Buchanan: Decline of the Anglos

[stu2002]

http://buchanan.org/blog/?p=853

PJB: The Decline of the Anglos

Posted By Linda On September 18, 2007 @ 1:18 am In PJB Columns | Comments Disabled

by Patrick J. Buchanan

In Russia’s Ulanovsk region, Sept. 12 is Conception Day.

Workers are given the day off and encouraged to go home and do their best to conceive a new Russian. The hope is to have a bumper crop of babies on Russia’s national holiday, nine months off.

Conception Day has occasioned much mirth and ribald humor. But for Mother Russia, the issue of her children is no laughing matter.

Two decades ago, the Soviet Union was three times the size of any of the other giant nation – the United States, Canada, China, Brazil – and the third most populous, with nearly 300 million people. Came then the great crack-up of 1990-91.

The Baltic republics – Lithuania, Latvia and Estonia – broke free first. Next were Belarus, Ukraine and Moldova in the west; Georgia, Armenia and Azerbaijan in the Caucasus; and Turkmenistan, Tajikistan, Uzbekistan, Kyrgyzstan and Kazakhstan in Central Asia.

These amputations removed a third of the territory and half the population of the Soviet Union. Yet the remnant, Russia, remained twice as large as any other nation and still boasted a population of 150 million.

Since the 1990s, however, Russia has been losing population at a rate of 750,000 a year – not to emigration, but to death. By one count, the Russian population is down to 143 million. President Putin has predicted that only 124 million Russians will be alive in 2015. In 2000, the United Nations projected that, at its present birth rate, by 2050 Russia’s population would fall to 114 million.

In a 2005 study, the United Nations estimated that, together, Ukraine and Russia will lose 50 million people – 25 percent of their combined populations – by mid-century. The Slavs are dying out, and the geostrategic implications are enormous.

In a few decades, Turkey, which seeks entry into the European Union, will become Europe’s most populous nation. Like Xerxes’ bridge of boats across the Hellespont, Turkey will be the Asian land bridge into Europe, the Bridge of The Prophet into the homeland of the Christians.

As critical, the vast majority of Russians live west of the Urals, while east of Novosibirsk (New Siberia City), all the way to Kamchatka, the tiny Russian population is departing or dying out. Yet, in timber, oil and minerals, this is the most resource-rich region on earth. And south of Siberia lies the most populous and resource-hungry nation on earth.

American children born today may have Chinese for neighbors across the Bering Strait from Alaska.

Nor is it only the Slavic peoples who are expiring. So, too, are the native-born populations of Western and Southern Europe, as the empty nurseries of Europa fill with bawling Muslim babies.

Americans of European ancestry are also declining as a share of the U.S. population, down from near 90 percent into 1960 to 66 percent today. Anglos, as they are called now, are now minorities in our two largest states, Texas and California, and, by 2040, will be a minority in the nation that people of British and European stock built.

Last month, the Census Bureau projected the U.S. population would grow by 167 million by 2060, to 468 million.

And immigrants and their children will constitute 105 million of that 167 million. That would be triple the 37.5 million legal and illegal immigrants here today, which is itself the largest cohort of foreigners any nation has ever taken in.

With the 45 million Hispanics here to rise to 102 million by 2050, the Southwest is likely to look and sound more like Mexico than America. Indeed, culturally, linguistically and ethnically, it will be a part of Mexico.

Like Russians, Americans of European ancestry are failing to reproduce. Yet, a closer look reveals that population growth remains healthy among the religiously devout – evangelical Christians, Catholic traditionalists, Muslims and Mormons. Among the secularists, however, birth rates are far below Zero Population Growth – and the possibility of extinction looms.

One recent study found that the Jewish population in the United States fell by 6 percent in the 1990s, from 5.5 million to 5.2 million. Orthodox Jews, however, are known for families of five, eight or 10 children.

“And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and have dominion … over every living creature.” So reads Genesis. And so European Man once preached and practiced. But having lost his empires along with his faith, European Man no longer sees himself as commissioned by God.

