How would you like it if...

[ronpaulitician]

How would we like it if Giuliani supporters came to this forum, and did what some Ron Paul supporters have done to this (click me) forum?

What if the rude behavior by some Ron Paul supporters results in "virtual blowback" in that the users of these messageboards that we invade decide to go vote against Ron Paul en masse in online polls? Imagine if Ron Paul suddenly drops to a 1-digit number in the MSNBC poll after the debate next week. And then the next day there are stories in the mainstream media about how the rude behavior of Ron Paul supporters lead to an organized effort to hurt Ron Paul in the polls.

Someone within the Ron Paul campaign has already told me that he, too, believes we need to set up guidelines for Ron Paul supporters, because he, too, has been bothered by the abusive behavior of some of the RP supporters.

Hopefully, Ron Paul himself will approve whatever guidelines we/the campaign comes up with. "I can do whatever I want. You don't control me." is not too uncommon a reply from these rude posters when I've approached them about the fact that they're supposed to represent Ron Paul. Perhaps if we show them the actual request by Ron Paul to behave a certain way, it might just be enough to let them see the error of their ways.

And these guidelines should not just apply to posting in online forums. Digg, YouTube, MySpace, letters to the editor, stamping money (I've stamped a couple of bills, but after reading some good arguments against it, I will no longer do so), putting stickers on private property, calling in to radio shows, etc.

Let's come up with some acceptable guidelines that will do two things:

1. Give Ron Paul the exposure he deserves.
2. Avoid antagonizing people who are not yet supporters of Ron Paul.

I've been posting in online forums for about ten years now. Here are some guidelines/principles I'd suggest:

• Restrict your posting to forums where you have been posting for some time now, and where the other users have a certain amount of respect for you. These users will listen to what you have to say more so than the users of a forum you've never visited before.
• If you haven't been posting in any forums in the recent past, try to restrict your posting to forums that are specifically set up for discussions of politics. Don't go post about Ron Paul on www.justflowersforums.com.
• Search for existing Ron Paul threads, and restrict your posting to those threads. Don't open a new thread for every new Ron Paul issue that you think of. This will allow users that do not want to read about Ron Paul to simply ignore the one thread about Ron Paul.
• Don't call anyone names. There are two things you accomplish when you call someone names: (1) You show the weakness of your argument. (2) You associate the name of Ron Paul with name-calling. If someone gets on your nerves, just ignore that poster. If they won't listen to your argument, move on to another poster.
• Don't talk just about Ron Paul. Discuss the issues. If the war on drugs comes up, don't just say "Ron Paul is against it." Talk about why you personally believe the war on drugs is a bad (or good) idea. "Those are my views, and I happen to think that Ron Paul is the candidate that most closely resembles my views" is a far more effective message than "Ron Paul, Ron Paul, Ron Paul!" Let the person on the other end get to know how you feel about the issues. Let them form an opinion of you as a person, because until they do, you're just an anonymous, faceless entity on the other end of the country, asking them to vote for someone they barely know.
• Know when to shut up. If you don't know enough about an issue, don't start debating the issue. Do your research. Read what the other posters have to say. Form an informed opinion before you post. As much as possible, back your arguments up with facts, and as much as possible, provide links to these facts.
• Be reasonable. If you disagree with Ron Paul on a certain issue, be frank about it. If you're not sure how you feel about a certain issue, be frank about it. Your goal should be to not only inform others about your views, but also to inform yourself about your own views. When someone asks you a tough question, don't be afraid to answer it to yourself. You may think you're for complete personal freedom, but does that mean people should be able to sell their own organs for profit? Should they be able to sell themselves into slavery? You may think you're against all forms of abortion, but what if a doctor tells you that a pregnant woman will definitely die if her baby is not aborted? You may be for or against gun control, but what if research shows that gun control or the lack thereof does the opposite of what you thought it would do? It's okay to change your mind on issues as you learn more about those issues. If you go into online discussions with the intent to learn, you'll automatically make for a much nicer discussion partner for the other users, and you're much more likely to have a positive effect on their view of Ron Paul.

 

[Brandybuck]

Thank you. I think one of us needs to go over there and apologize.

 

[ronpaulitician]

Thank you. I think one of us needs to go over there and apologize.

Done, but a slew of new Ron Paul threads (and even another apology thread) have bumped that apology to the next page already.

They don't need apologies at this point. They just need people to stop posting about Ron Paul. I don't think they'll be able to accomplish that without just removing all the Ron Paul threads. If it were my site, I would've done just that a long time ago.

 

[Bob Cochran]

The thinking here is good, but this is the Internet and people say crazy things. The Internet, blogosphere, whatever you wanna call it, is going to have an influence, but still a lot of people don't pay that much attention to the Internet.

Dr. Paul will have to slug it out in the debates, etc. I think he will do well on his own. It will help if his Internet supporters are "classy", of course, but we can't control what people are going to say on the web....

 

[Seth M.]

