14 Wacky "Facts" Kids Will Learn in Louisiana's Voucher Schools

[ATXRevolutionary]

http://www.motherjones.com/blue-marble/2012/07/photos-evangelical-curricula-louisiana-tax-dollars

What are your thoughts on Louisana's new voucher system? One of my Democrat friends sent me the above link and is freaking out. He is pointing to it as a reason we need more government control over what we teach children and why we shouldn't be helping private schools. How would you respond?

 

[torchbearer]

who should decided what your children learn, you or your neighbor?

 

[torchbearer]

plus, the teacher union is threatening to sue anyone who used the vouchers.
i went to private school many years ago before vouchers. my parents paid to send someone else's kid to public school and paid for my education on top of that.
the voucher program allows parents to choose what school to send their money and kid.
i could see why shitty teachers and schools would hate such a program.

 

[Yieu]

Parents should be allowed to teach their children what they want to. The government should never tell parents what their child must be taught.

 

[CaptUSA]

My concerns about vouchers are higlighted here, but not in the way the author intended.

I'm afraid of the strings attached to the "gubmint" money. As this article shows, it is very easy to demagogue any education that doesn't fit the norm. And of course, the "norm" is defined by those that couldn't care less about education and care more about having the monopoly on ideas.

But just like any other subsidy, I fear that private schools will become addicted to the vouchers and will bend their curriculum in order to keep receiving the money. So not only have to created another subsidy, but you have also ruined some of the best organized education left.

 

[torchbearer]

My concerns about vouchers are higlighted here, but not in the way the author intended.

I'm afraid of the strings attached to the "gubmint" money. As this article shows, it is very easy to demagogue any education that doesn't fit the norm. And of course, the "norm" is defined by those that couldn't care less about education and care more about having the monopoly on ideas.

But just like any other subsidy, I fear that private schools will become addicted to the vouchers and will bend their curriculum in order to keep receiving the money. So not only have to created another subsidy, but you have also ruined some of the best organized education left.

well, yeah- private schools only would be the best way to go with no government tax/money being used, but this program does create a market force in the school system that is need.
prior to this program, failing schools got more funding and good schools got budget cuts.

 

[dannno]

Wait a minute, the first paragraph says that the kids will be learning this stuff on the TAXPAYERS dime... Isn't the entire idea of the voucher system that the parents get BACK their taxes that they would normally spend on school and then decide which school to give that money to instead of letting the government decide for them?

 

[torchbearer]

Wait a minute, the first paragraph says that the kids will be learning this stuff on the TAXPAYERS dime... Isn't the entire idea of the voucher system that the parents get BACK their taxes that they would normally spend on school and then decide which school to give that money to instead of letting the government decide for them?

well, technically- the money is taken by force from a parents paycheck, goes to a general fund- then dispersed.
but yeah, for the working person- it is their money to begin with.

 

[CaptUSA]

well, yeah- private schools only would be the best way to go with no government tax/money being used, but this program does create a market force in the school system that is need.
prior to this program, failing schools got more funding and good schools got budget cuts.

I hear ya. That's what they say. But we must always look how government subsidies work. They will not allow you to use your voucher at just any school. You have to pick a school from their approved list. If a private school wants to be on the list - and of course they do - they will have to conform.

When this happens, any market forces that may have been created have been destroyed. And they have removed the market system that was in place before the programs started.

I'm all for school choice, but it's got to be the consumer's choice. I'm afraid voucher programs, while they sound like a good idea initially, are actually more harmful than the status quo. If they just got rid of taxpayer funded education (at least on federal and state level), then we wouldn't have to worry about creating a new program to counteract their last program.

 

[squarepusher]

well, technically- the money is taken by force from a parents paycheck, goes to a general fund- then dispersed.
but yeah, for the working person- it is their money to begin with.

it would depend on your tax level. For some people, who pay little taxes other tax payers subsidize their 'allotment' (guessing 5k per student per year). For high tax payers, they may pay well more than their 'allotment,' the same goes for people with no children to use schools (these people would be paying for kids to learn about how humans used to ride dinosaurs).

 

[jmdrake]

http://www.motherjones.com/blue-marble/2012/07/photos-evangelical-curricula-louisiana-tax-dollars

What are your thoughts on Louisana's new voucher system? One of my Democrat friends sent me the above link and is freaking out. He is pointing to it as a reason we need more government control over what we teach children and why we shouldn't be helping private schools. How would you respond?

