# Lifestyles & Discussion > Personal Health & Well-Being >  Infant Monkeys Given Standard Doses of Vaccines Develop Autism Symptoms

## libertyjam

Infant Monkeys Given Standard Doses of Vaccines Develop Autism Symptoms

University Of Pittsburgh logo

Source: SafeMinds.org

Infant Vaccines Produce Autism Symptoms in New Primate Study by University Of Pittsburgh Scientists

Routine Safety Study That Government Scientists Refused to Do Illustrates Vaccine Program and Mercury Health Risks

http://vran.org/in-the-news/infant-m...tism-symptoms/

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## libertyjam

The above study and story was from 2008, for a followup:

When You Give Primates Vaccines, they Develop Autism-Like Symptoms… I Mean, Ummm, Never Mind. That Didn’t Happen.

Corporate Bull$#@!, Vaccine Lies

by Ana Bananarama

Abstracts from an autism study presented in 2008 at IMFAR (the world’s top autism science conference) described biological changes and altered behavior in vaccinated primates resembling the behavior traits of children with autism. The unvaccinated animals in the study showed no such adverse outcomes.

One would think that pharmaceutical companies would regularly experiment for safety on primates. But studies like the one mentioned at IMFAR which was researched by Dr. Laura Hewitson and her team simply do not happen prior to vaccines being released to the public.

The safety studies used by the pharmaceutical companies, are usually done on humans and last a few months total. The “control groups” are usually simply a different kind of vaccine rather than a saline injection or some other ACTUAL control.

Not only do pharmaceutical companies not do primate safety tests for vaccines, they also clearly don’t want anyone else doing any either.

That very damning study never made it to print. See, Dr. Hewitson has a conflict of interest: Her own child was reportedly vaccine injured.

Hewitson and the other authors then narrowed the focus in a bit in order to get published in the October 2009 edition of Neurotoxicology. The new article, “Delayed acquisition of neonatal reflexes in newborn primates receiving a thimerosal-containing Hepatitis B vaccine,” discussed very specific behavior indicative of brain injury that the monkeys portrayed when they got the Hep B vaccine at birth. That article made it into the journal. But of course, that article was later withdrawn by the editor’s request. Perhaps it was the conflict of interest, but notice as well that Andrew Wakefield was a co-author on the study.

Andrew Wakefield of course was at the center of the MMR/autism scandal. Wakefield lost everything from the accusations of impropriety of research.

Here we are now though, a few more years later and Wakefield is suing his accusers. Wakefield says he has proof that his tests were not flawed and that his accusers had undisclosed financial ties to the pharmaceutical industry itself. The BJM (the medical journal that is being sued) asked the the judge to dismiss Wakefield’s case. More recently, Wakefield’s partner in the MMR study has just been exonerated.

Given all this controversy and the new autism statistics they just threw at us…. And while I don’t want any more primates given autism, a study is already out there in existence. Don’t you think it’s about time we take another good hard look at those primates that were mentioned back in 2008? 

http://www.intellipissies.com/primate-vaccine-study/

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## Domalais

> Infant Monkeys Given Standard Doses of Vaccines Develop Autism Symptoms


That's actually a rather blatant lie, as the researchers added thimerosal to a vaccine that does not contain thimerosal.  Why?   Well, because the study was entirely funded by anti-vaccine groups, and run by doctors who make money as paid experts in vaccine-related lawsuits.  The primary author herself sued for money under the National Vaccine Injury Compensation Program.  She's also married to a guy who is a board member of Safe Minds.  Another author... the original Andrew Wakefield...  He's evidently moved on from making discredited studies about the MMR vaccine to instead making biased studies of the Hep B vaccine.  Other authors are repeat IMFAR presenters.

Their study group was 13 monkeys.  Their control group was 3 monkeys.  Why the difference?  Who knows!  Doesn't that ruin the statistical significance of the study?  Yep!

They only studied male monkeys.  Why?  Here's a quote from the study itself:




> It is notable that, within low birth weight animals, males have significantly delayed development for some reflexes relative to females...


Guess which monkeys showed signs of delayed development?  The ones with a low birth weight.  Shock.


They vaccinated the monkeys at birth, and then only studied those monkeys for 14 days, and based all of their results on those two weeks.  Why not study the monkeys longer? Who knows!  They kept the monkeys for a year and then vivisected them to examine their brains.  We know that from other, related, equally bad studies on the same monkeys.

