US just don't like anybody to tell them that they are wrong...

uncollapse · Mar 21, 2008

that the iraq war was a mistake...
that our CIA interfering with Iranian politics was a mistake...
that we proped up and support Taliban against Russains was a mistake...
that we detention/torture at Guantánamo was a mistake...
that our support for the militant dictator Musharraf was a mistake...
that the assasination of two-time Prime Minister Benazir Bhutto was our mistake..

And quoting Jeremiah's sermon on 911:
“We have supported state terrorism against the Palestinians and black South Africans, and now we are indignant because the stuff that we have done overseas is now brought right back into our own front yards. America’s chickens are coming home to roost. "

Violence begets violence. Hatred begets hatred. Can we really quench the terrorism fear with acts of violence against our enemies?

Food for thoughts... I am saddened by how our country got into such a complicated mess.... Ron Paul is absolutely right on this point. A non-intervention foreign policy is the best policy.

uncollapse · Mar 21, 2008

so this is really true....

icon124 · Mar 22, 2008

yea I wish I had a response other than that...but it's all true..what do you want me to say lol

uncollapse · Mar 22, 2008

icon124 said:
yea I wish I had a response other than that...but it's all true..what do you want me to say lol

ChickenHawk · Mar 22, 2008

None of those things were a mistake. There were plenty of mistakes made in implementing many of those policies but the policies themselves were not mistakes. The world is a complicated place with lots of people trying to grab power for themselves. You can't just decide that everything is simple and if you mind your own business everyone will not end up holding hands and signing Kumbaya. The US definitely is over involved in the world but non interventionism is totally unworkable. The fact that non-interventionism has not been to policy of ANY administration in the history of this country says something.

soapmistress · Mar 22, 2008

Uncollapse - are you by any chance Cliff Potter from newsvine.com?

uncollapse · Mar 22, 2008

soapmistress said:
Uncollapse - are you by any chance Cliff Potter from newsvine.com?

No, Mdm.

But I just searched for this guy... he wrote an interesting article here...
http://cliffpotter.newsvine.com/_ne...horror-the-war-national-perspectives-and-iraq

"Another sensitive and essential question is: "What does the world think?" We need all such perspectives, and to answer these questions from a moral standpoint. Not just from an egotistical, self-centered perspective. Not just a way to win an election, but completely removed from all political ramifications..."

Can we really restore our moral authority in the world by just pulling out our troops in iraq? Is there any moral obligations to rebuild the destructions we had caused? Can a military presence and ally in iraq help us against religious extremists? Tough... really bugs me why anyone wants to be president at times like this...

soapmistress · Mar 22, 2008

I'm not sure what it means to restore our moral authority in the world. Why would we have a moral authority?

Are we worried about religious extremists? I am not entirely convinced that religious extremism is the problem we are facing here.

soapmistress · Mar 22, 2008

That's strange. I was going to link to one of Cliff Potter's articles about how he is switching from Obama to John McCain. I just read it a half hour ago but now the article has restricted access to newsvine members only! Weird huh?

http://cliffpotter.newsvine.com/_news/2008/02/22/1318711-a-lifelong-democrat-switches-to-mccain-a-clinton-supporters-personal-journey-

Anyways, something I found really interesting is that this guy, who switched from Obama to McCain, *also* has an article about "ending blog tyrrany" - see I guess on Newsvine the way that members shut each other up when they don't agree with them is that they go around collapsing each others comments. Some of them get really snarky about it. So this Cliff Potter guy actually wrote an article in his column about - get this - how all the comments should be left uncollapsed! That is so peculiar!

soapmistress · Mar 22, 2008

Well my goodness! That whole switching-to-McCain article has now been completely deleted from Cliff Potter's column! Truly an oddity, I tell you.

uncollapse · Mar 22, 2008

soapmistress said:
That's strange. I was going to link to one of Cliff Potter's articles about how he is switching from Obama to John McCain. I just read it a half hour ago but now the article has restricted access to newsvine members only! Weird huh?

http://cliffpotter.newsvine.com/_news/2008/02/22/1318711-a-lifelong-democrat-switches-to-mccain-a-clinton-supporters-personal-journey-

Anyways, something I found really interesting is that this guy, who switched from Obama to McCain, *also* has an article about "ending blog tyrrany" - see I guess on Newsvine the way that members shut each other up when they don't agree with them is that they go around collapsing each others comments. Some of them get really snarky about it. So this Cliff Potter guy actually wrote an article in his column about - get this - how all the comments should be left uncollapsed! That is so peculiar!

