# News & Current Events > Individual Rights Violations: Case Studies >  Was Ron Paul in the secret "closed session" of Congress?

## beachmaster

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,337709,00.html

I wonder what really went on in there.  I read some rumors... it wasn't anything good.  Anyone else?  Did Ron Paul participate in this session?

Yesterday I went through a roadside driver license check that the state police set up.  This morning the local police were setting one up, with a camera, on a two lane highway, with cones directing traffic to one lane.  Looks like this is it folks... hope I'm wrong.

[h1]House Holds Rare Secret Session on Terror Surveillance Bill [/h1]
*Friday   , March     14, 2008*






WASHINGTON  

House lawmakers wrapped the first secret session in 25 years Thursday night to discuss the terror surveillance bill and plan to open debate and possibly vote later this morning.

GOP representatives were hoping to sway House Demcrats against moving forward with their version of the legislation, which the White House has threatened to veto.

"I'm glad the majority joined us in allowing this serious discussion, " said House Minority Whip Roy Blunt after the session. "Based on the intelligence offered tonight, there are very powerful reasons why we must pass the bipartisan Senate bill."

Many Democrats initially objected to the secret meeting, calling it a political ploy by Republicans to delay the vote.

Republicans argued, though, that they have relevant information for the debate that can only be considered in closed session  House Majority Leader Steny Hoyer agreed to the request by Blunt.

Only members of Congress and some staff were allowed to attend and time was believed to be split between Hoyer and House Minority Leader John Boehner. They are not allowed to divulge activities that go on during these secret sessions, and are required to sign a special oath that they won't divulge what's discussed during the meeting.

The press and the public were banned from the sessions, and the doors were locked hours earlier to allow for a security sweep. Lawmakers were asked to deposit their phones, pagers and BlackBerries in sealed yellow envelopes which were then stowed in large milk crates outside the sealed House chamber.

Capitol police moved all press off the second floor area surrounding the chamber where the closed session was held.

The closed sessions are most often held to discuss national security. The last such session in the House was in 1983 on U.S. support for paramilitary operations in Nicaragua. Only five closed sessions have taken place in the House since 1825.

No secret sessions occurred between 1830 and 1979.

Speaking of the decision to hold a secret session, House Judiciary Committee Chairman John Conyers said the more information lawmakers get on the eavesdropping programs, the less fearful they are of scare tactics. He said the administration has not made the case for unprecedented spying powers and blanket retroactive immunity for phone companies, the two key prongs of the terror surveillance legislation.

"Whether this is a worthwhile exercise or mere grandstanding depends on whether Republicans have groundbreaking new information that would affect the legislative process," Conyers said. "There must be a very high bar to urge the House into a secret session for the first time in 25 years. I eagerly await their presentation to see if it clears this threshold. As someone who has seen and heard an enormous amount of information already, I have my doubts."

A previous bill was passed temporarily in August, and its expiration was pushed back once already as lawmakers debated which tools are essential to intelligence agents listening in on suspected terrorists.

President Bush issued a new veto threat on Thursday against the House Democrats' version of the bill, which he says would undermine the nation's security because it would offer no protections to telecoms that help the government with phone numbers.

"The American people understand the stakes in this struggle. They want their children to be safe from terror," Bush said. The House bill "could reopen dangerous intelligence gaps by putting in place a cumbersome court approval process that would make it harder to collect intelligence on foreign terrorists."

Article I, Section 5 of the Constitution allows for closed sessions of both the House and Senate. While all closed sessions are rare, they are particularly unique in the House.

Over the past few days, House Republicans have forced a variety of parliamentary votes to protest how Democrats have handled the terror surveillance issue. Boehner, R-Ohio, said Republicans want to make sure Democrats have the classified information they frequently claim to lack when it comes to making decisions on this legislation.

"Democratic leaders cannot hide behind these excuses any longer. We must give our intelligence officials all the tools they need to keep the American people safe, as well as protect patriotic third parties who have helped us defend this country since 9/11. Its our hope that members will come away from this briefing with a better understanding of how important these programs are for the safety and security not only for the American people, but our soldiers on the ground in Iraq, Afghanistan and elsewhere around the world," said Boehner.

At a press conference Thursday, House Speaker Nancy Pelosi said she was willing to listen to the case Republicans are presenting so she could make an informed judgment on the legislation.

"If there is some merit to having a closed session that is worth pushing back consideration of the bill, let's hear what their purpose is," she said.

FOX News' Chad Pergram and The Associated Press contributed to this report.

------------------

going to be an interesting year any way you slice it.

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## Madison

Bump.

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## coyote_sprit

He was banned from participating because he is an honest politician.

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## smartguy911

> He was banned from participating because he is an honest politician.


you are just making that up right?

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## coyote_sprit

> you are just making that up right?


