Immigration: Is Ron Paul for or against amnesty? Is he flip-flopping?

[Patriot123]

Okay, so I've been working on a website with many, many other grassroots supporters here called Ron Paul Myths. Now there's a lot of information on the net that clearly states Paul is against amnesty, and therefore our research has defended this point, shown here: http://ronpaulmyths.com/domestic-policy.php?expanddiv=immigration

At the same time, I've heard Cain supporters bash Paul by saying in one of his books he recently came out in favor of amnesty. So which one is it? Is Paul for or against amnesty? Or is he flip flopping on the issue?

 

[torchbearer]

in the hispanic interview I saw, he was talking about something similar to a guest worker permit to get all of them into the system.

 

[Krugerrand]

Okay, so I've been working on a website with many, many other grassroots supporters here called Ron Paul Myths. Now there's a lot of information on the net that clearly states Paul is against amnesty, and therefore our research has defended this point, shown here: http://ronpaulmyths.com/domestic-policy.php?expanddiv=immigration

At the same time, I've heard Cain supporters bash Paul by saying in one of his books he recently came out in favor of amnesty. So which one is it? Is Paul for or against amnesty? Or is he flip flopping on the issue?

It's a complex issue that is difficult to boil down into a single moniker.

(from what I recall) Ron Paul supports allowing free-market Mexican labor in the US. He opposes a federal campaign to round up those here illegally. That said, he support deportation of those here illegally who commit crimes. He wants to see birth rite citizenship ended. He wants to end any welfare-state apparatus that encourages people to enter the country illegally.

It's the perfect blend of free-markets, pragmatism, humanitarianism and nationalism.

 

[eworthington]

It sounds like Ron Paul more-or-less supports Singapore's immigration system; which has worked out real well. It has lifted many foreigners out of poverty while preventing many of the problems that we have with regard to immigration.

 

[Steve-in-NY]

recent interview about it:
http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?320648-Ron-Paul-Won-t-Kow-Tow-to-Latino-Vote

Edit:
Also - http://ronpaulmyths.com/foreign-policy.php
NEW! MYTH:Ron Paul is weak on Iran and won't act to stop it from obtaining nuclear weapons.

Needs a space after Myth:

NEW! MYTH: Ron Paul is weak on Iran and won't act to stop it from obtaining nuclear weapons.

 

[Brian4Liberty]

Taking a look at the official Ron Paul 2012 Campaign website should eliminate any doubts...

http://www.ronpaul2012.com/the-issues/immigration/

A MATTER OF NATIONAL SECURITY

A nation without borders is no nation at all.

It just doesn’t make sense to fight terrorists abroad while leaving our front door unlocked.

Unfortunately, for far too long, neither major political party has had the courage to do what is necessary to tackle the problem.

Instead, we’re presented with so-called “solutions” that involve amnesty proposals or further restricting Americans’ civil liberties through programs like REAL ID.

Ron Paul opposes both of these schemes and believes they will only make illegal immigration and the problems associated with it worse. He has been proud to see states exercising their Tenth Amendment rights and protecting their citizens by refusing to comply with the unconstitutional REAL ID law.

While the federal government neglects its constitutional responsibility to protect our borders, it continues to push mandates on the states to provide free education and medical care to illegal immigrants at a time when the states are drowning in debt. This must not be tolerated any longer.

Like most Americans, Ron Paul also understands just how valuable legal immigration is to our country.

Immigrants who want to work hard, obey our laws, and live the American Dream have always been great assets.
COMMON SENSE REFORMS

If elected President, Ron Paul will work to implement the following common sense reforms:

* Enforce Border Security – America should be guarding her own borders and enforcing her own laws instead of policing the world and implementing UN mandates.

* No Amnesty - The Obama Administration’s endorsement of so-called “Comprehensive Immigration Reform,” granting amnesty to millions of illegal immigrants, will only encourage more law-breaking.

