# Lifestyles & Discussion > Personal Health & Well-Being >  Psychiatry and liberty

## kona

What is everyone's opinion with respect to psychiatry? Does anyone believe meds are actually helpful? Or is the default position here that psychiatry was spearheaded by globalists for experimentation and social control, and doctors today are just following BS protocols from above and don't know any better?

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## Swordsmyth

Like everything else it has been hijacked and perverted, not being a hard science it has been perverted to an extreme, it is now a danger to liberty and society in general.

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## heavenlyboy34

Quackery. Worse than chiropractic.

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## Schifference

They diagnose people and then prescribe mind altering medication to treat a problem that the person could fix themselves if they only chose to deal with their problem. Instead the mind altering drugs change the chemistry in the brain. The brain stops producing chemicals because the brain recognizes an abundance of those chemicals. Thus a person cannot stop taking the medications without major withdrawal symptoms. People that get on those medications at first feel so much better. A few months later they slip back into the same problems they never dealt with. The answer is to up the medication to a higher dose and or add other medications. Before a person knows it they are on a cocktail of many psych drugs that they can never get off of.

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## RonZeplin



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## donnay

These meds have been helpful to those globalist who want to control all of us.

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## donnay

> Quackery. Worse than chiropractic.


Some chiropractors are great!

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## angelatc

The people here that would probably benefit from psychiatric help are, not coincidentally, the same people screeching that it's some complicated evil plot that only they can see.

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## donnay

> The people here that would probably benefit from psychiatric help are, not coincidentally, the same people screeching that it's some complicated evil plot that only they can see.


Well if your rectum nerve wasn't attached to your optic nerve, I believe you would be able to see the handwriting on the wall.  So let me point some things out for you.

When you look at the school shootings and see that most of the shooters were on psychotropic drugs and then the agenda is to always go after our second amendment.   That's part of the control grid to disarm law abiding citizens guns.

They are putting very small children on psychotropic drugs, saying they have ADHD.  They have been doing this for 30 years.  A good portion of those children are now adults.  Some of the studies I have read say that psychotropic drugs can cause flashbacks breaks in the mind later in life.

They are prescribing them to the elderly to keep them quiet/docile or to sleep.

The VA is prescribing them to our veterans for PTSD like candy.  The other thing is, if a veteran is diagnosed with PTSD the VA can strip them of their second amendment right.

The thing is that you cannot just stop talking these drugs, cold turkey, because they will cause psychotic episodes.  Take a look around you, things are getting crazy out there, and I can assure you these people had help getting there.

Ref:
https://www.cchrint.org/2018/02/20/s...investigation/
http://www.chicagotribune.com/g00/li...a=1&i10c.dv=14
http://www.breitbart.com/big-governm...ment-for-ptsd/
https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle...sd-goes-wrong/
http://wesa.fm/post/long-term-effect...stery#stream/0

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## specsaregood

> Quackery. Worse than chiropractic.


Sure you aren't thinking about psychology?

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## pcosmar

> The people here that would probably benefit from psychiatric help are, not coincidentally, the same people screeching that it's some complicated evil plot that only they can see.


*
10 of the Worst Political Abuses of U.S. Psychiatry and Psychology*
http://brucelevine.net/10-of-the-wor...can-history-2/

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2800147/
This one goes into everyone else,,but not the US.

Not new,,   NOT a Theory.  and it is widespread and deeply ingrained.

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## pcosmar

> The people here that would probably benefit from psychiatric help are, not coincidentally, the same people screeching that it's some complicated evil plot that only they can see.


or just have not turned away at the sight of the Truth.

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## pcosmar

> Quackery. Worse than chiropractic.


I have had a Chiropractor benefit me. Adjusted my neck and back.. Can't speak for bad ones,,but have known a good one..
Much like Doctors or mechanics.. There are good and bad. 

Manipulating people through mind control is the worst form of Rape. It is the most serious invasion of privacy.

These people literally Rape the Mind.
and with no oversight or consequences.

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## heavenlyboy34

> Sure you aren't thinking about psychology?


