violence.  Look at the military drone program we've got going.  It's like a video game but it's assassinating REAL people thousands of miles away in other countries.  Think about it.  A generation of young soldiers grew up on these games.

----------


## AuH20

Daily Kos is melting down right now. sounds like they want water pistols banned as well.

http://www.dailykos.com/#

----------


## Antischism

Oh wow, of course the lamestream media was careless enough to plaster the kid's face and name all over the television before getting the shooter right. I feel terrible for having posted it. That kid must be pretty upset right about now, hah.

----------


## supermario21

His facebook has been taken down. I bet those images were a hoax.

----------


## gwax23

Fox new is still reporting this ryan as the guy. How can he update his status while supposedly being the criminal? Government conspiracy?

----------


## Deborah K

Let the "goddamned detectives" loose I say.  It'll work itself out.

----------


## Nirvikalpa

> His facebook has been taken down. I bet those images were a hoax.


Still up.  You must be logged on to see it.

----------


## gwax23

if anyone looked at his profile it seems very fake.

----------


## kathy88

If I was that kid I'd get the hell out of town NOW before some vigilante psycho starts stalking him.

----------


## COpatriot

Oh man they are gonna demagogue the $#@! out of this.

----------


## Brian4Liberty

Another false lead.

----------


## qh4dotcom

I've been reading a lot of comments about the tragedy and I have a question for you all.

How come many of you don't have the same reaction/don't speak out when the US military kills innocent children in the Middle East?

----------


## TER

> How harshly does a loving God judge an individual?
> 
> Or an entire nation?
> 
> We sow death and destruction worldwide for a 100 years.
> 
> What harvest will that bring?


According to the teachings of the Church, as we approach the end of days, the evil in the world will become stronger.  Satan will become more emboldened and his power in the physical world will strengthen.  The consequences of this will be seen in the turbulence in the world, politically, materially, and spiritually, as foretold by Christ.  As humanity rejects ever more the source of life which is God, and looks instead to this falling world for their means of fullness, hope and salvation, the evil in the world will find less restraint and grow more unimpeded in the hearts and minds of men and things like what have happened today will become more and more frequent.

You are right that the fruits of our actions as a collective nation is being displayed in today's shooting.  Maybe not easily discernible or directly obvious, but these are the fruits of a society estranged from God.  The sickness of this nation does not lie in the weapons of murder used by this sick and twisted individual, but in the hearts of such murderers.  And likewise the heart of this nation has been corrupted and continues to be corrupted even more so.  Our efforts politically and in community are needed and necessary, but unless we have as our correct aim righteousness with God and with our neighbor, according to the teachings and commandments of He Who was sent to save mankind, then our sliding into confusion and anguish will continue, and indeed it will.  Our hope as a nation is in God and as a nation in God we trust.  When we as a nation proclaim otherwise, then this nation will continue to be overrun by those in the darkness who have fought against the light since before our world was even made.

----------


## HigherVision

> Video games are so realistic nowadays that I do believe they desensitize people to violence.  Look at the military drone program we've got going.  It's like a video game but it's assassinating REAL people thousands of miles away in other countries.  Think about it.  A generation of young soldiers grew up on these games.


It seems like it but there's a Reason video about the topic & apparently youth violence is down overall over the past decades. I prefer the games from the 80's & 90's myself. All the great emulators that have been created.




> I've been reading a lot of comments about the tragedy and I have a question for you all.
> 
> How come many of you don't have the same reaction/don't speak out when the US military kills innocent children in the Middle East?


That's what came to my mind man. I was thinking about how selfish and self-centered Americans are that they consider this an unspeakable tragedy which is it but when it's hundreds of kids murdered via drone strikes it's 'fighting the terrorists'.

----------


## Anti Federalist

> Reason 9443323427788434363 not to have a FedBook.


Oh, god, this.

----------


## gwax23

> The real shooters twitter feed is still up. Doesn't look good. Depression and recent break-up?


Link to his twitter?

----------


## Antischism

Fox News is still using the guy's image and name on the television.

----------


## ronpaulfollower999

Second person taken into custody is the brother of the shooter. They don't know if he was there coincidentally, or not.

----------


## ronpaulfollower999

> I've been reading a lot of comments about the tragedy and I have a question for you all.
> 
> How come many of you don't have the same reaction/don't speak out when the US military kills innocent children in the Middle East?


True. 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...-campaign.html

----------


## coastie

> aNOTHER FALSE LEAD!?


Enter Big Pharma? Wonder if and what he was taking, not taking, recently stopped, etc?

----------


## ronpaulfollower999

His mother was a K5 teacher. So is my mother.

I don't know how someone can be so sinister.

----------


## UWDude

> I've been reading a lot of comments about the tragedy and I have a question for you all.
> 
> How come many of you don't have the same reaction/don't speak out when the US military kills innocent children in the Middle East?


I sure as hell do.  At least this kid didn't do it in my name for "freedom" and "democracy".
So I consider the murdered children in Afghanistan and Pakistan and Libya and Iraq far more infuriating.

----------


## Acala

> I've been reading a lot of comments about the tragedy and I have a question for you all.
> 
> How come many of you don't have the same reaction/don't speak out when the US military kills innocent children in the Middle East?


I would say that the participants on this board are more likley than almost anyone in the whole country to be equally upset about this tragedy AND our government murdering people with its double tap drone war.  In other words, what are you talking about?

----------


## Brian4Liberty

> Link to his twitter?


Another guy with the same name, who apparently is depressed after a break-up. Pure coincidence.

----------


## cbrons

> Video games are so realistic nowadays that I do believe they desensitize people to violence.  Look at the military drone program we've got going.  It's like a video game but it's assassinating REAL people thousands of miles away in other countries.  Think about it.  A generation of young soldiers grew up on these games.


They have "drones" you can handle in the new Call of Duty

----------


## belian78

> I've been reading a lot of comments about the tragedy and I have a question for you all.
> 
> How come many of you don't have the same reaction/don't speak out when the US military kills innocent children in the Middle East?


A lot of us do, in fact.

----------


## Anti Federalist

> I've been reading a lot of comments about the tragedy and I have a question for you all.
> 
> How come many of you don't have the same reaction/don't speak out when the US military kills innocent children in the Middle East?


I can't speak for everybody, but I certainly do.

In fact, I can't think of anybody who makes a bigger pest of himself over indiscriminate killings by government "officials".

----------


## James Madison

> Another guy with the same name, who apparently is depressed after a break-up. Pure coincidence.


Ban relationships! Go back to arranged marriage.

----------


## dannno

> Fox News is still using the guy's image and name on the television.


They aren't very good at using the internets over there.

----------


## gwax23

NOW his facebook is officially down. Im logged in and page is unavailable.

----------


## dannno

> I've been reading a lot of comments about the tragedy and I have a question for you all.
> 
> How come many of you don't have the same reaction/don't speak out when the US military kills innocent children in the Middle East?


I'm pretty sure this is not a good question for RPF and a much better question for just about everybody who doesn't support RP.

----------


## COpatriot

Another Prozac head maybe?

----------


## devil21

School psychologist, principal, shooter's own parent and the shooter was killed?  Hmm.   (second shooter reported early on....let's see if this one disappears like the other second shooters always do)

All of these "random mass shootings" of late (always with ARs) are really starting to reek of coordinated psyops.  Will these keep becoming bigger, more gruesome and more often until the gov't gets the gun bans it wants?    

Create problem - Wait for reaction - Offer solution 

Just terrible......smh

----------


## osan

> Another Prozac head maybe?


Would not be surprising.

Thus far, shooter is 24 and the son of one of the teachers at the school.  The mother of the shooter is apparently dead as well.


UPD: shooter's brother found dead in Hoboken NJ.

So lets get this straight - shooter kills mother, brother, shoots up school, then dies himself.  WTF?

UPD: CNN is laying it on really thickly.  I smell major gun control initiatives in the house.

----------


## Nirvikalpa

> NOW his facebook is officially down. Im logged in and page is unavailable.


I'd delete mine too.  I'd be on a bus or driving my car OUT right now if I was him.  Gives more support for the idea he was "on his way home," got home, and deleted.  Probably freaking out that his photo is now plastered on national TV.

Still waiting and seeing...

----------


## DerailingDaTrain

I'm not saying anything until we have all the information...

----------


## QuickZ06

> *I'm not saying anything* until we have all the information...


Irony.

----------


## Anti Federalist

Some will disagree.

I do not. These were calm truths, spoken in the midst of chaos.

Thank you.




> According to the teachings of the Church, as we approach the end of days, the evil in the world will become stronger.  Satan will become more emboldened and his power in the physical world will strengthen.  The consequences of this will be seen in the turbulence in the world, politically, materially, and spiritually, as foretold by Christ.  As humanity rejects ever more the source of life which is God, and looks instead to this falling world for their means of fullness, hope and salvation, the evil in the world will find less restraint and grow more unimpeded in the hearts and minds of men and things like what have happened today will become more and more frequent.
> 
> You are right that the fruits of our actions as a collective nation is being displayed in today's shooting.  Maybe not easily discernible or directly obvious, but these are the fruits of a society estranged from God.  The sickness of this nation does not lie in the weapons of murder used by this sick and twisted individual, but in the heart of this murderer.  And likewise the heart of this nation has been corrupted and continues to be corrupted even more so.  Our efforts politically and in community are needed and necessary, but unless they have as their correct aim righteousness with God and with our neighbor, according to the teachings and commandments of He Who was sent to save mankind, then our sliding into confusion and anguish will continue, and indeed it will.  Our hope as a nation is in God and as a nation in God we trust.  When we as a nation proclaim otherwise, then this nation will continue to be overrun by those in the darkness have fought against the light since before our world was even made.

----------


## Pericles

> Newtown, Conn. School District Had Recently Installed New Safety Protocols
> 
> http://newyork.cbslocal.com/2012/12/...ety-protocols/
> 
> NEW YORK (CBSNewYork)  In the wake of the tragic school shooting in Newtown, Conn., that left more than two dozen people dead, including 18 children, CBS 2 has learned the school district had just installed a new safety policy designed to prevent situations such as what happened on Friday.


I'm giving the school a failing grade on that.

----------


## gwax23

Obama giving a speech about incident. Expect anti gun rhetoric

----------


## erowe1

> Obama giving a speech about incident. Expect anti gun rhetoric


Expect irony.

----------


## erowe1

..

----------


## gwax23

> I'd delete mine too.  I'd be on a bus or driving my car OUT right now if I was him.  Gives more support for the idea he was "on his way home," got home, and deleted.  Probably freaking out that his photo is now plastered on national TV.
> 
> Still waiting and seeing...


Interesting point. I want to see how this plays out. If it wasnt him this was a $#@!up on a major scale by the mass media

----------


## Brian4Liberty

Obama crying on TV right now.

----------


## belian78

> Color me curious.


Lack of natural outlets for anger/agression which tends to manifest in violent outbursts vs hunting/fishing/rough-housing/camping lifestyles in regards to children brought up in typical liberal/democrat homes vs those brought up in typical conservative/republican ones.  That progresses into later in life where dealing with everyday stressors, in a majority of cases this means mind/mood altering drugs in the more liberal of americans vs being brought up releasing stress in constructive ways and not needing/taking said meds.  

But like I said, thats lumping a huge number of people into groups where, honestly there's probably a ton of crossover.  At the end of the day though, collectivism aside, it's not that shaky of a hypothesis.

----------


## Anti Federalist

> I'm pretty sure this is not a good question for RPF and a much better question for just about everybody who doesn't support RP.


+rep

----------


## seraphson

> Expect irony.


This. Exactly what I thought when I saw his face pop up on the TV. He isn't failing to deliver at all.

----------


## Philhelm

> Obama giving a speech about incident. Expect anti gun rhetoric


And false sympathy.

----------


## Acala

> Obama crying on TV right now.


He might have to take some time out to murder some children with a drone strike.  But that's okay.

----------


## tangent4ronpaul

the egotist n chief talking about "doing whatever is necessary to prevent this in the future" ... "politics be dammed"...

OH $#@!!

-t

----------


## brandon

I didn't read much of the thread... but can someone tell me if there is a conspiracy theory (or whatever you want to call it) on this yet?  Just curious

----------


## UWDude

> Lack of natural outlets for anger/agression which tends to manifest in violent outbursts vs hunting/fishing/rough-housing/camping lifestyles in regards to children brought up in typical liberal/democrat homes vs those brought up in typical conservative/republican ones.  That progresses into later in life where dealing with everyday stressors, in a majority of cases this means mind/mood altering drugs in the more liberal of americans vs being brought up releasing stress in constructive ways and not needing/taking said meds.  
> 
> But like I said, thats lumping a huge number of people into groups where, honestly there's probably a ton of crossover.  At the end of the day though, collectivism aside, it's not that shaky of a hypothesis.


Dumb ass.  God damn.

----------


## AuH20

I guess I'm going to drown my sorrows out at the local gun store today.

----------


## kathy88

> Obama giving a speech about incident. Expect anti gun rhetoric


I think he should set an example and disarm the secret service post haste.

----------


## AuH20

> the egotist n chief talking about "doing whatever is necessary to prevent this in the future" ... "politics be dammed"...
> 
> OH $#@!!
> 
> -t


Lincoln talked the same way.

----------


## erowe1

> I didn't read much of the thread... but can someone tell me if there is a conspiracy theory (or whatever you want to call it) on this yet?  Just curious


You have 12k posts and you have to ask this here?

----------


## libertygrl

> If your boss told you to go to a school, shoot up a ton of kids, and then let the cops shoot you to death - would you go along with that? Would anyone? That's just an unbelievable idea to float around.
> 
> If anything, it's some dude in a custody dispute (maybe on anti-depressants) that snapped.


It's possible.  But don't easily dismiss other possible scenarios despite how incredible it may seem. Have you ever heard of MK-Ultra?   Do the research and it won't sound so unbelievable. It certainly changed my whole persepective on things. These people have no idea what they are doing.  It's done by a combination of drugs and trauma based mind control.  It's really quite sick and evil.

----------


## belian78

> Dumb ass.  God damn.


Did you not see my earlier post where I said I didnt want to type it out, because it was collectivist and had no basis in reality?  No?  Didn't think so, please retract your claws, sir.

----------


## Philhelm

> Obama crying on TV right now.




What a masterful sociopath he is.

----------


## RonPaulFanInGA

> I didn't read much of the thread... but can someone tell me if there is a conspiracy theory (or whatever you want to call it) on this yet?  Just curious


Yes, of course.  Like the anti-gun crowd, they don't let a tragedy go to waste.

----------


## UWDude

> I didn't read much of the thread... but can someone tell me if there is a conspiracy theory (or whatever you want to call it) on this yet?  Just curious


many reports of two shooters.  If the story eventually claims there was only one, it is M.O., and yes, there will be conspiracy theories.

Supposedly, they have his brother, who was in camo and flak, in custody, found him in the forest outside the school.

----------


## Sola_Fide

"We must come together to prevent these kinds of tragedies."

----------


## Philhelm

> the egotist n chief talking about "doing whatever is necessary to prevent this in the future" ... "politics be dammed"...
> 
> OH $#@!!
> 
> -t


So he's going to shut down government schools?

----------


## Lucille

> the egotist n chief talking about "doing whatever is necessary to prevent this in the future" ... "politics be dammed"...
> 
> OH $#@!!
> 
> -t


Why do I suspect he doesn't mean arming school personnel?

----------


## Pericles

> Lack of natural outlets for anger/agression which tends to manifest in violent outbursts vs hunting/fishing/rough-housing/camping lifestyles in regards to children brought up in typical liberal/democrat homes vs those brought up in typical conservative/republican ones.  That progresses into later in life where dealing with everyday stressors, in a majority of cases this means mind/mood altering drugs in the more liberal of americans vs being brought up releasing stress in constructive ways and not needing/taking said meds.  
> 
> But like I said, thats lumping a huge number of people into groups where, honestly there's probably a ton of crossover.  At the end of the day though, collectivism aside, it's not that shaky of a hypothesis.


Seems reasonable to me.

----------


## UWDude

> Did you not see my earlier post where I said I didnt want to type it out, because it was collectivist and had no basis in reality?  No?  Didn't think so, please retract your claws, sir.





> it's not that shaky of a hypothesis.


everything about it is shaky.

----------


## Nirvikalpa

> many reports of two shooters.  If the story eventually claims there was only one, it is M.O., and yes, there will be conspiracy theories.
> 
> Supposedly, they have his brother, who was in camo and flak, in custody, found him in the forest outside the school.


Parents said it was a grown man, in camo, without a gun, taken from the woods.  Last I heard...

----------


## UWDude

> Seems reasonable to me.


liberals don't go camping?
conservatives don't medicate their kids.

Stupid.

----------


## belian78

> everything about it is shaky.


Please don't let your obsession with me spill into this thread, it's not needed.

----------


## Philhelm

> "We must come together to prevent these kinds of tragedies."


That sounds like it could be a Hitler quote.  Oh $#@!, I call Godwin on myself.

----------


## dannno

> Parents said it was a grown man, in camo, without a gun, taken from the woods.  Last I heard...


He very well may have woken up in the woods, dressed in camo, thinking "wtf am I doing here?!"

Suddenly agents grab him, pull him out of the woods and present him to the public.

----------


## UWDude

> Please don't let your obsession with me spill into this thread, it's not needed.


Dude, you wrote some stupid $#@!.  I called you out on it.  Don't take it personally, you aren't the only one on these boards who has written stupid $#@! and been called out on it.  Ask around, then drop your delusions of persecution.

----------


## Pericles

> liberals don't go camping?
> conservatives don't medicate their kids.
> 
> Stupid.


 Probably not out there with scary animals, only in approved camping areas that have been checked for insects.

----------


## Deborah K

> "We must come together to prevent these kinds of tragedies."


The only way to ever prevent these kinds of tragedies is to have a world filled with peace, prosperity, and freedom.

----------


## RonPaulFanInGA

> He very well may have woken up in the woods, dressed in camo, thinking "wtf am I doing here?!"
> 
> Suddenly agents grab him, pull him out of the woods and present him to the public.

----------


## donnay

> Video games are so realistic nowadays that I do believe they desensitize people to violence.  Look at the military drone program we've got going.  It's like a video game but it's assassinating REAL people thousands of miles away in other countries.  Think about it.  A generation of young soldiers grew up on these games.



Definitely, then compound that desensitizing with mind altering drugs and that is a recipe for a tragedy!

----------


## tangent4ronpaul

> The only way to ever prevent these kinds of tragedies is to have a world filled with peace, prosperity, and freedom.


and armed teachers...

-t

----------


## UWDude

> Probably not out there with scary animals, only in approved camping areas that have been checked for insects.


Have you ever gone back packing in the wilderness?  Have you seen the people out there when you run across them?  You going to tell me those are conservatives?

God, you people and your assumptions about "libruls".

----------


## Brian4Liberty

> Lincoln talked the same way.


Seems to be a pattern among old-school Marxists...

----------


## Philhelm

> Seems to be a pattern among old-school Marxists...


Using violence in order to impose their will?

----------


## Tod

I hope by the time I save up enough to buy an AR-15 or similar, they aren't banned.    Dang things are too expensive!

----------


## cbrons

> *UPD: CNN is laying it on really thickly.  I smell major gun control initiatives in the house.*


Yep, get ready

----------


## Brian4Liberty

Holy $#@!, they got the shooters name wrong!

----------


## UWDude

ABC has now decided it is time to talk about gun control.

"In a nation so adamant about the right to bear arms, but at the same time, the right of parents to protect their schools"

----------


## libertygrl

> the egotist n chief talking about "doing whatever is necessary to prevent this in the future" ... "politics be dammed"...
> 
> OH $#@!!
> 
> -t


I wonder if "whatever is necessary" is really a code for signing statements. Can Obama just bypass Congress and sign something to repeal the 2nd amendment?  He's done it before with other matters, hasn't he?  Is this "incident" the opening they were waiting for?   A horrific act on innocent gradeschool children which will undoubtedly get the public to cry out for gun restrictions.  Problem/reaction/solution?

----------


## ronpaulfollower999

> Holy $#@!, they got the shooters name wrong!


For real? What a cluster$#@!. 

I'm against government mandated blackouts, but journalist need to learn some integrity and not report every fart in the wind.

----------


## tangent4ronpaul

Shooter was in face Adam Lanza, Ryans brother.

Ryan is supposedly in custody now in NJ

firearms are changing from 2 handguns to 1 handgun and a M4 type of assault weapon.

-t

----------


## Philhelm

> Holy $#@!, they got the shooters name wrong!


Is it official that it isn't Ryan Lanza, or the Ryan Lanza as depicted on facebook?

----------


## ronpaulfollower999

> ABC has now decided it is time to talk about gun control.
> 
> "In a nation so adamant about the right to bear arms, but at the same time, the right of parents to protect their schools"


Meh. I'm convinced.


MK Ultra.

----------


## James Madison

> I wonder if "whatever is necessary" is really a code for signing statements. Can Obama just bypass Congress and sign something to repeal the 2nd amendment?  He's done it before with other matters, hasn't he?  Is this "incident" the opening they were waiting for?   A horrific act on innocent gradeschool children which will undoubtedly get the public to cry out for gun restrictions.  Problem/reaction/solution?


Right before Christmas, no less.

----------


## Brian4Liberty

> For real? What a cluster$#@!.


The guy they named on Facebook and Twitter may have been the brother of the shooter though. Hell of a way to find out your family is dead.

----------


## ronpaulfollower999

Citizens can't own guns, but that's okay. To protect you, we will station a TSA agent in front of every door and give you a full body pat down every time you leave your house.

----------


## Nirvikalpa

Media cluster$#@!.

Also now reporting the father is in CT (and I guess not dead)... not NJ, and found dead?

----------


## compromise

Obama will attempt to bring in the gun control after 2014. He has no voters to lose, 2012 was his last election. He was pretty much waiting for a shooting like this to happen after the election so he could use it as a political tool to help him (along with other things) win back the House in 2014. If the Democrats are successful, I expect him to bring in stringent gun control like that of Australia or Canada.

----------


## Dark_Horse_Rider

> Media cluster$#@!.


anything else on the " nun " ?

----------


## Brian4Liberty

> Is it official that it isn't Ryan Lanza, or the Ryan Lanza as depicted on facebook?


They are saying Adam Lanza now.

----------


## UWDude

> Citizens can't own guns, but that's okay. To protect you, we will station a TSA agent in front of every door and give you a full body pat down every time you leave your house.


Funny.

Realistic?  TSA at schools, molesting every kid every day.

----------


## UWDude

the point of a gun control law, if it happens, will not be gun control.  It will be to spark civil conflict.

----------


## Nirvikalpa

> anything else on the " nun " ?


Nope.  Still hearing things about a "purple/maroon" van still, no mention of nun.  As I said, it just came over the radio stream.

----------


## tangent4ronpaul

> Obama will attempt to bring in the gun control after 2014. He has no voters to lose, 2012 was his last election. He was pretty much waiting planning for a shooting like this to happen after the election so he could use it as a political tool to help him (along with other things) win back the House in 2014. If the Democrats are successful, I expect him to bring in stringent gun control like that of Australia or Canada.


fixed that for ya!

-t

----------


## supermario21

> Shooter was in face Adam Lanza, Ryans brother.
> 
> Ryan is supposedly in custody now in NJ
> 
> firearms are changing from 2 handguns to 1 handgun and a M4 type of assault weapon.
> 
> -t


I don't get it, assault weapons are illegal in New Jersey and CT, as well as NY I believe. How did he get it?!?!?!?!

----------


## Philhelm

> Obama will attempt to bring in the gun control after 2014. He has no voters to lose, 2012 was his last election. He was pretty much waiting for a shooting like this to happen after the election so he could use it as a political tool to help him (along with other things) win back the House in 2014. If the Democrats are successful, I expect him to bring in stringent gun control like that of Australia or Canada.


Which is why he is a sociopath.  He doesn't have the integrity to try to make the changes now, even according to his own misguided beliefs.  It's all about numbers.

----------


## ronpaulfollower999

So far on my Farcebook, no cries for gun control. Just prayers and sympathies.

----------


## Philhelm

> So far on my Farcebook, no cries for gun control. Just prayers and sympathies.


They're only Biden their time.

----------


## NOVALibertarian

Obama cried over this.  Can't wait to hear people claim that he "has a heart" or some variation of that.

Wonder if he cried over the children killed in his drone strikes?

----------


## Mach

> UPDATE: 3:25 P.M. EST
> 
> A law enforcement official says that Ryan Lanza's girlfriend and another friend are missing in New Jersey, according to the Associated Press.


This guy is getting posted as the shooter in places (facebook) and says...... "Everyone shut the $#@! up it wasn't me."


http://www.mediaite.com/online/is-th...nzas-facebook/

----------


## tangent4ronpaul

They are now saying 2 children transported to the hospital have died.  I don't know if that alters the totals.

-t

----------


## RonPaulFanInGA

> They are saying Adam Lanza now.


Quick, flame the Facebook page of the first Adam Lanza that pops up in search!

----------


## Nirvikalpa

Wait - why would Ryan Lanza (the NJ brother, I guess) be in custody... ?

Two room mates (of the Lanza bro) brought down and are now being questioned by police (in NJ), so says News12NJ.

----------


## Sola_Fide

> Wonder if he cried over the children killed in his drone strikes?


But those kids are brown and evil.  Our kids are white and delightsome.

----------


## seapilot

> and armed teachers...
> 
> -t


That is the real solution right there.

Arm at least half the teachers, VP and Principal and lives would have been saved. Its their responsibility to protect those children while they are in school. 

