No Amnesty Petition: Sign It & Post Elsewhere

[Lord Xar]

http://www.noamnestypetition.com/

 

[kylejack]

I figure they're probably going to get amnesty. It'll be fine, as long as restrictions are eased for legal immigrants. Immigrating to the country is insanely difficult.

 

[Lord Xar]

No, it still has to pass on Thursday and THEN it has to get past the house, which is pretty much impossible right now as a coalition of republicans have signed a blockage to it.

Amnesty is NOT good... at all. Even if you have Provisions and what not. You have to look at the population explosion, the family inclusions, the preferences in schools etc... The responsibiilty of America is NOT to help others OVER helping our own. Its just bad business... but BIG BUSINESS doesn't care... it will see you ground to dust if it means saving a buck.

Allowing 20million illegals amnesty is a horrible horrible policy on sooo many levels.

Check these out:

Part 1: (more of a commercial against illegal immig)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uHs2Jfbh90o&mode=related&search=

Part 2: (professor talks about population EXPLOSION in US)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z2RKBxR3BTI

--> keep in mind that the academic is talking about 1 million LEGALS per year when he is doing the numbers... he doesn't even include the 20million undocumented that will given LEGAL status or their families from wherever...

 

[kylejack]

Population explosion sounds great. That's what fueled the Industrial Revolution in this country and made the US an economic powerhouse.

 

[literatim]

I figure they're probably going to get amnesty. It'll be fine, as long as restrictions are eased for legal immigrants. Immigrating to the country is insanely difficult.

Do you really want the US to be a 3rd world country?

 

[Lord Xar]

I figure they're probably going to get amnesty. It'll be fine, as long as restrictions are eased for legal immigrants. Immigrating to the country is insanely difficult.

The point is that THEY GET CITIZENSHIP IN 24hours..... They are suppose to get a background check or 24 hours.. WHATEVER COMES FIRST!!

Now, the legal path takes, how long???? think on that.. and how unfair this bill is.

Bush wants SLAVE LABOUR FOR BIG BUSINESS and to promote his North American Union (SPP) .... lets wake up people

 

[kylejack]

Do you really want the US to be a 3rd world country?

Ahem. That's impossible. We are the United States, therefore we are a First World Country, as are any countries that were allied with us in the Cold War.

 

[kylejack]

The point is that THEY GET CITIZENSHIP IN 24hours..... They are suppose to get a background check or 24 hours.. WHATEVER COMES FIRST!!

Now, the legal path takes, how long???? think on that.. and how unfair this bill is.

Bush wants SLAVE LABOUR FOR BIG BUSINESS and to promote his North American Union (SPP) .... lets wake up people

I agree, legal immigration is insanely unfair and is fueling the illegal immigration into this country.

 

[MGS]

Hey i just noticed that snake Saul Anuziz is on this petition! Oh well i guess ill sign it anyway...

 

[Lord Xar]

Population explosion sounds great. That's what fueled the Industrial Revolution in this country and made the US an economic powerhouse.

No, you are wrong. You are schill and it sounds like it.

When you have a HUGE population of LOW SKILLED workers with Minimal education, you create a HUGE mass of poor people. There are already tax breaks for big business and the rich.. so who do you think will pay for this social epidemic.. yes, the middle class.

So the middle class will shrink. The rich will get richer, and the poor will become completely unmanageable and huge.

Your analogy is wrong because it presumes POPULATION caused the industrial revolution... that is like saying "murder" is okay because without the slaughter of the indians we would of never been a great nation.

 

[Lord Xar]

I agree, legal immigration is insanely unfair and is fueling the illegal immigration into this country.

Okay. I see what you are doing..

Again, immigration is NOT the fuel, legal or otherwise. You are a typical word twister and argument creator. You pick a topic and then create assanine statements that have no bearing on the actual argument you are trying to manuever.

 

[guntherg16]

I agree, legal immigration is insanely unfair and is fueling the illegal immigration into this country.

So in order to solve the illegal immigration problem we need to just do away with our borders and cease to be a sovereign nation?

Are you Jorge Boosh's illegitimate son?

 

[kylejack]

No, you are wrong. You are schill and it sounds like it.

Oh good, we've moved on to personal attacks.