Indeed, he no longer believes in God. Among our best and brightest are many whose purpose is to enjoy life to the fullest and to end it, when the time comes, as painlessly as possible.

Which seems to suit the rest of the world – China, India, Islam, Africa, Latin America – fine, as all look forward to a magnificent inheritance.

If demography is destiny, the West is finished. And, if so, does it really matter all that much who rules in Baghdad?
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URL to article: http://buchanan.org/blog/?p=853

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[johngr]

Those slated to replace "Anglos" (a slur) and other European peoples in their homelands aren't too interested in liberty or any of the values reflected in the Magna Carta, Common Law, Viking Law, the ancient Icelandic anarchic system, Declaration of Independence or US Constitution and Bill of Rights.

[Corydoras]

An interesting article coming at secularism from a completely different angle is this:
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/09/16/bo...ldstein-t.html

The claim is basically that secularism was the result a very unusual historical situation, and that throughout human history and in most of the world, religious values are an integral part of the way people understand life.

Perhaps secularism is a self-extinguishing phenomenon insofar as it is not welcoming toward children.

And yet indeed European cultures were the only ones to be really interested in rights. If European civilization is going to fall, it remains to the United States to uphold the concept of rights, coupled with the acknowedgement that religious values are a natural part of life.

[Dustancostine]

Get to having sex people....

[Dustancostine]

Oh and on another note. It is hard to afford kids under socialism.

[drednot]

This is the area where I think Buchanon tends to lose the plot.

He says "Americans" may have "Chinese" as neighbors across the straight, conflating citizenship with race. A lot of Americans are Chinese.

Few people are more enamored with the critical Western tradition of liberty than asian and european immigrants to America. As Ayn Rand said to a heckler, "I chose to live here, what do you every do besides being born?".

I work in Silicon Valley, with folks originally from India, China, France, Korea, Iceland, you name it. Yet we all watch Lost, play Warcraft, and generally appreciate capitalism, secularism and freedom.

If you only look at race and ethnicity, you miss the fact that Western philosophy is increasingly dominating the world.

[johngr]

No nations other than European and European diaspora ones are required to take in people of other races. "Chinese", "Japanese", et. al. still refer to the the ethny of the people who founded and reside in those nations. It is all but impossible to for anyone but a Japanese "become" "Japanese". One is struck on visiting there with the unbrokeninto vending machines in residential areas selling relatively expensive items and the lack of graffiti and other social pathological symptoms of the non-existent 2nd generation ersatz Japanese.

[EvilEngineer]

Yeah... idiotocracy had it right. Smart and affluent people don't breed far enough, while conversely the stupid and poor breed out the wazoo.

[PaleoForPaul]

This is the area where I think Buchanon tends to lose the plot.

He says "Americans" may have "Chinese" as neighbors across the straight, conflating citizenship with race. A lot of Americans are Chinese.

What does that matter? What he means is CHINA IS GOING TO TAKE SIBERIA.

Few people are more enamored with the critical Western tradition of liberty than asian and european immigrants to America. As Ayn Rand said to a heckler, "I chose to live here, what do you every do besides being born?".

I work in Silicon Valley, with folks originally from India, China, France, Korea, Iceland, you name it. Yet we all watch Lost, play Warcraft, and generally appreciate capitalism, secularism and freedom.

The Chinese government appreciates secularism, and people there play warcraft too. That has nothing to do with how demographic changes will effect the world (which was the point of the article)

If you only look at race and ethnicity, you miss the fact that Western philosophy is increasingly dominating the world.

Western philosophy, or western culture? They are two different things.

It doesn't seem to me that western philosophy is dominating the world, other than former communist countries are putting on good imitations of capitalism.

[ChooseLiberty]

Devolution.

The more the third world comes to the US the more the US is like the third world.

Those cultures were never based on Democracy or Freedom. If they have Democracy it's just a show like in Mexico, to cover over the fact there are a few very rich Spanish or Lebanese families ruling over millions of mestizo peasants.

Yeah... idiotocracy had it right. Smart and affluent people don't breed far enough, while conversely the stupid and poor breed out the wazoo.