Yeah but the fact that you had to ask if I was making it up speaks for itself.

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## Hawk45

'IF', and this is a big 'IF', only half the rumors coming out are true then most of the government needs to be tried for TREASON NOW!

I truly hope we get to vote in November.

The three boxes of Liberty.

1 The soap BOX.

2. The ballot BOX.

3. The Bullet BOX!

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## ARealConservative

> No secret sessions occurred between 1830 and 1979.


WW1, WW2, Depression, Cuban Missile Crisis, end of Bretton Woods, Iranian Hostages, etc, etc yet now we need one?

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## Dr.3D

I didn't know it was constitutional to have secret sessions.

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## Hawk45

> WW1, WW2, Depression, Cuban Missile Crisis, end of Bretton Woods, Iranian Hostages, etc, etc yet now we need one?


Thats because then the Congress at least paid lip service to the Constitution!  Today they think the Constitution is just a 'suggestion' instead of the LAW of the land.

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## Working Poor

> "The American people understand the stakes in this struggle. They want their children to be safe from terror," Bush said.


I want my children safe from war mongers like Bush

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## dsentell

> Thats because then the Congress at least paid lip service to the Constitution!  Today they think the Constitution is just a 'suggestion' instead of the LAW of the land.


Right.  According to GW Bush, the Constitution is just a "damn piece of paper."  They sure do treat it like that . . . .

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## mmink15

I saw on youtube a session of the house discussing the secret meeting and Dennis Kucinich was speaking out against it.   I was surprised Ron Paul wasn't speaking against it.  I know DK did not attend but not sure about Ron Paul.

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## beachmaster

> I saw on youtube a session of the house discussing the secret meeting and Dennis Kucinich was speaking out against it.   I was surprised Ron Paul wasn't speaking against it.  I know DK did not attend but not sure about Ron Paul.



If Ron Paul did attend, I would hope he'd tell us what happened.  Perhaps he'd exercise a little civil disobedience, disobey the secrecy oath, and let We the People know what the People's representatives are up to behind closed doors.

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## maeqFREEDOMfree

> If Ron Paul did attend, I would hope he'd tell us what happened.  Perhaps he'd exercise a little civil disobedience, disobey the secrecy oath, and let We the People know what the People's representatives are up to behind closed doors.


wow that would kick me back into gear. lead by example and all :-)

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## Geronimo

> If Ron Paul did attend, I would hope he'd tell us what happened.  Perhaps he'd exercise a little civil disobedience, disobey the secrecy oath, and let We the People know what the People's representatives are up to behind closed doors.


I'm really surprised that he hasn't come out with any information. 
There's no way that he can't know what went on.

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## kyleAF

I'm thinking more was discussed than this surveillance bill.  Everyone knows what the surveillance bill means...they don't need a secret session to figure that out.

It's not like anyone's going to come out and tell Congress "yes, we are planning on spying on the U.S. citizenry to gather data for our eventual coup".  Why the secrecy to tell Congress: "We need you to pass this bill".  They've been telling Congress that for weeks.

I predict this had something to do with the economy.

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## maeqFREEDOMfree

anymore news on this? i haven't been able to find much

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## abruzz0

Everyone's a terrorist

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## beachmaster

> anymore news on this? i haven't been able to find much


The crickets are chirping.

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## Hawk45

If only one tenth of the 'rumor' I am hearing is true then EVERYONE there should be tried for TREASON NOW!  Especially if they are NOT telling us. 

That is why someone who actually talks to Ron Paul needs to ask him the simple question of 'Were you there?' and then it MUST be reported here.  Until that is done folks are just going to get wet from urinating in the wind.

As one part of the 'rumor' is that the election in Nov 'if' it happens is the least of our worries.

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## Sandra

> If only one tenth of the 'rumor' I am hearing is true then EVERYONE there should be tried for TREASON NOW!  Especially if they are NOT telling us. 
> 
> That is why someone who actually talks to Ron Paul needs to ask him the simple question of 'Were you there?' and then it MUST be reported here.  Until that is done folks are just going to get wet from urinating in the wind.
> 
> As one part of the 'rumor' is that the election in Nov 'if' it happens is the least of our worries.



What makes YOU so important that YOU call the shots?... See how these kind of things can go? I'm sure they are trying to get the word out without causing unnecessary panic.

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## Hawk45

I am NOT important and I am for sure not calling any shots, but I DO know treason when I hear it.  I did NOT spend time bleeding in a couple of wars just to watch our country be blended into BOTH Canada and Mexico.  Then there are the economic issues that go along with it and the pending BANKRUPTCY of the US that will do it.

Hopefully it is just rumors and we can go on our lives, but I am NOT betting on it.