When you have a HUGE population of LOW SKILLED workers with Minimal education, you create a HUGE mass of poor people.

Yep, the Irish, Scottish and Italians that immigrated to this country were pretty poor. Then they worked hard and made something of themselves, had children and grandchildren, and here I am today, grandson of a Scottish immigrant and plenty successful, and no government program fed my grandfather.

There are already tax breaks for big business and the rich.. so who do you think will pay for this social epidemic.. yes, the middle class.

How exactly will the middle class be paying the bill if we get rid of the IRS? Ah yes, they won't. If people want to come here, they can, but not on the back of any entitlement program.

Your analogy is wrong because it presumes POPULATION caused the industrial revolution... that is like saying "murder" is okay because without the slaughter of the indians we would of never been a great nation.

Yes, immigration is morally analogous to murder.

Population FUELED the Industrial Revolution, it didn't CAUSE it. Without all the low level workers, there would have been no economic boom.

 

[kylejack]

So in order to solve the illegal immigration problem we need to just do away with our borders and cease to be a sovereign nation?

No, we defend our borders. Easing legal immigration regulations reduces the massive influx of illegal immigration and allows us to actually screen the people coming in, and also makes enforcement of illegal immigration easier.

Are you Jorge Boosh's illegitimate son?

I'm the grandson of Alec Anderson, a Scottish immigrant who thinks others should have the same rights to immigrate as my ancestors did.

 

[kylejack]

Okay. I see what you are doing..

Again, immigration is NOT the fuel, legal or otherwise. You are a typical word twister and argument creator. You pick a topic and then create assanine statements that have no bearing on the actual argument you are trying to manuever.

There you go again. Why don't you address the arguments I'm making rather than attacking me as a person? Legal immigration is how this country became king of the world during the Industrial Revolution.

 

[guntherg16]

No, we defend our borders. Easing legal immigration regulations reduces the massive influx of illegal immigration and allows us to actually screen the people coming in, and also makes enforcement of illegal immigration easier.


I'm the grandson of Alec Anderson, a Scottish immigrant who thinks others should have the same rights to immigrate as my ancestors did.

Why would you want to screen the immigrants? Isn't that what you're complaining about? Won't screening them just cause them to enter illegally?

After the great flood of immigrants from Europe, our government put a stop on immigration in order to allow the newcomers to assimilate into American society. They have for the most part.

The new flood of immigrants from points south are not assimilating. It seems as though they have no desire to as was witnessed by the waving of the Mexican flags at last years first illegal immigration rallies.

Your grandfather did not sponge off the taxpayers of the country when he came and that is good. But, the welfare programs did not exist at that time. Now they do. Now the illegals take full advantage of the "generosity" of our lawmakers.

 

[Lord Xar]

Oh good, we've moved on to personal attacks.


Yep, the Irish, Scottish and Italians that immigrated to this country were pretty poor. Then they worked hard and made something of themselves, had children and grandchildren, and here I am today, grandson of a Scottish immigrant and plenty successful, and no government program fed my grandfather.




How exactly will the middle class be paying the bill if we get rid of the IRS? Ah yes, they won't. If people want to come here, they can, but not on the back of any entitlement program.


Yes, immigration is morally analogous to murder.

Population FUELED the Industrial Revolution, it didn't CAUSE it. Without all the low level workers, there would have been no economic boom.

Well, you answered pretty much everyones argument here. Your grandfather didn't get handouts, so he had to assimilate and make his own way. Illegals nowadays get handouts. They get alot of handouts. So much so, that they pretty much can get on welfare, education, and medical care and never have to assimliate. Sounds like a great deal.

We 'needed' the workers back when you are quoting. We needed them. WE DO NOT NEED 20 million workers. I am sorry. We have Americans for that. The only thing is BIG BUSINESS will not pay a worthy wage. When I painted 15 years, I made $10/hr. Here we are 15years later, and that pays $8/hr... why? Flooding the labour pool with LOW SKILLED WORKERS.. so American workers are displaced and they hire illegals. Completely wrong. Not only that... the time you are talking about, my grandfather ALSO came over - From Italy. My family assimilated quickly. We didn't have our language in readily available newspapers, and alternate tv shows.. and in government offices...