LOL. you are just too cute. Why don't you send an email to Cliff Potter and ask him whether he had an account here at RPforums called uncollapse? I rather let my other ego self (which you had deduced so far) entertain you

uncollapse · Mar 22, 2008

soapmistress said:
Well my goodness! That whole switching-to-McCain article has now been completely deleted from Cliff Potter's column! Truly an oddity, I tell you.

LOL. this is so funny. I am really speechless. What else can i say.

soapmistress · Mar 22, 2008

I don't know! That was really weird! Ha!

Anyways, what do you think our moral authority in the world is, and how should it manifest itself? I'm trying to figure out what you're referring to... like spreading democracy, or doing missionary work or something else entirely? Can you elaborate on that?

soapmistress · Mar 22, 2008

Whoever he is, his ears must be burning. He's now taken down his profile picture! LOLOL!!!!

uncollapse · Mar 22, 2008

soapmistress said:
Anyways, what do you think our moral authority in the world is, and how should it manifest itself? I'm trying to figure out what you're referring to... like spreading democracy, or doing missionary work or something else entirely? Can you elaborate on that?

If we want to be policeman of the world, we need moral authority, just like a general needs moral authority in order to convince his men that the war is worth fighting/dying for. How can US rally other nations to fight against a war against terror when US had supported terrorists groups in the past? How can US stop the war against human rights in Africa when US had secret prisons that defy human rights?

uncollapse · Mar 22, 2008

soapmistress said:
Whoever he is, his ears must be burning. He's now taken down his profile picture! LOLOL!!!!

this guy is really not cooperating.. he took his picture down from http://cliffpotter.newsvine.com/. it was there when i last visited.

i am really speechless now. its either you are colluding with him to create this soap opera or he was really my long-lost ego self who got entangled with me again. :confused:

soapmistress · Mar 22, 2008

uncollapse said:
If we want to be policeman of the world, we need moral authority, just like a general needs moral authority in order to convince his men that the war is worth fighting/dying for. How can US rally other nations to fight against a war against terror when US had supported terrorists groups in the past? How can US stop the war against human rights in Africa when US had secret prisons that defy human rights?

Oh - well I don't think we should assume moral authority in those areas. I don't think most people here would either. I see now the perspective that the original question was coming from - I thought it was directed more towards us needing a justification for moral authority. Bleh. I'm not making sense.

soapmistress · Mar 22, 2008

uncollapse said:
this guy is really not cooperating.. he took his picture down from http://cliffpotter.newsvine.com/. it was there when i last visited.

i am really speechless now. its either you are colluding with him to create this soap opera or he was really my long-lost ego self who got entangled with me again.

Sorry dude. Never known the guy. The only Soap I deal with is the caustic variety. No opera for me, thanks... :rolleyes:

uncollapse · Mar 22, 2008

soapmistress said:
Oh - well I don't think we should assume moral authority in those areas. I don't think most people here would either. I see now the perspective that the original question was coming from - I thought it was directed more towards us needing a justification for moral authority. Bleh. I'm not making sense.

if only US pursue a non-intervention foreign policy, then who gives a crap about moral authority in the world... but the irony of the situation is countries having a non-intervention foreign policy has far superior moral authority than US. IMO

uncollapse · Mar 22, 2008

soapmistress said:
Sorry dude. Never known the guy. The only Soap I deal with is the caustic variety. No opera for me, thanks...

i think i want to send him an email asking him if he was really my long lost ego-self.

US just don't like anybody to tell them that they are wrong...

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