The results?  Three of the thirteen survival metrics studied were delayed in those receiving the vaccine:  One was delayed by two days, and the other two were delayed by two days.




Unsurprisingly, this laughably bad study was withdrawn from NeuroToxicology immediately after the antivax community's publicity blitz in 2009.  Shortly after they got done parading Jenny McCarthy around, in other words.

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science...61813X09002228

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## tennman

Thimerosal is mercury. You can't possibly think that it does nothing negative when injected into the human body. I was a chemistry major, mercury is toxic in ALL forms.

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## dannno

> That's actually a rather blatant lie, as the researchers added thimerosal to a vaccine that does not contain thimerosal.  Why?


Why not? Maybe they used to put thimerosal in that vaccine? Isn't thimerosal supposed to be "safe"?

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## Brian4Liberty

This is very popular on the news today:




> Mom's obesity tied to child's autism, development: study
> 
> Mon Apr 9, 2012 8:24pm EDT
> 
> (Reuters) - Children born to obese women are more likely to be diagnosed with autism or related developmental delays than the children of slimmer mothers, according to a U.S. survey.


And this was popular just the week before:




> Gene mutations and father's age among cues for autism, studies suggest
> 
> The New York Times
> 
> Three teams of scientists working independently to understand the biology of autism have for the first time homed in on several gene mutations that they agree sharply increase the chances that a child will develop the disorder, and have found further evidence that the risk increases with the age of the parents, particularly the father.
> 
> Read more://www.denverpost.com/nationworld/ci_20329158/gene-mutations-and-fathers-age-among-cues-autism

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## James Madison

> Thimerosal is mercury. You can't possibly think that it does nothing negative when injected into the human body. I was a chemistry major, mercury is toxic in ALL forms.


The mercury in vaccines is ethyl mercury, which has a half-life of about 10 days. Methyl mercury, however, is the form that bioaccumulates through the food chain.

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## Kluge

> The mercury in vaccines is ethyl mercury, which has a half-life of about 10 days. Methyl mercury, however, is the form that bioaccumulates through the food chain.


Was just going to mention that. Thanks.

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## Domalais

> Thimerosal is mercury. You can't possibly think that it does nothing negative when injected into the human body. I was a chemistry major, mercury is toxic in ALL forms.


Eat any tuna lately?

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## Domalais

> Why not? Maybe they used to put thimerosal in that vaccine? Isn't thimerosal supposed to be "safe"?


It is safe. It was removed from the vaccines on the basis of fraudulent medical studies like this one, concocted by doctors who discovered that they can make money hand over fist by milking parents of disabled children.

The old vaccine did contain thimerosal. It was removed in 2001. The new version undoubtedly contains a different additive to prevent fungal and bacterial growth; adding thimerosal in doesn't make it identical to the old vaccine. It's purely lawsuit bait. 

If they really wanted to examine the issue they would have had a group of monkeys without the added thimerosal and another with, plus the control. But that comes with the risk of ending their gravy train. The doctors involved make good money selling chelation therapy to rich, gullible parents.

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## John F Kennedy III

> The mercury in vaccines is ethyl mercury, which has a half-life of about 10 days. Methyl mercury, however, is the form that bioaccumulates through the food chain.


That doesn't mean it doesn't do damage.

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## donnay

> The mercury in vaccines is ethyl mercury, which has a half-life of about 10 days. Methyl mercury, however, is the form that bioaccumulates through the food chain.


ethylmercury and methylmercury are both neurotoxins.  Ethylmercury is slightly less toxic than methymercury, but both are still a toxin nevertheless.  Children receive nearly 36 vaccines before entering Kindergarten.

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## Mark37snj

> It is safe. It was removed from the vaccines on the basis of fraudulent medical studies like this one, concocted by doctors who discovered that they can make money hand over fist by milking parents of disabled children.
> 
> The old vaccine did contain thimerosal. It was removed in 2001. The new version undoubtedly contains a different additive to prevent fungal and bacterial growth; adding thimerosal in doesn't make it identical to the old vaccine. It's purely lawsuit bait. 
> 
> If they really wanted to examine the issue they would have had a group of monkeys without the added thimerosal and another with, plus the control. But that comes with the risk of ending their gravy train. The doctors involved make good money selling chelation therapy to rich, gullible parents.


