# Lifestyles & Discussion > Open Discussion >  Back in the wind.

## Anti Federalist

After a 25+ year dry spell.

No vintage Brit or American iron, but rides sweet nevertheless.

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## donnay

I thought it was the beef jerky that gave you the wind something terrible...

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## Origanalist

Sweet, I've been thinking about getting one just like that. Feels good huh?

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## TheTexan

Bad-ass!  And of course I'm assuming you filled out the proper paperwork, completed any required training, and gotten your motorcycle license.

We wouldn't want you to hurt yourself on that thing.

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## Anti Federalist

> Sweet, I've been thinking about getting one just like that. Feels good huh?


Yes, yes it *does*.

It's an 800 Vulcan, one of the smaller ones, with a "softail" frame setup, no fuel injection, no computer engine controls.

2005 with 7182 miles on it.

Paid $2100

Got a little damage on the starboard side where the kid who had it laid it down, a scrape on the tank, lower pipe, and turn signal.

If the mood hits me, it may transform over the winter into this:



Or this:

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## Anti Federalist

> Bad-ass!  And of course I'm assuming you filled out the proper paperwork, completed any required training, and gotten your motorcycle license.
> 
> We wouldn't want you to hurt yourself on that thing.


Oh of *course*, all legal...and a full helmet. (not)

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## phill4paul

Sweet, man. Congratulations!

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## JK/SEA

''Full moon is rising
The sky is black
I heed your call I'm coming back
The road is straight cast
Wind's in my eyes
The engine roars between my thighs

From desert plains I bring you love
From desert plains I bring you love

Wild mountain thunder
Echoes my quest
My body aches but I'll not rest
Quartz light to guide me
Till sunrise leads
My passion screams, my heart it bleeds

From desert plains I bring you love
From desert plains I bring you love

Then in the distance
I see you stand
On the horizon you raise your hand
In burning rubber
I end my quest
You fall into my arms and rest

From desert plains I bring you love''

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## Origanalist

how does Donna like the back of that thing?

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## donnay



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## Suzanimal

Nice. Enjoy yourself but not so much you get killed.

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## phill4paul



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## Anti Federalist

> Nice. Enjoy yourself but not so much you get killed.


Sez the Animal dropping Lortabs and wine.

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## Suzanimal

> Sez the Animal dropping Lortabs and wine.


It was perfectly safe. My mom was supervising and besides, the label said to "use caution when mixing with alcohol". I was very cautious. I didn't operate any heavy machinery.

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## Anti Federalist

> It was perfectly safe. My mom was supervising and besides, the label said to "use caution when mixing with alcohol". I was very cautious. *I didn't operate any heavy machinery*.


Well, that's no damn fun.

I once spent a day at a buddy's farm, years ago, thrashing around on a bulldozer after dropping mescalin.

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## William Tell

Lol, title fooled me. Thought it was about a boat.

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## phill4paul

> Lol, title fooled me. Thought it was about a boat.

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## Anti Federalist

> Lol, title fooled me. Thought it was about a boat.


I let other people buy the boats.

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## Anti Federalist

Top Gear, 1949




>

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## wizardwatson

> After a 25+ year dry spell.
> 
> No vintage Brit or American iron, but rides sweet nevertheless.


I'm jealous...







...that you don't have to worry about seatbelt tickets.

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## Anti Federalist

> I'm jealous...
> 
> ...that you don't have to worry about seatbelt tickets.


I'm in NH.

I don't have to worry about those anyway.

Or helmet tickets.

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## pcosmar

Cool

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## phill4paul

> I let other people buy the boats.


  If it flies, floats or $#@!s it's cheaper to rent. Or so Danke has told me.

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## phill4paul

> Cool


  I thought this was the Arlo song?

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## Anti Federalist

> Cool


I gotta tell you Pete, it was missing a chance to bid on this: (I honestly didn't know you still owned it)



that prompted me to say $#@! it all, *not* letting another chance slip by.

So, in a way, I can thank you for getting me back on two wheels again.

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## Danke

> If it flies, floats or $#@!s it's cheaper to rent. Or so Danke has told me.


Trust me on that one.

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## Danke

> After a 25+ year dry spell.
> 
> No vintage Brit or American iron, but rides sweet nevertheless.


This belongs here.

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## Anti Federalist

> This belongs here.

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## Danke

> 


I looked it up, but your link doesn't load.  She would be a nice addition to your bike.

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## invisible

Cool!  What's a Vulcan?  
After my own 25+ year dry spell, I got one of these:



The picture isn't mine.  My bike is blue (same year, a 2001), and has had the fairing removed.  With a tuned exhaust, bigger carb, and 20 more cc's, it'll do 50+ mph.  Tomos Targa LX.  Best past of all: no license whatsoever, no tags, no insurance, no registration, no plates, no nothing!  Completely unregulated!    Was able to beat real id, and there's only about 3-6 days a year when it snows here and I can't ride.  Got a rainsuit, a rain cover, and made a rain cover for the air intake.

After riding it around for months, I finally had my first run-in with the cops yesterday.  I sped up to beat a changing light at one of two lights I found that the bike isn't heavy or big enough to trigger the sensors.  Pulled into a parking lot on the other side of the intersection to stop and check the time (needed to see which store I could make before they both closed).  Cop pulls in and blocks me in the parking space, jumps out of his car, and says "where's your tag?  you gotta have a tag to ride that!".  
Me: "No I don't.  It's 50 cc's, can be pedaled like a bicycle, and has an automatic transmission, so state law says I don't need one".  
cop: "I saw you speed up to run that red light, you were going like a bat out of hell (which brought the album cover immediately to mind, as I tried not to laugh)!  You don't have a tag for that thing, and you can't ride it without one!"
Me: "I researched the law very carefully, and it says I don't need one".
cop: "What law is that?"
Me: "It's part of the motor vehicle code.  It's exempt and falls outside of any regulation because it meets those 3 requirements, state law says the only place I can't ride it is on the interstate."
cop: "Well, there's a city ordinance that says all motor vehicles have to have a tag, even scooters."
Me: "This isn't a scooter, because it has pedals.  Any city ordinance that may exist doesn't overturn state law.  What exactly would you like me to do, officer?"
cop: "I have to get to another call.  You have a good day, and you better get a tag for that thing."
With that, he jumped back in his car and left.  I gotta print out a copy of the actual law in case that happens again.

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## invisible

> 


So of course, this goes here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D8EZOjYUy5U

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## tod evans



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## Anti Federalist

Haulin ass...

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## Danke

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=RkuohI4XyjQ

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## Anti Federalist

> https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=RkuohI4XyjQ


Severely overloaded.

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## Anti Federalist



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## bunklocoempire

Can't stroll past this thread without thinking:  Break Like the Wind / A Mighty Wind Is Blowin'.  lol




Flat. Black. Quick.  All the shiny -it hurts me eyes!

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## Anti Federalist

> Flat. Black. Quick.  All the shiny -it hurts me eyes!


I'm pretty sure I'm gonna bob this thing over the winter.

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## Anti Federalist

Need a ride...or a cocktail...or both...sigh.

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## phill4paul

> Need a ride...or a cocktail...or both...sigh.


  Sounds good. When in doubt do both.

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## Anti Federalist

> Sounds good. When in doubt do both.


Working...

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## phill4paul

> Working...


  Oh, joy, oh, joy, the ole lady just came home with a bottle of Makers. Gonna join ya, my friend.

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## Anti Federalist

> Oh, joy, oh, joy, the ole lady just came home with a bottle of Makers. Gonna join ya, my friend.


Enjoy a shot for me.

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## Anti Federalist

> Oh, joy, oh, joy, the ole lady just came home with a bottle of Makers. Gonna join ya, my friend.


Enjoy a shot for me.

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## phill4paul

> Enjoy a shot for me.


  Will do. Just broke the wax seal. I have no idea why this tasty present was visited on me other than having "dusted the cobwebs" yesterday. She has had a glow since then, so....

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## Anti Federalist

> Will do. Just broke the wax seal. I have no idea why this tasty present was visited on me other than having "dusted the cobwebs" yesterday. She has had a glow since then, so....


*sigh*

Enjoy while you can...I *used* to get that treatment.

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## phill4paul

> *sigh*
> 
> Enjoy while you can...I *used* to get that treatment.


  Lol. Hey, it's been awhile for me too. I've known that we have been busy as hell for awhile but never realized how busy. I'm just kinda thinking in the back of my mind " If this is the reward I get for getting "busy" after being busy maybe I need to be busy more often.

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## Dianne

> Sweet, I've been thinking about getting one just like that. Feels good huh?


LOL, first time I noticed the Trump pic...   Nice job )

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## Anti Federalist

> LOL, first time I noticed the Trump pic...   Nice job )


What's that hiding in his hair?

Oscar the Grouch?

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## Anti Federalist

Been looking at ideas to chop the ride as well, but it does not lend itself to that.

This looks best, I think.

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## phill4paul

> Been looking at ideas to chop the ride as well, but it does not lend itself to that.
> 
> This looks best, I think.


  The world is your oyster! I'm a fan of Rat Rods or a kind of military-aircraft theme and if I had a bike I'd take it to that end.

  Something like this...



  but with a Flying Tiger theme...

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## donnay

> *sigh*
> 
> Enjoy while you can...I *used* to get that treatment.


*SIGH*

"Woe unto you, when all men shall speak well of you!"

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## phill4paul

> *SIGH*
> 
> "Woe unto you, when all men shall speak well of you!"

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## TheCount

Adding my FZ-07 just because, even though it's not the classic cruiser type.  I love the hell out of it.  Cheap, more than enough power to make me smile, and still gets 55mpg.  It's EFI, but everything is still cable operated, which I prefer.

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## phill4paul

Another theme might be "Live free and Ride" w/ the Copperhead symbol.

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## phill4paul

> Adding my FZ-07 just because, even though it's not the classic cruiser type.  I love the hell out of it.  Cheap, more than enough power to make me smile, and still gets 55mpg.  It's EFI, but everything is still cable operated, which I prefer.


   Should have went with the long bed on the Silverado.

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## TheCount

> Should have went with the long bed on the Silverado.


Not mine; that's in the gas station parking lot where she got her first tank of gas.

I do need a truck, though.  Hunting for used trucks now.  Waffling between 1/4 ton and 1/2 ton because my towing needs are basically just bikes and toolboxes.

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## tod evans

> Not mine; that's in the gas station parking lot where she got her first tank of gas.
> 
> I do need a truck, though.  Hunting for used trucks now. * Waffling between 1/4 ton and 1/2 ton* because my towing needs are basically just bikes and toolboxes.


If it doesn't sport a 14 bolt corporate rear end it doesn't qualify as a truck.

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## Anti Federalist

> *SIGH*
> 
> "Woe unto you, when all men shall speak well of you!"


I'm not interested in all men, I'd be happy with with you speaking well of me.

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## Anti Federalist

> *SIGH*
> 
> "Woe unto you, when all men shall speak well of you!"


I'm not interested in all men, I'd be happy with with you speaking well of me.

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## phill4paul

> If it doesn't sport a 14 bolt corporate rear end it doesn't qualify as a truck.


  Depends on the need. Wish I had a light truck for the light work.

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## tod evans

> Depends on the need. Wish I had a light truck for the light work.


As a second truck......

For light duty I'd rather a wagon or van though.....

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## phill4paul

> As a second truck......
> 
> For light duty I'd rather a wagon or van though.....


 Honestly, yeah. I'd really like a van. Since the back seat burned outta my truck it's not like it's a recreation/work vehicle anymore. Just a work vehicle. A van would make much better sense. But, the truck is sound.

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## Anti Federalist

When the '93 $#@!s the bed:

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## Anti Federalist

I went off the cliff, goin' 150 mph sideways and 500 feet a second, down.

I was looking for the cops.

Cause I knew that was illegal.




> Cool

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## TheCount

> Depends on the need. Wish I had a light truck for the light work.


It's a shame that light trucks basically don't exist in the US.

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## phill4paul

> It's a shame that light trucks basically don't exist in the US.


    Loved a Datsun.

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## Anti Federalist

*Diesel powered* light trucks.

Over 50 MPG without a single computer.

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## Anti Federalist

> It's a shame that light trucks basically don't exist in the US.


Thank Uncle Sucker for that.

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## TheCount

> Thank Uncle Sucker for that.


And you can thank the lobbying efforts of US manufacturers in turn.  The Chicken Tax exists in part because they were unable to compete with European and Asian light trucks.

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## Anti Federalist

> And you can thank the lobbying efforts of US manufacturers in turn.  The Chicken Tax exists in part because they were unable to compete with European and Asian light trucks.


It goes far beyond a protectionist tariff at this point.

New light trucks do not comply with EPA and NHTSA rules and cannot be sold here.

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...at-gets-50-mpg

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## TheCount

> It goes far beyond a protectionist tariff at this point.
> 
> New light trucks do not comply with EPA and NHTSA rules and cannot be sold here.
> 
> http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...at-gets-50-mpg


I would say it's a combination of both.  There are plenty of small trucks that meet stringent standards in Europe and Asia, but the tariff makes it uneconomical for those manufacturers to import them to the US.  They know that, with the tariff, they won't be competitive, so they don't even try.

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## Anti Federalist



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## Anti Federalist



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## Anti Federalist



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## Anti Federalist

Didn't bob it over the winter, had no time.

Made some minor changes and removed some extraneous junk.

Service: oil, brakes, coolant, battery charge, tighten and adjust cables and rods as needed, valve lash and so on.

Be ready to ride next time home, gas and go.

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## pcosmar

> Be ready to ride next time home, gas and go.


Is your snow gone?
I had a very mild winter.. Ride safe.

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## afwjam

I also ride, here is what's in the stable now.

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## Anti Federalist

I'll take a pic later.

Out of the basement and fired right up in 2 seconds.

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## Anti Federalist

> Is your snow gone?
> I had a very mild winter.. Ride safe.


Long gone, was a piss warm winter here as well.

Had a couple of weeks of sleety/snowy/slushy crap up to this point but dry and mild for the next few days.

50s or so then 60s...cool but no bite.

Thanks Pete.

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## bunklocoempire

> I also ride, here is what's in the stable now.


Taken from Mauna Loa Observatory/Park road?  I think I've seen that green one on 11 a few times while stopped at the lights, making my into Hilo.

I had an '89 Yam XT350 when I lived on Maui.  Stolen.

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## Anti Federalist

> Taken from Mauna Loa Observatory/Park road?  I think I've seen that green one on 11 a few times while stopped at the lights, making my into Hilo.
> 
> I had an '89 Yam XT350 when I lived on Maui.  Stolen.


Is that where that is?

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## bunklocoempire

> Is that where that is?


I believe so.

We are on Hawaii Island looking at Mauna Kea, and I believe the hill or pu'u, at what appears to be the end of the road ribbon is one I recognize from the Saddle Road. 

I think the Mauna Loa Observatory/Park road is the only paved road sort of South-East of that line. 

 Mauna Kea -> pu'u -> liberty biker gang -> Mauna Loa

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## afwjam

That's it, two Ron Paul warriors and my Ron Paul chicka. 



Found this funny today for us old timers that remember the 500+ cc two strokers.

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## Anti Federalist

750 cc two stroke Kawa triple chopper.

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## tod evans

> 750 cc two stroke Kawa triple chopper.


That's $#@!ing dangerous!

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## afwjam

Ah yes the Kawasaki triple, Plenty of power, just no brakes or suspension. The trick was to wobble around the corner, set your target and then ignite the rocket, hoping there was nothing behind the target for at least 500 feet. I had many a scary time on one of those, the only thing in recent memory that has given me an experience like that was my Arctic cat firecat 700, fuel injected 700 twin, also did not like to turn or stop.

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## Anti Federalist

> That's $#@!ing dangerous!





> Ah yes the Kawasaki triple, Plenty of power, just no brakes or suspension. The trick was to wobble around the corner, set your target and then ignite the rocket, hoping there was nothing behind the target for at least 500 feet. I had many a scary time on one of those, the only thing in recent memory that has given me an experience like that was my Arctic cat firecat 700, fuel injected 700 twin, also did not like to turn or stop.


Yeah, I've ridden that little piece of insanity myself.

AFW is right, the only thing close is two stroke, big displacement snow machine.

Years ago I had my son with me who about 6 or 7 at the time, riding in front on an Arctic Cat GTX. We stopped for minute to stretch and pee on the side of the trail, I started the machine and set my son on the front. While I was climbing on he decided to grab a handful of throttle, because "hey I saw dad doing it".

We had climbed a tree and fell into a snowbank before I could shut down.

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## Anti Federalist

Rode about 4 hours today, with my daughter.

Gorgeous spring day in NH.

On the top of the hill where I live.

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## tod evans

> Yeah, I've ridden that little piece of insanity myself.
> 
> AFW is right, the only thing close is two stroke, big displacement snow machine.
> 
> Years ago I had my son with me who about 6 or 7 at the time, riding in front on an Arctic Cat GTX. We stopped for minute to stretch and pee on the side of the trail, I started the machine and set my son on the front. While I was climbing on he decided to grab a handful of throttle, because "hey I saw dad doing it".
> 
> We had climbed a tree and fell into a snowbank before I could shut down.


That motor is what coined the term "crotch rocket"....

I've riddeen 'em too, back in my stroked shovelhead days......Two completely different types of power...The smoker'd come on about 6K and would stand up in 3rd or 4th...

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## Anti Federalist

> That motor is what coined the term "crotch rocket"....
> 
> I've riddeen 'em too, back in my stroked shovelhead days......Two completely different types of power...The smoker'd come on about 6K and would stand up in 3rd or 4th...


