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Battle of the Stupid: The Debates are On

A. Havnes

Member
Joined
Jan 3, 2008
Messages
3,214
They're debating, although it's kind of late for it now.

https://apnews.com/article/2024-election-presidential-debates-biden-trump-6b1d1dbb2ed61c7637041b23662d7da8

Here's a snippet:

WASHINGTON (AP) — President Joe Biden and former President Donald Trump on Wednesday agreed to hold two campaign debates — the first on June 27 hosted by CNN and the second on Sept. 10 hosted by ABC — setting the stage for the first presidential face-off in just weeks.

The quick agreement on the timetable to meet followed the Democrat’s announcement that he will not participate in fall presidential debates sponsored by the nonpartisan commission that has organized them for more than three decades. Biden’s campaign instead proposed that media outlets directly organize the debates with the presumptive Democratic and Republican nominees. Trump, in a post on his Truth Social site, said he was “Ready and Willing to Debate” Biden.

Hours later, Biden said he accepted an invitation from CNN, adding, “Over to you, Donald.” Trump said on Truth Social he’d be there, adding, “Let’s get ready to Rumble!!!” And soon after that, they agreed to the second debate on ABC.

“Trump says he’ll arrange his own transportation,” Biden wrote on X. “I’ll bring my plane, too. I plan on keeping it for another four years.”

The swiftness with which the match-ups came together reflects how each of the two profoundly unpopular candidates thinks he can get the better of his opponent in a head-to-head showdown. The first debate will play out amid a busy and unsettled political calendar, following the expected conclusion of Trump’s hush money trial in New York, foreign trips by Biden to France and Italy, the end of the Supreme Court’s term, and the expected start of two criminal trials for the president’s son, Hunter Biden.

CNN said that its debate would be held in its Atlanta studios and that “no audience will be present.” It said moderators and other details would be announced later. Disagreements about moderators and debate rules were some of the very questions that prompted the formation of the Commission on Presidential Debates in 1987.

The two campaigns and television networks had held weeks of informal talks on ways to circumvent the commission’s grip on presidential debates, owing to years of complaints and perceived slights, according to two people familiar with the matter.

Biden’s campaign had proposed excluding third-party candidates, such as Robert F. Kennedy Jr., from the debates outright. Under the debate commission’s rules, Kennedy or other third-party candidates could qualify if they secured ballot access sufficient to claim 270 Electoral Votes and polled at 15% or higher in a selection of national polls.

Kennedy accused Biden and Trump of “colluding to lock America into a head-to-head match-up that 70% say they do not want.”

“They are trying to exclude me from their debate because they are afraid I would win,” Kennedy said. “Keeping viable candidates off the debate stage undermines democracy.”

CNN held open the door to Kennedy’s participation if he or any other candidate met polling and ballot access requirements similar to the commission’s.

As recently as Wednesday morning, Trump expressed his desire for a large live audience for his debates with Biden.

“I would strongly recommend more than two debates and, for excitement purposes, a very large venue, although Biden is supposedly afraid of crowds - That’s only because he doesn’t get them,” Trump said. “Just tell me when, I’ll be there.”

Trump has been pushing for more debates and earlier debates, arguing voters should be able to see the two men face off well before early voting begins in September. He has repeatedly said he will debate Biden “anytime, anywhere, any place,” even proposing the two men face off outside the Manhattan courthouse where he is currently on criminal trial in a hush money case. He also has been taunting Biden with an empty lectern at some of his rallies.

Trump’s campaign on Wednesday challenged the Biden campaign to agree to at least two other debates between the two candidates, beside the June and September dates. The Biden campaign did not immediately respond to a request for comment.

Biden’s campaign has long held a grudge against the nonpartisan commission for failing to evenly apply its rules during the 2020 Biden-Trump matchups — most notably when it didn’t enforce its COVID-19 testing rules on Trump and his entourage.

It sounds like the debates are going to be an even bigger sham, though:

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/here-all-restrictions-bidens-team-demanded-their-trump-debate-offer

Here's a TL;DR version:

  • No Audience
  • No RFK Jr. or any other 3rd-party candidate
  • Limited news outlets
  • Candidate mics must mute after time expires

Basically, nothing that might distract Biden or allow him to start rambling.
 
They're debating

  • No Audience
  • No RFK Jr. or any other 3rd-party candidate
  • Limited news outlets
  • Candidate mics must mute after time expires

17d404d37caad04a7f1384ec06bdac5e.jpg
 
Some BS restrictions to agree to but it's Trump's fault, kept boasting anytime anyplace
 
IMG-0225.jpg


Trump: "I'm building The Wall!" Biden: "I'm building The Wall too!"

Trump: "I love Tariffs!" Biden: "I love Tariffs too!"