So does this mean I should stop taking my Copaxone? I was prescribed it by my new doc, he is a Neurologist and a Multiple Sclerosis specialist, shortly after being vaccinated for Hepatitus B back in 2009. About a week after my 3rd shot I got seriously sick. I refer to it as the SuperFlu meets a world class butt whopping and withing a few months it struck hard so I went up the ladder through docs and specialists and I was sitting in my new MS docs office being diagnosed with MS. The MRI with contrast was quite interesting. The vaccine product insert does say that in their double-blind studies Multiple Sclerosis was documented as one of the Adverse Reactions. Guess I was one of the lucky ones. However, the vaccine I took did not contain thimerosal so that means there is still a problem with these safe vaccines. I guess its fortunate, for the pharmaceutical companies that is, that they now have a scape goat and that they no longer use it. Maybe were looking in the wrong place. I remember breaking a thermometer in the lab once and my boss, Ph D, freaked about no physical contact at all. Not sure on the specifics of each type of mercuric compound but I do know its very bad stuff to living tissues. There was a problem with vaccines back then and there still is. It may have been the mercury compound then, it may be something else now, or both could have done the damage. And to think I actually did medical/pharmaceutical research for them. I don't anymore, my MS is about to put me out of work for good. But it is comforting to have all these experts telling me there is nothing to see here and that this is just about law suites and making money, that should make all the difference.

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## simon1911

The concerning part is the amount of the stuff (and not just mercury) they put in those vaccines exceed the standard level for IV fluids. And yes, I have tunas but I don't inject it to my bloodstream. Yes, some vaccines are important...but I caught the measles when I was young, my brother caught the mumps and pretty much all of the kids in my grade school caught rubella. Some of the vaccination should totally be categorized as "big government in bed with big pharmaceutical". Gardisil they tried and failed. But Hep B is a sexually transmitted disease and you want to give it to my one day old baby? Give me a break. 

We delayed giving vaccines to our kids. When we can't enroll our kids to school because they are not vaccinated, that to me is a coercion. It presumes that they know what's "better" for my family.

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## Domalais

> So does this mean I should stop taking my Copaxone? I was prescribed it by my new doc, he is a Neurologist and a Multiple Sclerosis specialist, shortly after being vaccinated for Hepatitus B back in 2009.


So no thimerosal.




> However, the vaccine I took did not contain thimerosal so that means there is still a problem with these safe vaccines. I guess its fortunate, for the pharmaceutical companies that is, that they now have a scape goat and that they no longer use it. Maybe were looking in the wrong place.


That's the point I was making in the post that you quoted.  The antivax studies, such as this one, could prove that thimerosal isn't the problem, but they choose not to.

For them, uncertainty is the most profitable.  If it's not the thimerosal, then they can't sell chelation therapy and other mercury-related treatments.  If it is the thimerosal, then they can't scam parents of children vaccinated since 2001.  They want to have their cake and eat it too.




> I remember breaking a thermometer in the lab once and my boss, Ph D, freaked about no physical contact at all. Not sure on the specifics of each type of mercuric compound but I do know its very bad stuff to living tissues.


A thermometer has a bit more than 5 micrograms in it.

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## Kluge

It's not easy to absorb *elemental* mercury into the bloodstream via skin contact, and very unlikely to be harmful. The way it's generally dangerous is if it's breathed in.

What's important in a mercury spill, is making sure that you get it all cleaned up, so it isn't sitting around slowly evaporating into the air. If there is some remaining that can't be picked up, or you think there is (in a crack in the floor or something), sprinkle a generous amount of sulfur on it. Sulfur will absorb it and make it more visible as it binds with the mercury. For a spill that I had to clean up, I found that a heavy-gauge syringe worked best to suck it up (used an old syringe that was for injecting chemicals into an old gas chromatograph) then I gently squirted it into a beaker of sulfur under a hood.

I'm sure you all have that equipment in your home.

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## donnay

Glad that you guys brought that up...how about the new cork screw light bulbs that have _mercury_ in them.  It is said that if you drop or brake one, you should call a Hazmat team out to clean it up.  The very worst thing you should do is try to vacuum it up.  Vacuum it will blow mercury out into the air.

So a combination of these new light bulbs and all the crap in our environment maybe having an impact on our health after all.

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## Kotin

> Glad that you guys brought that up...how about the new cork screw light bulbs that have _mercury_ in them.  It is said that if you drop or brake one, you should call a Hazmat team out to clean it up.  The very worst thing you should do is try to vacuum it up.  Vacuum it will blow mercury out into the air.
> 
> So a combination of these new light bulbs and all the crap in our environment may having an impact on our health after all.


Yup.. Just recently changed all my bulbs that were cfl to daylight incandescent bulbs.. mercury vapor leaks from these while they are on.. In what amount I don't know and I don't care..

