TX-Self driving Tesla with no one in driver's seat, crashes, incinerates both passengers

[Anti Federalist]

Tesla Car With No One In The Front Seats Crashes And Bursts Into Flames, Kill Both Passengers While Self Driving

https://vidmax.com/video/203801-tes...lames-kill-both-passangers-while-self-driving

Two men died after a Tesla (TSLA.O) vehicle, which was believed to be operating without anyone in the driver's seat, crashed into a tree on Saturday night north of Houston, authorities said.

“There was no one in the driver’s seat," Sgt. Cinthya Umanzor of the Harris County Constable Precinct 4 said.

The 2019 Tesla Model S was traveling at a high rate of speed, when it failed to negotiate a curve and went off the roadway, crashing to a tree and bursting into flames, local television station KHOU-TV said.

After the fire was extinguished, authorities located 2 occupants in the vehicle, with one in the front passenger seat while the other was in the back seat of the Tesla, the report said, citing Harris County Precinct 4 Constable Mark Herman.

Tesla and the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration did not immediately respond to a request for comment.

 

[TheTexan]

A "hold my beer" situation probably

 

[TheTexan]

Holy shit they weren't kidding when they said it burst into flame. What's that fucking car made out of? C4?

 

[Danke]

Were they in the back seat fiddling with each other?

 

[phill4paul]

Were they in the back seat fiddling with each other?

Kinda my first impression, but, no. One in the passenger other in the back.

On a side note are Tesla batteries environmentally friendly? Took 32,000 gallons of water to put them out.

 

[Brian4Liberty]

Just a little software bug. Download the latest version of software and reboot your car, it might fix it.

 

[enhanced_deficit]

What kind of materials are these cars made of?

2 dead in fiery Tesla crash in Houston
It took around four hours and 23,000 gallons of water before the flames were out, firefighters said.

 

[Anti Federalist]

Holy shit they weren't kidding when they said it burst into flame. What's that fucking car made out of? C4?

Damn near.

Lithium ion thermal runaway.

 

[Anti Federalist]

Kinda my first impression, but, no. One in the passenger other in the back.

On a side note are Tesla batteries environmentally friendly? Took 32,000 gallons of water to put them out.

In one fire, more smoke, soot, particulate matter and toxic gases were emitted than 100,000 standard ICE Honda Civics driving 100,000 miles each.

 

[pcosmar]

What kind of materials are these cars made of?

2 dead in fiery Tesla crash in Houston
It took around four hours and 23,000 gallons of water before the flames were out, firefighters said.

a Better Question is what kind of Idiot pours water on an Electrical Fire?

an 800 Volt.. 80KW arc furnace and you want to dump water on it..

Does anyone else realize how abjectly stupid that is?

 

[dannno]

a Better Question is what kind of Idiot pours water on an Electrical Fire?

an 800 Volt.. 80KW arc furnace and you want to dump water on it..

Does anyone else realize how abjectly stupid that is?

That's what the manual said.

 

[phill4paul]

a Better Question is what kind of Idiot pours water on an Electrical Fire?

an 800 Volt.. 80KW arc furnace and you want to dump water on it..

Does anyone else realize how abjectly stupid that is?

Well, truth to that. But, does every firehouse have the right foam?

 

[Dr.3D]

a Better Question is what kind of Idiot pours water on an Electrical Fire?

an 800 Volt.. 80KW arc furnace and you want to dump water on it..

Does anyone else realize how abjectly stupid that is?

The would probably do the same with a sodium or postassium ion battery.

 

[pcosmar]

The would probably do the same with a sodium or postassium ion battery.

The massive power output from 300v battery Pack Shorted by mangled metal will not be extinguished by water.

Type of battery being irrelevant.

 

[pcosmar]

Well, truth to that. But, does every firehouse have the right foam?

Powder or CO2 would be better options. Foam is for Fuel fires.

 

[Anti Federalist]

I'm moving my replies from the other thread to here:

I remember training materials that dealt with extractions from electric vehicles before Tesla was a known name. 84/85

I would like to believe the materials and training would be updated by now..

Here's an updated flier for first responders dealing with an EV fire/crash from DOT dated 2014

http://www.nhtsa.gov/staticfiles/nv...ideHEV-HV-Batt_LawEnforce-EMS-FireDept-v2.pdf

While they note that damaged or burning battery packs may contain residual high voltages and leads and cables are to be avoided, the best and only solution seems to be "surround and drown".

A "B" class extinguisher could be used to knock down visible flames long enough to extract or rescue occupants, but without massive amounts of water to cool and stop a thermal runaway, your only other choice is to retreat, isolate and let it burn.

Apparently these batteries are not too different from lead acid batteries, in that they have plates, screens and spacers all wrapped around one another and submerged in an electrolyte solution. Rupture and short circuiting of these plates during charging or in crash, causes electrolyte boiling, offgassing then explosion and fire.

Here's a quick read on it:

https://engineering.purdue.edu/P2SAC/presentations/documents/Lithium-Ion-Battery-Thermal-Runaway.pdf

 

[Anti Federalist]

Power leads are the issue.. Not the batteries other than the massive power stored.

Both voltage and amperage to be a Hugh arc Welder..

Water is Wrong.. Cut power supply. and smother what the arc lit.

Water will just make steam till the batteries are depleted.

Pete, here's the problem with the damn things.

It's not the arc or an external short causing the fire, it's an internal runaway reaction that cannot be stopped without massive amounts of cooling water.

The plates contain energy, the electrolyte allows energy to drain or charge the battery by allowing ionic flow through it from plate to plate.

If that plate separation is compromised, and they make contact in a short circuit, or the electrolyte is lost and they heat up and melt together, a fire is inevitable as all the energy contained in the plates is now rapidly released at the short circuit, and expands as the area gets hotter, the components melt together and the electrolyte gasses off.

Which leaves the only way it can be put out is to drown it with water to cool the components below explosion, BLEVE or LEL limits.

In my reading and personal experience with these things (had a 20 foot TEU container with a bunch of them in it catch fire about 15 years ago, had a deuce of a time with it) the analogy is very similar to a runaway nuclear reaction.

 

[phill4paul]

Powder or CO2 would be better options. Foam is for Fuel fires.

And again you are correct. Been a long time since military fire training and was posting quick. Perhaps Tesla should send a memo to departments. Or we could invent a water, powder, foam spray. We kill the trinity outright instead of breaking just a leg.

ETA: After reading AF's post's I've changed my mind. You may well be incorrect on this.

 

[phill4paul]

Well, there is the billion dollar winner, AF and Pete. The fire triangle consist of ignition source, fuel and oxygen. Cut any leg and the stool falls.

So, get your two heads together. Come out with a non-combustible foam that will choke out oxygen from a burning battery and I will huck it in late night television

 

[Anti Federalist]

Well, there is the billion dollar winner, AF and Pete. The fire triangle consist of ignition source, fuel and oxygen. Cut any leg and the stool falls.

So, get your two heads together. Come out with a non-combustible foam that will choke out oxygen from a burning battery and I will huck it in late night television

I'd be looking at a Halon 1211 (yeah yeah yeah I know...or a suitable "green" equivalent) foam system combined with a liquefied refrigerant.

Cooling is essential and absolutely key to knocking one of these battery fires down. That's why they keep re-igniting. You think you got it knocked down, overhauled and out, meanwhile the shorted plates are still there, still discharging rapidly and creating fresh heat.

Maybe a portable fire tent as well.

Cover the vehicle with the tarp or tent, secure it as best as possible and flood the now enclosed space with 1211 Halon foam and liquid R426 or something similar.