* Abolish the Welfare State – Taxpayers cannot continue to pay the high costs to sustain this powerful incentive for illegal immigration. As Milton Friedman famously said, you can’t have open borders and a welfare state.

* End Birthright Citizenship – As long as illegal immigrants know their children born here will be granted U.S. citizenship, we’ll never be able to control our immigration problem.

* Protect Lawful Immigrants – As President, Ron Paul will encourage legal immigration by streamlining the entry process without rewarding lawbreakers.

As long as our borders remain wide open, the security and safety of the American people are at stake.

As President, Ron Paul will address immigration by fighting for effective solutions that protect our nation, uphold the rule of law, and respect every American citizen’s civil liberties.

 

[Feeding the Abscess]

He wants free movement of goods and labor, and doesn't want welfare and benefits given to illegal immigrants.

That's his position in a sentence.

 

[John F Kennedy III]

recent interview about it:
http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?320648-ron-paul-won-t-kow-tow-to-latino-vote

edit:
Also - http://ronpaulmyths.com/foreign-policy.php
new! Myth:ron paul is weak on iran and won't act to stop it from obtaining nuclear weapons.

Needs a space after myth:

New! Myth: Ron paul is weak on iran and won't act to stop it from obtaining nuclear weapons.

nice

 

[erowe1]

Okay, so I've been working on a website with many, many other grassroots supporters here called Ron Paul Myths. Now there's a lot of information on the net that clearly states Paul is against amnesty, and therefore our research has defended this point, shown here: http://ronpaulmyths.com/domestic-policy.php?expanddiv=immigration

At the same time, I've heard Cain supporters bash Paul by saying in one of his books he recently came out in favor of amnesty. So which one is it? Is Paul for or against amnesty? Or is he flip flopping on the issue?

He didn't come out in favor of amnesty. He came out against laws that force employers to verify that someone's not an illegal immigrant when they hire them. His position hasn't changed.

 

[sailingaway]

Ron Paul says that until the system is fixed we have to enforce our laws. Fixing the system means stopping illegal immigrants getting taxpayer funded education, etc. ending automatic birthright and easy citizenship, and letting the states enforce their own laws as well as letting private property owners enforce the laws by calling state police. After all subsidies were gone, and the birthright citizenship magnet were ended, then so long as they continued to not take taxpayer subsidies, didn't commit a crime, had lived here a long time and hadn't already caused problems, he'd be in favor of some kind of work permit that is not commutable into citizenship without them leaving and starting over. It would not grant chain migration, which is the huge point on numbers. You need to read Liberty Defined or look up his recent interview. But the magnets have to be dealt with first or more and more would always come illegally. He believes in borders and sovereignty.

No one else is addressing what they would do with those already here. They fudge and duck. There is no way it is stricter than this, Ron is just forthright about it.

What Cain says he would do is irrelevant because he changes what he would do on issues week to week and sounds every bit as decisive in his new view as he had in his old view.

 

[sailingaway]

He wants free movement of goods and labor, and doesn't want welfare and benefits given to illegal immigrants.

That's his position in a sentence.

but it isn't accurate. It leaves out that he believes in national sovereignty and the right of a nation to have borders and decide who comes in. He personally would want to let people in to work, with their spouse, only, not give automatic birthright citizenship, etc. But it isn't anarchy or open borders, and he would enforce the laws that existed.

 

[brushfire]

Getting them into the system /= citizenship

He's also come out and said that they are not entitled to school, or welfare of any kind. "Remove the entitlements and there's less incentive for them to come here"

 

[erowe1]

Numbers USA has the quotes they're concerned about here:
https://www.numbersusa.com/content/action/ron-paul.html

 

[Krugerrand]

He didn't come out in favor of amnesty. He came out against laws that force employers to verify that someone's not an illegal immigrant when they hire them. His position hasn't changed.

Excellent point to highlight in the discussion. So called "amnesty" has been a back-handed attempt to get RealID and additional government database/people tracking implemented - all at the expense of private businesses.

