CFL - Top Down or Bottom Up? (Live report from MSP)

[Matt Collins]

I am sitting here at the CFL leadership summit and will report on various things throughout the day.

There has been a group of people that seem to think that the top down organization of the new CFL will not work. And there are others think that the idea of top down organization is the best way to manage the new emerging organization.


This has caused some friction on the floor and the discussion is still ongoing.


Grassroots control, or top-down control is the issue.

 

[airborne373]

Is there room for a combination of both?

 

[Matt Collins]

Is there room for a combination of both?

Well at this point John Tate who was at the podium decided not to take any more questions from the floor and has moved on to Adam Kokesh who is now giving a motivational speech.

 

[Sally08]

Matt,

Will everyone be discussing this issue, instead of participating in the *voting* for the GOP platform?

Or the vote to nominate McCain (by acclamation?) in the next few hours?

I have seen zero "news alerts" to RP delegates/alternates to be at the RNC *NOW*.

How many delegates/alternates are in MN, but don't know the vote is imminent (earliest I've seen for start time, presumably to determine quorum, is 3 p.m. ET)

 

[airborne373]

Thanks Matt. Keep up the good work in the end it is all about each individuals efforts.

 

[free.alive]

I'm here as well.

Using the CFL name will be a voluntary choice, but as it is a private organization reflecting Ron Paul's values and goals, the man who we have sacrificed much to fight with, it has the right to define at least a minimum criteria for groups to carry their name.

We can, and undoubtedly will have splinter groups, even movements. The leadership seems to welcome it, especially since a major task will be to work with other groups anyway.

However, we must build on the movement we have now, for all obvious reasons including the fact that most of all other movements have at some time died out. Not only is the CFL the best game in town, it's really the only one. Definitely, the only one I think every Ron Paul supporter could happily sign on to.

 

[Matt Collins]

Will everyone be discussing this issue, instead of participating in the *voting* for the GOP platform?

I am at the CFL event, not the GOP event.

 

[Matt Collins]

I have seen zero "news alerts" to RP delegates/alternates to be at the RNC *NOW*.

How many delegates/alternates are in MN, but don't know the vote is imminent (earliest I've seen for start time, presumably to determine quorum, is 3 p.m. ET)

We just broke for lunch. And they did make an announcement but I don't know if everyone heard it.

 

[constituent]

... And there are others think that the idea of top down organization is the best way to manage the new emerging organization.

i guess that's one way to stagnate...

though from a franchising/brand identity p.o.v. i certainly understand.

guess it depends on what the deep-down nitty-gritty purpose of the organization is, and the ends it seeks to achieve...

it's w/e to me though.

[perhaps i'd be more sympathetic had the "leaders" not consistently proven themselves utterly inept both in terms of imagination and administration.]

 

[LibertyEagle]

I'm going to reserve judgment until we see who the Executive Director is going to be.

 

[New York For Paul]

alot of interest groups that were very powerful have come and gone over the years.

Especially on the conservative side.

It really depends on us the donors to help decide whether we would like to fund a top down organization or a bottom up organization.

They both have their good points and bad points.

 

[JoshLowry]

They're going to start their own forum from what I understand.

They want control! *shakes fist*

It's not that big of a deal, but I originally thought that they were going to promote the grassroots projects, not compete with them.

We'll see what happens.

*splintering sound*

 

[Sally08]

I'm going to reserve judgment until we see who the Executive Director is going to be.

Which proves Constituent's post:

[perhaps i'd be more sympathetic had the "leaders" not consistently proven themselves utterly inept both in terms of imagination and administration.]

Who has been in charge of the entire Target Center event? Management by consensus? Management by whoever stepped up to take charge of individual tasks with no coordination among those tasks?

Who signed contracts and has been/will be paying those expenses with how many dollars available?

I don't see how any organization can survive, let alone accomplish anything, without some sort of published organization chart of who is responsible for what ,with a project plan by when, and actual to budget under/over comparisons for how much has been expended vs. how much was available.

Have any of those currently associated with CFL ever run a business or even taken management courses related to the many core corporate functions/processes/procedures?

 

[New York For Paul]

Which proves Constituent's post:


Who has been in charge of the entire Target Center event? Management by consensus? Management by whoever stepped up to take charge of individual tasks with no coordination among those tasks?

Who signed contracts and has been/will be paying those expenses with how many dollars available?

I don't see how any organization can survive, let alone accomplish anything, without some sort of published organization chart of who is responsible for what ,with a project plan by when, and actual to budget under/over comparisons for how much has been expended vs. how much was available.

Have any of those currently associated with CFL ever run a business or even taken management courses related to the many core corporate functions/processes/procedures?

That is a great question.

The lack of response may make the answer obvious.

 

[Sally08]

They're going to start their own forum from what I understand.

They want control! *shakes fist*

It's not that big of a deal, but I originally thought that they were going to promote the grassroots projects, not compete with them.

We'll see what happens.

*splintering sound*

I keep shaking my head at how much *harm* CFL announcements and actions have done to major grassroots projects:

1. If CFL has its own forum, does that harm RPFs and DailyPaul?

Given the fact that no one appears to be moderating obnoxious CFL blog posts (per RPFs quotes) and I personally reported obnoxious "member names" rotating on the home page (e.g., Hitler and others) the day before the ticket sale bomb, "who's on first" [famous Three Stooges comedy routine] comes to mind.

2. Couldn't the announcement of the campaign ending and the formation of the CFL waited until after *state conventions to elect national delegates* were over? (Couldn't some of the $4+ million in unused Presidential campaign donations been used to "spread the message" in those states?)