Also mercury is not safe in any form and injecting it without the barrier of the digestive tract is even more unsafe.. Especially for children..

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## Roxi

> Glad that you guys brought that up...how about the new cork screw light bulbs that have _mercury_ in them.  It is said that if you drop or brake one, you should call a Hazmat team out to clean it up.  The very worst thing you should do is try to vacuum it up.  Vacuum it will blow mercury out into the air.
> 
> So a combination of these new light bulbs and all the crap in our environment may having an impact on our health after all.


You are half right. They do contain mercury, and you can spread it through the house by vacuuming or sweeping it up. You don't have to call hazmat though... the clean up process is a bitch though. You have to open all the windows, evacuate the house for a couple of hours and use duct tape to pick up all the pieces.

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## Domalais

> We delayed giving vaccines to our kids. When we can't enroll our kids to school because they are not vaccinated, that to me is a coercion. It presumes that they know what's "better" for my family.


There's a line between deciding what is best for your family and forcing other children to bear the consequences for the decisions you made regarding your own.  I support your right to not vaccinate, however ludicrous I think it is, but I don't believe any group, public or private, has an obligation to provide services them.

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## donnay

> Yup.. Just recently changed all my bulbs that were cfl to daylight incandescent bulbs.. mercury vapor leaks from these while they are on.. In what amount I don't know and I don't care..
> 
> Also mercury is not safe in any form and injecting it without the barrier of the digestive tract is even more unsafe.. Especially for children..


I totally agree.  I absolutely hate the mercury lights bulbs and have definitely tried to remove them from all parts of my home.  Although my husband thinks they are nothing to worry about, and that they save so much on electric bills. *SIGH*

People should check out ways to detox themselves from heavy metals.  I have tried to take more cilantro to do just that.  

_Cilantro and Chlorella combined is the primary natural chelation method for mercury.  Cilantro in a tincture form is more potent, and you can regulate the dose better.  If you're very toxic and particularly if you have any metal in your mouth you need to remove them first before trying any form of chelation therapy.  Garlic/vitamin C, etc... is also used in combination along with adequate protein, etc... to prevent reabsorption from the colon/bloodstream. _ 

Here is some good information about detoxing.

http://webcache.googleusercontent.co...s&client=opera

http://www.renewlife.com/media/spec_...reeCleanse.pdf

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## angelatc

> Glad that you guys brought that up...how about the new cork screw light bulbs that have _mercury_ in them.  It is said that if you drop or brake one, you should call a Hazmat team out to clean it up.  The very worst thing you should do is try to vacuum it up.  Vacuum it will blow mercury out into the air.
> 
> So a combination of these new light bulbs and all the crap in our environment maybe having an impact on our health after all.


If Americans were not living longer now than at any point in history, you might have a point.

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## Kluge

> Glad that you guys brought that up...how about the new cork screw light bulbs that have _mercury_ in them.  It is said that if you drop or brake one, you should call a Hazmat team out to clean it up.  The very worst thing you should do is try to vacuum it up.  Vacuum it will blow mercury out into the air.
> 
> So a combination of these new light bulbs and all the crap in our environment maybe having an impact on our health after all.


Who knows...life has changed so dramatically in the last 30+ years that many of these issues that plague us (autism, obesity, cancers, etc.) probably have more than one cause, or several causes working in tandem. Hormones in the milk/meat, mercury in the light bulbs/vaccines, the vaccines themselves, VOC's in paint, HFCS in everything we eat, BPA in packaging of food and drinks. Radon, mold, all kinds of chemicals around the house.

And then I was thinking the other day after reading about the drops in male fertility/sperm count, that it could also (in some areas) be a natural response to overpopulation, not just all the pseudo-estrogens that are in our food supply. It could also be that Bill Gates is sponsoring an evil scientist to put something in the water that reduces fertility.

Hard to say.

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## heavenlyboy34

> If Americans were not living longer now than at any point in history, you might have a point.


Fair enough, but Americans are, on average, unhealthier than at any point in history. (even the kids are developing obesity and type 2 diabetes  ) It's mostly diet and sedentary lifestyle, but what donnay is talking about may be an important factor.  I don't know enough about that to say for certain.

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## Mark37snj

> That's the point I was making in the post that you quoted.  The antivax studies, such as this one, could prove that thimerosal isn't the problem, but they choose not to.
> 
> For them, uncertainty is the most profitable.  If it's not the thimerosal, then they can't sell chelation therapy and other mercury-related treatments.  If it is the thimerosal, then they can't scam parents of children vaccinated since 2001.  They want to have their cake and eat it too.


