Me:
no.. i was saying that sometimes how a persons faith can be influenced by culture and diviate from what is in the bible
how being lutheran helps people be christ centered..
because it has a foundation in it
i used the example of politics.. did christ teach that we should make laws to force people to what we believe is right? or is it the behavior of God to allow a sense of freedom to turn from the truth.. how is it rational then that christians want to force ideology through politics.. it isnt within the example of God
thats culture influencing faith.. and divating from the will of God. God doesnt seek to conqure nations yet people want to see theocracy
seek
it reminds me of the influence of the catholic church during the reformation
My Aunt:
oh, i see, but wouldn't that be separation of Church and State ? ( i agree, thats why there shouldn't be a separation but there always will be) You would need a TRUE SINCERE BELIEVING FAITH to assure that government would be run as God would want his people to be govern, but that willl never happen sadly
Me:
the understanding of the Two Kingdoms that came out of the reformation was one of the starting theories of the seperation between church and state.. Christians should live out our faith.. but i dont understand how it is ethical to legislate it.. see.. Liberty is an important concept in politics as it is in religion.. We do not need a law to tell us what is right and wrong because we already have God's Word..
should we persecute those who dont think the same way that we do?
My Aunt:
Sounds good, its a borderline subject, too many people with out any or a incorrect perception of faith will not completely understand this way of thinking and believing. LIke you say, Its all in God's word and it is always like we are living in two different worlds, the ones you believe and the ones that don't and how do you combine the two in a good way according to God's word?
Me:
its not only the fact that the Christian ideal is different and wont work in the world.. It is part of our witness as Christans to represent our faith to others in the example of God.. God does so in Love, patience, understanding.. not force.. Force such as a lot of Christians seek to use against non christians in our culture..
My Aunt:
true, i think that is where being persecuted for you faith comes into play. When a true believer actually lives in love, patience etc.. Non believers don't quite get that way of witnessing. The others are really Christians in name only or misinterpret the bible.
Me:
ill use specific examples.. first within the united states its important to view things consitutionally.. meaning some laws are not meant to be made on a national level and that is for good purpose and meaning.. With Abortion; it goes along with murder and i will stand up for that point.. but for other things such as marriage; there are some laws that dont physically harm eachother that dont infringe on our rights as christians but instead infringe on the general nature of freedom.. we do not need something about marriage on any level to tell us what is right or give us the freedom to believe the way we do..
when non christians see that they do not understand a christians love the message of God is lost
My Aunt:
God considers a true marriage the way He meant it to be as a sacred commitment to one another. If you look at marriage from God's point of view it is only between a man and woman. Other's may have valid points to consider but it is only from secular thinking and not from the God of the Bible. they should have a legal union together, but if you understand what marriage really is meant to be by God's standards (which most don't) It's only suitable for a man and woman union . NOt saying most couples mess it up, hence, not following God's standards in the first place.
Me:
What God teaches about marriage I believe and subscribe to whole heartedly but do we honestly need a large government to tell us what is right or wrong? is it within the Word of God conquer nations in his name?
We need to have the understanding that small government comes hand in hand with civil liberties..
let people screw up.. culture can adapt to have places that do good and people who mess up
competition and freedom will help sustain those who do good
My Aunt:
Valid points.. It depends how you look at that, It so confusing to so many because of the separation of church and state, Its almost like half church and half state. but people still misunderstand the church part making it too secular. I wouldn't want the Pope or any religious figure head to rule over government. All I want is God to rule over EVERYTHING. It's like a said before, two different worlds.....
Me:
thats my point.. the pope shouldnt rule over government.. so shouldnt any other sinful christian, jewish person, muslim or athiest.. with people ruling over people we will make mistakes and hurt ourselves.. and even christians dont understand or do things to the Will of God.. in the end God will prevail but we should have the understanding that we do not or can not do things perfectly.. and so by the golden rule if we want to have the freedom to be christians we also have to understand that other people should be free so long as what we do do not infringe upon eachothers right to life liberty or property
My Aunt:
That's what this country is suppose to represent. But do you ever notice the most "picked" on group are
the Christians?
