# Lifestyles & Discussion > Personal Health & Well-Being >  Grass-Fed vs Grain-Fed Beef  Whats The Difference?

## donnay

*Grass-Fed vs Grain-Fed Beef  Whats The Difference?*

by Kris Gunnars 

The way cows are fed can have a major effect on the nutrient composition of the beef.

Whereas cattle today is often fed grains, the animals we ate throughout evolution roamed free and ate grass.

Many studies have shown that the nutrients in beef can vary depending on what the cows eat.

Its not only important what we eat. It also matters what the foods that we eat, ate.

The Difference Between Grass-Fed and Grain-Fed Cows

Most cows start out living similar lives.

The calves are born in the spring, drink milk from their mothers and are then allowed to roam free and eat grass, shrubs or whatever edible plants they find in their environment.

This continues for about 6 to 12 months. After that, the conventionally raised cows are moved to feedlots.

Large feedlots are called Concentrated Animal Feeding Operations (CAFOs), which tend to be really nasty places, one of the few things the vegans and I agree on.

There, the cows are rapidly fattened up with grain-based feeds, usually made with a base of soy or corn.

The conventionally raised cows are often given drugs and hormones to grow faster, as well as antibiotics to survive the unsanitary living conditions. The cows live there for a few months and are then moved into the factory for slaughtering.

Compare that to grass-fed cows, which may continue to live on grassland for the remainder of their lives.

Of course, this isnt really that simple and the different feeding practices are complicated and varied. The term grass-fed isnt even clearly defined.

But generally speaking, grass-fed cows eat (mostly) grass, while grain-fed cows eat (mostly) an unnatural diet based on corn and soy during the latter part of their lives.

Bottom Line: Most cows start out on pasture, drinking milk and eating grass. However, conventionally raised cows are later moved to feedlots and fed grain-based feeds, while grass-fed cows may continue to live on grassland.

Differences in Fatty Acid Composition

You are what you eat applies to cows too

What a cow eats can have a major effect on the nutrient composition of the beef. This is particularly evident when it comes to the fatty acid composition.

Grass-fed usually contains less total fat than grain-fed beef, which means that gram for gram, grass-fed beef contains fewer calories.

But the composition of the fatty acids is vastly different, which is where grass-fed really shines (1, 2, 3):
Saturated and monounsaturated: Grass-fed beef has either similar, or slightly less, saturated and monounsaturated fats.

Omega-6 Polyunsaturated Fats: Grass-fed and grain-fed beef contain very similar amounts of Omega-6 fatty acids.

Omega-3s: This is where grass-fed really makes a major difference, containing up to 5 times as much Omega-3.

Conjugated Linoleic Acid (CLA): Grass-fed beef contains about twice as much CLA as grain-fed beef. This fatty acid is associated with reduced body fat and some other beneficial effects (4).

If you cant afford or cant access grass-fed beef, then it is a good idea to eat fatty fish once or twice a week or supplement with fish oil to make up for the lost Omega-3s.

Bottom Line: Grass-fed beef may contain slightly less total fat than grain-fed beef, but a lot more Omega-3 fatty acids and CLA, which are both very beneficial for health.

Red Meat is Highly Nutritious, Grass-Fed Even More so

Humans have been eating meat throughout evolution and our bodies are well equipped to digest and absorb the nutrients from meat.

Traditional hunter-gatherer populations like the Masai and Inuit got most of their calories from meat and remained in excellent health (5, 6).

This is possible because red meat, even conventional grain-fed meat, is incredibly nutritious.

Regular grain-fed beef is loaded with Vitamin B12, B3 and B6. It is also very rich in highly bioavailable Iron, Selenium and Zinc. Meat contains some amount of almost every nutrient that humans need to survive (7).

Meat also contains high quality protein and various lesser known nutrients like Creatine and Carnosine, which are very important for our muscles and brains.

However, grass-fed beef is even more nutritious than that: (8):
Vitamin A: Grass-fed beef contains carotenoid precursors to Vitamin A, such as beta-carotene.

Vitamin E: This is an antioxidant that sits in your cell membranes and protects them from oxidation. Grass-fed beef contains more.

Micronutrients: Grass-fed beef also contains more Potassium, Iron, Zinc, Phosphorus and Sodium.


Bottom Line: Even conventional grain-feed beef is highly nutritious, but grass-fed beef contains more Carotenoids, Vitamin E and minerals like Potassium, Iron, Zinc, Phosphorus and Sodium.

Is Grass-Fed Beef Worth The Extra Cost and Inconvenience?

It is important to keep in mind that even conventional, grain-fed beef is very healthy.

As long as you dont overcook your beef (which can form harmful compounds) then it is a nutritious food that should be a regular part of your diet.

Grass-fed beef can be more expensive and it may not be worth the extra cost for some people.

Depending on where you live, it may also be inconvenient to access grass-fed beef.

While some people might live close to a farmers market or a Whole Foods store, others might need to drive long distances to acquire it.

There can also be subtle differences in taste. Grass-fed beef is often leaner and there may be some differences in texture. Some people prefer grass-fed, others grain-fed, I recommend you try both and see which one you prefer.

Take Home Message

Despite all the controversies in nutrition, most people are beginning to agree that the most important thing is to just eat real food!

Id like to take that one step further

Just eat real food that eats real food.

Source:
http://authoritynutrition.com/grass-...rain-fed-beef/

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## tod evans

> Just eat real food that eats real food.


Good synopsis!