Another thing they could do, which many may reject here is to set up a perimeter fence and have armed security checking all guests and kids before they enter. Or get public officers to protect the schools during the day time when it is in session rather than setting up speed traps on the local highway.

----------


## tangent4ronpaul

The 2 that died in the hospital brings the count of dead kids to 20.

-t

----------


## Nirvikalpa

There's a Ryan Lanza, and Adam Lanza... names being thrown around.
Body found in NJ home, at first they said it was the father, now reports say the father is in CT alive...
Reports saying a girlfriend of one of the two is missing... 

wtf.

----------


## Nirvikalpa

> The 2 that died in the hospital brings the count of dead kids to 20.
> 
> -t


Devastating.

----------


## Noob

Turn Them Over: Feinstein Moves To Ban ALL Assault Rifles, High Capacity Magazines, and Pistol Grips

http://www.infowars.com/turn-them-ov...-pistol-grips/

http://www.inquisitr.com/411099/sena...no-exceptions/


 Defeat the H.R. 308 McCarthy Magazine Ban Bill

http://www.nagr.org/McCarthyBanPetition2.aspx?pid=ND1

----------


## Nirvikalpa

Now it's a person dead in a CT home... which may be the father.

----------


## cstarace

There isn't much that will put a wrench in my gut. This did it.

----------


## RonPaulFanInGA



----------


## tangent4ronpaul

> 


LOL! - I was just thinking of that, as a Sig pistol turns into an AR40...

-t

----------


## Brian4Liberty

> There's a Ryan Lanza, and Adam Lanza... names being thrown around.
> Body found in NJ home, at first they said it was the father, now reports say the father is in CT alive...
> Reports saying a girlfriend of one of the two is missing... 
> 
> wtf.


What happened to the shooter being the father of one of the students? Lol. 

Never believe the media.

----------


## Brian4Liberty

> The 2 that died in the hospital brings the count of dead kids to 20.
> 
> -t


Terrible.

----------


## twomp

It's a sad world we live in when we hear of 20 kids getting shot and killed yet the first thing we do is think about our guns. While most parents should be hugging their kids right now. Some of you are hugging your guns. NO THEY SHOULD NOT USE THIS TO TAKE OUR GUNS. 

But sheesh, by the way some of you here are reacting, you would think your guns means more to you then someone else kids. It almost Christmas folks. Have a little compassion today and go back to hugging your guns tomorrow. I guarantee you if one these kids were your kids, you sure as hell wouldn't be caring too much about gun control right now.

----------


## kathy88

> It's a sad world we live in when we hear of 20 kids getting shot and killed yet the first thing we do is think about our guns. While most parents should be hugging their kids right now. Some of you are hugging your guns. NO THEY SHOULD NOT USE THIS TO TAKE OUR GUNS. 
> 
> But sheesh, by the way some of you here are reacting, you would think your guns means more to you then someone else kids. It almost Christmas folks. Have a little compassion today and go back to hugging your guns tomorrow. I guarantee you if one these kids were your kids, you sure as hell wouldn't be caring too much about gun control right now.


FFS no one is minimizing the tragedy here. This is, however a political forum, and a big issue for most of us. My first thought was, of course, for the kids, and mine. But my second thought was "holy $#@! here comes the gun control freaks." I think many on here would cop to the same reaction.

----------


## gwax23

So now its Adam lanza his brother. What a $#@!up. This explains the facebook statuses from earlier.

----------


## belian78

> It's a sad world we live in when we hear of 20 kids getting shot and killed yet the first thing we do is think about our guns. While most parents should be hugging their kids right now. Some of you are hugging your guns. NO THEY SHOULD NOT USE THIS TO TAKE OUR GUNS. 
> 
> But sheesh, by the way some of you here are reacting, you would think your guns means more to you then someone else kids. It almost Christmas folks. Have a little compassion today and go back to hugging your guns tomorrow. I guarantee you if one these kids were your kids, you sure as hell wouldn't be caring too much about gun control right now.


You're quite naive if you think the gungrabbers are thinking this way.  They are most likely scrambling to see which filed away bill can be brought up the fastest and revised.

----------


## BSU kid

This is the nail in the coffin of the second amendment, even right leaning people will now favor gun control...just watch. Man those poor children, I feel for those families...little kids gunned down, man its sick.

----------


## dannno

> It's a sad world we live in when we hear of 20 kids getting shot and killed yet the first thing we do is think about our guns. While most parents should be hugging their kids right now. Some of you are hugging your guns. NO THEY SHOULD NOT USE THIS TO TAKE OUR GUNS. 
> 
> But sheesh, by the way some of you here are reacting, you would think your guns means more to you then someone else kids. It almost Christmas folks. Have a little compassion today and go back to hugging your guns tomorrow. I guarantee you if one these kids were your kids, you sure as hell wouldn't be caring too much about gun control right now.


The problem is that half of us believe that a small group of individuals caused this to happen with the specific intent of riling up society enough so they can pass legislation to take said guns.

Trust me, everybody is mortified, but when the other team is playing a different game than the rest of society, and they are playing against the rest of society, we tend to call out the perps and call out their sick game because that is the only way it will end.

Saying prayers and hugging your kids won't end this slaughter. Calling out the perpetrators and holding onto our rights is the way to end it.

----------


## Brian4Liberty

> It's a sad world we live in when we hear of 20 kids getting shot and killed yet the first thing we do is think about our guns. While most parents should be hugging their kids right now. Some of you are hugging your guns. NO THEY SHOULD NOT USE THIS TO TAKE OUR GUNS. 
> 
> But sheesh, by the way some of you here are reacting, you would think your guns means more to you then someone else kids. It almost Christmas folks. Have a little compassion today and go back to hugging your guns tomorrow. I guarantee you if one these kids were your kids, you sure as hell wouldn't be caring too much about gun control right now.


No doubt everyone feels and understands the tragedy.

----------


## UWDude

> It's a sad world we live in when we hear of 20 kids getting shot and killed yet the first thing we do is think about our guns. While most parents should be hugging their kids right now. Some of you are hugging your guns. NO THEY SHOULD NOT USE THIS TO TAKE OUR GUNS. 
> 
> But sheesh, by the way some of you here are reacting, you would think your guns means more to you then someone else kids. It almost Christmas folks. Have a little compassion today and go back to hugging your guns tomorrow. I guarantee you if one these kids were your kids, you sure as hell wouldn't be caring too much about gun control right now.


Thanks for the soap box speech.

We can talk about whatever we want.

And the anti-gun people are already talking.

----------


## Brian4Liberty

> FFS no one is minimizing the tragedy here. This is, however a political forum, and a big issue for most of us. My first thought was, of course, for the kids, and mine. But my second thought was "holy $#@! here comes the gun control freaks." I think many on here would cop to the same reaction.


That sums it up.

----------


## AuH20

> It's a sad world we live in when we hear of 20 kids getting shot and killed yet the first thing we do is think about our guns. While most parents should be hugging their kids right now. Some of you are hugging your guns. NO THEY SHOULD NOT USE THIS TO TAKE OUR GUNS. 
> 
> But sheesh, by the way some of you here are reacting, you would think your guns means more to you then someone else kids. It almost Christmas folks. Have a little compassion today and go back to hugging your guns tomorrow. I guarantee you if one these kids were your kids, you sure as hell wouldn't be caring too much about gun control right now.


We can't bring them back.

----------


## Noob

> You're quite naive if you think the gungrabbers are thinking this way.  They are most likely scrambling to see which filed away bill can be brought up the fastest and revised.


H.R. 308 McCarthy Magazine Ban Bill is one them.  Feinstein is going to put forward a new ban all assault weapons, high capacity magazines, and pistol grips soon.

----------


## UWDude

> It's a sad world we live in when we hear of 20 kids getting shot and killed yet the first thing we do is think about our guns. While most parents should be hugging their kids right now. Some of you are hugging your guns. NO THEY SHOULD NOT USE THIS TO TAKE OUR GUNS. 
> 
> But sheesh, by the way some of you here are reacting, you would think your guns means more to you then someone else kids. It almost Christmas folks. Have a little compassion today and go back to hugging your guns tomorrow. I guarantee you if one these kids were your kids, you sure as hell wouldn't be caring too much about gun control right now.


You hug your kids after every time you hear about a drone strike?

Honestly, my first thought was about the kids killed in drone strikes, and how nobody crying, including the man who orders their murders, ever shed a tear for them.

----------


## Anti Federalist

> It's a sad world we live in when we hear of 20 kids getting shot and killed yet the first thing we do is think about our guns. While most parents should be hugging their kids right now. Some of you are hugging your guns. NO THEY SHOULD NOT USE THIS TO TAKE OUR GUNS. 
> 
> But sheesh, by the way some of you here are reacting, you would think your guns means more to you then someone else kids. It almost Christmas folks. Have a little compassion today and go back to hugging your guns tomorrow. I guarantee you if one these kids were your kids, you sure as hell wouldn't be caring too much about gun control right now.


Nothing happens in vacuum.

*There is more to this than meets the eye, and you had damn well better be prepared for all out assault on ALL our rights, not just guns.*

This will enable TSA, DHS, the *entire police state apparatus* to ratchet up the control grid exponentially.

I said the same thing after 9/11, and I was right: "The loss of liberty over this event will last long after everybody has forgotten what even happened today".

----------


## Nirvikalpa

Ryan Lanza, the one of the facebook status/pictures before... is definitely the brother who was in NJ at the time, and has been taken into custody in NJ for questioning (they showed video of the police cuffing and escorting him, and it was definitely a match to the picture).  Horrible way to find out all of this happened... why they cuffed him, I don't know... seems a bit torturous.

----------


## tangent4ronpaul

Now saying father is alive.

-t

----------


## belian78

> Nothing happens in vacuum.
> 
> *There is more to this than meets the eye, and you had damn well better be prepared for all out assault on ALL our rights, not just guns.*
> 
> This will enable TSA, DHS, the *entire police state apparatus* to ratchet up the control grid exponentially.
> 
> I said the same thing after 9/11, and I was right: "The loss of liberty over this event will last long after everybody has forgotten what even happened today".


I said something along the same lines to my friends at the time, "This is going to be the justification for the $#@!ers in Washington to do everything they've wanted to do for years", and was admonished for my lack of sensitivity to the victims of the day.  Same ole Same ole

----------


## kathy88

I really wish they would all STFU until they verify their damn stories. This is criminal.

----------


## Nirvikalpa

... So who was the guy they caught in the woods?  Not the other brother, apparently... just an innocent, wrong-place, wrong-time?

Ryan Lanza, older brother, 24 - in police custody, in NJ.
Adam Lanza, younger brother, 20 - actual shooter, dead in CT.

----------


## RonPaulFanInGA

"TENTATIVE info: It’s looking like Adam killed both his mother and father, who were divorced and living in separate places, then went to the school where his mother was a teacher and slaughtered her entire kindergarten class. There are also reportedly a girlfriend and a friend who are missing. It’s not clear to me whether it is Adam’s girlfriend and friend, or his brother Ryan’s.

Also looking like Adam could not or decided not to get to his 24 year old brother Ryan, but instead carried his ID so that Ryan would be publicly blamed."

----------


## Austrian Econ Disciple

> It's a sad world we live in when we hear of 20 kids getting shot and killed yet the first thing we do is think about our guns. While most parents should be hugging their kids right now. Some of you are hugging your guns. NO THEY SHOULD NOT USE THIS TO TAKE OUR GUNS. 
> 
> But sheesh, by the way some of you here are reacting, you would think your guns means more to you then someone else kids. It almost Christmas folks. Have a little compassion today and go back to hugging your guns tomorrow. I guarantee you if one these kids were your kids, you sure as hell wouldn't be caring too much about gun control right now.


Our guns (E.g. defense) are more important than someone else's kids not only for the fact that without the population being armed, defense against tyranny is limited to politics and that always means tyranny triumphs which means more kids dead, or enslavement of the entire kid population. Never mind the fact that, I have a natural right to defend myself and someone else's kids never trump my rights. I'm really tired of 'the kids' argument. _ITS DEMAGOGUERY_. I just cannot stomach demagogues. 

No one likes to see loss of life, but in today's political world, it means political scumsucking opportunists and wretched State-ideologues will pounce on it like a lion on an antelope. It's them, not us, who have made it such a subject every time something like this comes up.

----------


## klamath

Unfortunately it is the 1st admendment that is the most at fault here. The press making school shootings the most dramatic thing a deranged person can do to show the world his hate. I am sure wheels are turning in the minds of other deranged persons at this very coverage. And no I am not advocating the repeal of the 1st admendment.

----------


## gwax23

> "TENTATIVE info: It’s looking like Adam killed both his mother and father, who were divorced and living in separate places, then went to the school where his mother was a teacher and slaughtered her entire kindergarten class. There are also reportedly a girlfriend and a friend who are missing. It’s not clear to me whether it is Adam’s girlfriend and friend, or his brother Ryan’s.
> 
> Also looking like Adam could not or decided not to get to his 24 year old brother Ryan, but instead carried his ID so that Ryan would be publicly blamed."


So thats how they originally identifed Ryan lanza? Adam lanza was carrying some ID of his? interesting.

----------


## dillo

All the shootings that were killing adults were not enough to sway public opinion.  Time to start killing children, no better way to sway public opinion.

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## Brian4Liberty

> I said something along the same lines to my friends at the time, "This is going to be the justification for the $#@!ers in Washington to do everything they've wanted to do for years", and was admonished for my lack of sensitivity to the victims of the day.  Same ole Same ole


MSNBC is calling to vote on gun control today. Never let a tragedy go to waste.

----------


## Anti Federalist

> The problem is that half of us believe that a small group of individuals caused this to happen with the specific intent of riling up society enough so they can pass legislation to take said guns.
> 
> Trust me, everybody is mortified, but when the other team is playing a different game than the rest of society, and they are playing against the rest of society, we tend to call out the perps and call out their sick game because that is the only way it will end.
> 
> Saying prayers and hugging your kids won't end this slaughter. Calling out the perpetrators and holding onto our rights is the way to end it.


Owe ya a rep.

----------


## tangent4ronpaul

Every time one of these things happens, I wonder why it couldn't have happened someplace more appropriate.  Say the Brady Campaign HQ...

They certainly have blood on their hands every time there is a school shooting!

-t

----------


## BSU kid

Anyone notice these shootings occur more often in liberal states with stricter gun control, I think that says something...what I'm not sure but there is something there.

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## gwax23

Thinsga re getting confusing. Father still alive, Mother WASNT killed in the school, but someone was killed at RYAN Lanzas apartment in Hoboken.

----------


## Deborah K

It will be interesting to learn what the motive was, if that's even possible.  Why little children?  Could it be linked to the drone bombings?  Does anyone believe that if it was, we'd ever be told?  Nope, not as long as a democrat is in office.  Nope. Nosiree.

----------


## itshappening

> MSNBC is calling to vote on gun control today. Never let a tragedy go to waste.


America is becoming an Ochlocracy

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ochlocracy

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## gwax23

and now the girlfriend of Ryan lanza (Supposedly the innocent one) is now missing.

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## twomp

> Anyone notice these shootings occur more often in liberal states with stricter gun control, I think that says something...what I'm not sure but there is something there.


Exactly! If this was some sort of "planned" conspiracy, why don't they target a state that has looser gun control laws? That way they can say, "hey! It's your loose gun control laws that CAUSED this?" 

I mean there's no way that this could be just some guy that fell off the deep end right? It HAS TO BE A CONSPIRACY!! Oh yah, it's sad the kids died too....

----------


## Philhelm

> It's a sad world we live in when we hear of 20 kids getting shot and killed yet the first thing we do is think about our guns. While most parents should be hugging their kids right now. Some of you are hugging your guns. NO THEY SHOULD NOT USE THIS TO TAKE OUR GUNS. 
> 
> But sheesh, by the way some of you here are reacting, you would think your guns means more to you then someone else kids. It almost Christmas folks. Have a little compassion today and go back to hugging your guns tomorrow. I guarantee you if one these kids were your kids, you sure as hell wouldn't be caring too much about gun control right now.


There is a difference between the concrete and the abstract.  From a concrete perspective twenty children, all of whom I have never met, were killed today.  If people truly grieved over every wrongful death that occurs with each passing day, we would not be able to function being paralyzed with despair.  To put it bluntly, on a concrete level, I really do not care that some people somewhere died somehow.

On an abstract level, I do care, since a great evil has been committed.  But this is not the same as though the event had directly impacted my life.  Essentially, on an intellectual level I understand that the act was atrocious, but on an emotional level I cannot truly be moved to grief.

Maybe I am just jaded and desensitized.  I will tell you this though:  the thing that I hate most about these events is the outpouring of staged grief and crocodile tears emoted from our media and politicians.  They do not care about such events as much as they lead us to believe, but it seems socially acceptable to play the game.

----------


## tangent4ronpaul

gun details changing again.  Now, apparently the glock and the sig did the wild thing, hatched a M40 which wasn't happy with it's sexuality and had an operation to become a M22.  So now there are 3 guns.

-t

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## UWDude

> Exactly! If this was some sort of "planned" conspiracy, why don't they target a state that has looser gun control laws? That way they can say, "hey! It's your loose gun control laws that CAUSED this?" 
> 
> I mean there's no way that this could be just some guy that fell off the deep end right? It HAS TO BE A CONSPIRACY!! Oh yah, it's sad the kids died too....


Doesn't AZ have open carry?
Isn't that where Gabby Giffords was shot, and a half dozen others killed?

----------


## devil21

> Anyone notice these shootings occur more often in liberal states with stricter gun control, I think that says something...what I'm not sure but there is something there.


Im not sure that's accurate.  Ft Hood TX, Giffords shooting in AZ, I remember one in Georgia or another southern state a few years ago at a factory/workplace, Colorado (twice) is full of gun owners and low restrictions, etc.

Im tired of listening to Dr. Drew on CNN droning on and on.  Guy has always been a blow hard and he's over the top today.

----------


## itshappening

> There is a difference between the concrete and the abstract.  From a concrete perspective twenty children, all of whom I have never met, were killed today.  If people truly grieved over every wrongful death that occurs with each passing day, we would not be able to function being paralyzed with despair.  To put it bluntly, on a concrete level, I really do not care that some people somewhere died somehow.


And Obama weeping about it when he sits in the White House situation room and orders drone strikes in Pakistan that kill children and then double dip and kill first responders, that's hypocrisy on a grand scale.

----------


## UWDude

> Im not sure that's accurate.  Ft Hood TX, Giffords shooting in AZ, I remember one in Georgia or another southern state a few years ago at a factory/workplace, Colorado (twice) is full of gun owners and low restrictions, etc.
> 
> Im tired of listening to Dr. Drew on CNN droning on and on.  Guy has always been a blow hard and he's over the top today.


Also, a large majority of the population lives in "blue" states.  So a large majority of the tragedies and crimes will happen there.

----------


## osan

> There isn't much that will put a wrench in my gut. This did it.


I can certainly see why.  There may not be too many things left in the world that people regard. Sacred, but children will always be that in my eyes.

----------


## UWDude

> And Obama weeping about it when he sits in the White House situation room and orders drone strikes in Pakistan that kill children and then double dip and kill first responders, that's hypocrisy on a grand scale.



He'll have to kill a couple dozen more muslim kids in response to the terrorist attack in Connecticut today.

----------


## LibertyEagle

It's the 24 hour news shows.  They salivate when these things happen, so they'll have something to talk about.  They will milk this for a long time.

----------


## mac_hine

We live in a world that is incoherent and spiritually broken. Evil has permeated our culture. Events like this will continue to happen until we learn to love each other. It goes deeper than banning guns or limiting access to certain guns.

A  study was done at the University of Hawaii which concluded that government was responsible for the death of 260 million people in the 20th century alone. The authors of the study coined the term, "democide".

Death and destruction have become common in our world. I think we need to engage in deeper and more meaningful discussions of big picture issues. Turn off the television. Don't listen to the propagandists in the corporate media or Government who use divide and conquer techniques to distract us.

Separate the signal from the noise.

Love each other.

~peace

----------


## itshappening

> He'll have to kill a couple dozen more muslim kids in response to the terrorist attack in Connecticut today.


If I was a terrorist i'd grab an assault weapon and go on a rampage. Why don't they do it? Aren't we supposed to be in a war on terror?

----------


## Lucille

http://www.lewrockwell.com/blog/lewr...es/128447.html




> What a travesty that there was not a single armed adult in that school in Newtown, Connecticut who could have stopped that murderous devil who killed more than two dozen people today.


Indeed.

----------


## RonPaulFanInGA

20 children dead = scrap the Second Amendment and ban guns.

Millions of children dead since 1973 = a woman's unalienable right.

----------


## LatinsforPaul

> And Obama weeping about it when he sits in the White House situation room and orders drone strikes in Pakistan that kill children and then double dip and kill first responders, that's hypocrisy on a grand scale.


Exactly, you can include most from the left on the hypocrisy.

----------


## devil21

How much msm coverage did yesterday's knife attack on 22 Chinese kids get?

http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2012...s&emc=rss&_r=0

Crazy people do crazy things.

----------


## twomp

> Doesn't AZ have open carry?
> Isn't that where Gabby Giffords was shot, and a half dozen others killed?


That is true but you still didn't answer the question. IF THIS event was a staged conspiracy with the intent being gun control. Why pick a state with one of the strictest gun control? Why not pick a state with looser gun control? Wouldn't that make the argument for gun control better?

----------


## twomp

> How much msm coverage did yesterday's knife attack on 22 Chinese kids get?
> 
> http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2012...s&emc=rss&_r=0
> 
> Crazy people do crazy things.


EXACTLY! CRAZY people DO CRAZY things and they don't need a gun to do it either!

----------


## James Madison

> 20 children dead = scrap the Second Amendment and ban guns.
> 
> Millions of children dead since 1973 = a woman's unalienable right.


Welcome to the mind of liberal Americans.

----------


## tangent4ronpaul

> A  study was done at the University of Hawaii which concluded that government was responsible for the death of 260 million people in the 20th century alone. The authors of the study coined the term, "democide".


It's prime travel season and a lot more than 20 kids will die on the roads today and never hit the national news, because they all didn't die together and at once.  They will have died because car travel is more dangerous than air travel and because their parents cared about them and refused to let them be radiated and molested.

Many of the kids that died in the school today, wouldn't have if the gvmt hadn't made it a gun free zone.

Thank you gvmt!  

-t

----------


## AFPVet

> Doesn't AZ have open carry?
> Isn't that where Gabby Giffords was shot, and a half dozen others killed?


No one was carrying there though. There was one across the street, but he didn't get there in time.

----------


## donnay

> Owe ya a rep.



Took care of it for you.

----------


## Pericles

> Nothing happens in vacuum.
> 
> *There is more to this than meets the eye, and you had damn well better be prepared for all out assault on ALL our rights, not just guns.*
> 
> This will enable TSA, DHS, the *entire police state apparatus* to ratchet up the control grid exponentially.
> 
> I said the same thing after 9/11, and I was right: "The loss of liberty over this event will last long after everybody has forgotten what even happened today".


Evil never sleeps, but on occasion, we do.

----------


## tangent4ronpaul

> That is true but you still didn't answer the question. IF THIS event was a staged conspiracy with the intent being gun control. Why pick a state with one of the strictest gun control? Why not pick a state with looser gun control? Wouldn't that make the argument for gun control better?


Because the shooter wouldn't have lived long enough to rack up a significant enough body count to be newsworthy?

-t

----------


## devil21

> EXACTLY! CRAZY people DO CRAZY things and they don't need a gun to do it either!


"We" don't like those Chinese people or those Muslim people so when bad things happen to them, it's NBD. /s

----------


## CaptLouAlbano

Don't know if anyone has mentioned this, but the one law in CT that needs to be changed which likely could have prevented this tragedy (or a least minimized it) would be to allow teachers and principles to carry.  That needs to be the stock answer for the knee jerk "we need more gun control" responses we are hearing today

----------


## donnay

Curiouser and curiouser:* Shooter carrying other person's ID, left 2 more guns in car* --*'We're drilling all the time, practicing all the time for these events'* -Mayor of Danbury, CT --'New school safety measures' had been implemented--and yet, a man dressed in military garb will a bullet-proof vest gained entrance? --Shooting took place at three diffrerent locations inside the school 14 Dec 2012

http://www.legitgov.org/Shooter-carr...-more-guns-car

----------


## twomp

> Because the shooter wouldn't have lived long enough to rack up a significant enough body count to be newsworthy?
> 
> -t


I highly doubt kids (K-4) in a loose gun control state like New Hampshire or so would be carrying around a gun to defend themselves. But to be sure, do teachers in states like Texas and New Hampshire carry guns to class? Anyone know?

----------


## alucard13mmfmj

Tragic... so many killings involving guns these days. I wonder what made people go crazy.

----------


## Pericles

> I highly doubt kids (K-4) in a loose gun control state like New Hampshire or so would be carrying around a gun to defend themselves. But to be sure, do teachers in states like Texas and New Hampshire carry guns to class? Anyone know?


Schools, hospitals, and sporting events are exceptions in TX - no carry permitted.

----------


## devil21

> I highly doubt kids (K-4) in a loose gun control state like New Hampshire or so would be carrying around a gun to defend themselves. But to be sure, do teachers in states like Texas and New Hampshire carry guns to class? Anyone know?


Probably a lot more guns available in cars or principal's desks or in a neighbor's home that hears the shooting starting, etc.  Just more guns all around.  No one is suggesting elementary kids are packing.  That's a strawman and a poor one at that.

