# Lifestyles & Discussion > Personal Prosperity >  Silver Trading Over $20 per ounce

## WilliamC

Well Silver has moved past $20 per ounce, and is not showing signs of slowing down.

Gold over $1,000 will be this week, maybe even by the end of the day.

Going, going....how long before it all goes?

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## markpa

Yeah...I'm actually thinking about selling sometime after $1,000. Thoughts on that anyone?

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## Dark Aerow

Yeah selling your silver when it goes over $1000 dollars might not be a bad idea.  It all depends though.

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## theseus51

I don't see it going down a lot as long as interest rates are really low.  If Helicopter Ben does what Paul Volker did to curb inflation, like have 20% interest rates, then gold is less appealing.  People would sell their gold to get huge interest rates on their cash, but as long as interest rates at banks are like less than 1%, the difference between holding gold and cash is nominal, so people will hold gold.

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## adam1mc

> Yeah selling your silver when it goes over $1000 dollars might not be a bad idea.  It all depends though.


  Ha

I've read reports of $50.00 silver by the end of the year.  Liberty Dollar is about to start minting 1oz rounds with a $50 stamp.  I'm not sure it's quite the time to sell yet... but I could be wrong..

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## WilliamC

As soon as I can free up some more cash I'll be buying more.

I'm very negative on holding too much cash or stocks right now, not that I have much of either.

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## Brown Sapper

Yeah I just bought my first 10oz of silver.  Yeah me!!!

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## Brown Sapper

Speaking of it.  I just bought from buillion direct is there another better place to get precious metals?

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## constitutional

> Yeah...I'm actually thinking about selling sometime after $1,000. Thoughts on that anyone?


Leaving the party even before it starts? Naw, I don't recommend it.

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## Brown Sapper

How much higher do you think gold can go?

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## IChooseLiberty

I think Silver is in a bubble at this point.  I won't be buying any more until the price comes down to something reasonable.

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## JSutter

I found a local shop today I'd never been to. Selling silver below spot with no tax. I got 10 Walking Liberty halves for $65.00 

Got 240 65-70 JFK halves in the mail that I bought off ebay for $2.45 each shipped as soon as i got my tax check. By the time they got here they're already worth $3 each

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## Banana

I'm kicking myself in butt for not getting in action earlier. Hindsight is 20/20. 

Now only if foresight was 20/20... I'm plagued with doubts that it may be too late for me.

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## WilliamC

> How much higher do you think gold can go?


Ask instead how much lower the dollar can go.

The dollar can go to zero, since it has no intrinsic value. As soon as people stop believing in the "full faith and credit" of the Government they won't accept Federal Reserve Notes for goods anymore.

Gold has never been worth zero, and it never will.

Now if the FED starts seriously raising interest rates then maybe there will be a respite, but it looks like they are going to actually lower interest rates again.

Go figure.

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## JSutter

How much lower do you think the dollar can go?

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## Apparition

Keep in mind people that holding on to gold/silver is holding onto purchasing power.. so even if the values do go back down to what they were a year or whatever ago, it's merely because the value of the dollar has gone back up....

So then remember WHY silver/gold is going up.. it's because the dollar is going to crap... and why is the dollar going to crap?.... because of our domestic & foreign policy (guns and butter)... which doesn't look to be changing any time soon, so I suggest that if you have the means, go ahead and keep buying.  *just my opinion*

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## Archie

Hey does anyone know if Apmex will sell and deliver to Canada? I was on the sight and read there FAQ section and they sounded like they dont So I was wondering if anyone has ordered from them to Canada or know anyone from Canada who got a n order from them. IT would suck if they didnt..

Also I Always hear stuff like this from others as  Apparition has also stated

"Keep in mind people that holding on to gold/silver is holding onto purchasing power.. so even if the values do go back down to what they were a year or whatever ago, it's merely because the value of the dollar has gone back up...."


