What would happen to my....?

[Idon'tknow]

My mother is a teacher for elementary school children. I'm all for Ron Paul. I like most of his ideas but ending the Department of Education is one where I'm still a bit unclear of it all.

Say Ron Paul gets his way, and the DE ends. What would happen to my mother? What would happento her school children? She has up to 40 in a classroom per day, and we live in the typically less "rich" (for the lack of a better word) area. I'm concerned, because she's been a sincerely wonderful elementary teacher for 10 years, and counting.


What would happen to that specific school she works at?


I would appreciate all answers, so long as it is an "answer" to the question(s).

 

[ronpaulitician]

What should happen is that the improper federal government makes way for the proper state government in her school.

I do not expect this to happen overnight, and I fully expect that this is yet another part where president Paul will not (be able to/be willing to) remove the federal element overnight.

What specifically will happen to her school will depend on state (and local) government.

Some Ron Paul statements on education.

 

[Acala]

Freedom

Let me answer by asking you a couple questions.

In a world where people are free to choose what they do with the money they earn and free to choose how they raise their children, will they stop educating their children?

Did people educate their children before government intervened with force?

Assuming that people will continue to educate their children without government sticking gun muzzles into everyone's face, will there be a market for good teachers?

As long as human beings love their children, there will be a market for good teachers.

 

[TER]

If she is a wonderful elementary teacher with 10 years experience, getting the fed out of the education business will ultimately lead to her getting a higher salary, working in a more efficient and appropriate education system, and paying less in taxes.

 

[Working Poor]

Well my nephew was going to an almost brand new school that is close to the house where he lives. The school was closed and my nephew now goes to a school that is many miles away. Thanks DoE

 

[XNavyNuke]

Say Ron Paul gets his way, and the DE ends. What would happen to my mother? What would happento her school children? She has up to 40 in a classroom per day, and we live in the typically less "rich" (for the lack of a better word) area. I'm concerned, because she's been a sincerely wonderful elementary teacher for 10 years, and counting.

What would happen to that specific school she works at?

I'm a Gen X'r who actually went through public elementary education prior to Carter's creation of the DOE. I had the "benefit" of being a non-minority child being bussed across town to a "not rich" minority school in the name of fairness. Believe it or not, the teachers still had books and worksheets for student. Teachers kept pencils and paper to hand to those students who had none. Defunding the DOE, by itself, should have no effect on the ability of your mother's school to provide a fundamental education to her students. Accreditation of public schools remains a state government matter, even with the DOE's meddling. It sounds as though your mother's school district is cash strapped. That means that your elected officials will have to prioritize, the teachers unions will be fighting over a smaller pie, your county might have to decide that a school district is more important than a park district. If certain individuals in the organization are firm in demanding that only students with IPads will receive an education, and the voters are gullible enough to buy it, then I guess teachers will have to be fired so that the class size increases to 50, but at least they have technology that can only produce educated students.

I see this is your first post. That means you're either honestly searching for your own education, or you're trolling to see how many flames you can generate. I hope its the former.

XNN

 

[UtahApocalypse]

Back before the DoE America was the forefront of Science, Engineers, and many other fields. Just look at where the U.S. places now.

 

[Johnnybags]

Good Lord, education is locally funded thru taxes. Department of Education at the Federal level has done nothing but employ hacks since 1979. Ya think education is better since then? Abolish the dept and locally decide educations fate, do your really think some hack in DC cares? Cut out the middle man and save money. Allow Charter schools to compete with the local public school and we will once again have the best education available.

 

[Icymudpuppy]

DoE is only 32 years old. Before that, there were no schools, no Teachers, and nobody could count higher than the number of protuberances on their extremities, yet somehow we managed to put a man on the moon, harness the power of the atom, develop the personal computer, and lead the world in science and engineering.

See if you can find the part of my last sentence that is false. Here's a hint... it starts with the word "there" and ends with the word "somehow".

 

[ForLiberty2012]

Schools are funded by local property taxes and donations... the only federal support comes from federal mandates and regulations that are in place. My sister is a teacher and I have a few friends that are teachers... and they ALL say that the federal government has no role in education and that it restricts their ability to teach effectively (with restrictions such as No Child Left Behind).

