Forbes on DHS ammo purchases

[shane77m]

http://www.forbes.com/sites/ralphbe...ecurity-its-time-for-a-national-conversation/

The Denver Post, on February 15th, ran an Associated Press article entitled Homeland Security aims to buy 1.6b rounds of ammo, to far too little notice. It confirmed that the Department of Homeland Security has issued an open purchase order for 1.6 billion rounds of ammunition. As elsewhere reported, much of this purchase order is for rounds forbidden by international law for use in war plus a frightening amount specialized for snipers. Also reported elsewhere, at the height of the Iraq War the Army was expending fewer than 6 million rounds a month. 1.6 billion rounds, therefore, would be enough to sustain a hot war for 20+ years. In America.

Add to this perplexingly outré purchase of ammo, DHS now is showing off its acquisition of heavily armored personnel carriers, repatriated from the Iraqi and Afghani theaters of operation. As observed by “paramilblogger” Ken Jorgustin last September:
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“[T]he Department of Homeland Security is apparently taking delivery (apparently through the Marine Corps Systems Command, Quantico VA, via the manufacturer – Navistar Defense LLC) of an undetermined number of the recently retrofitted 2,717 ‘Mine Resistant Protected’ MaxxPro MRAP vehicles for service on the streets of the United States.” …

“These MRAP’s ARE BEING SEEN ON U.S. STREETS all across America by verified observers with photos, videos, and descriptions.

“Regardless of the exact number of MRAP’s being delivered to DHS (and evidently some to POLICE via DHS, as has been observed), why would they need such over-the-top vehicles on U.S. streets to withstand IEDs, mine blasts, and 50 caliber hits to bullet-proof glass? In a war zone… yes, definitely. Let’s protect our men and women. On the streets of America… ?

…

“They all have gun ports… Gun Ports? In the theater of war, yes. On the streets of America…?

“Seriously, why would DHS need such a vehicle on our streets?”

Why indeed? It is utterly inconceivable that Department of Homeland Security Secretary Janet Napolitano is planning a coup d’etat against President Obama, and the Congress, to install herself as Supreme Ruler of the United States of America. There, however, are real signs that the Department bureaucrats are running amok. About 20 years ago this columnist worked, for two years, in the U.S. Department of Energy’s general counsel’s office in its procurement and finance division. And is wise to the ways. The answer to “why would DHS need such a vehicle?” almost certainly is this: it’s a cool toy and these (reportedly) million dollar toys are being recycled, without much of a impact on the DHS budget. So… why not?

Why, indeed, should the federal government not be deploying armored personnel carriers and stockpiling enough ammo for a 20-year war in the homeland? Because it’s wrong in every way. President Obama has an opportunity, now, to live up to some of his rhetoric by helping the federal government set a noble example in a matter very close to his heart (and that of his Progressive base), one not inimical to the Bill of Rights: gun control. The federal government can (for a nice change) begin practicing what it preaches by controlling itself.

And … remember the … Sequester? The president is claiming its budget cuts will inconvenience travelers by squeezing essential services provided by the (opulently armed and stylishly uniformed) DHS. Quality ammunition is not cheap. (Of course, news reports that DHS is about to spend $50 million on new uniforms suggests a certain cavalier attitude toward government frugality.)

Spending money this way is beyond absurd well into perverse. According to the AP story a DHS spokesperson justifies this acquisition to “help the government get a low price for a big purchase.” Peggy Dixon, spokeswoman for the Federal Law Enforcement Training Center: “The training center and others like it run by the Homeland Security Department use as many as 15 million rounds every year, mostly on shooting ranges and in training exercises.”

At 15 million rounds (which, in itself, is pretty extraordinary and sounds more like fun target-shooting-at-taxpayer-expense than a sensible training exercise) … that’s a stockpile that would last DHS over a century. To claim that it’s to “get a low price” for a ridiculously wasteful amount is an argument that could only fool a career civil servant.

Meanwhile, Senator Diane Feinstein, with the support of President Obama, is attempting to ban 100 capacity magazine clips. Doing a little apples-to-oranges comparison, here, 1.6 billion rounds is … 16 million times more objectionable.

More at the link.

 

[Ranger29860]

http://www.forbes.com/sites/ralphbe...ecurity-its-time-for-a-national-conversation/

More at the link.

Talks about MRAPS but shows a tracked APC.

 

[thoughtomator]

I saw this earlier - I was shocked to see a mainstream mag run this story.

 

[shane77m]

Talks about MRAPS but shows a tracked APC.

Those will probably be next.

I saw this earlier - I was shocked to see a mainstream mag run this story.

It is surprising. That is the biggest reason I wanted to share the article. Everything in it is really old news.

 

[CPUd]

Hopefully, Forbes will stay on this; I suspect DHS is placing these orders in an attempt to create a shortage, and rather than use the ammo, they are gonna turn around and sell it.

 

[Tod]

I suspect DHS is placing these orders in an attempt to create a shortage, and rather than use the ammo, they are gonna turn around and sell it.

Wishful thinking, methinks. If we weren't facing such huge economic problems, that might be a good explanation.