Now I understand that the Dollar is going to Crap hence why Gold/Silver and other commodities are going up but say you were to purchase a $30.000 new luxery Volvo Car right now with USD its $30.000 cash,or if its gold you have to have 30 + ounce's of Gold to pay for the car, Now if Gold goes down to say 400 an ounce again and the dollar increase's Did Gold really Hold its "Purchasing power" in this Case? because at 400 an ounce your gonna now need over 70 ounces of Gold to Pay for that $30.000 dollar car where as the USD woulc of Bought that Same Car when  It was worth $#@! at 30.000 USD and then when it became stronger it still pays 30 grand for the new car again ? I do Understand how Gold/Silver have kept "value" through out history but to say that it will always maintain the same "Purchasing power" is not exactly correct as I stated with the Car example. Oh and before someone tries saying "well if the price of Gold went down then the Price of a brand new 30 grand dollar car's would go down  too"LOL!!!!!!! That is not the case I remember when a Brand new Cadi or volvo was 30 -40 grand when Gold was only worth 300 an ounce today the brand new cars are the exact same price {unless its used cars} ....

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## forsmant

Is 22$ for a silver eagle a good price?

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## Archie

> Is 22$ for a silver eagle a good price?


Well Silver is at a very high price right now so $22 ounce eagles is a logical price , Is it a steal ? maybe if Silver goes as high as some say it will . But if not then you will just have to wait for the next cycle to get your money's worth LOL!!!!!!

They very nice coins though .

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## Deborah K

> How much lower do you think the dollar can go?



Personally, I think the dollar will crash.  And it will do so by design.  The powers that be are hell bent on globalisation and the best way to force us into a merge with mexico and canada is by destroying our economy and then introducing a new currency (Amero) which is to be used in all of North America.  No more borders except around the parimeter of mexico and canada.  A national ID for all.  Immigrant problem solved.


Watch this.  Steve Purvis is a vice president of a very prestigious financial institution.  I think he knows what he is talking about**:  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6hiPrsc9g98

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## Deborah K

> How much lower do you think the dollar can go?



Personally, I think the dollar will crash.  And it will be by design.  The powers that be are hell bent on globalisation and the best way to force us into a merge with mexico and canada is by destroying our economy and then introducing a new currency (Amero) which is to be used in all of North America.  No more borders except around the perimeter of mexico and canada.  A national ID for all.  Illegal immigrant problem -  solved.  Ask yourself why, if we are fighting a war on terror, the borders around our country are STILL like swiss cheese since 9-11!  It's because they plan to merge us.


Watch this.  Steve Purvis is a vice president of a very prestigious financial institution.  I think he knows what he is talking about**:  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6hiPrsc9g98

Read this. It's the start of the securing of mexico's most southern border: http://www.dailypaul.com/node/37413

Here is where this plot to merge us was hatched, and here is the plan:  
http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=120498

If you are still incredulous or are experiencing cognitive dissonance, let me know, I will overwhelm you with evidence.

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## seapilot

> Yeah I just bought my first 10oz of silver.  Yeah me!!!


Good job. You will soon find yourself becoming addicted. 

Holding gold and silver( not ETFs) to profit in dollars that are inflating into nothing doesnt make sense to me. Its more of an insurance policy and to retain purchasing power in the face of weakening of the dollar.

A good example that Ive seen is 3 silver dimes( 3 dollars value in 2008) from 1964 would buy a gallon of gas in 1964. It will still today as the value of the silver hasnt changed, three silver dimes from 1964 are worth around 3 dollars.

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## sluggo

> I think Silver is in a bubble at this point.  I won't be buying any more until the price comes down to something reasonable.


I tend to agree with you. I see the price being driven up right now by the rush of new buyers. I think there may be a sharp pullback at some point in the near future. But hey, what do I know?

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## Cowlesy

Jim Cramer was just barking about how great gold/silver/agriculture was (don't ask me why I was actually watching Mad Money).

Is this a sell signal????

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## sluggo

> Jim Cramer was just barking about how great gold/silver/agriculture was (don't ask me why I was actually watching Mad Money).
> 
> Is this a sell signal????


lol. Quite possibly. I question anything the Big Boys tell me I should do.

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## Paulitician

I believe both gold and silver will correct sometime soon.  However, I still believe they can go much higher.  Gold reached 800 bucks in the early 80s.  If we were to believe the government bogus statistics, that would be equivalent to $2300.  Ben Bernanke has indicated he does not care about inflation.  He's going to continue the rate cuts, he's going to continue creating money, and the congress will probably make another stimulus plan.  This is nowhere near over if you ask me.  We haven't even seen the worst of it yet.