Well, said by the way.
well said, by the way (sorry for typos)
Me:
the big understanding should be the understanding of Large government vs Small government.. yea, know well and understand that christians get persecuted by people who would want us to stop believeing but this should open our eyes to the fact that both groups act in similar ways.. if we focus on small government both fiscally and within civil liberties there is no other choice to live and let live and christians will be persecuted less because of the over all perspective of the role of government in the lives of individuals
My Aunt:
You have great insight! I have to go to lunch now. Be back in an hour.
no.. i was saying that sometimes how a persons faith can be influenced by culture and diviate from what is in the bible
how being lutheran helps people be christ centered..
because it has a foundation in it
i used the example of politics.. did christ teach that we should make laws to force people to what we believe is right? or is it the behavior of God to allow a sense of freedom to turn from the truth.. how is it rational then that christians want to force ideology through politics.. it isnt within the example of God
thats culture influencing faith.. and divating from the will of God. God doesnt seek to conqure nations yet people want to see theocracy
seek
it reminds me of the influence of the catholic church during the reformation
My Aunt:
oh, i see, but wouldn't that be separation of Church and State ? ( i agree, thats why there shouldn't be a separation but there always will be) You would need a TRUE SINCERE BELIEVING FAITH to assure that government would be run as God would want his people to be govern, but that willl never happen sadly
Me:
the understanding of the Two Kingdoms that came out of the reformation was one of the starting theories of the seperation between church and state.. Christians should live out our faith.. but i dont understand how it is ethical to legislate it.. see.. Liberty is an important concept in politics as it is in religion.. We do not need a law to tell us what is right and wrong because we already have God's Word..
should we persecute those who dont think the same way that we do?
My Aunt:
Sounds good, its a borderline subject, too many people with out any or a incorrect perception of faith will not completely understand this way of thinking and believing. LIke you say, Its all in God's word and it is always like we are living in two different worlds, the ones you believe and the ones that don't and how do you combine the two in a good way according to God's word?
Me:
its not only the fact that the Christian ideal is different and wont work in the world.. It is part of our witness as Christans to represent our faith to others in the example of God.. God does so in Love, patience, understanding.. not force.. Force such as a lot of Christians seek to use against non christians in our culture..
My Aunt:
true, i think that is where being persecuted for you faith comes into play. When a true believer actually lives in love, patience etc.. Non believers don't quite get that way of witnessing. The others are really Christians in name only or misinterpret the bible.
Me:
ill use specific examples.. first within the united states its important to view things consitutionally.. meaning some laws are not meant to be made on a national level and that is for good purpose and meaning.. With Abortion; it goes along with murder and i will stand up for that point.. but for other things such as marriage; there are some laws that dont physically harm eachother that dont infringe on our rights as christians but instead infringe on the general nature of freedom.. we do not need something about marriage on any level to tell us what is right or give us the freedom to believe the way we do..
when non christians see that they do not understand a christians love the message of God is lost
My Aunt:
God considers a true marriage the way He meant it to be as a sacred commitment to one another. If you look at marriage from God's point of view it is only between a man and woman. Other's may have valid points to consider but it is only from secular thinking and not from the God of the Bible. they should have a legal union together, but if you understand what marriage really is meant to be by God's standards (which most don't) It's only suitable for a man and woman union . NOt saying most couples mess it up, hence, not following God's standards in the first place.
Me:
What God teaches about marriage I believe and subscribe to whole heartedly but do we honestly need a large government to tell us what is right or wrong? is it within the Word of God conquer nations in his name?
We need to have the understanding that small government comes hand in hand with civil liberties..
let people screw up.. culture can adapt to have places that do good and people who mess up
competition and freedom will help sustain those who do good
My Aunt:
Valid points.. It depends how you look at that, It so confusing to so many because of the separation of church and state, Its almost like half church and half state. but people still misunderstand the church part making it too secular. I wouldn't want the Pope or any religious figure head to rule over government. All I want is God to rule over EVERYTHING. It's like a said before, two different worlds.....
Me:
thats my point.. the pope shouldnt rule over government.. so shouldnt any other sinful christian, jewish person, muslim or athiest.. with people ruling over people we will make mistakes and hurt ourselves.. and even christians dont understand or do things to the Will of God.. in the end God will prevail but we should have the understanding that we do not or can not do things perfectly.. and so by the golden rule if we want to have the freedom to be christians we also have to understand that other people should be free so long as what we do do not infringe upon eachothers right to life liberty or property
My Aunt:
That's what this country is suppose to represent. But do you ever notice the most "picked" on group are
the Christians?
Well, said by the way.
well said, by the way (sorry for typos)
Me:
the big understanding should be the understanding of Large government vs Small government.. yea, know well and understand that christians get persecuted by people who would want us to stop believeing but this should open our eyes to the fact that both groups act in similar ways.. if we focus on small government both fiscally and within civil liberties there is no other choice to live and let live and christians will be persecuted less because of the over all perspective of the role of government in the lives of individuals
My Aunt:
You have great insight! I have to go to lunch now. Be back in an hour.