Exactly.

Chainsaw vs. diesel tractor.

One's all low end torque and the other all high rev HP.

The only thing I've ever ridden that was close off the line was a "for export to Brazil" Honda Hurricane.

Touched 160 on the Palmetto expressway west of Miami.

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## afwjam

> Yeah, I've ridden that little piece of insanity myself.
> 
> AFW is right, the only thing close is two stroke, big displacement snow machine.
> 
> Years ago I had my son with me who about 6 or 7 at the time, riding in front on an Arctic Cat GTX. We stopped for minute to stretch and pee on the side of the trail, I started the machine and set my son on the front. While I was climbing on he decided to grab a handful of throttle, because "hey I saw dad doing it".
> 
> We had climbed a tree and fell into a snowbank before I could shut down.


Sounds about right.

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## afwjam

If you guys like stump pulling torque you gotta try the Triump Rocket III, different kind of beast, but you can actually wheelie the 800 pound goliath.

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## afwjam

You can almost hear that little boy in the second video thinking: "man, I love the smell of two stroke smoke in the morning!"

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## pcosmar

> the only thing in recent memory that has given me an experience like that was my Arctic cat firecat 700, fuel injected 700 twin, also did not like to turn or stop.


Had a Bearcat 660 widetrack. Drove like a truck. Would catch air with two up.

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## tod evans

4-stroke Buell

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## phill4paul

> 4-stroke Buell


Good Lord!  Suicide bars indeed.

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## tod evans

> Good Lord!  Suicide bars indeed.


185bhp street legal V-twin USA made....

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## afwjam

A bearcat would have been a more practical option for what I was doing in the tundra, I believe the 660 is air cooled which is also more practical for running around the village drunk. Love the Buells, shame what Harley did to Eric, I had a firebolt xb12 for a bit and it was serious fun, wheelies in the first three gears easy.

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## Anti Federalist

48 cylinder Kawasaki 2 stroke.

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## Anti Federalist

Wish I was riding...

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## Anti Federalist

Still wishin...

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## phill4paul

> Still wishin...


  If wishes were fishes we'd all cast nets.

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## Anti Federalist

> If wishes were fishes we'd all cast nets.


No kidding...meh, this job has become *misery* over the last six months or so.

Been twenty years with this same outfit.

Time to move on down the road...

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## Origanalist

Ok, I'm giving up on the goldwing. Don't want to fix it, and the damn things too big for me anyway. Going to look at one of these later in the week. Not particularly fast but I hear good things from the owners and it's cheap. 

1982 Yamaha VIRAGO 920

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## Anti Federalist

Did you ever get the Virago?

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## Natural Citizen

> If wishes were fishes we'd all cast nets.


Heh. That's pretty good, phill.

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## Anti Federalist

Still good riding, a little chilly...

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## Danke

First bump tonight,  I was gonna let it slide.  But now.





> This belongs here.

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## Natural Citizen

She has a messy room.

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## Danke

> She has a messy room.


You passed the test.



Not many do. Congratulations.

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## Anti Federalist

Motorcycles...

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## Origanalist

> Did you ever get the Virago?


No. Right now I only have a DR 350 Suzuki dual sport. Looking to get a road bike before the weather turns good though.

Looks like this;

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## Anti Federalist

Bump, spring coming, talking motorcycles in another thread.

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## tod evans

> Bump, spring coming, talking motorcycles in another thread.




I'm still scooterless until I pay off my legal bills...

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## Origanalist

I put one in the picture thread, might as well put one here. Sold the dual sport, bought this. For less money.

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## Anti Federalist

That's my kind of truck, in the background.

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## Danke



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## oyarde

I took a break from weed eating and got in the wind in a kayak today . If Danke was here we could have took the boat if he rowed.

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## Danke

> I took a break from weed eating and got in the wind in a kayak today . If Danke was here we could have took the boat if he rowed.

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## Anti Federalist

> 


.... zuh ...

???

Oh, OH...

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## Anti Federalist

Had no idea they were not, but they are now, legal in NH.

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## phill4paul

> Had no idea they were not, but they are now, legal in NH.


  Ape hangers were illegal?

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## Anti Federalist

> Ape hangers were illegal?


Apparently so...got this in a NHLA email:

The Governor has already signed 28 bills, vetoed none, and another 69 are awaiting his signature. Other than concealed carry and some bills that expand the conditions where medical marijuana can be used, there's nothing too interesting in those 97 bills. Employers can now pay bi-weekly (instead of just weekly), there will be a central database of voters who use IDs issued from other states, bitcoin users will not have to register as money transmitters, the immunity granted for calling an ambulance in the event of a drug overdose will no longer sunset, firecrackers can be sold, *motorcycle hand grips can be above shoulder height*, registered sex offenders must report their email addresses and social media IDs, stronger proof will be needed to terminate parental rights, parents will get more notice of sex ed materials, medical imaging licensing is delayed 13 months, and the finances of the state colleges will be opened to legislative investigation.

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## phill4paul

> Apparently so...got this in a NHLA email:
> 
> The Governor has already signed 28 bills, vetoed none, and another 69 are awaiting his signature. Other than concealed carry and some bills that expand the conditions where medical marijuana can be used, there's nothing too interesting in those 97 bills. Employers can now pay bi-weekly (instead of just weekly), there will be a central database of voters who use IDs issued from other states, bitcoin users will not have to register as money transmitters, the immunity granted for calling an ambulance in the event of a drug overdose will no longer sunset, firecrackers can be sold, *motorcycle hand grips can be above shoulder height*, registered sex offenders must report their email addresses and social media IDs, stronger proof will be needed to terminate parental rights, parents will get more notice of sex ed materials, medical imaging licensing is delayed 13 months, and the finances of the state colleges will be opened to legislative investigation.


  Damn. So what about riders from other states? Were they breaking the law by riding the King's roads?

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## tod evans

> Damn. So what about riders from other states? Were they breaking the law by riding the King's roads?


Of course...

I probably still have several dozen tickets on the books, pre-'puter, from riding through Missouri with no helmet.....

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## oyarde

> Of course...
> 
> I probably still have several dozen tickets on the books, pre-'puter, from riding through Missouri with no helmet.....


I have two unpaid tickets , Missouri and Frankfort West Germany .

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## shakey1

> Had no idea they were not, but they are now, legal in NH.


They're ok everywhere, so long as you stay on you're own property.

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## Root

I gotta ask, because I'm not a motorcycle guy...

Are those ape hangers comfortable?  Do they limit the turning ability of the bike?  Why are they so popular?

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## tod evans

> I gotta ask, because I'm not a motorcycle guy...
> 
> Are those ape hangers comfortable?  Do they limit the turning ability of the bike?  Why are they so popular?


Between 45-75 they're really comfortable, especially with forward controls, kind of like sitting in a rocking chair....

As far as handling..........If you're runnin' apes you're not a cafe-racer..

Guys who tear up their shoulders at work (like carpenters and farriers) like apes due to the pulling the ball out of the socket arrangement that's so painful...

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## Anti Federalist

> I gotta ask, because I'm not a motorcycle guy...
> 
> Are those ape hangers comfortable?  Do they limit the turning ability of the bike?  Why are they so popular?


The one in the photo I posted was a little extreme, so there is some showing off involved.

But a "mild" set of apes, like tod mentioned, can be a godsend for an older rider with back and shoulder pain.

Hell, the first chopper I built had a 12 inch set over 4 inch "dogbones" and it was comfortable as hell and I was in my late teens early 20s

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## Root

I always learn something new, everyday here.  Thanks Tod & AF.

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## anaconda

> 


Also liquid cooled. +1

I've considered a Vulcan 500 recently. Parallel twin with dual carbs.Same engine from the old Ninja 500 I believe. No fuel gauge seems weird to me:

Yamaha V-Star 650's are supposed to be pretty bullet proof I believe, though not the best for long and fast on the freeway. And I don't like the sound of V-Twins.



Another pretty neat bike is the Kawasaki Vulcan S. Same parallel twin engine from the Versys and Ninja 650. But probably more than I care to spend (plus I think the Honda CTX may be superior):

----------


## anaconda

Got my license here in CA last Fall but haven't bought anything yet and have no riding history except in the Rider Safety Course. I believe CA is the only state where lane splitting is legal, which really adds to the incentive to get one for rush hour commuting.I want something small I believe. Although I'd consider a Honda CTX700 DCT (Dual Clutch Transmission) if money were no object. I don't like noisy V-Twins and this has their parallel twin sport bike engine, used on the CBR650 I believe (the DCT shifts gears like an automatic transmission in a car):


But I believe I would be initially happier with something small and flickable. Here's a few things I'm checking out:
Kymco People 150


Honda PCX


Honda Grom

Genuine Buddy 170i


Honda Reflex (precursor of the current Forza):


I keep changing my mind every few weeks.

----------


## tod evans

BMW and Ducati make nice bikes if you're put off by V Twins...

These bikes will appreciate;







[edit]

'56 on E-Bay just a few hrs left;

----------


## oyarde

Today I am going to get in the wind on the tractor . Still waiting for Danke to send me a nice old Triumph .

----------


## Dr.3D

> Had no idea they were not, but they are now, legal in NH.


That can't be comfortable.

Doesn't that make the blood run out of your arms?

----------


## tod evans

> That can't be comfortable.
> 
> Doesn't that make the blood run out of your arms?


It's lots more comfortable than riding like this;

----------


## Anti Federalist

> I keep changing my mind every few weeks.


Comes very highly recommended:

2017 - BMW C650 GT

https://ericpetersautos.com/2017/04/...7-bmw-c650-gt/

----------


## tod evans

> Comes very highly recommended:
> 
> 2017 - BMW C650 GT


I'd rather walk.....

----------


## Anti Federalist

> Also liquid cooled. +1


It's funny how people's tastes run...that is the primary *drawback* to that bike in my mind, the fact that it is not air cooled, and is probably the reason why I'll be going bigger and air cooled next year, if the timing, money and stars align properly.

I saw a great deal on one of these, but could not commit to pull the trigger...

----------


## Anti Federalist

> I'd rather walk.....


LOL, well so would I...but out young friend from California has tastes that run 180 degrees from ours, brother.

----------


## oyarde

> It's funny how people's tastes run...that is the primary *drawback* to that bike in my mind, the fact that it is not air cooled, and is probably the reason why I'll be going bigger and air cooled next year, if the timing, money and stars align properly.
> 
> I saw a great deal on one of these, but could not commit to pull the trigger...


I might look good on that , but too hard to give up the F 150 .

----------


## shakey1



----------


## tod evans

> It's funny how people's tastes run...that is the primary *drawback* to that bike in my mind, the fact that it is not air cooled, and is probably the reason why I'll be going bigger and air cooled next year, if the timing, money and stars align properly.
> 
> I saw a great deal on one of these, but could not commit to pull the trigger...


The priest at our church rides one like this;

----------


## tod evans

> LOL, well so would I...but out young friend from California has tastes that run 180 degrees from ours, brother.


That '56 Beemer I linked to on EBay is out in the land of fruits-n-nuts, doesn't look imposing, will get out of its own way and will be worth more tomorrow than today....

----------


## TheCount

> Got my license here in CA last Fall but haven't bought anything yet and have no riding history except in the Rider Safety Course. I believe CA is the only state where lane splitting is legal, which really adds to the incentive to get one for rush hour commuting.I want something small I believe. Although I'd consider a Honda CTX700 DCT (Dual Clutch Transmission) if money were no object.


The Honda parallel twins have no soul.  Truly boring to ride, and I'm not a huge fan of their transmissions.  That said, if that's the sort of bike that you want, then the new Rebel 500 would be a good choice.  They took the 500 out of the CB500 bikes and put it in a more cruiseresque frame.  Quite nice.  The 300 is garbage, don't even bother.



You'll really want to get riding before too much time passes after your class.  It'll just get harder to get into it.  Lane splitting is the best, saves me an enormous amount of time on my commute.  Nearly half.

----------


## anaconda

> BMW and Ducati make nice bikes if you're put off by V Twins...
> 
> These bikes will appreciate;
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Thank you for the ideas! Bur are parts availability and cost, and labor costs reasonable for these brands?

----------


## anaconda

> That can't be comfortable.
> 
> Doesn't that make the blood run out of your arms?


Sounds like modest ape hangers are very comfortable for many, for a variety of reasons.

https://www.hdforums.com/forum/sport...s-comfort.html

https://www.reddit.com/r/motorcycles...eal_of_monkey/

http://www.v-twinforum.com/forums/ge...drag-bars.html

----------


## anaconda

> The Honda parallel twins have no soul.  Truly boring to ride, and I'm not a huge fan of their transmissions.  That said, if that's the sort of bike that you want, then the new Rebel 500 would be a good choice.  They took the 500 out of the CB500 bikes and put it in a more cruiseresque frame.  Quite nice.  The 300 is garbage, don't even bother.
> 
> 
> 
> You'll really want to get riding before too much time passes after your class.  It'll just get harder to get into it.  Lane splitting is the best, saves me an enormous amount of time on my commute.  Nearly half.


Yes. I forgot to mention I had been seriously thinking about the new 2017 redesigned Honda Rebel. Thanks for pointing that out. They are apparently exactly the same except for the engine. I don't really want any thing too heavy or too powerful. The 300 should do at least 90 MPH. I think I could easily live with that. Why do you consider the 300 garbage? Just curious. Thanks.

----------


## anaconda

> It's funny how people's tastes run...that is the primary *drawback* to that bike in my mind, the fact that it is not air cooled, and is probably the reason why I'll be going bigger and air cooled next year, if the timing, money and stars align properly.
> 
> I saw a great deal on one of these, but could not commit to pull the trigger...


It is my understanding that water-cooled engines can be constructed with more precision tolerances since they don't contract and expand as much with temperature variances. So, presumably, for a given displacement, you will get more horsepower, better fuel economy, less overheating on hot days, and a longer engine life.

----------


## anaconda

> The priest at our church rides one like this;


Looks like the preacher has a little bit of the devil in him.

----------


## anaconda

> Comes very highly recommended:
> 
> 2017 - BMW C650 GT
> 
> https://ericpetersautos.com/2017/04/...7-bmw-c650-gt/


Too big for me as a starter. I'm gonna need to push whatever I buy around some obstacles in the small garage I'll be sharing with a car. The older Honda Reflex is about the biggest I would want to try for if I go the "maxi-scooter" route. But yes, these are great I believe. Thanks for mentioning it. This beemer is 575 lbs. The Honda Reflex (shown above in post #134) is 375 lbs.

----------


## tod evans

> Thank you for the ideas! Bur are parts availability and cost, and labor costs reasonable for these brands?


Absolutely parts are available and there's a following just like with Harley..

Both of those motors were as common as 350 Chevy motors only in the bike world. Tons of information, aftermarket parts and accessories too...

----------


## TheCount

> Yes. I forgot to mention I had been seriously thinking about the new 2017 redesigned Honda Rebel. Thanks for pointing that out. They are apparently exactly the same except for the engine. I don't really want any thing too heavy or too powerful. The 300 should do at least 90 MPH. I think I could easily live with that. Why do you consider the 300 garbage? Just curious. Thanks.


The weight difference is not much at all between the two, and the 300cc engine is a single cylinder.  I'm not fond of the characteristics of a single, they're naturally unbalanced and tend to vibrate the bike at certain RPMs, particularly at constant speeds like commuting.  The two cylinder 500 will be much smoother and overall friendlier to ride, plus the additional torque will be a godsend in traffic.

There's a number of very favorable reviews on Youtube already by major motorcycle outlets.  I'd check 'em out.

----------


## Origanalist

> That can't be comfortable.
> 
> Doesn't that make the blood run out of your arms?


It sure would mine. No way I would have those.

----------


## Origanalist

> I might look good on that , but too hard to give up the F 150 .


You CAN have both you know.

----------


## Origanalist

> Yes. I forgot to mention I had been seriously thinking about the new 2017 redesigned Honda Rebel. Thanks for pointing that out. They are apparently exactly the same except for the engine. I don't really want any thing too heavy or too powerful. The 300 should do at least 90 MPH. I think I could easily live with that. Why do you consider the 300 garbage? Just curious. Thanks.


You aren't going to do 90 with it.

----------


## anaconda

> Absolutely parts are available and there's a following just like with Harley..
> 
> Both of those motors were as common as 350 Chevy motors only in the bike world. Tons of information, aftermarket parts and accessories too...


Good to know. Parts are crazy cheap for that Kymco People 150 shown above (the green large-wheeled full step-thru scooter). On the other hand, just _try_ to find fairings for the pre-2009 Kawasaki Ninja 250, of which there are tons of on the road.

----------


## anaconda

> You aren't going to do 90 with it.


CBR300R with same motor goes 100 MPH. Why would 90 MPH a bad estimate?

----------


## anaconda

> The weight difference is not much at all between the two, and the 300cc engine is a single cylinder.  I'm not fond of the characteristics of a single, they're naturally unbalanced and tend to vibrate the bike at certain RPMs, particularly at constant speeds like commuting.  The two cylinder 500 will be much smoother and overall friendlier to ride, plus the additional torque will be a godsend in traffic.
> 
> There's a number of very favorable reviews on Youtube already by major motorcycle outlets.  I'd check 'em out.


Great comments. Thanks. Much to consider.

----------


## Origanalist

> Too big for me as a starter. I'm gonna need to push whatever I buy around some obstacles in the small garage I'll be sharing with a car. The older Honda Reflex is about the biggest I would want to try for if I go the "maxi-scooter" route. But yes, these are great I believe. Thanks for mentioning it. This beemer is 575 lbs. The Honda Reflex (shown above in post #134) is 375 lbs.