Nah, Psych is legit.
Per Phlip Hickey, M.D. of Behavioral Science:



> http://behaviorismandmentalhealth.co...valid-science/
> *Psychiatry Is Not Based On Valid Science*n December 23, I wrote a post called _DSM-5 – Dimensional Diagnoses – More Conflicts of Interest?_   In the article I sketched out the role of David Kupfer, MD, in  promoting the concept of dimensional assessment in DSM-5, and I  speculated that at least part of his motivation in this regard might  have stemmed from the fact that he is a major shareholder in a company  that is developing a computerized assessment instrument.  I ended the  piece with a general criticism of psychiatry: “There is only one agenda item in modern  American psychiatry:  the relentless expansion of psychiatric turf and  drug sales.  They’ve promoted categorical diagnoses and chemical  imbalances strenuously for the past five decades.  Now that these  spurious notions are on the point of expiration, psychiatry is  developing dimensional diagnoses and neurocircuitry malfunctions as the  rallying points of the ‘new and improved’ psychiatry.
> 
>  But the bottom line is always the same:  turf and money.  Something is truly rotten in the state of psychiatry.”
>  The article precipitated a fairly lengthy debate in the comments  section.  The discussion was wide ranging, and some of the issues  addressed were fundamental to the entire psychiatric debate, in  particular:  whether or not psychiatry is based on valid science.
> 
>  My own position is that the foundations of psychiatry are spurious,  and the purpose of this post is to set out my position on this matter.
>  PSYCHIATRY’S USE OF THE TERM “ILLNESS”
> 
> ...

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## heavenlyboy34

> I have had a Chiropractor benefit me. Adjusted my neck and back.. Can't speak for bad ones,,but have known a good one..
> Much like Doctors or mechanics.. There are good and bad. 
> 
> Manipulating people through mind control is the worst form of Rape. It is the most serious invasion of privacy.
> 
> These people literally Rape the Mind.
> and with no oversight or consequences.


That's nice, but the chiro didn't use _science_ to get it you fixed. I've known people who felt worse after chiro. If you want legit science, go to an osteopath or someone who has studied the science of muscles and joints. Psychiatry was invented by David Palmer-a beekeeper/raspberry salesman who knew literally nothing about science or medicine or the human body. Just another quack science movement of the 19th/20th century like phrenology.

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## pcosmar

> That's nice, but the chiro didn't use _science_ to get it you fixed. I've known people who felt worse after chiro.


Actually He did.. The X-rays of my back showed deposits pressing on nerves....
Electrical stimulation relaxed my muscles.
Science applied.

And yes I was sore after the adjustment,,  but the numbness and tingling on my left side was gone,, and I could walk without a limp.
My employer paid for it...  
He also showed me some exercises  to prevent recurrence.

So,, there is one.

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## heavenlyboy34

> The people here that would probably benefit from psychiatric help are, not coincidentally, the same people screeching that it's some complicated evil plot that only they can see.


It's not an "evil plot". (though it has been weaponized several times and is still very corrupt) It is complicated, certainly. It's just bull$#@!. Same as any made up, unproveable, non-empirical "natural" cure you've seen debunked.

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## pcosmar

> It's not an "evil plot". (though it has been weaponized several times and is still very corrupt) It is complicated, certainly. It's just bull$#@!. Same as any made up, unproveable, non-empirical "natural" cure you've seen debunked.


The lame apology of the sitting president,,
For those that falsely claim it it a theory.

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## shakey1



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## Firestarter

Psychiatrists don’t even try to "cure" mental health problems. Their main activity is prescribing drugs that cause mental health problems. The main objective of psychiatry is to make their patients/victims docile.
For more information on psychiatry: http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...lation-control


The CIA’s MKULTRA project was mainly about mind control experiments.
This included torture programs by insane psychiatrist (most psychiatrists are more insane than their patients/victims).
Dr. Donald Ewen Cameron for example tortured his victims so terribly that he created human plants: http://www.ronpaulforums.com/entry.p...ed-Individuals

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## tod evans

> Does anyone believe meds are actually helpful?


All 'meds' are helpful to some people, problems arise when government becomes involved in their use and procurement/possession.

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## pcosmar

*Psychiatry and Liberty*

Free your mind..

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## heavenlyboy34

> Psychiatrists don’t even try to "cure" mental health problems. Their main activity is prescribing drugs that cause mental health problems. The main objective of psychiatry is to make their patients/victims docile.
> For more information on psychiatry: http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...lation-control
> 
> 
> The CIA’s MKULTRA project was mainly about mind control experiments.
> This included torture programs by insane psychiatrist (most psychiatrists are more insane than their patients/victims).
> Dr. Donald Ewen Cameron for example tortured his victims so terribly that he created human plants: http://www.ronpaulforums.com/entry.p...ed-Individuals


THIS^^ My mother has been on Sinequan since her nervous breakdown 40+ years ago. The psychiatrist has never done anything but refill her prescription. Even now that dad's dead and she has no major daily stressors, she's hooked on the pills and has no plans to try quitting.