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## opal

I don't know if any studies have been done on this and YMMV but .. personal experience here
hubby's diabetic.. if he eats grain fed beef only - like a steak without sides, his sugar numbers go up.. grass fed beef.. no sugar jump

bonus.. he likes the flavor of grass fed better and doesn't slop it with some sort of sauce

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## SouthBeachPrimal

> I don't know if any studies have been done on this and YMMV but .. personal experience here
> hubby's diabetic.. if he eats grain fed beef only - like a steak without sides, his sugar numbers go up.. grass fed beef.. no sugar jump
> 
> bonus.. he likes the flavor of grass fed better and doesn't slop it with some sort of sauce


There was a study done in Australia on Kangaroo meat vs Wagyu beef meat.  Not a perfect grass vs grain test since they used different animals, but they found grain fed produced a mildly inflammatory reaction in subjects whereas the grass fed Kangaroo did not.

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## BamaAla

Grass-fed cooks a lot faster and doesn't taste as good (to me.)

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## opal

> Grass-fed cooks a lot faster and doesn't taste as good (to me.)


soak.. er marinate it in some olive oil, wine and herbs for a while before you cook it.. should help

and ground grass fed.. hubby likes it on it's own but for added flavor, the first time I made it for him, I added some tony Cacheries creole seasoning and olive oil.. tony's is a staple around here.

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## SouthBeachPrimal

> Grass-fed cooks a lot faster and doesn't taste as good (to me.)


I agree, but grass is what a cow is supposed to eat.  A grain fed cow is an unhealthy cow, and there is increasing evidence that eating unhealthy cows makes for unhealthy humans.  And you get used to the taste.

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## Brian4Liberty

It's funny that the article goes into such detail about the specific fat composition and doesn't mention the fact that grass-fed beef has more trans-fat than grain-fed. Of course it's not a big deal, as natural trans-fat is not bad. It's artificially created trans-fat (hydrogenated) that is artery clogging poison.

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## BamaAla

> I agree, but grass is what a cow is supposed to eat.  A grain fed cow is an unhealthy cow, and there is increasing evidence that eating unhealthy cows makes for unhealthy humans.  And you get used to the taste.


I'm not sure about that. I've been Primal since September 2011 and I still haven't started liking grass-fed better!

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## SouthBeachPrimal

> I'm not sure about that. I've been Primal since September 2011 and I still haven't started liking grass-fed better!


I said "used to it".  Never mentioned anything about liking it better, lol!

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## opal

> I'm not sure about that. I've been Primal since September 2011 and I still haven't started liking grass-fed better!


just a thought here .. but in the *you are what you eat* vein.. maybe the cows your supplier uses eat grass you don't particularly care for.. try a supplier from a different area maybe?  How far up in TWA are you?  half way up the state or further south?
Hubby tasted it the first time and said.. this is what beef should taste like .. isn't thrilled with the meat we have a freezer full of from the commissary anymore.

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## BamaAla

> I said "used to it".  Never mentioned anything about liking it better, lol!


LOL. Fair enough! 




> just a thought here .. but in the *you are what you eat* vein.. maybe the cows your supplier uses eat grass you don't particularly care for.. try a supplier from a different area maybe?  How far up in TWA are you?  half way up the state or further south?
> Hubby tasted it the first time and said.. this is what beef should taste like .. isn't thrilled with the meat we have a freezer full of from the commissary anymore.


I usually order online from US Wellness or pick it up at Whole Foods/Earth Fare. There are some places around here (between Huntsville and Cullman, North Alabama) but you have to buy at least a quarter cow and I've been too lazy to get a deep freeze. Don't get me wrong, I still enjoy my grass-fed beef, but decades of eating fatty marbled steaks spoils a guy!

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## presence

> Just eat real food that eats real food.



You are what_ your food eats_

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## Feeding the Abscess

> It's funny that the article goes into such detail about the specific fat composition and doesn't mention the fact that grass-fed beef has more trans-fat than grain-fed. Of course it's not a big deal, as natural trans-fat is not bad. It's artificially created trans-fat (hydrogenated) that is artery clogging poison.


Yes, the higher trans-fat content is due to the CLA found in grass-fed meat. CLA has been shown to be beneficial for humans, as opposed to the man-made trans-fats.

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## fr33

How about cattle that eat a balanced mix of grains and grasses? It's not completely true that cattle don't naturally eat grains. Cattle will often eat the seed heads off of many different plants.

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## XNavyNuke

> How about cattle that eat a balanced mix of grains and grasses? It's not completely true that cattle don't naturally eat grains. Cattle will often eat the seed heads off of many different plants.


Cutting grasses and legume hays normally occurs before seed head production so as to spur regrowth for the next cutting. The case could be made that this is significantly different to the diet of a truly feral cattle population.

XNN

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## dannno

> Grass-fed cooks a lot faster and doesn't taste as good (to me.)


It has more beef flavor so you must not like beef flavor, or you are cooking it too much. Yes, it does cook faster, so don't cook it as long!!

Honestly every time I eat non-grass fed meat it tastes like NOTHING.. it has zero flavor and I don't get energy from eating it. 

Where are you buying your grass fed meat?

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## dannno

> I usually order online from US Wellness or pick it up at Whole Foods/Earth Fare. There are some places around here (between Huntsville and Cullman, North Alabama) but you have to buy at least a quarter cow and I've been too lazy to get a deep freeze. Don't get me wrong, I still enjoy my grass-fed beef, but decades of eating fatty marbled steaks spoils a guy!


If you are ordering online, price out Beetnik, though I can't really afford to get it online unless there is a crazy sale or Groupon or something.