----------


## kathy88

> Tragic... so many killings involving guns these days. I wonder what made people go crazy.


maybe the fact that most people work until April or May every year before they get to keep one penny they've earned. Then they try to exist on what's left, and the government has ruined the value of the dollar so they can't do it.

----------


## tangent4ronpaul

> I highly doubt kids (K-4) in a loose gun control state like New Hampshire or so would be carrying around a gun to defend themselves. But to be sure, do teachers in states like Texas and New Hampshire carry guns to class? Anyone know?


There was a principle that carried illegally in TX and stopped a school shooting in it's tracks.

The media didn't think it was newsworthy...

-t

----------


## UWDude

> That is true but you still didn't answer the question. IF THIS event was a staged conspiracy with the intent being gun control. Why pick a state with one of the strictest gun control? Why not pick a state with looser gun control? Wouldn't that make the argument for gun control better?


I didn't say it was a conspiracy theory.  I was just questioning your original assumption of argument.

----------


## devil21

> There was a principle that carried illegally in TX and stopped a school shooting in it's tracks.
> 
> The media didn't think it was newsworthy...
> 
> -t


If you have some link to this, it may come in handy very soon!  Please share!

----------


## tony m

Homeschool.

----------


## alucard13mmfmj

> maybe the fact that most people work until April or May every year before they get to keep one penny they've earned. Then they try to exist on what's left, and the government has ruined the value of the dollar so they can't do it.


It is unfortunate that gun bans will be coming sooner than we think with all these "attacks". I bet the shooter(s) is a white guy... Blame everything on the white, gun nuts. But ignore the gun totting gang bangers who get their firearms illegally most of the time.

----------


## tod evans

> Tragic... so many killings involving guns these days. I wonder what made people go crazy.



Scary thought process, please reevaluate...

----------


## tangent4ronpaul

> If you have some link to this, it may come in handy very soon!  Please share!


It's mentioned in a number of the anti-gun control papers and I think the book is "Death by Gun Control".  It happened 15-20 years ago.

-t

----------


## dillo

> Exactly! If this was some sort of "planned" conspiracy, why don't they target a state that has looser gun control laws? That way they can say, "hey! It's your loose gun control laws that CAUSED this?" 
> 
> I mean there's no way that this could be just some guy that fell off the deep end right? It HAS TO BE A CONSPIRACY!! Oh yah, it's sad the kids died too....


Except Chicago has some of the strictest gun controls in the country, and this happens every day except its black poor people, not rich white children.  Dont confuse what the media chooses what to report with what is actually happening

http://homicides.redeyechicago.com/

----------


## Acala

> We live in a world that is incoherent and spiritually broken. Evil has permeated our culture. Events like this will continue to happen until we learn to love each other. It goes deeper than banning guns or limiting access to certain guns.
> 
> A  study was done at the University of Hawaii which concluded that government was responsible for the death of 260 million people in the 20th century alone. The authors of the study coined the term, "democide".
> 
> Death and destruction have become common in our world. I think we need to engage in deeper and more meaningful discussions of big picture issues. Turn off the television. Don't listen to the propagandists in the corporate media or Government who use divide and conquer techniques to distract us.
> 
> Separate the signal from the noise.
> 
> Love each other.
> ...


Yup

----------


## mac_hine



----------


## anaconda

The 2nd amendment people need to immediately turn the tables on this argument. They need to appear stark raving mad that the governments are stripping them of the ability to protect themselves and their children. This should be touted as the complete fault of the government.

----------


## awake

Clearly there wasn't enough guns in that school. Not one adult in that school was an armed and responsible law enforcing citizen. Cue the blow hards, mouth pieces and political parasites who will step up on their soapboxes to make it even harder for people to defend themselves and loved ones.

The second amendment is the toughest nut to crack to would be totalitarians.

Watch for the psychological drugging aspect to pop out after the parasites get thier feeding time.

----------


## NC Liberty

This is a guy on my FB telling me what i said about Obama was wrong.  Notice how he backs down after I tell him the facts?


Uploaded with ImageShack.us

----------


## Kodaddy

I guarantee that if some nut pulled a gun on children while I was around, he wouldn't get off a second shot...

----------


## kcchiefs6465

> The 2nd amendment people need to immediately turn the tables on this argument. They need to appear stark raving mad that the governments are stripping them of the ability to protect themselves and their children. This should be touted as the complete fault of the government.


I am not in the business of touting 20 some odd murdered children for political purposes. $#@! the shooter, the government, and anyone who tries to gain political points through this tragedy.

----------


## kathy88

> This is a guy on my FB telling me what i said about Obama was wrong.  Notice how he backs down after I tell him the facts?
> 
> 
> Uploaded with ImageShack.us


i must have missed the part where he backed down.

----------


## devil21

OMFG

Cnn reporter just reported the guns he was carrying was a "Bushwhacker" and a "Sig Sowzer".  No $#@!.

----------


## Lucille

http://www.lewrockwell.com/blog/lewr...es/128458.html




> Tom:  On his program the other evening, Piers Morgan asked if the 2nd Amendment defenders thought shopping malls could be made safe from shooters if everyone who came into the mall was armed. This character misses the point: you wouldn't have to have anyone in the mall armed.  It would be sufficient - to dissuade a would-be shooter - that people were at liberty to carry a gun. If others might be armed - and thus able to resist his attack - this possibility would enter into his calculation of the benefits and costs of his planned action. (I grow weary of listening to those who fail to take into account John Lott's research on the topic.)

----------


## MoneyWhereMyMouthIs2

> That is true but you still didn't answer the question. IF THIS event was a staged conspiracy with the intent being gun control. Why pick a state with one of the strictest gun control? Why not pick a state with looser gun control? Wouldn't that make the argument for gun control better?


It would make it more likely to be stopped at the hands of someone who wouldn't put up with such $#@!.  More potential to backfire.

----------


## ronpaulfollower999

> Probably a lot more guns available in cars or principal's desks or in a neighbor's home that hears the shooting starting, etc.  Just more guns all around.  No one is suggesting elementary kids are packing.  That's a strawman and a poor one at that.


One of my principal's at a private school had at least one gun in his office.

----------


## Brian4Liberty

> OMFG
> 
> Cnn reporter just reported the guns he was carrying was a "Bushwhacker" and a "Sig Sowzer".  No $#@!.


As much as many people call for not politicizing this event, the media is going crazy on gun control right now. Try out CNN and MSNBC. Never let a tragedy go to waste.

----------


## tangent4ronpaul

Yes - John Lott is one of the people that brings up the TX principle that stopped a school shooting regularly.  Look up his writings.

-t

----------


## NC Liberty

> i must have missed the part where he backed down.


Not really back down but tried to change the subject

----------


## familydog

Heh, I bet none of the murdered children were home educated. 

I feel much more badly for the slain children than adults. No one forced the adults into those prisons.

----------


## UWDude

> I am not in the business of touting 20 some odd murdered children for political purposes. $#@! the shooter, the government, and anyone who tries to gain political points through this tragedy.


The American people could stop the mass shootings of children in the middle east.  Obama could stop it right this minute.  But the slaughter continues.  

I don't see any runny mascara over all the children these crying Americans have killed.

Americans need the truth shoved down their stupid throats until it bleeds out their $#@!ing eyes so they can finally see that their own tiny tragedies are nothing compared to the mass death and carnage they mercilessly inflict upon the world.

And if it takes someone ruining their little kleenex party over their own two dozen dead kids to make them realize they are mass murderers themselves, so be it.

----------


## MoneyWhereMyMouthIs2

> Clearly there wasn't enough guns in that school. Not one adult in that school was an armed and responsible law enforcing citizen. Cue the blow hards, mouth pieces and political parasites who will step up on their soapboxes to make it even harder for people to defend themselves and loved ones.
> 
> The second amendment is the toughest nut to crack to would be totalitarians.



Not really.  They used to say the 2nd amendment protected the others.  Where are the others now??

----------


## Deborah K

I just saw on Fux News a mother from the school who had never heard of the kindergarten teacher that is supposedly the killer's mother (who was also killed).  Is there any confirmation outside of the lamestream media that the killer's mother was in fact a teacher there?

----------


## anaconda

> I am not in the business of touting 20 some odd murdered children for political purposes. $#@! the shooter, the government, and anyone who tries to gain political points through this tragedy.



This is obviously a monumentally sad tragedy. To not rail with outrage against the self-serving and failed government policies that continually enable these shootings would be unfair to everyone who may, in the future, be put in harm's way with no way to defend themselves or the children whose safety they have been entrusted with. This is not the time for passivity while gun control lobbyists are working overtime writing new legislation.

----------


## Lightweis

Some of you guys with wild conspiracy theories this early, is pathetic.

----------


## chudrockz

> Some of you guys with wild conspiracy theories this early, is pathetic.


Was this not perpetrated by two (or more) nutjobs acting together? If so, it WAS a conspiracy.

----------


## ronpaulfollower999

My heart sank when I drove by a local middle school and saw the flags at half-staff.

----------


## devil21

Watching CNN is like watching a car accident.  You just can't look away.

Now there's a "forensic psychiatrist" on CNN stating that MORE unstable people should be taking psychotropic drugs to treat disorders. MORE!  Is she just horribly ignorant of the connections between psychotropic drug use and mass murders or is she running interference against the growing concerns about these drugs and the "conspiracy theories" surrounding them?  Im reminded of GWB's quick "Let us not tolerate conspiracy theories" comment right after 9/11.

----------


## kathy88

We will never know the true story. That makes situations like this automatic conspiracies. BTW an aside... $#@! the media interviewing kids.

----------


## tangent4ronpaul

This town has had a very low crime rate.  The last time they had a violent crime was in 2010.

I can't say the same for Hoboken...

-t

----------


## erowe1

> Was this not perpetrated by two (or more) nutjobs acting together?


You know more than anyone else if you know the answer to this.

----------


## Brett85

> The American people could stop the mass shootings of children in the middle east.


I'm as much opposed to the wars as anyone.  I want to bring all of our troops home from around the world.  But this kind of rhetoric is reckless in my opinion.  What evidence do you have that our military is intentionally engaging in mass slaughter of children in the Middle East?

----------


## UWDude

> My heart sank when I drove by a local middle school and saw the flags at half-staff.


And this pisses me off too!
What soldiers were killed in this?
Whitney Houston and dead kids should not get the flag flown half-staff for them.  It cheapens the meaning of it.
Why don't we just always fly the flag half-staff for every tragedy?

----------


## pcosmar

> My heart sank when I drove by a local middle school and saw the flags at half-staff.


All the flags here have been half mast for years.
I haven't seen them raised since I moved here in 2006. (Perpetual War)

----------


## UWDude

> What evidence do you have that our military is intentionally engaging in mass slaughter of children in the Middle East?


The hundreds of thousands of dead children is a pretty good start.

----------


## brushfire

> Except Chicago has some of the strictest gun controls in the country, and this happens every day except its black poor people, not rich white children.  Dont confuse what the media chooses what to report with what is actually happening
> 
> http://homicides.redeyechicago.com/


QFT

----------


## Brett85

> The hundreds of thousands of dead children is a pretty good start.


So you think that the leaders in our government just sit around and say, "let's figure out a way to murder thousands of children in the Middle East today."

----------


## pcosmar

> What evidence do you have that our military is intentionally engaging in mass slaughter of children in the Middle East?


Continuing Drone strikes against a people that never attacked us.

Equally as senseless as this event.

----------


## ronpaulfollower999

> We will never know the true story. That makes situations like this automatic conspiracies. BTW an aside... *$#@! the media interviewing kids.*


This. 

Why are the parent's letting them talk?

----------


## ronpaulfollower999

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...-campaign.html

168 children killed in drone strikes in Pakistan since start of campaign

----------


## Brett85

> Continuing Drone strikes against a people that never attacked us.


We weren't attacked on 9-11?

----------


## devil21

> So you think that the leaders in our government just sit around and say, "let's figure out a way to murder thousands of children in the Middle East today."


That would require that they actually care enough about who they kill to contemplate such a question.

----------


## Lucille

> I'm as much opposed to the wars as anyone.  I want to bring all of our troops home from around the world.  But this kind of rhetoric is reckless in my opinion.  What evidence do you have that our military is *intentionally* engaging in mass slaughter of children in the Middle East?


US Military Says Killing Afghan Children Is Fair Game
http://antiwar.com/blog/2012/12/04/u...-is-fair-game/

----------


## TER

> We weren't attacked on 9-11?


Not by children in Iraq.

----------


## Noob

> We weren't attacked on 9-11?


27 dead 2+7=9 

12-14-12 = 11

1+2+1+4+1+2 = 11

----------


## James Madison

//

----------


## devil21

I could be mistaken or just a coincidence but Im pretty sure I had a high school teacher named Nancy Lanza (shooter's mother's name) in northern VA.  I remember she had a couple young sons at the time.

----------


## AuH20

> US Military Says Killing Afghan Children Is Fair Game
> http://antiwar.com/blog/2012/12/04/u...-is-fair-game/


Lucille, we agree on alot of things but that is taken out of context. In a warzone, children are unfortunately used to inflict damage. It happened in Saigon and it happens in Afghanistan. If I'm patrol with my unit in a hostile zone and some kid runs at me with an undisclosed box, I'm going to double-tap him right between the eyes for good measure.

----------


## mac_hine

> All the flags here have been half mast for years.
> I haven't seen them raised since I moved here in 2006. (Perpetual War)


Yup. Just the other day I noticed the same thing. 

Why bother putting them back up? (perpetual war+societal decay)

----------


## MoneyWhereMyMouthIs2

> We weren't attacked on 9-11?



Please identify the children involved.  If you have information, come forward.

----------


## UWDude

> So you think that the leaders in our government just sit around and say, "let's figure out a way to murder thousands of children in the Middle East today."


It doesn't matter what generals mutter to themselves to justify their murdering of children.

----------


## LibertyEagle

> Just saw this on my facebook feed.
> 
> [IMG]C:\Users\Ian\Pictures\31605_10151301247429661_1894  360076_n.jpg[/IMG]


Nobody can see it on your hard drive.  Upload it to something like tinypic and link to the image there.

----------


## donnay

> 27 dead 2+7=9 
> 
> 12-14-12 = 11
> 
> 1+2+1+4+1+2 = 11




11 days before Christmas.

----------


## Brett85

> Not by children in Iraq.


I think the war in Iraq was a terrible idea as well, but I don't think we went into Iraq with the intention of slaughtering children.

I basically agree with everyone here that we need to have a non interventionist foreign policy.  However, I guess where I disagree is that I don't claim that those who disagree with me on foreign policy issues have evil intentions.  I think they have a point of view that I just respectfully disagree with.

----------


## mac_hine

> I'm as much opposed to the wars as anyone.  I want to bring all of our troops home from around the world.  But this kind of rhetoric is reckless in my opinion.  What evidence do you have that our military is intentionally engaging in mass slaughter of children in the Middle East?

----------


## twomp

> We weren't attacked on 9-11?


This interview was BEFORE 9/11. See for yourself, it is only 23 seconds long.

----------


## UWDude

> However, I guess where I disagree is that I don't claim that those who disagree with me on foreign policy issues have evil intentions.  I think they have a point of view that I just respectfully disagree with.


Rich people killing poor people for control of their resources is pure evil.

----------


## Acala

> I think the war in Iraq was a terrible idea as well, but I don't think we went into Iraq with the intention of slaughtering children.
> 
> .


There is no such thing as a war where the innocent are not slaughtered.  That is why moral people never, EVER go to war unless life or liberty are at stake.

----------


## libertygrl

> Another thing they could do, which many may reject here is to set up a perimeter fence and have armed security checking all guests and kids before they enter. Or get public officers to protect the schools during the day time when it is in session rather than setting up speed traps on the local highway.


I hate to tell you this, but I think they may have similar plans for that involving the TSA.

----------


## Brett85

> Please identify the children involved.  If you have information, come forward.


I don't support what we're doing in the Middle East, but to say that our purpose there is to kill as many children as possible is just irresponsible and diminishes the argument against foreign intervention.

----------


## AuH20

> I think the war in Iraq was a terrible idea as well, but I don't think we went into Iraq with the intention of slaughtering children.
> 
> I basically agree with everyone here that we need to have a non interventionist foreign policy.  However, I guess where I disagree is that I don't claim that those who disagree with me on foreign policy issues have evil intentions.  I think they have a point of view that I just respectfully disagree with.


Bingo. The military has objectives to complete. On the macro level, they don't create sinister plans to kill as many children as possible. The U.S. military isn't the modern reincarnation of Genghis Kahn's Golden Horde nor are they a "global force for good." Like I said, they are an enforcement unit. Collectively, they simply enforce policy, albeit often criminal policy.

----------


## TER

> I think the war in Iraq was a terrible idea as well, but I don't think we went into Iraq with the intention of slaughtering children.


No, we went to install our own puppet government and build a 1 billion dollar fortress.  And if innocent children died in the process (which of course would happen), then so be it.  This is pure evil and we should have no respect for it.

----------


## erowe1

> What soldiers were killed in this?
> ...dead kids should not get the flag flown half-staff for them.  It cheapens the meaning of it.


Cheapens it? Meaning soldiers' deaths are more valuable than kindergartners'?

----------


## tangent4ronpaul

> 11 days before Christmas.


7 days before the end of the world.

-t

----------


## Brett85

> There is no such thing as a war where the innocent are not slaughtered.  That is why moral people never, EVER go to war unless life or liberty are at stake.


Yes, but I simply said that our government isn't intentionally killing children in the Middle East, which is why that isn't a valid comparison to what happened at this school shooting.  The man who shot these children did so intentionally with no motive at all.

----------


## chudrockz

> I think the war in Iraq was a terrible idea as well, but I don't think we went into Iraq with the intention of slaughtering children.
> 
> I basically agree with everyone here that we need to have a non interventionist foreign policy.  However, I guess where I disagree is that I don't claim that those who disagree with me on foreign policy issues have evil intentions.  I think they have a point of view that I just respectfully disagree with.


Feel free to "respectfully disagree" with mass murder all you want. For my part, I'll call it (and those who defend it) what it is:  pure evil.

----------


## James Madison

> Nobody can see it on your hard drive.  Upload it to something like tinypic and link to the image there.


There we go.

[IMG][/IMG]

----------


## Brett85

> No, we went to install our own puppet government and build a 1 billion dollar fortress.  And if innocent children died in the process (which of course would happen), then so be it.  This is pure evil and we should have no respect for it.


Well, I think that abortion is pure evil, and I still try to have respectful debates with people who disagree with me on that issue.  I don't claim that those who are pro choice are evil people who support a mass slaughter of children.

----------


## erowe1

> There is no such thing as a war where the innocent are not slaughtered.


I'm not so sure of that. You can probably say that at least some nonmilitants have died in every war. But over history there seems to be a spectrum of tolerance for the killing of nonmilitants, with a lot of historical examples of wars fought with much less tolerance for it than is now taken for granted.

----------


## donnay

Second man wearing camouflage led out of woods in handcuffs, said 'I did not do it' (14 Dec 2012) A witness tells WFSB-TV that a second man was taken out of the woods in handcuffs wearing a black jacket and camouflage pants and telling parents on the scene, "I did not do it."

http://www.legitgov.org/Second-man-w...-did-not-do-it

----------


## TER

> Well, I think that abortion is pure evil, and I still try to have respectful debates with people who disagree with me on that issue.  I don't claim that those who are pro choice are evil people who support a mass slaughter of children.


I am not suggesting you should not have debates with people and be respectful.  Be respectful to the person, but have no respect to the evil they have attached themselves to.

----------


## UWDude

> I don't support what we're doing in the Middle East, but to say that our purpose there is to kill as many children as possible is just irresponsible and diminishes the argument against foreign intervention.


Doesn't matter if that is the purpose or not.  The wars are evil.  The killing of children in those wars or evil.  If the purpose is to rape, rob and pillage, and children are killed along the way, doesn't make it any less evil.

The point is PERSPECTIVE.  CONTEXT.

Twenty murdered kids is just another day at the office for the pentagon. 

But where are the tears for them?  Where are the flags at half mast for them?  
Where are the hour long specials with soft guitar music and sobbing parents holding school pictures for them?
Where is the in depth analysis with wolf blitzer and Andersen Cooper for them?

Oh, that's right, there is none.

BECAUSE ONLY DEAD AMERICAN KIDS ARE A TRAGEDY.

----------


## ronpaulfollower999

> Second man wearing camouflage led out of woods in handcuffs, said 'I did not do it' (14 Dec 2012) A witness tells WFSB-TV that a second man was taken out of the woods in handcuffs wearing a black jacket and camouflage pants and telling parents on the scene, "I did not do it."
> 
> http://www.legitgov.org/Second-man-w...-did-not-do-it


I had assumed that was the older brother, no?

----------


## UWDude

> The man who shot these children did so intentionally with no motive at all.


So?  That's your argument, and I am glad you feel proud of it.

Doesn't change the fact Americans have killed way more than 20 kids a week.

And most of them are pretty happy with it.

----------


## donnay

> I had assumed that was the older brother, no?



No, not from my understanding.


4:52 p.m: Ryan Lanza, 24, brother of  gunman Adam Lanza, 20, tells authorities that his younger brother is autistic, or has Asperger syndrome and a “personality disorder.”  Neighbors described the younger man to ABC as “odd” and displaying characteristics associated with obsessive-compulsive disorder.

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headline...hool-shooting/


Rest assured in the next coming hours, days and week we will hear he had to have anti-psychotic drugs to help with his OCD.

ETA: 
It's starting to sound like a "Lone nut" story.

----------


## libertygrl

Thought it would be a good idea to check out an independent news outlet. This is from RT:


A gunman has gone on a shooting spree in a Connecticut elementary school, killing at least 26 people, among them 20 children in what has become one of the deadliest shootings in US history.

Dec. 14, 17:20 ET: The suspected shooter, Adam Lanza, is autistic, or has aspergers syndrome and a personality disorder, his elder brother Adam Lanza told authorities, ABC reports.

Dec. 14, 17:03 ET: One person was injured in Connecticut school shooting, police say.

Dec. 14, 16:56 ET:
A Glock and a Sig Sauer pistols belonging to the gunman were found inside the school, a law enforcement official told AP on condition of anonymity. Also, a .223-caliber rifle was found in the back of Nancy Lanzas car, which her son used to drive to the school.

Dec. 14, 16:50 ET: The total death toll in Connecticut stands at 28, police say. This includes 20 children and six adults killed at the school, the suspected attacker and an adult victim at the second scene in Connecticut.

Dec. 14, 16:21 ET: A law enforcement official has confirmed that the suspect in the Connecticut school shootings is 20-year-old Adam Lanza  AP. His brother, Ryan Lanza is being questioned by police. Nancy Lanza, a teacher at the Sandy Hook Elementary School, has been identified as his mother  WCBS-TV.

Dec. 14, 16:18 ET: Investigators believe the mother was the suspects primary target, but its thought to have come with clear intention of mass killing, CNN says.

Dec. 14, 16:10 ET: Law officials confirm that the Connecticut school shooting suspect is a 20-year-old son of a teacher  AP.

Dec. 14, 16:04 ET: The shooting suspect is no longer identified as Ryan Lanza, CNN says. The attacker could have been carrying his older brother's ID, according to NBC News. Police however have not yet released the suspect's identity.

Dec. 14, 15:51 ET: Twenty children and six adults pronounced dead at school, area, Connecticut police say.

Dec. 14, 15:41 ET: Connecticut Governor Malloy: "Perpetrator of crime is dead, as is a person perpetrator lived."

Dec. 14, 15:30 ET:  President Obama said the country's leaders must "take meaningful action" regardless of politics, in response to the mass shooting at a Connecticut elementary school. The president had apparent difficulty speaking and used his index finger to wipe at the corner of his eyes.

Dec. 14, 15:23 ET: The younger brother of the suspect in the Connecticut shooting is being held for questioning, as a possible second shooter, AP quoted a law enforcement official as saying.

Dec. 14, 15:20 ET: "While nothing can fill the space of a lost child or loved one, all of us can extend a hand to those of us in need"  Obama said in an emotional statement on the Connecticut school shooting.

Dec. 14, 15:17 ET: President Obama: "Our hearts are broken today."

Dec. 14, 15:12 ET: Robert Licata told the AP his son aged just 6 was in class when the gunman burst in and shot the teacher. "That's when my son grabbed a bunch of his friends and ran out the door," he said. The shooter didn't say a word, Licata added.

Dec. 14, 15:09 ET:  Flags on Capitol Hill have been ordered to be flown at half staff through sunset on December 18
.
Dec. 14, 15:00 ET:  SIG and Glock pistols were found at Sandy Hook Elementary School, while a Bushmaster rifle was found in the suspect's vehicle, law enforcement officials tell WCBS-TV.

Dec. 14, 14:57 ET: The suspect's younger brother has been held  AP source.

Dec. 14, 14:51 ET: President Obama to make a statement about the Newtown school shooting at 15:15 ET (20:15 GMT). This will be followed shortly by Gov. Malloy's press conference.

Dec. 14, 14:43 ET: The shooting happened quickly and happened in a concentrated area, police tell CNN.

Dec. 14, 14:37 ET: Many of the victims appear to be the students of the suspected gunman's mother  WCBS-TV.

Dec. 14, 14:26 ET: All public and private schools in Newtown are on lockdown.

Dec. 14, 14:23 ET: The suspected gunman's mother, Nancy Lanza, was a teacher at the elementary school, reports CBS News. She is among those killed.
Dec. 14, 14:22 ET: CNN quoting a law enforcement official: The suspect is named Ryan Lanza, 24.

Dec. 14, 14:15 ET: Child victims were aged 5-10.