The monkey study cited may not have been properly setup but the fact that they were able to reproduce Autism symptoms is what should be focused on. If the study is not a complete fake then that fact alone is one hell of a coincidence and there is no way I'm gona give Thimerosal a clean slate till more comprehensive studies are done. One thing about biochemical reactions is that many require a cofactor. Thimersoal may be that cofactor that led to the problems when it was being used. Now it may be something else or changed sufficiently so that no cofactor is needed for problems to occur. The product insert does not say what the new preservative is so who really knows what the hell is in it.

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## Domalais

> The monkey study cited may not have been properly setup but the fact that they were able to reproduce Autism symptoms is what should be focused on.


All they found was that if you unbalance the size of the control and vaccine groups enough, there are going to be more monkeys with a low birth weight in the vaccine than in the control.  And thus, more monkeys that are slightly slower developmentally.

Also, what exactly in the 'instinctual responses take one day longer to develop' sounds like autism, when the entire course of the study is fourteen days?



Everyone is eager to read nefarious intent into everything that large corporations and/or the government does, but mysteriously those same people are quite willing to overlook blatant biases and conflicts of interest when it comes to people advocating their preferred position.

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## Mark37snj

> All they found was that if you unbalance the size of the control and vaccine groups enough, there are going to be more monkeys with a low birth weight in the vaccine than in the control.  And thus, more monkeys that are slightly slower developmentally.
> 
> Also, what exactly in the 'instinctual responses take one day longer to develop' sounds like autism, when the entire course of the study is fourteen days?


Can you cite the link where you read the actual paper and getting this info? I want to read more then just the abstract.




> Everyone is eager to read nefarious intent into everything that large corporations and/or the government does, but mysteriously those same people are quite willing to overlook blatant biases and conflicts of interest when it comes to people advocating their preferred position.


Well when you have dozens of vidoes of these people talking about culling the human race through disease and making mass profits of them and these people are linked to corporations/goverments then I would say they should not cut them any slack. The evidence keeps piling up and all the corporation/goverments do is deflect and lie.

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## kezt777

> Glad that you guys brought that up...how about the new cork screw light bulbs that have _mercury_ in them.  It is said that if you drop or brake one, you should call a Hazmat team out to clean it up.  The very worst thing you should do is try to vacuum it up.  Vacuum it will blow mercury out into the air.
> 
> So a combination of these new light bulbs and all the crap in our environment maybe having an impact on our health after all.


After I read on the Health Canada website how you are supposed to clean up after breaking one of those bulbs, I wondered WTF was going on. Canada still hasnt seemed to make a final decision on the fate of incandescent bulbs but last I heard on the news was that they were to be banned from sale sometime this year. I cannot believe that they would peddle a bulb that they say on their own site to 'clear the area, open windows, remove people and pets' etc etc. What if it breaks in the winter where I live and it's -44C outside? I can't even get my windows open in bad winters cos they are frozen shut and Im afraid they will shatter if I try to yank one open. If I bust a bulb at that time of year, how do I air out my house? LOL. It's simply hysterical. So in the meantime, I am hitting the dollar stores and any cheap sales of the regular bulbs and stock piling. That may sound stupid, but it's not even just about the mercury for me - it's the cost. I spent over $100 on those stupid bulbs when I moved into this house in Feb 2008. All but one had burnt out exactly one year later. I replaced them with incandescent bulbs at 99 cents for a pack of 4 and after 3 more years, I have only had to replace my outdoor bulbs in the dead of winter and maybe 2 indoors, if that. Sorry but I am not paying $15 for 2 bulbs that last a year or two if I can buy 4 bulbs for a buck that last 3-5 years. I couldnt even tell you if they helped my electric bill or not because the cost of electricity in my city has gone up 3 times in the past 4 years anyway. I'll take a chance with my 40 and 60 watt bulbs instead. But the cleanup was insane. My boss dropped one on the floor at the daycare and I honestly did not know if I should panic and get the kids outside or what (also point to note - it was winter at the time and tons of snow and very windy that day). I had printed off the clean up sheet for our health file and showed it to her while she was sweeping up the bulb and she was floored. We are no longer buying them for the daycare either.