Sometimes grassfed means nothing because they also feed them grains, you want 100% grass fed or grass finished.

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## XNavyNuke

> Sometimes grassfed means nothing because they also feed them grains, you want 100% grass fed or grass finished.


If you're not sourcing it personally, then you are almost certainly not getting 100% grass fed. 

USDA Agricultural Marketing Service




> _Grass-fed._ Grass-fed animals receive a *majority* of their nutrients from grass throughout their life, while organic animals’ pasture diet may be supplemented with grain. Also USDA regulated, the grass-fed label does not limit the use of antibiotics, hormones, or pesticides. Meat products may be labeled as grass-fed organic.


Emphasis mine. 50.01% baby!
XNN

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## Acala

> If you're not sourcing it personally, then you are almost certainly not getting 100% grass fed. 
> 
> USDA Agricultural Marketing Service
> 
> 
> 
> Emphasis mine. 50.01% baby!
> XNN


Yes, grass-fed is not enough.  It needs to be grass-fed and grass-finished.  And I agree you should be buying directly from the rancher and asking about their operation.

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## Acala

> How about cattle that eat a balanced mix of grains and grasses? It's not completely true that cattle don't naturally eat grains. Cattle will often eat the seed heads off of many different plants.


Unlikely that a wild ruminant animal would get much seed at all.  Natural grass seed is tiny, sparse, and seasonal.  It would not be a significant portion of the diet.

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## specsaregood

> If you are ordering online, price out Beetnik, though I can't really afford to get it online unless there is a crazy sale or Groupon or something.
> 
> Sometimes grassfed means nothing because they also feed them grains, you want 100% grass fed or grass finished.


I linked here before; but might as well again: http://www.texasgrassfedbeef.com/buy_meat_online.htm
I've ordered from him a few times, he's a total nut (in a good way) about grassfed only.  I had a hunch he was an rp supporter, and found I was correct via FEC lookup.

Personally,  I'm not a big fan of grassfed steaks,  I've tried em from a variety of sources and they are just a bit too gamey.   If I want a steak, I'll buy some corn-finished stuff and treat it like a dessert.   But I don't eat steaks all that often, but we use a fair amount of groundbeef and you can't beat slankers (link above)  78%! grassfed ground beef.   And if you are adventurous try the "Primal Ground Beef"  (Beef trim, beef liver, beef heart, beef spleen, beef kidneys).  It makes a damn good chili.

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## dannno

> Personally,  I'm not a big fan of grassfed steaks,  I've tried em from a variety of sources and they are just a bit too gamey.   If I want a steak, I'll buy some corn-finished stuff and treat it like a dessert.


The best thing I've ever eaten was a grass-fed filet mignon wrapped in bacon, I don't know what this is about grass-fed steak not tasting good, you must be cooking it wrong. I get 100% grass fed/finished steaks from New Zealand and locally, they have WAY more flavor than the corn fed stuff, which again, does not have much if any beef flavor at all. 

Are you properly seasoning the steaks with some salt and pepper beforehand, and some olive oil? Are you really giving the outside a good sear and only cooking it to medium rare on a smokin hot cooking surface? As was mentioned earlier, grass-fed takes less time to cook. The only thing I can think of is that cooking grass-fed might require a little more attention and finesse in cooking it properly, but when done properly the flavors don't compare.

I also recently had some grass fed lamb chops that had way more flavor than the grain/grass combo fed lamb chops I got from the store a week ago. 

Pastured chicken doesn't take as long to cook, and has far better flavor, even most good chefs will tell you this. 

I had a wild boar shank that was the best pork I've ever had. 

The best ground beef I've ever had is 100% grassfed wagyu beef from New Zealand, it has a higher fat content than grain fed cows here in the US (that you can see) but still has great beef flavor. 

Really not buying any of this crap about anything fed grains making it taste better. The only reason I every consider buying it is because it is near half the cost... but I know it's not going to taste as good and be bad for my health.

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## specsaregood

> The best thing I've ever eaten was a grass-fed filet mignon wrapped in bacon, I don't know what this is about grass-fed steak not tasting good, you must be cooking it wrong. I get 100% grass fed/finished steaks from New Zealand and locally, they have WAY more flavor than the corn fed stuff, which again, does not have much if any beef flavor at all. 
> 
> Are you properly seasoning the steaks with some salt and pepper beforehand, and some olive oil? Are you really giving the outside a good sear and only cooking it to medium rare on a smokin hot cooking surface? As was mentioned earlier, grass-fed takes less time to cook. The only thing I can think of is that cooking grass-fed might require a little more attention and finesse in cooking it properly, but when done properly the flavors don't compare.


It's not a matter of not knowing how to cook it, its a matter of taste.   They taste differently; people have different taste preferences.    I think that grassfed beef tastes a bit (definitely smells a bit) like fish.  Which makes perfect sense since they have similar fat profiles.  The omega3's are what gives fish that fishy smell.   I've noticed that from all the sources of grassfed beef I've tried, same with lamb.  I can't stomach lamb leg or shank as it is just too fishy.   However, ground lamb an ground beef don't bother me for some reason.  It is what it is, I've never been a fish fan and the few fish I like are low in o3's.

edit: also grassfed flatiron or flank steaks I like.  It's just the bigger thick cuts that just aren't appealing.