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## IChooseLiberty

> I tend to agree with you. I see the price being driven up right now by the rush of new buyers. I think there may be a sharp pullback at some point in the near future. But hey, what do I know?


Yah.  I keep thinking.... "Maybe this is it and It'll just keep going up and up and up and blow up in a massive bubble like housing did"

...but I don't think that is realistic in silver and gold.

All it'll take is a major holder choosing to realize these recent gains and the prices will come down.

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## Cowlesy

Yeah I saw someone drop about 400,000 shares of GLD around 2:30PM today (about $38 million worth), the price dipped as someone bought the block, but the price buoyed right back up.

I imagine the central banks will try lightening up on Gold at some point in the next few months to squash the price, and that will represent a buying opportunity.

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## constitutional

Gold hitting 1k will create quite a stir and quite a panic...

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## bluemarkets

there is always a risk when buying silver/gold at these levels ... 

I agree that there is room for a correction, but if there is not and it goes to 1200+ how much harder will it be to buy then?  

I would love for gold to come down to 700-800 or silver $14-15, and I'd jump in again but never think you can time the market just perfect, if you are looking to be in this for awhile, might as well have some position than no position at all and then have different price levels in mind where you will buy more if it drops to A or goes up to B etc ... 

just my 2 cents

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## IChooseLiberty

> there is always a risk when buying silver/gold at these levels ... 
> 
> I agree that there is room for a correction, but if there is not and it goes to 1200+ how much harder will it be to buy then?  
> 
> I would love for gold to come down to 700-800 or silver $14-15, and I'd jump in again but never think you can time the market just perfect, if you are looking to be in this for awhile, might as well have some position than no position at all and then have different price levels in mind where you will buy more if it drops to A or goes up to B etc ... 
> 
> just my 2 cents


Aye.  I just pulled the trigger and dropped the MOAB order.  Eating my own words from just a few posts back  I'm in it for the long haul.... and in the long run, I only see it going up.

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## buffalokid777

> I believe both gold and silver will correct sometime soon.  However, I still believe they can go much higher.  Gold reached 800 bucks in the early 80s.  If we were to believe the government bogus statistics, that would be equivalent to $2300.  Ben Bernanke has indicated he does not care about inflation.  He's going to continue the rate cuts, he's going to continue creating money, and the congress will probably make another stimulus plan.  This is nowhere near over if you ask me.  We haven't even seen the worst of it yet.


I agree with you, in the short term, I feel silver will have a correction bringing it back to $17 range very shortly.....one to one a half months I think it will happen.....I have money to buy silver now, but feel so strongly that $17 an ounce silver will be available soon.....I am holding off until then.....

Why you ask? Here is an article with a chart that should show why i believe so.....

http://news.silverseek.com/SilverSeek/1204268280.php

There is a graph there showing silver spot price and 50 day and 200 day move price.

I will add it here so if you are too lazy to click the link for reference.



This chart goes back to 2002....notice there are 3 very large spikes on the chart.

The first, is the first quarter of the year 2004, notice how the spot price at its peak about $8/oz, drops below the 50 day moving price......very rapidly....until the 50 day moving price and spot price converge several months later and the rise of silver spot begins to rise again......

The second spike is in the beginning of the second quarter of 2006 when the spot price peaks at $15.....this spike is bigger than the first, yet after the peak, same thing.....sharp drop against the 50 day moving average before beginning the climb once again on the convergence a month later or so......also notice this spike is roughly twice the size of the 2004 spike.....

The third spike is now.....It should last to around $23 very soon.....less than a month, then recede back to the $17 I expect to buy the silver I am waiting to buy then  (I buy for the long term....I don't have enough capital to make money on the short term as I cant afford the quantities of product to make it on the short term prices and low profit margins.)

Now in the short term, You can make some money quick by capatalizing on the jump from $20 an ounce to $23 an ounce if you have the money to take advantage of a $3 ounce profit and make it worth your while.....

But if we examine the 3 spikes in this chart and the fundamentals driving them....and the rate the spikes are growing....as long as nothing changes...ie increase in money supply, declining dollar due to increased money supply, and continuation of american debt due to Iraq war, I think it is possible to predict $40-$50 an ounce silver by the 1st-2nd quarter 2010....possibly 2009 depending on how many US banks fail and drive new buyers to the silver market.