 

[devil21]

It's still not entirely clear to me where this 1.6B rounds figure comes from.

 

[KingNothing]

Hopefully, Forbes will stay on this; I suspect DHS is placing these orders in an attempt to create a shortage, and rather than use the ammo, they are gonna turn around and sell it.

I suspect that they're just using up their budget in a way that they could sell to superiors. I guess it is no worse than naval fleets refueling, then dumping their fuel, repeatedly, to justify their bloated budgets.

 

[Michigan11]

Forbes reporting this, ads credibility to fearing your government to the mainstream voters and should be spread around. Many mainstream people today are reading survival blogs now and buying silver and guns, ammo, because of what Big G is doing, this is a great article to spread around. Put some thought into those that are on the fence.

 

[MoneyWhereMyMouthIs2]

Hopefully, Forbes will stay on this; I suspect DHS is placing these orders in an attempt to create a shortage, and rather than use the ammo, they are gonna turn around and sell it.

They'd destroy it, rather than sell it, just like their military counterparts.

 

[presence]

It's still not entirely clear to me where this 1.6B rounds figure comes from.

http://www.naturalnews.com/038407_ammunition_homeland_security_civil_war.html

 

[devil21]

http://www.naturalnews.com/038407_ammunition_homeland_security_civil_war.html

That write-up is somewhat misleading. I was following a thread on another forum about the actual purchase orders and where exactly this 1.6B figure comes from and there's specifics that are being ignored or misinterpreted. First, the PO for the 450million says "up to 450 million", not a flat out 450 million. Could end up being much less than 450 million. Most of the other purchase orders aren't even for DHS. Notice that the link above changes the narrative from "DHS buys 1.6 billion rounds" midway through the article to the "US Government buys...." For example, the FBI isn't under DHS, though that's one of the agencies in one of the included purchase orders that reaches the 1.6B mark. Then there's the recent purchase order that mistakes the Training Center's 240 cases for 2.4 million rounds when in reality it's 240,000 rounds. Infowars has been doing some dubious reporting on these figures. Im no gov't apologist but the numbers don't add up to 1.6B rounds and it certainly doesn't add up to 1.6B for DHS alone.

 

[presence]

"federal non-military agencies have bought"

yes these are 'purchase orders, not bullets in hand... yet

Even if its just .6 billion instead of 1.6 billion... that's still enough to shoot all of us twice.

 

[shane77m]

Even if they only purchase half of the 1.6 billion, that is enough ammo to last 50 years at their current consumption rate.

 

[TheTexan]

“Seriously, why would DHS need such a vehicle on our streets?”

Noone needs an assault vehicle... except the DHS, they need it...

 

[devil21]

I realize its a lot of ammo but Ive kinda accepted that once Infowars breaks stories you have to look deeper since they often play fast and loose with the facts to make a story a little more sensational than it otherwise would be to get hits. Most of these purchase orders/bid solicitations are open ended and over a period of time. The 450 million PO basically says "up to 450 million over 5 years", not "450 million at once". I would have thought a publication like Forbes would do more fact checking before running with figures that haven't really been vetted.

 

[Brian4Liberty]

The Denver Post, on February 15th, ran an Associated Press article entitled Homeland Security aims to buy 1.6b rounds of ammo, to far too little notice. It confirmed that the Department of Homeland Security has issued an open purchase order for 1.6 billion rounds of ammunition. As elsewhere reported, much of this purchase order is for rounds forbidden by international law for use in war plus a frightening amount specialized for snipers. Also reported elsewhere, at the height of the Iraq War the Army was expending fewer than 6 million rounds a month. 1.6 billion rounds, therefore, would be enough to sustain a hot war for 20+ years. In America.

Add to this perplexingly outré purchase of ammo, DHS now is showing off its acquisition of heavily armored personnel carriers, repatriated from the Iraqi and Afghani theaters of operation.

Insanity. Wow, the sequester has really stopped them from spending money. They are going to close the Whitehouse tours and make lines at TSA checkpoints look like the DMV, but they have money for this?

 

[Brian4Liberty]

Perhaps they are trying to corner the market on bullets and drive the price through the roof. Wonderful use of borrowed money, attempts at market manipulation.

 

[awake]

Look, at this point both the users of these 'vehicles', and their potential 'targets', know exactly what these units are for. It is silly for both sides to lie to themselves about it. This is simply the state using the last resort of its crummy rat infested tool bag: when all else fails, roll out the threatening weapons and let the people mull over their possible uses on them.

Bankruptcy and break away states are why they are arming domestically. Washington falls if any state succeeds in separating. I hope Ron Paul leads the way out.

 

[TheTexan]

Look, at this point both the users of these 'vehicles', and their potential 'targets', know exactly what these units are for. It is silly for both sides to lie to themselves about it. This is simply the state using the last resort of its crummy rat infested tool bag: when all else fails, roll out the threatening weapons and let the people mull over their possible uses on them.

Bankruptcy and break away states are why they are arming domestically. Washington falls if any state succeeds in separating. I hope Ron Paul leads the way out.

Ron Paul for President of Texas 2015