If the Department of Education is ended, your mom will have a little bit more freedom in her job... that's all that will change.

 

[Idon'tknow]

Thanks for all the answers everyone! From some of the answers I received, it raised a few questions for me; hopefully I can have some answers to those too!

@TER: "If she is a wonderful elementary teacher with 10 years experience, getting the fed out of the education business will ultimately lead to her getting a higher salary, working in a more efficient and appropriate education system, and paying less in taxes."


How so? If I were to inform her of this, and she asked me how that would be possible, what would I say? I definitely understand the more efficient education system, and the paying less taxes, but how would her salary be higher?
-------------------------------------------------------

@XNavyNuke: It sounds as though your mother's school district is cash strapped. That means that your elected officials will have to prioritize, the teachers unions will be fighting over a smaller pie, your county might have to decide that a school district is more important than a park district. If certain individuals in the organization are firm in demanding that only students with IPads will receive an education, and the voters are gullible enough to buy it, then I guess teachers will have to be fired so that the class size increases to 50, but at least they have technology that can only produce educated students.


Okay, this is a big one that I need help with understanding. Yes. Her school has some problems with money. It pink slips a few of her fellow colleagues a few times every year, albeit the teachers are usually brand new to the school. They also don't supply coloring pencils, pencils, markers, etc, etc. Things it provided back when I was still going there. The Ipad part you were talking about, this is something I should have asked at the start. Would ending the DE be more beneficial to the rich, than the poor? Haha, and I PROMISE I am not a troll. I'm pushing for Ron Paul. He has my vote, I just need help understanding certain things about him, and his propositions. He seems like the only politician whom actually gets it. Whether it's his foreign policy, or his Constitutional support, he's right.

 

[ronpaulitician]

Yes. Her school has some problems with money. It pink slips a few of her fellow colleagues a few times every year, albeit the teachers are usually brand new to the school. They also don't supply coloring pencils, pencils, markers, etc, etc. Things it provided back when I was still going there. The Ipad part you were talking about, this is something I should have asked at the start. Would ending the DE be more beneficial to the rich, than the poor? Haha, and I PROMISE I am not a troll. I'm pushing for Ron Paul. He has my vote, I just need help understanding certain things about him, and his propositions. He seems like the only politician whom actually gets it. Whether it's his foreign policy, or his Constitutional support, he's right.

I have the same experience. My ex sister-in-law is a teacher here in LA. She constantly has to buy school supplies for her own students. It's sad to see teachers who really care like that be mistreated by the system, especially since she says there are many fellow teachers who seem to care nothing for the children they teach. (I'm sure your mom has similar colleagues, who do NOT buy supplies for their kids.)

What you want to ask your mom is if she has seen any progress, both with the education the children receive and the administration the system offers to those children and to the teachers. Then take a look at the cold, hard data that shows just how much more money has been put into the Department of Education over the last decade. It's stunning, really, and most of it happened under Bush. His heart may have been in the right place, but what happens when you use federal taxes to try and educate the children in the nation is that those funds are no longer available to the individuals at a local and state level. What would help your mom more? Pay an extra $100 in taxes, and then see $20 of that reach the kids in her classroom, or get to keep that $100, and be allowed to spend it on her kids herself? (Not that I think she should have to pay anything. With the average cost of a public school student being about $10,000 per year, and with an average classroom being between 25-30 students, any decent system should be able to run that classroom while paying the teacher a really good income.

Department of Education budget history 1980-2012
1980 $14 billion
1984 $15 billion
1988 $20 billion
1992 $32 billion
1996 $30 billion
2000 $38 billion
2001 $42 billion
2002 $56 billion
2003 $63 billion
2004 $67 bilion
2005 $71 billion
2006 $100 billion
2007 $67 billion
2008 $68 billion
2009 I'm not sure how to read this info. Looks like a lot of budget shenanigans to me from here on out.

$68 billion is a LOT of money. That's about $1,000 for every child in the US.