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## Zippyjuan

> I totally agree.  I absolutely hate the mercury lights bulbs and have definitely tried to remove them from all parts of my home.  Although my husband thinks they are nothing to worry about, and that they save so much on electric bills. *SIGH*
> 
> People should check out ways to detox themselves from heavy metals.  I have tried to take more cilantro to do just that.  
> 
> _Cilantro and Chlorella combined is the primary natural chelation method for mercury.  Cilantro in a tincture form is more potent, and you can regulate the dose better.  If you're very toxic and particularly if you have any metal in your mouth you need to remove them first before trying any form of chelation therapy.  Garlic/vitamin C, etc... is also used in combination along with adequate protein, etc... to prevent reabsorption from the colon/bloodstream. _ 
> 
> Here is some good information about detoxing.
> 
> http://webcache.googleusercontent.co...s&client=opera
> ...


If you replaced your CFLs with traditional bulbs, you may actually be contributing to MORE mercury in the environment than you save. Why? CFLs use considerably less electricity and coal power generation is the #1 producer of mercury in the environment. 

http://www.popularmechanics.com/home...s/news/4217864



> How much mercury is contained in a CFL?
> Each bulb contains an average of *5 milligrams* of mercury, “*which is just enough to cover a ballpoint pen tip*,” says Leslie, associate director of the Lighting Research Center at Rensselaer. “Though it’s nothing to laugh at, unless you wipe up mercury [without gloves] and then lick your hand, you’re probably going to be okay.”
> 
> How do CFLs and incandescents compare in terms of electricity consumption?
> On average, CFLs require about 25 percent of the electricity as their incandescent counterparts to produce equivalent light. Replacing an incandescent with a CFL ultimately decreases the amount of electricity the nation’s power plants must generate and, in turn, the amount of carbon dioxide—a powerful greenhouse gas—that they emit into the atmosphere.
> 
> How much mercury do power plants emit to light a CFL? 
> About 50 percent of the electricity produced in the U.S. is generated by coal-fired power plants. When coal burns to produce electricity, mercury naturally contained in the coal releases into the air. In 2006, coal-fired power plants produced 1,971 billion kilowatt hours (kwh) of electricity, *emitting 50.7 tons of mercury into the air*—the equivalent amount of mercury contained in more than *9 billion CFLs (the bulbs emit zero mercury when in use or being handled*). 
> 
> Approximately 0.0234 mg of mercury—plus carbon dioxide, sulfur dioxide and nitrogen oxide—releases into the air per 1 kwh of electricity that a coal-fired power plant generates. Over the 7500-hour average range of one CFL, then, *a plant will emit 13.16 mg of mercury to sustain a 75-watt incandescent bulb but only 3.51 mg of mercury to sustain a 20-watt CFL* (the lightning equivalent of a 75-watt traditional bulb). *Even if the mercury contained in a CFL was directly released into the atmosphere,* an *incandescent would still contribute 4.65 more milligrams of mercury into the environment over its lifetime.*





> How much of a difference can CFLs really make?
> According to EnergyStar—a program run by the Environmental Protection Agency—*if each U.S. home replaced just one of its incandescent bulbs with a CFL, the electricity saved each year could light 3 million homes* and prevent greenhouse gas emissions equal to that of 800,000 cars. And with a recent study for the U.S. government saying that a single 24-watt CFL’s lifetime energy savings add up to the gas equivalent of a coast-to-coast Prius road trip, it’s probably time to get moving on your energy footprint.
> 
> What is the proper way to handle a broken CFL?
> Open the windows and let the room air out for 15 to 30 minutes, then remove as much material as possible without a vacuum cleaner. Using disposable gloves, scoop the glass onto a piece of cardboard and wipe the area with a wet paper towel. For smaller pieces of glass and powder, use duct tape to pull up the fragments and wash your hands after cleaning up the debris.
> 
> What is the proper method to dispose a CFL?
> Check if your local recycling center has services available for CFL disposal by calling directly or by visiting Earth 911. Plus, as retail giants such as Home Depot and Wal-Mart amp up their CFL offerings, IKEA recycled 156,301 pounds of CFLs in its 2005 fiscal year with its “Free Take Back” recycling program that puts a collection bin in each store. If that wasn’t enough incentive, officials are looking into providing more consumer bonuses for CFL recycling, Leslie says, and they may even add a deposit value much like cans and bottles. Leslie promises: “Over six months to a year, you will see changes.”

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## craezie

> If Americans were not living longer now than at any point in history, you might have a point.