Good post. TY

 

[Bossobass]

I've gotta throw in my 2 cents here:

The guy called my candidate's comments at the GOP debate in SC, 'Exraordinarily absurd' and demanded an immediate apology, on national TV.

I was there. It was like swallowing an apple whole.

This marked the first attack of any GOP candidate against another in the debate format.

Since then, he has not only refused to debate his ridiculous claim, he has said repeatedly, in a cowardly fashion, through a spokesperson, that RP's claims are indeed absurd, and that, ""It is extraordinary and reckless to claim that the United States invited the attacks on September 11th."

This goes beyond rude and begs redress. If we let him off the hook, he walks away the apparent victor and is emboldened to do it again and again.

Also, it's a bit too politically correct to censor comments made in a public forum.

It's commendable that many such as yourself choose to conduct themselves in a polite and tactful manner, but equally out of place to become the manners police in a debate over mudslinging that was begun by Rudy Giuliani.

Forums have Mods. It does little good to apologize for someone else's comments. Rudy invited on line blowback, and it's fitting in the eyes of many, since Rudy has the MSM in his arsenal and RP does not.

I think the only way to end the problem you observe is for Rudy Giuliani to apologize to RP, on national TV. He would gain instant respect in every forum, IMO, and his detractors would be chastised much more readily.

Alas, I fear that it's far too late for Rudy, and I don't believe he's the kinda man who would apologize for anything he's done...ever.

 

[ronpaulitician]

...we can't control what people are going to say on the web....

We certainly can't control them all, but I am certain that a formal request by Ron Paul to behave a certain way will control some, if not many, of them. Combined with some self-policing, that'll go a long way towards preventing what has happened on the Daily Show messageboard.

 

[ronpaulitician]

The guy called my candidate's comments at the GOP debate in SC, 'Exraordinarily absurd' and demanded an immediate apology, on national TV.

I was there. It was like swallowing an apple whole.

This marked the first attack of any GOP candidate against another in the debate format.

Since then, he has not only refused to debate his ridiculous claim, he has said repeatedly, in a cowardly fashion, through a spokesperson, that RP's claims are indeed absurd, and that, ""It is extraordinary and reckless to claim that the United States invited the attacks on September 11th."

This goes beyond rude and begs redress. If we let him off the hook, he walks away the apparent victor and is emboldened to do it again and again.

So the blowback for Rudy's comments is an invasion of the Daily Show messageboard?

Also, it's a bit too politically correct to censor comments made in a public forum.

Public? Last I checked, forums like this are privately owned and operated.

It's commendable that many such as yourself choose to conduct themselves in a polite and tactful manner, but equally out of place to become the manners police in a debate over mudslinging that was begun by Rudy Giuliani.

Have you heard Ron Paul do any mudslinging? Did he call Giuliani any names in his press conference? Or on Bill Maher?

Forums have Mods.

And mods generally dislike using their moderation powers. Do we really want to allow a situation where we force mods to use their moderation powers because of the rude behavior of Ron Paul supporters? Do we want to force them to just start pulling any and all threads that have Ron Paul in them, or banning any and all posters that talk about Ron Paul? Because that's pretty much what happened at abcnews.com. If the situation at the Daily Show messageboard doesn't improve soon, that's what's going to have to happen there as well. Boom. That's two forums where we not only can no longer promote Ron Paul, but that's also two forums where the users will remember only the bad things about Ron Paul. When those users visit other forums, they'll tell everyone how Ron Paul supporters are so annoying that they had to be banned. Word will spread.

I've just about had it with the "Who are you to tell them how to behave?" attitude. I'm still passionate about supporting Ron Paul, and I can't see these idiot posters from changing my mind about that, but they sure are undoing a lot of the time and effort that reasonable supporters are putting in, and sure are making getting Dr. Paul elected a lot more difficult. I thought we'd have to overcome hurdles like the mainstream media, attack ads by the other opponents, etc., not the childish behavior of our own.

 

[hambone1982]

Well said, ronpaulitician.

People will not be convinced to vote for Ron Paul by attacking them. We need to push Ron Paul's message of strong classical Republican values of liberty and limited government. We don't need to piss people off and become a target that they can all focus on.

We need to be above reproach and we need not give them any ammo to throw at us. They're going to be gunning for us anyway.

 

[DjLoTi]

Hey, guys, lets just get along... mmmk???

We don't want any internal wars on this site.

 

[mesler]

I'd like to echo ronpaulitician's sentiments, I think the Giuliani folks who receive us as well as we'd receive them here. It's unhelpful and many people really get turned off by the way some people conduct themselves. It's just the way it is.

 

[ronpaulitician]

We don't want any internal wars on this site.

Do we want external wars on other sites?

If one doesn't think we need guidelines, simply ignore this thread.

If you do believe we need guidelines, let's use this thread to put something together. The people running the campaign are busy running the campaign. It'd be nice if we can prepare something for them, so that they can focus on getting Ron Paul as many MSM appearances as possible.

