The Ron Paul Story, Tea Party, Koch's and the war for control of its history.

[Australianbrah]

G'day from sunny Perth Western Australia.
I couldn't see an international section so I thought I would just start a thread and maybe get some discussion/answers.

The impact of the Ron Paul movement has been world wide-never bigger internationally than in Australia. Where I know he was followed with great interest and is still mentioned on many Australian political blog and forum sites.

My thought/discussion is focusing on the way certain people, at least in my country-but I’m sure in others, view the Tea Party and Dr Paul.

The conversation in my country goes a little like this:
Person 1: What’s going on with the debt ceiling in America?
Person 2: It’s those extremists in the Tea Party.
Person 1: What is the Tea Party?
Person 2: It’s a movement started, cultivated and co-oped by wealthy industrialist like the Koch brothers, embraced by white, racist members of the GOP.
Person 1: But what about that Ron Paul fella?
Person 2: He’s part of that Tea Party, an old white man who wants to dump all the earnings of hard working Americans into the hands of the GOP. He’s a Koch puppet.
Person 1: Isn’t he vastly different in his views? Didn’t he vote against most of his parties bad decisions? I thought he was a Libertarian and not a conservative?
Person 2: They are all the same thing. He’s a Tea Partier, he gets money from big companies, supports the rich and wants a radical laissez Faire government designed to channel the wealth to the 1%.

Let’s face it, this isn’t new. You are never going to be able to change the minds of individuals who have no understanding of the RP revolution and its beginnings. However these are my problems with just letting this ignorance fly:

1. There seems to be a concerted effort by people on the left (and some on the right) in Australia to disconnect Dr Paul to the beginnings of the Tea Party. In effect rewriting history.
2. This rewriting of history seems to be deliberate and concerted. It aims to discredit the activist roots of the tea party.
3. They are aiming to tie the tea party, GOP and the Koch’s, muddling the waters and dishonestly changing the time line of events that are so important to understanding Dr Paul’s rise to prominence.
4. By changing the time line, they are able to muddle events-for example, they want to claim Dr Paul is a result of the tea party not the grandfather of the tea party.
5. The left, at least internationally, has made an effort to deny the grass roots nature of the origins of the tea party and its beginning in Dr Paul’s campaign.
6. They want to portray Ron Paul Libertarians as a part of the conservative, tea party alliance. They do this by rewriting history.

History matters. The correct order of events in the Tea Party needs to be understood in its correct context and timeline. Revolution isn’t a purview of the left. Dr Paul Began the Campaign for Liberty, his dedicated followers were the original tea party, the movement was then Co-Opted by others. However its grass roots message cannot be denied. The Ron Paul people are not necessarily tea partiers, especially the movement that it has morphed into.

By understanding the way the movement evolved, it’s then possible to explain to people how Dr Paul and his followers differ from your run of the mill astro-turf tea party person.
You can then explain the ideological differences, the theoretical differences and who Dr Paul is, what he believes and why his is important …but you need the historical context.
Without the correct timeline of events, it’s too easy for people who don’t care or understand to write the movement off.

I know this maybe doesn’t seem like a big thing, but it is. Revisionist history contests the thinking of the whole movement.
Dr Paul’s influence stretches further than the US of A and to many people he is still a hero.
I hate to see his legacy defamed by those on the left who see his influence and impact as a threat to their collectivist, activist status quo.

I really think that if ideas matter, then so does the correct interpretation of history.
Dr Paul and his movement came first; it’s not some Hodge-Podge of events that resulted in this ‘evil tea’ party evolving from big industry.
Does this make sense? Do we need a time line clip explaining the differences?
A Ron Paul-Tea Party history book?

 

[torchbearer]

For Liberty, buy a 20 pack and pass it out to your friends.

 

[torchbearer]

http://forlibertymovie.com/itunes/
also available on itunes.

 

[phill4paul]

I appreciate your observations. As an American that has been to Perth I will offer some of my own.

Australian men like to fight in the streets, they like Ac/DC and cover bands play them in every bar, "Oil" cans hurt when thrown full on and they treat their women like shit.
Which is not all bad as I don't mind a street fight if it can't be avoided, I like AC/DC even from cover bands, I'd rather drink a shitty beer like Fosters than throw one and the women..well, one of my best imports ever.

As to your other concerns History has yet to be written. There is still no clear winner.

 

[Australianbrah]

I appreciate your observations. As an American that has been to Perth I will offer some of my own.

Australian men like to fight in the streets, they like Ac/DC and cover bands play them in every bar, "Oil" cans hurt when thrown full on and they treat their women like shit.
Which is not all bad as I don't mind a street fight if it can't be avoided, I like AC/DC even from cover bands, I'd rather drink a shitty beer like Fosters than throw one and the women..well, one of my best imports ever.