Dec. 14, 14:11 ET: NBC: A parent of the suspected shooter has been found dead at a home in New Jersey.

Dec. 14, 14:10 ET:
The death toll in the Newtown school shooting is approaching 30, a source tells CNN. Most of them are children.

Dec. 14, 14:06 ET: The suspected shooter might have murdered someone else before going to the elementary school, a new report by CBS News suggests. A dead body has been found in his house.

Dec. 14, 13:54 ET: The suspected shooter was armed with four weapons. He was wearing a bullet proof vest  WABC.

Dec. 14, 13:49 ET: President Barack Obama is receiving updates on the incident, will comment later in the day.

Dec. 14, 13:44 ET: "The scene is secure. Public is not in danger", Conn. State Police's Lt. Vance told a press conference in the wake of the shooting. However, he only confirmed "several fatalities, both students and staff" and "the shooter is deceased inside the school building." The death toll will be released after all the affected families are notified.

Dec. 14, 13:40 ET: Connecticut Gov. Malloy is now meeting with the families, Connecticut Governors senior adviser Roy Occhiogrosso said at a press conference.

Dec. 14, 13:31 ET: Children had to hide in the school's gym until the police came to pick them up and take to the firehouse. Parents continue picking up their kids from the designated safe zone, reveals CNN.

http://h ttp://rt.com/usa/news/sandy...e-updates-091/

----------


## pcosmar

> We weren't attacked on 9-11?


Not by Iraq or any Iraqis.
Not by Afghanistan or by any Afghans 
Not by Pakistan or any Pakis 
Not by Libya nor any Libyans 
Not by Syria,, or Iran,,,,

----------


## libertygrl

> No, not from my understanding.
> 
> 
> 4:52 p.m: Ryan Lanza, 24, brother of  gunman Adam Lanza, 20, tells authorities that his younger brother is autistic, or has Asperger syndrome and a personality disorder.  Neighbors described the younger man to ABC as odd and displaying characteristics associated with obsessive-compulsive disorder.
> 
> http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headline...hool-shooting/
> 
> 
> Rest assured in the next coming hours, days and week we will hear he had to have anti-psychotic drugs to help with his OCD.


I'm not pro-pharmacuticals by any means, but my nephew who is under the autistic spectrum is on a low dose of an anxiety medication.  He's been on it for many years and it's helped him temendously.  My sister didn't want to do it, but she researched it carefully and it has helped with the anxiousnous that these kids go through. So in some cases, the medication is a necessity.  Wonder what kind of meds this kid might have been on. Did he have a personality disorder because he was born that way, or was it the drugs?

----------


## alucard13mmfmj

> Not by Iraq or any Iraqis.
> Not by Afghanistan or by any Afghans 
> Not by Pakistan or any Pakis 
> Not by Libya nor any Libyans 
> Not by Syria,, or Iran,,,,


Heh. 9/11 terrorists kinda won. destroyed USA financially and took away our freedoms indirectly. I will humor MSM, terrorists are after our freedoms so our government took away our freedoms to safekeep it =p....

----------


## donnay

abc/cbs Conn local:  Mother found shot to death at home, not at the school.

http://betaplayer.radio.com/player/1080-wtic-newstalk

Sandy Hook School Shooter's Mother Found Dead at Home
http://www.housatonictimes.com/artic...1451531780.txt

----------


## Brett85

> Not by Iraq or any Iraqis.
> Not by Afghanistan or by any Afghans 
> Not by Pakistan or any Pakis 
> Not by Libya nor any Libyans 
> Not by Syria,, or Iran,,,,


But we were attacked by Al-Quaeda, and we are specifically targeting members of Al-Quaeda with the drone bombings.  I don't personally believe that it makes sense to have a perpetual drone war in the Middle East 12 years after 9-11.  I don't believe that it's realistic to have a "global war on terror" with no clear ending.  I don't believe that a military response to the 9-11 attacks should last perpetually.  But having said that, I still don't think it's accurate to say that we're targeting people who never attacked us.  The purpose of the drone bombings is to kill the members of the terrorist organization who attacked us on 9-11.  But, I just think it's naive to think that we can have perpetual military action overseas as a result of one terrorist attack on our soil.  The response to the 9-11 attacks needed to be more short and swift, rather than turning into the perpetual conflict that we have today.

----------


## libertygrl

Alright folks. Don't get mad but here's another perspective.  You don't have to believe it.  But just store it away on the back burner. I like to take in all persepectives.  But AJ's right about what's been happening over the past few weeks in the media:

----------


## erowe1

> we are specifically targeting members of Al-Quaeda with the drone bombings


But doesn't "member of Al Quaeda" just depend on whatever arbitrary criteria they want to use to define whatever Al Quaeda is supposed to be?

That seems kind of like attacking all members of militias (whatever those might be) after some members of a militia committed some crime.

----------


## erowe1

> Thought it would be a good idea to check out an independent news outlet. This is from RT:


That's not an independent news outlet.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RT_(TV_network)

----------


## cbrons

*LIVE SPECIAL TRANSMISSION to cover the Connecticut Elementary School Massacre, starts at 6pm central/7pm eastern - tune in: www.libertymovementradio.com - call in number: (310) 388-9718*

Alex Jones is right at least about this, they are going to use this to take more of your human rights away if they can. Opportunities like this don't come often. Go ahead and read your facebook home page and just look at how brainwashed most people are.

----------


## Brett85

> But doesn't "member of Al Quaeda" just depend on whatever arbitrary criteria they want to use to define whatever Al Quaeda is supposed to be?
> 
> That seems kind of like attacking all members of militias (whatever those might be) after some members of a militia committed some crime.


That may be true, but my point is simply that the purpose of the drone bombings isn't to kill innocent children in foreign countries.  That's why I just don't think comparing that to what happened in New Jersey is really a valid comparison.  There are children who are inadvertently killed as a result of the drone bombings overseas, and that's one reason why I believe it's a bad idea to have a perpetual drone war in the Middle East.  But, I don't view it as being the same as someone who intentionally massacres a group of children.

----------


## libertygrl

Dudes, something has been going on with YouTube.  A few times today I was looking up some videos. I would do a search and when I get to the page, the video is gone. It's black and it has no controls at the bottom.  I just copied the code to post this video here, but now it's gone from YouTube!  It's just a black screen.  Anyone notice this today?  Try looking up some controversial stuff.

----------


## libertygrl

> That's not an independent news outlet.
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RT_(TV_network)


I should have said alternative.  They do report things that our media never covers.

----------


## Vanilluxe

20 children dead and 6 adults as well.  Right now I believe that we should be mourning and not politicalizing this. It is disrespectful.

----------


## Brett85

> 20 children dead and 6 adults as well.  Right now I believe that we should be mourning and not politicalizing this. It is disrespectful.


I agree.

----------


## tangent4ronpaul

> But doesn't "member of Al Quaeda" just depend on whatever arbitrary criteria they want to use to define whatever Al Quaeda is supposed to be?
> 
> That seems kind of like attacking all members of militias (whatever those might be) after some members of a militia committed some crime.


It's a strategy that is never presented to us as such, rather we are told it's an organization.

-t

----------


## donnay

> Alright folks. Don't get mad but here's another perspective.  You don't have to believe it.  But just store it away on the back burner. I like to take in all persepectives.  But AJ's right about what's been happening over the past few weeks in the media:



+Rep

He has been spot on!  I would only wish he was wrong, but the handwriting is on the wall folks!

----------


## Anti-Neocon

> 20 children dead and 6 adults as well.  Right now I believe that we should be mourning and not politicalizing this. It is disrespectful.


I don't see why it should be seen as disrespectful to talk about different policies, and whether or not they'd save lives in the future.

----------


## Jordan

> Alright folks. Don't get mad but here's another perspective.  You don't have to believe it.  But just store it away on the back burner. I like to take in all persepectives.  But AJ's right about what's been happening over the past few weeks in the media:


I think I officially hate Alex Jones.

----------


## alucard13mmfmj

I can already tell you that most of my asian/liberal friends want to ban guns =s...

----------


## erowe1

> That may be true, but my point is simply that the purpose of the drone bombings isn't to kill innocent children in foreign countries.  That's why I just don't think comparing that to what happened in New Jersey is really a valid comparison.  There are children who are inadvertently killed as a result of the drone bombings overseas, and that's one reason why I believe it's a bad idea to have a perpetual drone war in the Middle East.  But, I don't view it as being the same as someone who intentionally massacres a group of children.


That's true. There's a rationalization a person can do when they don't see their target and they convince themselves they're going after terrorists. A person who points a gun at a kindergartner and pulls the trigger, and then, when that one dies, does it over and over again to others, has something else going on in their head.

----------


## anaconda

> 20 children dead and 6 adults as well.  Right now I believe that we should be mourning and not politicalizing this. It is disrespectful.


It's disrespectful to sit silently while the government continually enables these incidences. Our silence enables further incidences. I will leave the "mourning" to the people that actually knew the victims and/or the families and friends. I don't think fighting for freedom and self reliance is "politicizing."

----------


## AuH20

> I think I officially hate Alex Jones.


He's right though. Obama has been caught blatantly lying hundreds of times. He preys on emotional moments to sink his claws deeper. He's an expert politician.

----------


## libertygrl

> 20 children dead and 6 adults as well.  Right now I believe that we should be mourning and not politicalizing this. It is disrespectful.


I respect your view. But sometimes these discussions are a way of trying to make sense of something so senseless and tragic.  For me personally, it's too terrible to focus on these innocent children being killed so violently so I guess it's like a coping mechanism to want to find answers.

----------


## Vanilluxe

> I respect your view. But sometimes these discussions are a way of trying to make sense of something so senseless and tragic.  For me personally, it's too terrible to focus on these innocent children being killed so violently so I guess it's like a coping mechanism to want to find answers.


Growing up and living in San Francisco taught me values of empathy and respectfulness for others around you.

----------


## Vanilluxe

> I respect your view. But sometimes these discussions are a way of trying to make sense of something so senseless and tragic.  For me personally, it's too terrible to focus on these innocent children being killed so violently so I guess it's like a coping mechanism to want to find answers.


Growing up and living in San Francisco taught me values of empathy and respectfulness for others around you.

----------


## Vanilluxe

> I respect your view. But sometimes these discussions are a way of trying to make sense of something so senseless and tragic.  For me personally, it's too terrible to focus on these innocent children being killed so violently so I guess it's like a coping mechanism to want to find answers.


Growing up and living in San Francisco taught me values of empathy and respectfulness for others around you.  I understand your pov.

----------


## osan

> It's a sad world we live in when we hear of 20 kids getting shot and killed yet the first thing we do is think about our guns. While most parents should be hugging their kids right now. Some of you are hugging your guns. NO THEY SHOULD NOT USE THIS TO TAKE OUR GUNS.


Nonsense.  There is plenty of cause for concern because it is precisely this sort of event that serves as pretext for confiscation, prohibition, and criminalization.

That some have immediately  raised the concern does not lead rational man to conclude that such persons care more about their guns than those  poor children and their families.  To suggest otherwise seems to me very cynical or  simply clued out.




> But sheesh, by the way some of you here are reacting, you would think your guns means more to you then someone else kids. It almost Christmas folks. Have a little compassion today and go back to hugging your guns tomorrow. I guarantee you if one these kids were your kids, you sure as hell wouldn't be caring too much about gun control right now.


You cannot be serious. This smells like troll dung.

----------


## Vanilluxe

Forgive my triple posting.

----------


## twomp

> That may be true, but my point is simply that the purpose of the drone bombings isn't to kill innocent children in foreign countries.  That's why I just don't think comparing that to what happened in New Jersey is really a valid comparison.  There are children who are inadvertently killed as a result of the drone bombings overseas, and that's one reason why I believe it's a bad idea to have a perpetual drone war in the Middle East.  But, I don't view it as being the same as someone who intentionally massacres a group of children.


You are talking about INTENTIONS. We are talking about RESULTS. This shooter and the US government had different intentions but the results were pretty similar. It resulted in dead kids. That is the problem here.

If you want to talk about intentions, then I would say that the people who want to support Obama care and all that other stuff have good intentions too! For that matter, I would say the people who want guns to be banned have good INTENTIONS too! They don't want more shootings. But the results of those INTENTIONS are that the rest of us will lose our 2nd amendment rights.They want health care for everyone but the results of these intentions aren't that good now are they?

So defend the US government's INTENTIONS all you want but the results speak for themselves. That is the issue here. We aren't attacking their INTENTIONS. I'm sure most of us here have no love for Al Qaeda but the results of these INTENTIONS have been terrible.

----------


## MoneyWhereMyMouthIs2

> Yes, but I simply said that our government isn't intentionally killing children in the Middle East, which is why that isn't a valid comparison to what happened at this school shooting.  The man who shot these children did so intentionally with no motive at all.



It is not exactly the same.  It is close enough for me to be equally repulsed by both.  I could expand, but I think that's enough.

----------


## James Madison

Murderers are hated, scorned, unless they kill to the decree of kings and to the sound of trumpets.

----------


## AuH20

So it sounds like Lanza only used handguns in the attack. They found the Bushmaster in the trunk apparently.

----------


## devil21

Where did the information that Adam Lanza is autistic/Aspergers come from?  Seemed to just kinda appear out of nowhere in the media cycle, as if it were just a "declaration".  There was just an interview with a classmate of Lanza on CNN who said he was just a normal kid.  Nothing out of the ordinary.  Autistic/Aspergers kids are not known for being "normal".  I don't like this rush to classify him that.  

I know based on personality profile threads here that many of the members of this forum would be classified as mildly/high-functioning autistics due to the high amount of INTJs and similar classifications based on the Myers-Briggs scale.  If this autistic/Aspergers thing gains steam, it's something to watch.

----------


## awake

When Obama sheads a tear you're about to have your liberties assaulted.

----------


## LibertyEagle

> I think I officially hate Alex Jones.


Actually, he is spot on in what he said in that video.

----------


## presence

> 20 children dead and 6 adults as well.  Right now I believe that we should be mourning and not politicalizing this. It is disrespectful.



My heart bleeds but... really?





> This time I want to believe things may be different. 
> 
> This seems like a  level of horror that belongs to a whole different category,
> _one that has  the potential_ to shame our public officials into action,
>  as long as* we  insist that there is no other moral alternative.*


http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/...-nothing-will/



> Enough! 
> 
> Enough with putting off  tomorrow what we should be talking about today.
>  Enough with being afraid  to step on someone's delicate sensibilities when it comes to the Second  Amendment.
>  Enough with elected leaders who are too cowardly to confront  the National Rifle Association and their ardent supporters. 
> Enough with  moms and dads and brothers and sisters and aunts and uncles and pastors  and deacons who are afraid to make public the private anguish of mental  illness.
> 
>  Enough! Enough! Enough!
> []
> *There is absolutely no doubt that we need tough and stringent gun control.*


http://www.cnn.com/2012/12/14/opinio...ol/?hpt=hp_bn7




> *What is needed is gun control—strict, comprehensive gun control*  that places the values of public safety and security before the values  of deer hunting and a perverse ahistorical reading of the Second  Amendment.


 http://www.newyorker.com/online/blog...#ixzz2F4e0gGqJ




> The reality is they’re extremely lethal.* I would*





> *instantly  surrender* *them if I could save a human life.* If you wouldn’t, you’re  moral compass is broken.




http://www.montrosepress.com/opinion...9bb2963f4.html



> it is not the Second Amendment but *political cowardice that precludes sensible*





> *regulation.*



http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinio...532_story.html


And you want the liberty movement to sit silently to mourn?  Bad $#@! happened, my heart goes out to the families... but the writing is on the wall; MSM is slamming this event with calls for strict gun control, assault weapon bans, revising the 2nd Amendment, etc.  

Those kids are dead because no lawful citizen could lawfully protect them with their own gun in a *fictitious* "school zone".   Is this what George Washington envisioned; *every hour* except near "schools"?  Am I supposed to sit here and quietly control my outrage with the violence brought upon us *by* the gun conrol status quo let alone the impending violence coming with strict, comprehensive, and tough instant surrender bans while I can feel my forefathers rolling in their respective graves to accept these kids beside them?   Speaking up for ourselves* is* mourning.


These shootings wouldn't happen if





> [we] Guard with jealous attention the public liberty.
>  Suspect everyone who approaches that jewel. 
> Unfortunately, nothing will preserve it but downright force. 
> Whenever you give up that force, you are ruined. 
> The great object is that* every man be armed.* 
> 
> _Patrick Henry_
> 
> Let your gun therefore be the constant companion of your walks.
> ...


http://www.eskimo.com/~bpentium/articles/guns.html





> _Connecticut
> gun code of 1650:
> 
> _
> *"All persons shall bear arms, 
> and every male person
>  shall have in continual readiness
> a good musket or other gun, fit for service."*





So far have we strayed...





> *The very atmosphere* of firearms anywhere and everywhere *restrains evil influence.*
>  They deserve a place of honour with all that's* good.* 
> When firearms go, all goes. 
> We need them _every hour._
> 
> *George Washington*

----------


## alucard13mmfmj

Wonder what Ron and Rand or Amash or other people has to say about this? I am interested in what they think should happen to prevent something like this from happening. So far, all we hear from MSM is ban guns.

----------


## Confederate

> The dude's name is Ryan Lanza, and he was apparently 24-years old.

----------


## osan

> Actually, he is spot on in what he said in that video.


Seems so.

----------


## Noob

> Wonder what Ron and Rand or Amash or other people has to say about this? I am interested in what they think should happen to prevent something like this from happening. So far, all we hear from MSM is ban guns.


Sean Hannity ‏on his radio show said there should be armed guards, you know  kind of like the TSA at public schools.

----------


## LibertyEagle

> Wonder what Ron and Rand or Amash or other people has to say about this? I am interested in what they think should happen to prevent something like this from happening. So far, all we hear from MSM is ban guns.


Today isn't the day for them to talk about that.  It would be twisted by the media. Today they need to grieve the losses.

----------


## ronpaulfollower999

Why did he wear body armor if he planned on committing suicide?

----------


## AuH20

> Why did he wear body armor if he planned on committing suicide?


To complete his 'mission' if he ran into armed resistance.

----------


## Anti Federalist

> 20 children dead and 6 adults as well.  Right now I believe that we should be mourning and not politicalizing this. It is disrespectful.


The enemies of liberty and the authoritarians have already "politicized" this.

I will not unilaterally "disarm".

----------


## kathy88

So the mother was a teacher there. Wouldn't someone have noticed her MIA and checked on her? If a teacher is a no show that's a big deal.

----------


## tangent4ronpaul

> Where did the information that Adam Lanza is autistic/Aspergers come from?  Seemed to just kinda appear out of nowhere in the media cycle, as if it were just a "declaration".  There was just an interview with a classmate of Lanza on CNN who said he was just a normal kid.  Nothing out of the ordinary.  Autistic/Aspergers kids are not known for being "normal".  I don't like this rush to classify him that.


I kind of like the direction it's going.  It's already illegal to buy a gun if you have a mental disorder.  It's already illegal to buy or possess a "assault weapon"(sic) in the state of NJ.  This case has all the making for legal precedent FAIL!

-t

----------


## klamath

> Doesn't matter if that is the purpose or not.  The wars are evil.  The killing of children in those wars or evil.  If the purpose is to rape, rob and pillage, and children are killed along the way, doesn't make it any less evil.
> 
> The point is PERSPECTIVE.  CONTEXT.
> 
> Twenty murdered kids is just another day at the office for the pentagon. 
> 
> But where are the tears for them?  Where are the flags at half mast for them?  
> Where are the hour long specials with soft guitar music and sobbing parents holding school pictures for them?
> Where is the in depth analysis with wolf blitzer and Andersen Cooper for them?
> ...


 No they are NOT always. To many libertarians and liberals 40 MILLION american children specifically targeted and killed are a choice. Most of the time around here it is called a red herring or a social issue. Excuse me if I see the crocodile tears spilled around here over war dead as a joke. A very sad joke.

----------


## Anti Federalist

> Sean Hannity ‏on his radio show said there should be armed guards, you know  kind of like the TSA at public schools.


TSA isn't armed, yet.

But, see, that didn't take long.

----------


## AuH20

> The enemies of liberty and the authoritarians have already "politicized" this.
> 
> I will not unilaterally "disarm".


Anyone who intends to disarm, should just go to the pet store tonight and buy themselves a leash to wear the rest of their lives.

----------


## Keith and stuff

> What is needed is gun control—strict, comprehensive gun control that places the values of public safety and security before the values of deer hunting and a perverse ahistorical reading of the Second Amendment.


You already need a permit to buy a handgun in CT. Plus, it is a may issue state meaning, unless the cops like you, you cannot carry a handgun. I am not sure what else CT can do to further restrict handguns. It's already at about the level IL is about to move to.

----------


## tangent4ronpaul

> So the mother was a teacher there. Wouldn't someone have noticed her MIA and checked on her? If a teacher is a no show that's a big deal.


"umm, hi - my mom is sick and asked me to call you so you could get a substitute and to take her daily teaching plan down and drop it off...."

-t

----------


## devil21

> I kind of like the direction it's going.  It's already illegal to buy a gun if you have a mental disorder.  It's already illegal to buy or possess a "assault weapon"(sic) in the state of NJ.  This case has all the making for legal precedent FAIL!
> 
> -t


Be careful what you wish for.

http://www.naturalnews.com/038322_DS...diagnosis.html




> (NaturalNews) The industry of modern psychiatry has officially gone insane. Virtually every emotion experienced by a human being -- sadness, grief, anxiety, frustration, impatience, excitement -- is now being classified as a "mental disorder" demanding chemical treatment (with prescription medications, of course).
> 
> The new, upcoming DSM-5 "psychiatry bible," expected to be released in a few months, has transformed itself from a medical reference manual to a testament to the insanity of the industry itself.
> 
> "Mental disorders" named in the DSM-5 include "General Anxiety Disorder" or GAD for short. GAD can be diagnosed in a person who feels a little anxious doing something like, say, talking to a psychiatrist. Thus, the mere act of a psychiatrist engaging in the possibility of making a diagnoses causes the "symptoms" of that diagnoses to magically appear.
> 
> This is called quack science and circular reasoning, yet it's indicative of the entire industry of psychiatry which has become such a laughing stock among scientific circles that even the science skeptics are starting to turn their backs in disgust. Psychiatry is no more "scientific" than astrology or palm reading, yet its practitioners call themselves "doctors" of psychiatry in order to try to make quackery sound credible.
> 
> much more at link...good read

----------


## tangent4ronpaul

> You already need a permit to buy a handgun in CT. Plus, it is a may issue state meaning, unless the cops like you, you cannot carry a handgun. I am not sure what else CT can do to further restrict handguns. It's already at about the level IL is about to move to.


OK, but the guy lived in and drove up from NJ which has the second most restrictive gun laws in the country, to Connecticut who has the 8th most restrictive.  He presumably got the guns in NJ.

That he had a drivers license says something about his organic mental state.  They don't give those to Autistics.

-t

----------


## devil21

> OK, but the guy lived in and drove up from NJ which has the second most restrictive gun laws in the country, to Connecticut who has the 8th most restrictive.  He presumably got the guns in NJ.
> 
> That he had a drivers license says something about his organic mental state.  They don't give those to Autistics.
> 
> -t


It's already been confirmed on CNN that all three guns were registered to his mother, according to Connecticut officials that traced the guns.

----------


## Pericles

> Anyone who intends to disarm, should just go to the pet store tonight and buy themselves a leash to wear the rest of their lives.


I consider any further firearm restriction to be casus belli

----------


## angelatc

> How much msm coverage did yesterday's knife attack on 22 Chinese kids get?
> 
> http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2012...s&emc=rss&_r=0
> 
> Crazy people do crazy things.



Lord knows I hate to do this, but.....that story changed.  Originally the Chinese News agency was reporting 8 dead.  You can still find it on Google.

----------


## angelatc

> "umm, hi - my mom is sick and asked me to call you so you could get a substitute and to take her daily teaching plan down and drop it off...."
> 
> -t


Saw a report with a neighbor, and he said that Mom was not a teacher.

----------


## James Madison

> Saw a report with a neighbor, and he said that Mom was not a teacher.


So, what's his connection to this school then?

----------


## FindLiberty

> Anyone who intends to disarm, should just go to the pet store tonight and buy themselves a leash to wear the rest of their lives.


and get a sign made up for their front yard...

----------


## tangent4ronpaul

> It's already been confirmed on CNN that all three guns were registered to his mother, according to Connecticut officials that traced the guns.


Mom had one of these registered in her name and at least 100 rounds of ammo... plus a Glock and a Sig?  



That's kinda unusual... 

gotta link?

-t

----------


## ShaneEnochs

On a positive note, this has finally convinced my wife to allow me to homeschool my son.

----------


## DerailingDaTrain

"The Sandy Hook Elementary murders will be covered on the news for weeks to come. But if you ask a forensics psychiatrist, we shouldn't."




http://www.reddit.com/r/videos/comme...ll_be_covered/

----------


## Pericles

> Mom had one of these registered in her name and at least 100 rounds of ammo... plus a Glock and a Sig?  
> 
> 
> 
> That's kinda unusual... 
> 
> gotta link?
> 
> -t


I'll take the M203, but I want the 12 inch barrel.