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## DamianTV

There is a True Science to understanding the human mind.

What we have today though does not focus on helping people as individuals, but how to manipulate people and destroy individuality.  Why?  Simple, its more profitable.  Just like Goldman recently came out and said that "curing cancer is not a sustainable business model".  They make much more money on keeping people sick.  Thus, what you end up with in Psychology which extends into Psychiatry is a business model for both unhealthy thinking and unhealthy drugs.  

There are a few people out there that may truly benefit from some types of medications.  Much like Pot is now being used to treat Epilepsy.  The thing is with Psychiatry, there are NO TESTS that are actually done on an individual to measure those brain chemicals.  They are too quickly prescribed for everyone.  When coming up with illnesses for the DSM V and beyond, you have a bunch of people that sit around and vote with very little solid evidence of such a condition.  Right now, the DMS V has 15,000 forms of Mental Illness.  If that isnt the definition of Quackery, then I dont know what is.

Understanding how something works allows a person with that knowledge to either help repair what is broken, or to cause the most damage possible with least effort.  The same is true for the Mind.  Understanding how the mind works, such as the idea of "Scripts" or "Routines" allows Marketers, who also learn Psychology, to take advantage of Mental Loopholes.  Cake Batter can be simply made with Mix and Water.  But, it didnt sell very well.  People like Edward Bernays, who is the Father of Propaganda, showed us that "adding an egg" will play to the minds idea of "Scripts", link to the Female Identity of adding femininity to the cake will increase sales.  Edward Bernays was the nephew of Sigmund Freud.

In Psychology, typically there is "no wrong answer".  If that is true, then why are there Tests in Psychology class?  I could go off on the educational model, but what they are doing to Psych Students is pretty much programming them to only accept the perspectives of figures of authority, while also rejecting ideas that what they are doing is flat out wrong.  Understanding Psychology and Psychiatry does not make even the Practitioners of the fields of study immune to the manipulations that true understanding enables.  

Knowing Martial Arts does not prevent you from your bones being broken when a non defensive stance is taken.  They tend to focus on breaking your bones and replacing your sense of self with their version of it, while getting paid to hurt people.

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## Suzanimal

> What is everyone's opinion with respect to psychiatry? Does anyone believe meds are actually helpful?


It depends on the situation. I believe meds are helpful in certain circumstances. 




> Or is the default position here that psychiatry was spearheaded by globalists for experimentation and social control, and doctors today are just following BS protocols from above and don't know any better?


There's a good bit of that, too.

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## Firestarter

> THIS^^ My mother has been on Sinequan since her nervous breakdown 40+ years ago. The psychiatrist has never done anything but refill her prescription. Even now that dad's dead and she has no major daily stressors, she's hooked on the pills and has no plans to try quitting.


 I don't know about "Sinequan", but anti-psychotics have such horrible adverse effects (these aren't the SIDE effect, but ARE the effect) that nobody gets "hooked" on it.
Most of the drugs make you numb.

I guess Sinequan is an "anti-depressant". Long-term use of anti-depressants causes "extreme" behaviour as the patients/victims get frustrated with the lack of stimulus caused by the drugs.
And ironically anti-depressants cause depression...

Another problem with all of these psychiatric drugs are the withdrawal effects. These withdrawal effects are in turn used to "prove" that the psychiatric drugs "work" (see what happens without them).
They even use this to rigg the medical "scientific" trials...

Because of the withdrawal effects, most "anti-psychiatry" experts agree that the only way to stop with the "drugs" (don't call them "medicine") is by tapering off.

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## heavenlyboy34

> I don't know about "Sinequan", but anti-psychotics have such horrible adverse effects (these aren't the SIDE effect, but ARE the effect) that nobody gets "hooked" on it.
> Most of the drugs make you numb.
> 
> I guess Sinequan is an "anti-depressant". Long-term use of anti-depressants causes "extreme" behaviour as the patients/victims get frustrated with the lack of stimulus caused by the drugs.
> And ironically anti-depressants cause depression...
> 
> Another problem with all of these psychiatric drugs are the withdrawal effects. These withdrawal effects are in turn used to "prove" that the psychiatric drugs "work" (see what happens without them).
> They even use this to rigg the medical "scientific" trials...
> 
> Because of the withdrawal effects, most "anti-psychiatry" experts agree that the only way to stop with the "drugs" (don't call them "medicine") is by tapering off.


