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Musk Advocates to Double H-1B Visas

TheCount said:
Musk Advocates to Double H-1B Visas
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And??

Come on, Count... Are you going to let the implication go silent??

Like there is no difference between "legal" immigration of talent and an "illegal" invasion at taxpayer expense.
 

https://x.com/elonmusk/status/1872146238017339644

VISH BURRA ☠️ @VishBurra

Okay since the H1B visa and country caps and the tech sector and India an Indians are all a hot topic right now, I would like to address this as someone who has worked behind the scenes in H1B consultancies in the tech sector and explain EXACTLY why I’m against removing country caps, against the H1B visa, and against the entire canard that we need to import more people from anywhere, let alone India, to do “jobs that the tech sector can’t find Americans to do:

1) Sourcing Talent- Big companies like Google and Meta have the resources to go and actually pluck out the ACTUAL best talent from these countries, and it’s not hard for them to attract those applicants either because they have the brand recognition. All the best want to work for the best. This isn’t necessarily the problem. The problem is all the no name consultancies and mid size/small size consultancies. They can petition for H1B’s too. How are they sourcing them? Well, they (usually run by Indians) just find a guy from India through their network…who’s willing to work for them and come to America. That’s it. They’ll make sure they have some kind of Bachelors or Masters from some college out there and have the aptitude to learn and understand software that’s it. They aren’t actually “geniuses” or anything like that. They are just willing to work and can learn to “talk the talk” quickly.

2) Importation- once the prospective worker agrees, the consultancy petitions the American government (USCIS) on their behalf, saying they tried to recruit for the job (job doesn’t exist) in America and couldn’t find anyone, that’s why they need to bring this guy. Key part of this is that the visa is tied to the employer, so if the employer drops the worker, worker has to go back. He can’t just find another job. This is the indentured servitude model.

3) The Gambit- the consultancy makes sure the guy speak English, and that’s really it. USCIS can’t actually vet the workers on the knowledge they claim they have, especially a vast and sophisticated field like software. USCIS doesn’t actually have a way to tell if someone is lying about their skills or not. All they have to do is convince the USCIS that they can speak English so they can come and immediately start working here.

4) The Actual Job- once they get the petition for visa approved and they come here, they find out (or already know) they actually don’t have a job here yet. The consultancy now tries to find Corp to Corp contract gigs for the worker. That’s if they actually know the tech and they’re not faking. If they are faking their skills, another workflow is initiated.

5) Training Day (or months) - the fakers are trained for up to 3-4 months in a software that’s marketable and fetch a good hourly contract rate. Basically a coding Bootcamp style program. They go from zero to superficial knowledge in the tech, just enough to pass an interview with a potential client.

6) Sell the fake - after training the fake for 3-4 months, the fake is provided with a fake resume claiming 7-8 years of experience. Why? Because that’s how much experience is needed to demand a minimum of $50 per hour on a contract. Does it work? Duh. These workers trained for 3-4 months routinely fool interviewers looking for 7-8 years experience.

7) The Split- once the job and rate is secured, the consultancy bills at $50 per hour and pays the actual worker the minimum (about $27.50) an hour, and the consultancy pockets the difference. Imagine a 100 H1Bs on a roster doing this for you.

Does this sound like fraud? Well that’s because it is, from beginning to end.
...
https://x.com/VishBurra/status/1871782594523840753
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Ask yourself, if some Indian fresh off the boat, getting 3-4 months of training is able to fool an American that they are actually a seasoned 7-8 year professional, why can’t we just train Americans to do that? Why import anyone?

That’s where the indentured servitude model of tying the visa to the employer is highly important. Americans can take the training and leave and take their talents to another company, because Americans have rights and will not tolerate being mistreated. Imported workers on a H1B do not have such rights or a path for recourse. If the H1B worker doesn’t comply or keep their mouth shut, they are sent back.

This is why Americans aren’t being trained or selected for these jobs, because they can go to another company at any time for any reason. The H1Bs can’t by design.

Merit has nothing to do with anything, and the Americans who are in charge of gatekeeping the system can’t actually sus out merit or fraud. Even worse, they might be scared of denying applications due to “racism”.
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https://x.com/VishBurra/status/1871782596658761789
 
I like Razib and all the Indian names mentioned here (save for National Review Ramesh perhaps) but please don’t attribute my views on stuff without actually getting it from me. I am vehemently against the H1B system and I’m especially against more of them coming from India.