Just my opinion, but unless your a really timid sort you will end up wanting to do modifications on the Reflex after a week or two. Just my 2 cents for what it's worth. If you're going to be on the highway you need to be able to get out of your own way just for safety's  sake.

----------


## Origanalist

> CBR300R with same motor goes 100 MPH. Why would 90 MPH a bad estimate?


Well, maybe downhill with a backwind.

----------


## Origanalist

> Great comments. Thanks. Much to consider.


Again, just my 2 cents but I'm in agreement with TheCount here.

----------


## Anti Federalist

> It is my understanding that water-cooled engines can be constructed with more precision tolerances since they don't contract and expand as much with temperature variances. So, presumably, for a given displacement, you will get more horsepower, better fuel economy, less overheating on hot days, and a longer engine life.


No question about it, all of that is true.

Presumably one could water cool a chainsaw as well, and derive all those benefits, but it would be unwieldy and impractical to do so.

My love affair with motorcycles started with, partly, their relative simplicity. The cleaner and simpler and less complex a motorcycle is, the more it pleases me.

Even with water cooling and relatively modern Japanese design, the Vulcan I own has a standard carburetor, non computerized ignition (it is electronic however) and chain drive.

Water cooling adds a whole new level of complexity that is not, for my uses and tastes, needed or wanted.

----------


## anaconda

> Just my opinion, but unless your a really timid sort you will end up wanting to do modifications on the Reflex after a week or two. Just my 2 cents for what it's worth. If you're going to be on the highway you need to be able to get out of your own way just for safety's  sake.


Reflex does 80 MPH max.

----------


## anaconda

> No question about it, all of that is true.
> 
> Presumably one could water cool a chainsaw as well, and derive all those benefits, but it would be unwieldy and impractical to do so.
> 
> My love affair with motorcycles started with, partly, their relative simplicity. The cleaner and simpler and less complex a motorcycle is, the more it pleases me.
> 
> Even with water cooling and relatively modern Japanese design, the Vulcan I own has a standard carburetor, non computerized ignition (it is electronic however) and chain drive.
> 
> Water cooling adds a whole new level of complexity that is not, for my uses and tastes, needed or wanted.


I can certainly respect that.

----------


## tod evans

> Reflex does 80 MPH max.


The 'advertised' speed means nothing about the cycle being safe or steady at that velocity. 

Seriously...........Find some old farts in your area who ride and pick their brains.

Listening to other youngsters or advertising isn't going to give you real-world perspective...

----------


## anaconda

> Well, maybe downhill with a backwind.


This dude has his up to about 110 MPH:




This guy about 105 MPH:

----------


## anaconda

> The 'advertised' speed means nothing about the cycle being safe or steady at that velocity. 
> 
> Seriously...........Find some old farts in your area who ride and pick their brains.
> 
> Listening to other youngsters or advertising isn't going to give you real-world perspective...


The Reflex is a highly rated scooter. User reviews are great. And I don't think many youngsters ride them.

----------


## tod evans

> The Reflex is a highly rated scooter. User reviews are great. And I don't think many youngsters ride them.


I suppose I should have been more specific.....

Old farts (over 60) with 20+ years of riding experience, the kind of people who are capable of giving you an educated opinion....

----------


## Origanalist

> This dude has his up to about 110 MPH:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This guy about 105 MPH:


I see I was wrong after reading up on the 300. It sounds like Honda has a pretty good entry level bike there. I'm a guy that doesn't care for high rpm's on the highway but it sounds like the 300 is built to handle it.

Whatever you decide on it still a great way to commute, wish I didn't have to haul equipment every day.

----------


## tod evans

> I see I was wrong after reading up on the 300. It sounds like Honda has a pretty good entry level bike there. I'm a guy that doesn't care for high rpm's on the highway but it sounds like the 300 is built to handle it.
> 
> Whatever you decide on it still a great way to commute, wish I didn't have to haul equipment every day.


Would you feel comfortable riding a 'scooter' or even an entry level bike during rush hour in any city?

Obviously anaconda can do as he pleases but my kid won't get my permission to ride anything smaller than a sportster as long as I'm in charge

----------


## Origanalist

> Would you feel comfortable riding a 'scooter' or even an entry level bike during rush hour in any city?
> 
> Obviously anaconda can do as he pleases but my kid won't get my permission to ride anything smaller than a sportster as long as I'm in charge


I really have no idea having never been on one, but truthfully during rush hour a lite, easy to handle bike like that is preferable. Much better in stop and go traffic than a bigger bike, my DR350 dual sport was great in traffic compared to the gold wing. But once you're out of traffic......

----------


## tod evans

> I really have no idea having never been on one, but truthfully during rush hour a lite, easy to handle bike like that is preferable. Much better in stop and go traffic than a bigger bike, my DR350 dual sport was great in traffic compared to the gold wing. But once you're out of traffic......


I'm picturing 75mph, 4-6 lanes fighting for position....The ability to drop a gear, or two, and open it up has always been my favorite way to avoid idiots.

But in town you're 100% correct.....Hell a 10 speed is better than cars or full sized scoots in town....

----------


## Origanalist

> I'm picturing 75mph, 4-6 lanes fighting for position....The ability to drop a gear, or two, and open it up has always been my favorite way to avoid idiots.
> 
> But in town you're 100% correct.....Hell a 10 speed is better than cars or full sized scoots in town....


I'm in agreement there, out on the open highway the ability to accelerate out of danger is a much needed safety feature.

----------


## tod evans

> I'm in agreement there, out on the open highway the ability to accelerate out of danger is a much needed safety feature.


45mph secondary streets are a completely different animal than interstates....

Way back when, when I tried city life, I'd stick to the interstates/toll roads and limit my exposure to stop-n-go lights as much as possible...

----------


## Origanalist

Lol, if I dropped down 2 gears on the shadow I would end up on the pavement. It's a 4 speed.

----------


## tod evans

I knew a drywaller who rode one of these, 6'-2" 200+# ripping around town...


*Yamaha RZ350 - Best Used Bikes*



http://www.cycleworld.com/2014/12/17...etbikes-review

BLUE BOOK RETAIL VALUE: $4300
BASIC SPECS: A two-stroke, power-valve-equipped 347cc parallel twin with 26mm slide-valve Mikuni carbs, oil injection and six-speed transmission. A steel-tube frame with an aluminum swingarm rolls on 18-inch wheels with triple disc brakes. Its simplicity allowed it to be a light 371 pounds with the 5.2-gallon (!) gas tank half full.
WHY IT’S DESIRABLE: The RZ350 is the most modern and last legal street-going two-stroke sold in the US. In the first full test, we said our July 1984 cover bike rated a “perfect 10” on the fun scale. On Jerry Branch’s dyno, the stock RZ350 made 42.7 hp at 9,000 rpm; redline is 9,500. Below 6,000 rpm, the engine “doesn’t make enough power to pull the skin off a bowl of rice pudding,” read the test, but power came on strong after 6K. Hey, welcome to the fun zone! The RZ350 turned in an impressive quarter-mile time of 13.19 seconds at 99.22 mph, and that was with the OE catalyst exhausts. Fun and nimble handling are improved with fitment of modern tires on those classic ’80s wheels. A surprising number of these bikes come up for sale at reasonable cost, but original, low-mileage examples in excellent condition can go for double blue book. Aftermarket parts support remains very good.
THE COMPETITION: Not really. Yamaha’s own RZ500 V-4 two-stroke was sold in Canada, and many made the gray-market journey south, but prices are quite a bit higher. Kawasaki’s Ninja 600R was the most high-performance middleweight of the time, but it was significantly heavier.

----------


## Origanalist

> I knew a drywaller who rode one of these, 6'-2" 200+# ripping around town...
> 
> 
> *Yamaha RZ350 - Best Used Bikes*
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.cycleworld.com/2014/12/17...etbikes-review
> 
> ...


Where did he put his equipment??

----------


## tod evans

> Where did he put his equipment??


Gangbox...

He was an out-of-towner brought in on commercial work........1st tapeworm I ever saw in use...

----------


## Origanalist

> Gangbox...
> 
> He was an out-of-towner brought in on commercial work........1st tapeworm I ever saw in use...


Lol, I own one of those pre-historic beasties, in working order!

----------


## tod evans

> Lol, I own one of those pre-historic beasties, in working order!


Whadda use now?

----------


## Origanalist

> Whadda use now?


Tape Tech. There are probably 7 or 8 different brands now, Tape Tech is a direct copy of the Ames tools. I was actually working for the guy who started Tape Tech, he used to send tools out with us to run and give feedback on. He finally gave up and just directly copied Ames when their patent ran out.

----------


## TheCount

> CBR300R with same motor goes 100 MPH. Why would 90 MPH a bad estimate?


There's a world of difference aerodynamically between a sportbike with a fairing and a cruiser or something pretending to be a cruiser.  Also, even though those bikes have the same engine, they do not have the same cams or gear ratios  They've sacrificed top end power in the rebel for more torque.

Ultimately, though, riding a light bike at those speeds - any speed above 60-ish really - is not a pleasant experience.  You get blown all over the place, and the bike is much more apt to track the pavement and go where it wants to go rather than where you want it to go.  If you've ever driven a tiny car with small wheels/tires, it's a similar problem, but much more pronounced on the bike.  It requires a lot more attention from the rider, and you have to constantly adjust to keep going where you want to go.  It's partly to do with weight and partly to do with the angle of the front fork.  My wife has a CB500F which I've ridden many times.  I wouldn't choose to ride more it for longer than maybe 30-45 minutes at freeway speeds.  I could, and it would be fine, but it certainly wouldn't be fun or pleasant.

If this is purely a commute machine for you, then you likely won't be affected by that, but you should keep it in mind if you are thinking about doing any long-distance riding.


On the topic of 'enough power' one thing that you should keep in mind is gearing.  That 300cc single cylinder is going to be in its top gear on the freeway, and midway through the RPMs.  It would be completely wrung out.  If you suddenly decided that you needed more power to scoot out of a situation, you would have very little power on tap no matter how far you turned the throttle.   You'd need to drop a gear or else just scoot away slowly.  Either way you're not going to be able to react as quickly to a problem as if you had a bit more displacement, torque, etc. where you could just twist the throttle a bit and have instant power.

----------


## anaconda

> Would you feel comfortable riding a 'scooter' or even an entry level bike during rush hour in any city?
> 
> Obviously anaconda can do as he pleases but my kid won't get my permission to ride anything smaller than a sportster as long as I'm in charge


Make no mistake. Everyone's opinions here are monumentally valuable to me. 

Ironically, the reason a smaller bike might be A-OK in lane splitting CA is that the rush hour traffic in many areas is SLOW! If everyone is going 0 to 10 MPH in their cages, you could zip through that stuff and never have your bike over about 35 MPH. Lane splitters, if I recall, are limited to 15 MPH over the bogged down cars. BTW "rush hour" between S.F. and Oakland is from about 7 AM to 8 PM with a break from about 11 AM to 1 PM.

----------


## tod evans

> Make no mistake. Everyone's opinions here are monumentally valuable to me. 
> 
> Ironically, the reason a smaller bike might be A-OK in lane splitting CA is that the rush hour traffic in many areas is SLOW! If everyone is going 0 to 10 MPH in their cages, you could zip through that stuff and never have your bike over about 35 MPH. Lane splitters, if I recall, are limited to 15 MPH over the bogged down cars. BTW "rush hour" between S.F. and Oakland is from about 7 AM to 8 PM with a break from about 11 AM to 1 PM.


At 15mph a water cooled rig might be your best bet.......

Even those get hot at low speeds, hot for the rider more than the motor....

----------


## anaconda

> I'm picturing 75mph, 4-6 lanes fighting for position....The ability to drop a gear, or two, and open it up has always been my favorite way to avoid idiots.


Ah! We were having a semantic misunderstanding. The situation you describe here is not Bay Area "rush hour." You've described the Bay Area at all times not rush hour. "Rush hour" is cars backed up a quarter of a mile bumper to bumper waiting to creep towards the Bay Bridge toll booth. And after paying, they get to wait at metering lights. The only lane that moves fast is the "car pool" lane which, BTW, motorcycles can use!

----------


## anaconda

> At 15mph a water cooled rig might be your best bet.......
> 
> Even those get hot at low speeds, hot for the rider more than the motor....


Another great point. The legal lane splitting in CA helps some with this some, I imagine.

----------


## anaconda

> There's a world of difference aerodynamically between a sportbike with a fairing and a cruiser or something pretending to be a cruiser.  Also, even though those bikes have the same engine, they do not have the same cams or gear ratios  They've sacrificed top end power in the rebel for more torque.
> 
> Ultimately, though, riding a light bike at those speeds - any speed above 60-ish really - is not a pleasant experience.  You get blown all over the place, and the bike is much more apt to track the pavement and go where it wants to go rather than where you want it to go.  If you've ever driven a tiny car with small wheels/tires, it's a similar problem, but much more pronounced on the bike.  It requires a lot more attention from the rider, and you have to constantly adjust to keep going where you want to go.  It's partly to do with weight and partly to do with the angle of the front fork.  My wife has a CB500F which I've ridden many times.  I wouldn't choose to ride more it for longer than maybe 30-45 minutes at freeway speeds.  I could, and it would be fine, but it certainly wouldn't be fun or pleasant.
> 
> If this is purely a commute machine for you, then you likely won't be affected by that, but you should keep it in mind if you are thinking about doing any long-distance riding.
> 
> 
> On the topic of 'enough power' one thing that you should keep in mind is gearing.  That 300cc single cylinder is going to be in its top gear on the freeway, and midway through the RPMs.  It would be completely wrung out.  If you suddenly decided that you needed more power to scoot out of a situation, you would have very little power on tap no matter how far you turned the throttle.   You'd need to drop a gear or else just scoot away slowly.  Either way you're not going to be able to react as quickly to a problem as if you had a bit more displacement, torque, etc. where you could just twist the throttle a bit and have instant power.


This is a top concern as I navigate the shark infested waters of first bike decision making. Thank you for suggesting this. I will prioritize it.

----------


## tod evans

> Ah! We were having a semantic misunderstanding. The situation you describe here is not Bay Area "rush hour." You've described the Bay Area at all times not rush hour. "Rush hour" is cars backed up a quarter of a mile bumper to bumper waiting to creep towards the Bay Bridge toll booth. And after paying, they get to wait at metering lights. The only lane that moves fast is the "car pool" lane which, BTW, motorcycles can use!


Were it I navigating 4-6 lanes of hangovers-n-housewives I'd opt for drag pipes and a stroker.........

But you've poo-pooed that............

Next up is enough power to get away from them, them being the idiot trying to kill you either intentionally or by neglect...

After your first year you'll understand that every car and most small trucks are gunnin' for you.............Semi drivers generally show respect.

----------


## anaconda

Also I've read that dual sports with their very high seat heights are good for city traffic as you can see and be seen from the several extra inches of height. Also good for for going over man hole covers, potholes, railroad tracks, and tore up segments of streets. Many months ago I thought I wanted one of these:



But now I really like the idea of not just full flat-footing, but full flat-footing with also some bend in the knees. Which has driven me toward the consideration of something in a cruiser style frame set up.

----------


## TheCount

> Also I've read that dual sports with their very high seat heights are good for city traffic as you can see and be seen from the several extra inches of height. Also good for for going over man hole covers, potholes, railroad tracks, and tore up segments of streets. Many months ago I thought I wanted one of these:
> 
> But now I really like the idea of not just full flat-footing, but full flat-footing with also some bend in the knees. Which has driven me toward the consideration of something in a cruiser style frame set up.


The problem with cruisers is their width.  In a standard or moto bike, you're vaguely top on top of the engine, and they are more narrow.  That narrowness will help you lane split.

Somewhat in between the two types of bikes you're talking about is a standard.  The CB500X is taller like a motocross bike, and is 'adventure' which means it's 90% pavement and 10% dirt roads.  The CB500F is similar but about 2-3 inches shorter.  Other than suspension height the two bikes are identical.

If your inseam is 30" or longer you will be flat-footed on a CB500F. Above 32" you would be flat-footed on a CB500X.


The rebel 500 is essentially the same bike but with a 4" lower seat. The rear suspension is different because the seat is too low for the shock to be under the seat and so there's two smaller shocks, one on either side of the seat.













If you look between the white CB500F and the grey Rebel you can see same engine, same radiator, same headers, same footpegs... same same same.  The only difference is seating position.

----------


## Origanalist

> Too big for me as a starter. I'm gonna need to push whatever I buy around some obstacles in the small garage I'll be sharing with a car. The older Honda Reflex is about the biggest I would want to try for if I go the "maxi-scooter" route. But yes, these are great I believe. Thanks for mentioning it. This beemer is 575 lbs. The Honda Reflex (shown above in post #134) is 375 lbs.


Just a thought, but IMO this is a bad way to go about considering buying a motorcycle. You need to consider what your needs will be on the road and the rest should be secondary and accommodations made accordingly. Otherwise your going to regret your purchase except when you're parking it.

----------


## anaconda

> Just a thought, but IMO this is a bad way to go about considering buying a motorcycle. You need to consider what your needs will be on the road and the rest should be secondary and accommodations made accordingly. Otherwise your going to regret your purchase except when you're parking it.


Great point. But for me right now anything large will have to be parked outside. In Oakland. Plus, there's a vague correlation because I believe I will be far more inclined to ride something that I fund fun, flickable, and approachable. There's a youtube of a guy who owned a Ninja 300 and he loved it but just never rode it much. He swapped it out for a Honda PCX 150 scooter and he apparently rides the scooter all the time.