[hmurchison]

I'm concerned with "Anglos" and their relative numbers but rather keeping the ideology of Western Civ and as fair of a commerce framework as possible clean and unsullied.

The race of the progenitor has little correlation with how effective other people can embrace the progentors creation or ideology.

You don't have to be Karl Marx to understand his philosphy, you don't have to be Jewish to understand Jesus.

Those who attempt to insert racial supremacy laced with FUD as sound politiking are being disingenous at best.

[Nefertiti]

An interesting article coming at secularism from a completely different angle is this:
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/09/16/bo...ldstein-t.html

The claim is basically that secularism was the result a very unusual historical situation, and that throughout human history and in most of the world, religious values are an integral part of the way people understand life.

That is true. There was a time when atheism as we know it today didn't exist. I attended a lecture a couple months ago where the speaker argued that really before Judaism, and especially Christianity, the idea of religions didn't really exist in the sense that one people didn't believe their religion was right and those of others were wrong. People worshipped different gods but they didn't regard those different gods as not existing.

[Locke_rpr]

Well, I guess I'm part of the problem. I'm not Anglo nor Saxon, but of Welsh decent... a Briton, like Arthur and his round table. I guess that's close enough. I don't hold a grudge for them taking England away from us, that was a long time ago; although, the Welsh word for England does still translate as "The Lost Lands". Anyway, I'm sorry to say that I'm deliberately not having kids because I consider having children nowadays to be cruel. I don't look forward to what this country is going to be like in the next 30 years that I'll probably still be around. I sure don't want to have kids and make them suffer though what lies after that. Let the people who are keen on the direction this country have what they ordered.

[drednot]

....
The Chinese government appreciates secularism, and people there play warcraft too. That has nothing to do with how demographic changes will effect the world (which was the point of the article)

Western philosophy, or western culture? They are two different things.

It doesn't seem to me that western philosophy is dominating the world, other than former communist countries are putting on good imitations of capitalism.

Western Philosophy is dominating the world because it is superior.

Look at Hong Kong, Taiwan, Korea, Japan. Do you think these people want to go back to feudalism and emperor worship? What Western Philosophy are these people rejecting? Caucasianism? While Japan and Korea have work to do with regard to ethnic tolerance, I think progress is inevitable due to the nature of capitalism. The wealthier a people get, the more they need to import cheap labor to do things they are now overqualified to do.

Ironically immigration enhances western philosophy rather than diminishes it. Immigrants come here because they believe there's something good, not evil, about what we do. They find social mobility in the West where there was none at home. Sure some illegal proletariats coming in from Mexico are looking for free welfare (which I oppose), but most seek work.

You mention that "former communist countries are putting on good imitations of capitalism", but I'd say it's far more than a good show. Czechoslovakia, Poland, and especially the Baltic Republics are installing free market reforms that put ours to shame.

[apropos]

Anyway, I'm sorry to say that I'm deliberately not having kids because I consider having children nowadays to be cruel. Let the people who are keen on the direction this country have what they ordered.

Self-fulfilling prophecy, isn't it?

I think a valid question to ask would be why our forefathers bothered having children when the world was a much more uncertain place. Disease was much more rampant. You had invading armies appear over the horizon, burning your town and enslaving your people. Even one's own government could throw you in jail for no reason. Historically, 'individual rights' have been the exception, not the rule, around the world. But in spite of all that people still had children.

Things have been much, much worse in the past. I think we need more Brits and Welsh in the world. They've brought so much good to the world overall (everything from the Magna Carta to Newton to personal hygiene) that the world will be a much dimmer place without you guys. That might sound weird, but I believe this is the case. The spirit of England and Wales is only going to last as long as there are Englishmen and Welshmen to keep it going.

I hope you'll reconsider.

[literatim]

Western Philosophy is dominating the world because it is superior.

Look at Hong Kong, Taiwan, Korea, Japan. Do you think these people want to go back to feudalism and emperor worship? What Western Philosophy are these people rejecting? Caucasianism? While Japan and Korea have work to do with regard to ethnic tolerance, I think progress is inevitable due to the nature of capitalism. The wealthier a people get, the more they need to import cheap labor to do things they are now overqualified to do.