As to your other concerns History has yet to be written. There is still no clear winner.

Its true we like to fight in the streets.
AC/DC is an awesome band.
Not sure what "oil cans" were thrown at you.
I treat my wife like a queen.

It makes me mad when revisionist history is created to fit political view points.

 

[acptulsa]

Yes, sir, it makes perfect sense. But it's just the tip of the iceberg.

We aren't just defending Ron Paul and ourselves. We are defending what this nation was founded upon, and what made it the great nation it became. I have a thread here about rail travel, in which (by the way) I hold the Indian-Pacific up as a paragon of what we could have here if it weren't for our federal government. A product of our modern education popped up, and was arguing that the Robber Barons of the Nineteenth Century, from whom liberals generally argue government must protect us, were in fact the government because obviously no one but the government could ever build a railroad! The degree to which this denies and subverts history is mind-boggling. But this troll argued it with a straight face.

Yes, there's something to be said for defending our honor, and that of Ron Paul. But we're so damned busy trying to help people understand that the Roaring Twenties were exceptionally prosperous precisely because Harding and Coolidge did not try to micromanage the economy, but instead got Washington, the District of Calamity the hell out of the way and let a bunch of bright people make the economy happen without interference that we have no time for less critical niceties. Especially now that Ron Paul has retired.

People have such a distorted view of history due to miseducation that it's no wonder they're so bewildered when everything they were taught is right turns out to be exactly wrong. We have to turn their whole world upside down to make them see what is right, correct, proven and real. They're living on the other side of the looking glass, where left is right and right is left, where America got where it was by being communist and the Soviet Union fell because it believed in liberty. Yes, defending Ron Paul's honor would be nice. But, you know, if we have to make the choice, I'll just bet he'd tell us to do what we have to do even if it means taking care of more important business while his good name is dragged through the mud. For if his reputation must be sacrificed to make the world free for his granddaughters, he'll go for his granddaughters' liberty ten times out of ten.

I'm not saying you're wrong, or that there's no value in setting the record straight. I believe there is. And I'm always gratified to hear from our friends down under--God bless you, mate. I'm just trying to take the big view and put it all in perspective. The way they are changing the history of this movement, or trying to, is exactly the way they always try to reinvent history to suit their narrative. Yes, it's important. It's even more important, and encompasses a much wider scope, than even you say.

Wish us luck, brother.

 

[american.swan]

If that's really going on in Australia, then there needs to be some historical blogs [from America] people can point to for facts.

 

[phill4paul]

Its true we like to fight in the streets.
AC/DC is an awesome band.
Not sure what "oil cans" were thrown at you.
I treat my wife like a queen.

It makes me mad when revisionist history is created to fit political view points.

"Oil cans" were Fosters Lager = the size of an oil can.
Glad to hear that you treat your wife respectfully. Not all did when I was there and made it easy for me as a foreigner to plunder goods.

Makes us mad too. But, like I've said history, the true history, hasn't been written yet. And while there is a propaganda arm of the current power holders then the spin will be what it is. Keep on educating. Thanks.

 

[phill4paul]

You might like this thread and video Australia...

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?404852-Video-How-the-Establishment-Cheated-Ron-Paul

 

[Tinnuhana]

Before Campaign for Liberty went "dot org", there was a whole section for peopole form different countries. Germany, England, Australia, had many people signed up on this. I hope this can be reinstituted.

 

[Article V]

Rand is quickly becoming THE standard-bearer of the Tea Party; and if Rand wins the 2016 primary, then the Tea Party history in all likelihood will be set right.

Fear not and focus on the future.

 

[ClydeCoulter]

I agree that getting history correct is a necessity. The mindset that we can just keep plugging forward without reguard to the past is foolish. But that is the mindset that keeps being pushed - "We have to leave the past behind, and move forward". So, George and company get away with torture, Goldilocs gets away with the dough, The Tea Party was a spontaneos movement of white folks that wanted to leave grandma eating dog food (according to the new revised edition of history).

 

[compromise]

Most people outside America (in Europe or the Anglosphere) who sympathize with the Tea Party will immediately be accused of being racist, fascist ultra-nationalists. Foreign and domestic liberal media have equated the Tea Party, a common sense, non-racist classical liberal protest group with far-right Nazis.

If the Tea Party is so racist, then why are there so many non-whites involved with it and so few non-whites among the GOP establishment?

Cruz, Labrador, Amash, Scott, Chaffetz, Love to name just a few.