----------


## anaconda

> The problem with cruisers is their width.  In a standard or moto bike, you're vaguely top on top of the engine, and they are more narrow.  That narrowness will help you lane split.
> 
> Somewhat in between the two types of bikes you're talking about is a standard.  The CB500X is taller like a motocross bike, and is 'adventure' which means it's 90% pavement and 10% dirt roads.  The CB500F is similar but about 2-3 inches shorter.  Other than suspension height the two bikes are identical.
> 
> If your inseam is 30" or longer you will be flat-footed on a CB500F. Above 32" you would be flat-footed on a CB500X.
> 
> 
> The rebel 500 is essentially the same bike but with a 4" lower seat. The rear suspension is different because the seat is too low for the shock to be under the seat and so there's two smaller shocks, one on either side of the seat.
> 
> If you look between the white CB500F and the grey Rebel you can see same engine, same radiator, same headers, same footpegs... same same same.  The only difference is seating position.


Thanks for the great analysis! I knew the engines were identical, but was not aware of all of this you have pointed out.

----------


## anaconda

> The problem with cruisers is their width.  In a standard or moto bike, you're vaguely top on top of the engine, and they are more narrow.  That narrowness will help you lane split.


I'm not understanding why a cruiser would necessarily be wide. V-Twins mostly are longitudinally opposed in line with the frame. Maybe you are referring to the fact that many cruisers are simply big bikes that are also wide. But wouldn't something like, say, a Suzuki S40 be pretty narrow?

----------


## Anti Federalist

> I'm not understanding why a cruiser would necessarily be wide. V-Twins mostly are longitudinally opposed in line with the frame. Maybe you are referring to the fact that many cruisers are simply big bikes that are also wide. But wouldn't something like, say, a Suzuki S40 be pretty narrow?


If you like that, you also have this option:

----------


## TheCount

> I'm not understanding why a cruiser would necessarily be wide.


It's because of the riding position and styling.  Many cruisers you sit more 'in' the bike than 'on' the bike.  You're entirely behind the engine, rather than being somewhat above the transmission.  Footpegs are forward and wide because your legs are spread out somewhat.  The handlebars are also typically wider because of the rake angle of the front suspension.

Again, sticking with Honda bikes for easy comparison, the CTX700 and the NC700 are essentially the same bike, but the CTX is significantly larger.  According to Honda's dimensions specs, the CTX is 6 inches wider, which is around 20% more.  On the other hand, the Rebel 500 is only about an inch wider than the CB500F.

----------


## anaconda

> If you like that, you also have this option:


$6,000 gives this a lot of competition. This is kickstart only! Very Hipster, or possibly simply the A/F simplicity doctrine! I also heard somewhere that you can't kick start a fuel injected engine. But this appears to defy that story line. Very nice looking, sufficient power for me, not too big. Love the seat shape and length. Isn't 24 HP for 399cc's a bit stingy?

----------


## anaconda

> It's because of the riding position and styling.  Many cruisers you sit more 'in' the bike than 'on' the bike.  You're entirely behind the engine, rather than being somewhat above the transmission.  Footpegs are forward and wide because your legs are spread out somewhat.  The handlebars are also typically wider because of the rake angle of the front suspension.
> 
> Again, sticking with Honda bikes for easy comparison, the CTX700 and the NC700 are essentially the same bike, but the CTX is significantly larger.  According to Honda's dimensions specs, the CTX is 6 inches wider, which is around 20% more.  On the other hand, the Rebel 500 is only about an inch wider than the CB500F.


Thanks again. This is all very fascinating to me and quite informative and will be useful quite soon.

----------


## tod evans

> Just a thought, but IMO this is a bad way to go about considering buying a motorcycle. You need to consider what your needs will be on the road and the rest should be secondary and accommodations made accordingly. Otherwise your going to regret your purchase except when you're parking it.


Sage advice!

----------


## tod evans

Investment bikes that aren't Harley and aren't Jap;

Feel free to add what I miss!



Ace

Triumph

Moto Guzzi

BSA

Norton

Crocker

BMW

Indian

Excelsior

Ducati

Benelli.

Royal Enfield

Vincent

Matchless

Zundapp

----------


## specsaregood

I've never been a bike guy, always preferred 4wheels.  Preferred ATV to DirtBike, Jeep to MotorCycle.   Although I did have bike pegs mounted on the outside of my doorless jeep back in the day.  

With that said, for some reason the kid has a fascination with motorcycles.  We were at the car show and he was rather ho-hum about it all until near the end and we ran across the ONLY bike at the show.   All of a sudden he demanded I take picture of him with it.  lol



As I queued up the camera, he started belting out "the pickle song" at the top of his lungs to the amusement of the old hippies in the crowd.

----------


## tod evans

That Beemer your kid liked would make a kick-ass starter bike for anaconda!

It wouldn't appreciate but it has every modern convenience available and enough power to get out of trouble plus it's "flingable"....

----------


## Anti Federalist

> $6,000 gives this a lot of competition. This is kickstart only! Very Hipster, or possibly simply the A/F simplicity doctrine! I also heard somewhere that you can't kick start a fuel injected engine. But this appears to defy that story line. Very nice looking, sufficient power for me, not too big. Love the seat shape and length. Isn't 24 HP for 399cc's a bit stingy?


De-compression device is built in.

The same way you pull start or hand crank a small direct injected diesel engine.

The 24 HP is in keeping with the bike's retro and simple design.

Sure, you *could* pull more power from 400cc...with water cooling and multiple cylinders and balanced cranks and ball bearing connecting rods...but that's not the point of this motorcycle....which is why I like it and it reflects what we talked about about before.

And so do millions of other people, cause they are selling like hotcakes.

----------


## anaconda

> That Beemer your kid liked would make a kick-ass starter bike for anaconda!
> 
> It wouldn't appreciate but it has every modern convenience available and enough power to get out of trouble plus it's "flingable"....


Are parts & labor pricey for BMWs?

----------


## tod evans

> Are parts & labor pricey for BMWs?


It's subjective............Parts-n-labor are pricey for everything...

10,000 miles in you'll have less maintenance on a BMW than most anything else on 2 wheels..........And that'll hold true even if you buy used.


[edit]

http://www.bmwlt.com/forums/rt-serie...ance-cost.html


[edit again]

Heck of a deal!

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1971-BMW-R-S...3D201908480408

----------


## shakey1

> Investment bikes that aren't Harley and aren't Jap;
> 
> Feel free to add what I miss!
> 
> 
> 
> Ace
> 
> Triumph
> ...


ha... use-ta have one of these in my youth.

----------


## Anti Federalist

Apparently there is a wave of motorcycle thefts in the UK.

_Grand Tour's_ James May weighs in:



*BIKE THEFT - SOLVED*

https://drivetribe.com/p/VNj_vFUgTNK...RLWQwr14htY-MQ

I’ve now spent several hours digesting the contents of Zander Warren’s post on motorcycle thieves (bit.ly/2qvqfno). I felt it was important not to rush into a response.

As someone who loves motorcycles, it’s an emotive issue; as someone whose new Triumph was badly damaged by thieves a few years ago, I find the idea that these gangs are brazenly roaming the streets, unchallenged, to be infuriating. Of course I do.

But the landscape of crime is never as simple as it seems. It’s all too easy to believe that a zero tolerance crackdown in the community with greater powers and funding for law enforcement agencies (blah blah whatever it is people say on radio phone-ins) is the right thing to say here. We could attempt to absolve society of its responsibilities and blame the bike makers, for not providing adequate built-in security. These are platitudes. We must deal with the problem of bike thieves at its source, by killing them.

It makes me shudder to write that. I, like any civilised person, am vehemently opposed to capital punishment and any other form of state-sponsored murder. Justice should not admit a public’s thirst for pure revenge. But that’s not what’s happening here. I have arrived at this conclusion not through knee-jerk reaction or impotent fury, but by a pure and unadulterated process of logic. They have to be killed.

'A PURE AND UNADULTERATED PROCESS OF LOGIC.'
JUDGE JAMES

As the law-abiding public, we are not permitted to take the law into our own hands. I’m not suggesting we do. The law already exists, viz: it’s wrong to steal motorcycles. It’s just that the law isn’t being enforced. The police seem unwilling or in some way unempowered to deal with it, the aggrieved people are unable to convene courts to try the perpetrators even if they could be caught, so they’ll just have to be killed. That way, they won’t nick any more bikes.

There is, as ever, the matter of morality to deal with. Many people imagine that theft is a cut and dried issue as far as morality is concerned, but this isn’t so. The ‘ethics of burglary’ is a subject worthy of debate because, let’s be clear, there comes a point within the disparity of wealth and personal circumstance of peoples where it is entirely reasonable. It’s what the Littleport Riots were all about.

I hate the idea of people nicking my stuff, but in all honesty, I’m pretty well off. If a genuinely desperate man on his last gasp nicks my coat from the pub on a freezing night, well, he’s welcome to it. It’ll change his life, mine’s only inconvenienced by having to buy another one. Even a truly desperate drug addict can have my coat. He’s made a mistake somewhere in life and I haven’t, which is my good fortune. But the people we’re talking about here are just wankers nicking bikes for profit, so we should kill them.

It has, like The Archers, gone on long enough. What many assume is a spate of petty theft is in fact a threat to societal stability. These thieves are not merely taking other people’s property, they are threatening anyone who opposes them with power tools, machetes and mediaeval debonkers. As several people have already pointed out, someone is going to be killed.

In which case, it might as well be them.

----------


## anaconda

> http://www.bmwlt.com/forums/rt-serie...ance-cost.html


$3200 for one year of maintenance? Ouch! (???) City College Of San Francisco across the bay from me has very inexpensive motorcycle maintenance courses ($46 per unit). I think I may go that route and try to save some $$$. Takes about 20 minutes if traffic is not bad.

http://www.ccsf.edu/dam/ccsf/documen...icianMajor.pdf

----------


## anaconda

> http://www.ebay.com/itm/1971-BMW-R-S...3D201908480408


This would be a very appropriate vehicle for me...expressive of who I am. It's called an "Air Head!"

Unfortunately, I do not yet possess the wrench skills to take on much of a "project bike."

----------


## anaconda

> 


Now this is more up my alley.

----------


## anaconda

> Apparently there is a wave of motorcycle thefts in the UK.
> 
> _Grand Tour's_ James May weighs in:
> 
> 
> 
> *BIKE THEFT - SOLVED*
> 
> https://drivetribe.com/p/VNj_vFUgTNK...RLWQwr14htY-MQ
> ...


In anticipation of this, I looked into motorcycle anti-theft solutions a while back. There are several. One cool idea was where you get a cheap smart phone and put it somewhere discreet on board your bike and install this app that uses the phone's GPS capability. If your bike is moved from a very small and specific geometric perimeter the phone starts texting or calling you. I believe it then uses the GPS to track the bike's location. I suppose if the thieves discover the phone too soon than the strategy fails.

----------


## anaconda

I see this now going on over on the Embarcadero on the waterfront in San Francisco.

----------


## tod evans

> This would be a very appropriate vehicle for me...expressive of who I am. It's called an "Air Head!"
> 
> Unfortunately, I do not yet possess the wrench skills to take on much of a "project bike."


For the money you could pay someone to instruct you on a total rebuild and own a cycle you could work on 100% by yourself....All for less than $6k

----------


## tod evans



----------


## anaconda

> 


Sounds good starting at 1:09. Body looks to have zero dents. Would be interesting to know what subsequent restorations were done.

----------


## Danke

> 


I bet donnay is jealous.

----------


## Anti Federalist

> I bet donnay is jealous.


Tod posted that, not me...

----------


## Anti Federalist



----------


## Anti Federalist



----------


## Anti Federalist



----------


## Anti Federalist



----------


## Danke

,.,

----------


## Origanalist

> ,.,


Takes some real talent to win  a guy on a bike with a A-10, I wonder if he was scared.

----------


## Danke

> Takes some real talent to win  a guy on a bike with a A-10, I wonder if he was scared.


Ya, I cried  a little bit, just like when hunters take down prey with high powered rifles.

----------


## Origanalist

> Ya, I cried  a little bit, just like when hunters take down prey with high powered rifles.


So, the pilot ate him?

----------


## Origanalist

I'm on the bike commuting for now. The job is big enough I'm there for a little while so I can leave my equipment there and the weather is good for a few days. Sweet.

----------


## anaconda

> 


Smoking too much out of the tail pipe? The guy in the video with the Mercedez diesel bike has got no smoke out of the tail pipe.

----------


## anaconda

> 


So, how come they don't make production diesel motorcycles?

----------


## Anti Federalist

> So, how come they don't make production diesel motorcycles?


There have been some over the years, and some newer attempts, generally because diesels are heavier and have less power for a given weight.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diesel_motorcycle

Here's a US Marine Corp diesel Kawasaki KLR650.

[img]https://static01.********/images/2008/02/24/automobiles/600-klr.jpg[/img]

Gets 100 MPG and can do 90mph.

Sadly, next to impossible to find one, as the company only converted 214 for the USMC.

----------


## Anti Federalist

> Smoking too much out of the tail pipe? The guy in the video with the Mercedez diesel bike has got no smoke out of the tail pipe.


Probably has not gotten the fuel injector/turbo mix right yet.

Different injectors inject more or less fuel for a given power range and turbo boost or not.

Better to go too rich and get smoke than too lean and wreck the engine.

----------


## anaconda

> Probably has not gotten the fuel injector/turbo mix right yet.
> 
> Different injectors inject more or less fuel for a given power range and turbo boost or not.
> 
> Better to go too rich and get smoke than too lean and wreck the engine.


I've got a lot to learn about engines.

----------


## tod evans

> I've got a lot to learn about engines.


The fewest moving parts and simplified electronics might be a good place to start....

----------


## Anti Federalist

> I've got a lot to learn about engines.


And that's old style "fixed" injectors.

New computerized diesel and direct injection gas engines have infinitely variable injection rates controlled by the engine's ECM.

----------


## Anti Federalist

> The fewest moving parts and simplified *no* electronics might be a good place to start....


FTFY

----------


## tod evans

> FTFY


Gimmie gas and a mag....

I'm just more familiar with it than oil and injector pumps...

----------


## Anti Federalist

> Gimmie gas and a mag....
> 
> I'm just more familiar with it than oil and injector pumps...


This is what almost all diesels used prior to Uncle Sucker's _fatwas_ and computers...it was dirt simple, efficient and reliable to the point of being bulletproof.

The pump and fuel system in this video is an almost exact replica of the fuel system in my John Deere backhoe.

----------


## Anti Federalist

Unit injectors are also used, they used to be driven by the camshaft but now are almost universally electronic.

----------


## Anti Federalist

Would love to build one of these.

----------


## anaconda

> The fewest moving parts and simplified electronics might be a good place to start....


I'm thinking seriously about one of these I spotted on Craigslist in my area. 2007 black Kymco People S 200. $1250. 4400 miles. Carburetor. Forced air cooled. Kick start back up. Parts are insanely cheap. 256 lbs. Like the idea of the 16" wheels. Gutless but bulletproof GY6 based 163cc engine (even though they brand it a "200"). Might hit 60 MPH on a good day with no headwind. Slightly freeway legal for CA just in case I need an exit or two occasionally. Whaddya think for a first bike?

----------


## Anti Federalist

> I'm thinking seriously about one of these I spotted on Craigslist in my area. $1250. 4400 miles. Carburetor. Forced air cooled. Kick start back up. Parts are insanely cheap. Like the idea of the 16" wheels. Gutless but bulletproof GY6 based 163cc engine. Might hit 60 MPH on a good day with no headwind. Slightly freeway legal for CA just in case I need an exit or two occasionally. Whaddya think for a first bike?


I know you asked tod, but based on what you've told us, I think you'd do fine with it.

----------


## anaconda

> I know you asked tod, but based on what you've told us, I think you'd do fine with it.


I'm thinking at $1250 with zero riding experience I can't go too far wrong. Even though it would require delaying learning to shift. I could learn to ride, lean into turns, get smart about how traffic works, do some generic maintenance, etc. If I total it I'm only out $1250. And if I don't I think I could resell it for at least $900.

----------


## anaconda

> Would love to build one of these.


I'm getting a broken link on your photo. Maybe it's just my PC?

----------


## anaconda

> The fewest moving parts and simplified electronics might be a good place to start....


This reviewer (the second discussion in the video regarding the 2017 Honda Rebel 300) makes an interesting statement about carburetors vs. electronic fuel injection at 6:10 in the video. He says carbs "keep you wrenching instead of riding." Also numerous other comments in his monologue implying that a more technologically advanced machine can in many ways can provide for a more confidence inspiring, safer, smoother, less frustrating and distracting situation to devote all of one's focus on confidently learning how to ride (i.e. by utilizing EFI, ABS disc brakes, liquid cooling, ergonomics, smooth throttle response, etc.). BTW this is probably my top choice for a first bike, without any consideration for $$$. But I think if I take a motorcycle class or two over at City College of San Francisco (cheap) that carb maintenance, rebuilds, or replacements would likely be a no-brainer. But it sounds like carburetors will soon go the way of the dinosaurs. But no harm in learning both technologies, right?

----------


## anaconda

> I know you asked tod, but based on what you've told us, I think you'd do fine with it.


I meant for the question to be addressed to all of you experienced motorcycle geeks. I was just pivoting off of the simplicity theme which, of course, you have emphasized throughout.

----------


## anaconda

> ,.,


Was this part of the Bradley Manning dump?

----------


## anaconda

> This is what almost all diesels used prior to Uncle Sucker's _fatwas_ and computers...it was dirt simple, efficient and reliable to the point of being bulletproof.
> 
> The pump and fuel system in this video is an almost exact replica of the fuel system in my John Deere backhoe.