Biden: ”My turn to go first. We need a North American Union!” Trump: “Sorry Joe, I beat ya to it!”

Trump: "Operation Warp Speed is mine and I'm proud of it!" Biden: "I renamed it "Project NextGen", so there!"

Trump: "I was the first to sign off on $8 Trillion in one single term!" Biden: "So what? I'm doing that too!"

Trump: "Take the guns first, ban bump stocks, raise the age to 21!" Biden: "I'm actually good with that."

Trump: "We need to THROW Massie OUT of the Republican Party!" Biden: "No complaints there either."

Trump: "I endorsed Mike Johnson (R) as Speaker!" Biden: [reads teleprompter] He's the one who sided with us, right?"


Special announcement: Sorry folks, no discussion of the printing of money, IRS, eVerify and/or other National ID, DHS & NGO funding, or other topics will be heard.


Trump: "Round of golf after this?" Biden: "My legs are too feeble... meet at Hillary's for drinks?"



[MENTION=65299]Swordsmyth[/MENTION]
 
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Get ready to see Trump supporters say Trump will be dropping massive bombshells and haymakers during this debate. Why do I get the feeling neither of those things are going to happen?
 
Kennedy just said Biden and Trump are colluding to exclude him from the debates. They probably are.
 
Kennedy just said Biden and Trump are colluding to exclude him from the debates. They probably are.

They don't want any different perspectives, not to mention that Biden probably can't keep two candidates straight in his mind.
 
Kennedy just said Biden and Trump are colluding to exclude him from the debates. They probably are.

Maybe if he knew what he was doing (he does not), he'd already be polling 15% and on his way to being on enough ballots to win 270 electorals.

If he meets this threshold, he belongs there. If he doesn't, he doesn't.

Compare. In 1992, when Ross Perot was on the debate stage, in many polls he was BEATING BOTH Bush and Clinton.
AND he was on ALL state ballots.
 
Maybe if he knew what he was doing (he does not), he'd already be polling 15% and on his way to being on enough ballots to win 270 electorals.

If he meets this threshold, he belongs there. If he doesn't, he doesn't.

Compare. In 1992, when Ross Perot was on the debate stage, in many polls he was BEATING BOTH Bush and Clinton.
AND he was on ALL state ballots.

Actually Kennedy has already polled 15 or more in way more than 4 national polls, which was the criteria that the commission for presidential debates used. I guess the commission is over now though. Kennedy's running mate is paying the bills to get him on all the battles with all the Google money she got in the divorce. Good chance they pull it off.

I would not be surprised one bit if the Trump and Biden campaigns or even Trump and Biden personally conspired to bypass the commission to keep Kennnedy out.
 
Actually Kennedy has already polled 15 or more in way more than 4 national polls, which was the criteria that the commission for presidential debates used. I guess the commission is over now though. Kennedy's running mate is paying the bills to get him on all the battles with all the Google money she got in the divorce. Good chance they pull it off.

I would not be surprised one bit if the Trump and Biden campaigns or even Trump and Biden personally conspired to bypass the commission to keep Kennnedy out.

Yeah, I think Kennedy will probably be in at least one debate, and when CNN says 15% I didn't mean to imply that he hasn't attained that, but that historically there is no reason to be so upset if you can't win. He needs to get on more ballots. Right now, he's barely comparing to Anderson in 1980. Anderson's high was 26% but then downhill...

The Commission and CNN maintain the candidate must have an arithmetic chance of winning the Electoral College:
https://debates.org/2024/05/01/cpd-statement/index.html

Kennedy has a lot of work to do. I recall Texas State was going to have him attend, but that's also axed, by the Uniparty.
https://www.kens5.com/article/news/...sity/273-be18778e-917d-43aa-8ff3-113a142f1833
 
If he meets the requirements then it's up to them if they want to refuse to attend...

And if both of them have already stipulated that they won't come if there's a third candidate on stage, then RFKJr can't any more meet the requirements than you can. No matter what happens.

Do you really think they didn't?
 
If he meets the requirements then it's up to them if they want to refuse to attend...

They move the goal posts. If you look at the wording of the (former?) commission on presidential debate, it has ambiguous wording like "recognized" or "accepted" national polls. They have for at least the last 20 years had one college professor who decides which poll are acceptable.

Both already are refusing if RFK is there.
 
And if both of them have already stipulated that they won't come if there's a third candidate on stage, then RFKJr can't any more meet the requirements than you can. No matter what happens.

Do you really think they didn't?

I’m sure they did, but it would be fun to include him anyway just to showcase the pettiness of Biden and Trump.

EDIT: Just saw this article. Trump apparently would be open to having RFK on stage.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/elections/2024/05/17/rfk-jr-debate-stage-biden-trump/73712743007/
 
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