Obviously liberals would rather children be illiterate than face the possibility of learning something "wrong". Take the KKK "whacky fact". Actually the KKK was so pervasive in some parts of the country (Birmingham Alabama during the early 20th century for example) that to have any kind of power role you almost had to be a member. Several police chiefs of that era were KKK members. So the " In some communities it achieved a certain respectability as it worked with politicians." whacky fact is actually true. Some members of Hezbollah are "respectable politicians" in their communities. Some Nazi party members attempted to do some good. And? So?

 

[jmdrake]

My concerns about vouchers are higlighted here, but not in the way the author intended.

I'm afraid of the strings attached to the "gubmint" money. As this article shows, it is very easy to demagogue any education that doesn't fit the norm. And of course, the "norm" is defined by those that couldn't care less about education and care more about having the monopoly on ideas.

But just like any other subsidy, I fear that private schools will become addicted to the vouchers and will bend their curriculum in order to keep receiving the money. So not only have to created another subsidy, but you have also ruined some of the best organized education left.

^This! Private schools have more to fear from vouchers than do private school opponents.

 

[jmdrake]

Wait a minute, the first paragraph says that the kids will be learning this stuff on the TAXPAYERS dime... Isn't the entire idea of the voucher system that the parents get BACK their taxes that they would normally spend on school and then decide which school to give that money to instead of letting the government decide for them?

And if you're a parent who doesn't pay taxes because of your financial status? That said, vouchers theoretically can be structure various ways.

 

[dannno]

And if you're a parent who doesn't pay taxes because of your financial status?

Well in that case in the old system that money is going to public school where your kids are forced to attend. I'd rather give them the money to spend it at the institution of their choice than put, YET ANOTHER, decision in the hands of government.

 

[jmdrake]

Well in that case in the old system that money is going to public school where your kids are forced to attend. I'd rather give them the money to spend it at the institution of their choice than put, YET ANOTHER, decision in the hands of government.

Or you could give the voucher to the taxpayer. You can donate it to whatever school you choose. Parents, if they want to go to school free, have to pick from one of those options.

 

[Demigod]

I always thought that a complete voucher system would be the best replacement for a public education.

Every kid would have to take 2 classes which would be mandatory native language and literature ( in the USA English ) and math for which there would be a class every day.Then on top of that there could be another 20 classes a week that the parents and students would choose how to fill.They could choose the teachers and the schools and kids could even take different classes in different schools.

If some parents want their kids to be home schooled then they would get a tax break of a 10 year period ( the time needed to get to college )

 

[Demigod]

Or you could give the voucher to the taxpayer. You can donate it to whatever school you choose. Parents, if they want to go to school free, have to pick from one of those options.

Bad idea for example in my country gypsies have 6+ kids ( although most don't even reach 30 ) if you give them a voucher for every kid they would turn into a business.In the USA you have welfare queens that will become hive queens that will just pump out kids for money.

 

[PierzStyx]

Mark Twain WAS a hack.

 

[jmdrake]

Bad idea for example in my country gypsies have 6+ kids ( although most don't even reach 30 ) if you give them a voucher for every kid they would turn into a business.In the USA you have welfare queens that will become hive queens that will just pump out kids for money.

Ummmm....apparently you didn't understand what I wrote. When I said "give the voucher to the taxpayer" that means "If you pay $1,000 in taxes you should get a voucher where you can give some or all of that money to a school". The amount of money you would get in vouchers wouldn't be based on the amount of kids that you have, but the amount of taxes that you paid. Someone sitting around having kids and collecting welfare isn't a taxpayer.

 

[The Free Hornet]

I always thought that a complete voucher system would be the best replacement for a public education.

Every kid would have to take 2 classes which would be mandatory native language and literature ( in the USA English ) and math for which there would be a class every day.Then on top of that there could be another 20 classes a week that the parents and students would choose how to fill.They could choose the teachers and the schools and kids could even take different classes in different schools.

If some parents want their kids to be home schooled then they would get a tax break of a 10 year period ( the time needed to get to college )

This doesn't replace public education, it recreates it.

Who is to say how many classes there should be? Colorado College students only take one class at a time.

Mandates exist for the benefit of the lobbyists, not the taxpayers.