Ironically immigration enhances western philosophy rather than diminishes it. Immigrants come here because they believe there's something good, not evil, about what we do. They find social mobility in the West where there was none at home. Sure some illegal proletariats coming in from Mexico are looking for free welfare (which I oppose), but most seek work.

They come here because we are wealthy and they are not. Not because they have some great dream of being apart of the republic or democracy. They decided that it was easier to come here an leech off the civilization our ancestor's built up instead of changing their own country. Then they whine about why we aren't dumping our wealth into repairing their homeland.

It is self destructing for us to let these people in. We are having a clash of cultures in our own neighborhoods. Multiculturalism does not work and will not work. You can't force a bunch of people with opposing outlooks on the world to get along. One side will die off and that side is those of the Western people. It is like a parasite that slowly kills off its host.

[drednot]

They come here because we are wealthy and they are not. Not because they have some great dream of being apart of the republic or democracy. They decided that it was easier to come here an leech off the civilization our ancestor's built up instead of changing their own country. Then they whine about why we aren't dumping our wealth into repairing their homeland.

It is self destructing for us to let these people in. We are having a clash of cultures in our own neighborhoods. Multiculturalism does not work and will not work. You can't force a bunch of people with opposing outlooks on the world to get along. One side will die off and that side is those of the Western people. It is like a parasite that slowly kills off its host.

I've got one guy telling me our culture is winning but that that doesn't matter, and now you saying our culture isn't winning.

Which "opposing outlooks" are you talking about?

Are you talking about illegals or legal immigrants?

I agree that we want americans that value liberty, capitalism and tolerance. But frankly the legal immigrants I work with exemplify these values a lot more than some of the birthright americans in the Democratic and Republican party.

Even with illegals, sure, we all see first generation types speaking broken english, watching Telemundo, and hanging on to various aspects of their home culture. But I think when you examine second generation types, they speak decent english, watch the NFL, and generally immerse themselves with the dominant culture.

I agree that spending tax dollars on trying to support "multiculturism" is counter-productive. The melting pot works on its own.

[cjhowe]

They come here because we are wealthy and they are not. Not because they have some great dream of being apart of the republic or democracy. They decided that it was easier to come here an leech off the civilization our ancestor's built up instead of changing their own country. Then they whine about why we aren't dumping our wealth into repairing their homeland.

It is self destructing for us to let these people in. We are having a clash of cultures in our own neighborhoods. Multiculturalism does not work and will not work. You can't force a bunch of people with opposing outlooks on the world to get along. One side will die off and that side is those of the Western people. It is like a parasite that slowly kills off its host.

How short sighted our view of history is.

[apropos]

But I think when you examine second generation types, they speak decent english, watch the NFL, and generally immerse themselves with the dominant culture.

That's not the case in France.



Norway is also learning the joys of multiculturalism.

Oslo rape statistics shock

Two out of three charged with rape in Norway's capital are immigrants with a non-western background according to a police study. The number of rape cases is also rising steadily.

Rape charges in the capital are spiraling upwards, 40 percent higher from 1999 to 2000 and up 13 percent so far this year.

http://www.aftenposten.no/english/lo...icle190268.ece

[Tsoman]

of course, this is assuming that there won't be some sort of mass starvation, extreme scarcity of drinking water, killer plague, or a world war.

[Stealth4]

Self-fulfilling prophecy, isn't it?

I think a valid question to ask would be why our forefathers bothered having children when the world was a much more uncertain place. Disease was much more rampant. You had invading armies appear over the horizon, burning your town and enslaving your people. Even one's own government could throw you in jail for no reason. Historically, 'individual rights' have been the exception, not the rule, around the world. But in spite of all that people still had children.

Things have been much, much worse in the past. I think we need more Brits and Welsh in the world. They've brought so much good to the world overall (everything from the Magna Carta to Newton to personal hygiene) that the world will be a much dimmer place without you guys. That might sound weird, but I believe this is the case. The spirit of England and Wales is only going to last as long as there are Englishmen and Welshmen to keep it going.