 

[Athan]

Tell the Cain supporters to shut the hell up from someone who LIVES in the Rio Grande Border.
(<- You see that badass flag on the left there? That my friend is the flag of the emphermal former Rio Grande Republic before Texas seceeded from Mexico. Laredo was to be the capital. INSTANT STREET CRED.)


He is against Amnesty.
He is against the border wall. (A joke since most trafficing is done by air, underground, or submerssables)
He is against drug war (which gives HUGE funds to the cartels. BIGGEST plus)
He is against scapegoating illegal immigrants as blame goes to them for economic problems.
(They ARE NOT WHY OUR MANUFACTURING JOBS ARE OVERSEAS. Good God you silly Cain supporters.)
He is against for subsidizing illegal immigration with welfare problems. (BIG problem)

He is for workers permit.
He is for boots on the border.
He is for gun rights.

Essentially no unfair freebees to illegal immigrants and workers. No persecution of them either so if they make it they will have to do on their own merits and without begging for hand outs. He wants to control the border as it is the job of the federal government but there is no need for a wall.

Again, I LIVE on the Rio Grande border and have to deal with border problems unlike GOP snobs who know nothing of the growing violence and illegal trades. I'm also Tejano. Hispanic Texan with roots back in the Texas republic and US.

Ron Paul's positions are the BEST ones availiable from ANY candidate (not sure about Gary Johnson's sorry) trying to actually FIX the border problems we have. Every other candidate is a joke. Perry allows Mexican military crossing OUR border rather regularly because the situation is really out of control. (Just military isn't enough. The ILLEGALITY of drugs brings in to much money for cartels able to counter military operations at person to person, financial, political, government, to military level.)

It gets rid of the ridiculous abuses of the welfare system of a woman birthing 5 kids for welfare dependence and no job. It also doesn't persecute some of the poorest folks in the country that are decent people who do assit with local economies and jobs. These guys are not going to take your white or blue collar work people. They just want to afford gas to got to work and eat. Ron Paul does want to ATTACK the biggest source of the drug cartels who's violence is not just insane but establishing itself in border counties. They are beheading people like they do chickens in "la frontera" Northern Mexico and dumping them on the street! Of course they are going to have the gall to challenge the mexican military and kill US citizens having a leisure cruise in Falcon Lake near Old Guerrero. They don't just get their guns from the US and ATF. Maybe those little douches that are pawns involved in cross gang violence get those. Real Zetas and Gulf Cartel guys have grenades and bazookas. They are military and they are former special ops.

 

[Liberty74]

From RP's campaign site...

* Enforce Border Security – America should be guarding her own borders and enforcing her own laws instead of policing the world and implementing UN mandates.

* No Amnesty - The Obama Administration’s endorsement of so-called “Comprehensive Immigration Reform,” granting amnesty to millions of illegal immigrants, will only encourage more law-breaking.

* Abolish the Welfare State – Taxpayers cannot continue to pay the high costs to sustain this powerful incentive for illegal immigration. As Milton Friedman famously said, you can’t have open borders and a welfare state.

* End Birthright Citizenship – As long as illegal immigrants know their children born here will be granted U.S. citizenship, we’ll never be able to control our immigration problem.

* Protect Lawful Immigrants – As President, Ron Paul will encourage legal immigration by streamlining the entry process without rewarding lawbreakers.

 

[Okie RP fan]

He wants free movement of goods and labor, and doesn't want welfare and benefits given to illegal immigrants.

That's his position in a sentence.

This is basically what I've come to conclude. He certainly does not support illegal immigration, but he is about the free market and uninhibited movement of goods for the people. I don't necessarily believe he is one of the many who want to throw up a physical fence, because he believes if you cut the head off of the snake (stated below), there will be no need for a fence.

He also wants to cease all sort of aid and benefits to illegal immigrants because that is part of the reason they come here and stay.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

against