Pretty accurate there. *thumbsup*




> *What is doxepin (Sinequan) (Sinequan)?* Doxepin is a tricyclic antidepressants. Doxepin affects chemicals in the brain that may become unbalanced.
> Doxepin  (Sinequan or other generic name) is used to treat symptoms of  depression and/or anxiety associated with alcoholism, psychiatric  conditions, or manic-depressive conditions.
> Doxepin may also be used for purposes not listed in this medication guide.


https://www.rxlist.com/sinequan-drug...cts.htm#whatis

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## kona

> It depends on the situation. I believe meds are helpful in certain circumstances.


Can you list a few circumstances? Thanks.

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## DamianTV

I have a hypothesis, but need more data.

First, yes, this is related to the drugs.  The conscious mind has two major parts, System 1 and System 2.  System 1 is fast but prone to errors.  System 2 is slow, can process a lot of data, but is far more accurate.  System 1 is what we use the majority of the time for efficiency.  System 2 is the "deep thought".

This is something you can observe yourself.  Together, a bat and a ball cost $1.10.  The bat costs $1.00 more than the ball.  How much does the ball cost?  There are no taxes or any other hidden information.  Your System 1 will tell you the ball "obviously" costs $0.10 cents.  This is actually incorrect.  Remember, the bat costs $1.00 more than the ball.  So if the ball only costs 10 cents and the bat costs 1 dollar, the difference, which is what was requested, is only $0.90 cents, not $1 dollar.  Stop and think about it for a second.  When you stop and think and analyze, that is your System 2 kicking in.  The correct answer is that the ball costs 5 cents, and the bat costs $1.05, so the difference of 1.05 - 0.05 is $1.00, which is what was requested.

The point of the paragraph is to show that System 1 is prone to make "snap judgements" and inaccurate conclusions.  What is taught in much of psychology is not how to prevent making mistakes, but intended for marketing purposes where the inaccurate conclusions drawn by System 1 are exploited more often than concepts such as "checking your answers".  Phrases like "Call Now" basically tell you to not think, or to think as little as possible.  Buy today.  Again, don't think.  Its manipulation.

What I think may be happening is all these drugs prevent System 2 from ever kicking in.  The only thing thats left is System 1, where inaccuracies overwhelm the individual.  I dont have enough information to draw further conclusions.  

Does anyone have any more information about Drugs shutting down System 2 in the human mind?

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## pcosmar

> Can you list a few circumstances? Thanks.


LSD was helpful in breaking addiction..  was quite effective on alcohol addiction..
 It failed for mind control but is has other uses.

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## Suzanimal

> Can you list a few circumstances? Thanks.


Well, they helped my dad after his stroke. He had a massive stroke and was a mess until he got the meds he needed. Once he got on his "John Wayne pills" (that's what he called them), he was mostly back to his old self. Although the stroke left him physically disabled, the meds gave him the ability to find some enjoyment in life and gave me 10 more years with the man I knew and loved.

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## pcosmar

> Well, they helped my dad after his stroke. He had a massive stroke and was a mess until he got the meds he needed. Once he got on his "John Wayne pills" (that's what he called them), he was mostly back to his old self. Although the stroke left him physically disabled, the meds gave him the ability to find some enjoyment in life and gave me 10 more years with the man I knew and loved.


There are all kinds of Meds.

I have never known SSRIs to have that effect..  "Zombie Like" is generally more descriptive.

The Army had "Superman"pills..  I am sure other branches had their Brand.  though few talk about them.

Way better than coffee.  But cause psychosis with prolonged use.

ALL kinds of meds.

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## Suzanimal

> There are all kinds of Meds.
> 
> I have never known SSRIs to have that effect..  "Zombie Like" is generally more descriptive.
> 
> The Army had "Superman"pills..  I am sure other branches had their Brand.  though few talk about them.
> 
> Way better than coffee.  But cause psychosis with prolonged use.
> 
> ALL kinds of meds.


It's been a long time since I picked up his scrips but he was taking Paxil and I seem to recall another one he was taking but I can't recall the name. They really helped him.

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## pcosmar

> It's been a long time since I picked up his scrips but he was taking Paxil and I seem to recall another one he was taking but I can't recall the name. They really helped him.


Must have been the other one,,, or a combination of,,,,

But the known effects of Paxil ,,common side effects,,  (not the really bad ones)



> vision changes;
>     weakness, drowsiness, dizziness;
>     sweating, anxiety, shaking;
>     sleep problems (insomnia);
>     loss of appetite, constipation;
>     dry mouth, yawning; or.
>     decreased sex drive, impotence, or difficulty having an orgasm.


pretty much the very opposite of what you described.