----------


## dannno

> Mom had one of these registered in her name and at least 100 rounds of ammo... plus a Glock and a Sig?  
> 
> 
> 
> That's kinda unusual... 
> 
> gotta link?
> 
> -t


Yes, apparently locked in her trunk... and now she's dead so we'll never really know

----------


## tangent4ronpaul

> Mom had one of these registered in her name and at least 100 rounds of ammo... plus a Glock and a Sig?  
> 
> 
> 
> That's kinda unusual... 
> 
> gotta link?
> 
> -t


I'm fairly certain that the "M4" which is the most quoted gun on the news feeds, is a selective fire machine gun, which is banned in CT.  It's a relatively new addition to the AR line and newly manufactured machine guns are illegal to sell to the public.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_law...ssault_weapons

Connecticut has bans on defined 'assault weapons,' which includes selective fire firearms unless purchased before October 1, 1993, and a limited list of semiautomatic AR, AK, and SKS variants. However, it does not restrict magazine capacity.[4]

Connecticut allows all NFA firearms other than selective fire machine guns, however guns of this type that existed in Connecticut before the ban are grandfathered. Selective fire means that a machine gun can fire semi or fully automatic. Machine guns that can only fire fully automatic are legal in Connecticut.

-t

----------


## AuH20

I reallly feel for Colt. This could be the end for them in Connecticut. 

http://www.colt.com/

----------


## devil21

CNN just reported it again.  No link sorry, tangent.  Im sure it's buried somewhere in the zillion links to the story on CNNs front page.

----------


## tangent4ronpaul

> Yes, apparently locked in her trunk... and now she's dead so we'll never really know


Yeah, locked in the trunk... so he did this with 2 pistols.  What is that 10-15 mags that mom had laying around? (over 100 shots reported)  That's also kinda unusual...

-t

----------


## AuH20

Celebrities weigh in. Brace yourselves before you read this:

http://www.eonline.com/news/371720/c...age-toward-nra

----------


## Dark_Horse_Rider

> That is true but you still didn't answer the question. IF THIS event was a staged conspiracy with the intent being gun control. Why pick a state with one of the strictest gun control? Why not pick a state with looser gun control? Wouldn't that make the argument for gun control better?


because someone would most likely put a quick end to planned rampage ( people being able to carry ), notice how these things often happen on campus , or theatre in a town with no carry allowed

----------


## erowe1

> It's already been confirmed on CNN that all three guns were registered to his mother, according to Connecticut officials that traced the guns.


Odd. According to this CT doesn't have registration for handguns.
http://www.nraila.org/gun-laws/state...nnecticut.aspx

Anybody know more about that?

----------


## Pericles

> I'm fairly certain that the "M4" which is the most quoted gun on the news feeds, is a selective fire machine gun, which is banned in CT.  It's a relatively new addition to the AR line and newly manufactured machine guns are illegal to sell to the public.
> 
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_law...ssault_weapons
> 
> Connecticut has bans on defined 'assault weapons,' which includes selective fire firearms unless purchased before October 1, 1993, and a limited list of semiautomatic AR, AK, and SKS variants. However, it does not restrict magazine capacity.[4]
> 
> Connecticut allows all NFA firearms other than selective fire machine guns, however guns of this type that existed in Connecticut before the ban are grandfathered. Selective fire means that a machine gun can fire semi or fully automatic. Machine guns that can only fire fully automatic are legal in Connecticut.
> 
> -t



Don't live in CT, and build your own:

----------


## Anti Federalist

> On a positive note, this has finally convinced my wife to allow me to homeschool my son.


Thank Christ for the small miracles.

If *this* is not enough reason to get your child out of the government indoctrination/lockdown camps, what they will shortly turn into after this, will most *CERTAINLY* be.

----------


## devil21

> Odd. According to this CT doesn't have registration for handguns.
> http://www.nraila.org/gun-laws/state...nnecticut.aspx
> 
> Anybody know more about that?


Do they have pistol permits in CT?  Here in NC you have to get a pistol permit from the local sheriff prior to purchasing a handgun but there is no "registration" of the weapon.  We know the media is pretty lax with using proper terms regarding firearms so they could be using wrong terminology.  Either way, CNN has said repeatedly that the guns were his mother's in so many words.

----------


## Pericles

> Thank Christ for the small miracles.
> 
> If *this* is not enough reason to get your child out of the government indoctrination/lockdown camps, what they will shortly turn into after this, will most *CERTAINLY* be.


That ^ too

----------


## erowe1

> Do they have pistol permits in CT?  Here in NC you have to get a pistol permit from the local sheriff prior to purchasing a handgun but there is no "registration" of the weapon.  We know the media is pretty lax with using proper terms regarding firearms so they could be using wrong terminology.  Either way, CNN has said repeatedly that the guns were his mother's in so many words.


But they would have to have registration of the weapons themselves in order to make the claim the person I responded to was reporting. The permit itself doesn't tell you who owns what weapons.

----------


## Slutter McGee

I am not going to lose my temper in this thread, though I am tempted.

The government doesn't go around causing these horrible things. They simply take advantage of the situation after they happen. So even though I think your crazy for considering the deaths of 18 little kids as nothing more than a government plot, the results afterwards are the same.

Some people are seriously disturbed. Society has had these individuals for all of its existence. I don't know why now we must consider it some kind of conspiracy. 

Second off, I will still insist on sending my children to public school or private school. Where they can play football, or be in the band. Where they can develop the social skills that so many home schooled kids lack.

Finally, I am glad we can all agree that the most important thing for tonight and tomorrow, is prayer for the victims. And this is coming from somebody who doubts God. I will say a prayer just in case.

Sincerely,

Slutter McGee

----------


## tangent4ronpaul

> Celebrities weigh in. Brace yourselves before you read this:
> 
> http://www.eonline.com/news/371720/c...age-toward-nra


VOMIT!

-t

----------


## donnay

I am posting the whole article from the CT newspaper--so that it can be referenced later.  We know when stories are printed some things that were in the news disappear.  So here is the scoop from the Hartford Courant.

*27 Dead, Including 20 Children, At Sandy Hook School Shooting In Newtown*
*The Hartford Courant Staff*

7:47 p.m. EST, December 14, 2012
NEWTOWN—

Twenty-seven people, including 20 children, are dead after a shooting at Sandy Hook Elementary School.

Another person was found dead at 36 Yogananda St. in Newtown, sources told The Courant, and the gunman was found dead inside the school.

The shootings at the school took place in two rooms, one of which is a kindergarten classroom, sources said. One entire classroom is unaccounted for.

Students described being ushered from their classrooms hand-in-hand, with their eyes closed, to the safety of a nearby fire station as police converged on the school. Anguished parents rushed to the scene.

State police sources told The Courant that the shooter is 20-year-old Adam Lanza. When he was found, he had his brother Ryan Lanza’s identification, which initially led to confusion about his identity, police said.

He was dressed in black fatigues, police said.

A law enforcement official said the boys' mother, Nancy Lanza, works at the school as a teacher. The Associated Press is reporting that she is presumed dead.

A grandmother of the suspect — who is also the mother of teacher believed killed — was too distraught to speak when reached by phone at her home in Brooksville, Fla.

“I just don't know, and I can't make a comment right now,” Dorothy Champion, 78, said in a shaky voice as she started to cry. She said she hadn't heard anything official about her daughter and grandsons. She declined to comment further and hung up.

Nancy Lanza, 52,  was according to friends and neighbors a kind woman with a sense of humor. Slender, with short hair, Lanza was a fixture at neighborhood events such as the Labor Day parade, and had a special interest in Christmas lights.

Lanza lived on Yogananda Street, in a hilly, affluent neighborhood in the east end of town. Neighbors call it a children- and family-friendly place, a description backed up by the kids riding their bikes and the folks walking their dogs despite the crush of television trucks and reporters waiting near the Lanza home. 

Though many interviewed in the neighborhood said they didn't know Nancy Lanza, or merely knew that a family by that name lived nearby, those that did know her said the day's events were too much.

Lanza's friend and neighbor Rhonda Cullens fought back tears Friday afternoon in the doorway of her home on Founders Lane, just around the corner from the Lanza residence.

She said she met Nancy Lanza playing bunco, a popular dice game, with a group of women in the neighborhood, but she hadn't seen her for years since she stopped playing with the group. “She was just a sweet, caring person."

The gunman drove to the school in his mother's car, an official said. Three guns were found — a Glock and a Sig Sauer, both pistols, inside the school, and a .223-caliber rifle in the back of a car.

President Obama, in an emotional address to the nation Friday afternoon, said "These neighborhoods are our neighborhoods, and these children are our children."

“I know there’s not a parent in America who doesn’t feel the same overwhelming grief that I do," he said. "The majority of those who died today were children, beautiful little kids between the ages of 5 and 10 years old. … They had their entire lives ahead of them. Birthdays, graduations, weddings, kids of their own." 

“Among the fallen were also teachers, men and women who devoted their lives to help their children achieve their dreams,” he said. 

State Police Lt. J. Paul Vance said two children died at a local hospital and another had injuries.

Shortly after 9:40 a.m., police reported that a shooter was in the main office of the school. A person in one room had “numerous gunshot wounds,” police said.

“A minute after our officers were there, they realized what a horrific scene we had there,” said Newtown Police Lt. George Sinko.

Once they know how serious the incident was, they called for help.

“This is most definitely the worst thing experienced here in town,” he said. “But for now, we’re concerned about the families of the victims.”

Groups of students — some crying, some holding hands — were being escorted away from the school by their teachers. Some students were still in the school at 10:30 a.m., parents said, as police searched the area.

Police were still searching the school at 11 a.m., and police dogs were brought in. Around noon, the triage area was broken down, stretchers were taken away and the SWAT team left the building.

Sandy Hook Elementary has nearly 700 students in kindergarten through fourth grade. *Its doors are locked at 9:30 a.m., and visitors are required to sign in, according to the school's website.*

School and local emergency officials were accounting for the children, who were released to their parents. Some parents were sequestered at the Sandy Hook fire department, just down the road from the school. 

By 4 p.m., somber groups of families were leaving the firehouse, many accompanied by police or firefighters.

A temporary morgue was being set up in the area so that the victims could be positively identified as expeditiously as possible.

Earlier, frustrated parents were desperately trying to get information from officials as they searched the school.

Vanessa Bajraliu, a 9-year-old fourth grader, heard the shots.

*"I saw policemen -- lots of policemen in the hallway with guns," she said. "The police took us out of the school. We were told to hold each others' hands and to close our eyes. We opened our eyes when we were outside."*

Her brother, 17-year-old Mergim Bajraliu, a senior at Newtown High School, was at his nearby home when he heard shots, he said. He first went to a neighbor's house.

"Then we heard sirens," he said.

He rushed to the school on foot and saw a girl being carried out, he said. She looked badly injured. Another girl had blood on her face, he said.

Mergim soon found his sister and took her away from the scene.

Parent Richard Wilford said his Sandy Hook second-grader, Richie, heard what he described as “pans falling” when gunshots rang out. He said that his son told him that the teacher went to go check, came back in and locked the door and told the students to stand in the corner.

“What does a parent think about coming to a school where there’s a shooting … It’s the most terrifying moment of a parent’s life … you have no idea,” said Wilford.

Brendan Murray, a 9-year-old 4th grader, said he was in the gym with his class when they heard "lots of banging." He said the teachers put the students in a nearby closet where they stayed for about 15 minutes before police officers told them to leave the building.

The boy said the students ran down a hallway where there were police at every door. He said "lots of people were crying." 

Eight-year-old Alexis Wasik, a third-grader at the school, said police were checking everybody inside the school before they were escorted to the firehouse.

"We had to walk with a partner," she said.

One child leaving the school said that there was shattered glass everywhere. A police officer ran into the classroom and told them to run outside and keep going until they reached the firehouse.

Audra Barth, who was walking away from the school with her first-grade son and third-grade daughter, said a teacher took first-graders into the restroom after bullets came through the window.  

When Janet Vollmer, a Sandy Hook Elementary School kindergarten teacher, returned to her Liberty Street home around 4 p.m. Friday, her grown son and a nearby neighbor were there to greet her. The neighbor, who did not want to be identified, ran over as soon as she saw Vollmer and hugged her. The neighbor said she heard about the shooting at work and, “I kept hearing it might have been a kindergarten teacher. I was hoping it wasn’t her. I was shaking at work.”

When she learned that Vollmer was OK, “I was so relieved. This is too close to home,” she said.

The neighbor said she was so sad for all the *families whose children died nine days before Christmas*. [10 days before Christmas Eve and 11 to Christmas Day-donnay]

One of Vollmer’s adult sons came to the door of her home and said she didn’t want to talk.

Students at nearby Newtown High School on Berkshire Road were stunned Friday when they learned of the shootings.

Senior Alex Buttery said when she learned the shootings had taken place on Dickinson Drive — where the school is located — “I immediately thought of Sandy Hook,” she said. “It’s devastating.”

Buttery, walking out of the school Friday afternoon with her friend Clare Donnelly, said she’d cried a lot today.

Donnelly said “it’s hard to wrap your head around” the shooting. “It’s difficult to watch [young children] go through this.”

Junior Renee Henriques said she was “shocked, speechless” by the shootings.

Buttery said she had been texting back and forth with her mother all day. “I went there,” she said of Sandy Hook School. “I know the teachers. I’m just wondering who it is.” Her mother, she said, was very emotional. They “know a lot of neighbors who go to Sandy Hook.”

NHS student Stefanie Carr said she was having a hard time processing what had happened. “I just couldn’t process how I felt. I’m still trying to get over it.”

All of the students had the same question: “Why someone would do that to the children?” 

James Dietter, 26, lives in the Yogananda neighborhood where a person was found dead. His mother works in the school system.

"This is the idyllic New England hamlet … there was a bit of a magical insulation or feeling that tragedy won't happen here.  Now it has, and, unfortunately, I think it is going to define this town."

Several news outlets, including The Associated Press and CNN, initially identified the shooter as his older brother, Ryan Lanza.

*One law enforcement official said Ryan Lanza had been extremely cooperative, was not believed to have any involvement in the rampage and was not under arrest or in custody, but investigators were still searching his computers and phone records. Ryan Lanza told law enforcement he had not been in touch with his brother since about 2010.*

Marsha Moskowitz, a former bus driver in town, remembered the Lanza boys.

“You know the trouble kids, and you figure, ‘Pff, that one’s going to be trouble.’ But I never would have thought that about them,” she said.

Moskowitz ran into the boys’ mother a couple of weeks ago and exchanged peasantries, she said.

Residents and out-of-towners alike were lined up outside a packed St. Rose of Lima Church well before the start of a 7 p.m. Mass.

Jim Craig, Newtown resident, said he lives about a mile away from Sandy Hook Elementary School, and has a friend who teaches there. “You never expect anything like this to happen in Newtown, of all places.” He said he was at St. Rose of Lima to support the families of the victims.

Those who came from out of town said they were there to support the community and its families.

Chris Leon, of Waterbury, said “It’s terrible what happened, especially to the little kids. I have two little boys of my own and I can’t imagine what it would be like if this happened to mine.”

Megan Silver, 19, came from Brookfield with four friends. “We came out to support the community. We know people are hurting, and they’re not alone.”

Her friend Samantha Lawlor, 16, said “It’s terrible to think of parents sending their kids on the bus to get an education and they never come home. It shouldn’t happen.”

Newtown United Methodist Church opened the doors around noon after ministers there heard of the tragedy. Brad Tefft, a bereavement minister at the church, drove in and opened the doors.

"I better get down there. It's in our neighborhood," Tefft remembered thinking. 

He created a sign that said "prayer vigil," which he placed out by the street, and also put a sign on the door saying sanctuary open.

“The closeness became more apparent when you see a tragedy like this,” he said. “We all feel for the families, and the kids and the teachers. It’s part of who we are. It’s part of the fabric of what this community is like. When something like this happens it tears at all our heartstrings.”

As word spread of the magnitude of the tragedy in Newtown, Gov. Dannel P. Malloy talked on the telephone Friday with President Obama about the incident and held a press conference after Obama addressed the nation.

"Earlier today, a tragedy of unspeakable terms played itself out in this community," he said. "You can never be prepared for this incident."

"Beautiful children had their lives taken away from them, as well as adults whose responsibility it is to supervise and take care of those children," Malloy said. 

Malloy spoke again Friday evening from the scene.

“Evil visited this community today,” he said. “It’s too early to speak of recovery, but each parent, each sibling, each member of the family has to understand that Connecticut, we’re all in this together, we’ll do whatever we can to overcome this event. We will get through it, but this is a terrible time for this community and these families.”

“Our prayers at this time have to go out to the families. ... The No. 1 way to be helpful is to say a prayer or send a best wish or to be thinking of these individuals who have suffered so mightily today.”

Earlier, Malloy spent time with the families, said Roy Occhiogrosso, Malloy's senior adviser. 

"He is attempting to make sure they get the information they need. It is an unspeakable scene.''

Malloy ordered state and U.S. flags to be flown at half-staff.

In Washington, D.C., House Speaker John Boehner ordered flags at the U.S. Capitol to be flown at half-staff.

State officials reacted with shock and alarm to the shootings.

House Republican leader Larry Cafero and Senate President Pro Tem Donald Williams were both stunned upon hearing that 27 had been killed. Cafero put his hand over his mouth in an immediate reaction.

The state departments of public health, education, mental health and addiction services, and the state police are all working on the incident.

Incoming U.S. Rep. Elizabeth Esty, who represents Newtown as part of the 5th Congressional District, said, "As a mother, I can only begin to imagine what the students, parents, teachers and staff of Sandy Hook Elementary must be experiencing. My thoughts and prayers go out to everyone impacted by this horrific tragedy. While details are still emerging, I hope for the safety and well being of the children, teachers and staff at Sandy Hook Elementary and for the Newtown community.''

Incoming U.S. Sen. Chris Murphy arrived at the firehouse around 2:30 p.m. and went to talk with parents.

Afternoon buses and kindergarten were cancelled.* The entire Newton district was put on lockdown*, and other school districts took similar measures across the state.

In West Hartford, Superintendent Karen List sent a recorded message to families Friday noting an increased police presence at town schools after the Newtown shootings.

“It’s really for reassurance,” List said. Counselors will also be available for students at the schools, and West Hartford administrators are now creating a set of talking points for parents if they decide to explain the shootings to their children over the weekend.

A meeting of Farmington Valley-area superintendents that was scheduled for Friday was canceled.

“We need to be in our districts,” List said. “We need to be communicating with our families; we need to be supporting our faculty and children.”

Southington schools were placed on a precautionary “passive lockdown” in which exterior doors are locked, Assistant Superintendent Karen Smith said. “We’re asking all administrators to be vigilant and to be aware of what is going on.”

In Waterbury, Wilby, Crosby and Kennedy high schools have canceled Friday’s afternoon and night games, according to the school system. Other after-school activities for Waterbury schools will go on as planned, but there will be police on the premises.

Bridgeport Superintendant of Schools Paul G. Vallas has canceled all after-school programs except for the Central High School basketball game.  

All Winterfest Hartford activities in Bushnell Park in Hartford will be closed today. The skating rink is closed effective immediately and will re-open tomorrow on regular schedule.

Schools in the Pomperaug Regional School District 15, based in nearby Southbury and Middlebury, were put on lockdown after the shootings, Superintendent Frank Sippy said. After-school and weekend activities were canceled.

“Everyone is searching for the reason why — why such a senseless tragedy has to transpire in this country,” Sippy said.

“We’ll take the weekend to reflect. I just think it’s time for people to step back and take a breath and spend time with loved ones,” said Sippy, who has offered the district’s services to Newtown schools. 

The only mass shooting in the U.S. with more than 27 killed since the 1950s took place on April 16, 2007, when a student named Seung-Hui Cho shot and killed 32 people at Virginia Tech in Blackburg, Va., before shooting himself.

On May 18, 1927, Andrew Kehoe, school board treasurer in Bath Township, Michigan, bombed three schools, killing 38 children, two teachers and four other adults, as well as himself, because he was enraged by higher taxes to fund a new school.

Friday’s massacre may be the largest school shooting of young children in the world, said Larry Barton, a professor at the American College in Pennsylvania whose three decades of research includes studying violence in workplaces, public spaces and schools.

Mass school shootings have often targeted high schoolers, such as the victims of Columbine, and university-age students. And in China, there have been numerous cases over the past three years of knife-wielding adults attacking children, such as an incident Friday in the Henan province where a man slashed 22 children.

“This is among the most diabolical crimes, to kill kindergarten-age children,” Barton said of the Newtown case. “It’s very rare.”

Barton also teaches threat assessment at the FBI Academy in Quantico, Va., where one of the cases he presents to law enforcement is the 2010 Hartford Distributors Inc. rampage in Manchester. Omar Thornton, 34, fatally shot eight of his co-workers before killing himself.

“The most dangerous person in society is what we call the grievance collector,” Barton said. “It’s the person who has a grudge, who cannot let go of an issue. They become obsessed and they tend to be exceptional at both planning and documenting ...

“It will take weeks, maybe even months, to understand motivation. Often what the shooter is seeking is not just revenge, but notoriety,” Barton said. “They are seeking a sense of trying to eclipse prior perpetrators.”

- Staff writers David Owens, Dave Altimari, Josh Kovner, Marc O'Connell, Chris Keating, Samaia Hernandez, Denise Buffa, Steve Goode, Brian Dowling, Hilda Munoz, Jenny Wilson, Vanessa de la Torre, Jenna Carlesso, Bernie Davidow, Naedine Hazell, Sandy Csizmar and Stephen Busemeyer contributed to this report. Associated Press reports are included.

----------


## tangent4ronpaul

> Odd. According to this CT doesn't have registration for handguns.
> http://www.nraila.org/gun-laws/state...nnecticut.aspx
> 
> Anybody know more about that?


Well, it says you have to get a permit to purchase one and have to be licensed to own one.  I would think that would contain all the registration info the state needs.

-t

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## devil21

> But they would have to have registration of the weapons themselves in order to make the claim the person I responded to was reporting. The permit itself doesn't tell you who owns what weapons.


Tell them that.

Ive never been convinced that the federal background check paperwork filed during purchase isn't stored permanently.  They claim it's disposed of after 10 days or something but Ive always thought that's bull$#@!.  

Check out Form 4473, ATF Background Check form.  It *specifically* asks for the info of the firearm.  *I bet the ATF has been storing this information permanently, which is de facto registration, contrary to what they claim they do.*

http://www.atf.gov/forms/download/atf-f-4473-1.pdf

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## Danke

> I am not going to lose my temper in this thread, though I am tempted.
> 
> The government doesn't go around causing these horrible things.


lol, ya government doesn't prevent teachers, etc. from being armed.

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## erowe1

> Well, it says you have to get a permit to purchase one and have to be licensed to own one.  I would think that would contain all the registration info the state needs.
> 
> -t


How if they don't register handguns?

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## 2young2vote

How often did these types of things happen 30+ years ago?  Were they just as common and the news didn't spread because of the internet, or did they actually occur less?

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## erowe1

> Tell them that.
> 
> Ive never been convinced that the federal background check paperwork filed during purchase isn't stored permanently.  They claim it's disposed of after 10 days or something but Ive always thought that's bull$#@!.  
> 
> Check out Form 4473, ATF Background Check form.  It *specifically* asks for the info of the firearm.  *I bet the ATF has been storing this information permanently, which is de facto registration, contrary to what they claim they do.*
> 
> http://www.atf.gov/forms/download/atf-f-4473-1.pdf


That's possible. But is it something they do secretly, or are they open about it? If it's a secret, then they can't tell news people the guns are registered to someone.

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## cbrons

Matt Bracken next on radio

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## erowe1

> How often did these types of things happen 30+ years ago?  Were they just as common and the news didn't spread because of the internet, or did they actually occur less?


I'm pretty sure it was less.

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## devil21

(/tinfoil hat on)

Just a random thought here, but if the doors of the school were locked at 9:30 and all visitors were required to be let in by school officials after that time, how did he get inside?  Seems to me a guy wearing black fatigues and a bulletproof vest (nevermind carrying two guns) would probably not be let in.  Seems like a reasonable assumption.  Now, consider the gun types used according to the media.  A Glock and a Sig.  Who carries Glocks and Sigs almost in entirety?  COPS!  Who would be let in by school officials, no questions asked?  COPS!

See where I'm going with this?  Just connecting the dots....  [/tinfoil]

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## tangent4ronpaul

> Do they have pistol permits in CT?  Here in NC you have to get a pistol permit from the local sheriff prior to purchasing a handgun but there is no "registration" of the weapon.  We know the media is pretty lax with using proper terms regarding firearms so they could be using wrong terminology.  Either way, CNN has said repeatedly that the guns were his mother's in so many words.


I would imagine it probably works like this:

OK - you want a permit to purchase a pistol.  After the fingerprints, background check and interview you file paperwork saying this is the gun I wish to purchase.  It's this make and model, with this serial number, etc.  Then when you purchase it, you go down and file more paperwork to add it to your license so you can legally possess it.

A lot of countries do it like that, as well as at least some states - and CT is near the worst end of the list, and this is pretty common w/ class III weapons, also.

-t

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## Dianne

So you guys are really serious?    You believe this was a disturbed teen?

I say it is another United Nations hit job... to steal weapons.    The Colorado shooter's Dad was due to testify before the Congress against the LIBOR scandal ...

Eric Holder and Obama... and their crockodile tears... lmao ....     they murdered those kids today, with the plea of the United Nations...     Find info... about this kid's family before it is erased off of Google.

Holder whining about guns in the United States, when he sent ammo of mass destruction to drug cartels in Mexico ...   Holder murdered thousands of young children .... Obama has murdered thousands....  of  young children.    The perps lie within our government...    this savage attack was not of one human; but of our United Nations Government.    They will seek any means available to inact their bann of assault rifles...