Nice video.

----------


## Anti Federalist

> This reviewer (the second discussion in the video regarding the 2017 Honda Rebel 300) makes an interesting statement about carburetors vs. electronic fuel injection at 6:10 in the video. He says carbs "keep you wrenching instead of riding." Also numerous other comments in his monologue implying that a more technologically advanced machine can in many ways can provide for a more confidence inspiring, safer, smoother, less frustrating and distracting situation to devote all of one's focus on confidently learning how to ride (i.e. by utilizing EFI, ABS disc brakes, liquid cooling, ergonomics, smooth throttle response, etc.). BTW this is probably my top choice for a first bike, without any consideration for $$$. But I think if I take a motorcycle class or two over at City College of San Francisco (cheap) that carb maintenance, rebuilds, or replacements would likely be a no-brainer. But it sounds like carburetors will soon go the way of the dinosaurs. But no harm in learning both technologies, right?


Again, like water cooling, all true.

The modern, electronic, fuel injected, ECM controlled engines are a glory to behold when they are working properly.

It when they don't, that the problems arise.

Incredibly sophisticated and complex systems are also incredibly difficult to troubleshoot and repair when they stop working properly.

To me, this goes against everything the "zen" of motorcycling is all about**: simplicity, self reliance and freedom.

----------


## tod evans

> This reviewer (the second discussion in the video regarding the 2017 Honda Rebel 300) makes an interesting statement about carburetors vs. electronic fuel injection at 6:10 in the video. He says carbs "keep you wrenching instead of riding." Also numerous other comments in his monologue implying that a more technologically advanced machine can in many ways can provide for a more confidence inspiring, safer, smoother, less frustrating and distracting situation to devote all of one's focus on confidently learning how to ride (i.e. by utilizing EFI, ABS disc brakes, liquid cooling, ergonomics, smooth throttle response, etc.). BTW this is probably my top choice for a first bike, without any consideration for $$$. But I think if I take a motorcycle class or two over at City College of San Francisco (cheap) that carb maintenance, rebuilds, or replacements would likely be a no-brainer. But it sounds like carburetors will soon go the way of the dinosaurs. But no harm in learning both technologies, right?


All those electronics are the cats ass when they're new but just like any electronic device they're prone to glitches/intermittent failure or complete failure especially on a used and older vehicle...

You may think I'm completely nuts but there's lots to be said for learning to drive/ride a vehicle with manual drum brakes and no gizmos....

Disc brakes will be a night-n-day experience, more cylinders, a wet clutch, overhead cams, fuel injection.............Each 'improvement' changes how a vehicle behaves and how the human interacts with it...

If you start with techno-gizmo marvels you'll quickly become dependent on them....

----------


## ghengis86

> This reviewer (the second discussion in the video regarding the 2017 Honda Rebel 300) makes an interesting statement about carburetors vs. electronic fuel injection at 6:10 in the video. He says carbs "keep you wrenching instead of riding." Also numerous other comments in his monologue implying that a more technologically advanced machine can in many ways can provide for a more confidence inspiring, safer, smoother, less frustrating and distracting situation to devote all of one's focus on confidently learning how to ride (i.e. by utilizing EFI, ABS disc brakes, liquid cooling, ergonomics, smooth throttle response, etc.). BTW this is probably my top choice for a first bike, without any consideration for $$$. But I think if I take a motorcycle class or two over at City College of San Francisco (cheap) that carb maintenance, rebuilds, or replacements would likely be a no-brainer. But it sounds like carburetors will soon go the way of the dinosaurs. But no harm in learning both technologies, right?


Why take a class?  There's plenty of resources online for free. Back when I had my first quad, I just took it all apart, cleaned it, put it back together and the set all the screws per the manual and tuned from there. There's always a troubleshooting section that tells you how to adjust for rich/lean on top and bottom. Not that hard and teaching yourself is a great skill to have. Classes are fine and dandy, I just think you'd be better off financially and building skills and self-confidence to do it yourself.

----------


## ghengis86

> I'm thinking at $1250 with zero riding experience I can't go too far wrong. Even though it would require delaying learning to shift. I could learn to ride, lean into turns, get smart about how traffic works, do some generic maintenance, etc. If I total it I'm only out $1250. And if I don't I think I could resell it for at least $900.


Yeah, I think it's time you just pull the trigger. It's cheap, simple and easy. You're not over your head and should you determine in a few weeks to move up in size, you're not out much cash at all. I say go for it and get started on the learning curve and have fun!

----------


## Origanalist

> I'm thinking seriously about one of these I spotted on Craigslist in my area. 2007 black Kymco People S 200. $1250. 4400 miles. Carburetor. Forced air cooled. Kick start back up. Parts are insanely cheap. 256 lbs. Like the idea of the 16" wheels. Gutless but bulletproof GY6 based 163cc engine (even though they brand it a "200"). Might hit 60 MPH on a good day with no headwind. Slightly freeway legal for CA just in case I need an exit or two occasionally. Whaddya think for a first bike?


Do it. Jump in and get your feet wet. Next year you can upgrade if you feel the need.

----------


## tod evans

> Yeah, I think it's time you just pull the trigger. It's cheap, simple and easy. You're not over your head and should you determine in a few weeks to move up in size, you're not out much cash at all. I say go for it and get started on the learning curve and have fun!





> Do it. Jump in and get your feet wet. Next year you can upgrade if you feel the need.


I'm going against the trend here....

Don't buy some underpowered piece of imported $#@! to 'learn' on...

Best case scenario you blow it up before some idiot in a cage flattens you like a pancake and you're out money and desire....

Learn on something that will carry you down the road with a modicum of style and class and most importantly power.

----------


## Origanalist

> I'm going against the trend here....
> 
> Don't buy some underpowered piece of imported $#@! to 'learn' on...
> 
> Best case scenario you blow it up before some idiot in a cage flattens you like a pancake and you're out money and desire....
> 
> Learn on something that will carry you down the road with a modicum of style and class and most importantly power.


Lol. My first bike was a GS 850 that I hardly got to ride, needed work. My first bike that I spent any time on was the 1500 goldwing, but it sounds like anaconda is going to be doing most of his riding in extremely urban settings. Are you planning on getting out on the bay bridge, freeways ect. anaconda?

----------


## tod evans

Worth the 20 min.....

----------


## anaconda

> Lol. My first bike was a GS 850 that I hardly got to ride, needed work. My first bike that I spent any time on was the 1500 goldwing, but it sounds like anaconda is going to be doing most of his riding in extremely urban settings. Are you planning on getting out on the bay bridge, freeways ect. anaconda?


Bay Bridge & freeways in CA require a minimum of 150cc. I'd like to at least be legal to utilize them minimally. But I think I would need closer to 500cc to expect to access them with any frequency.

----------


## anaconda

> I'm going against the trend here....
> 
> Don't buy some underpowered piece of imported $#@! to 'learn' on...
> 
> Best case scenario you blow it up before some idiot in a cage flattens you like a pancake and you're out money and desire....
> 
> Learn on something that will carry you down the road with a modicum of style and class and most importantly power.


There are three Taiwanese companies that are very nearly, if not fully, in the class with the "big four (Honda, Kawasaki, Suzuki, and Yamaha)." They are Sym, PGO, and Kymco. The bike I posted a photo of is a Kymco.

----------


## tod evans

> There are three Taiwanese companies that are very nearly, if not fully, in the class with the "big four (Honda, Kawasaki, Suzuki, and Yamaha)." They are Sym, PGO, and Kymco. The bike I posted a photo of is a Kymco.


I'm not an advocate for any of those you named, especially the 'big four'....

In my opinion they all four escalated the disposa society we all suffer under....

It's obvious you're pretty set on spending your money in that venue so I'll try and hold my tongue.....

----------


## Danke

> Was this part of the Bradley Manning dump?


No, just my solution to noisy bikes.

----------


## anaconda

> I'm not an advocate for any of those you named, especially the 'big four'....
> 
> In my opinion they all four escalated the disposa society we all suffer under....
> 
> It's obvious you're pretty set on spending your money in that venue so I'll try and hold my tongue.....


No, no. I am quite intrigued and interested in what you have to say. Seriously. And I've flip-flopped more than Mitt Romney on what bike to get. I'd like to hear your thoughts on this. The only thing you've said that I take some adverse issue with is the "style and class" motive. I don't think I care too much what others think about what I'm riding. But that may not be exactly what you were referring to.

----------


## anaconda

> No, just my solution to noisy bikes.


You have my permission.

----------


## afwjam

> I'm not an advocate for any of those you named, especially the 'big four'....
> 
> In my opinion they all four escalated the disposa society we all suffer under....
> 
> It's obvious you're pretty set on spending your money in that venue so I'll try and hold my tongue.....


kymco makes a great bike with high quality components, they made motors for Honda for many years. Sym and the others not so great...

----------


## anaconda

> I'm not an advocate for any of those you named, especially the 'big four'....
> 
> In my opinion they all four escalated the disposa society we all suffer under....
> 
> It's obvious you're pretty set on spending your money in that venue so I'll try and hold my tongue.....


For example, it's my understanding that Harley Davidson are traditionally perpetually over-heated and broken down. So I'm wondering if their parts and systems are part of the "disposa?" The big four are known for reliability and performance. The opposite of disposa.

----------


## afwjam

> Would love to build one of these.


Thats a two stroke Detroit right? Great motors.

----------


## afwjam

> I'm thinking seriously about one of these I spotted on Craigslist in my area. 2007 black Kymco People S 200. $1250. 4400 miles. Carburetor. Forced air cooled. Kick start back up. Parts are insanely cheap. 256 lbs. Like the idea of the 16" wheels. Gutless but bulletproof GY6 based 163cc engine (even though they brand it a "200"). Might hit 60 MPH on a good day with no headwind. Slightly freeway legal for CA just in case I need an exit or two occasionally. Whaddya think for a first bike?


Kymco makes a quality piece of kit, especially for the money.

----------


## anaconda

> kymco makes a great bike with high quality components, they made motors for Honda for many years. Sym and the others not so great...


People rave about the Sym HD 200. And the American company that imports and brands PGO's scooters is called Genuine headquartered in Chicago. The Genuine "Buddy" also has stellar reviews from their owners. They also import the Indian manufacturer LML's copy of the Piaggio PX, having formerly made Piaggio's PX scooters for the Indian market and manufactured parts for Piaggio (Vespa).

----------


## Anti Federalist

> Thats a two stroke Detroit right? Great motors.


Yes, in this case a 4-53 Detroit (4 cylinders 53 cid per cylinder)

That seems to be the most common, since it will fit easily.

But I've seen 6-53s 6-92s and even an inline 6-71 installed.

----------


## afwjam

> This reviewer (the second discussion in the video regarding the 2017 Honda Rebel 300) makes an interesting statement about carburetors vs. electronic fuel injection at 6:10 in the video. He says carbs "keep you wrenching instead of riding." Also numerous other comments in his monologue implying that a more technologically advanced machine can in many ways can provide for a more confidence inspiring, safer, smoother, less frustrating and distracting situation to devote all of one's focus on confidently learning how to ride (i.e. by utilizing EFI, ABS disc brakes, liquid cooling, ergonomics, smooth throttle response, etc.). BTW this is probably my top choice for a first bike, without any consideration for $$$. But I think if I take a motorcycle class or two over at City College of San Francisco (cheap) that carb maintenance, rebuilds, or replacements would likely be a no-brainer. But it sounds like carburetors will soon go the way of the dinosaurs. But no harm in learning both technologies, right?


Avoid ethonal(eats the float needle) and drain the carb when you store for more then a month. No problems. Fuel injection pretty much always works, biggest problem is usually the $#@!ty fuel maps and electronic throttles some come with, nothing worse then the digital on off snatch of a poorly mapped fuel injection system. My triumphs have had fuel injection since the 90's and it's a thing of beauty. My 1991 k75s has fuel injection and abs, never had a problem and it always starts even after sitting for months and 50k odd miles.

----------


## afwjam

> People rave about the Sym HD 200 and the American company that imports and brands PGO's scooters is called Genuine headquartered in Chicago. The Genuine "Buddy" also has stellar reviews from their owners.



I understand and I used to sell them and wrench on them. Have a kymco under the house I'm hopping up for a buddy who rides sym right now. Honda>Kymco>--- everyone else. All the components, suspension, brakes, fit and finish, general build quality and ride quality is superior on the kymco. For the price kymco has no competition. The sym is better then china, the cheaper Taiwan brands are getting better, kymco even seems to be getting worse, but still no comparison.

----------


## afwjam

> Yes, in this case a 4-53 Detroit (4 cylinders 53 cid per cylinder)
> 
> That seems to be the most common, since it will fit easily.
> 
> But I've seen 6-53s 6-92s and even an inline 6-71 installed.


There's a reason the army still runs the two strokes....

----------


## anaconda

> Avoid ethonal(eats the float needle)


Unfortunately not an option here in The Peoples' Republic of Kalifornia.

----------


## Anti Federalist

> There's a reason the army still runs the two strokes....


Railroads and marine service still use the two stroke EMDs as well.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EMD_710

----------


## Anti Federalist

> Unfortunately not an option here in The Peoples' Republic of Kalifornia.


He made a good point...any small foreign engine, especially one not made by the "big four" is susceptible to ethanol damage.

Use a high quality additive to mitigate damage to tanks, lines, carbs, injectors and so on.

*Especially* if it's a two stroker.

----------


## afwjam

> Unfortunately not an option here in The Peoples' Republic of Kalifornia.


What do they sell down by the recreational docks? Ethonal free can be stored for a while.

----------


## tod evans

> What do they sell down by the recreational docks? Ethonal free can be stored for a while.


Avgas is an option too.

----------


## afwjam

> Avgas is an option too.


'Especially in a modern fuel injected bike, it makes more power.

----------


## tod evans

> No, no. I am quite intrigued and interested in what you have to say. Seriously. And I've flip-flopped more than Mitt Romney on what bike to get. I'd like to hear your thoughts on this. The only thing you've said that I take some adverse issue with is the "style and class" motive. I don't think I care too much what others think about what I'm riding. But that may not be exactly what you were referring to.


This is a good/great starter bike that will hold its value or appreciate, is easier to work on than the BMW I showed you earlier, is small enough to maneuver yet powerful enough to get you out of trouble.....The company is still in business and parts are available from the manufacturer as well as aftermarket....And it's classy

----------


## tod evans

> 'Especially in a modern fuel injected bike, it makes more power.


Or with 13-1

----------


## Anti Federalist

> This is a good/great starter bike that will hold its value or appreciate, is easier to work on than the BMW I showed you earlier, is small enough to maneuver yet powerful enough to get you out of trouble.....The company is still in business and parts are available from the manufacturer as well as aftermarket....And it's classy


Was my first bike.

----------


## afwjam

> This is a good/great starter bike that will hold its value or appreciate, is easier to work on than the BMW I showed you earlier, is small enough to maneuver yet powerful enough to get you out of trouble.....The company is still in business and parts are available from the manufacturer as well as aftermarket....And it's classy


im a triumph guy, I loved my trident and the new triples are the best, but about that drum brake and the oil weep on the lower case

----------


## afwjam

> Or with 13-1


Thas a lot a pressure

----------


## anaconda

> This is a good/great starter bike that will hold its value or appreciate, is easier to work on than the BMW I showed you earlier, is small enough to maneuver yet powerful enough to get you out of trouble.....The company is still in business and parts are available from the manufacturer as well as aftermarket....And it's classy


Is buying a 45 year old bike a good idea for a novice with no wrenching experience?

----------


## afwjam

> Is buying a 45 year old bike a good idea for a novice with no wrenching experience?


Not that bike lol, I have two of them in pieces in a storage unit, prolly stay that way and I'm a decent wrench. �� lol 

Unless I find a featherbed for the one good motor.

----------


## tod evans

> im a triumph guy, I loved my trident and the new triples are the best, but about that drum brake and the oil weep on the lower case


Can you think of a better bike to learn on?

Simple to wrench, no 'puters carbs drums and a chain, spokes to knock out of true fork seals that contain oil instead of air or gas.....

----------


## tod evans

> Is buying a 45 year old bike a good idea for a novice with no wrenching experience?


It'd be a learning experience that not many youngsters get today....

My kid will learn the old stuff 1st then if he wants the headaches he can go new(er)....

I'm steering him toward a 74 knuckle on a hardtail but you don't like those.....

----------


## Anti Federalist

> im a triumph guy, I loved my trident and the new triples are the best, but about that drum brake and the oil weep on the lower case


Or that Joe Lucas - Prince of Darkness electrical system.

----------


## afwjam

> Can you think of a better bike to learn on?
> 
> Simple to wrench, no 'puters carbs drums and a chain, spokes to knock out of true fork seals that contain oil instead of air or gas.....


Any 80's or 90's Japanese standard or enduro. I recommend the Kawasaki KLR 650 as the best bike ever made, dead simple/reliable/easy to work on. Does everything good, excels at nothing.

----------


## afwjam

> Or that Joe Lucas - Prince of Darkness electrical system.


They were well ahead of the curve and invented intermittent wipers and auto dimming headlights before anyone ever thought of the idea.

----------


## afwjam



----------


## tod evans

Here's one for AF;





And what I hope to get built for son before he graduates (6yrs)

----------


## anaconda

> I recommend the Kawasaki KLR 650 as the best bike ever made


I like the idea of being able to flatfoot, perhaps even with a modest bend at the knee. Wouldn't one need to be about 6' 7" to accomplish that with a KLR 650?