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## Acala

> It's not a matter of not knowing how to cook it, its a matter of taste.   They taste differently; people have different taste preferences.    I think that grassfed beef tastes a bit (definitely smells a bit) like fish.  Which makes perfect sense since they have similar fat profiles.  The omega3's are what gives fish that fishy smell.   I've noticed that from all the sources of grassfed beef I've tried, same with lamb.  I can't stomach lamb leg or shank as it is just too fishy.   However, ground lamb an ground beef don't bother me for some reason.  It is what it is, I've never been a fish fan and the few fish I like are low in o3's.
> 
> edit: also grassfed flatiron or flank steaks I like.  It's just the bigger thick cuts that just aren't appealing.


In a sense I was lucky in that I had not eaten any beef for thirty years when I decided to go primal and start eating grass fed beef only.  So I didn't have anything to compare it to.  Now I love it!  I eat it raw (dried).

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## dannno

> It's not a matter of not knowing how to cook it, its a matter of taste.   They taste differently; people have different taste preferences.    I think that grassfed beef tastes a bit (definitely smells a bit) like fish.  Which makes perfect sense since they have similar fat profiles.  The omega3's are what gives fish that fishy smell.   I've noticed that from all the sources of grassfed beef I've tried, same with lamb.  I can't stomach lamb leg or shank as it is just too fishy.   However, ground lamb an ground beef don't bother me for some reason.  It is what it is, I've never been a fish fan and the few fish I like are low in o3's.
> 
> edit: also grassfed flatiron or flank steaks I like.  It's just the bigger thick cuts that just aren't appealing.


That seems odd, I've never noticed a fishy smell with my meats, and slow cooked grass fed lamb is phenomenal with a little bit of mint apple jelly (i'll be making my own jelly soon with honey). It's probably one of my favorites. 

I don't know if it is really a matter of 'tastes', grass fed beef has more beef 'flavor' and 'taste' and grain fed has less. It's either there or it isn't.

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## dannno

> In a sense I was lucky in that I had not eaten any beef for thirty years when I decided to go primal and start eating grass fed beef only.  So I didn't have anything to comapre it to.  Now I love it!  I eat it raw (dried).


Does the raw/dried have a fat content? What is that exactly? I notice beef jerky has very little if any fat content (right?), so unless you reserve the fat yourself and use it some how I'm thinking it's mostly worthless, no?

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## specsaregood

> That seems odd, I've never noticed a fishy smell with my meats, and slow cooked grass fed lamb is phenomenal with a little bit of mint apple jelly (i'll be making my own jelly soon with honey). It's probably one of my favorites. 
> 
> I don't know if it is really a matter of 'tastes', grass fed beef has more beef 'flavor' and 'taste' and grain fed has less. It's either there or it isn't.


Maybe you just have a diminished sense of taste and smell.

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## Acala

> Does the raw/dried have a fat content? What is that exactly? I notice beef jerky has very little if any fat content (right?), so unless you reserve the fat yourself and use it some how I'm thinking it's mostly worthless, no?


It depends on which cut you use.  I use round roast, which is pretty lean, and I trim off any fat, because I use some of the dried beef for making pemmican.  I don't want any unrendered fat in the pemmican.  Because it is lean, the dried beef would not be a meal unto itself - like pemmican - but I mainly eat it in the locker room right after a workout when I am looking for a protein hit.  So it is good for that.

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## dannno

> Maybe you just have a diminished sense of taste and smell.


No, it's very common knowledge that grass fed beef has more beef flavor, I've never heard of beef smelling like fish in my life.

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## BamaAla

> I linked here before; but might as well again: http://www.texasgrassfedbeef.com/buy_meat_online.htm
> I've ordered from him a few times, he's a total nut (in a good way) about grassfed only.  I had a hunch he was an rp supporter, and found I was correct via FEC lookup.
> 
> Personally,  I'm not a big fan of grassfed steaks,  I've tried em from a variety of sources and they are just a bit too gamey.   If I want a steak, I'll buy some corn-finished stuff and treat it like a dessert.   But I don't eat steaks all that often, but we use a fair amount of groundbeef and you can't beat slankers (link above)  78%! grassfed ground beef.   And if you are adventurous try the "Primal Ground Beef"  (Beef trim, beef liver, beef heart, beef spleen, beef kidneys).  It makes a damn good chili.


Same here. I like grass-fed ground beef just fine, but the steaks just don't do it for me. I hate to admit this too, but wild caught salmon just doesn't taste as good as farm raised to me either. That's not a problem because I eat a fraction of salmon to beef. 

I'm not claiming that I'm the greatest cook in the South, but I think I've got a pretty good handle on grilling a steak. I've tried many different things, but the steaks just aren't as good to me. I wish they were, and I'll keep trying, but in two years I just haven't cracked it.

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## tod evans

Been growing and eating bovine flesh for decades and my preference is yellow marbling from corn...

Any number of farmers in these parts'll let you walk out back and point to the "grass fed" steer you want, load it in the trailer and deliver it to your butcher of choice...

If ya'll want to try what the locals prefer look for Beefmaster cattle that are fed out at home....

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## AFPVet

Some farms do both grass and grain. If you have the right balance, you can still get a quality cut. The trick is to feed them mostly grass and just enough grain to get that extra 'marbling'.