This isn't quite true.  Average life expectancy statistics are misleading, because they don't actual tell you how long you, as a person living in this year, can expect to live.  The "average life expectancy" is actually the average death age for this year.  We are seeing those in their 70s through 90s living longer than in history, but those people were born in the 1920s-40s and for the most part did not face the environmental pressures of younger generations.  That generation is in the "sweet spot" of having had access to safe conditions and great modern medical care for all of their lives while at the same time not eating and drinking the toxic crap we have for much of their life.  

A more useful statistic to look at is the rate of death in each bracket, and you will find that the death rate for younger people in each bracket is increasing despite living in safe, hygenic conditions.  The chronic disease rates among younger people (including pediatric cancer) has also been steadily increasing.

Bottom line: by the time people in their 20s, 30s, and 40s reach the age where most die off, the average death age will almost certainly decrease despite advances in medical technology.

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## craezie

> If you replaced your CFLs with traditional bulbs, you may actually be contributing to MORE mercury in the environment than you save. Why? CFLs use considerably less electricity and coal power generation is the #1 producer of mercury in the environment. 
> 
> http://www.popularmechanics.com/home...s/news/4217864


This is true.  And that coal mercury burned into the atmosphere and then rained down is the reason why water bodies, and therefore fish, are so contaminated with mercury.

The market is already providing solutions to this, though, in the form of alternative options such as LED light bulbs.  While expensive, they offer a better light than fluorescent with less toxicity and more energy efficiency.   I affirm the right of each person to weigh the pros and cons (high electricity usage vs. possible toxic contamination and inferior light) and decide what is best for them.

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## wrestlingwes_8

> This isn't quite true.  Average life expectancy statistics are misleading, because they don't actual tell you how long you, as a person living in this year, can expect to live.  The "average life expectancy" is actually the average death age for this year.  We are seeing those in their 70s through 90s living longer than in history, but those people were born in the 1920s-40s and for the most part did not face the environmental pressures of younger generations.  That generation is in the "sweet spot" of having had access to safe conditions and great modern medical care for all of their lives while at the same time not eating and drinking the toxic crap we have for much of their life.  
> 
> A more useful statistic to look at is the rate of death in each bracket, and you will find that the death rate for younger people in each bracket is increasing despite living in safe, hygenic conditions.  The chronic disease rates among younger people (including pediatric cancer) has also been steadily increasing.
> 
> Bottom line: by the time people in their 20s, 30s, and 40s reach the age where most die off, the average death age will almost certainly decrease despite advances in medical technology.


QFT

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## donnay

> Who knows...life has changed so dramatically in the last 30+ years that many of these issues that plague us (autism, obesity, cancers, etc.) probably have more than one cause, or several causes working in tandem. Hormones in the milk/meat, mercury in the light bulbs/vaccines, the vaccines themselves, VOC's in paint, HFCS in everything we eat, BPA in packaging of food and drinks. Radon, mold, all kinds of chemicals around the house.
> 
> And then I was thinking the other day after reading about the drops in male fertility/sperm count, that it could also (in some areas) be a natural response to overpopulation, not just all the pseudo-estrogens that are in our food supply. It could also be that Bill Gates is sponsoring an evil scientist to put something in the water that reduces fertility.
> 
> Hard to say.



You make a valid point.  It can be a number of things indeed that is causing the male infertility.  The problem is that they are inundating us with toxins from all different aspects, food, water, and air.  However, our bodies are definitely unique and can fight off most of the toxins if we help it.  Like eating foods that lean towards organic, stay away from beef, chicken, and pork that do come from factory farms that are fed grains.  Also fish that is wild caught and usually the fish that have scales and fins.

I am certainly not convinced in the over population theories either.  We, as humans, have lots of earth left to explore and inhabit.

The Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation is definitely evil.  All these so-called philanthropists need to mind their own business.

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## Domalais

> Can you cite the link where you read the actual paper and getting this info? I want to read more then just the abstract.


http://www.rescuepost.com/files/hewi...-hbv-study.pdf

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## Zippyjuan

Thanks for the link. I went through it fairly quickly and it seemed to show a link between low birthweight and some symptoms (which they atributed to the lower weight bodies being less able to handle the vaccines but it may also have been simply due to the lower level of development of the apes) though not all. 

A key test for me would be to see how they changed over time- taking measurements before and after vaccinations to see if it was indeed vaccination induced any changes in behavior or if these were already present in the apes but this was not done. This would be the only real way to be able to say if the vaccine actually caused the symptoms.  Shots- if any- were administered at birth.  All testing was to see how they would respond after vaccination- whether with a placebo, the hepatitus vaccination, or no vaccination. Sample size seems small for drawing extensive conclusions- they started with 20 rhesus macaques broken down into the three groups which would mean six or seven in each class (vax, no vax, placebo) and socialized in groups of three or four.