I hope you'll reconsider.

Huge 2nd.

You have to have HOPE!

[saku39]

This is the area where I think Buchanon tends to lose the plot.

He says "Americans" may have "Chinese" as neighbors across the straight, conflating citizenship with race. A lot of Americans are Chinese.

Few people are more enamored with the critical Western tradition of liberty than asian and european immigrants to America. As Ayn Rand said to a heckler, "I chose to live here, what do you every do besides being born?".

I work in Silicon Valley, with folks originally from India, China, France, Korea, Iceland, you name it. Yet we all watch Lost, play Warcraft, and generally appreciate capitalism, secularism and freedom.

If you only look at race and ethnicity, you miss the fact that Western philosophy is increasingly dominating the world.

I agree.

Blacks? Anglos? Chinese? Mexicans? Puerto Ricans? Filipinos? Who cares what ethnicity or nationality has a majority? I know I don't. Because I know in the long run it doesn't matter. The concept of races, ethnicities and nationalities are the problem. It's divisive and useless.

What matters are the ideals of personal liberty, free speech, democratic republic, free trade and capitalism. Without question, they work the best.

My father was born in Mexico. My mother's grand parents were from Poland. Neither side of my ancestors spoke english or knew the customs, but they learned and their children learned even more. As it is now, you cannot tell their grandchildren from the "native-born" americans.

They came here because this place was better. They wanted a better future for themselves and their children. The ideas of personal liberty and capitalism are huge to immigrants. In the end, no matter what race or what nationality, they all end up AMERICANS.

I agree also, article like that make me think Buchanan has lost it.

[literatim]

I've got one guy telling me our culture is winning but that that doesn't matter, and now you saying our culture isn't winning.

Which "opposing outlooks" are you talking about?

Are you talking about illegals or legal immigrants?

I agree that we want americans that value liberty, capitalism and tolerance. But frankly the legal immigrants I work with exemplify these values a lot more than some of the birthright americans in the Democratic and Republican party.

Even with illegals, sure, we all see first generation types speaking broken english, watching Telemundo, and hanging on to various aspects of their home culture. But I think when you examine second generation types, they speak decent english, watch the NFL, and generally immerse themselves with the dominant culture.

I agree that spending tax dollars on trying to support "multiculturism" is counter-productive. The melting pot works on its own.

Take a good look at our country as it stands now. It is crumbling. The values that built this country to its height were replaced. The culture isn't dying--the culture is dead. Only a remnant of its former self and glory exists today. Turn on TV, that isn't Western culture, that is the result of foreign cultures added to our own. You may call it a melting pot, but I call it a cesspool of filth that is slowly killing us like a poison. It is simply so slow that no one bothers to notice, but if you look hard you will see the effects.

The birthrates of people European ancestry, around the world, is dropping like a rock. You need an average birthrate of 2.1 to maintain the present population. In Europe, the average is 1.4. In America, the average is 1.25. All this while other peoples are multiplying rapidly.

The world population growing in leaps and bounds and none of its growth is coming from those of European ancestry. In late 60s, those of European ancestry numbered 750 million, one-fourth of the 3 billion people alive. Since then, the world population has double and those of European ancestry became one-sixth of the earth's population. Another 3 billion will be added to the earth by 2050, but Europeans will be one-tenth.

The downfall of the West has only been slowed because of technological advancements. Our medical knowledge has reduced our deaths and increased our lives, but we are reaching critical levels. What happens when we become the minority and all those from Mexico become the majority? It is already happening in various south-western States. Do people really believe they will hold loyalty to what our ancestors built? The baby boomers can only lives so long and when they die off, so will America.

[saku39]

They come here because we are wealthy and they are not. Not because they have some great dream of being apart of the republic or democracy. They decided that it was easier to come here an leech off the civilization our ancestor's built up instead of changing their own country. Then they whine about why we aren't dumping our wealth into repairing their homeland.