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## specsaregood

> No, it's very common knowledge that grass fed beef has more beef flavor, *I've never heard of beef smelling like fish in my life.*


And now you have

http://kellythekitchenkop.com/2009/0...-question.html



> Girl Gone Domestic July 17, 2009 at 12:46 am I will never forget the time *I was cooking some grass fed ground beef and my Dad walked into our house and said “Having fish for dinner?”*


http://chowhound.chow.com/topics/798608



> *Our grass fed beef tastes like fish, why?*
> 
> We splurged this last year and bought 1/4 of a grass fed cow. I am fine with the slightly tougher texture, etc, but neither hubby nor I like the taste of this meat. I have had grass fed before from Whole foods and liked it, *but this stuff tasts like FISH* (it is very reminicent of the aftertaste of fish oil capsules taken for health).


http://paleohacks.com/questions/1272...t-likely-to-be



> Interesting. My TJs sells their grass-fed beef in the meat case (not frozen). *I have noticed a few times that it has that fishy smell*


http://www.lynnskitchenadventures.co...e-readers.html



> *Is the taste somewhat fishy?* Grass fed beef is higher in the Omega oils that other beef. We have found the extent of the “flavor” to us it is fishy depends on how long the beef was “hung” after slaughter

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## dannno

Hah, you $#@!ers, I told you so..

Get some GOOD beef that actually has some good grass to eat and get back to me..





> *Does Grass-fed Beef Taste Gamey?*
> 
> We grow weary of people claiming that grass-fed beef is always chewy and tastes gamey or livery. Some probably does, but ours certainly doesn't. *A chewy texture can come from grass-fed beef that is raised in places where there isn't much grass for much of the year* (most of the US, for example) or from cattle that is provided inconsistent feed. Usually these problems go together since ranchers who don't have access to green pastures year-round will truck in commercially-grown grass to feed their animals.
> 
> As for tasting livery or gamey, that happens for the same reason: cattle that don't have consistent access to high-protein, sweet grass. *If cattle are thrown sour grass, they will have sour-tasting meat. If they are stressed and afraid prior to processing, that can also impact the flavor of their meat in a negative way*.


http://www.estanciabeef.com/news/doe...ef-taste-gamey





> But for many of us who were raised on grain-fed beef, the flavor and texture of grass-fed beef can seem a little, well, off. *At its best, lean, grass-fed beef will have a deeper, more beefy, and earthier flavor than grain-finished, but it may not be as tender as corn-finished beef*. Other times the taste and texture can both be less than appealing. But that may have something to do with the quality of the grass-fed beef we’re eating. And the quality of grass that the cows are eating.


http://www.foodrepublic.com/2011/04/...-grass-matters

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## dannno

> And now you have
> 
> http://kellythekitchenkop.com/2009/0...-question.html
> 
> 
> http://chowhound.chow.com/topics/798608
> 
> 
> http://paleohacks.com/questions/1272...t-likely-to-be
> ...





> We have found the extent of the “flavor” to us it is fishy depends on how long the beef was “hung” after slaughter


There ya go.

Get some good fresh high quality grass fed beef.

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## specsaregood

> There ya go.
> Get some good fresh high quality grass fed beef.


Maybe yours isn't grass finished.

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## specsaregood

> Hah, you $#@!ers, I told you so..
> 
> Get some GOOD beef that actually has some good grass to eat and get back to me..


No link?

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## dannno

> Maybe yours isn't grass finished.


The $#@! it isn't, it is a special lowline bread of cattle that is fed a specialized diet of specific grasses. And the rest usually comes from New Zealand, which has no shortage of grass.

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## dannno

> No link?


Added links..

The point is if the cow isn't getting enough good grasses then the meat is going to suffer. If you hang the cow for too long after slaughter it's going to smell fishy and it probably doesn't matter what its diet was, just that grain fed beef have the economies of scale working for them and so they aren't going to let their beef sit around as much since they need to move it faster. 

Maybe if we didn't use so much water for watering grains we would have enough water for to keep some grass going and move cow pastures to more hilly and grassy locations instead of moving them closer to where their grain feedlot is.

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## specsaregood

> The $#@! it isn't, it is a special lowline bread of cattle that is fed a specialized diet of specific grasses. And the rest usually comes from New Zealand, which has no shortage of grass.


ooooh a special breed of cattle on a specialized diet of specific grasses.  Certainly not the norm for a grassfed cow.   I certainly wasn't speaking about your hoity toity bioengineered beef.  I have no idea what that smells or tastes like.    You sound almost emotionally invested in this, why so much butthurt over whether others think grassfed cows smell like fish?

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## specsaregood

> Added links..


your quotes say nothing about the fish smell or taste.  It talks about gamey.   FWIW: every bit of NZ lamb I have had, had the same fishy smell/taste.  I think its the high Omega 3 content.  Similarly, farm raised fish which are low in O3's aren't fishy to me.

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## dannno

> ooooh a special breed of cattle on a specialized diet of specific grasses.  Certainly not the norm for a grassfed cow.   I certainly wasn't speaking about your hoity toity bioengineered beef.  I have no idea what that smells or tastes like.    You sound almost emotionally invested in this, why so much butthurt over whether others think grassfed cows smell like fish?


Because it is disinformation to say that grassfed beef smells like fish when it is cows hanging for too long after slaughter that causes it. There is plenty of grassfed beef that doesn't smell like fish.

It is disinformation to say that grassfed beef doesn't taste better than grain fed when a cow that has access to good pasture and is grass fed tastes much better than grain fed. SOMETIMES grain fed tends to be slightly more tender, but not all the time, and much of it has to do with preperation and cooking time when it isn't due to lack of good grasses.

I just showed you that the reason some grass fed beef doesn't taste good is because they have a diet lacking in nutrition, they need GRASS to be grass fed cows, right??

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## dannno

> your quotes say nothing about the fish smell or taste.


YOUR quotes and links had the thing about cows hanging for too long having a fishy smell.