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## AuH20

> So you guys are really serious?    You believe this was a disturbed teen?
> 
> I say it is another United Nations hit job... to steal weapons.    The Colorado shooter's Dad was due to testify before the Congress against the LIBOR scandal ...
> 
> Eric Holder and Obama... and their crockodile tears... lmao ....     they murdered those kids today, with the plea of the United Nations...     Find info... about this kid's family before it is erased off of Google.
> 
> Holder whining about guns in the United States, when he sent ammo of mass destruction to drug cartels in Mexico ...   Holder murdered thousands of young children .... Obama has murdered thousands....  of  young children.    The perps lie within our government...    this savage attack was not of one human; but of our United Nations Government.    They will seek any means available to inact their bann of assault rifles...


Right now, given the information we have, it doesn't appear to be a false flag attack. It sounds like a mentally unbalanced teen lashing out. The Holmes incident was much more sketchy, given his academic background and the puzzling details of the attack.

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## Pericles

> How often did these types of things happen 30+ years ago?  Were they just as common and the news didn't spread because of the internet, or did they actually occur less?


http://listverse.com/2008/01/01/top-...ool-massacres/

----------


## Pericles

> (/tinfoil hat on)
> 
> Just a random thought here, but if the doors of the school were locked at 9:30 and all visitors were required to be let in by school officials after that time, how did he get inside?  Seems to me a guy wearing black fatigues and a bulletproof vest (nevermind carrying two guns) would probably not be let in.  Seems like a reasonable assumption.  Now, consider the gun types used according to the media.  A Glock and a Sig.  Who carries Glocks and Sigs almost in entirety?  COPS!  Who would be let in by school officials, no questions asked?  COPS!
> 
> See where I'm going with this?  Just connecting the dots....  [/tinfoil]


Dressed as a SWAT ninja?

----------


## AFPVet

> Tell them that.
> 
> Ive never been convinced that the federal background check paperwork filed during purchase isn't stored permanently.  They claim it's disposed of after 10 days or something but Ive always thought that's bull$#@!.  
> 
> Check out Form 4473, ATF Background Check form.  It *specifically* asks for the info of the firearm.  *I bet the ATF has been storing this information permanently, which is de facto registration, contrary to what they claim they do.*
> 
> http://www.atf.gov/forms/download/atf-f-4473-1.pdf


They are required to keep a 4473 on file for 10 years. At least, that's the way it used to be. ... you're right... it is registration.

----------


## bolil

> (/tinfoil hat on)
> 
> Just a random thought here, but if the doors of the school were locked at 9:30 and all visitors were required to be let in by school officials after that time, how did he get inside?  Seems to me a guy wearing black fatigues and a bulletproof vest (nevermind carrying two guns) would probably not be let in.  Seems like a reasonable assumption.  Now, consider the gun types used according to the media.  A Glock and a Sig.  Who carries Glocks and Sigs almost in entirety?  COPS!  Who would be let in by school officials, no questions asked?  COPS!
> 
> See where I'm going with this?  Just connecting the dots....  [/tinfoil]


I had the same questions... if it is true the shooter was in black fatigues, and armed, then he probably looked like a cop.  Allegedly there was a school cop present (according to hannity talk radio) and wouldn't said school cop have been able to identify him as a co-worker or imposter?  Many questions will go unanswered because the answer of gun control/banning is being shouted from the tip of  (most)every tongue and fingertip across these united states.

----------


## devil21

> That's possible. But is it something they do secretly, or are they open about it? If it's a secret, then they can't tell news people the guns are registered to someone.


They slip up just like anyone else.  A Connecticut official may have screwed up by releasing that information without ATF or FBI/NICS approval.

Here's the "official story" on what happens to background check info:
http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/nic...ion/fact-sheet




> The privacy and security of the information in the NICS is of great importance. In October 1998, the Attorney General published regulations on the privacy and security of NICS information, including the proper and official use of this information. These regulations are available on the NICS website. Data stored in the NICS is documented federal data and access to that information is restricted to agencies authorized by the FBI. Extensive measures are taken to ensure the security and integrity of the system information and agency use. *The NICS is not to be used to establish a federal firearm registry; information about an inquiry resulting in an allowed transfer is destroyed in accordance with NICS regulations. Current destruction of NICS records became effective when a final rule was published by the Department of Justice in The Federal Register, outlining the following changes. Per Title 28, Code of Federal Regulations, Part 25.9(b)(1), (2), and (3), the NICS Section must destroy all identifying information on allowed transactions prior to the start of the next NICS operational day.* If a potential purchaser is delayed or denied a firearm and successfully appeals the decision, the NICS Section cannot retain a record of the overturned appeal. If the record is not able to be updated, the purchaser continues to be denied or delayed, and if that individual appeals the decision, the documentation must be resubmitted on every subsequent purchase. For this reason, the Voluntary Appeal File (VAF) has been established. This process permits applicants to request that the NICS maintain information about themselves in the VAF to prevent future denials or extended delays of a firearm transfer. (See VAF Section below.)


So they claim the info is destroyed the next business day.  I think they're lying.

----------


## Pericles

> Matt Bracken next on radio


Where?

----------


## Dr.3D

> (/tinfoil hat on)
> 
> Just a random thought here, but if the doors of the school were locked at 9:30 and all visitors were required to be let in by school officials after that time, how did he get inside?  Seems to me a guy wearing black fatigues and a bulletproof vest (nevermind carrying two guns) would probably not be let in.  Seems like a reasonable assumption.  Now, consider the gun types used according to the media.  A Glock and a Sig.  Who carries Glocks and Sigs almost in entirety?  COPS!  Who would be let in by school officials, no questions asked?  COPS!
> 
> See where I'm going with this?  Just connecting the dots....  [/tinfoil]


Could be they thought he was a cop and let him in.

----------


## James Madison

> How often did these types of things happen 30+ years ago?  Were they just as common and the news didn't spread because of the internet, or did they actually occur less?


Almost cetainly less. 

What's the cause of the rise? A mixture of things, I'd suppose.

1. Broken families
2. Lack of communication between family and troubled youth
3. A general culture of violence
    --Look at movies like Machete, Pulp Fiction, etc. that glorify murder
    --Music, especially rap and death metal, that promote murder, theft, assault
    --Video games like CoD, MoA, and Hitman that expose children to thousands of simulated murders (slaughters, really). And, yes, I play games myself, but I do not 
       enjoy playing these kinds of games. Shooters like Halo and Resident Evil aren't as bad.
4. Overprescribing SSRIs and other psychoactives

And here's the big one.

5. Public acceptance of perpetual-warfare, abortion as a right, dead foreigners, and 'making the world safe for democracy'.


The sins of the father....the sins of the father....

----------


## devil21

> They are required to keep a 4473 on file for 10 years. At least, that's the way it used to be. ... you're right... it is registration.


How does that reconcile with the info I posted above from the NICS website?




> Could be they thought he was a cop and let him in.


Could be.  Usually cops have badges, patches, other identifying paraphenalia.  Has there been any word on who the other adults that were killed are?  So far Ive only seen the principal and the psychologist specifically named as dead adults.  The total number of adults killed is reported as 6.  Not a peep about who the other 4 are.

So I guess it's possible they thought he was a cop and let him in.  Im trying not to go off the deep end with conspiracy thoughts here but something stinks with this.

----------


## Pericles

> They slip up just like anyone else.  A Connecticut official may have screwed up by releasing that information without ATF or FBI/NICS approval.
> 
> Here's the "official story" on what happens to background check info:
> http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/nic...ion/fact-sheet
> 
> 
> 
> So they claim the info is destroyed the next business day.  I think they're lying.


The 4473 remains with the FFL dealer, unless he gives up is firearms license, then all of his records go the the ATF. The Tihart amendment to the DoJ appropriations bill prohibits the .gov from using background check data or 4473s to compile data of gunowners. Personally, I assume the Tihart amendment is violated every day.

----------


## KingNothing

Remember when the media embedded reporters with military units as they invaded Iraq, and presented it as infotaiment?  A society that would embrace that seems like one that would suffer repeated mass homicide.

----------


## AFPVet

> How does that reconcile with the info I posted above from the NICS website?


NICS doesn't retain the information. 4473s are required to be kept on file for 10 years by the FFL for inspection purposes by the ATF.

----------


## erowe1

> They slip up just like anyone else.


That seems like a big slip up. It's the kind of thing journalists need to follow up on.

----------


## erowe1

> NICS doesn't retain the information. 4473s are required to be kept on file for 10 years by the FFL for inspection purposes by the ATF.


Do you think that's what's behind the claim that the handguns were registered to the mom?

----------


## UtahApocalypse

A former school board official in Newtown called into question earlier reports that Nancy Lanza had been connected to Sandy Hook Elementary School, possibly as part of the teaching staff.

No one has heard of her, said Lillian Bittman, who served on the local school board until 2011. Teachers dont know her."

http://blogs.wsj.com/metropolis/2012...school-gunman/

Yet all networks are saying she was a teacher

----------


## devil21

> Do you think that's what's behind the claim that the handguns were registered to the mom?


Ok, so we're talking about two different things then.  Im talking about the information that gets sent to NICS, AFPVet is talking about the actual form staying on record with the FFL holder for 10 years.  So the question is, does the specific gun information (make/model/serial) get sent to NICS as part of the instant background check?

----------


## Pericles

> Ok, so we're talking about two different things then.  Im talking about the information that gets sent to NICS, AFPVet is talking about the actual form staying on record with the FFL holder for 10 years.  So the question is, does the specific gun information (make/model/serial) get sent to NICS as part of the instant background check?


The background check is name, place and date of birth.

----------


## bolil

Interestingly enough, a google search for nancy lanza last year brings up only current stories.  Works for other names though.  Indeed every return for "Nancy Lanza" in a google search has to do with the incident.

----------


## devil21

> The background check is name, place and date of birth.


You seem to know what you're talking about so sorry for all the questions.

Is this based on the official story or do you personally know this to be a fact?  Have you ever processed a background check yourself?  Any idea how the feds could cross-reference NICS info with 4473 gun specific information as needed in the future?

----------


## awake

There is one question that the shooter I'm certain asked himself: Will there be any one at the school, I am about to shoot up, carrying a gun that could possibly stop me? His answer would have been instantaneously and with near scientific certainty* no*. He realized that he had a open window of time where he could kill at will. Had he been unsure of this question...

Evil requires docility on behalf of its victims.

----------


## bolil

Also, spokeo some kind of data site lists a son for a nancy lanza, Ryan.  There is no adam listed.

----------


## devil21

> Interestingly enough, a google search for nancy lanza last year brings up only current stories.  Works for other names though.  Indeed every return for "Nancy Lanza" in a google search has to do with the incident.


CNN just interviewed a girl Alex Israel who said she knew the shooter since first grade and described him as typical autistic kid.  She said she knew the mother, then backtracked and said she didnt know her.....and did not say she knew her through school.  Said she was a nice lady, blah blah....then sorta added (paraphrased) "she had to be a nice woman since she obviously was a kindergarten teacher".  She came off as not having a clue what she was talking about and just regurgitating what she was told.

----------


## libertygrl

> Growing up and living in San Francisco taught me values of empathy and respectfulness for others around you.


  Well good for you. My parents taught me that as well.

----------


## Pericles

> You seem to know what you're talking about so sorry for all the questions.
> 
> Is this based on the official story or do you personally know this to be a fact?  Have you ever processed a background check yourself?  Any idea how the feds could cross-reference NICS info with 4473 gun specific information as needed in the future?


I'm sitting there while the FFL calls it in. The data on the weapon itself is not given - the NICS system just compares your name, and birthdate to the list of criminal records they have. If there is any doubt about whether you match a name in the DBs, they go to place of birth, or the dealer gets a delay message. If the dealer gets a delay - he has to submit the rest of the background info you gave to see if you are really a match. That is a lot of FFL hassle, so many try to avoid that by selling the stuff that only "respectable" people would buy.

I have as my address on my driver's license, and thus the 4473, an address at which I spend very little time .....

----------


## kathy88

> So you guys are really serious?    You believe this was a disturbed teen?
> 
> I say it is another United Nations hit job... to steal weapons.    The Colorado shooter's Dad was due to testify before the Congress against the LIBOR scandal ...
> 
> Eric Holder and Obama... and their crockodile tears... lmao ....     they murdered those kids today, with the plea of the United Nations...     Find info... about this kid's family before it is erased off of Google.
> 
> Holder whining about guns in the United States, when he sent ammo of mass destruction to drug cartels in Mexico ...   Holder murdered thousands of young children .... Obama has murdered thousands....  of  young children.    The perps lie within our government...    this savage attack was not of one human; but of our United Nations Government.    They will seek any means available to inact their bann of assault rifles...


daddy is the Vice President of Taxes for GE Energy Financial Services. Peter Lanza.

----------


## devil21

> I'm sitting there while the FFL calls it in. The data on the weapon itself is not given - the NICS system just compares your name, and birthdate to the list of criminal records they have. If there is any doubt about whether you match a name in the DBs, they go to place of birth, or the dealer gets a delay message. If the dealer gets a delay - he has to submit the rest of the background info you gave to see if you are really a match. That is a lot of FFL hassle, so many try to avoid that by selling the stuff that only "respectable" people would buy.
> 
> I have as my address on my driver's license, and thus the 4473, an address at which I spend very little time .....


Ok gotcha.  So if they did keep the inquiry information instead of destroying it, they could contact the FFL in the future and have the FFL pull up the form and get the gun specific info that way, if there were a pressing need such as a mass shooting like this, once they ID'ed the shooter.  Thanks for clearing it up.

----------


## devil21

Just saw on CNN (Piers in full ban mode tonite) that Michigan also just yesterday passed a law allowing more concealed carry in locations that were previously prohibited, provided the CCW holder takes some additional training.  I'd only heard about the Illinois court ruling.

----------


## Pericles

> Ok gotcha.  So if they did keep the inquiry information instead of destroying it, they could contact the FFL in the future and have the FFL pull up the form and get the gun specific info that way, if there were a pressing need such as a mass shooting like this, once they ID'ed the shooter.  Thanks for clearing it up.


Not exactly - if a weapon is part of a crime investigation, ATF does the trace from factory to FFL to form 4473. The ATF then tries to contact the person listed on the form 4473 and will ask to see the weapon. Either you still have it - and hterefore can't be the crime gun, you sold it in a private sale and you will be aske who bought it from you for more investigation, or you gave it to some one ... in states with gun registration. or specific permits tied to a weapon (don't know exactly because I don't live there) then the state local police can assist in the trace.

The NICS is like what happens when you get stopped by the police and they "run" your ID - if there is no match to a wanted person, the shouldn't be anything to leave behind as a result of a no match.

----------


## Odin

What type of weapon did he use?

----------


## devil21

> What type of weapon did he use?


Standard issue for mass killers.  Black guns.

----------


## tangent4ronpaul

> What type of weapon did he use?


A Glock and a Sig - calibers unknown, but I think one was mentioned as being .40 . That is a LE caliber for common LE guns, which these both are.

-t

----------


## Slutter McGee

> lol, ya government doesn't prevent teachers, etc. from being armed.


Yeah jackass, people were arguing direct causation of this incident. Not indirect causation of it getting out of control.

Sincerely,

Slutter McGee

----------


## libertygrl

NEWTOWN -- The man who authorities believe unleashed a bloody rampage at Sandy Hook Elementary School Friday was an honors student who was described a "socially awkward" youth.

Several sources have identified Adam Lanza as the 20-year-old man responsible for the deaths of 20 children and six adults at the school in a horrific scene that gripped the nation.

State police, who as of late Friday had yet to identify the shooter by name, said the shooter was found dead in the school. Sources cited by the Associated Press said it was a self-inflicted gunshot wound.

A woman who lives near the Lanza family said Lanza was a "reserved" and shy youth who appeared to be "troubled."

"His mother would always say how smart he was," said Beth Israel, who lives in the neighborhood and whose daughter was friends with Lanza while attending elementary school.

She added that Lanza, who was listed as receiving "high honors" while attending the ninth-grade at Newtown High School in May 2007, may have had a developmental disability.

Lanza's parents, Nancy and Peter Lanza, were divorced in 2009 after 28 years of marriage due to "irreconcilable differences," according to court documents.

About nine months after Nancy Lanza filed for the divorce, the couple worked out an agreement that included joint custody of Adam Lanza, who was 17 at the time, although he was to live primarily with his mother, the records state.

The divorce filings indicated that Adam Lanza had lived in Sandy Hook since his birth.

A source told Hearst Connecticut Newspapers that Nancy Lanza was a substitute teacher at the elementary school but was not at work on Friday when the shooting occurred.

The Associated Press reported that Nancy Lanza was found dead in her home.

State and local police blocked off the neighborhood surrounding a house in Newtown Friday on Yogananda Street that local property records state is owned by Nancy Lanza.

While State Police spokesman Lt. Paul Vance confirmed there was one fatality in a different location other than the school, he declined to identify the victim.

Officials cited by the Associated Press said Adam Lanza drove to the school in his mother's car and three guns were found at the scene. Two handguns, a Glock and a Sig Saur were found inside the school, officials said, while a .223-caliber rifle was recovered from the back of car in the school parking lot.

CNN, citing an unnamed law enforcement official, reported that Lanza entered the school building wearing "black battle fatigues and a military vest."

Originally, sources had identified the shooter as Ryan Lanza, 24, Adam Lanza's older brother who lives in Hoboken, NJ.

According to reports with NorthJersey.com, police surrounded a Hoboken apartment on Friday afternoon where the alleged shooters' older brother lived before taking him into custody for questioning.

Ryan Lanza has a Facebook page that posted updates Friday afternoon that read "it wasn't me" and "I was at work."

Peter Lanza, a vice president of taxes for GE Energy Financial Services, declined to answer questions from reporters in front of his home in Stamford in the Westover section of the city.

Lanza has worked as tax specialist and had served as an adjunct professor at Northeastern University in Boston since 1995.

A neighbor said Peter Lanza had recently remarried.

According to court documents, Peter Lanza was required to send significant alimony payments to Nancy Lanza, including monthly payments of $10,000 a month and increasing to a minimum of $12,450 up until 2023.

The court documents list Peter Lanza's gross weekly income as $8,556 and that he was required to pay all of Adam Lanza's college and graduate school expenses.

It wasn't immediately clear, however, if Lanza was attending college at the time of the shooting.

Peter and Nancy Champion Lanza were married in 1981 in Kingston, N.H.

According to a report Friday on the website of the Tampa Bay Times, Nancy Lanza's mother has a winter home in Brookville, Fla. In the article, she acknowledged to a reporter over the phone that Adam and his brother Ryan are her grandchildren. Her Facebook page links to two sons, Jack and James Champion.

James Champion, who lives in Kingston, N.H., where the Lanzas were married, is identified as a police officer. The Union Leader reported that he was "too distraught to comment" when reached by one of its reporters and that media arriving at his home were turned away by police.

Some of the early descriptions of Lanza are eerily similar to the two teenagers responsible for killing 13 people in April, 1999 at Columbine High School in Colorado.

Both Eric David Harris and Dylan Bennet Klebold, who also took their lives after the shooting rampage, were described as social outcasts who were troubled students and often the victim of bullies.

Harris and Klebold entered the Colorado school wearing black overcoats and were heavily armed in what was at the time the deadliest school shooting in the country's history.

The shooter in the April 2007 Virginia Tech killings that claimed 32 lives, Seung-Hui Cho, was found in an independent review after the slayings to have shown signs of depression and isolation and occasional instances of aberrant behavior at the university.

h ttp://www.chron.com/news/article/Reported-shooter-appeared-troubled-4120058.php

----------


## pochy1776

Gun control is now popular again. Opinion makers like ezra klein now have changed my opinion (not really, being sarcastic)
The boobus will now want immediate action. Thank you MSM.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/...united-states/
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/...oting-utopias/

----------


## AuH20

> What type of weapon did he use?


Sounds like two 9mms.

----------


## tangent4ronpaul

You must spread some reputation around before giving it to libertygirl again

-t

----------


## cjm

> There we go.
> 
> [IMG][/IMG]


I wonder how many of the 10,728 were justifiable homicides committed by lawfully armed citizens?

How many were officer-involved shootings?

----------


## EBounding

Can you imagine if this was an "al Queda attack"?

----------


## James Madison

> I wonder how many of the 10,728 were justifiable homicides committed by lawfully armed citizens?
> 
> How many were officer-involved shootings?


I wonder how many posting this are aware West Germany and Great Britain no longer exist.

----------


## presence

> How often did these types of things happen 30+ years ago?  Were they just as common and the news didn't spread because of the internet, or did they actually occur less?





> 1990
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun-Fre...es_Act_of_1990
> The Gun Free School Zones Act states:[6]
> 
>  (A) It shall be unlawful for any individual knowingly to possess a  firearm that has moved in or that otherwise affects interstate or  foreign commerce at a place that the individual knows, or has reasonable  cause to believe, is a school zone.


Before that we had:




> *The very atmosphere* of firearms anywhere and everywhere *restrains evil influence.*
>  They deserve a place of honour with all that's* good.* 
> When firearms go, all goes. 
> We need them _every hour._
> 
> *George Washington*

----------


## pochy1776

What about Switzerland, they now want gun control, so do the israelis. America is the only place where people are free to have guns. But, human natures coupled with Boobus, is gonna whine and rant about how we need to become a first world country.

----------


## tangent4ronpaul

> Gun control is now popular again. Opinion makers like ezra klein now have changed my opinion (not really, being sarcastic)
> The boobus will now want immediate action. Thank you MSM.
> http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/...united-states/
> http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/...oting-utopias/





> 3. Lots of guns don’t necessarily mean lots of shootings, as you can see in Israel and Switzerland.*
> 
> As David Lamp writes at Cato, “In Israel and Switzerland, for example, a license to possess guns is available on demand to every law-abiding adult, and guns are easily obtainable in both nations. Both countries also allow widespread carrying of concealed firearms, and yet, admits Dr. Arthur Kellerman, one of the foremost medical advocates of gun control, Switzerland and Israel ‘have rates of homicide that are low despite rates of home firearm ownership that are at least as high as those in the United States.’” 
> 
> *Correction: The info is out-of-date, if not completely wrong. Israel and Switzerland have tightened their gun laws substantially, and now pursue an entirely different approach then the United States. More details here. I apologize for the error.


Yes, Switzerland has tightened their gun laws a bit.  The problem is that they had too good of an economy.  Everyone was middle and upper class, and they needed ppl on the low end of the food chain.  Then came conflict, and they decided to ease residency requirements and offer asylum to middle eastern refuges.  This brought a rise in crime and even some pipe bombings.  So they clamped down on guns a bit.

-t

----------


## AuH20

The wise and powerful McCarthy has spoken. Destroy your guns while you have the opportunity to do so....

http://www.newsmax.com/Newsfront/gun...2/14/id/467867




> Among those leading the charge was one of Capitol Hill’s strongest gun-control advocates, nine-term New York Democratic Rep. Carolyn McCarthy.
> 
> She reminded the White House on Friday that she that “the gloves are off” if President Barack Obama did not work to toughen the nation’s gun laws.
> “I want to talk to the White House,” McCarthy told Politico. “I know that they can’t give me an answer tonight, but I want to know what they’re going to do. I need to know what they’re going to do.”
> 
> McCarthy’s husband was killed and son severely injured in a 1993 mass shooting on the Long Island Rail Road in New York.

----------


## pochy1776

Ezra Klein, You are not a good writer. i prefer..........................................

Here is what i read:
RT America
Al Jazeera
American Conservative
Taki's Magazine and
YAL Report

----------


## qh4dotcom



----------


## pochy1776

> 


Brilliant. I don't know but +rep.

----------


## Okie RP fan

^^ I used that pic to show a bunch of progressives, by the way. Hope no one minds.

----------


## James Madison

> ^^ I used that pic to show a bunch of progressives, by the way. Hope no one minds.


Be sure to tell us if their heads explode.

----------


## cjm

Since it hasn't been referenced, I'm guessing many RPFers are too young to remember this...




> Then one day Purdy decided it was time to go home.
> 
> He bought himself an AK-47 assault rifle over the counter of a local store. He caught a bus back to Stockton.
> 
> Purdy paid a visit to his old school, the Cleaveland Elementary School on January 17, 1989.
> 
> At 11.40 am Purdy parked his car outside the school, got out, set it alight, and walked through the front gate *armed with the AK-47 and two handguns*. He strode like a man on a mission *into a classroom and proceeded to randomly shoot at the children* sitting behind their desks. While Purdy was reeling of bullets his car exploded outside. Seemingly finished with the classroom kiddies Purdy calmly walked back outside and let loose with the AK-47. Survivors say he was firing the weapon in wide swoops, causing maximum carnage, in all directions. *After 130 shots of the automatic rifle Purdey pulled one of his handguns from his waistband and blew a large portion of his head off.*
> 
> The entire homecoming only took one and a half minutes but in that time Purdy managed to kill five kiddies and injure thirty-nine, six of those seriously.


http://murderpedia.org/male.P/p/purdy-patrick.htm

(this story differs slightly from the wikipedia account btw, ymmv)

----------


## pochy1776

Why, despite all the "facts" and MSM brainwashing, i still don't think Gun Control is the answer. Why do i never hear of gun violence in Texas or Missouri? Why only Northeastern or prominent states?

----------


## tangent4ronpaul

> What about Switzerland, they now want gun control, so do the israelis. *America is the only place where people are free to have guns.* But, human natures coupled with Boobus, is gonna whine and rant about how we need to become a first world country.


You are delusional!