Gold looks great long term......but short term, not so much due to the pending possibility of the 400 tonnes IMF selloff.....while the IMF selloff should not truly affect the price of gold too bad....the perception of the selloff will drive away new gold investors until later when the sell off is complete......then you will see a major spike.....

Silver is the better choice right now IMHO....In 1-2 years.....i beleive i will probably end up thinking Gold will be the one to get again.....but right now, I believe investing in silver over gold is the prudent investment.

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## Banana

Hmmm, so let me see if I got this right.

Silver/Gold makes for good investment long-term against inflation, but not that good in short term?

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## WilliamC

> Hmmm, so let me see if I got this right.
> 
> Silver/Gold makes for good investment long-term against inflation, but not that good in short term?


It just depends on if you are risk tolerant enough to try and time the market.

Some people look at graphs of past performance and pretend that they are somehow indicative of future performance. This is called technical analysis.

Some people look at extrinsic factors affecting the market and pretend that this gives them some indication of the future. This is called fundamental analysis.

Then there are the dolts like me who don't know enough to be able to pretend to predict the future. I had spare cash in savings and finally took the plunge and bought some silver. I don't intend to sell it unless it gets so expensive I can sell maybe 1/5th of what I bought for the same price I purchased the entire lot. That would be about $100 per ounce for silver. If so I'll take the spare trash (I mean cash) that generates and use it to pay a year or so of my mortgage, which is my only debt.

If I don't have the mortgage anymore then I'll only sell/trade the silver for survival purposes.

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## WilliamC

It's back over $20 per ounce today.

I guess yesterdays pullback was temporary.

Up, up, and away!

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## PatriotG

Significant Range so far today

20.97 to19.48


These big gyrations are going to become normal.
Still looks very bullish

Support is at 18.34 on the charts
No resistance in sight

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## IChooseLiberty

WoW! Up almost a dollar an ounce.  Made up for yesterday's losses and then some.

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## Gideon

...and all of the tangible commodities are going up in relation to the rapidly inflating U.S. Dollar.
Silver just happens to be one of the best values, at bargain basement prices, for now at least.

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## seapilot

> ...and all of the tangible commodities are going up in relation to the rapidly inflating U.S. Dollar.
> Silver just happens to be one of the best values, at bargain basement prices, for now at least.


Yes its still cheap, get it while it lasts! Rumors are China may try to corner the market. Buy on the dips as they dont seem to last much more than a day.

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## buffalokid777

> Yes its still cheap, get it while it lasts! Rumors are China may try to corner the market. Buy on the dips as they dont seem to last much more than a day.


I concur.....there will be a dip....as predicted above on previous post....$17-$18 ounce....within 2 months.....

I get 100$-$1000 to spend on investments every 3 months.....not a rich man's money, but enough to keep moving forward and gaining.....

Right now is a $1000 spend waiting to happen.....

I could spend now....at a little over $20/ounce......

I have no doubt I will see $50 an ounce silver in 2 years......

But since I have limited capital right now....I will wait for the dip.....

Because I am so confident silver will hit the $17-18 range in  the next 2-3 months....before beggining its climb to $50/ounce....

I am waiting for that dip, because in the past, when the spot price goes too far over the 50 day moving price, there is a correction....has it happened every time....NO!.....but the odds are in the favor of the trader who sees the dip coming based on too far rapid growth in price.......based on history......maybe you had too much too fast??? that applies to commidities....whenever there is a rapid ascension of price....a correction usually comes along with it except in the most dire of times when the commodity is needed NOW by a GREAT many people who wish to purchase.....and while the overall financial outlook is not great.....it has yet to reach the point of a dire outlook yet....though we are on the path for dire times several years down the road if things remain unchanged.........

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## buffalokid777

> I agree with you, in the short term, I feel silver will have a correction bringing it back to $17 range very shortly.....one to one a half months I think it will happen.....I have money to buy silver now, but feel so strongly that $17 an ounce silver will be available soon.....I am holding off until then.....
> 
> Why you ask? Here is an article with a chart that should show why i believe so.....
> 
> http://news.silverseek.com/SilverSeek/1204268280.php
> 
> There is a graph there showing silver spot price and 50 day and 200 day move price.
> 
> I will add it here so if you are too lazy to click the link for reference.
> ...