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## dannno

> I hate to admit this too, but wild caught salmon just doesn't taste as good as farm raised to me either.


I have never, ever, ever, ever, ever heard that from somebody who lives in an area that has access to relatively fresh wild caught seafood anything.. You probably have the ability to get fresher farm raised salmon and so that tastes better.

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## specsaregood

> Because it is disinformation to say that grassfed beef smells like fish when it is cows hanging for too long after slaughter that causes it. There is plenty of grassfed beef that doesn't smell like fish.
> 
> It is disinformation to say that grassfed beef doesn't taste better than grain fed when a cow that has access to good pasture and is grass fed tastes much better than grain fed. SOMETIMES grain fed tends to be slightly more tender, but not all the time, and much of it has to do with preperation and cooking time. 
> 
> I just showed you that the reason some grass fed beef doesn't taste good is because they have a diet lacking in nutrition, they need GRASS to be grass fed cows, right??


It isn't disinformation, its opinion.  I've had plenty of high quality grassfed beef from a variety of locations around the country, it all has that fishy smell.   Like I said, perhaps you aren't sensitive to it.  I've had fresh caught fish make me barf from that fishy taste, I notice it right away.    Its all in the omega3s my man, its not hangtime.

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## specsaregood

> YOUR quotes and links had the thing about cows hanging for too long having a fishy smell.


Because that's the disinformation.   Do you know why they hang beef after slaughter?

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## jj-

Eat the one tastes better. There are much, much bigger issues in health. Avoiding platic-bottled water, with its estrogenic substances, even those that say BPA-free, would have more important effects in health.

Also, even if you eat grass-fed beef, some cuts are better than others. Organs are better than muscle meat. So if you eat a bunch of muscle meat from grass fed beef you're probably worse than someone who eats liver, tripe, bone broth from grain-fed beef.

I personally can't digest some grain-fed goat milk I tried.

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## dannno

> Because that's the disinformation.   Do you know why they hang beef after slaughter?


To drain the blood I suppose, are you saying it is the opposite?

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## specsaregood

> I personally can't digest some grain-fed goat milk I tried.


Yeah, that's another thing.  Grassfed milk and butter have that same fishy smell.

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## specsaregood

> To drain the blood I suppose, are you saying it is the opposite?


you should look It up.

edit:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hanging_(meat)




> Meat hanging is a culinary process, commonly used in beef aging, that improves the flavor of meats by allowing the natural enzymes in the meat to break down the tissue through dry aging. Also, the process allows the water in the meat to evaporate to concentrate the flavor.

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## dannno

> Eat the one tastes better. There are much, much bigger issues in health. Avoiding platic-bottled water, with its estrogenic substances, even those that say BPA-free, would have more important effects in health.
> 
> Also, even if you eat grass-fed beef, some cuts are better than others. Organs are better than muscle meat. So if you eat a bunch of muscle meat from grass fed beef you're probably worse than someone who eats liver, tripe, bone broth from grain-fed beef.
> 
> I personally can't digest some grain-fed goat milk I tried.


I disagree with this - a cow with a heavy grain diet does NOT imo have a very good fat profile, so eating high fat portions of grain fed beef is going to give you a heart attack - You'd be better off eating the grains yourself with some fruit and veggies, imo. That's why the medical establishment has been telling everybody to stop eating red meat, that is why vegetarians have better heart health than meat eaters, because animals eat so many grains. 

Grass fed beef has a much better fat profile, you are better off eating the fatty organs and such but you are still better off eating the non fatty portions of grass fed beef as opposed to the fatty portions of grain fed beef.

Not to mention, if you eat grain fed beef and it isn't organic, the liver can be VERY nasty with a lot of toxic $#@!!! I've actually heard it recommended that you don't eat liver or organs UNLESS it is grass fed.

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## dannno

> Yeah, that's another thing.  Grassfed milk and butter have that same fishy smell.


Go to Trader Joe's and buy some super cheap 100% Irish grass fed butter... there is no fishy smell, very healthy cows with plenty of grass to eat.

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## jj-

> I disagree with this - a cow with a heavy grain diet does NOT imo have a very good fat profile, so eating high fat portions of grain fed beef is going to give you a heart attack - You'd be better off eating the grains yourself with some fruit and veggies, imo. That's why the medical establishment has been telling everybody to stop eating red meat, that is why vegetarians have better heart health than meat eaters, because animals eat so many grains. 
> 
> Grass fed beef has a much better fat profile, you are better off eating the fatty organs and such but you are still better off eating the non fatty portions of grass fed beef as opposed to the fatty portions of grain fed beef.
> 
> Not to mention, if you eat grain fed beef and it isn't organic, the liver can be VERY nasty with a lot of toxic $#@!!! I've actually heard it recommended that you don't eat liver or organs UNLESS it is grass fed.


The disagreement here might come down to our differences in the definition of good fat profile. What's your definition of good fat profile?

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## specsaregood

> Go to Trader Joe's and buy some super cheap 100% Irish grass fed butter... there is no fishy smell, very healthy cows with plenty of grass to eat.


You talking about Kerrys Gold?  Smells like fish when I cook with it.  Or Organic Valley?  Same deal.   All smells fishy to me -- not the cultured stuff though.    And I doubt its the hangtime.

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## jj-

Dannno, regarding the fat profile, you forgot a huge important part of the context.




> Personally,  I'm not a big fan of grassfed steaks,  I've tried em from a variety of sources and they are just a bit too gamey.   If I want a steak, I'll buy some corn-finished stuff and treat it like a dessert.   *But I don't eat steaks all that often*, but we use a fair amount of groundbeef and you can't beat slankers (link above)  78%! grassfed ground beef.