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## Sandra

But.... you accused Dr Paul of treason in your first post. Not to mention your few posts have been relegated to guns and your self described "Ron Paul's treason". Your a troll aren't you?

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## banjojambo9

seems people use the word troll around here the way the media uses racist or anti-semite I am tired of it

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## Hawk45

No, not a troll.  I only asked that someone ask Dr Paul if he was there and what was said.

I actually DID vote for Dr Paul and see him as the only chance for a peaceful US in the near future.  He is one of the VERY few in DC that I trust to tell us the truth.

"If" he was there and is NOT telling us what went on then he is equally guilty of treason and should be prosecuted for it also.

Right now I do not even know if he was there and NO one is saying anything different.

I posted in the guns section because that is something I do know alot about and was just trying to help.  If that help is not needed or wanted I WILL go away and not bother anyone here again.

Fair enough?

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## Sandra

> seems people use the word troll around here the way the media uses racist or anti-semite I am tired of it



Having low post numbers AND saying Ron Paul is committing treason....yeah, buddy , you bet that's a TROLL of the highest calling. What do YOU call it? 

Edit: read his post above mine, then jump in for his defense.

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## Hawk45

> Having low post numbers AND saying Ron Paul is committing treason....yeah, buddy , you bet that's a TROLL of the highest calling. What do YOU call it? 
> 
> Edit: read his post above mine, then jump in for his defense.


He does not have to defend me.  I am a big boy and can defend myself.  For YOUR information I do not care if a person is named Ron Paul or Jesus H Christ if they were in the meeting and are NOT talking they are guilty of treason.

If YOU want to consider me a troll then so be it.  

Here is what I got for info on the meeting and like I have said before if only one tenth of it is true then anyone there SHOULD be tried for treason if they are not talking.

"March 14, 2008
SPECIAL "CLOSED SESSION" OF U.S. HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES DISCUSSED A LOT MORE THAN THE PENDING SECURITY SURVEILLANCE PROVISIONS
LAST NIGHTS SESSION WAS ONLY THE FOURTH TIME IN 176 YEARS THAT CONGRESS CLOSED ITS DOORS TO THE PUBLIC
Word has begun leaking from last nights special, closed-door session of the United States House of Representatives.

Not only did members discuss new surveillance provisions as was the publicly stated reason for the closed door session, they were also bluntly warned about**: 

the imminent collapse of the U.S. economy to occur by September 2008,

the imminent collapse of US federal government finances by February 2009,

the possibility of Civil War inside the USA as a result of the collapse,

advance round-ups of "insurgent U.S. citizens" likely to move against the government,

The detention of those rounded-up at "REX 84" camps constructed throughout the USA,

the possibility of retaliation against members of Congress for the collapses,

the location of "safe facilities" for members of Congress and their families to reside during expected massive civil unrest

the necessary and unavoidable merger of the United States with Canada (for its natural resources) and with Mexico (for its cheap labor pool),

the issuance of a new currency - THE AMERO - for all three nations as the proposed solution to the coming economic armageddon.

Members of Congress were FORBIDDEN to reveal what was discussed and ABC News via WCPO web site at the link below CONFIRMS congress members were FORBIDDEN to talk about it!".

For myself I truly hope NONE of it is true, but if ANY of it IS we are ALL up defacation river without a paddle.   Sandra you have suceeded in one aspect though, you have just turned OFF one Ron Paul supporter.  Happy now or is that YOUR JOB?

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## Doktor_Jeep

Hawk45 is NOT a troll. I have known Hawk for years and we moderate another website along with other nefarious nabobs of negativism.

Frankly the lack of information from Congressman Paul on this has me worried too. I think he was threatened. Ron is not a young man bristling with guns and muscles. The outrage and perseverence is up to US now.

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## Sandra

Then maybe you two should just mosey somewhere else. Ron Paulforums won't be your cup of tea.

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## acptulsa

It would be a damned shame if the powers that be could cause major dissention and division among the opposition just by closing their doors to the light of day.  So far all I see is rampant speculation.  Forming opinions based on rampant speculation and/or throwing people out based on those opinions is a job for the Thought Police, not me...

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## Sandra

Why don't all of you GET YOUR OWN FORUMS then. This is a privately owned forum in which the owner can enact his policing power in any way he choses without "users" interfering with his freedom to implement those powers he has through ownership.

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## Bryan

> It would be a damned shame if the powers that be could cause major dissention and division among the opposition just by closing their doors to the light of day.  So far all I see is rampant speculation.  Forming opinions based on rampant speculation and/or throwing people out based on those opinions is a job for the Thought Police, not me...


QFT- gold star post of the day.  




> Why don't all of you GET YOUR OWN FORUMS then. This is a privately owned forum in which the owner can enact his policing power in any way he choses without "users" interfering with his freedom to implement those powers he has through ownership.