It is possible one of his Heart or Blood meds was making him feel good. It is not a known attribute of Paxil.

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## Suzanimal

> Must have been the other one,,, or a combination of,,,,
> 
> But the known effects of Paxil ,,common side effects,,  (not the really bad ones)
> 
> 
> pretty much the very opposite of what you described.
> 
> It is possible one of his Heart or Blood meds was making him feel good. It is not a known attribute of Paxil.


He took 9 different prescriptions a day. There's no telling but I was just glad his doctors found something that gave him some quality of life.

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## donnay

> *How a Maine woman reclaimed her life after 30 years of drug therapy*
> 
> By Meg Haskell
> 
> Jane Tholen is an angry woman on a mission. Living in low-income housing and getting by on her social security benefits, the 70-year-old former marketing professional says she lost three decades of her life, sacrificing her health, her happiness, her career and her personal relationships to a pharmaceutical nightmare.
> 
> About two years ago, bucking the skepticism of the doctors who were treating her, Tholen insisted on being weaned off a cocktail of antidepressants, sleeping pills and antianxiety drugs. What she discovered at the end of that arduous process was her authentic self — battered and exhausted, but mostly intact.
> 
> “I’m still here,” she told the Bangor Daily News, looking polished and put-together during a recent interview in her Falmouth home. “This waking-up process is excruciating … I am experiencing a clarity in the last few months that is remarkable, [but] that is also horrifying.”
> ...


http://bangordailynews.com/2017/02/0...-drug-therapy/

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## timosman

> It's been a long time since I picked up his scrips but he was taking Paxil and I seem to recall another one he was taking but I can't recall the name. They really helped him.


Great job Rachel.

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## timosman

> He took 9 different prescriptions a day. There's no telling but I was just glad his doctors found something that gave him some quality of life.


Suz, you sound different. Did you sell your account?

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## DamianTV

*The Original Complete List Of The 45 Declared Goals For The Communist Takeover Of America*
http://www.rense.com/general32/americ.htm




> 38. Transfer some of the powers of arrest from the police to social agencies. Treat all behavioral problems as psychiatric disorders which no one but psychiatrists can understand [or treat].
> 
> 39. Dominate the psychiatric profession and use mental health laws as a means of gaining coercive control over those who oppose Communist goals.
> 
> 40. Discredit the family as an institution. Encourage promiscuity and easy divorce.


Does any of this sound familiar?  Not that I am blaming Russians or Communists, were are doing a bang up job of $#@!ing ourselves up.

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## Firestarter

> *The Original Complete List Of The 45 Declared Goals For The Communist Takeover Of America*
> http://www.rense.com/general32/americ.htm


 Why such a long list?!?

Reportedly on 13 January 1489, Chemor, Jewish Rabbi of Arles in Provence, wrote for advice to the Grand Sanhedrin.
According to sources that claim the letter is real, it was printed in 1889 in the _Revue des estudes Juives_ (financed by James de Rothschild).

Below is the 4 point advice that was send in return: http://theshamecampaign.com/2014/05/...ews-in-france/



> 1) As for what you say about the command to despoil you of your goods: make your sons merchants, that little by little they may despoil the Christians of theirs.
> 2) As for what you say about their making attempts on your lives: make your sons doctors and apothecaries, that they may take away Christians’ lives.
> 3) As for what you say of their destroying your synagogues: make your sons cannons and clerics in order that they may destroy their churches.
> 4) As for the many other vexations you complain of: arrange that your sons become advocates and lawyers, and see that they always mix themselves up with the affairs of State, in order that by putting Christians under your yoke you may dominate the world and be avenged on them.

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## DamianTV

> Why such a long list?!?
> 
> Reportedly on 13 January 1489, Chemor, Jewish Rabbi of Arles in Provence, wrote for advice to the Grand Sanhedrin.
> According to sources that claim the letter is real, it was printed in 1889 in the _Revue des estudes Juives_ (financed by James de Rothschild).
> 
> Below is the 4 point advice that was send in return: http://theshamecampaign.com/2014/05/...ews-in-france/


I dont know why its so long, I didnt write the list.  What I can say is the goals are very very specific.

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## Suzanimal

> Suz, you sound different. Did you sell your account?


Yes. She fetched a nice price for it on ebay and retired to St Somewhere.

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