Too many of them have a penchant for being complicit in this fraud, and then well meaning Indians wonder why anti-Indian sentiment is so rampant. It’s festering because we are facilitating this fraud and crying racism at anyone who fights against it. I prefer not to lie in that bed my fellow Indians are making for me.
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https://x.com/VishBurra/status/1871782603717787875
 
America is not an economic zone.

It is, or was, a nation of ideals that were specific and well stated.

That "proposition" has been smashed.
 
We Need Fewer, Not More, Worker Visas



There's an important debate raging on social media about the tech bros being brought into the Trump administration and their plans to expand immigration. I explain that what they want to continue doing with college educated workers is the exact same thing they've already done with non-college educated fields; namely, drive down wages and culturally gerrymander Americans out of jobs.
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https://x.com/USAB4L/status/1872402104364802321

Jeremy Carl @realJeremyCarl

This is a revealing take from @VivekGRamaswamy, and probably (judging from other comments from others on X and my own extensive personal experience with Indian Americans in Silicon Valley) fairly representative.

Before I get into why it is fundamentally wrong in its most important particulars, let me give it its limited due: Yes, the most talented American kids probably need to work harder academically. Our public school system, especially, is generally a disaster, which I can say with some confidence having five kids currently in it We need to fix it, and universal school choice will do a lot to get us there.

However, having competed successfully with the top of the talent stack (my wife and I have five top-tier Ivy League degrees between us) and having seen what that looks like up close and made the choice to largely opt-out for our own five kids, I think Vivek seems to have a misapprehension about the roots of American success.

I knew lots of parents who made their kids *grind* and yes, I did look down on them and did not aspire to that for my own kids. I did this for many reasons-- first, I saw the massive burnout among such kids, even the "successful" ones who I went to school with. I didn't want that to happen to my kids. A career is an important part of most people's lives. But it is not, with rare, rare exceptions, life itself. And you don't need to train most people, even at the top of your talent stack, to be those rare, rare exceptions.

Second, countries that push children to an extreme, like South Korea and China, have miserable kids and collapsing fertility. And the next generation is ultimately what we're all playing for.

Third, the elite culture of these countries, (including India, where I have lived) often encourages ruthlessness, lack of ethics, and rampant cheating in a desperate quest to get ahead. This ultimately bleeds over to the professional world, where IP theft and research fraud from countries like China is rampant. Of course, we're not perfect in this regard either, but we're a heck of a lot better than our competition and it's a key comparative advantage for America.

Fourth, I don't think the kind of training that Vivek seems to aspire to has created the dynamism that powered success in Silicon Valley or anywhere else in America. Yes, some of the people from grind culture played useful technical roles-- but these companies were often founded by brilliant dropouts and iconoclasts-- not the guy who always listened to his teacher, studies eight hours a day, and did #1 on the test.

America's willingness to embrace dynamism and risk-- to have a society in which the rule of the law is honored (though Democrats have badly eroded this in recent years) and our unique culture, ultimately derived from Europe but strengthened with our own unique pioneering American qualities, has made us so successful.

It's why far, far more people want to come here than anywhere else, and why our tech companies are far more successful than those anywhere else-- and this was true before we had mass H-1Bs-- and I am confident it will be true after we shut the door on this ill-advised policy.

What Vivek is proposing, however sincerely intentioned, would destroy the things that actually make America great.
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I can see a brief moratorium being placed on H1B and similar visas while we overhaul the immigration system to actually be subject to the will of WTP. But I see no reason to cap the number of people immigrating here so long as they are going through a proper vetting and naturalization process that would catch things like fake degrees or other fake qualifications. We want the best people here, the best workers, the best thinkers, the best artists, etc. Let them be here, and we will be the best in the world. If we enforce the Constitution, the ones who are only coming for nefarious reasons will quickly find out they've made a mistake, even if they manage to "sneak in". So, the real issue is obeying the Constitution, not the bulk number of legal immigrants.

And we need to halt all illegal immigration forthwith. I didn't understand the importance of that issue pre-2020. Now I do.
 
ClaytonB said:
I can see a brief moratorium being placed on H1B and similar visas while we overhaul the immigration system to actually be subject to the will of WTP.
Click to expand...

Trump's proposed cabinet is the wealthiest in the history of the country. With few exceptions, their money comes from a system which relies on employing foreign-born indentured servants in place of US citizens and permanent residents.

Do you believe that this group of people plan to destroy their own livelihoods?
 
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