How many students in your mom's classroom? Ask her what she could do with an extra $1,000 to spend on each student per year. That should be the initial goal for all of us: reduce the scope of government in public education. Local control always benefits the "poor". By moving control away, out of sight, you are putting control in the hands of the rich. I'm not convinced that public education is needed in society, but if we are going to have it, you better believe that I want those kids to get the best that money can buy. And I happen to believe it is good teachers, not more administrators or fancy buildings designed by expensive architects.

 

[XNavyNuke]

@XNavyNuke: It sounds as though your mother's school district is cash strapped. That means that your elected officials will have to prioritize, the teachers unions will be fighting over a smaller pie, your county might have to decide that a school district is more important than a park district. If certain individuals in the organization are firm in demanding that only students with IPads will receive an education, and the voters are gullible enough to buy it, then I guess teachers will have to be fired so that the class size increases to 50, but at least they have technology that can only produce educated students.


Okay, this is a big one that I need help with understanding. Yes. Her school has some problems with money. It pink slips a few of her fellow colleagues a few times every year, albeit the teachers are usually brand new to the school. They also don't supply coloring pencils, pencils, markers, etc, etc. Things it provided back when I was still going there. The Ipad part you were talking about, this is something I should have asked at the start. Would ending the DE be more beneficial to the rich, than the poor? Haha, and I PROMISE I am not a troll. I'm pushing for Ron Paul. He has my vote, I just need help understanding certain things about him, and his propositions. He seems like the only politician whom actually gets it. Whether it's his foreign policy, or his Constitutional support, he's right.

People don't like to make tough decisions. If Uncle Sam says that you can get something and mitigate that decision, it is the simpler route to take.

With the Florida primary coming up, let's look at an example from their state. Pinellas County (St. Petersburg region) The public school budget in for the 1950 school year was $5 million, the population of the county was 160k (http://news.google.com/newspapers?id=zBAkAAAAIBAJ&sjid=ZX0DAAAAIBAJ&pg=5637,4693482&dq=school-budget+petersburg&hl=en). the public school budget for 2010 school year was $1.3 billion (https://www.pcsb.org/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=1701&Itemid=607), the population of the county was 920k. Let's adjust the 1950 budget to reflect that a dollar then is worth $9 today. The value of the 1950 budget today would be $45 million. Of course, the population in 2010 is 6 times great, so lets adjust for that. The $45 becomes $270 million. So, assuming that the student % of the population has remained the same (likely the 2010 is lower given 1950 was baby boom time), and assuming that parents still send their children to school to learn how to read, write, and do math, why is their a five fold increase by 2010? In my opinion, the answer is there is a LOT of fluffy programs that can be cut before the fundamentals even get touched. No one wants to make the hard decisions.

XNN

 

[osan]

My mother is a teacher for elementary school children. I'm all for Ron Paul. I like most of his ideas but ending the Department of Education is one where I'm still a bit unclear of it all.

Allow me to reverse the position a bit and ask you: why do we need a Department of Education? What benefit, if any, does it provide? These questions are more valid than yours for several reasons, the most essential of which is the fact that the nation functioned well enough and arguably better without it up until the 1970s when it was imposed upon us.

Say Ron Paul gets his way, and the DE ends. What would happen to my mother?

Impossible to say for certain, but the likely answer is "nothing" all else equal. She may lose her job, get a raise, a pay cut, be recognized for her outstanding performance or her lack thereof. There is no standard answer. States are likely to keep going with the same miserable structure and operations they now use... at least for a while until the prospects of better results for less money become apparent. Imbecile states such as New York will likely never change, at least until economic reality forces them to. Other, brighter states will see the light sooner and hopefully make changes for the better. The centralization of such power as that of "education", which very readily becomes indoctrination has been a cluster copulation of truly monumental proportions not only in the USA, but worldwide. In general, public schools are tyranny's greatest ally.

What would happento her school children? She has up to 40 in a classroom per day, and we live in the typically less "rich" (for the lack of a better word) area. I'm concerned, because she's been a sincerely wonderful elementary teacher for 10 years, and counting.

Her "children" are neither her business nor yours, but rather that of the respective parents. PERIOD. Get over your hand wringing because it avails neither the world nor your mother nor yourself anything of value. This is truth.

What would happen to that specific school she works at?

See above. Above all else, relax. The world will not come to an end. Really, it won't.