The Top Hit at just under $21 on the spike instead of the $23 Top I originally thought might occur (The bear stearns bail out and the perception on wall street that the fed has things back under controll was the reason it never reached my projected spike high)......Re assesing buy point from $17-$18 range an ounce to $16-$17.....I don't think Silver will fall much more than that, then climb begins again.......

Here's the correction as predicted......

Be time to buy soon......

What do others think the best price for silver per ounce we'll be able to buy in on this correction? My current $16-17 Prediction....or Less? Or the price today is the lowest....what does everyone else think?

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## ARealConservative

Apmex is giving up.

They can't keep up with the demand.

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## buffalokid777

> Apmex is giving up.
> 
> They can't keep up with the demand.


 So is that your prediction....that today is low as it may go?

Seeing Apmex shut down from being overwhelmed on the dip.....could be a sign that the current dip may be short lived......but that is just ONE online seller....

I think I'm gonna take a third of my $1000 silver purchase to my local coin shops who don't sell online tommorow first thing.....

And keep the rest budgeted for my predicted $16-$17 price......

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## ARealConservative

> So is that your prediction....that today is low as it may go?
> 
> Seeing Apmex shut down from being overwhelmed on the dip.....could be a sign that the current dip may be short lived......but that is just ONE online seller....
> 
> I think I'm gonna take a third of my $1000 silver purchase to my local coin shops who don't sell online tommorow first thing.....
> 
> And keep the rest budgeted for my predicted $16-$17 price......


I don't trust the central banks, they might be pushing this stuff down because of all the attention PM's are getting lately.  If so, they might just ignore what they are doing to the bullion market and keep pushing it down to quell fears.

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## buffalokid777

> I don't trust the central banks, they might be pushing this stuff down because of all the attention PM's are getting lately.  If so, they might just ignore what they are doing to the bullion market and keep pushing it down to quell fears.


Even if they are pushing it down (Which I don't think they are) what would scare me is if I couldn't purchase silver off ebay for anywhere near spot price.....which is NOT happening......I see rolls of silver quarters available tommorow still under spot......And will prolly buy some soon......

Ebay is much more of a free market than wall street........

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## seapilot

> Even if they are pushing it down (Which I don't think they are) what would scare me is if I couldn't purchase silver off ebay for anywhere near spot price.....which is NOT happening......I see rolls of silver quarters available tommorow still under spot......And will prolly buy some soon......
> 
> Ebay is much more of a free market than wall street........


This is true about ebay and there are some good deals if you can find them, but a share of rip off and scam artists will come out of the woodwork with increased demand in PM.

 Apmex is reputable as well as local dealers if you get to know them. 
Flea markets, garage sales and pawn shops sometimes have good deals to be found.

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## Archie

Wow I really enjoy lots of the great theories on this subject and thanks for your wonderful charts Buffalokid they really do use common sense and a brisk understanding of some of the major factor's in corrections and spike's..  My take is this When Jim Cramer sounded idiotic by telling that guy "no!!!no!!!no!!! dont sell on Bear" there was actually something that "cramer's Friends" picked up on and that wasnt the part where Cramer said "NO NO NO" it was at the end when he hush's the words "or worst yet they will get bought out" or merge'd so to speak "WHICH DID HAPPEN"  I think Cramer and his Buddies made a killing of Gold These couple weeks especially on monday. Because I Truly Believe that this "Bear Stearns Bailout" OR what I call the "BSB" was known by alot of insiders on wall street and new that this would rocket PM's to all time high's. So they waited for the "insider" cash in/correction when Bear went diving..  I really think what happened today is whats been happening with the previous spikes as buffalokids chart shows . ITs just that this "bear stearns bailout" BSB Was there Ultimate "cash cow" on short sell moves.. Im as sure as ten dimes makes a buck that the "rumour" of Bear going down was clearly known buy alot of people on wallstreet and when I saw the youtube clip of "cramer's bad advice" on Bear it sounded to me as more cerebrial then people thought because you can clearly hear cramer hush the words at the end of a merger/buyout angle in the works.. Dont think Jim Cramer is Stupid he is Very Smart and is on the inside of possible major move's in the market .