I rented a room to a student a few years back that had grown up in the middle east and he wa checking out my AK.  He looks at it and the first thing he asks is "Where is the selector switch?"  I believe we are the only country in the world to have "assault weapons"(sic) that are strictly semi-automatic and don't rock and roll.  In some countries guns are banned and there are documented cases of the murder rates going up but the firearms murder rate going down.  In many other countries, you can easily buy weapons - AK-47's, RPG's. land mines, grenades, AA, whatever you want! - but Soviet and Chinese equipment is generally more abundant and cheap.

In parts of the middle east, you can buy a full auto AK for $50.  Here, because of the machine gun ban, they are scarce so demand a price in the thousands, then there is the $200 non-transferable transfer tax, sometimes state yearly taxes, a background check, fingerprints, interview, investigation and hopefully in a few months you get your gun.

SUCKS! - don't it?

-t

----------


## EBounding

> 


And anyone who posts this will be accused of politicizing.  

smh

----------


## pochy1776

> You are delusional!
> 
> I rented a room to a student a few years back that had grown up in the middle east and he wa checking out my AK.  He looks at it and the first thing he asks is "Where is the selector switch?"  I believe we are the only country in the world to have "assault weapons"(sic) that are strictly semi-automatic and don't rock and roll.  In some countries guns are banned and there are documented cases of the murder rates going up but the firearms murder rate going down.  In many other countries, you can easily buy weapons - AK-47's, RPG's. land mines, grenades, AA, whatever you want! - but Soviet and Chinese equipment is generally more abundant and cheap.
> 
> In parts of the middle east, you can buy a full auto AK for $50.  Here, because of the machine gun ban, they are scarce so demand a price in the thousands, then there is the $200 non-transferable transfer tax, sometimes state yearly taxes, a background check, fingerprints, interview, investigation and hopefully in a few months you get your gun.
> 
> SUCKS! - don't it?
> 
> 
> ...


We should just ARM everyone. I think every citizen should be given a gun. Well, not really. Guns are like Drugs in the world. 

Switzerland is good because they are responsible. Downside, required to serve in a military (small price to pay.) 
You can't have everything.

----------


## cjm

> Why, despite all the "facts" and MSM brainwashing, i still don't think Gun Control is the answer. Why do i never hear of gun violence in Texas or Missouri? Why only Northeastern or prominent states?


Texas had Charles Whitman and Luby's.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Whitman
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luby%27s_massacre

----------


## Anti Federalist

> I am not going to lose my temper in this thread, though I am tempted.


Why not?




> The government doesn't go around causing these horrible things. They simply take advantage of the situation after they happen. So even though I think your crazy for considering the deaths of 18 little kids as nothing more than a government plot, the results afterwards are the same.


I fail to see what the difference is.

The fact of the matter is that they (government) *have* done such things in the past, and *are* doing such things now.

Whether you want to admit that or not is up to you.




> Some people are seriously disturbed. Society has had these individuals for all of its existence. I don't know why now we must consider it some kind of conspiracy.


Because sometimes it is. Who knows about this particular case, but it certainly has the earmarks of it.




> Second off, I will still insist on sending my children to public school or private school. Where they can play football, or be in the band. Where they can develop the social skills that so many home schooled kids lack.


Be my guest. 

Please refrain from sending heavily armed men to my home to make me pay for that, when I do not "use" that "service" or force my children to attend at the barrel of a gun. 

Thank you.




> Finally, I am glad we can all agree that the most important thing for tonight and tomorrow, is prayer for the victims. And this is coming from somebody who doubts God. I will say a prayer just in case.
> 
> Sincerely,
> 
> Slutter McGee


Perhaps, if you doubt God, a moment of silent introspection would be more "sincere".

----------


## Odin

> A Glock and a Sig - calibers unknown, but I think one was mentioned as being .40 . That is a LE caliber for common LE guns, which these both are.
> 
> -t


So not assault weapons then?

----------


## tangent4ronpaul

> So not assault weapons then?


It was found locked in the trunk. The rifle.

-t

----------


## James Madison

> It was found locked in the trunk. The rifle.
> 
> -t


Why didn't he bring the rifle?

Strange choice of weapons.

----------


## Odin

> It was found locked in the trunk. The rifle.
> 
> -t


So basically the killer thought he would be more deadly with 2 guns that would remain legal in any case, than with the assault weapon that everyone thinks we need to ban?

----------


## Anti Federalist

> (/tinfoil hat on)
> 
> Just a random thought here, but if the doors of the school were locked at 9:30 and all visitors were required to be let in by school officials after that time, how did he get inside?  Seems to me a guy wearing black fatigues and a bulletproof vest (nevermind carrying two guns) would probably not be let in.  Seems like a reasonable assumption.  Now, consider the gun types used according to the media.  A Glock and a Sig.  Who carries Glocks and Sigs almost in entirety?  COPS!  Who would be let in by school officials, no questions asked?  COPS!
> 
> See where I'm going with this?  Just connecting the dots....  [/tinfoil]


Nothing tin foil hattey about it.

That's how Anders Breivik (Norway mass killer last year) was able to carry out his "mission" with almost no questioning.

He was dressed up as a cop.

And in the "civilized" nations of the West, that's a free pass to do just about anything you want without question.

----------


## tangent4ronpaul

> So basically the killer thought he would be more deadly with *2 guns that would remain legal* in any case, than with the assault weapon that everyone thinks we need to ban?


Oh, members of Congress want to ban some pistols.  Well, starting with magazine capacity - for which smaller cap mags do not exist for some...  Or anything that will accept a higher cap mag...  Camels nose under tent...

-t

----------


## pochy1776

$#@! YOU STATIST LOVING MSM

----------


## qh4dotcom



----------


## phill4paul

> 


  True.

----------


## James Madison

> Nothing tin foil hattey about it.
> 
> That's how Anders Breivik (Norway mass killer last year) was able to carry out his "mission" with almost no questioning.
> 
> *He was dressed up as a cop.
> 
> And in the "civilized" nations of the West, that's a free pass to do just about anything you want without question.*


I'm noticing a lot of people on message boards saying that only police and military should be allowed to own guns. 'Civilian' ownership should be outlawed. No way that could go wrong....

----------


## Anti Federalist

> I'm noticing a lot of people on message boards saying that only police and military should be allowed to own guns. 'Civilian' ownership should be outlawed. No way that could go wrong....


That's a great idea, yeah!

Oh...wait.

----------


## liberty2897

> That's a great idea, yeah!
> 
> Oh...wait.


Hey,  where are they going?  That looks like fun...  Can I come too?

----------


## bolil

Armed society: tragedy the exception.
Disarmed society: tragedy the rule.

----------


## pochy1776

> Armed society: tragedy the exception.
> Disarmed society: tragedy the rule.


Why are there lower rates of violence in Japan and other countries that banned guns?

----------


## bolil

> Why are there lower rates of violence in Japan and other countries that banned guns?


Might have to do with a lower base population.  I don't care much for rates, and statistics, and other numbers that are easily manipulated so: $#@!ed if I know.

Let me ask you a questions: What did Hitler, Stalin, and Mao have in common?

----------


## Odin

> Why are there lower rates of violence in Japan and other countries that banned guns?


Why are there higher rates in the UK and other countries that banned guns?

----------


## BSU kid

> Why are there lower rates of violence in Japan and other countries that banned guns?


Because they are vastly smaller, have a more homogenous population and have better education. :-/

----------


## pochy1776

> Why are there higher rates in the UK and other countries that banned guns?


I need the source.

----------


## Anti Federalist

> Why are there lower rates of violence in Japan and other countries that banned guns?


A more docile and compliant society.

All rates of crime are lower, not just "gun crime".

In addition to the fact that police have even greater powers than here.

----------


## bolil

wheres your source? pochy? and answer my question now.

----------


## James Madison

> Why are there lower rates of violence in Japan and other countries that banned guns?


The rate of violence is almost purely cultural in these cases.

Japan has a long history of isolation from the outside world, being an island nation. With few natural resources, Japanese culture adopted a highly collectivist mindset, whereby the individual is always second to the group as a whole. People learned to 'fall in line' because self-indulgence and individual expression could jeopardize the entire community. It's not just gun violence that's rare in Japan, it's all violence. Crime is virtually unheard of because of long-standing cultural taboos against selfishness, pridefullness, and greed. This is why Japanese people are so humble and polite and why they look negatively on people who are boastful, loud, and brash. It's great at times, but it comes at the cost of being an individual.

This is the exact opposite of America. With tons of resources and even more space, we're free to be who we choose to (not so much any more. whatever). With a culture of extreme individualism comes more crime, but it also leads to wealth, prosperity, and freedom. The Japanese never enjoyed freedom until recent decades, certainly never to the extent we used to have. 

Switzerland has a low crime rate, as well. This is largely because they have a small, most homogenous population with many values in common. They've also chosen to abstain from every major war of the 20th and 21st Century. No war = no blood-lust. Again, it's cultural.

----------


## Odin

> I need the source.


'

You didn't provide one for your Japan assertion. 

It is fairly common knowledge that the UK has higher rate of violent crime.

----------


## tangent4ronpaul

> Why are there lower rates of violence in Japan and other countries that banned guns?


Japan is a weird culture.  They pack people in at a density that drives all other animals, including humans, insane.  If you put down a bag of groceries on the sidewalk and walk away, it will still be there in an hour.  Guns are actually legal in Japan, but the legal BS to own one is incredible!

Compare this with, say, Jamaica, where guns were banned and confiscated - house to house style.  And GASP! The firearms murder rate actually went down! - YEAH GUN CONTROL!!! ... Oh wait a min..  The actual violent crime rate, the murder rate - and hell crime in general, increased!  How could that be?  Well, people are adaptive, and with a populous unable to defend itself, the machete became the weapon of choice.  Would you rather be murdered by being shot or hacked to death?  Decisions, decisions...  John Lott has written about this and I'm writing based on what I remember reading of him.

-t

----------


## jkob

I can't bring myself to watch the disaster porn

----------


## XTreat

> Celebrities weigh in. Brace yourselves before you read this:
> 
> http://www.eonline.com/news/371720/c...age-toward-nra


Jesus Christ.  I just lost cognitive thought for 15 seconds.

----------


## XTreat

> Why are there lower rates of violence in Japan and other countries that banned guns?


""

I am in Korea where guns are banned, I have no evidence of this, but my Korean friends swear that people do indeed own guns and use them. They say the reports of non-violent society in the east is a fake creation of media and government.

----------


## tangent4ronpaul

> I can't bring myself to watch the disaster porn





> Jesus Christ.  I just lost cognitive thought for 15 seconds.


Mommie got you hun.  Just lean over and let me cradle your head.  Let all that bad stuff out.  Sing to the porcelain god!

I know what you mean - I'd rather be Rick Rolled!

Please post stronger warnings next time....

-t

----------


## UWDude

> Crime is virtually unheard of because of long-standing cultural taboos against selfishness, pridefullness, and greed. This is why Japanese people are so humble and polite and why they look negatively on people who are boastful, loud, and brash. It's great at times, but it comes at the cost of being an individual.


Sounds neat, but false.
Ever hear of the Yakuza?

----------


## James Madison

> Sounds neat, but false.
> Ever hear of the Yakuza?


I've heard of the video game...

And, yes, I'm sure there's been _some_ crime in Japan's centuries of existence.

----------


## tangent4ronpaul

> Sounds neat, but false.
> Ever hear of the Yakuza?


Population is higher than I would have thought.

Yakuza, 102,400 members
Pop of JP:  127,817,277

so 1 in every 1.25 Thousand citizens are a member.  I've also read that they wear distinctive tattoos that the general population recognizes and stays the hell away from!

But then again, on the Internet, no one really knows you are a dog.

-t

----------


## Natural Citizen

OK, people. Open lines tonight on the highest rated night time radio program in the world. The subject is *Newtown School Shooting/ Open Lines* on Coast to Coast AM.

In the first hour, research scientist John Lott will react to calls for greater gun control in the wake of the Newtown school shooting. In the second hour, author and psychologist Peter Breggin will share his thoughts on the tragedy. Followed by Open Lines. 

The show is just starting as I post this and will continue with three hours of open lines after discussion. George is now discussing the massive attack on the 2nd amendment that will be coming in the next months.

*Live Stream* -- http://www.newsradioklbj.com/Other/Stream.html

*Western US*:
1-800-618-8255 (toll free)

*Eastern US*:
1-800-825-5033 (toll free)

*First time caller*:
1-818-501-4721

*Wild Card line*:
1-818-501-4109 (anyone can call)

*Skype* users call:
george97313

*Text*:
1-818-298-6521


*International Instructions*
Toll Free: (Sprint Direct Access Number)
1-800-893-0903, Press Option 5

----------


## A_Silent_Majority_Member

you awake hands bound in the back of a van with a cell phone to your ear.
"we have your family." a strange voice says.. you hear your mothers sobs on the other end.
the strange voice then instructs you to do a task or your family will pay the price. you hesitate only to hear the bang and your mothers cries of agony.
you contemplate taking your own life as sacrifice but are informed any attempt to do so will result in dire consequences for your mother and any remaining family.

what would you do? 

the strange voice continues to give you further instructions.. a set of pistols is offered to you.. you contemplate taking matters into your own hands to maybe shoot your way out but are assured that just as attempting to take your own life would result in your families deaths, this action to will have the same consequence.

what would you do?

you are informed that one of your captors will accompany you in this venture and upon completion you and your family will be set free.

what would you do?

the task at hand is revealed to be of such atrocity, how can anyone do this? yet your hesitation has now just costed a family members life and a countdown begins for the next in line.

what would you do?

... breaking news... shots fired, many dead.. shooter dead..second gunman(who always later vanishes).. how could this happen? why? more laws to be enacted soon after as usual.

stranger than fiction indeed.

----------


## XTreat

> Sounds neat, but false.
> Ever hear of the Yakuza?


You should go to the Korean or Japaneses war museums. You think ours is a bloody history? A culture of non-violence? Hardly.

----------


## A_Silent_Majority_Member

another thought on US gun crime statistics.. gangs...guns.... drugs.... drug war..... hmmmm.

----------


## papitosabe

> The government doesn't go around causing these horrible things.


gov't doesn't allow chemicals in ours and our kids food to ingest?, they don't allow fluoride in our drinking water?, gov't doesn't allow our kids to be put on prescription? drugs at an early age?, gov't doesn't allow mercury fillings in our teeth?.... all those issues affect brain function and cause mental issues... GOV'T studies may say its safe, but we all know its bull$#@!...it affects some more than others....we all know someone close to us with mental issues...the gov't makes money on our mental issues...  could other problems have caused this person to go off like this, most likely, but to say the govt's hands are clean I would say is a blind belief..

----------


## UWDude

> Population is higher than I would have thought.
> 
> Yakuza, 102,400 members
> Pop of JP:  127,817,277
> 
> so 1 in every 1.25 Thousand citizens are a member.  I've also read that they wear distinctive tattoos that the general population recognizes and stays the hell away from!
> 
> But then again, on the Internet, no one really knows you are a dog.
> 
> -t


Next look up "Hells Angels" membership.  I think they only have like 4000 members.
The four major biker gangs combined probably only have 8-9000 members.
MS-13, the most notorious Mexican gang, IIRC, "only" has 24,000 members.

----------


## UWDude

> I've heard of the video game...
> 
> And, yes, I'm sure there's been _some_ crime in Japan's centuries of existence.


Japan has crime.  Japan has lots of crime.  Both violent and white collar.  Drugs and prostitution.
EVERYWHERE has crime.

----------


## papitosabe

> ""
> 
> I am in Korea where guns are banned, I have no evidence of this, but my Korean friends swear that people do indeed own guns and use them. They say the reports of non-violent society in the east is a fake creation of media and government.


RUN, now!  or that will probably the last post of your life.... :P

----------


## anaconda

> Celebrities weigh in. Brace yourselves before you read this:
> 
> http://www.eonline.com/news/371720/c...age-toward-nra



Celebrities simply must be government operatives.

----------


## idiom

Dunno if this is news here yet...

http://www.latimes.com/news/world/wo...,6383015.story




> BEIJING -- A man with a knife slashed 22 children and one adult outside an elementary school in Henan province Friday morning, China's worst such incident in more than a year.
> The attack was reminiscent of a spate of knife attacks on schoolchildren that took place across China in 2010. In most cases, the attackers were unemployed middle-aged men, leading to speculation that the assaults stemmed from economic and social discontent.
> 
> Friday's attack occurred at about 7:40 a.m. as children were arriving outside the gate of Chenpeng Villages Wanquan Elementary School. The suspect, Min Yingjun, 36, allegedly slashed an elderly woman as well as the children. Local propaganda officials said later that Min had a psychological illness.


Same day. No guns.

----------


## anaconda

> Speaking up for ourselves is mourning.


Thank you. I couldn't agree more.

----------


## juleswin

> Dunno if this is news here yet...
> 
> http://www.latimes.com/news/world/wo...,6383015.story
> 
> 
> 
> Same day. No guns.


But how many of those slashes were fatalities? I bet you most people will prefer slashes to fatal gun shoot

----------


## tangent4ronpaul

I think this event might just blow the curve on Google's top search report for 2012.  It is still 2012, after all...

-t

----------


## UpperDecker

Sorry if this has already been discussed, but I don't have the time or patience to go through 67 pages haha.  Is there any word on the mental state of the shooter, or any prescriptions he might have been on?

----------


## James Madison

> I think this event might just blow the curve on Google's top search report for 2012.  It is still 2012, after all...
> 
> -t


Well, the world's gonna end in a week. I figure that will get a lot of play.

----------


## devil21

> you awake hands bound in the back of a van with a cell phone to your ear.
> "we have your family." a strange voice says.. you hear your mothers sobs on the other end.
> the strange voice then instructs you to do a task or your family will pay the price. you hesitate only to hear the bang and your mothers cries of agony.
> you contemplate taking your own life as sacrifice but are informed any attempt to do so will result in dire consequences for your mother and any remaining family.
> 
> what would you do? 
> 
> the strange voice continues to give you further instructions.. a set of pistols is offered to you.. you contemplate taking matters into your own hands to maybe shoot your way out but are assured that just as attempting to take your own life would result in your families deaths, this action to will have the same consequence.
> 
> ...


Sorta fiction already because it sounds like a test in the SAW movie series.........similar to the end of SAW 3 actually.




eta:  The SAW movie series is great insight into the mind of psychopaths and human instinct to survive.  These movies make any particular plot seem very easy to pull off so scenarios like you describe are definitely possible.  

Unlikely maybe but possible.

----------


## devil21

Do those celebrities know that most of their bodyguards are carrying?

----------


## paulbot24

> Do those celebrities know that most of their bodyguards are carrying?


 "I don't really _think_, I just _walk_." - Paris Hilton

My guess is probably not.

----------


## vienna

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of..._homicide_rate

----------


## DerailingDaTrain

> you awake hands bound in the back of a van with a cell phone to your ear.
> "we have your family." a strange voice says.. you hear your mothers sobs on the other end.
> the strange voice then instructs you to do a task or your family will pay the price. you hesitate only to hear the bang and your mothers cries of agony.
> you contemplate taking your own life as sacrifice but are informed any attempt to do so will result in dire consequences for your mother and any remaining family.
> 
> what would you do? 
> 
> the strange voice continues to give you further instructions.. a set of pistols is offered to you.. you contemplate taking matters into your own hands to maybe shoot your way out but are assured that just as attempting to take your own life would result in your families deaths, this action to will have the same consequence.
> 
> ...


SMH

----------


## Schifference

Maybe the kid really loved the Dad and felt that the post divorce financial arrangements  were unfair and figured out a way to nullify the settlement.



> NEWTOWN -- The man who authorities believe unleashed a bloody rampage at Sandy Hook Elementary School Friday was an honors student who was described a "socially awkward" youth.
> 
> Several sources have identified Adam Lanza as the 20-year-old man responsible for the deaths of 20 children and six adults at the school in a horrific scene that gripped the nation.
> 
> State police, who as of late Friday had yet to identify the shooter by name, said the shooter was found dead in the school. Sources cited by the Associated Press said it was a self-inflicted gunshot wound.
> 
> A woman who lives near the Lanza family said Lanza was a "reserved" and shy youth who appeared to be "troubled."
> 
> "His mother would always say how smart he was," said Beth Israel, who lives in the neighborhood and whose daughter was friends with Lanza while attending elementary school.
> ...

----------


## vienna

http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/datab...orld-list#data

----------


## tod evans

Surely a nasty divorce would have no effect on a child..




> NEWTOWN -- The man who authorities believe unleashed a bloody rampage at Sandy Hook Elementary School Friday was an honors student who was described a "socially awkward" youth.
> 
> Several sources have identified Adam Lanza as the 20-year-old man responsible for the deaths of 20 children and six adults at the school in a horrific scene that gripped the nation.
> 
> State police, who as of late Friday had yet to identify the shooter by name, said the shooter was found dead in the school. Sources cited by the Associated Press said it was a self-inflicted gunshot wound.
> 
> A woman who lives near the Lanza family said Lanza was a "reserved" and shy youth who appeared to be "troubled."
> 
> "His mother would always say how smart he was," said Beth Israel, who lives in the neighborhood and whose daughter was friends with Lanza while attending elementary school.
> ...

----------


## UWDude

> http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/datab...orld-list#data


Just an interesting sidenote:

Iraq hardly ever has any data for anything.  
They don't want any journalists researching and comparing before and after.

----------


## JK/SEA

anti-gun lobby has blood on their hands.

----------


## pochy1776

> wheres your source? pochy? and answer my question now.


http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/...d-gun-control/

annoying article by $#@!ehead klein.

----------


## Petar

The twisted dum dum head may also have been jealous of the attention that his mother gave to the kindergarteners.

----------


## itshappening

$10,000 a month alimony ??? that is just rape by another name

what does she need 10k a month for to provide for the kid? come on now, that's ludicrous on the male.  Another case of the man getting screwed.

----------


## cjm

No security footage from the parking lot or main entrance released yet?

----------


## itshappening

Still wondering how he got buzzed in with his black fatigues.  Also no details on what meds he was on and what his mental problems were. 

Not much info at all really.  I wonder if they're manufacturing it as we speak ?

----------


## cjm

> Still wondering how he got buzzed in with his black fatigues.  Also no details on what meds he was on and what his mental problems were. 
> 
> Not much info at all really.  I wonder if they're manufacturing it as we speak ?


I think the "security letter" that the parents got said the building locked down at 9:30.  Maybe he walked in before that and just hid somewhere?

----------


## osan

> http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/datab...orld-list#data


The list has no credibility.  How can a nation that shows no data be given a ranking?

What sorts of fools do you think we are?

----------


## itshappening

> I think the "security letter" that the parents got said the building locked down at 9:30.  Maybe he walked in before that and just hid somewhere?


You'd think a 20 year old male with black fatigues and a bunch of guns might stand out a bit...

He has to get through the front entrance which is surely manned? How did he get in and how did he get to the classroom? that's the question .

----------


## osan

> Still wondering how he got buzzed in with his black fatigues.  Also no details on what meds he was on and what his mental problems were. 
> 
> Not much info at all really.  I wonder if they're manufacturing it as we speak ?


Notice how the news articles refer to him as "_socially_" this or that.  The established, yet highly tacit fundamentals of newspeak are working overtime.

----------


## cjm

> You'd think a 20 year old male with black fatigues and a bunch of guns might stand out a bit...
> 
> He has to get through the front entrance which is surely manned? How did he get in and how did he get to the classroom? that's the question .


If his mother taught there (which still isn't clear to me), he might have been known to the staff.  If he walked in with plain clothes and a duffel full of gear to "drop something off" in the classroom before school started, that wouldn't necessarily raise eyebrows.  Hide somewhere, change into fatigues, whatever.  That's why I'm interested in seeing some footage.  What did he look like when he entered?  What time did he enter?  Was there other activity in the parking lot around the time he entered?  etc.

----------


## RonPaulFanInGA



----------


## PaulConventionWV

> Do those celebrities know that most of their bodyguards are carrying?


lol I wonder how they would feel if their body guards didn't have guns...

----------


## SewrRatt

> 


Hopefully Chuckie Bloomer will one day realize that his scenario doesn't exactly end optimally if you like good people.

The idiots running "Flashbunny.org" don't have the excuse of being a credulous six-year-old, though.

----------


## A Son of Liberty

> I think the "security letter" that the parents got said the building locked down at 9:30.  Maybe he walked in before that and just hid somewhere?


I thought I heard this morning on the news that he shot through the door; in which case one would assume the door to be glass.

As to the question of a "manned" door, speaking from my experience with public schools, both personally, as a student intern, and before we took my kid out and put him in a private school, I never once saw anyone standing at the door.  The office generally is situated near the front door, but there was never anyone manning it, other than to open the doors and let the students in.  So I don't think it would be all too rare for a school's front door to be unmanned.  Most people living in towns like this have no reason to expect something like this would ever happen.  And most of them are quite right.  It's just an extraordinarily sad event which we'll likely be synthesizing and deconstructing for quite some time.

----------


## A Son of Liberty

> lol I wonder how they would feel if their body guards didn't have guns...


Every single one of those bastards who chirp away about gun control should be the first to have their and/or their bodyguards weapon taken.

----------


## cjm

> I thought I heard this morning on the news that he shot through the door; in which case one would assume the door to be glass.
> 
> As to the question of a "manned" door, speaking from my experience with public schools, both personally, as a student intern, and before we took my kid out and put him in a private school, I never once saw anyone standing at the door.  The office generally is situated near the front door, but there was never anyone manning it, other than to open the doors and let the students in.  So I don't think it would be all too rare for a school's front door to be unmanned.  Most people living in towns like this have no reason to expect something like this would ever happen.  And most of them are quite right.  It's just an extraordinarily sad event which we'll likely be synthesizing and deconstructing for quite some time.