3. Couldn't the announcement of the dual convention have waited a few more days until *after* the Sturgis event and the Washington March that was specifically requested by RP?

Or was the dual convention announced before those two events *specifically* to let people decide which event to attend, effectively dividing attendance 3 ways (as Rally ticket sales have proven so far)?

How much money did the promoters of both July grassroots events *lose* due to the timing of that dual convention announcement?

4. How do people who paid for Rally tickets feel to now have CFL giving good tickets away for free? How do those who bought tickets, but can't attend, now, sell them vs. free?

More importantly, how will the MSM report Rally attendance, if it's not full even with free tickets and a performance?

5. Where is the front-page urgency for CFL related to the vote to nominate McCain and the GOP platform occurring in the next 4-5 hours?

6. Even this holiday weekend, how is CFL posting:
The Campaign for Liberty website will host a live webstream of the entire Rally for the Republic. You can watch it all live right here - www.CampaignforLiberty.com.

Given the many grassroots live online audio/video broadcasts scheduled for the Rally and other events these several days, has CFL just harmed all of those efforts?

Is CFL using one of the grassroots networks (e.g., BTM and/or RB and/or ???)? If that's been posted elsewhere, I must have missed it.

Or is CFL hiring professionals with professional equipment and broadcast network with full "insider" access? If so, then why would any CFL member use the grassroots networks for the Rally itself?

Given this thread topic, again, who is making all of these decisions, announcing them, paying for them, ...?

Who will make policy decisions as to who/what/how to promote/publish?

For instance, who hired the instructors/companies for the training classes based on what criteria?

Or is CFL just a "club" vs. an ongoing educational foundation?

I have seen no evidence of the latter since mid-June-

If CFL were a "team" on The Apprentice, how long would it have lasted?

[Constituent - that's more of the analytical side of me]

 

[BKom]

I keep shaking my head at how much *harm* CFL announcements and actions have done to major grassroots projects:

1. If CFL has its own forum, does that harm RPFs and DailyPaul?

Given the fact that no one appears to be moderating obnoxious CFL blog posts (per RPFs quotes) and I personally reported obnoxious "member names" rotating on the home page (e.g., Hitler and others) the day before the ticket sale bomb, "who's on first" [famous Three Stooges comedy routine] comes to mind.

2. Couldn't the announcement of the campaign ending and the formation of the CFL waited until after *state conventions to elect national delegates* were over? (Couldn't some of the $4+ million in unused Presidential campaign donations been used to "spread the message" in those states?)

3. Couldn't the announcement of the dual convention have waited a few more days until *after* the Sturgis event and the Washington March that was specifically requested by RP?

Or was the dual convention announced before those two events *specifically* to let people decide which event to attend, effectively dividing attendance 3 ways (as Rally ticket sales have proven so far)?

How much money did the promoters of both July grassroots events *lose* due to the timing of that dual convention announcement?

4. How do people who paid for Rally tickets feel to now have CFL giving good tickets away for free? How do those who bought tickets, but can't attend, now, sell them vs. free?

More importantly, how will the MSM report Rally attendance, if it's not full even with free tickets and a performance?

5. Where is the front-page urgency for CFL related to the vote to nominate McCain and the GOP platform occurring in the next 4-5 hours?

6. Even this holiday weekend, how is CFL posting:
The Campaign for Liberty website will host a live webstream of the entire Rally for the Republic. You can watch it all live right here - www.CampaignforLiberty.com.

Given the many grassroots live online audio/video broadcasts scheduled for the Rally and other events these several days, has CFL just harmed all of those efforts?

Is CFL using one of the grassroots networks (e.g., BTM and/or RB and/or ???)? If that's been posted elsewhere, I must have missed it.

Or is CFL hiring professionals with professional equipment and broadcast network with full "insider" access? If so, then why would any CFL member use the grassroots networks for the Rally itself?

Given this thread topic, again, who is making all of these decisions, announcing them, paying for them, ...?

Who will make policy decisions as to who/what/how to promote/publish?

For instance, who hired the instructors/companies for the training classes based on what criteria?

Or is CFL just a "club" vs. an ongoing educational foundation?

I have seen no evidence of the latter since mid-June-

If CFL were a "team" on The Apprentice, how long would it have lasted?

[Constituent - that's more of the analytical side of me]

Abbot and Costello, not the Three Stooges.

Did you like the way the campaign was run? If you did, then you'll love the CFL. Lots of the same people who worked their winning strategy. I think Jeff Greenspan did a nice job. I worked very closely with him and he worked extremely hard against a lot of obstacles, both from above and below.

 

[Jeremy]

They're going to start their own forum from what I understand.

They want control! *shakes fist*

It's not that big of a deal, but I originally thought that they were going to promote the grassroots projects, not compete with them.

We'll see what happens.

*splintering sound*

you should have emailed them more

maybe you still can =)

they should just work with you and make RPF official forums

argue that it is well established here already and already has 20k members and millions of posts

 

[MRoCkEd]

you should have emailed them more

maybe you still can =)

they should just work with you and make RPF official forums

argue that it is well established here already and already has 20k members and millions of posts

yea

 

[Sally08]

Abbot and Costello, not the Three Stooges.

Haha, did I just show my age

 

[Sally08]

Abbot and Costello, not the Three Stooges.

Did you like the way the campaign was run? If you did, then you'll love the CFL. Lots of the same people who worked their winning strategy. I think Jeff Greenspan did a nice job. I worked very closely with him and he worked extremely hard against a lot of obstacles, both from above and below.

Uh, given my lengthy list of issues, did I sound like I liked the way the campaign was run?