It is self destructing for us to let these people in. We are having a clash of cultures in our own neighborhoods. Multiculturalism does not work and will not work. You can't force a bunch of people with opposing outlooks on the world to get along. One side will die off and that side is those of the Western people. It is like a parasite that slowly kills off its host.

You are so blantantly incorrect it is offensive to me.

ALL of the immigrants I have ever known are here because the environment for prosperity is better. I have not met ANY immigrant that was interested in "leeching" off the system. NONE.

Sometimes, changing your own country is whole a lot harder than going somewhere else. What if you were a Jew in Germany, 1939? Or a worker in the Soviet Union? Or a black man in 1970's South Africa? Or a law abiding Colombian struck in the drug wars of the 1980's and 1990's? Or a landowner or entrepenuer in Venezuela right now?

Also, Multi-culturalism works fine so long as people respect each other.

When I go into my Vietnamese friends' house, I know I will be served pho and they don't like it if I wear shoes in the house. Just like when they go to my grandmothers' they will know she has Telemundo blasting in the livingroom and serves up spicy mexican food. I have an atheist friend that is best friends with a very devout Baptist. Both respect each other and neither tries to preach to the other because both believe in free-will. (What brings them together? Comic books and action movies.)

In each case, neither side is trying to convert the other to their way of life. They are accepting of differences, but are brought together by similarities (anything from music, movies, sports, etc. The majority of which are "american")

That's not to say there won't be disagreements or problems. Nobody's perfect. But it's not nearly as bad as you say. Not even close. In fact, you make it sound like total war-- When it is most certainly not.

Every culture has its differences and its nuances, but the core of what matters in this country will stay the same: personal liberty, free speech, freedom of religion, free market and capitalism. It's what works.

It's why people come here. They can't get the same environment anywhere else.

[hmurchison]

.
It is self destructing for us to let these people in. We are having a clash of cultures in our own neighborhoods. Multiculturalism does not work and will not work. You can't force a bunch of people with opposing outlooks on the world to get along. One side will die off and that side is those of the Western people. It is like a parasite that slowly kills off its host.

BS. Athenians thought differently than Spartans and thus were two seperate cultures by many definitions yet they could unite to fight a common enemy (Persia). Europe, and its significance to this Planet, cannot be understated but let us fool no one Europe was the epicenter of many multicultural conflicts which resulted in innovation in military equipment and strategy and overall evolution if Western Philosphy. If one side of opposing views dies off then natural selection has once again proven to be one of the Masters of all theory.

[hmurchison]

Take a good look at our country as it stands now. It is crumbling. The values that built this country to its height were replaced. The culture isn't dying--the culture is dead. Only a remnant of its former self and glory exists today. Turn on TV, that isn't Western culture, that is the result of foreign cultures added to our own. You may call it a melting pot, but I call it a cesspool of filth that is slowly killing us like a poison. It is simply so slow that no one bothers to notice, but if you look hard you will see the effects.

The birthrates of people European ancestry, around the world, is dropping like a rock. You need an average birthrate of 2.1 to maintain the present population. In Europe, the average is 1.4. In America, the average is 1.25. All this while other peoples are multiplying rapidly.

The world population growing in leaps and bounds and none of its growth is coming from those of European ancestry. In late 60s, those of European ancestry numbered 750 million, one-fourth of the 3 billion people alive. Since then, the world population has double and those of European ancestry became one-sixth of the earth's population. Another 3 billion will be added to the earth by 2050, but Europeans will be one-tenth.

The downfall of the West has only been slowed because of technological advancements. Our medical knowledge has reduced our deaths and increased our lives, but we are reaching critical levels. What happens when we become the minority and all those from Mexico become the majority? It is already happening in various south-western States. Do people really believe they will hold loyalty to what our ancestors built? The baby boomers can only lives so long and when they die off, so will America.

Hyperbole. Crime is actually down in the US as opposed to say 10-15 yrs ago. Americans still enjoy a standard of living that makes us very desirable to live. Frankly I do not care to address the rest of your idiotic post. Perhaps your Stormfront buddies would though.