My point is, the PEOPLE are not bad.. BUT the burden they cause and the REASON they are here is horribly inappropriate.

Also, the NUMBER of immigrants all those years ago is dwarfed by the level of illegal immigration and of the LEGAL immigration of a million a year.. especially when that LEGAL and ILLEGAL immigration is disproportionate from ONE country.

I apologize regarding the schill comment.

 

[kylejack]

Why would you want to screen the immigrants? Isn't that what you're complaining about? Won't screening them just cause them to enter illegally?

Only the bad ones. The ones that are criminals in their own country will continue to try to break in illegally, but now our Border Patrol will ONLY have to look for them. All the ones that just want to come work, be peaceful, and make money will go through the legal channels.

After the great flood of immigrants from Europe, our government put a stop on immigration in order to allow the newcomers to assimilate into American society. They have for the most part.

The new flood of immigrants from points south are not assimilating. It seems as though they have no desire to as was witnessed by the waving of the Mexican flags at last years first illegal immigration rallies.

Yes they are. First generations, as always, have a hard time integrating. Second generations continue to integrate, attending the same schools and speaking English. Third generations often don't even speak Spanish, as in the case of an ex of mine.

Your grandfather did not sponge off the taxpayers of the country when he came and that is good. But, the welfare programs did not exist at that time. Now they do. Now the illegals take full advantage of the "generosity" of our lawmakers.

Yeah, except Ron Paul and I advocate eliminating those programs, not keeping them.

 

[Lord Xar]

There you go again. Why don't you address the arguments I'm making rather than attacking me as a person? Legal immigration is how this country became king of the world during the Industrial Revolution.

Population is a HELP to the industrial revolution, but it certainly didn't cause it. The industrial revolution started in britain and spread outward. Predominantly got started with the advent of the steam-engine and OTHER technologies.. with the influx of people, you have commerce... and yes, workers. But the need for workers was BECAUSE of the revolution, not the other way around.

See. you see it as a good thing because you are a sire of an immigrant. I am too. But I love America and I want AMERICANS to work, and to get fair wages, not to be undercut by big business and special interest bringing over slave labour and diminishing my great country because of the burden on healthcare, educational systems, and basically a rise in crime. Non assimiliation.

This influx of illegals is a direct correlation to greed, and political power.

 

[kylejack]

Well, you answered pretty much everyones argument here. Your grandfather didn't get handouts, so he had to assimilate and make his own way. Illegals nowadays get handouts. They get alot of handouts. So much so, that they pretty much can get on welfare, education, and medical care and never have to assimliate. Sounds like a great deal.

Yes, so let's get rid of the entitlement programs.

We 'needed' the workers back when you are quoting. We needed them. WE DO NOT NEED 20 million workers. I am sorry. We have Americans for that.

There were people making that exact argument during that period of immigration. There were "anti-Chinese" leagues, and American unions that opposed European immigration and even physically attacked the immigrants.

The only thing is BIG BUSINESS will not pay a worthy wage. When I painted 15 years, I made $10/hr. Here we are 15years later, and that pays $8/hr... why? Flooding the labour pool with LOW SKILLED WORKERS.. so American workers are displaced and they hire illegals. Completely wrong.

Also a very common argument during the Industrial Revolution. New jobs developed and we developed a sophisticated service economy. The Internet allowed all new labor frontiers. This new wave will help us just as much as the European and Asian immigrants did in those days.

Not only that... the time you are talking about, my grandfather ALSO came over - From Italy. My family assimilated quickly. We didn't have our language in readily available newspapers, and alternate tv shows.. and in government offices...

Maybe your family did, but this country was full of angry first-gen parents who would yell at their children for speaking anything other than the native tongue in the house. By the second generation, they were bilingual, and third generations were pretty much totally Americanized. That continues to be true today.

Also, the NUMBER of immigrants all those years ago is dwarfed by the level of illegal immigration and of the LEGAL immigration of a million a year.. especially when that LEGAL and ILLEGAL immigration is disproportionate from ONE country.

I'd like to see some figures on this, but Ellis Island was basically wide open. Anyone who wanted to come was allowed to. Give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses, yearning to breathe free.

Anyway, cheaper lawncare or roofing allows me to spend more money elsewhere, creating demand for product or service, which creates all new job opportunities.