> Animals were allocated to either the vaccinated (exposed) or saline/no injection (unexposed) groups
> 20 on a semi-random basis in order to complete peer groups for later social testing [7] such that each
> 21 peer group contained animals from either the unexposed or exposed study groups. Once a new peer
> 22 group was started, new animals were assigned to this group until it consisted of 3 or 4 infants, the
> 23 ages of which were less than 4 weeks apart from their peers. Infants received either a single dose
> 
> (0.5ml) of Th-containing HB vaccine (n = 13) or a 1 saline injection (n = 4) both administered i.m. in
> 2 the thigh within 24 hours of birth, or no injection (n = 3).


Average age was 168 days which would be less than six months and in humans symptoms can be noticed as early as 14 months but usually not until at least two years of age but rhesus macaques have a much shorter lifespan of about 25 years so that is pretty comparable. 

http://www.nih.gov/researchmatters/j...2007autism.htm



> For children with autism, the sooner the disorder is identified and treated the better the outcome for the child. Now researchers report that it’s possible to detect autism in some children as young as 14 months of age, the earliest the disorder has ever been diagnosed. In other children, the scientists didn’t see definite signs of autism until later—by about 2 years old.


 I also noted their Potential Conflict of Interest notice:



> Conflict of Interest Statement
> 8 Prior to 2005, CS and AJW *acted as paid experts in MMR-related litigation on behalf of the plaintiff.*
> 9 *LH has a child who is a petitioner in the National Vaccine Injury Compensation Program*. For this
> 10 reason, LH was not involved in any data collection or statistical analyses to preclude the possibility of
> 11 a perceived conflict of interest.

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## Domalais

> they started with 20 rhesus macaques broken down into the three groups which would mean six or seven in each class (vax, no vax, placebo) and socialized in groups of three or four.


If you reread the text you quoted, you will find that that is not the case.  The "n=X" indicates the quantity of monkeys assigned to each class.





> (0.5ml) of Th-containing HB vaccine (n = 13) or a 1 saline injection (n = 4) both administered i.m. in
> 2 the thigh within 24 hours of birth, or no injection (n = 3).


13 Lawsuit monkeys (Thimerosal)
4 Saline Monkeys
3 No-vax Monkeys

No reason is given to explain this distribution.  Instead of 1/3rd each, they have nearly 2/3rds in the lawsuit category.  With that heavy a weighting, the statistical significance is almost zero.  Of course the large group has a much better chance of getting an outlier monkey with very low birth weight or other naturally occurring issues.

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## Zippyjuan

Thanks for pointing that out. I was unsure if the numbers were simply some sort of ID number but that makes sense now. If more of your subjects are in one category (in this case the vaccinated one) then even with a normal distribution one would expect to see more cases in that category. A very poorly designed study. Twice as many monkeys in the vax category should yield twice as many monkeys with symptoms- even if there is zero impact from the vaccine iteself. It should have had an equal amount in each class (which I was obviously incorrectly assuming they had done).

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## Domalais

I'm still of the opinion that if they were genuine about the study, they would have vaccinated ALL the monkeys.  Control would have been placebo rather than no injection.

1/3rd placebo
1/3rd vaccine w/o thimerosal
1/3rd vaccine w/ thimerosal


If all three groups are the same, then it's not the vaccine.  If the the vaccine groups are both screwed up, then it's the vaccine but not the thimerosal.  If it's just the third group, then it's the thimerosal.  The only purpose I can think of for not conducting the study in this way is because it could very quickly put the authors of the study out of business.


On a side note, I think that we can conclude that it's not the thimerosal simply because the rates of incidence of autism would have decreased or otherwise changed when it was removed from vaccines.  I do not think that the vaccines are at all at fault but I'm open to having my mind changed by properly conducted studies.  However, the groups funding these sorts of studies seem more interested in profit than science.

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## Zippyjuan

That would be good- it could show if it was perhaps something related to the vaccine which may or may not be the thimerisol (which is no longer in vaccines intended for children anyways- you are right about autism rates not changing but continuing to rise even after that occured).  And as I mentioned earlier, I would like to have seen "before" and "afters"- taking measurements of behavior before any vaccine was given and see if any changes came about after the shots were given.

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