So it really doesn't matter.

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## dannno

Think of grains like mercury poisoning. We know there are plenty of studies that show vegetarians have much lower risk of heart problems than meat eaters - vegetarians eat grains, meat eaters eat animals that eat grains. So eating grains we know is bad, but the effect seems to be MULTIPLIED when you eat animals that have a very high or all grain diet. 

So a small fish intakes a small amount of mercury from their environment, then they get eaten by the dolphin and the dolphin ends up with greater concentrations of mercury, and you definitely don't want to eat the dolphin. 

Think of grains the same way, or at least I do. 

100% grass fed > Pastured with grain supplement > Grains themselves > Animal with a near 100% grain diet 

That is why I am against grain fed meat, if i buy meat that eats grains I try to ensure that it AT LEAST has access to pastures so it can get out and forage, otherwise I feel like I'd be healthier eating rice and veggies. 

Remember the poster who recently has said how their significant other has an blood sugar spike issues when eating GRAIN FED MEAT? 

Why are we assuming that eating 100% grain fed meat is healthier than eating grains? These are not healthy animals, they probably aren't getting any sun or vitamin D, at least the god damn vegetables and grains get some sun!!

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## jj-

> The best thing I've ever eaten was a grass-fed filet mignon wrapped in *bacon*,


And then whatever benefits you might've derived from grass-fed beef go to hell.

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## dannno

> You talking about Kerrys Gold?  Smells like fish when I cook with it.  Or Organic Valley?  Same deal.   All smells fishy to me -- not the cultured stuff though.    And I doubt its the hangtime.


I put 2 tablespoons of kerrygold in my coffee, and I put butter on my gf's corn on the cob and various other things, I'm completely convinced my gf has a better sense of smell than anybody in the world and she has never complained of a fishy smell from anything I have cooked.

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## jj-

> It's not a matter of not knowing how to cook it, its a matter of taste.   They taste differently; people have different taste preferences.    I think that grassfed beef tastes a bit (definitely smells a bit) like fish.  Which makes perfect sense since they have similar fat profiles.


They don't have similar fat profiles. Beef fat, even grain-fed, is less than 3% polyunsaturated. Salmon has 36% of polyunsaturated fats. That fat profile is more similar to that of a pig or a chicken.

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## dannno

> And then whatever benefits you might've derived from grass-fed beef go to hell.


Not if the bacon is pastured, and the bacon I buy for my breakfast is, and I am sure the bacon on my filet mignon was too since it was from Beetnik.

I'd rather eat pastured bacon than a cow that was grass fed and then gets stuck indoors eating grains for the last 2 months of its life.

Pastured bacon is probably equal to a grass fed cow that goes to a grain feedlot for a short time and has some access to outdoors.

Honestly I'd prefer wild boar... I just bought some ground wild boar and there is some wild boar up in the hills I would love to go hunt some day.

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## jj-

Meat hanging, aging, whatever they want to call them makes the quality of the meat poorer.

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## dannno

I also found ground elk and ground venison in addition to my ground wild board, only $6.99/lb... unfortunately they are from new zealand which is good because they are actually wild grass fed, not grain fed venison which does exist altho it's probably not that bad because I'm sure they have plenty of access to outdoors, but bad because they need to be shipped so far.

We really need to increase the size of the grass fed/wild animal industry in this country so it can compete better with the grain fed in terms of cost and such, but there needs to be some restructuring of the industry and probably some changes in regulation.

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## jj-

> Not if the bacon is pastured, and the bacon I buy for my breakfast is, and I am sure the bacon on my filet mignon was too since it was from Beetnik.


Bacon has a worse fat profile because bacon is about 15% polyunsaturated while grain-fed beef fat is less than 3% polyunsaturated. That's because pigs don't convert the polyunsaturated fats they ingest to saturated, while cows do, even grain fed.

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## specsaregood

> Dannno, regarding the fat profile, you forgot a huge important part of the context.
> 
> So it really doesn't matter.


I eat the crap out of groundbeef though.  I've found you can mix pretty much anything into a meatball and come out with an edible dinner.

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## specsaregood

> I also found ground elk and ground venison in addition to my ground wild board, only $6.99/lb... unfortunately they are from new zealand which is good because they are actually wild grass fed, not grain fed venison which does exist altho it's probably not that bad because I'm sure they have plenty of access to outdoors, but bad because they need to be shipped so far.
> 
> We really need to increase the size of the grass fed/wild animal industry in this country so it can compete better with the grain fed in terms of cost and such, but there needs to be some restructuring of the industry and probably some changes in regulation.


I swear you must be employed by the NZ agricultural dept.

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## jj-

As long as you eat mostly beef and minimize chicken, pork, and fatty fish, your fat profile from the consumption of meat is going to be very good. E.g., you would eat mostly saturated and monounsaturated fats and little polyunsaturated.

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## dannno

> I eat the crap out of groundbeef though.  I've found you can mix pretty much anything into a meatball and come out with an edible dinner.


Doesn't it smell like fish?

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## dannno

> As long as you eat mostly beef and minimize chicken, pork, and fatty fish, your fat profile from the consumption of meat is going to be very good. E.g., you would eat mostly saturated and monounsaturated fats and little polyunsaturated.


What about bison?

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## jj-

> What about bison?


Probably good, ruminants convert their fats to saturated. But I think not as good as beef or lamb.

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## specsaregood

> Doesn't it smell like fish?