[saku39]

I've got one guy telling me our culture is winning but that that doesn't matter, and now you saying our culture isn't winning.

Which "opposing outlooks" are you talking about?

Are you talking about illegals or legal immigrants?

I agree that we want americans that value liberty, capitalism and tolerance. But frankly the legal immigrants I work with exemplify these values a lot more than some of the birthright americans in the Democratic and Republican party.

Even with illegals, sure, we all see first generation types speaking broken english, watching Telemundo, and hanging on to various aspects of their home culture. But I think when you examine second generation types, they speak decent english, watch the NFL, and generally immerse themselves with the dominant culture.

I agree that spending tax dollars on trying to support "multiculturism" is counter-productive. The melting pot works on its own.

I second what you are saying about immigrants being absorbed into the US. There are actually statistics that support this.

First generations tend to be a half and half mix of cultures. Seconds are for the most part "americanized" but still carry some of the culture form the first generation. By third generation, it is extremely rare that they even can speak their grandparent's language. They are practically indistinguishable from your "average" american.

I am a example of this: I can speak no Polish that my great grand parents spoke and I can barely speak any spanish my grandmother speaks. I prefer BBQ chicken, pizza and hamburgers to tacos, barszcz soup, and kielbasa. I prefer NBA finals and the UFC to the world cup. I'd rather watch Saturday Night Live than Sabado Gigante. And the list can go on and on.

I also agree, tax-dollars for multi-culturalism is definitely a no-no.

[literatim]

You are so blantantly incorrect it is offensive to me.

of the immigrants I have ever known are here because the environment for prosperity is better. I have not met ANY[/SIZE] immigrant that was interested in "leeching" off the system. NONE.

Sometimes, changing your own country is whole a lot harder than going somewhere else. What if you were a Jew in Germany, 1939? Or a worker in the Soviet Union? Or a black man in 1970's South Africa? Or a law abiding Colombian struck in the drug wars of the 1980's and 1990's? Or a landowner or entrepenuer in Venezuela right now?

Be offended all you want, I do not care. Reality is harsh and the effects are clear. Living in deluded visions of rainbows and unicorns does not fix the problem.

Leeching off our system? They are leeching off our prosperity. It isn't just about coming here and hopping on the welfare bandwagon. It is about coming here and bringing their culture with them. The same culture that has kept their homelands in disparity for generations.

Also, Multi-culturalism works fine so long as people respect each other.

When I go into my Vietnamese friends' house, I know I will be served pho and they don't like it if I wear shoes in the house. Just like when they go to my grandmothers' they will know she has Telemundo blasting in the livingroom and serves up spicy mexican food. I have an atheist friend that is best friends with a very devout Baptist. Both respect each other and neither tries to preach to the other because both believe in free-will. (What brings them together? Comic books and action movies.)

In each case, neither side is trying to convert the other to their way of life. They are accepting of differences, but are brought together by similarities (anything from music, movies, sports, etc. The majority of which are "american")

It is naivety to believe that one culture will respect another for long. The only thing keeping the minority cultures from dominating over the others is the strength of the majority culture. How far do we go to accommodate? How much do we tolerate?

Culture goes beyond taking ones shoes off when entering someones house. Culture is the fundamental outlook and way of life of the people. The Republic itself is apart of our culture.

That's not to say there won't be disagreements or problems. Nobody's perfect. But it's not nearly as bad as you say. Not even close. In fact, you make it sound like total war-- When it is most certainly not.

Every culture has its differences and its nuances, but the core of what matters in this country will stay the same: personal liberty, free speech, freedom of religion, free market and capitalism. It's what works.

It's why people come here. They can't get the same environment anywhere else.[/COLOR]

It isn't nearly as bad as I say? Was I just hallucinating when two giant airliners flew into the World Trade Center? Am I imagining the Aztlan movement among Mexicans coming across our borders? How about the repeated call for Sharia Law in Canada and various other countries with a high Muslim population? What do you think will happen when they become the majority?