----------


## anaconda

> 


He left us hanging as to why a pickup truck in Hawaii must be a Nissan or Toyota. Jeez that BMW motorcycle sure sounded smooth!

----------


## tod evans

> He left us hanging as to why a pickup truck in Hawaii must be a Nissan or Toyota. Jeez that BMW motorcycle sure sounded smooth!


You won't go wrong with a Beemer....

----------


## afwjam

> I like the idea of being able to flatfoot, perhaps even with a modest bend at the knee. Wouldn't one need to be about 6' 7" to accomplish that with a KLR 650?


Im 6'3" and flat foot, my after market suspension rides high and is sprung for my 240 and the wife. They make lowering links for the ladies, with 11" of travel gives plenty to work with. Stock the bike is sprung for like a 140 pound Japanese man, I recommend respringing and setting sag for your weight. Get the doohickey changed too, if it has not been done. Is dead cheap, fun and reliable otherwise you can fix it in a Home Depot parking lot.

----------


## anaconda

> Im 6'3" and flat foot, my after market suspension rides high and is sprung for my 240 and the wife. They make lowering links for the ladies, with 11" of travel gives plenty to work with. Stock the bike is sprung for like a 140 pound Japanese man, I recommend respringing and setting sag for your weight. Get the doohickey changed too, if it has not been done. Is dead cheap, fun and reliable otherwise you can fix it in a Home Depot parking lot.


Thanks for the insights. What's the doohickey, if I may ask?

----------


## afwjam

Balancer chain tensioner lever, prone to breaking and hosing the engine, easy fix from eagle Mike.

----------


## afwjam

They made a USMC diesel KLR which would be tits in a mad max situation.

----------


## anaconda

> It's obvious you're pretty set on spending your money in that venue so I'll try and hold my tongue.....


I'm pretty enamored with the idea of a very low seat height for the stability of flex-kneed flat footing, so something relatively affordable like this is not completely out of the question (currently on Craigslist - quite a good deal on this I believe):

https://sfbay.craigslist.org/sby/mcy/6122871555.html

These too I sorta like (another good deal here I believe...):

https://sfbay.craigslist.org/pen/mcy/6117709421.html

----------


## afwjam

This guys KLR videos are funny

----------


## anaconda

If I get a cruiser I will almost certainly be sticking a top case on it. Is that considered blasphemy?

----------


## afwjam

> If I get a cruiser I will almost certainly be sticking a top case on it. Is that considered blasphemy?


thats gay as $#@!. The only thing to do with a cruiser is bob it and paint all the chrome black. Cruisers aren't for practicality, mostly for getting pussy.

----------


## anaconda

> thats gay as $#@!. The only thing to do with a cruiser is bob it and paint all the chrome black. Cruisers aren't for practicality, mostly for getting pussy.


Awesome. I want to be gay. And carry stuff around like a scooter can. Don't H.D. riders usually dress up like gay pirates anyhow?

----------


## Anti Federalist

2017 Triumph Bonneville Bobber $12400 MSRP



https://www.cycletrader.com/dealers/...RDER-121464041

----------


## Natural Citizen

Hmmm. That's nice. Wonder if you can put a two seater and some pegs on it. 




>

----------


## Origanalist

> Hmmm. That's nice. Wonder if you can put a two seater and some pegs on it.

----------


## Anti Federalist

> 


Hahahah...yah, that was my first reaction as well.

----------


## Anti Federalist

Ok, so all this new bike talk has got me going...

Here's where my tastes are running right now:

The Victory "Eight Ball"...they had one of the these at the dealer, Victory line is being discontinued by Polaris, reduced for quick sale, new left over, to $8800.



The HD Softail "Slim" - MSRP $15000 - Downside, new design which means all computerized...



The classic HD softail, which is dated looking but I still love that pseudo chopper look. Gently used, non computerized, non emission model for around $5-6000



Or bite the bullet and undertake a new construction?

----------


## Anti Federalist

> Was my first bike.


Here's almost an exact duplicate of how it looked once in the hardtail frame.

Minus the oil tank, I blanked off and tapped fittings in the frame to use as an oil tank.



Mine had a little more rake, was all black, (chrome don't get you home) and had a girder front.

----------


## Natural Citizen

lol. Yeah, I know. I just been one seatin it too long, man. lolol.


>

----------


## TheCount

> Bay Bridge & freeways in CA require a minimum of 150cc. I'd like to at least be legal to utilize them minimally. But I think I would need closer to 500cc to expect to access them with any frequency.


You couldn't pay me to take anything 150 or 200cc onto a California freeway.

If traffic is 100% stopped you'd be fine, but if it's flowing - especially off and on - you'd never ever keep up with traffic.  You'd create a hazard.


Edit:  Let me explain.  That 200cc scooter, for example, has 15 hp and 11 ft/lb of torque.  It weighs 297 pounds dry.  Let's be generous and say that you, all your gear, whatever's in your top box, and all fluids in the bike combined weigh 203 pounds total.  That puts the total weight at 500 pounds.

That's 33.3 pounds per horsepower.  Even the very $#@!tiest econobox of a car is a rocketship compared to that scooter.

The Smart Fortwo, which is a pile of garbage masquerading as a car, has 23.0 pounds per horsepower.  It, one of the slowest cars you can buy, is 1/3rd more powerful than that scooter.

The Mitsubishi Mirage, which is evidently the very slowest car you can buy in the United States and takes 12.8 seconds to get from 0 to 60 mph has 29 lbs per horsepower and is therefore still more than 10% faster than that scooter.


Not only that, those cars have multiple gears with which to use that horsepower.  You, with one gear from 0 to 60-whatever, will be the absolute slowest thing on the freeway.  In my opinion, that is a dangerous situation for anyone on two wheels.



In contrast, a 300cc bike like the Ninja 300 or CB300F make 25-30 hp but weigh the same-ish. The Rebel 300 makes 25-ish hp but weighs a hundred pounds more.  They're fully twice as fast as the scooter... and still considered 'too slow' for the freeway by some.  Those bikes are about as fast as a normal car.  500cc bikes are in the 40-ish hp realm.

----------


## afwjam

> 2017 Triumph Bonneville Bobber $12400 MSRP
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.cycletrader.com/dealers/...RDER-121464041


Thats more like it, I like. Tough.

----------


## afwjam

> Awesome. I want to be gay. And carry stuff around like a scooter can. Don't H.D. riders usually dress up like gay pirates anyhow?


'A lot of them do this is true, but you can't put a top case on a chopper, leather saddle bags with tassels go for it. Get a scooter, a 250 would be perfect for California even on the highway, plenty of storage, plenty practicality, nothing gay about it.

----------


## afwjam

If it's going to be a Harley I would love a bobber, especially a classic flathead total loss, or a WLA. XRs are pretty cool too. 




Tough


Really I'm a sucker for the Art Deco style and fenders of the chief, park it next to my duesenberg.

----------


## anaconda

> you can't put a top case on a chopper, leather saddle bags with tassels go for it.


For the sake of argument, I don't see anything wrong with this whatsoever:



Or this:

----------


## anaconda

Real men ride Vespas:

----------


## afwjam

> For the sake of argument, I don't see anything wrong with this whatsoever:
> 
> 
> 
> Or this:


That's a full dress bagger, another matter. The sportster is an abomination.

----------


## afwjam

> Real men ride Vespas:


yes they do, I had a rally 200 myself. Always partial to the lambretta.



I competed two years in ESRA with a hopped up kymco super 9



nothing was more fun or turned more heads then the Italjet(piaggio group) Dragster 180, it had malossi everything and was good for 100+ mph, as much fun as a big bore two stroke snow machine. 



'Here's my firecat I had up in the arctic

----------


## anaconda

> That's a full dress bagger, another matter. The sportster is an abomination.


Is this an abomination?..

----------


## anaconda

> The sportster is an abomination.


Practical. Why not have some good storage space?

----------


## afwjam

I guess a metric cruiser can have a top case if you must, please don't. 

Heres half my trip to work on a DRZ 400(another great first bike)




trip up Mauna Kea on the KLR and round the backside




I mostly deal in dualport bikes these days, though I feel the itch for a Speed Triple.

----------


## Origanalist

> Ok, so all this new bike talk has got me going...
> 
> Here's where my tastes are running right now:
> 
> The Victory "Eight Ball"...they had one of the these at the dealer, Victory line is being discontinued by Polaris, reduced for quick sale, new left over, to $8800.
> 
> 
> 
> The HD Softail "Slim" - MSRP $15000 - Downside, new design which means all computerized...
> ...


That eight ball looks to be a fine ride. Of course I would take those monkey bars off it...

----------


## Origanalist

> Real men ride Vespas:


Looks pretty gay too me.

----------


## tod evans

> That eight ball looks to be a fine ride. Of course I would take those monkey bars off it...


$8800.00 for a 103.........

That's a steal...

S&S is getting almost that much for a long block.

----------


## Origanalist

> $8800.00 for a 103.........
> 
> That's a steal...
> 
> S&S is getting almost that much for a long block.


Yep, my thoughts exactly. And plenty of opportunity to 'personalize' it.

----------


## Anti Federalist

> $8800.00 for a 103.........
> 
> That's a steal...
> 
> S&S is getting almost that much for a long block.


I know, right?

They were blowing them out at what was probably below cost.

More than likely gone now...but I think I will ride over this afternoon and see.

----------


## Anti Federalist

> If it's going to be a Harley I would love a bobber, especially a classic flathead total loss, or a WLA. XRs are pretty cool too. 
> 
> 
> 
> Tough


Oh yeah, that one speaks to me..."Rat Bike" vibe, no visible oil tank, no battery, Morris Magneto ignition.

Tough is right...tough as steel balls.

----------


## pcosmar

> 2017 Triumph Bonneville Bobber $12400 MSRP
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.cycletrader.com/dealers/...RDER-121464041


That is so me..
Change to single carb, and buck horn bars.

----------


## Anti Federalist

> That is so me..
> Change to single carb, and buck horn bars.


If you look close Pete, it looks to me like they are still, to this day, using Amal slide valve carbs.

It's a shame they swapped the gear/rear brake around to the "right" sides, and the water cooling I don't care for, but it's still a sweet ride.

----------


## afwjam

> If you look close Pete, it looks to me like they are still, to this day, using Amal slide valve carbs.
> 
> It's a shame they swapped the gear/rear brake around to the "right" sides, and the water cooling I don't care for, but it's still a sweet ride.


no sir those "carbs" are throttle bodies, that monster twin is fuel injected. I rode one of the thruxtons a few month ago, great motor, wheelies were easy, I think they all have the 270 degree crank now, no more classic Bonnie sound.

----------


## afwjam

> Oh yeah, that one speaks to me..."Rat Bike" vibe, no visible oil tank, no battery, Morris Magneto ignition.
> 
> Tough is right...tough as steel balls.


'You might get tired of the oil on your leg, but that never kept me off my bosses flathead any chance I got.

----------


## Anti Federalist

> no sir those "carbs" are throttle bodies, that monster twin is fuel injected. I rode one of the thruxtons a few month ago, great motor, wheelies were easy, I think they all have the 270 degree crank now, no more classic Bonnie sound.


Aha yeah I should have known that.

And they opposed the pistons? 

ETA - Help me out here, it's been so long I'm trying to recall without Screwgling...

The British horizontal twins all used a parallel crank and piston configuration: meaning that both pistons traveled up and down at the same time, Norton, BSA, Triumph...but some fired at the same time, Norton comes to mind, but the Triumph's fired opposed, one piston would be the top of the exhaust stroke and the other at the top of the compression/ignition stroke.

----------


## Anti Federalist

> You couldn't pay me to take anything 150 or 200cc onto a California freeway.
> 
> If traffic is 100% stopped you'd be fine, but if it's flowing - especially off and on - you'd never ever keep up with traffic.  You'd create a hazard.
> 
> 
> Edit:  Let me explain.  That 200cc scooter, for example, has 15 hp and 11 ft/lb of torque.  It weighs 297 pounds dry.  Let's be generous and say that you, all your gear, whatever's in your top box, and all fluids in the bike combined weigh 203 pounds total.  That puts the total weight at 500 pounds.
> 
> That's 33.3 pounds per horsepower.  Even the very $#@!tiest econobox of a car is a rocketship compared to that scooter.
> 
> ...

----------


## afwjam

Hold on a second... what you say may be true about a gy6 150cc clone, but a real 200 or 250 cc scoot will have no trouble out accelerating traffic. It's not a single speed, it's a continuously variable transmission which means it's always in the power band and it always goes, just like my snow machine. A good 250 scooter can hit 80 mph, no more acceleration left there, but it will pull hard off the line faster then a $#@!box, same for the 200 although make the top speed 65-70 with no more acceleration. A 150 can't get past 55 or  so but it will still pull harder then most $#@!boxes off the line. I've had one of those 650 silver wings up to 110+ I would say any 250-450 scooter would make an excellent highway cruiser and they would pull from traffic every time and they have plenty of storage for beer, a top case is fine. I could easily cruise 70 mph on the kymco people 250, I don't think the kymco with the 150+ cc gy6 would be worth much, though the classic air cooled 150 cc kymco motored people was a great machine for everything but highway. I've ridden two hours on the highway with a italjet torpedo 125 with the piaggio motor, it was doing 55-60 the whole time. 

Now a italjet formula 125 is a twin cylinder two stroke and it will fly right up to 75...

----------


## afwjam

> Aha yeah I should have known that.
> 
> And they opposed the pistons? 
> 
> ETA - Help me out here, it's been so long I'm trying to recall without Screwgling...
> 
> The British horizontal twins all used a parallel crank and piston configuration: meaning that both pistons traveled up and down at the same time, Norton, BSA, Triumph...but some fired at the same time, Norton comes to mind, but the Triumph's fired opposed, one piston would be the top of the exhaust stroke and the other at the top of the compression/ignition stroke.


Yes you are right, classic bonnie is a 360 degree crank, sounded even and very rythmic. The first new older generation thruxton and scrambler introduced the 270 crank and now I believe all the 1200 motors are 270, more of a staccato sound. 270 brings the torque curve down in the rev range, better motor really, just don't sound right.

----------


## Anti Federalist

So...2006 HD Softail, 10,000 miles, last year with carb, asking $8200.

----------


## Anti Federalist

> lol. Yeah, I know. I just been one seatin it too long, man. lolol.


A *C*harlie *P*apa would solve the problem.

----------


## tod evans

> So...2006 HD Softail, 10,000 miles, last year with carb, asking $8200.


Get the Victory...

----------


## TheCount

> If you look close Pete, it looks to me like they are still, to this day, using Amal slide valve carbs.


It's a twin throttle body system which has been intentionally shaped to look like carbs.  They're all fuel injected.

Edit:  Hadn't refreshed my page to see that it'd been mentioned already.

----------


## Anti Federalist

> It's a twin throttle body system which has been intentionally shaped to look like carbs.  They're all fuel injected.


Yeah that was already pointed out...I forgot I was looking at a 2017

----------


## TheCount

> Yeah that was already pointed out...I forgot I was looking at a 2017


Yeah, I was working on a day-old version of the page.


I don't really understand it, to be honest.  I know that "heritage" is the hipster thing right now, but I'm not a fan of something pretending to be something that it's not.  Tacking on some carb-shaped plastic is worse, in my opinion, than just leaving the throttle bodies looking like throttle bodies.

----------


## Anti Federalist

> Yeah, I was working on a day-old version of the page.
> 
> I don't really understand it, to be honest.  I know that "heritage" is the hipster thing right now, but I'm not a fan of something pretending to be something that it's not.  Tacking on some carb-shaped plastic is worse, in my opinion, than just leaving the throttle bodies looking like throttle bodies.


Be nice if you *could* get the real thing, but we cannot, because Uncle.

----------


## Anti Federalist

Off topic, but, if you ever wondered, here's how "surface piercing propellers work".

Also how you go fast on the water.

----------


## Anti Federalist

Was in one of these...

----------


## afwjam

> Off topic, but, if you ever wondered, here's how "surface piercing propellers work".
> 
> Also how you go fast on the water.


Very cool! I've never seen one of those.

heres a Boston whaler with a 30 hp merc I helped fix up for my buddy Tom in the past year before his passing last month from the cancer.

----------


## Anti Federalist

> Very cool! I've never seen one of those.
> 
> heres a Boston whaler with a 30 hp merc I helped fix up for my buddy Tom in the past year before his passing last month from the cancer.


Sorry to hear about your buddy...looks like it's running nice.

----------


## afwjam

> Sorry to hear about your buddy...looks like it's running nice.


He was a good man and I'll miss him and his knowledge. 
ran like a peach after a new stator and a carb rebuild.

 I'm a sucker for big mercury outboard two strokes, better yet four of them.




of course the big v8s in the seven marines sound good for a four stroke...

----------


## Anti Federalist

> I'm a sucker for big mercury outboard two strokes, better yet four of them.


Oh hell yeah...used to run towboats with 200 HP souped up "Black Max" engines making about 225 hp.

Primary fast response vessel was a customized 28 ft Parker with three of them.

With full gear, salvage equipment and crew I could air it out to 50 knots.

I miss go fast boating...used to know these Team Apache guys, in a passing way, I've run an Apache and raced a season in a Reggie Fountain about 20 years ago now.




*That's* offshore racing...rough, stand up, and on the edge.

----------


## Anti Federalist

As long as we're daydreaming here...I've always wanted to get my hands on on of these, a Baja 24.

Simple, single engine, good for about 80 mph which is plenty fast enough for me at my age now.