No, I said that at the very beginning, for some reason the grassfed ground beef isn't fishy and doesn't bother me.  Bama- said the same thing.   Also some of the thinner cuts like flat iron an flank.  although frying up flank steak can sure make the house smell like a fish fry, but the taste doesn't bother me.   Its just the bigger cuts/steaks.  And I've had both the steaks and the ground from the same ranches.

Its just like the fish, I can't stand fish with dark meat, makes me want to puke.

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## Brian4Liberty

> Maybe you just have a diminished sense of taste and smell.


You are probably correct. All people can not detect odors the same way. It's like hearing or sight. Some people detect fish odors at super low concentrations. I'm with you, I can detect the slightest fishy odor. Can you also smell silk at a distance? It has a fishy odor too. I can smell it when a person wearing silk walks in the room.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supertaster

An interesting video, though not as unique as Stan Lee says...

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## jj-

How good are you guys at smelling plastic? Or at feeling the different taste from plastic-bottled water?

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## specsaregood

> You are probably correct. All people can not detect odors the same way. It's like hearing or sight. Some people detect fish odors at super low concentrations. I'm with you, I can detect the slightest fishy odor. Can you also smell silk at a distance? It has a fishy odor too. I can smell it when a person wearing silk walks in the room.
> 
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supertaster


I don't know when I was ever around any silk.   And now I'm not inclined to be.     yah know I used to love cilantro, then I heard about those supertasters and how they all thought cilantro tasted like soap.  Now I can't stand the stuff, because it tastes like soap.  It is probably just the power of suggestion; but damn anytime there is cilantro in something now I pick up on it right away and it makes the whole thing taste like soap to me.

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## specsaregood

> How good are you guys at smelling plastic? Or at feeling the different taste from plastic-bottled water?


Can't say that I've noticed it but I don't drink bottled water often.  the tap water here is actually pretty good and fluoride free.    I never could stand pop out of a plastic bottle though.

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## jj-

> I never could stand pop out of a plastic bottle though.


I can't drink soda of a plastic bottle either. There are studies that show that the plastic leaks and that has an estrogenic effect on the body.

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## Brian4Liberty

> How good are you guys at smelling plastic? Or at feeling the different taste from plastic-bottled water?


Yep, many times water from plastic bottles or containers has a plastic taste. Or even water from new plumbing. Very detectable.

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## dannno

> Bacon has a worse fat profile because bacon is about 15% polyunsaturated while grain-fed beef fat is less than 3% polyunsaturated.


How do you know what the fat profile of my bacon is? You don't think it changes with a pastured pig?

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## jj-

> How do you know what the fat profile of my bacon is? You don't think it changes with a pastured pig?


It's PUFA content is relatively high because pigs don't convert their polyunsaturated fats to saturated, and fat from plants is typically low in saturated.

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## Acala

> How do you know what the fat profile of my bacon is? You don't think it changes with a pastured pig?


He's right about pork being relatively high in pufas compared to grass-fed beef.  Pufa's are a problem because they become rancid more quickly than saturated fat.  Rancidity=free radicals=trouble.  I still eat bacon, but not all the time and not huge quantities.

He's also right about the fat in fish being relatively high in pufas.  But the omega-3 content is a balancing factor.  So I still eat a lot of fish.  Stick with fresh fish as much as you can.  Avoid fish oil capsules.

But don't sweat it.  You are already way ahead of the game.

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## jj-

I didn't mean to say one shouldn't eat bacon, just that it doesn't make sense to criticize the fat profile of grain-fed beef if one eats bacon.

Broda Barnes' book about hypothyroidism written in 1976 already explains why mainstream medicine is wrong about PUFAs. He was ahead of the health blogosphere by like 35 years.

Also, the mainstream theories about saturated fats, cholesterol, and heart attacks are all wrong. The main factor is thyroid function. Broda Barnes explains this well in his books about hypothyroidism and heart attacks.

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## specsaregood

> I didn't mean to say one shouldn't eat bacon, just that it doesn't make sense to criticize the fat profile of grain-fed beef if one eats bacon.


Grassfed beef bacon aint bad, either.  And like ground beef, isn't overly fishy to me.

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## Acala

> I didn't mean to say one shouldn't eat bacon, just that it doesn't make sense to criticize the fat profile of grain-fed beef if one eats bacon.
> 
> Broda Barnes' book about hypothyroidism written in 1976 already explains why mainstream medicine is wrong about PUFAs. He was ahead of the health blogosphere by like 35 years.
> 
> Also, the mainstream theories about saturated fats, cholesterol, and heart attacks are all wrong. The main factor is thyroid function. Broda Barnes explains this well in his books about hypothyroidism and heart attacks.


The evidence is pretty strong for the role of chronic inflammation in cardio-vascular disease.

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## jj-

Acala, bacon is a great food, maybe even a health food, if the pigs are from Thailand. Pigs' fat reflects their diet, and the fat profile of pigs from Thailand is similar to coconut oil's.

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## dannno

> Grassfed beef bacon aint bad, either.


I've been trying to source that ever since Gunny mentioned it. 

The reason I have 'hoity toity' grass fed beef is more because that was the only option for local grass fed beef. There are only two places that sell it locally and the other place was slightly cheaper but too far of a drive to make it worth while.

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## jj-

> The evidence is pretty strong for the role of chronic inflammation in cardio-vascular disease.


It might sound like a bold statement, but when the thyroid works well almost everything else fixes itself. Broda Barnes' books make that case, and also have things you would find interesting, like what's wrong with PUFAs from different perspectives.

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