Everyone who follows the forum guidelines is welcome.  
http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=22

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## beachmaster

> Frankly the lack of information from Congressman Paul on this has me worried too. I think he was threatened. Ron is not a young man bristling with guns and muscles. The outrage and perseverence is up to US now.


I don't think Dr. Paul worries about his own life.  Rather, I think he is more concerned with the lives of his large family.  

Thanks for you and Hawk's input.  I don't think you are trolls by any stretch.  For what, asking sincere questions?  Please!

These are serious and trying times.  We need to stick together, not let others tear us apart with name calling.

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## Hawk45

It appears the 'Brits' are being told more than we are by the 'press'.

Secret Session of Congress 

This was happening at about the same time. 

"Fed chairman Ben Bernanke has moved with breathtaking speed to contain the crisis. Last Sunday night, he resorted to the "nuclear option", invoking a Depression-era clause - Article 13 (3) of the Federal Reserve Act - to be used in "unusual and exigent circumstances". 

The emergency vote by five governors allows the Fed to shoulder $30bn of direct credit risk from the Bear Stearns carcass. By taking this course, the Fed has crossed the Rubicon of central banking." 

<http://www.telegraph.co.uk/money/main.jhtml?xml=/money/2008/03/23/ccfed123.xml&CMP=ILC-mostviewedbox>

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## beachmaster

> It appears the 'Brits' are being told more than we are by the 'press'.
> 
> Secret Session of Congress 
> 
> This was happening at about the same time. 
> 
> "Fed chairman Ben Bernanke has moved with breathtaking speed to contain the crisis. Last Sunday night, he resorted to the "nuclear option", invoking a Depression-era clause - Article 13 (3) of the Federal Reserve Act - to be used in "unusual and exigent circumstances". 
> 
> The emergency vote by five governors allows the Fed to shoulder $30bn of direct credit risk from the Bear Stearns carcass. By taking this course, the Fed has crossed the Rubicon of central banking." 
> ...



Maybe the congress was talking about growing balls to confront the Fed? ! yeah right!  hahaha!

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## Kraig

> Then maybe you two should just mosey somewhere else. Ron Paulforums won't be your cup of tea.


I hope this is not for you to decide, because I like what this guy has to say.

I am willing to give Ron Paul the benefit of the doubt, but IF he was at this meeting, and IF he has no good reason not to tell us what it is about (maybe he was threatend, etc.) then I certainly would think he is guilty of something, if not treason.  I love how everyone is freaking out about how horrible this secret meeting was, yet if Ron Paul was a part of it he somehow holds none of the blame.  The moment we are willing to flame and disassociate with someone for asking a completely honest question will be the moment our message has completely lost it's objective meaning.

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## amy31416

So, do we know if RP was there yet or not? 

The only thing I know is that Kucinich opted out for "ethical" reasons, which I think was stupid. The more people there who can tell us what went on, the better.

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## Kraig

It doesn't seem like anyone does.

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## GigiBowman

Sandra, 

I have the perfect place for you. The Ron Paul World Wide message board. It's filled with people like you. People who kick off other people for expressing ideas, for typing outside the box, for giving a difference of opinion.

I am constantly amazed at the controlling nature of some Ron Paul supporters.  They say they are for our liberty and freedom....but they are the first to try and stifle others from saying what they don't want to hear.

Many many hypocrites in the Ron Paul Revolution.  The only one dividing the Revolution.....are the Revolutionaries themeselves.

Live and let live. If you don't like a post.....skip over it, move on....but why feel that other's must Leave?  What makes their opinion wrong and yours right?

Always ask yourself the question....."What would Ron Paul do?"

Do you think he would kick out either of the men in here you called trolls?

I don't think so.


There is really no place for dictators in the Ron Paul Revolution.

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## Hawk45

For those who are open to 'other' opinions and for the support, a sincere Thank You.

My whole thing is finding exactly WHO we can and cannot trust.

To give you a little of my background I am a Retired LtCol in the Tn Guard.  My last duty assignment was as Commander of the Anti-Terr group here.  Part of that duty was liasion with Al Gore's Secret Service detail.  Or, as I like to refer to it as Al's Valet parking detail.

I was FINALLY able to retire AFTER Klinton left office, only to be recalled 10 days later when 9/11 happened.  I did not retire as a Full Bird Col because I told Al to his face that MY oath was to the Constitution and NOT to some red neck politician.

No, I an not politically correct and I am NOT apologizing for it either as the Constitution and NOT individuals are the important thing.

Now we have to ask ourselves just what the heck is really going on.  Was RP there first off.  Second if he was, was he threatened.  If so then we need to know why and by whom.  This needs to be answered so RP can be protected.  Some of us do know how to do it and are willing to.

Once we have those questions answered then we can go on to CORRECTIVE actions.

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