 

[RonPaul4President]

This is a revolution in the making. Hell, Ron Paul's statements on national television during the debates were, alone, a revolution. There are a LOT of pissed off people out there. Look what they/we have been subjected to since 2000. These people need to be allowed to let off some steam. Be prepared for much worse than what you're seeing now. The Revolution isn't going to be pretty, or easy.

 

[NewEnd]

Do we want external wars on other sites?

If one doesn't think we need guidelines, simply ignore this thread.

If you do believe we need guidelines, let's use this thread to put something together. The people running the campaign are busy running the campaign. It'd be nice if we can prepare something for them, so that they can focus on getting Ron Paul as many MSM appearances as possible.

Nobody is going to read, or heed yuour thread, unless they already would.

There are going to be idiots out there, doing retarded stuff.

there will also be peopel out there intetnionally creating mischief.

And there will always be Paul-haters. First they say its because of "spam" but soon they reveal their true colors as anti-libertarians. I know, I have run into them in real life. Some people really, really, hate libertarians. These people tend to come from the left.

 

[ronpaulitician]

This is a revolution in the making. Hell, Ron Paul's statements on national television during the debates were, alone, a revolution. There are a LOT of pissed off people out there. Look what they/we have been subjected to since 2000. These people need to be allowed to let off some steam. Be prepared for much worse than what you're seeing now. The Revolution isn't going to be pretty, or easy.

Since 2000? People have been subjected to a welfare state for almost a century. They've accepted wars. Many of them will accept Hillary and Giuliani.

If we allow the revolution to look like the what happened on the Daily Show messageboard, the revolution will die. The passion will lessen in those that want to use reason as their weapon of revolution, and the torch will be passed to those that use "Ghouliani", "homosexualist Romney", and "Operation Wetback", and spamming as their weapon of choice, and they'll miserably fail in their attempt to circumvent the mainstream media, and Paul's only voice to likely voters will be the angry shouts of his supporters. That kind of revolution is sure to fail.

 

[wwycher]

Whatever guys, I read that crap and I don't even what to say about it. I am sorry there are people who want to be rude and nasty to each other. They will probably be bitchin' all the way to FEMA camps as they are being pepper sprayed. All I know is I don't like all this shit thats goin' down and I want to protect my family against it. I believe Ron Paul is concerned about this too. I don't want to waste my time cursing in forums with brainwashed people. Its not their fault. THey are trained in our government funded schools. Lets do what we gotta do to stop the globalist from destoying this country and everything that makes it great.

 

[ronpaulitician]

There are going to be idiots out there, doing retarded stuff.

Not all of the ones doing retarded stuff out there are idiots. And even the ones that are may listen, at least to some degree, to Ron Paul's request.

there will also be peopel out there intetnionally creating mischief.

Nothing you can do about that, but I think it's unrealistic to believe that at this point, with Paul still polling way low in offline polls, the supporters of his opponents are going online pretending to be Ron Paul supporters just to cause havoc.

And there will always be Paul-haters. First they say its because of "spam" but soon they reveal their true colors as anti-libertarians. I know, I have run into them in real life. Some people really, really, hate libertarians. These people tend to come from the left.

Have you gone to the Daily Show forum?

 

[cujothekitten]

I agree wholeheartedly. I would hope that the people making these comments are just young and overly passionate. They need to understand that their comments are damaging the campaign and pushing away many perspective younger voters (I’m sure there are some older people as well) that use those message boards.

These aren't rules you're forced to follow but if you really want to help Ron Paul win you'd be smart to stick to them.

 

[X_805]

Lets do what we gotta do to stop the globalist from destoying this country and everything that makes it great.

Most people I know do not even know about globalism. It's sad, but true.

 

[Bossobass]

So the blowback for Rudy's comments is an invasion of the Daily Show messageboard?

Public? Last I checked, forums like this are privately owned and operated.

It's a public forum...period. If a poster violates a forum's rules, it's up to the mods to take appropriate action. Feel free to go over there and report the offenders, but take some spare time with you.

I've just about had it with the "Who are you to tell them how to behave?" attitude. I'm still passionate about supporting Ron Paul, and I can't see these idiot posters from changing my mind about that, but they sure are undoing a lot of the time and effort that reasonable supporters are putting in, and sure are making getting Dr. Paul elected a lot more difficult. I thought we'd have to overcome hurdles like the mainstream media, attack ads by the other opponents, etc., not the childish behavior of our own.

Calling others idiots and appealing for their censorship is not gonna accomplish much, IMO.

BTW, we ARE talking about Comedy Central, right?

I wonder how much time and effort RP supporters put into that forum? There's a forum violation in every thread in that place, and it's not exactly the first place I thought to go to spread the good news about RP. Heck, they even dis' Jon Stewart.

OTOH, some 50 threads appeared in that forum with RP in the title since last Friday. I wonder how many lurkers Googled RP? I'm sure not gonna venture a guess, but I wouldn't want to be the guy who says with any authority that political correctness and manners would have yielded a higher count.

Bosso