BS. Athenians thought differently than Spartans and thus were two seperate cultures by many definitions yet they could unite to fight a common enemy (Persia). Europe, and its significance to this Planet, cannot be understated but let us fool no one Europe was the epicenter of many multicultural conflicts which resulted in innovation in military equipment and strategy and overall evolution if Western Philosphy. If one side of opposing views dies off then natural selection has once again proven to be one of the Masters of all theory.

We are talking about destruction from within ala Trojan Horse.

[Dustancostine]

What happens when we become the minority and all those from Mexico become the majority? It is already happening in various south-western States. Do people really believe they will hold loyalty to what our ancestors built? The baby boomers can only lives so long and when they die off, so will America.

I'm not sure what you are afraid of, but the Hispanics trace their ancestry to the same WEST that Anglo's do, just a different country (Spain instead of the UK/Germany/Italy). I live in Texas and I have seen no affect on the politics of Texas with the increase of the Hispanic Population. I also lived in South Florida and if wasn't for the Cuban's, Miami would be 10 times more liberal than it is.

Also there is a problem with the way statistics are being compiled. Statisticians act like only "pure blooded" anglo's are considered caucasian. Any mixing what so ever makes that person another race.

For instance, I am caucasian, my wife is hispanic from Santo Domingo, DR. We have two daughters that would be considered hispanic because my wife is hispanic, even though they are 50% caucasian. Thus showing that I as a caucasian had a 0% reproductive rate because my children hispanic.

But what if you looked further. My wife's father was 25% Dutch. That would make my children 56.25 "white" but they are still considered hispanic. My wife also has African genes, Taino Indian genes and Spanish genes. From my side of the family there are remote native american genes as well from both sides of my family.

While my wife can pass as African American my youngest daughter is pale and has blond hair.

These statistics are usless, utterly useless!!!!!


--Dustan

[saku39]

Be offended all you want, I do not care. Reality is harsh and the effects are clear. Living in deluded visions of rainbows and unicorns does not fix the problem.

Leeching off our system? They are leeching off our prosperity. It isn't just about coming here and hopping on the welfare bandwagon. It is about coming here and bringing their culture with them. The same culture that has kept their homelands in disparity for generations.

Sir, you have it so wrong it is disturbing. Immigrants have added to the prosperity of the country. This goes back to the Italian, German, Irish, Chinese in the 1800's to the Jewish of the 1930's to the Vietnamese and Koreans of the 1970's, to the Mexican, Indian, Filipino immigrants of today. They bring new ideas, new workers, new businesses to the economy.

It is naivety to believe that one culture will respect another for long. The only thing keeping the minority cultures from dominating over the others is the strength of the majority culture. How far do we go to accommodate? How much do we tolerate?

Culture goes beyond taking ones shoes off when entering someones house. Culture is the fundamental outlook and way of life of the people. The Republic itself is apart of our culture.

You sound like a neo-con that relies only on fear to make argument. I am not naive and neither is anybody else when they believe in personal freedom, a democratic republic and free market capitalism. This is what ties us all together, including the immigrants. I believe in personal freedom as do everyone else I know, including the immigrants.

Sure, culture is more than food, entertainment and dress. I apologize for not making it more clear. You are correct that outlook is part of culture. But know this: They come here because they share the same outlook on freedom and free market capitalism.

It isn't nearly as bad as I say? Was I just hallucinating when two giant airliners flew into the World Trade Center? Am I imagining the Aztlan movement among Mexicans coming across our borders? How about the repeated call for Sharia Law in Canada and various other countries with a high Muslim population? What do you think will happen when they become the majority?

Now you're talking complete nonsense.

A terrorist attack is because of our culture? "They hate us because we're free?"

Do you realize you sound like a neo-con hack right now?

If I recall, that attack happened because of our militrary presence in the arabian peninsula, our economic sanctions and bombing of Iraq, and our financial and military support of Israel.

The Aztlan movement, the Sharia Law idiots, etc are marginal fools that will NEVER be the majority. Why? Because of personal freedom, because of free market capitalism, because of republic. It is a better way and a better system. After having all these rights for their entire lives, how will people feel if their rights are taken away?