 

[GunnyFreedom]

I am elsewhere tangentially connected to something calling itself "the Australian Tea Party" which seems on brief examination to be far more Ron Paulish than the 'normal' Tea Parties here in the States. You likely have a lot more insight on this than I do, but I am very much enjoying their posts on a regular basis.

 

[GunnyFreedom]

Here is their FB. They appear to be in-between Paul and the current US 'average' Tea party, slightly on the Paul side of halfway. Interestingly, they appear to be equally interested in US politics as AUS politics...

http://www.facebook.com/AusTeaParty?sid=0.18322252109646797

 

[Article V]

Most people outside America (in Europe or the Anglosphere) who sympathize with the Tea Party will immediately be accused of being racist, fascist ultra-nationalists. Foreign and domestic liberal media have equated the Tea Party, a common sense, non-racist classical liberal protest group with far-right Nazis.

I'd say most of this stems from the geographical locations of media hubs. Since most media tends to be based in progressive-dominated areas, most media develops a confirmation bias toward the results they want because all those around them already think like them and so parrot back the same ideas. Said enough times, the media becomes sure of itself that their version of reality is true and stop considering alternative evidence while rationalizing away any conflicting evidence. Then, because most world news gets their US info from these media hubs, they become biased because they are making subsequent decisions, i.e. they are deciding what's news off the decisions of others (like deciding what restaurant to visit because one is more crowded or changing what candidate you support because of Iowa caucus results).

Of course, there is a lot of puppeteering by the media, but a lot of what conspiracy-theorists call puppeteering is just dumb media making bad decisions because of groupthink, confirmation bias, subsequent decision-making, and beaucracy.

If you really want to correct/prevent these sort of occurrences from purposefully or inadvertently rewriting history, then you need to diversify the media (diversity of opinion, that is), vary their hubs geographically (to help maintain independent reporting rather than accidental confirmation bias), decentralize it (so that information can creep in from all manner of sources rather than a top down "this is news/this isn't news" bigwig), and open up pathways of information so that good info can get aggregated across the entire platform.

Interestingly, the internet as a whole does all this, and various websites operate like this: social-networking, YouTube, reddit, etc.; but perhaps there are other methods easily available besides the internet, we just haven't found them yet and we haven't given incentive for the current media to commit the capital and resources necessary to alter their current models or vary their geographical hubs to protect against information bias.

(Think about it, New Yorkers are largely GOP haters who consider the entire South an ignorant bunch of racists; is it any wonder that a news reporter who lives in this area might be influenced by the people they see every day at lunch, at dinner, at the grocery store, on the subway, in the deli, at the gym, at the bookstore, in their halls, in their beds!, etc.? Now multiply that opportunity for progressive influence based off location alone across thousands of the top reporters who then all communicate about what they've been hearing from their "sources," and...voila! rewrite of history and a dislike for anything that threatens liberalism.) You don't need a conspiracy to rewrite history; you just need a platform that is largely similar-minded, dependent upon one another, centralized, or any combination therein. (This is one of the reasons I truly dislike when RPF-users bully outsiders, or when mods use their centralized power to isolate threads according to their personal bias... that kind of behavior in any venue--tv network or internet forum--fosters a community toward bad decision-making, groupthink, confirmation bias, etc. which ultimately hurts the cause and the goals of all involved.)

 

[Smudge Dog]

I'm not sure I've seen the "perect tube" or vid that lays out the whole devolution. There was Denninger and "teabag the white house" then those guys up in Boston, then GOP hacks came running from all directions, the stillborn tea party coalition in congress and glen beck trying to sneak in and eat our porridge.

However you are correct. You are getting standard leftist ideology. The only utility is arguing with them in public. Ypu won't convince them but listeners are up for grabs.

 

[acptulsa]

I'd say most of this stems from the geographical locations of media hubs...

Good job spinning The Agenda. Goebbels would be proud.

Now tell me how the CIA says Iran has no nuclear program, then every MSM outlet without exception says they do.

 

[Article V]

Good job spinning The Agenda. Goebbels would be proud.

Now tell me how the CIA says Iran has no nuclear program, then every MSM outlet without exception says they do.

I think I already explained it in my longer post above. I didn't claim their weren't puppeteers, just that those puppeteers don't need to be in control of everything to get their desired results because the structure of the "system" is inherently susceptible to bias and bad decision-making. In a system like that, a puppeteer only needs to push lightly the right domino; the rest takes care of itself.

 

[afwjam]

Its coming from stories like this:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/brendan-demelle/study-confirms-tea-party-_b_2663125.html

And who knows there might be some limited truth to it, its not my "Tea Party" as Im sure its not anyone elses here. The "Tea Party" is not one giant centrally controlled group, OK, maybe for some, not us.