----------


## afwjam

> Oh hell yeah...used to run towboats with 200 HP souped up "Black Max" engines making about 225 hp.
> 
> Primary fast response vessel was a customized 28 ft Parker with three of them.
> 
> With full gear, salvage equipment and crew I could air it out to 50 knots.
> 
> I miss go fast boating...used to know these Team Apache guys, in a passing way, I've run an Apache and raced a season in a Reggie Fountain about 20 years ago now.
> 
> 
> ...


'That's absolutely incredible racing, right on the bloody edge, those guys got balls. I love watching racers in the zone like that, they are so smooth with the throttle and as a result fast, but it almost makes it look slower then a guy with less precise throttle control.

reminds me of  this lap at mount panorama TWR campaigned an XJS

----------


## Anti Federalist

> 'That's absolutely incredible racing, right on the bloody edge, those guys got balls. I love watching racers in the zone like that, they are so smooth with the throttle and as a result fast, but it almost makes it look slower then a guy with less precise throttle control.
> 
> reminds me of  this lap at mount panorama TWR campaigned an XJS


Two wheels!

I wish I had the money and time to get into racing.

One of favorite segments of Top Gear was the "Star in a Reasonably Priced Car"...

Check out Tom Cruise at 3 minutes even...wait for it.

----------


## afwjam

> Oh hell yeah...used to run towboats with 200 HP souped up "Black Max" engines making about 225 hp.
> 
> Primary fast response vessel was a customized 28 ft Parker with three of them.
> 
> With full gear, salvage equipment and crew I could air it out to 50 knots.



where were you running the tow and salvage? I would like to hear more. I love the big ocean going tugs myself, racing to the salvage Job somewhere in the pacific...

----------


## afwjam

Love the sound of that Jaguar V12...

----------


## Danke

> As long as we're daydreaming here...I've always wanted to get my hands on on of these, a Baja 24.
> 
> Simple, single engine, good for about 80 mph which is plenty fast enough for me at my age now.






> 


...

----------


## Origanalist

I just want to say to all of you who ARE in the wind now, be careful. There are a lot of Danke's out there.

----------


## Danke

> I just want to say to all of you who ARE in the wind now, be careful. There are a lot of Danke's out there.


I actually give motorcyclist and bicyclists a lot of room on the road.  I do not care if they ride between lanes (legal in California) and get in front of me, etc.  It is just the ones that purposely make noise.  But whatever.  I still have my first motorcycle.  But I don't ride on the roads anymore.  I drive trucks and SUVs. Too many idiots on the road.  Not taking chances like that.


I think bicyclists would be much safer using sidewalks, especially when nobody seems to use them anymore.  Unless you are in a downtown area.

----------


## Danke

I just want to add.  I am probably one of the most conservative drivers out there.  I use the right lane and usually drive slower than most, I don't need the aggravation to get somewhere 5 seconds before the next guy.  I fly too, very cautiously.

----------


## Danke

My first bike, got it in third grade.  My bothers and me used paper route money to get it.

https://www.google.com/search?client...M57YTgqy18N2M:

----------


## Anti Federalist

> Love the sound of that Jaguar V12...


Love the Ferrari V12s too...

----------


## Anti Federalist

> where were you running the tow and salvage? I would like to hear more. I love the big ocean going tugs myself, racing to the salvage Job somewhere in the pacific...


Atlantic, Northeast and Florida and Caribbean.

SeaTow commercial operations...tugs, barges, riding crew changes, sinkings, groundings, fires, lifesaving you name it.

The last towing vessel I ran was similar to this, but used only for drilling rig set up and towing...although it would make a damn good salvage tug.

----------


## Anti Federalist

> where were you running the tow and salvage? I would like to hear more. I love the big ocean going tugs myself, racing to the salvage Job somewhere in the pacific...


If you have an interest in that, you really need to read these books:

https://www.amazon.com/Grey-Seas-Und.../dp/1585742406

https://www.amazon.com/Serpents-Coil.../dp/1585742872

----------


## Danke

> where were you running the tow and salvage? I would like to hear more. I love the big ocean going tugs myself, racing to the salvage Job somewhere in the pacific...

----------


## afwjam

> My first bike, got it in third grade.  My bothers and me used paper route money to get it.
> 
> https://www.google.com/search?client...M57YTgqy18N2M:


thats a great bike, awesome motor...

----------


## afwjam

> Atlantic, Northeast and Florida and Caribbean.
> 
> SeaTow commercial operations...tugs, barges, riding crew changes, sinkings, groundings, fires, lifesaving you name it.
> 
> The last towing vessel I ran was similar to this, but used only for drilling rig set up and towing...although it would make a damn good salvage tug.


You have the variable pitch props on that?

----------


## Danke

> thats a great bike, awesome motor...


Still running.

----------


## Anti Federalist

> You have the variable pitch props on that?


On the one in that photo, yes, that's CPP with stern thrusters.

The one I ran used Z drives.

The ideal set up is Z drives on the stern with twin tunnel thrusters and a "drop down" azimuthing thrusting on the bow.

Used to do it with "stick and rudder" seamanship...now it's all done with Dynamic Positioning systems.

----------


## Anti Federalist

What happens when computer boats lose power.

----------


## Origanalist

> I just want to add.  I am probably one of the most conservative drivers out there.  I use the right lane and usually drive slower than most, I don't need the aggravation to get somewhere 5 seconds before the next guy.  I fly too, very cautiously.


I'm sure you're the most considerate driver out there, never needlessly antagonizing people.

----------


## tod evans



----------


## Anti Federalist

Came real close to picking one up just like this yesterday...couldn't agree on price.

----------


## Suzanimal

> I just want to add.  I am probably one of the most conservative drivers out there.  I use the right lane and usually drive slower than most, I don't need the aggravation to get somewhere 5 seconds before the next guy.  *I fly too, very cautiously*.







>

----------


## Danke

> 



No passengers, that was a ferry flight.

----------


## Anti Federalist

> No passengers, that was a ferry flight.


Knowing how my luck runs, you would have crashed on my house.

----------


## ghengis86

> No passengers, that was a ferry flight.



You spelled fairy wrong

----------


## Anti Federalist

> You spelled fairy wrong

----------


## Danke

> You spelled fairy wrong




No, HB is not allowed on my flights.

----------


## Origanalist

@anaconda

----------


## anaconda

> @anaconda


Awesome. I like the accessibility of the gas cap. I wonder how many cc's this is and how fast it is? Imagine the parking options for this.

----------


## Anti Federalist

> Awesome. I like the accessibility of the gas cap. I wonder how many cc's this is and how fast it is? Imagine the parking options for this.


http://www.motorizedbicyclehq.com/mo...ws-california/

----------


## anaconda

> @anaconda


If that motor is 80cc I'll bet that bike can dO about 50 mph.

----------


## tod evans

Now this is $#@!in' cool!

----------


## tod evans

Another!

----------


## Anti Federalist

> Now this is $#@!in' cool!


Oh wow, that *is* hot $#@! right there.

The Brits have become geniuses at recreating lost technology like that.

----------


## phill4paul

> Oh wow, that *is* hot $#@! right there.
> 
> The Brits have become geniuses at recreating lost technology like that.


  Yes. Lost. Discarded and then disregarded.

----------


## Anti Federalist

> Yes. Lost. Discarded and then disregarded.


The Peppercorns were phenomenal pieces of engineering...and not a single one of them survived, scrapped, every single one.

This is a similar locomotive from the USA...none survived.



Working on building a new one from original plans, but we can't seem to get our $#@! together as well as the Brits on these projects.

https://prrt1steamlocomotivetrust.org/

----------


## Anti Federalist

That said, sometimes we can make things come together.

This is ex C and O #1309.



It's currently undergoing restoration at Western Maryland Scenic RR and is supposed to be completed and in steam this year.

That will make it, IIRC, the largest and most powerful steam locomotive in operation, in the world.

----------


## tod evans



----------


## specsaregood

> 


That kid was seriously thinking of taking off.

----------


## tod evans

> That kid was seriously thinking of taking off.


Dindonuffin.......

----------


## specsaregood

> Dindonuffin.......


when the guy told him "pull over to the side" you could see it register on his face that it was his opportunity to skip out.  the motorcycle guy must have registerd it too since he immediately changed his mind, told him to stay and called the cops.

----------


## Origanalist

> Dindonuffin.......


Ha ha ha ha

----------


## Anti Federalist

Can't believe he didn't get more seriously hurt.

Me, personally, you'd never catch me riding in the lane he was in.

No escape route at all.

----------


## Anti Federalist

> when the guy told him "pull over to the side" you could see it register on his face that it was his opportunity to skip out.  the motorcycle guy must have registerd it too since he immediately changed his mind, told him to stay and called the cops.


Pretty level headed after what just happened to him.

----------


## specsaregood

> Pretty level headed after what just happened to him.


So would you have called the cops if you were the motorcycle guy?

----------


## Anti Federalist

> So would you have called the cops if you were the motorcycle guy?


I knew somebody would bring that up.

This was CA right?

I think you would leave yourself open to "leaving the scene" felony charge if you did not.

I meant he was level headed through the whole confrontation...obviously in pain and shock but still managed.

My constant admonition to "never call cops" still applies...if at all possible, if not legally required, I would not have.

Or I would have tried to avoid it.

I realize that in some cases there is no choice, maybe *"never voluntarily call the cops"* is more accurate.

----------


## Anti Federalist

Looking at another one.

----------


## Origanalist

> Looking at another one.


I'm pretty happy with mine, but it's that time of year to start looking for good deals. Also, I would like another dual sport to go along with a cruiser.

----------


## Anti Federalist

> *I'm pretty happy with mine, but it's that time of year to start looking for good deals*


Yeah, that's what I was thinking.

Guy wants $8,000 for that one.

----------


## Anti Federalist

Laconia Bike Week 2018.

Weather was gorgeous.

This is the top of the hill looking down on the town.

----------


## Anti Federalist



----------


## Anti Federalist



----------


## Danke

When AF pulls into foreign ports, his buddies come to greet him.


http://digg.com/video/naked-man-motorcycle

----------


## Anti Federalist



----------


## Anti Federalist

Got the bike out and serviced for the year...but the weather has been for $#@!...cold and rain.

Got a few hours in two weeks ago then had to go to work.

----------


## Anti Federalist

*Cycle Therapy*

https://www.ericpetersautos.com/2019...cycle-therapy/

By eric - June 3, 2019

There are sound, practical reasons for owning a motorcycle that transcend fantastic gas mileage and low buy-in cost. 

I speak of the therapeutic aspects of motorcycle ownership.

Knowing you have one; that it’s out in the garage – ready to go whenever you are.

Just looking at it – even if you can’t ride it today.

Because there is always tomorrow.

The “Dr.” is always in. No need to make an appointment. Whenever you feel the need, he is there, waiting and ready – maybe even in your TV room. So long as you remembered to keep the trickle charger hooked up – and didn’t forget the fuel stabilizer in the tank. Roll it around the room once a week or so, to keep the tires from flat-spotting.

When you do get to ride, your worries recede  . . . because they have to. 

A bike is not like a car – especially modern cars, which practically beg you to fall asleep at the wheel and then nag you for doing it.

On a bike, your presence – of mind and body – is required.

It is up to you to keep it upright. If you don’t, it won’t. There is no Lane Keep Assist or Automated Emergency Braking. The only assistant along for the ride is  . . . you.

It is your job to keep track of what gear you’re in – and to operate the clutch. To be smooth. If you forget to downshift when downshifting is called for, the engine will bog and you’ll *feel* stupid. If you forget to pull in the clutch as you roll to a stop, the engine will stall – and you’ll *look* stupid.

Bikes are not for the stupid. Not for very long, at least.

Some bikes have kick starters. Few things in life are more satisfying than physically starting an engine by a well-choreographed forceful downstomp. 

Buttons are for people who’ve fallen – and can’t get up.

Since you have no air bags and there are lots of gadget-addled people in cars not paying much attention ton anything going on outside their cars, you grok the importance of paying attention to them.

Which keeps your attention lit on the scene at hand – and not what went down at work or what is waiting for you at home. Few things keep you in the moment like a bike does. It is a kind of time machine that makes time stand still. There is no past or future. Just right now.

For as long as the ride lasts.

It is a taste of the psychological ease our early ancestors must have enjoyed on those days when the sun was warm and their bellies full and everything seemed well.

And was.

There is a secondary therapeutic aspect: Wrenching.

Bikes, most of them, are still primarily mechanical things – tangible things. Not cell phones that roll. Their machinery is also largely accessible; you can lay your hands on just about anything. The engine – all of it – is literally right in front of you. Not buried under a plastic shroud. Not crammed up against a firewall. You can sit beside it, examine it from almost any angle.

It can actually be fun to change the oil, replace the spark plugs or do a brake job – which jobs generally don’t require jacking up anything and (usually) no special tools. The act is a kind of communion which creates an emotional bond between man and machine. There is the immense satisfaction which comes from doing it yourself – which satisfaction is denied to owners of cars whose complexity and impossibly inaccessible packaging and necessity for specialized tools and “diagnostic” equipment has made them forbidding, remote and as difficult to bond with as a wire-mesh wet nurse.

Even newer bikes with fuel injection are easy to deal with by dint of the fact that you can get to the injectors without disassembling a third of the engine. And the FI is still relatively simple throttle body or port injection, not direct injection as in almost all new cars.

Bikes are still what cars would have been had “the government” – busybodies and control freaks with badges and guns – stayed out of the car business. Of course, “the government” has decided to get into the bike business, too – and the new stuff is being encrusted with the bad stuff which has ruined cars as other than Transportation Modules.

But the good news is this creeping rot only began a few years ago – so you don’t have to go back 20-plus years to avoid it, as is the case with cars.

Go back to the early 2000s and before and you’ll be dealing with carburetors – and no electronic controls at all. Just a few electronic devices – such as the battery/generator and ignition system.

All of them under your control.

The bike is your co-conspirator, not your nanny. It has no event data recorder; no Intelligent Speed Limit Assist. It does not pester you with annoying buzzers for doing something a bureaucrat who imagines himself to be your parent or – worse – your owner – thinks you ought not to do. As all modern cars do.

It is as autonomous a vehicle as ever existed.

*Get one – and ride it – while you still can.*

----------


## phill4paul

These Russian off-roaders have kinda piqued my interest. Can be kicked into 2-wheel drive (rear motorcycle and side-car wheels) and even has a reverse. 

Engine and Transmission

Displacement, cc: 749

Engine type: OHV air cooled 2 cylinder 4 stroke boxer (flat twin)

Valve per cylinder: 2

Bore and stroke (mm x mm): 78 x 78

Max output (hp): 41 @ 5500 rpm

Max torque (ft-lbs): 42 @ 4300 rpm

Compression: 8.6:1

Fuel system: Throttle body EFI

Starting: Electric & Kickstart

Clutch Double-disc dry

Transmission type: Manual

Speeds: 4 forward 1 reverse

Primary drive (rear wheel): Driveshaft

Final drive ratio: 4.62

Engageable sidecar wheel drive: Yes, driveshaft

Misc.

Fuel grade: 91 Octane, unleaded

Fuel tank capacity, gallons: 5.0

Reserve, gallons: app. 1

Estimated fuel economy, mpg: 31-37

Estimated range, miles: 155-185

Recommended max cruising speed, mph: 70

Max permissible weight, lbs:1325

Trunk volume, cubic ft.: 2.9

----------


## Anti Federalist

@phill4paul

Did you see that thread on Janus motorcycles I posted a few weeks back?

----------


## Anti Federalist



----------


## Origanalist

> I'm pretty happy with mine, but it's that time of year to start looking for good deals. Also, I would like another dual sport to go along with a cruiser.


Got a dual sport, older one. 83 xt 550. Put it on a carrier on the back of the motorhome. Finally got the old lady on the back of one of my bikes, lol. Perfect for putting around on forest service roads when you're camping.

----------


## Anti Federalist

> Got a dual sport, older one. 83 xt 550. Put it on a carrier on the back of the motorhome. Finally got the old lady on the back of one of my bikes, lol. Perfect for putting around on forest service roads when you're camping.


Mrs AF still refuses...nothing new there.

Enjoy, and good to see you around.

----------


## phill4paul

> @phill4paul
> 
> Did you see that thread on Janus motorcycles I posted a few weeks back?


  Sure did. I was trying to find it to post the Ural in but for some  reason couldn't and then up popped this bike thread so....
  And yeah I thought of that Indiana Jones scene, but if I were to get one I'd have to trick it out as an Deutsches Afrikakorps even though it ain't a BMW.

----------


## Anti Federalist

> Sure did. I was trying to find it to post the Ural in but for some  reason couldn't and then up popped this bike thread so....
>   And yeah I thought of that Indiana Jones scene, but if I were to get one I'd have to trick it out as an Deutsches Afrikakorps even though it ain't a BMW.


Oh yes, do that!

----------


## shakey1



----------


## Anti Federalist

Absolutely beautiful day here today.

Trimmed back a bunch of trees then rode to get the sawdust and chips off.

Mid 70s, cool N wind blowing.

Life is good.

----------


## Anti Federalist

My daughter's new ride.

2001 Guzooki GZ250.

Perfect little lite-weight cruiser for her to start on.

----------


## Origanalist

> My daughter's new ride.
> 
> 2001 Guzooki GZ250.
> 
> Perfect little lite-weight cruiser for her to start on.


My daughter bought a new 883, lol, I'm still on the Shadow.

----------


## Origanalist

Get much riding in AF? My Shadow only made it out about 7 or 8 times, but I rode the hell out of that xt 550, lol. Line riding is way easier on a dual sport.

