When the 2nd Amendment becomes obsolete

[winston84]

I read this response on another thread as to why someone should remain in this country if RP fails to become president.

"Don't run...you will just die tired.

If you let them run you out of the country of your birth against your will, you have ceded your natural rights, and totally missed the intent of the 2nd Amendment."

Now don't get me wrong, I do believe that citizens should have the right to bear arms. The only problem is that, speaking from a technological point of view don't you think that quashing a government when it becomes tyrannical is starting to look like an impossible feat? The argument and purpose behind the 2nd amendment is starting to loss its function (not that it should go anywhere either )

Do you really think that citizens armed with guns that abide the laws in your state would be able to topple such a government considering that you may have to go up against the National Guard that has military grade weapons at their disposal? I'm not making a case for looser guns laws either, I'm just exploring this topic.

 

[austinphish]

look at what they are doing to our military in Iraq

you don't need special weapons to resist tyranny. automatic rifles and some home made bombs will do.

yikes - I even scare myself sometimes.

 

[cujothekitten]

He's acting like parts of the military wouldn't join the resistance.

If this country started a forceful revolution people would 1) stop paying taxes which means no paycheck for the military, 2) members of the military would split up and pick a side, 3) people would also be using unconventional weapons and 4) many of the people fighting would also be ex-military. If you mix that with a well-armed population you have the makings of a strong resistance with a better chance at defeating a tyrant.

In his world though he wants to just give up because he thinks the other side is too strong. Unfortunately he's not considering the above scenarios, which are likely to happen.

 

[NewEnd]

look at Iraq to learn how an insurgency operates.

Plus, if there ever were violent revolution, there would be alot of ex-military, and possibly even break-away generals, colonels, etc.

Also, airpower would not be nearly the option it is in Iraq.... because it would be our own cities we would be reducing to rubble, and it would be American getting slaughtered by the bucketload. So it would have to be more of a soldier vs rebel small arms type battles.

------

Oh damn Cujo..... I should have read your post first... we thinkexactly alike.

 

[Seth M.]

I would like to suggest that topics such as these are used by covert ops programs to disseminate hate and inspire dissent of the worst kind. Under the PA all internet content is monitored. Im sure there are some that would love Ron Paul supporters to be labels as threatening. PLease keep this in mind when you use key words such as |8? ..0_mb

to add to the conversation. NO formal military can fight a goorilla tactic enemy, and win. Look at iraq or vietnam. This is the only reason we have not been formally attacked here. America is armed and must always be so.

 

[winston84]

Wow you guys need to get off my nuts, I just wanted to know what everybody else thought about this. I was looking at it from a standpoint of ordinary citizens that happen to be armed versus the establishment. You guys are right about the other scenarios that would likely make for a well armed resistance. I have just been disenchanted with the rise of anti-riot equipment (ie sonic tanks) and weapons being developed.

If the administrators deem this thread as not being helpful for the RP campaign, go ahead and remove it immediately.

 

[aravoth]

Having been in the active duty army, and been on several deployments, I can say with all certainty, no. They are not as omnipresent as people think. Hollywood does a great job of making them look superhuman, but in reality they are not, not even close.

 

[Kuldebar]

The reason for the 2nd Amendment will never become obsolete because human nature doesn't change. The right to self-defense and a check against tyranny will always be necessary.

Eternal vigilance is the price of liberty—power is ever stealing from the many to the few…. The hand entrusted with power becomes … the necessary enemy of the people. Only by continual oversight can the democrat in office be prevented from hardening into a despot: only by unintermitted Agitation can a people be kept sufficiently awake to principle not to let liberty be smothered in material prosperity.

-Wendell Phillips (1811–1884), Speeches Before the Massachusetts Anti-Slavery Society

 

[Korey Kaczynski]

The reason for the 2nd Amendment will never become obsolete because human nature doesn't change. The right to self-defense and a check against tyranny will always be necessary.

-Wendell Phillips (1811–1884), Speeches Before the Massachusetts Anti-Slavery Society

The people wanted communism in many countries, and then they were promptly disarmed and oppressed (lol). There's no reason to be so certain; after all, neoconservatism is extremely close to communism.

 

[RonPaul4President]

...neoconservatism is extremely close to communism.

With the main difference being the poor dying homeless, instead of employed slaves.

 

[angelatc]

Google "Halliburton Internment Camps"

 

[Kregener]

I believe your question has been answered.

Ask yourself why the most powerful, technologically advanced and trained military on the planet is struggling so with "insurgents" over in Chaostan.

Now mulitply their numbers by 100.

There are 80 million gun-owners in America. Only a million or two would have to "rise up" to strike fear into the statist one-worlders who have co-opted our government.

 

[RonPaul4President]

Google "Halliburton Internment Camps"

Ironically, the personnel used to do the dirty work are breaking their sworn oath to defend the Constitution when they arrest a dissentor. This is sick and deranged.

 

[Kuldebar]

The people wanted communism in many countries, and then they were promptly disarmed and oppressed (lol). There's no reason to be so certain; after all, neoconservatism is extremely close to communism.

I am absolutely certain that human nature doesn't change, that is why we will always need the 2nd Amendment. Oppression can come in many forms with various labels and democracy isn't special by any measure in regards to the issue of tyranny. The people that wish to have power and control over others will always exist and the need to resist them will require the means to resist.

 

[rwbris18]

Just one last thought about an armed rebellion.

Guerilla tactics... aimed at a leader... CANNOT be controlled by military force especially if someone is willing to die for the cause.

 

[SWATH]

as long as a weapon can kill, it will never be obsolete.

 

[agentl074]

1. All weapons (including battle rifles) have collector and shooting sports value.
2. Criminals will not discontinue buying from black market sources.
3. Law abiding citizens will suffer.


Now here is what the NEW gun control measure should state:

1. All weapons (including automatic) should be made availible to law abiding citizens.
- It is a proven fact that all around the world - citizens who arm themselves appropriately are able to deter crime (Switzerland).
2. RESTORE the US Constitutional right of the people to bear ALL arms to resist tyranny!
- When the people are so armed to protect themselves - criminals do have enough of a brain to realise the fact that they will be gunned down at every encounter!

 

[TruckinMike]

Only a million or two would have to "rise up" to strike fear into the statist one-worlders who have co-opted our government.

Do you really think that "a million or two" would rise up? I'm more inclined to believe that less than 100,000 patriots would be willing stand in the face of tyranny with arms. Remember, of those 80 million, 79 million have families, are to old, or lack the resolve. That leaves 1 million that might make a stand. Of them, only a handful would actually make it to the fight. And when does this fight start? Who starts it? Is it another waco? A ruby ridge? No one stood up then, why would they now? I personally don't believe there will be a fight. Not unless something really oppressive happens. FEMA camps for dissidents (Ron Paul supporters), multiple mass killings, suspension of the Constitution,etc. - All happening simultaneously.

What do you think it would take?

TMike

 

[RedLightning]

Do you really think that citizens armed with guns that abide the laws in your state would be able to topple such a government considering that you may have to go up against the National Guard that has military grade weapons at their disposal? I'm not making a case for looser guns laws either, I'm just exploring this topic.

Some military troops might join or just sit out the Revolution. Various gov't agencies like the ATF and other thugs are the ones you have to watch out for.

 

[xd9fan]

If its time to bury them....its time to use them.