The local elementary school here also has an office near the door without anyone actually manning the door itself, but the door is locked and there's a monitor in the office.  To get past that front door, you buzz the intercom, they look you over through the camera and sometimes ask you a question or two through the intercom, and then buzz you in.  The impression I got from the letter (which I should probably dig up to re-read) was that they had a security system like this to buzz people in.  Moot point if he shot through a glass door though.

----------


## osan

> Hopefully Chuckie Bloomer will one day realize that his scenario doesn't exactly end optimally if you like good people.


Given the context, that sentiment jumps the synapse from "hope" to "psychosis".

----------


## donnay

> The local elementary school here also has an office near the door without anyone actually manning the door itself, but the door is locked and there's a monitor in the office.  To get past that front door, you buzz the intercom, they look you over through the camera and sometimes ask you a question or two through the intercom, and then buzz you in.  The impression I got from the letter (which I should probably dig up to re-read) was that they had a security system like this to buzz people in.  Moot point if he shot through a glass door though.



Even as we speak this story keeps changing.  Now it is, "Adam forced his way in."

These were first reports I heard:

"Just before 9:30 a.m., according to still developing reports, Adam Lanza, 20, *walked into the school in Newtown, Conn*., and opened fire on students and staff. Unofficial reports have the body count at 26, at least 20 of them children, with still more being treated at nearby Danbury Hospital. Lanza then shot and killed himself."
http://www.thedailybeast.com/article...dam-lanza.html

"That morning, Adam Lanza walked into Sandy Hook Elementary School in Newtown, Connecticut, dressed in "black battle fatigues and a military vest" and began firing, according to a law enforcement source. By the time he was done, 26 were dead -- 20 of them young students."
http://www.cnn.com/2012/12/14/justic...spect-profile/

"According to police, Lanza burst into the elementary school on Friday morning sometime after 9 a.m., armed with four firearms and wearing a bullet-proof vest."
http://global.christianpost.com/news...shooter-86683/

"Cops said Lanza forced his way into the school before silently walking through and opening fire — leaving among his victims, 20 children aged five to ten."
http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage...-massacre.html

*Gunman who killed 26 forced his way into Connecticut elementary school, police say*
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/12/15...cticut-school/



The narrative will change even more in the days and weeks ahead.  Of course to suit the ones trying to legislate gun confiscation against the people.

----------


## Dark_Horse_Rider

> ""
> 
> I am in Korea where guns are banned, I have no evidence of this, but my Korean friends swear that people do indeed own guns and use them. They say the reports of non-violent society in the east is a fake creation of media and government.


yeah i seem to remember several acid incidents happening in that region

----------


## coastie

> The local elementary school here also has an office near the door without anyone actually manning the door itself, but the door is locked and there's a monitor in the office.  To get past that front door, you buzz the intercom, they look you over through the camera and sometimes ask you a question or two through the intercom, and then buzz you in.  The impression I got from the letter (which I should probably dig up to re-read) was that they had a security system like this to buzz people in.  Moot point if he shot through a glass door though.


I wish my kid's schools were like that. It would be extraordinarily quick and easy to get into both schools, within seconds a shooter would be in classrooms. I've accidentally carried into school on several occasions. While I am always aware of where my weapon is, its easy to forget about doing what I'm "supposed" to be doing when I carry, like not go to victim disarmament zones with my CCW. Its easy to forget because what you're supposed to do today is not be armed to defend yourself, wait several minutes on the police while they gather around in their tactical stand-by circles waiting for the shooting to stop. Well, that's just stupid, does not compute in my head. 

I'll continue to carry wherever I go, especially after studying the effects of big pharma's poison and their role and nearly every mass shooting since 1967. You can beg all you want with these people, and they'll pull the trigger just the same. I don't really care what their motivation is-if I see a weirdo with a gun come in, I know at least I'll be there to try to stop him. Better than waiting around for a SWAT team to save you 30 minutes later.

These are the zombies of our time. These incidents are happening when they stop or switch medications too fast. Imagine that on the scale of what's to come during a sudden economic collapse or natural disaster and the nearly 100 million people in the world currently prescribed these drugs-all suddenly stopping them at once.

Guess where over 60% of those people are? USA.

----------


## Dark_Horse_Rider

> you awake hands bound in the back of a van with a cell phone to your ear.
> "we have your family." a strange voice says.. you hear your mothers sobs on the other end.
> the strange voice then instructs you to do a task or your family will pay the price. you hesitate only to hear the bang and your mothers cries of agony.
> you contemplate taking your own life as sacrifice but are informed any attempt to do so will result in dire consequences for your mother and any remaining family.
> 
> what would you do? 
> 
> the strange voice continues to give you further instructions.. a set of pistols is offered to you.. you contemplate taking matters into your own hands to maybe shoot your way out but are assured that just as attempting to take your own life would result in your families deaths, this action to will have the same consequence.
> 
> ...


i remember 10 or so years ago in NY when there were a few cases of people walking into banks with bombcollars on that told a similar tale, but to please give them all the cash. . .

some were detonated before a solution could be found for the victims

----------


## Danke

> Japan has crime.  Japan has lots of crime.  Both violent and white collar.  Drugs and prostitution.
> EVERYWHERE has crime.


Sure they have crime.  But one can walk anywhere at anytime and feel safe (at least when I lived there).

----------


## JK/SEA

i wonder if this school will ever be used again...

----------


## pcosmar

> Sure they have crime.  But one can walk anywhere at anytime and feel safe (at least when I lived there).


I have done the same here. Both as an armed man and as unarmed.

I have been comfortable in places where there were armed people,,  partying. And have never had any trouble in such a place.

I have also committed a crime, (long ago) armed. But had no intention of harming anyone except perhaps myself. 
I was borderline suicidal,, or at least "self destructive" at the time,, but was not using any of the SSRI type drugs.

II have lived in a place with the most violent people in our society,, where they are locked away. And in a most authoritarian environment.

I have traveled across this country a couple times,, both legally and illegally.

Violence is a reality. 
in nature,, in society . it is a fact of life.
I have observed it to be much less common when there is freedom. (lifetime observation)

I would rather have a Free society. More Freedom=Less violence.
Authoritarian= More violence

----------


## cjm

> I've accidentally carried into school on several occasions...


The Virginia legislature loosened up some of the K-12 carrying last session.  IIRC, it used to be that you couldn't go on the school property at all.  Now (with concealed carry permit), you can drive on to the school property legally and pick-up or drop-off as long as you don't leave your car.  A small improvement, but it's a step.  It will be interesting to see what happens in the next legislative session.

----------


## UpperDecker

Wow, the anti-gun lobby has to have the worst arguments ever.  I have seen people using pure gun homicide stats (ie: US vs Switzerland) which makes absolutely no sense considering the population difference.  People also don't seem to look at the overall homicide rates when comparing countries, which shows a completely different picture.  And god forbid they think when look at the stats and keep in mind the impact of the failed drug war and all things included.  I have also seen people use Norway as an example of how the US should be, but conveniently leave out the Anders Breivik incident. /rant

----------


## pochy1776

> Wow, the anti-gun lobby has to have the worst arguments ever.  I have seen people using pure gun homicide stats (ie: US vs Switzerland) which makes absolutely no sense considering the population difference.  People also don't seem to look at the overall homicide rates when comparing countries, which shows a completely different picture.  And god forbid they think when look at the stats and keep in mind the impact of the failed drug war and all things included.  I have also seen people use Norway as an example of how the US should be, but conveniently leave out the Anders Breivik incident. /rant


why does it seem like their winning and have the facts? why is Ezra Klien so succesful yet we are not?

----------


## UpperDecker

> why does it seem like their winning and have the facts? why is Ezra Klien so succesful yet we are not?


I don't see anybody "winning" right now, and as I said in my post I have not seen any worthwhile stats or facts.

----------


## pochy1776

> I don't see anybody "winning" right now, and as I said in my post I have not seen any worthwhile stats or facts.


http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/...united-states/

can anybody debunk this, he rescided number 3 and thinks guns are all bad. I still don't believe this is good journalism.

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## UpperDecker

> http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/...united-states/
> 
> can anybody debunk this, he rescided number 3 and thinks guns are all bad. I still don't believe this is good journalism.


Hmmm, interesting.  What are the overall homicide rates in those countries?  And do they have anything remotely close to the gang problems and drug wars that we face here in the US?  (Honest questions, I haven't looked into these things yet myself)

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## pochy1776

> Hmmm, interesting.  What are the overall homicide rates in those countries?  And do they have anything remotely close to the gang problems and drug wars that we face here in the US?  (Honest questions, I haven't looked into these things yet myself)


You can wiki it.

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## dillo

Does anyone else find it interesting that in all these mass shootings the initial reports have listed multiple gunmen

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## pcosmar

> And do they have anything remotely close to the gang problems and drug wars that we face here in the US?


Well, would not the roots and causes for that be the government? Creating a Black Market, and restricting trade?

Seems that the violence is created by the same Authoritarians that some want to give more power to.

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## cjm

> http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/...united-states/
> 
> can anybody debunk this, he rescided number 3 and thinks guns are all bad. I still don't believe this is good journalism.


debunk what?  I have a natural right to bear arms, period.

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## Brian4Liberty

> Wow, the anti-gun lobby has to have the worst arguments ever.  I have seen people using pure gun homicide stats (ie: US vs Switzerland) which makes absolutely no sense considering the population difference.  People also don't seem to look at the overall homicide rates when comparing countries, which shows a completely different picture.  And god forbid they think when look at the stats and keep in mind the impact of the failed drug war and all things included.  I have also seen people use Norway as an example of how the US should be, but conveniently leave out the Anders Breivik incident. /rant


Lies, damned lies, and leftist statistics.

And they are using total gun deaths too, which is more than 50% suicide, not homicide. The homicides are mostly gang related. Two areas that gun control will not effect.

It is a a little funny when the faction of "emotion" attempts to use statistics. They are statistically (and scientifically) incompetent. Doesn't matter to them though.

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## UpperDecker

> Well, would not the roots and causes for that be the government? Creating a Black Market, and restricting trade?
> 
> Seems that the violence is created by the same Authoritarians that some want to give more power to.


Yep, this is what I have been trying to talk to friends about.  I try to get them to understand that pushing things towards the black market is a bad way to go.  People need to face it, we have opened pandora's box with the creation of guns and I don't see a way that we will ever be able to rid the world of guns.

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## MoneyWhereMyMouthIs2

My local news now keeps saying his "primary weapon" was a "rifle."  I thought the rifle was found in his trunk at the school.

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## Confederate

Classy ABC, very classy.

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## Confederate

And another vulture:

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## TheTexan

> My local news now keeps saying his "primary weapon" was a "rifle."  I thought the rifle was found in his trunk at the school.


I figured they would.  It fits the desired narrative.

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## Pericles

> I'm noticing a lot of people on message boards saying that only police and military should be allowed to own guns. 'Civilian' ownership should be outlawed. No way that could go wrong....


To which I usually reply thus: "When I was on active duty in the Army, I could authorize the arming of an entire brigade with anything up to nuclear weapons. Now that I am not on active duty, you wouldn't even let me have a .22 cal pistol. At what point did I become unqualified to carry a firearm?"

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## RonPaulFanInGA



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## James Madison

> 


Wow, this guy will never have to work another day in his entire life. He should take these news agencies to the cleaners.

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## Dark_Horse_Rider

anyone know if he was masked at the time of shooting ?

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## pcosmar

> anyone know if he was masked at the time of shooting ?


Nobody knows anything but what the Media has reported,, and that is in question. (and has changed)

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## Dark_Horse_Rider

> Nobody knows anything but what the Media has reported,, and that is in question. (and has changed)


naturally. . .

was wondering if there were any initial reports of him being masked

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## pcosmar

> naturally. . .
> 
> was wondering if there were any initial reports of him being masked


I am wondering,,
Who was the second guy? Did he have a "get out of jail free" Card?

Demonizing the mother,,and the kid... but kid gloves for the well placed Dad and brother.

No good answers,, just wondering.

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## angelatc

> Still wondering how he got buzzed in with his black fatigues.  Also no details on what meds he was on and what his mental problems were. 
> 
> Not much info at all really.  I wonder if they're manufacturing it as we speak ?


Not all schools make you "buzz" in.  No school my kids have gone to have that.  You walk in, and you're supposed to check in at the office, but it wouldn't be hard to walk right by.

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## Nirvikalpa

When this first started, I was listening to the Newtown Police/Fire/EMS scan and heard them state there was a suspicious maroon/purple van in the area that may be tied to the shooting, and to be on the lookout for "a man wearing nun-like clothes," as he was believed to be involved.  Never heard it again after that.

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## UWDude

Where is the man in fatigues they brought out hand-cuffed that was in the forest, the one who said "I didn't do it." ?

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## devil21

> I am wondering,,
> Who was the second guy? Did he have a "get out of jail free" Card?
> 
> Demonizing the mother,,and the kid... but kid gloves for the well placed Dad and brother.
> 
> No good answers,, just wondering.


As expected, the 2nd shooter reports disappear into the media black hole.  

Dad allegedly works for GE, owner of the NBC family and one of the biggest defense contractors in the world.  He's special.

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## osan

> The rate of violence is almost purely cultural in these cases.
> 
> Japan has a long history of isolation from the outside world, being an island nation. With few natural resources, Japanese culture adopted a highly collectivist mindset, whereby the individual is always second to the group as a whole.


This is only partly true.  As with humans in general, the Japanese are a paradoxical people and in some ways more so than most others.

In feudal Japan there was a strong hierarchical  flavor to the majority of the cultures - a characteristic more or less typical of e_mpire,_ and yet they managed to retain something of the ancient tribal character.  In some ways the hierarchy was very collectivist, but the Japanese never lost the sense of respect for the individual.  This respect manifested itself in several ways.  For example, women were the only owners of property.  Their husbands may have been the operational bosses and may have been able to order their wives around this way and that, but the girls had their men by the balls in terms of property and how it was to be disposed.

A more telling example, however, may be had from the fact that even though a liege lord could order one of his subordinates to kill himself on the spot, he was _not_ free to treat him discourteously, especially in a mocking manner.  Such behavior could find a lord facing the sword of his shamed servant.  So even the feudal Japanese had a better sense of individual dignity than do we anymore, as measured and assessed by the ways in which government agents treat individuals in the course of their so-called "duties".  The simple fact that police routinely put their uninvited/unpermitted hands upon others, especially where no cause for such exists is a clear indicator of how degenerate our culture has become.  That we tolerate this behavior is a great shame upon us all, but I digress.




> People learned to 'fall in line' because self-indulgence and individual expression could jeopardize the entire community. It's not just gun violence that's rare in Japan, it's all violence. Crime is virtually unheard of because of long-standing cultural taboos against selfishness, pridefullness, and greed. This is why Japanese people are so humble and polite and why they look negatively on people who are boastful, loud, and brash. It's great at times, but it comes at the cost of being an individual.


This is largely true, but one must be careful not to over-state that truth.  There are other factors in that mix as well which have driven the bent to extreme courtesies and the "eight-fold fence", and individualism rests at the core of it, believe it or not.  The Japanese trained to such exacting standards of behavior precisely because of their respect for the individual and his right to his dignity.  Because the Japanese respected the individual so strongly, most particularly those of the bushi (samurai), death was the common penalty for violations of one man against another and often came as the result of dueling, but not always.  Though the samurai warrior ostensibly sought death in battle, he was nevertheless human and liked to remain alive.  He was, therefore, not particularly eager to die in a duel that could be set off by the slightest breach of proper etiquette.  Because the individual was so empowered in this particular fashion, individuals - males in particular - were extremely cautious about the ways in which they comported themselves among their fellows.

For example, when Tokugawa became shogun and banned dueling, many bushi eventually had the hilts of their katana (swords) shortened.  Why?  Because a proper tsuka (hilt) would have been about 15 inches long and stuck out like a giant penis.  Any accidental meeting of two tsuka as a result of indelicate movement on the part of an individual could have resulted in an immediate need to defend one's life against the perceived insult.  The shorter tsuka were "safer" in that they allowed for more casual movement among one's equals.  As you can see, even the great samurai were prone to laziness and convenience!




> With a culture of extreme individualism comes more crime, but it also leads to wealth, prosperity, and freedom.


Oh methinks you have bitten off a chunk too big to chew my friend, though I take some care to note that it depends largely on what you mean by "individualism".  It could mean the grasping, "me me ME" type of culture, and if that is included in your definition then we may be in some reasonable agreement.  But if we are speaking of healthy and proper respect for the individual and all that it implies, then I must vary with you significantly.  Such an assertion would imply that freedom breeds criminal attitudes and actions by necessity, and to this I cannot agree in even the smallest part.

When people are properly free, which in some ways more resembles the way of the samurai than that of twenty-first century America, crime is low because the penalties for violating the sovereignty of others are sufficiently severe to serve as deterrent for the great majority of people.  It is very much a stick and carrot arrangement.  Be cool with your neighbors and partake of endless bounty.  Be $#@!ty and have limbs hacked off with long blades.  Personally, I find great charm and attraction in this particular architecture of interpersonal relations.  Nobody has the right to lay hands upon another uninvited and under most conditions people so laying hands should risk amputation and death.  This is called "enforcement" of respect of one man for another.  To many westerners this will seem draconian.  To me it seems only proper because rights either mean something or they do not.  If they do, then people should be mindful of that and held accountable when they violate.  And when the violation is substantial, so should be the consequence.  But that all requires the self-control and the attendant mindfulness that most modern people are unwilling to pony up.  Therefore, we tolerate all manner of horrendously wrong behaviors in exchange for the mutual tolerance of our own bad manners and attitudes.  Just how attractive is that?  Not.




> The Japanese never enjoyed freedom until recent decades, certainly never to the extent we used to have.


This is unequivocally false.  The Japanese are less free today than ever have they been before, overall.  In ancient times even the farmers, merchants, and artisans were entitled to their fair shakes in issues such as that of self-defense.  Compare that with today's Japan.

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## osan

> Celebrities weigh in. Brace yourselves before you read this:
> 
> http://www.eonline.com/news/371720/c...age-toward-nra


No surprises there.

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## osan

http://www.newyorker.com/online/blog...-of-shame.html

This is going to get very bumpy, methinks.

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## Brian Coulter

Has this been posted yet?





I haven't even watched it yet, but I happy to see it got over 100,000 views in 2 days and almost 1000 likes.  That's a lot of people looking for answers.   It only had 60,000 views when I went to bed last night.  

 Bumpy indeed...

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## AuH20

http://video.today.msnbc.msn.com/tod...lite=obnetwork

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## jcannon98188

> http://video.today.msnbc.msn.com/tod...lite=obnetwork


What?

Why would he have been at the school the day before? No one remembered this altecation till today?

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## squarepusher

> What?
> 
> Why would he have been at the school the day before? No one remembered this altecation till today?


Im sure its just information they did not release initially.

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## squarepusher

> Has this been posted yet?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I haven't even watched it yet, but I happy to see it got over 100,000 views in 2 days and almost 1000 likes.  That's a lot of people looking for answers.   It only had 60,000 views when I went to bed last night.  
> 
>  Bumpy indeed...


that video is stupid, he just quotes unverified sources on random low credibility webpages.

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## pcosmar

> Im sure its just information they did not release initially.


Editing the script. Glitch in the Matrix.
WTF ever you want to call it.

Why is so much credibility given to people that lie to you regularly??

Why is it,, that questioning inconsistencies, and logical holes,, and misinformation,, is being"poo pooo'ed" ??



What about the Presumption of Innocence ?
oh,, that's right... Dead guys don't get a trial.

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## Brian Coulter

> that video is stupid, he just quotes unverified sources on random low credibility webpages.


So what website is the chunky kid affiliated with?

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## KMX

Weird how the father of the Colorado shooting and the father of the Conn shooting are both connected to the Ly borg scandle.

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## ClydeCoulter

> Weird how the father of the Colorado shooting and the father of the Conn shooting are both connected to the Ly borg scandle.


Well, that's been said, but I have yet to see any evidence in the way of credible sources on it yet.  Do you know of any?

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## Dark_Horse_Rider

> Editing the script. Glitch in the Matrix.
> WTF ever you want to call it.
> 
> Why is so much credibility given to people that lie to you regularly??
> 
> Why is it,, that questioning inconsistencies, and logical holes,, and misinformation,, is being"poo pooo'ed" ??
> 
> 
> 
> ...


yep, and the young guy in oregon found dead in stairwell from gunshot wound , was supposedly wearing hockey mask while shooting , correct ? 

is there evidence it was actually him ? and him not a dead patsy ?

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## dannno

> Where is the man in fatigues they brought out hand-cuffed that was in the forest, the one who said "I didn't do it." ?


I haven't heard a thing, keep talking about it and keep asking people.

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## farreri

I don't get why a young man would go out of his way to mass murder a classroom of kids.  Doesn't make sense to me.  Now officials are saying all the kids were shot multiple times by the rifle that they earlier reported was found in the trunk in the car.  WTF?

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## dannno

> I don't get why a young man would go out of his way to mass murder a classroom of kids.  Doesn't make sense to me.  Now officials are saying all the kids were shot multiple times by the rifle that they earlier reported was found in the trunk in the car.  WTF?


http://www.examiner.com/article/libo...ere-to-testify

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## gwax23

There saying the gun in the car was a shotgun. There also saying he was carrying 2 hand guns. 1 10mm and 1 9mm.

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## gwax23

I just want to see a recent picture of the guy. Not these 7 year old photos they keep showing us. The school apparently is going to be a crime scene for "months" according the fox news. 

Also they say that the mother apparently had no connection to the school after all and the second shooter still unheard of. Cant find anything on it.

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## farreri

> http://www.examiner.com/article/libo...ere-to-testify


I saw that about the Libor scandal, but can that really be varified?  All the links seem to go to conspiracy opinion sites.  Is there a MSM link for proof of these allegations?

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## pcosmar

> I saw that about the Libor scandal, but can that really be varified?  All the links seem to go to conspiracy opinion sites.  Is there a MSM link for proof of these allegations?


Would they publish it?

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## farreri

> Also they say that the mother apparently had no connection to the school after all and the second shooter still unheard of. Cant find anything on it.


Yeah and that's another thing, first it was reported she was a teacher there, then just a sub or volunteer, now the mother has no connection to the school.  WTF?  What would set a kid off that bad to mastermind a plan to go murder an entire classroom of innocent kids?

The MSM is really pushing the aspergers/mental illness angle to try to create the justification in the public's mind the Lanza was somehow "desensitized" and how they are starting to push the Goth anlge too.

*How honor student became 'goth killer' massacring 20 children at Sandy Hook Elementary | Mail Online*
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...lementary.html

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## farreri

> Would they publish it?


That's not what I meant, but there should be links to mainstream sources to back up the Libor theory.  Maybe there are and I just didn't see it, but seems all links just mostly go to someone's conspiracy site.

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## July

> This is unequivocally false.  The Japanese are less free today than ever have they been before, overall.  In ancient times even the farmers, merchants, and artisans were entitled to their fair shakes in issues such as that of self-defense.  Compare that with today's Japan.


Osan, nice post on Japan, I agree with the majority of what you posted...but I also wanted to add, I speak Japanese, and I am often struck at how much more concerned my Japanese friends are with the issue of privacy. Especially privacy online, etc...they are much more skeptical of surveillance, and that type of thing. Things like google maps and how that data is being used, etc. They are skeptical of Facebook. I don't get that sense from most Americans I know who just seem to trust everything at face value...in some ways I think we are far more collectivist in the US than we realize. It's unsettling when you realize it.

----------


## Dark_Horse_Rider

> Yeah and that's another thing, first it was reported she was a teacher there, then just a sub or volunteer, now the mother has no connection to the school.  WTF?  What would set a kid off that bad to mastermind a plan to go murder an entire classroom of innocent kids?
> 
> The MSM is really pushing the aspergers/mental illness angle to try to create the justification in the public's mind the Lanza was somehow "desensitized" and how they are starting to push the Goth anlge too.
> 
> *How honor student became 'goth killer' massacring 20 children at Sandy Hook Elementary | Mail Online*
> http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...lementary.html


no m.o. , perhaps his mother misled someone and said that she worked at that school ---> someone thought they had the perfect set up ---> set up malfunctioned

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## osan

> Osan, nice post on Japan, I agree with the majority of what you posted...but I also wanted to add, I speak Japanese, and I am often struck at how much more concerned my Japanese friends are with the issue of privacy. Especially privacy online, etc...they are much more skeptical of surveillance, and that type of thing. Things like google maps and how that data is being used, etc. They are skeptical of Facebook. I don't get that sense from most Americans I know who just seem to trust everything at face value...in some ways I think we are far more collectivist in the US than we realize. It's unsettling when you realize it.


I can readily believe what you wrote.   Many Americans have been very well trained to the collectivist mindset while also retaining the paradoxical belief that they are such rigged individualists.  It would be entertaining were it not so alarming.

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## tangent4ronpaul

I'm amazed this post got over 20,000 views and over 750 posts.  When I first posted, I was really thinking OK, I'm probably going to eat my hat, because nothing was confirmed.  There was a report of a teacher being taken to a hospital with a gunshot wound to his foot and a possible gunman.  I had initially thought - OK, some teach w/ a CCW shot himself in the foot and the media is over-reacting.  TOTAL FAIL!  This might be our Pearl Harbor day as to civil rights.

This IS NOT GOOD!!!! 

-t

----------