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## ARealConservative

> Even if they are pushing it down (Which I don't think they are) what would scare me is if I couldn't purchase silver off ebay for anywhere near spot price.....which is NOT happening......I see rolls of silver quarters available tommorow still under spot......And will prolly buy some soon......
> 
> Ebay is much more of a free market than wall street........


tomorrow?

check closing auction from today - future auctions mean nothing as most people wait till the last minute.

For junk, you can usually buy at spot even after shipping costs, but not today

And rounds usually only go 2-3 dollars over spot with shipping, but not today.

I spent a lot of timing trying to cash in on the drop today, here is just a small sample of what I watched:


http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...#39;T.m317.lVI

way over spot

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...#39;T.m317.lVI

Way over spot

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...#39;T.m317.lVI

way over spot

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...#39;T.m317.lVI

way over spot


I'm telling you, it was a weird day.

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## davver

Deflation in the short term, inflation in the long term.  Weak dollar throughout.

I bought my last silver at $17, if it gets down there I will buy again.  I'm not going to sell any, just accumulate on the dips.  Right now I'm sitting in Yen.

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## davver

I got a nice deal on some silver eagles.  Bought them for $20 each when they were $22-23 each on APMEX a few days ago.  I'm still even on this drop.

The US mint ran out of silver to make silver eagles, that's crazy.

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## buffalokid777

Thats a FEW auction out of thousands.....

That's the thing, some idiots on ebay decide to bid whatever.......and they get burned....you are citing the exception rather than the rule......

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## buffalokid777

> Deflation in the short term, inflation in the long term.  Weak dollar throughout.
> 
> I bought my last silver at $17, if it gets down there I will buy again.  I'm not going to sell any, just accumulate on the dips.  Right now I'm sitting in Yen.



I think $17 is VERY real and $16-$17 is where I'm looking to make my next purchase......

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## buffalokid777

> tomorrow?
> 
> check closing auction from today - future auctions mean nothing as most people wait till the last minute.
> 
> For junk, you can usually buy at spot even after shipping costs, but not today
> 
> And rounds usually only go 2-3 dollars over spot with shipping, but not today.
> 
> I spent a lot of timing trying to cash in on the drop today, here is just a small sample of what I watched:
> ...


Thats a FEW auction out of thousands.....

That's the thing, some idiots on ebay decide to bid whatever.......and they get burned....you are citing the exception rather than the rule......

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## ARealConservative

> Thats a FEW auction out of thousands.....
> 
> That's the thing, some idiots on ebay decide to bid whatever.......and they get burned....you are citing the exception rather than the rule......


no $#@!.

I'm not going to waste my time documenting thousands - I witnessed far more then I posted.

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## buffalokid777

> no $#@!.
> 
> I'm not going to waste my time documenting thousands - I witnessed far more then I posted.


I don't want you to document thousands.....the sheep are a pretty dumb lot......

This is the day the price dropped significantly versus the last few months.....the sheep are generally not very perceptive, and often behind the curve.....give them a week......if silver continues to sell on ebay for well over spot anywhere in a week.....then I will think you might be on to something in terms of a lying spot price caused by central bankers.......

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## Archie

hey davver are your a forex trader? I was really tempted to give it a try..  I bought on the early dip but as usual with the price of S&H and Shipping taxes and 2% credit card tax its Bull$#@! and Im really aching for a local dealer who charges small premiums over spot... Oh and the place I ordered from where even sold out of what I wanted and one guy there said he wouldnt be able to lock in the price untill I guess they recieve it which was contradicting the other person I spoke to first LOL who said even though it was sold out i could pre-order and get a "locked in price" then the guy tried telling me he just found out recently that they have to "Add 25 cents" onto the specific coin i wanted ? Talk about Hucksters and this fella I could tell was not happy trying to sell me on the "new price" LOL!!!! !!!!! My god why is everything so Expensive and Confusing to get something so simple like some silver coins? Aww well atleast we can find some Really straight forward dealers if ya look hard enough and catch them when they have what your looking for ...

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