----------


## Anti Federalist

> Get much riding in AF? My Shadow only made it out about 7 or 8 times, but I rode the hell out of that xt 550, lol. Line riding is way easier on a dual sport.


Last few weeks were great, we both got in over a thousand miles...NH in the fall.

I'm back on the vessel now...probably will be over for the year by the time I get back.

----------


## Origanalist

> Last few weeks were great, we both got in over a thousand miles...NH in the fall.
> 
> I'm back on the vessel now...probably will be over for the year by the time I get back.


Nice, glad you some in.

----------


## Anti Federalist

I'm down due to some knee issues...and it is killing me I can't ride...FACK

----------


## Origanalist

> I'm down due to some knee issues...and it is killing me I can't ride...FACK


Haven't had a chance to get the Shadow out but been riding the 550 quite a bit. Not real good on the  highway but still fun as hell. Sorry to hear about your knees man, hope you can get that straightened out.

----------


## Anti Federalist

> Haven't had a chance to get the Shadow out but been riding the 550 quite a bit. Not real good on the  highway but still fun as hell. Sorry to hear about your knees man, hope you can get that straightened out.


Thanks...good to see you back around

----------


## Anti Federalist

Dust cover off...
Wheel over to workbench, knees aching, popping but working...
Battery charger on...
Fresh oil and filter...
Check coolant...
Tires and pressure checked...
Chain lube and adjust...
Cables, lube and adjust...
Grease fittings, greased...
Clean and polish...
Add fresh fuel...
Crank for two seconds...LIFE!
Scooch out of the basement door, around the front to the road...
Roll that $#@!ing throttle out and crack 100+ at top gear...
That ain't rain on my cheeks...

Stop and watch the sunset at the lake down the road from my house...
Finish up the night with a couple o' frosty adult beverages.

Life in the US of A is still pretty good brothers, and worth defending.
Take the time to enjoy what we're fighting for, whatever it may be in *your* life...it's worth it.

----------


## cjm

> Stop and watch the sunset at the lake down the road from my house...
> Finish up the night with a couple o' frosty adult beverages.
> 
> Life in the US of A is still pretty good brothers, and worth defending.
> Take the time to enjoy what we're fighting for, whatever it may be in *your* life...it's worth it.


Excellent photo and comment.  Hoisting my pint to you.  Cheers!

----------


## Anti Federalist

> Excellent photo and comment.  Hoisting my pint to you.  Cheers!


Right back atcha!

----------


## Danke

Better than the POW.

----------


## Patrick Henry

Some nice bikes in this thread! I am looking to grab the new Honda CRF450L. While not exactly a "real motorcycle" as my buddies like to chide me with haha, still fun nonetheless. However, I am debating maybe getting something a little more bulletproof for the coming satanic commie hordes like the Suzuki DRZ400 or Honda XRL650.

My grandfather used to have a beautiful Moto Guzzi V7. When he passed away, my grandmother basically gave it away to someone. 

Looked exactly like this one:
https://cybermotorcycle.com/gallery/...Ambassador.htm

----------


## Anti Federalist



----------


## Anti Federalist



----------


## Anti Federalist



----------


## Anti Federalist



----------


## Anti Federalist



----------


## Anti Federalist



----------


## Anti Federalist



----------


## tod evans



----------


## Anti Federalist

That Velocette V Twin sounds gorgeous!

But damn a Pratt and Whitney Radial V?

Outstanding...I learned to ride on British steel...I still twitch my right foot looking to shift.

----------


## tod evans



----------


## Anti Federalist

That thing is just awesome... 50 mph at 100 rpm.

----------


## mtr1979

I just bought a 2020 Honda Grom today.

----------


## Anti Federalist

Yay Spring...got both mine and my daughter's bikes out and serviced for the year.

Been kind of chilly and damp though, plenty of snow still on the high mountains, not the greatest riding weather, but getting better.

I'll take it.

----------


## Anti Federalist

> @phill4paul
> 
> Did you see that thread on Janus motorcycles I posted a few weeks back?


Gonna try and get my daughter one of these.

----------


## Anti Federalist

Well...look what just came into my life:



This is just a facsimile, I'll get some shots of the real deal shortly.

Already started stripping and bobbing some of the excess horse$#@! off.

----------


## Anti Federalist



----------


## Anti Federalist

*The Art of the Ride*

https://www.ericpetersautos.com/2022...t-of-the-ride/

By
eric -
May 6, 2022

Why ride a motorcycle? 

You are exposed to the elements. It requires concentration, involvement. You cannot text. You may get wet. You are fully in control of the thing, especially if it’s a bike without ABS or stability control. There are no seatbelts. 

Exactly. 

Riding is what driving was, once – before most of the fun was emulsified by safetyism into mere transportation. To get on a bike is to experience the elemental, again. Just you and it – even if you have a passenger. Because it’s all on you, which is good. If it has a kick-starter, all the better. Move the kicker up or down just a bit, until you feel the engine rotate to just the right spot, compression building. Then a single, perfectly timed downward stroke. It comes alive in a connected way that is as far-removed from pushing a button as looking at a Playboy when you were 13 was from the real thing, a few years later.

The pipes sing their song, the machine settles into its rhythm.  

Now, you’re ready.

Hear – feel – the gravel under the tires as you roll out of the driveway, every nuance of the road. You get to know it, intimately, in ways not possible in cars. It is right there – inches away from your feet. Your eyes can pick out the individual macadam, trace the cracks. You roll with it, an unwinding ribbon of endless adventure. If you are lucky enough to live in a state that hasn’t imposed a requirement to wear a helmet – the proto Face Diaper – you will know the feel of the wind, conveying raw data about speed in a way that cannot be gauged, as by a speedometer and its anodyne numbers.

Here comes a curve. Downshift in anticipation. You do this, yourself. As most don’t, in most modern cars. There is no Lean Angle Control (I made that up). How far over? Where is my turn-in point? Maybe a little pressure on the rear brake – if they’re not linked, as they are in all modern cars – to take a little weight off the front end? There is a subtle art in this. And a satisfaction – when mastered – largely unavailable in most cars, which do most of the setting up for you. And have electronic interventions to safety-net you. Some late-model bikes have them, too – but only so much.

Thankfully so.

Of course, they are working to do to motorcycles what has already been done to cars. They haven’t been able to go as far – or as fast – because people who ride are a different demographic than those who “drive,” in air-fingers-quotes to emphasis the difference. Driving having been gelded by safetyism – the latter made into a sickly fetish object now generally worshipped by those who close doors and push buttons and do not want to be involved in the former activity of driving.

This was easily managed because almost everyone “drives,” in the sense  that almost everyone needs to. This includes many who don’t like having to and who for that reason like a car that does as much of the driving for them as is technically feasible.

Including the parking.

Let go of the wheel. Just push another button. In you go. All done for you.

The inevitable elaboration of this being the elimination of driving, altogether. In its place, transportation – “automated” and “self driving.” Windows rolled up, cell phone turned on.

Sensory connection to the world outside, off.

Many want this – and why not? Most cars made since about 2015 or so are already almost there. Lane Keep Assist. Park Assist. Brake Assist. Trailer Back-Up Assist. Speed Limit Assist.

Why not seal the deal?

It has been harder to get motorcycle people to come along for this ride because they are a self-selected crew that wants to ride. There is no need to ride. Especially when almost any can “drive.” It is analogous to choosing to learn how to weld, or to frame a wall. It takes active interest, for the sake of the thing, itself.

You don’t have to – but you want to.

Most riders do not want safetyism. It is a much harder sell, being contrary to the point. Something like Lean Angle Assist – should such an imagined atrocity ever become actuality – would go over with most riders as well as Advanced Rappeling Assist would find love among rock climbers.

Riding a bike is practical in some ways. A bike is generally much less expensive than a car – and always easier on gas. The thirstiest of them use less gas than the typical economy car. They fit where cars do not – including the smallest economy cars. Some can tote more cargo than some cars, too.

But these are incidentals – perks. Nice to have but not the essential thing. Those who know this already do. If you’d like to know, there’s only one way to.

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## mtr1979

> _Very_ low IQ, idiots, morons, misguided, self-identify as wanna-be bullies, troubled... but the biggest threat? I really haven't thought about that. The biggest threat that I see is that people in general are becoming lazier and stoopider with every passing year, relying more and more govt to solve their problems for them, at huge expense in terms of both money and freedom.
> 
> Helmet and go-pro... I take it you ride a crotch-rocket? Cool if you do, but nothing like an Injun on interstates playing Zepplin and Van Halen ;-)


I was being sarcastic.  I'm just repeating liberal talking points.  

I don't drive a crotch rocket.  Today I was driving a Honda CB300R.  I also have a Honda Grom.  If I had to pick between the two bikes I would pick the Grom.

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## Anti Federalist

> _Very_ low IQ, idiots, morons, misguided, self-identify as wanna-be bullies, troubled... but the biggest threat? I really haven't thought about that. The biggest threat that I see is that people in general are becoming lazier and stoopider with every passing year, relying more and more govt to solve their problems for them, at huge expense in terms of both money and freedom.
> 
> Helmet and go-pro... I take it you ride a crotch-rocket? Cool if you do, but nothing like an Injun on interstates playing Zepplin and Van Halen ;-)


My old ride which is now my daughter's.

And my new one...this pic is from the spring, I've nicely bobbed it since then, that goofy rear seat, lights, mirrors and bags are all gone.

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## PAF

> My old ride which is now my daughter's.
> 
> And my new one...this pic is from the spring, I've nicely bobbed it since then, that goofy rear seat, lights, mirrors and bags are all gone.


Saweeet 

Ya dropped the bags?! Chicken wing hopper or do you still cruise?

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## Anti Federalist

> Saweeet 
> 
> Ya dropped the bags?! Chicken wing hopper or do you still cruise?


Self post move to prevent thread derail:

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...=1#post7135075

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## Anti Federalist

@PAF




> Saweeet 
> 
> Ya dropped the bags?! Chicken wing hopper or do you still cruise?


I do, I still have the bags and could re mount them with no problem. I usually use a backpack and duffel bag that I ratchet strap to the rear fender when going any distance. Easy peasy.

In fact, I'm kicking around the idea of a cruise down to the Jersey Shore before cold weather shuts me down, go and visit a childhood buddy of mine.

One of the previous owners installed that Mustang seat system. I ordered a low profile seat from Dennis Kirk along with a set of Cobra pipes, but the fool thing was on backorder for months, so I kept the Mustang front seat as a solo seat, and mounted a removable slim line $#@! pad right behind it. From the few people that have ridden on it, (two daughters and a DiL) I'd say it's good for maybe twenty miles or so before ya go numb. Good enough for me...Mrs AF won't ride with me so I'm by myself most of the time.

Took the rear pillion footboards off and replaced them with lightweight flip up pegs. 

Took off the crash bar and highway pegs mounted on it.

Took off the sidelights and the hoods.

Took off the goofy aftermarket mirrors with turn signals in them and replaced with stock rectangular mirrors.

Took off the stock exhaust, resonator, pre muffler and mufflers, replaced with Cobra baffled drags.

Took off all that radio, communications and speaker crap.

Took off the windscreen and all it's hardware.

All in all I must have removed about 150 pounds of crap off of that bike, made it faster and more nimble.

I've got an idea in my head for this bike, which would be something I have yet to see on a Jap bike (outside of a 70s vintage CB 750 chopper anyways) : a springer front fork.

Something along these lines:



It will require some tricky machine work on the front neck bearings, to adapt an American fork dimesion to a metric bike.

But I've always loved the simplicity of a springer/girder fork.

Fits my whole "zen" of what a motorcycle should be, two wheels, a seat and an engine.

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## PAF

@Anti Federalist

I bought a 2007 VLX 600, took it home, and immediately got the torches out.




I cut up the swing arm, measured a few times, stuck rod in there and welded up and widened it:




Lots of grinding to make clearance for the FAT-ASS tire and chain:




Regrooved the transmission spline with the engine ON, a steady hand and Dremel. Flipped the sprocket, perfect alignment:




Scrapped the drum brake, picked up a Harley Dyna Disc Brake, an after market rotor, and made them fit on the Honda axle. Grinding and shims were required. I picked up a Suzuki Master Cylinder and stuck it between the Harley Disc and the Honda brake pedal lol




I bought a wide-ass spoke wheel and stuck a 240 tire on it:




6 Inch Fork Extensions
Italian Leather Seat
Single Bulb Bullet Lights which I wired up to serve as Stop, Turn, Night and 4-Way Flashers
Self-made Aluminum Cigarette Lighter mounted on the fork which doubles as a charging tender receiver
ALL Emissions yanked the hell off


Lots of other cutting, grinding and modifications to make it all work that I didn't take pictures of, but here is the finished project:

Oh, and the paint, DuPont Base Coat (GM Green), tapped crumbled-up aluminum foil on the black and silver paint to get the texture that I wanted, then the Clear Coat.

I picked GREEN because everybody said it was bad luck and the last color you ever want to put on a bike, so I went with that ;-)





See? There really is such thing as a Honda Davidson

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## Brian4Liberty

> Self post move to prevent thread derail:
> 
> http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...=1#post7135075


I went ahead and moved a few other posts here too.

I can't contribute much to this thread. The last motorcycle I used to ride was a Honda CB750, and it's been a long time...

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## Anti Federalist

> @Anti Federalist
> 
> I bought a 2007 VLX 600, took it home, and immediately got the torches out.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I cut up the swing arm, measured a few times, stuck rod in there and welded up and widened it:
> 
> ...


Outstanding brother, nice work.

I wish I had more pictures, I had a riding buddy that used to take pictures of everything, but we've lost touch decades ago.

But this, in black, is pretty close to the first chop I built in 1980.



Two of the neatest features I installed:

A Morris Magneto, so no Lucas electric, battery, rectum finder or wiring.

I bought a Jammer's hardtail and girder. I cut the frame on the upper cross member, welded plugs in each end and the drilled and tapped for brass fitting on the cut out and welded a fill spout right behind the fuel tank, so the oil tank behind the engine was eliminated as well.

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## PAF

> Outstanding brother, nice work.
> 
> I wish I had more pictures, I had a riding buddy that used to take pictures of everything, but we've lost touch decades ago.
> 
> But this, in black, is pretty close to the first chop I built in 1980.
> 
> 
> 
> Two of the neatest features I installed:
> ...



I just PM'd you, brother! Sweeeeet mods, that bike looks great! All black I can only imagine! Building them is every bit as fun as riding 'em!

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## PAF

> I went ahead and moved a few other posts here too.
> 
> I can't contribute much to this thread. The last motorcycle I used to ride was a Honda CB750, and it's been a long time...



Time to soak the tools in WD-40 and get to work!  One of my cousins used to have a CB750, I remember that bike very well!

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## Anti Federalist

> I went ahead and moved a few other posts here too.
> 
> I can't contribute much to this thread. The last motorcycle I used to ride was a Honda CB750, and it's been a long time...


Fun Facts...

Clint Eastwood's nemesis in _"Every Which Way But Loose"_, Cholla, the leader of The Black Widows M/C, rode a CB750 chopper.





The actor who played Cholla, John Quade, was one of us, he spoke publicly at events all around the country about the constitution, NWO and sound money.

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## Brian4Liberty

> Time to soak the tools in WD-40 and get to work!  One of my cousins used to have a CB750, I remember that bike very well!


It was a classic.




> Fun Facts...
> 
> Clint Eastwood's nemesis in _"Every Which Way But Loose"_, Cholla, the leader of The Black Widows M/C, rode a CB750 chopper.
> ...


LOL. Yeah, not a bad workhorse to turn into a chopper.

A friend back then had a Harley chopper, may have taken that for a spin once. Didn't really get into choppers or road bikes. Did want to replace the CB750 with a VF500, which were quite the rage at the time. Never did it.

Too much traffic and bad drivers around here. Not worth it anymore.




> The actor who played Cholla, John Quade, was one of us, he spoke publicly at events all around the country about the constitution, NWO and sound money.


Nice. If Clint kept hiring him, they must have had some things in common.

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## mtr1979

My 2020 Honda Grom


My current mods:
Motodynamic fender eliminator kit
Motodynamic integrated tail light
Tst Industries flush mount turn signals
Chimera cold air intake
Corbin seat
Kosovo 60% stiffer clutch spring and Koso clutch plate
Pro taper Klx110 handlebars
OTB Chain adjusters
Pro taper chain
Kenda Dual Sport tires
PSR footpegs
Bike Master 12v power adapter
36 tooth rear sprocket (changed from 34 tooth stock sprocket)
12 o'clock labs speedometer corrector 
Cheap amazon mirrors

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## Anti Federalist

@PAF

Here's a fresh pic, all cleaned up.

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## PAF

> @PAF
> 
> Here's a fresh pic, all cleaned up.


Amazing what a spit shine can do, looks awesome! ;-) I have that same brand tractor but in 46" lol. I had to re-weld the deck, but after that it's been trouble-free!

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## tod evans



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## Anti Federalist

Well, kiss my $#@!ing ass...here I've been singing the praises of these Vulcans...

Out riding today with AFsdottir, and notice the bike started idling janky, running rich as hell, barking and snapping through the exhaust.

I noticed this the other day, and figured, well, maybe some manky gas $#@!ing up the idle circuit.

Stopped to take a look, and oil has sprayed from the air breather cover, all over the side and pipes and frame.

WTF, over.

Limp it home, open the oil fill and start it up...*massive* blowby through the crankcase and breather assembly in the air intake.

$#@!...I'm guessing a cracked or melted piston, broken rings or possibly some failure in the startup decompression system.

I'll do a leak down and compression test on in it the morning, have not got the proper fittings for the plug holes....Got damn it.

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